Develop Bugs

Windows Embedded Compact 7 (CE7) released!

Microsoft officially unveiled WinCE7 which is widely believed to be the core of Windows Phone 7. Not only that, but they made a CTP download available. To grab it go to https://connect.microsoft.com/directory/non-feedback, find the "Windows Embedded Compact" product and click apply (it will automatically accept you). This is just a CTP and the product is expected to RTM Q4 of this year.
Hopefully this will help out the WP7 porting/hacking process.

oooh damn 8017 mb lol

thanks for notifying!

Been waiting for this, the headers will have alot of good stuff we need to push WP7 dev up Downloading!

Da_G said:
Been waiting for this, the headers will have alot of good stuff we need to push WP7 dev up Downloading!
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i also saw this earlier and thought it might help porting...

\WINCE700\platform\common\src\common\bldr\inc\bootdownloadbinformat.h appears to contain the structure of a flash.store.bin, but it's the same one i've looked at before, and doesn't match up with the one in the mondrian nbh, argh

RustyGrom said:
Microsoft officially unveiled WinCE7 which is widely believed to be the core of Windows Phone 7. Not only that, but they made a CTP download available. To grab it go to https://connect.microsoft.com/directory/non-feedback, find the "Windows Embedded Compact" product and click apply (it will automatically accept you). This is just a CTP and the product is expected to RTM Q4 of this year.
Hopefully this will help out the WP7 porting/hacking process.
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Click to collapse
I thought WinPh7 was based on WinCE 6.0?
http://www.osnews.com/story/22882/Windows_Phone_7_Series_To_Finally_Bring_CE_6_0_to_Users

joe_coolish said:
I thought WinPh7 was based on WinCE 6.0?
http://www.osnews.com/story/22882/Windows_Phone_7_Series_To_Finally_Bring_CE_6_0_to_Users
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Click to collapse
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=649911

Get going Da_G, we need it rapidly.

joe_coolish said:
I thought WinPh7 was based on WinCE 6.0?
http://www.osnews.com/story/22882/Windows_Phone_7_Series_To_Finally_Bring_CE_6_0_to_Users
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Indeed, the architecture documents do specifically say CE6.0.

im not progammer but i have this i duno how to use could someone help me ?

Proz00 said:
im not progammer but i have this i duno how to use could someone help me ?
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Try to MS Site, my friend

One thing I noticed after too much poking through this with a fine tooth comb,
The reason the Emulator files were marked ARMv4I Thumb in the PE headers even though they contain x86 code, is that ARMv4I Thumb is a fallback for "unknown" CPU type. I found it peculiar initially because there is a discreet "i386" value. I would guess MS has it marked somewhere as "emulated x86" rather than "i386"

hey
someone success to make NK.bin that work on qemu ?
its give me error
jumping to 0xXXXXXX somthing and halted

We are everyday nearer to the release of WP 7 , may be more leak will surface, cross our finger ... i cant help much, keep going guys...

Unless you are a good programmer, who can build a custom shell, and pick the right windows components to include in a package, there is absolutely ZERO use with this for the public.
It is a bare bones building block version of windows, which you could put on a tablet or smaller device, with a non x86 or x64 processor as well as those two kinds, which you can build your app, or shell ontop of.

Hi. i assume it is not coincidence that ctp was release in july (?) and it took just about those 5 months for wp7 hd2 dft release? and then there is of course this:
http://cotulla.pp.ru/leo/WP7S/IMAG0202.jpg
so this is the starting point hey . I am getting ce7 up along with riff box jtag, ida pro, and few other tools. I may be crazzzy but really want to get this new bldr +- oal +- nk.exe to strap up (onto- ie ce7 as quasi-firmware) a ntoskrnl.exe build.
I have win(nt) source.

Windows 8 to be the Windows Phone 7 Apollo update?

Just skimming the news. Anyone know (links please) otherwise than these claims ?
http://www.knowyourcell.com/news/1219326/windows_8_to_be_the_windows_phone_7_apollo_update.html
Source ^
Text:
Jan 25, 2012
"Renowned blogger and editor of Russian website Mobile-Review has let slip that the Windows 8 update we're looking forward to may actually be codenamed Windows Phone Apollo.
Eldar posted a tweet saying, 'Do u know that windows phone 8 os is special? May be we even dont see word phone here but that's apollo and oct2012'
This was quickly followed by a post stating Windows Phone 7 apps won't be compatible with Windows 8:
'WP8 os isn't compatible with wp7 on app level (u need to rewrite all apps). Thats another os core with metro ui...'
Just what is Mutazin suggesting here?
Will we see a separate mobile OS called Windows Phone 8, or will that be Windows Phone 7 - but a newer version?
Also, Nvidia's CEO mentioned last year that Windows Phone 7 apps would work natively on Windows 8.
Although Eldar Murtazin is very often correct with his predictions, he sometimes is way off the mark. We sincerely hope he's wrong about Windows Phone 7 apps not working on Windows 8.
After all, there are very few spectacular ones our there - surely Microsoft wouldn't want to start again?"

