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Hey everyone I just wanted to point out that Google Music works in IE9 in Mango ! It only works on 7112 or higher though. I dont know how many people already know this but I think I should just point it out . The best thing is you dont need to be in the browser to listen to your music !
Yes it does work Just tried it on my Omnia 7 with 7720.
I thought it used flash to play the songs...
But only the pause/play button works, not previous/next.
From what I remember, it won't move on to the next track in the playlist/album while the browser isn't open.
PG2G said:
From what I remember, it won't move on to the next track in the playlist/album while the browser isn't open.
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Yes, but considering it's a website designed for the desktop it's pretty good.
But anyway, I find Google Music very useless, since it's MY OWN MUSIC, that I already have stored on the phone :|
jotapm said:
Yes, but considering it's a website designed for the desktop it's pretty good.
But anyway, I find Google Music very useless, since it's MY OWN MUSIC, that I already have stored on the phone :|
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Well, its pretty nice if u have an 8 gig phone and are running out of space
I'm running 7.10.7712.60 in a 1.3v Samsung Focus. I tried to play a song and it states I need to install flash. What am I missing?
Seed 2.0 said:
I'm running 7.10.7712.60 in a 1.3v Samsung Focus. I tried to play a song and it states I need to install flash. What am I missing?
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flash？I think mango only can use html5
Sent from my HTC Hero using XDA App
jotapm said:
Yes, but considering it's a website designed for the desktop it's pretty good.
But anyway, I find Google Music very useless, since it's MY OWN MUSIC, that I already have stored on the phone :|
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did you not notice the "free" section ?
also, uploading from your computer means streaming THAT library to your phone... anywhere and saving that measely 8gb of space for important stuff like Microsoft Premium Wow Zing Edition 2012 superlative Edition. documents. or whatever.
Yay.
More ways to consume ridiculous amounts of data and bring the network to a grinding halt (wifi OR 3g).
andrewkeith5 said:
Yay.
More ways to consume ridiculous amounts of data and bring the network to a grinding halt (wifi OR 3g).
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well, the data has to come from somewhere... insufficient storage or insufficient bandwidth, it gives the user another choise. choise is good.
ohgood said:
well, the data has to come from somewhere... insufficient storage or insufficient bandwidth, it gives the user another choise. choise is good.
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Choice isn't good when you're destroying the bandwidth of the network to others' detriment. That's exactly why FUPs have to be used.
can't imagine that google music would be easy on bandwidth
andrewkeith5 said:
Choice isn't good when you're destroying the bandwidth of the network to others' detriment. That's exactly why FUPs have to be used.
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if you're sold 4g, or 3g when you sign the contract, the ISPshould have enough capacity to handle each and every customer using what they were sold. if they do not, they are not being truthful in their advertising, or their contracts.
I have zero sympathy for isps that oversell and under deliver.
Yes, which is why most contracts have a FUP, so that they can do that.
It's just a shame that some users have some ridiculous expectation that they should have infinite access to the finite network resources, which results in the overall network becoming bogged down.
ohgood said:
if you're sold 4g, or 3g when you sign the contract, the ISPshould have enough capacity to handle each and every customer using what they were sold. if they do not, they are not being truthful in their advertising, or their contracts.
I have zero sympathy for isps that oversell and under deliver.
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andrewkeith5 said:
Yes, which is why most contracts have a FUP, so that they can do that.
It's just a shame that some users have some ridiculous expectation that they should have infinite access to the finite network resources, which results in the overall network becoming bogged down.
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unlimited 4g is what is being sold. it either is, or it isn't. of late isps are charging MORE for 1.5gb data contracts than they were for "unlimited" a couple of years ago.
if they ever update the supporting towers and backends servers, I could see your point. as it is, att can't handle all their contracted subscribers, nor tmo, nor any isp.
then they act as though they're doing everyone a favor for throttling users, who were SOLD on the idea of unlimited. "unlimited" is a fairly self explanitary word, no asterisk required, nor should it be allowed. truth in advertising... that's all I want.
I'm getting the impression that AT&T in the US are very much like 3 over here in the UK - oversell for a cheap price and then don't support properly.
Unfortunately I can't speak for the US, but here in the UK there are regulations and laws governing advertising, and already mobile phone networks are being forced to make FUPs more prominent - in fact, "Unlimited*" is pretty much gone from UK mobile networks - you either get true Unlimited or a clearly stated limit.