If it's better than windows Phone 7 then that would be great, but if it's crapy then no. I can already see disaster with people having to re-write and re-buy apps. I don't know about MS now days, some one over there must be hitting the crack pipe pretty hard.

Eldar is a moron. It has been outright stated by two much more competent sources that wp7 apps would work on windows 8.

z33dev33l said:
Eldar is a moron. It has been outright stated by two much more competent sources that wp7 apps would work on windows 8.
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Ok, cool, but did you forget the links ?

Nope, no need to dig from a mobile device. Both Nvidia and a Microsoft rep said that it'd be done. NVIDIA stated it outright, and Microsoft said that you'd be able to exit a game on your phone and pick up where you left off on your windows 8 enabled PC. I am interested in seeing how games with accelerometer controls transition or if that will require further support from the dev. Only time will tell.
Eldar was speaking ill of Mango 4 months before the beta was leaked, he's an analyst, if he's right, he predicted the future. If he's wrong, well he's not a fortune teller, his industry is a joke.

ohgood said:
Ok, cool, but did you forget the links ?
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z33dev33l said:
Nope, no need to dig from a mobile device. Both Nvidia and a Microsoft rep said that it'd be done. NVIDIA stated it outright, and Microsoft said that you'd be able to exit a game on your phone and pick up where you left off on your windows 8 enabled PC. I am interested in seeing how games with accelerometer controls transition or if that will require further support from the dev. Only time will tell.
Eldar was speaking ill of Mango 4 months before the beta was leaked, he's an analyst, if he's right, he predicted the future. If he's wrong, well he's not a fortune teller, his industry is a joke.
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Right here is the NVIDIA link --http://www.winrumors.com/nvidia-ceo-claims-windows-phone-7-apps-will-run-on-windows-8/
(date is obviously old. This new rumour in the OP's post is recent. So can't say if this link still holds the same value)
Morons will be morons.

Think about it this way wp7 marketplace is barely catching up to likes of android and ios. Why do you think any developers would bother redoing the apps for wp8. Paid apps maybe but not free apps so MS would be starting almost from scratch

z33dev33l said:
Nope, no need to dig from a mobile device. Both Nvidia and a Microsoft rep said that it'd be done. NVIDIA stated it outright, and Microsoft said that you'd be able to exit a game on your phone and pick up where you left off on your windows 8 enabled PC. I am interested in seeing how games with accelerometer controls transition or if that will require further support from the dev. Only time will tell.
Eldar was speaking ill of Mango 4 months before the beta was leaked, he's an analyst, if he's right, he predicted the future. If he's wrong, well he's not a fortune teller, his industry is a joke.
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Thats a big ass dream. Entirely plausible, but very unlikely to come from Microsoft.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk

Am I misreading or is everyone else.
NVidia and Microsoft said Windows Phone 7 apps will be natively compatible with Windows 8 the PC OS.
What Eldar is suggesting is "WP8 os isn't compatible with wp7 on app level". Honestly, that would be the most ridiculous move MS could make in the whole WP existence.
That would be so stupid that I refuse to believe it. Unless WP8 had to run WP7 in some kind of sideloaded enviroment and even then why would MS scrap and start over again?

nicksti said:
Am I misreading or is everyone else.
NVidia and Microsoft said Windows Phone 7 apps will be natively compatible with Windows 8 the PC OS.
What Eldar is suggesting is "WP8 os isn't compatible with wp7 on app level". Honestly, that would be the most ridiculous move MS could make in the whole WP existence.
That would be so stupid that I refuse to believe it. Unless WP8 had to run WP7 in some kind of sideloaded enviroment and even then why would MS scrap and start over again?
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Windows Phone 7 development uses XAML from Silver Light. Microsoft is dumping Silver Light. Perhaps Eldar misunderstood and thought they were getting rid of XAML and the development tools of Visual Studio 2010 for Windows Phone 8.
http://everythingexpress.wordpress.com/2011/11/17/news-microsoft-kills-silverlight/
Also, it is possible that the apps will all need to be retargeted and recompiled to take advantage of any OS benefits of Windows Phone 8. This was true of Mango to get the fast resume. All a dev needed to do is upgrade the SDK. Change the target platform in the project. Then rebuild. Done.