The point of a Fair Use Policy is exactly that - to ensure everyone on the network acts fairly. If you are automatically charged for exceeding a FUP then you need to challenge it, but if you routinely exceed it then you'll be charged, naturally.
Essentially a FUP is the networks way of saying "Use as much data as you like, but if you take the piss and it starts affecting the network performance, we'll start charging you more" - generally FUPs are WAY higher than the data you would use from heavy use web browsing, they are designed more to discourage sitting there watching hours of video over a mobile connection, when you really should either be on WiFi or keep the video on internal storage.
Yep, it's works
I started writing this post in another thread but I felt it was better off in it's own. Please read it in full if you're going to respond, I know it's long but you'll just look silly if you don't:
The reality is that most data plans are limited to 500MB, or if you're lucky 1GB, and for the vast majority of users this is way more than enough - in my case I do occasionally go over, which is why I'm on a plan where I just pay £5 per 500MB, it might not be the cheapest option but it's the best for me, and my bills are normally £30 a month, which is very reasonable for the quality of service I get.
Most people will never use the cloud features on their phones, in reality. Fair enough, some people will require a phone with a larger storage capacity. It would be nice to see some phones with larger storage, but there is a massive problem: take a phone with big storage, or with storage size options, to a mobile network, and they'll just charge an absolute fortune for it, so nobody will buy it. That limits your market to SIM free devices- and maybe a few people will buy it then, but probably not enough to make it worth your while.
What you guys that want extra storage have to prove is that you can get enough people on board to make it worthwhile for Samsung/HTC/Nokia to get out of bed and do it. With android/iPhone that isn't a problem because average joe will buy it regardless and probably won't have a clue what they're buying, but Windows Phone is a harder sell, despite being a better system (in a lot of our opinons, I believe).
In the meantime, firstly why are videos so important to you? On a 4" screen my eyesight would be pretty screwed after about half an hour, which is why I have a 32GB Android tablet for videos, with a nice comfortable 10" screen, and it just stays in the bag that comes with me. On the odd occasion I don't have my tablet, then Youtube is normally more than enough and using it only occasionally doesn't hack out at my data plan.
For music, I don't know of anybody who actually listens to their entire music collection on their phone, and in my own perfect world I wish people would realise this. My way around not being able to store all of my music on my phone is to just have a smart playlist of tracks that I have starred, automatically synchronising 250 of my starred tracks to my phone at random- that way I have a nice selection of music I know I like, which in a way is better because I'm making better use of my collection, and I get nice surprises occasionally.
In summary, I just want to ask of everyone: Please just remember almost nobody is in the same precise position as you. It's great that there is a large range of people here with a range of opinions, but you have to understand that assuming that everybody is the same as you is just going to annoy people. There is nothing wrong with expressing that you would like a phone with more internal storage - but say it, then move on. Don't carry on saying it over and over. And if you don't want a phone with more internal storage, say it, then move on. Don't start arguments because you don't agree with people.
I personally love my HTC 7 Pro and won't be changing it. It isn't perfect, but I'm not going to moan endlessly about what's wrong with it, I'm going to give my opinion where it's relevant, and if there's a good response I'll back it up with my reasoning. That's how forums should work.
andrewkeith5 said:
What you guys that want extra storage have to prove is that you can get enough people on board to make it worthwhile for Samsung/HTC/Nokia to get out of bed and do it.
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The best way to show OEMs that it's worthwile would be for one of them to have one out and for the others to see how it sells. Not by having everyone on this forum sending them a letter. The question is they don't they make the effort, at least once? When you see a N9 with 64GB and a Lumia 800 with 16GB it hurts.
Really not sure why its thought only apple can accomplish things like having a smartphone line with large storage options. There's a very simple solution to this: offer a larger 32GB storage option at a $100 premium in limited quantities (just like Dell did with the DVP) and see what happens. In Dell's case it didn't sell well (likely due to their distribution model) and it was withdrawn. OEM's like HTC and Samsung will be better placed to make this option work but again, have the option to withdraw the higher priced option.
In any case, it seems they are still in softly softly mode with WP7 so I doubt anyone but Nokia will be the first to offer higher levels of storage. The cloud though is absolutely not the blanket solution for everybody, though it works for some but for others the current storage options will definitely be insufficient.
Apple did perfectly well. They decided to remove slot for SD cards but logically they offered 32GB and 64GB versions of their devices in order to compensate the loss of expandable storage.
Microsoft removed the SD card slot but is unable to propose any hardware having more than 16GB (actually it is only 13.2GB once the OS is installed).
Sorry but this is not acceptable.
Apple has only one hardware and offers you the choice.
MS works with several OEM and fails to propose more than 16GB.
The lack of storage, the lack of alternative finally made me switch to Android.
Congrats Microsoft !
Good responses, thanks! I think the main reason that none of the OEMs has released a higher capacity model is sheer numbers.
With Android, even if the high capacity model sells 10% of the volume of the low capacity version, that's still a lot of units. With WP7, though, the sales of the single model probably aren't enough to justify making variations as that will just make it harder to sell to the distributor (the network, mainly).
Like you efjay, I'm hopeful that with Nokia on board and Mango being more like the sort of feature-rich software people demand volumes will slowly start to increase and the manufacturers will start to break their model ranges into more variants.
IMHO a MASSIVE problem with the distribution models as they are is exclusivity - with WP7, the absolute key is going to be making every device available everywhere, so as many people see it/try it/want it as conceivably possible. With exclusives, you're limiting distribution of an already limited distribution product, and that's going to harm growth.
arturobandini said:
Apple did perfectly well. They decided to remove slot for SD cards but logically they offered 32GB and 64GB versions of their devices in order to compensate the loss of expandable storage.
Microsoft removed the SD card slot but is unable to propose any hardware having more than 16GB (actually it is only 13.2GB once the OS is installed).
Sorry but this is not acceptable.
Apple has only one hardware and offers you the choice.
MS works with several OEM and fails to propose more than 16GB.
The lack of storage, the lack of alternative finally made me switch to Android.
Congrats Microsoft !
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I never said that Apple didn't do well. What I said, was that WP7 has to be targeted at a big, but specific type of consumer base to work well, and that most of that consumer base probably don't know or care how much storage they have - once the volumes increase, then there will be more variants with more storage, but right now there is no incentive to provide high capacity variants because the networks will price them out of the market and they won't sell to joe public.
andrewkeith5 said:
IMHO a MASSIVE problem with the distribution models as they are is exclusivity - with WP7, the absolute key is going to be making every device available everywhere, so as many people see it/try it/want it as conceivably possible. With exclusives, you're limiting distribution of an already limited distribution product, and that's going to harm growth.
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Difference here is the territory. In Europe (and the UK in particular) the Lumia devices will be on practically every carrier (except it seems O2 cos of their iphone love) and are being backed by a huge marketing campaign and incentives to customers and probably sales staff. You can even pre-order the Nokia phones which has never happened for any other WP7 device. In the US however, the story is radically different - T-Mobile has announced only 1 new device, nothing for Sprint and Verizon, which leaves at&t who will have 3 new devices and none of these devices are being given special treatment, rather they are just being thrown up on the carrier's website with no fanfare. With that kind of lopsided distribution and lack of promotion, along with the acknowledged bias, its no wonder WP7 struggles in the US, and that really is down to poor carrier support. US carriers have no problem stocking the same android model but WP7 is largely ignored. Until that changes there is no way WP7 is going to make nay headway, at least in the US.
I think though, that with Nokia's media push, brand recognition and seemingly well liked devices WP7 can do very well in Europe. It will be interesting to see the sales figures for the Lumia 800/710 this holiday compared to other handsets in Europe and the US. The US looks like it will continue to have a poor selection of WP7 devices and be dominated by ios and android.
andrewkeith5 said:
1) Most people will never use the cloud features on their phones, in reality. Fair enough, some people will require a phone with a larger storage capacity. It would be nice to see some phones with larger storage, but there is a massive problem: take a phone with big storage, or with storage size options, to a mobile network, and they'll just charge an absolute fortune for it, so nobody will buy it. That limits your market to SIM free devices- and maybe a few people will buy it then, but probably not enough to make it worth your while.
2) In the meantime, firstly why are videos so important to you? On a 4" screen my eyesight would be pretty screwed after about half an hour, which is why I have a 32GB Android tablet for videos, with a nice comfortable 10" screen, and it just stays in the bag that comes with me. On the odd occasion I don't have my tablet, then Youtube is normally more than enough and using it only occasionally doesn't hack out at my data plan.
3) to just have a smart playlist of tracks that I have starred, automatically synchronising 250 of my starred tracks to my phone at random- that way I have a nice selection of music I know I like, which in a way is better because I'm making better use of my collection, and I get nice surprises occasionally.