nicksti said:
Am I misreading or is everyone else.
NVidia and Microsoft said Windows Phone 7 apps will be natively compatible with Windows 8 the PC OS.
What Eldar is suggesting is "WP8 os isn't compatible with wp7 on app level". Honestly, that would be the most ridiculous move MS could make in the whole WP existence.
That would be so stupid that I refuse to believe it. Unless WP8 had to run WP7 in some kind of sideloaded enviroment and even then why would MS scrap and start over again?
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Hmm....Windows Mobile? Besides its not like they would be losing much by starting over again.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk

vetvito said:
Hmm....Windows Mobile? Besides its not like they would be losing much by starting over again.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk
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They'd lose support from the developers of the existing 60k apps for sure. Not allowing WP7 apps to run on WP8 would be suicide. That said, I wouldn't be surprised to see the development environment change to something closer to Windows 8. I just think we'll see compatibility for WP7 apps as well.

PG2G said:
They'd lose support from the developers of the existing 60k apps for sure. Not allowing WP7 apps to run on WP8 would be suicide. That said, I wouldn't be surprised to see the development environment change to something closer to Windows 8. I just think we'll see compatibility for WP7 apps as well.
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I like the idea jvt put forward up there better.... recompile and carry on. It would on the other hand be a very effective weeding out process to trim down from 50000 redundant /replicative apps to ones that are solid and usable.

Silverlight is .net and the .net libs are platform independent. That means that 90% of your code is reusable either way. The goal is that you can take a shared library that contains your program logic and copy it from your windows pc to your phone without having to recompile or anything. The only thing that then needs rewriting is the user interface lib which must then take advantage of the underlying shared API. Infact it could even be that this is already the case. Either way anything in the future would only require little effort to sort out and if any w8 windows phone convergence happens that does cause incompatability, the mass amount of windows 8 support would be enough to make it neglible.

fed44 said:
Silverlight is .net and the .net libs are platform independent. That means that 90% of your code is reusable either way. The goal is that you can take a shared library that contains your program logic and copy it from your windows pc to your phone without having to recompile or anything. The only thing that then needs rewriting is the user interface lib which must then take advantage of the underlying shared API. Infact it could even be that this is already the case. Either way anything in the future would only require little effort to sort out and if any w8 windows phone convergence happens that does cause incompatability, the mass amount of windows 8 support would be enough to make it neglible.
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Not entirely true. .NET libs are not entirely platform independant. Ever write an app for you phone in C# and try to run it on your PC. Or write it for you PC and run it on your Phone. It doesn't work.
Phones use a compact dot net framework. Windows Phone 8, might supply an updated compact version. This may be incompatible with the previous version, just as the version on Windows Phone 7 is not compatible with the 3.5 version on Windows Mobile 6.5.
In fact, Windows 8 For Tablets is supposed to be getting WinRT.
Here is a negative slanting article, but seems pretty accurate with some exceptions.
http://www.i-programmer.info/profes...3323-windows-phone-7-sunk-by-silverlight.html
I suspect the tablets will also support a dot net compact framework for some time to come.
I've heard from multiple reliable sources at work and through different training companies that Silverlight is done. Development with it is just for phones (for now).
I am hoping they provide some XAML migration, so apps can be easily converted.
Actually, when reading the comments following the video here: http://www.neowin.net/news/former-microsoft-pm-silverlight-is-dead
XAML is coming to C++. With WinRT, C++ and native programming will be in Windows 8 on tablets.
XAML is the mark up language ued by Silverlight. Silverlight uses C#. But, since the programmer uses XAML to define the UI and Silverlight is used to glue it to the C# backend, something else could easily tie the XAML to the backend, so a minimal amount of work would be needed to to rebuild the apps affter Silver Light goes off into the sunset.

What MS meant was Windows 8, not Windows Phone 8. WP8 is, of course, an upgrade of WP7.
They said this because initially they said that crossing apps between windows 8 and phone 8 was possible.