4) In summary, I just want to ask of everyone: Please just remember almost nobody is in the same precise position as you. It's great that there is a large range of people here with a range of opinions, but you have to understand that assuming that everybody is the same as you is just going to annoy people. There is nothing wrong with expressing that you would like a phone with more internal storage - but say it, then move on. Don't carry on saying it over and over. And if you don't want a phone with more internal storage, say it, then move on. Don't start arguments because you don't agree with people.
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1) cloud features, like uploading audio, video, pictures, documents, (FILES) whenever, wherever ? this is extremely important. look at the protests, police brutality, natural disasters, and corruption caught by cell phone cameras. without an instant upload, the phone could be confiscated, the person punished (off record beating) and the public never the wiser. cloud = power, pricey for data or not, it is powerful.
2) videos are something fun to share, with family, friends, coworkers. renting a movie on youtube/itunes/whatever and showing the funny part to a friend is a blast, and stimulates more purchases/rents normally. self-shot videos are fun to share instantly, with other smart phones, via bluetooth or wifi... and guarantees there is a copy should you drop yours in the water/mud/etc. the option of streaming that movie to your 32Gb whatever-pad is awesome, and should be standard practice now. how are you going to watch the HD 3D video you just shot with your smart phone with poor vision , unless you can transfer it to the 32Gb somehow ? this is where wp7 fails, because of whatever reason they restricted moving files around and file access.
3) personally i only keep 2-3Gb of music on my phone. most of it is synced 2-3 times a month now, rented or bought from amazon/whoever, or just ripped from a cd. music is a non-issue, with a 32Gb microsd card. <--- this is another thing I can't understand microsoft crippling.
4) yep, understood. data plans are getting rediculously expensive by the month. 1Gb for $30 ? but then pack on tons of 'apps' that eat data 24/7 as oem junk ? all the US carriers are really sucking in this requard. they have the bandwidth, they have the infrastructure, but greeeeeeeeeed is creating a suck-zone of expense for anyone expecting "UNLIMITED" anything.
Of they support as cards the whole price argument falls on its face. Either support sd or offer more storage options. The cloud is terrible. It leads to worse battery life due to the constant downloading and it can be a terrible experience if reception isn't great where you are.
Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk
I agree that there are some that may need more space but to spam articles and forums saying that the phone or generation of phones (even tho not complete yet) are going to fail because it doesn't meet that particular persons need is wrong. Take me for example, I'm disappointed that the T-mobile radar has only 8gb of space but I'm not going around saying it's going to be a failure because of it.
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JustinTV773 said:
I agree that there are some that may need more space but to spam articles and forums saying that the phone or generation of phones (even tho not complete yet) are going to fail because it doesn't meet that particular persons need is wrong. Take me for example, I'm disappointed that the T-mobile radar has only 8gb of space but I'm not going around saying it's going to be a failure because of it.
Sent from my T7575 using Board Express
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The radar is a mid range device. Its comparable to focus flash not focus s.
The storage is a huge problem.
They pushing away early adapters with that, and thats their only marketing worth mentioning right now (their fanbois).
The focus s has < 13gb free on a fresh boot... ... ...
Again. With sd support, the low storage would be nonfactor.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk
Right now the best and only option for over 32gb of storage is a first gen Focus. If you want storage get this phone for $0.01 from at&t and spend the money for a 32gb card. I really wanted to upgrade from my focus to something with a FFC but I guess I am a customer that wants too much. It is too much to want a phone with lots of storage AND a FFC. So that means I won't be spending any money on a phone any time soon I guess. Someone lost a sale.
To the OP: I do not carry my entire music collection on my phone. I do however have 15 GB of music on my phone and listen to at least 3 hours of it daily. Like others have mentioned. Apple offers more storage options so you can't say it isn't wanted. Secondly, why should the price be the same if OEMs aren't adding more storage?
bennyj71 said:
To the OP: I do not carry my entire music collection on my phone. I do however have 15 GB of music on my phone and listen to at least 3 hours of it daily. Like others have mentioned. Apple offers more storage options so you can't say it isn't wanted. Secondly, why should the price be the same if OEMs aren't adding more storage?
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This kind of makes my point....15GBs of music by most compression standards amounts to roughly 150 hrs of music, of which this user listens to "at least 3 hours" of daily. Really? And this is supposed to back up the argument for needing more space? Really? And what about video? How much USEFUL video do most of us actually carry around on our phones? If I have a video, that means that Ive probably already seen it and, unlike music, have no reason to be carrying it around with me on my phone. Like most people (I believe) the vast majority of videos that I watch on my phone are streamed i.e YouTube, Netflix etc.
(and as for Apple [on the 4s only] offering more storage meaning that there is suddenly a demand, do not forget that the 2 best selling phones in the world are iphones with 8 and 16 GBs of total storage)
My point is: Unless your phone is your ONLY piece of hardware i.e. NO computer etc., somebody who is complaining about needing 32GBs+ of media storage on their PHONE please in some kind of detail explain how you are actually making use of anywhere close to even 1/10th of it on a daily basis.
That's only music. What about video documents and large apps and games - some of which are 200mb to 2gb just by themselves.
I think your point leaves out obvious things that must be considered.
Storage is only a problem on this platform, and no other. Even feature phones support 32g sd cards these days...
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I love how all your facts include "I" somewhere in the sentence.
The low gb phones sell will because they're the cheapest skus. Cheaper always sells more.
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N8ter said:
That's only music. What about video documents and large apps and games - some of which are 200mb to 2gb just by themselves.
I think your point leaves out obvious things that must be considered.
Storage is only a problem on this platform, and no other. Even feature phones support 32g sd cards these days...
Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk
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Thats only music? Yes, as I pointed out, thats WAY WAY more music than you could actually have any realistic use for on your phone unless you were stranded on the moon for a year. And how many gigs of video (that you've most likey already seen) do you really carry around with you on your phone and make use of on a daily basis?
Like I challenged: if you really need 32GBs+ of storage explain how you actually (in detail) use it all up and actually make use of it.
N8ter said:
I love how all your facts include "I" somewhere in the sentence.
The low gb phones sell will because they're the cheapest skus. Cheaper always sells more.
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Nitpicking when he uses I to try to cover up your wrongness is quite funny. Cheapest sells more? Not necessarily, the 250GB Xbox 360 outsold the 4GB one even tho it was $100 cheaper. That's just one example.
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JustinTV773 said:
Nitpicking when he uses I to try to cover up your wrongness is quite funny. Cheapest sells more? Not necessarily, the 250GB Xbox 360 outsold the 4GB one even tho it was $100 cheaper. That's just one example.
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I tend to agree that 8 & 16GB phones sell more because of being cheaper. But when a person wants something larger, they will go to whatever is available instead of settling for the smaller capacities. Myself as an example. When I bought my iPhone 4, I originally bought a 16GB because it was $100 cheaper and then started seeing how the games were filling it up rapidly after all of my music and pictures and other media were on it. I chose to return it for a 32GB model and even payed the return fee to get one.
I know there is a percentage of customers MS will lose out on because of the lower capacity phones they are choosing to stay with. Apple looks to get all customers rather than a majority who may be satisfied with 8 or 16GB.
There will be a percentage of customers that Microsoft lose out on, but I guess they know that, they are not stupid.
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An earlier post, thought it may be a good topic for debate:
TO ALL THE CLOUD PEOPLE!
Not usually one to rant but I need to here. What scares me about this is the larger picture. Data plans are getting smaller and more expensive and at the same time storage is getting smaller, which will force you to use a cloud service. So for all the music, etc. that you already own you will have to stream it and use up part of your data plan. That's what really scares me, it's like getting taxed twice. Your using data to get the song but it doesn't end there, now you have to use data every time you listen to it. This all boils down to the carriers making a lot of money off of stuff you own. What's next? 8GB phones and $50 per GB data plans in 5 years? I'm all for companies making a profit, I'm conservative and definitely not an occupy movement type but i see potential disaster for the consumer here. Who knows, hopefully this isn't a trend but for all the good things about a cloud, when combined with an expensive data plan it can be really bad for the consumer. I'll keep my content locally thank you. Not to mention all the downfalls of a cloud service, battery drain, losing signal, etc.
What's really disappointing is this entire issue can be avoided with expandable memory. Feels like we are going backwards.
This is only a concern if you believe AT&T's rhetoric that the sky is falling.
First off 90% of phones still come with a Micro SD card slot.
Second, Verizon is really the only carrier who still charges overage fee's (T-mobile and AT&T throttle after a certain point and Sprint is "Unlimited") so I don't get where you are going with this.
bleach168 said:
This is only a concern if you believe AT&T's rhetoric that the sky is falling.