For the folks that though Microsoft might break compatibility for existing apps, a tweet from Brandon Watson
@eldarmurtazin Rewatch Mix11 keynote. We were pretty clear on this. Any app built today will run on next major Windows Phone version.
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Here is the link to the same http://www.mobiletechworld.com/2012...paign=Feed:+Mobiletechworld+(MobileTechWorld)
Sent from my TITAN X310e using Board Express

Sigh... Sometimes I just wish Eldar would let his age old hate against MS aside and try digging up some useful information...
He's been such a douché since MS wouldn't let him run the official MS Russia site...

is apollo confirmed as wp7 1gen upgrade ? Or it will be designed for high ends ?

Reminder: Don't expect the 8.1 Preview to behave.

It's a beta! It's buggy, it's slow (at least on a Surface RT).
If you use your tablet daily, stay away from this thing. Wait for the full release.

SilverHedgehog said:
It's a beta! It's buggy, it's slow (at least on a Surface RT).
If you use your tablet daily, stay away from this thing. Wait for the full release.
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expecting bumps. so far it's good and I am not experiencing any hiccups yet. I very much like the changes.
cheers

Well, I found it rather buggy - though considering how I use it, I'm rather surprised how well it works in 8.0. Still, a warning might be a good idea - I'm sick of people attacking companies when beta software is behaving like beta software.

It's also so limited in terms of the number of devices and regions it will actually install in, I rather get the impression it was a real rush job to try and show that improvements are at least coming at some point.

SilverHedgehog said:
It's a beta! It's buggy, it's slow (at least on a Surface RT).
If you use your tablet daily, stay away from this thing. Wait for the full release.
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I don`t stand by you .I think the RT 8.1 is perfect。The experience on my surface RT is nice

seven7xiaoyang said:
I don`t stand by you .I think the RT 8.1 is perfect。The experience on my surface RT is nice
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I second that.. My Surface is faster and smoother now. Especially with IE11. I have no more lags or getting the Browser to freeze. I love it!

I have the 8.1 Preview on my Surface RT and it seems fine. I wouldn't caution anybody against it based on what I've seen so far.
Tk

ToddKlindt said:
I have the 8.1 Preview on my Surface RT and it seems fine. I wouldn't caution anybody against it based on what I've seen so far.
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Jailbreak. 'Nuff said.

Using Spotify crashes the browser - worked perfectly in 8.0.

A reminder to all who find bugs: PLEASE report them to MS! This is our last chance to ask Microsoft to fix things while the software is in development. Once it ships and gets handed off to a maintenance team, changes will be much slower to arrive.
Note: while the continued restriction on running our own desktop apps is not strictly a bug, this is also a good time to complain to MS about that; it's a very easy policy for them to change, if they decide it would be worth it!

So far my experience with windows rt. 8.1 is very nice. I like the outlook 2013, the keyboard and the response time of the tablet.

GoodDayToDie said:
A reminder to all who find bugs: PLEASE report them to MS! This is our last chance to ask Microsoft to fix things while the software is in development. Once it ships and gets handed off to a maintenance team, changes will be much slower to arrive.
Note: while the continued restriction on running our own desktop apps is not strictly a bug, this is also a good time to complain to MS about that; it's a very easy policy for them to change, if they decide it would be worth it!
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You need to read up on win32 vs. RT as well as some basic application architecture, then you will see why your complaint isn't valid.
Just because it has a pretty desktop and a run box doesn't mean apps magically work... Code for winform apps has to be compiled for arm vs x86/x64 to function and that just isn't going to happen. Explorer is there for a shim/stopgap.. By win9, will likely be gone for good.
This is like winnt on alpha and 2008 on titanium all over again... Except its now in the hands of consumers that don't understand what's going on under the covers.
MS should have never put a traditional desktop/explorer in RT and just finished the port of apps to modernui because its confusing to the average user.
Just think if apple had a shortcut in iOS to give you a macosx desktop that didn't run Mac apps..
Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