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I have unlimited data on verizon. I can just add the two scenarios together and see the POTENTIAL for a bad thing, but can you deny that the potential is there?
miketoasty said:
First off 90% of phones still come with a Micro SD card slot.
Second, Verizon is really the only carrier who still charges overage fee's (T-mobile and AT&T throttle after a certain point and Sprint is "Unlimited") so I don't get where you are going with this.
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Try 99% of phones haha
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
miketoasty said:
First off 90% of phones still come with a Micro SD card slot.
Second, Verizon is really the only carrier who still charges overage fee's (T-mobile and AT&T throttle after a certain point and Sprint is "Unlimited") so I don't get where you are going with this.
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Do you believe Sprint will have unlimited forever? Where I'm going is trying to point out what nobody else is. Smaller more expensive data plans and streaming services for content you already own COULD become very pricey down the road, hope it doesn't go that route. Not sure how to make that any clearer. Not about overage charges at all.
Verizon already has a 2GB plan (yes i know about double the data, just a gimmick to make you think they gave you something when they took it away). If you use 1GB streaming from the cloud you only have 1GB left for other use. You could have had the content on your phone locally and still had 2GB for other use. So if 2GB isn't enough now you need to spend more on a larger data plan, that's where the cost will be.
@joshnichols189
I'm well aware, see you bought a nexus anyways, good choice.
InfiniD said:
@joshnichols189
I'm well aware, see you bought a nexus anyways, good choice.
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If it does become a problem, I don't think it will happen within two years, but the next time you go looking for a phone make sure you get one with an expandable sd card slot
miketoasty said:
If it does become a problem, I don't think it will happen within two years, but the next time you go looking for a phone make sure you get one with an expandable sd card slot
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If this trend continues we could be in a tight spot in 2yrs. I was okay with the nexus because it was still 32GB, but if this continues and the higher end phones don't have expandable it will suck. I love the Gnex and the community support, I considered the Rezound and now very happy with my purchase mainly because of this site and everybody willing to help others. We are spoiled with the support here. My friend is trying to root his Sprint Evo Design 4G and there is some community support but nothing like the Gnex gets, heck it doesn't even have a forum here at xda.
I think everybody is kinda missing my point of the larger picture down the road lol. This topic started out as a response to discontinuing the 32GB nexus and people being okay with it because of cloud services. Just trying to point out the cloud could come back to bite us later.
I believe the OP has a very valid point here!
stickerbob said:
I believe the OP has a very valid point here!
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Thanks. Was starting to think I was the only one that could connect the dots lol
InfiniD said:
I'll keep my content locally thank you.
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I've been in the data retrieval industry for a long time. I've seen at all and am still surprised on a daily basis of what my clients tell me happens to them that results in them losing all of their data.
Your local storage (on your phone, or computer) will fail and you may have to pay hundreds to thousands of dollars to get it recovered, unless you're fine with losing it (which most people are forced to live with due to the high costs and fragile economy). You might shake your head in disagreement at what i'm saying, most think they will never experience this.
We're not walking backwards, cloud is the future, and in my experience, it's the only way to really make sure that you don't lose your data. The point is to never lose data and have it available to you anywhere. I suggest Box and Dropbox to every single client who asks how they can prevent this from happening to them again.
Google Music is a wonderful thing, i use it every morning on the way to work and every evening on the way home. I listen to about 30-40mb of music on the road. Wifi is always on at home, and available pretty much everywhere i go. Since Dec. 3rd, i've been using about 1 - 1.2GB/month for music and still have a little under 4 GB to use for whatever else my heart desires.
Anyway, while companies are screwing people with data plan costs, in the big picture cloud storage is a winner. My GN's 16GB is more than enough to store whatever i need. Also, i'm pretty sure there will be less and less 8GB phones in the future, i don't think you have anything to worry about.
I'm not saying the cloud is a bad thing on it's own, it definitely makes sense, I'm just worried what the future may hold and the how the carriers will take advantage of it. I agree with all of your points about data security/retrieval. I think if there was a plan that excluded cloud streaming as paid data usage that would be perfect. If that's even possible.
They should just make all phones with 64GB of data with an expandable slot and unlimited plans. I'll never worry again lol.
Nexcellent said:
I've been in the data retrieval industry for a long time. I've seen at all and am still surprised on a daily basis of what my clients tell me happens to them that results in them losing all of their data.
Your local storage (on your phone, or computer) will fail and you may have to pay hundreds to thousands of dollars to get it recovered, unless you're fine with losing it (which most people are forced to live with due to the high costs and fragile economy). You might shake your head in disagreement at what i'm saying, most think they will never experience this.
We're not walking backwards, cloud is the future, and in my experience, it's the only way to really make sure that you don't lose your data. The point is to never lose data and have it available to you anywhere. I suggest Box and Dropbox to every single client who asks how they can prevent this from happening to them again.
Google Music is a wonderful thing, i use it every morning on the way to work and every evening on the way home. I listen to about 30-40mb of music on the road. Wifi is always on at home, and available pretty much everywhere i go. Since Dec. 3rd, i've been using about 1 - 1.2GB/month for music and still have a little under 4 GB to use for whatever else my heart desires.
Anyway, while companies are screwing people with data plan costs, in the big picture cloud storage is a winner. My GN's 16GB is more than enough to store whatever i need. Also, i'm pretty sure there will be less and less 8GB phones in the future, i don't think you have anything to worry about.
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100% true.
While unlimited data may be on its way out, it's only because the telco's can afford to do that for now. Their goal is for you to think the exact same way the OP is thinking right now:
rather than get angry at the telcos, they want you to pay them more, and then get angry at Google, Netflix, Rdio, Slacker, Spotify, Pandora, Onlive, for trying to get you to stream more.
Cellular networks have had a great decade charging high rates on data that most people don't use much of. Average usage for an iPhone user 2 years ago was 800MB - 1.1GB. That means, ATT customers were essentially paying $30 for 1GB, which is a MONSTROUS rate per GB. Typical transit rates on wireline are closer to $0.04/GB. With Android, carriers noticed that usage began increasing very quickly, and just looking at the rise of cloud, they figured out that for them to keep their same profit margins, they needed to either charge more, or keep usage down.
Now, some cellular networks are fighting to keep you paying monstrous per GB rates, either by getting you to pay overages, or getting you to cut back your usage.
The only way to fight this is if enough customers begin actually using the wireless networks and begin bumping up against those artificial barriers, and then begin complaining.
Netflix has already advocated this for wireline networks, although they've been trying to help a bit with voluntary quality/bandwidth limiting.
But either way, cloud *is* the way forward. There are no 2 ways about it. Cell networks will fight as much as they can to retain their absurdly high quarterly results and keep their shareholders happy. If you don't agree with your particular network's policies, the only way to make sure they get the message that caps are bullsht, is to either call them or walk.
Hey folks!
I just got a warning letter from Sprint. They're threatening to disable service for tethering. I did a bit of searching on the forums and have seen similar threads, but thought I'd contribute so others wouldn't get flagged like I did.
I'm using CM9 Beta 1 (older version), with FL24 modem, and using WiFi Tether app to tether. Data usage for September so far has been 4.66 GB. Specific usage for data (from tethering) primarily involves web browsing, Youtube videos, Hulu, and playing Guild Wars 2 x3/week for less than 3 hour sessions each.
I'm not sure what all they can or cannot track, so I will try a newer CM9 or CM10 and use wired tethering instead to see if that helps. If I get terminated, oh well. After surcharges and tax, I'm paying 160 for two lines. The other phone on the line is a basic flip phone, of all things. I use tethering since it's more ideal than the campus wifi here.
If push comes to shove and I get terminated, I'll check out T-Mobile since their signal is strong-ish in this area. Not sure what factor/s caused the flag letter, but just posting the info so you could perhaps avoid it!
Good luck folks! :highfive:
They will be able to tell that you are tethering, it doesn't matter what ROM you are using or how you are tethering.
All of the information is in the packets that are being sent on the network. Everything from what browser you are using, operating system, which version of flash/java you have installed, etc...
Sent from my SPH-D710 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
Mattix724 said:
They will be able to tell that you are tethering, it doesn't matter what ROM you are using or how you are tethering.
All of the information is in the packets that are being sent on the network. Everything from what browser you are using, operating system, which version of flash/java you have installed, etc...
Sent from my SPH-D710 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
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Thanks for the info. From all the searching I've done across several different forums, this seems to be a consistent but very RANDOM problem (the letter). I wonder if they just do random checks on random people?? I saw a guy get a flag letter for using 100+GB, but I'm below 5GB. Is anyone else getting this letter?
Mattix724 said:
They will be able to tell that you are tethering, it doesn't matter what ROM you are using or how you are tethering.
All of the information is in the packets that are being sent on the network. Everything from what browser you are using, operating system, which version of flash/java you have installed, etc...
Sent from my SPH-D710 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
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The real question is what they are looking at. Truth is we probably won't know and things change.
Just looking at user agent strings in post and get requests will result in false positives when a user has their android browser using a Windows Chrome user agent string. Its not terribly intensive to spot check traffic on port 80 to see whats going on but probably not the most efficient or fool proof way. Especially when the heavier users of the network are not just casually using a web browser.
Desktop Youtube and Hulu are likely to raise flags. Even the most passive of monitoring will catch these 2. When a tower experiences any amount of unusual congestion someone is likely to take a look at why and see something usual triggers won't notify on. More active solutions are likely to notice an account without tethering connecting to a known game server IP on a known port. Not so much a problem with say hosted FPS servers more of a problem with MMO's.
If they know exactly what they want to look for its very easy to put an automated solution in place. They don't always know what a user is doing on the network and spot checks during unusual congestion will turn things up. All from network administration point of view less of an accurate carrier view though.
Hey guys an update on what I did.
I just got back and found an OK deal. I'm not sure what you guys were paying for Sprint, but I was paying (after taxes and surcharges) 160/mo. for two lines, unlimited data + 2k non cell-to-cell mins and unlimited everything else. I ended up going T-Mobile and it's looking like the bill will be around 130/mo for 3, not 2 lines. One will have unlimited data, the other two are basic flip phones. Everything else is unlimited.
After bugging the living crap out of the representative and asking repeatedly throughout the sales process, it seems like they have a more flexible, less technical data plan. If this is not true, I'll necro this thread sometime to let everyone know.
Although the 130/mo for 3 lines looks good on paper, I did have to put down (after taxes) $430 for the three phones (GS-4, x2 basic flip phones) - not a pretty amount. After bugging them about how much it cost, they at least gave me a zagg screen protector and some crappy.. body armor? body guard? phone case. Not bad.
I mentioned my usage with tethering in the original post. Should things go sour the same way it did with Sprint, I'll update this thread and let everyone know what happened in detail. Supposedly the rep at the store was an avid user for tethering as well, though he only hinted it, telling me there's little for me to worry from his 'personal' experience.
On another note, I did have an incident with Sprint in the past. My phone was evidently set on automatic connection and Sprint literally kicked my phone off the plan for something they called 'excessive roaming'. They claimed they sent me a warning letter beforehand.. and I'm sure they did. My desk is a mess. The guy over at T-Mobile told me roaming was truly unlimited, but I won't take my chances just in case.
Data speed differences in the Denver Metropolitan area are significant. Speed Test shows around 1.5mbps DL Sprint WiMax, 8.16mbps DL T-Mobile "LTE" (Someone told me T-Mobile LTE isn't 'real' LTE. Not sure on this). 10 tests each were done and averaged. 5 tests indoors, 5 tests outdoors.
Thanks for the responses/input - it helped me make my decision. This forum has always been nothing short of awesome. :good:
Besides the regular internet speed tests, is there a definitive website and/or app that allows you to say for sure that your device is being throttled.? I've been working on this for a week now but cannot find a good and specific answer online.
Thank you
Another difficult question
No, There isn't a way to definitively say you are throttled or not.
There are many more larger questions here.
For instance, Define throttled. Are you referring to a specific rate limit set on your device? Rate limit as in, Traffic exceeding the rate limit are either queued, And sent at a lower rate period (Packet Scheduling). Or dropped (Rate Limiting).
I doubt ATT has placed a rate limit on your connection. They are in the business of having happy customers. Specifically making your connection slow is bad business to them. Now, Placing limits
Now, Another form of limiting could be construed into how their gear is setup. Let's say they are running a 5Mhz LTE channel. Which is capable of 20Mb/s up/down. But the gear technically can run a 40Mhz LTE channel giving you 400Mb/s up/down. Are they "Throttling" you because they choose not to run the gear at it's highest operating spec? You could say that. But it's a horrible way of looking at it.
Finally, the better question is what does it matter? In my youth I spent many a day trying to find data like this. If your service is working poorly. And your expectation is to provide proof of throttling in some attempt to change your service. I can tell you. Don't waste your time. Even if you had proof. No one at ATT cares that you found out you were throttled. Or care to do anything about it.