@libbycm: Despite being here even longer than I have, you appear to have no idea who you're talking to *or* what you're talking about.
I maintain the Ported Apps thread for RT, and have ported a few of them myself (and should get back into it with something more realistic than Chrome, which I still hope to get working Some Day Soon Now). I am quite *personally* familiar with the requirements of porting, the difficulties of working around missing functionality (almost all of which, it should be noted, is missing by design and not neccessity), and the realities of what an ARM processor can and cannot do.
First of all, .NET apps (including WinForms ones and even once that use COM or P/Invoke to system libraries) work just fine, no recompile needed. That's a pretty small portion of the overall Windows software ecosystem, of course, but it's a growing one and also it's one that would be seen as worth targeting by more developers if they saw an actual benefit to architecture-independent toolchains on Windows.
Second, and related to the first, .NET is far from the only architecture-independent language. Java (though IKVM, though .NET) kind of works on RT already; it wouldn't take much to make a serious platform worthy of an official port. Same for Python, and we already have Perl. Yeah, that's still miniscule next to the bulk of legacy x86 code, but it would nonetheless make RT a far more popular platform (for example, many of the Windows bittorrent clients are either Java or Python code, and some very popular games are written in those languages).
Third, even with the crippled tools that we have cobbled together to do our porting, and despite the fact that it's all done on our own time, we've managed a fair number of native ports already. There'd be far more if it weren't for the fact that we can't port closed-source programs (and many open-source ones don't happily compile under MSVC, which is the only RT-targeting compiler we have right now). Already, a growing number of programs are natively available on x64 - after all, it's just a drop-down selection and another click on "Build" in Visual Studio. Well, the same is true of RT. It wouldn't get legacy software, but there's no reason that *new* software released in the last half year - even proprietary commercial stuff - couldn't support RT. After all, it's more customer base for almost no additional work (supporting x64 is sometimes actually more work than supported ARM; at least ARM uses the same-width pointers as x86).
Fourth, legacy code is - by its very nature - older code and generally suitable for running on less-powerful systems. You mentioned Apple... but you failed to mention that when Apple went from 68k CPUs to PowerPC CPUs, and then from PPC to x86, they used mostly-transparent emulation layers to bridge those gaps. Yeah, the code ran slower, but it ran well enough for most purposes. Yeah, ARM is *less* powerful than x86, not more powerful (although you could argue that the same is true for some use cases when going from a G5 to a first-gen Core Duo), but we've also gotten better at this emulation thing. When Apple did it before, they hired the best folks in the business, and pushed the entire field of CPU emulation forward with their need to make it work. When Microsoft declined to do that, one guy on XDA took it upon himself, in his free time, with only a partial toolchain and no access to Windows internals, hacking on open-source pieces, and built a transparent emulation layer for RT. Microsoft's Windows application compatibility team almost certainly loses more man-hours in one day's bathroom breaks than @mamaich has been able to spend on that project to date, and yet some of those very same people who pushed the whole industry forward at Apple, doing things like inventing what is today called dynamic recompilation, now work at Microsoft. They have the expertise to make it work if they'd wanted to.
Fifth, Windows on Itanium failed (mostly; it's still being used, just not developed) because Itaniums were targeted specifically at the enterprise market but weren't very good even there; there's plenty of software for that instruction set in the aforementioned market. Alpha (never mind Windows on Alpha, which I actually know people who used and worked on) failed because DEC wanted outrageous sums of money for it, seeking high-end margins instead of embracing the commodity market. Had they done otherwise, they might even still exist as a company today. NT on MIPS and PPC was similarly niche, targeting brand new (and poorly-merketed) segments that didn't have great penetration in the ecosystem (NT for PPC was a server/workstation OS, not a MacOS alternative). Unlike all those achitectures, though, ARM is well established in the consumer market for commodity computers, and its market share there is growing. If Microsoft is serious about succeeding with RT (and I think they are), they should look at the success story in that market... and it's not Apple anymore. Despite Apple's huge first-mover advantage with the consumer market, Android is rolling over them. Yet Microsoft seems determined to repeat many of Apple's mistakes, despite having precious few of its advantages. They need to make themselves a better Android, not a me-too Apple clone.
Sixth, while Microsoft has made no secret of their desire to move to WinRT, I don't really forsee them having much more success with that than with their prior effort to move people to .NET; lots of small developers will go, but the big programs that are the movers and shakers of the Windows world will stick with the vastly more powerful, flexible, and (frankly) useful Win32 API. Porting an app to RT is a hell of a lot harder than porting x86 native code to ARM, though...

Any way I can install 3rd party themes on Windows RT?

Hello everyone, I might came with a dumb question, but I'd like to know if there's any posibility to make Windows RT (8.0 or 8.1 Jailbroken) able to install 3rd party themes. If there's any way, then how? I've been searching everywhere and there wasn't anything for Windows RT or atleast a way without 3rd party software usage... But, if there's any posibility, it would be very nice..

It has been a while since waiting for answers and nobody had replied yet... Or just the silence might mean no..

r4d0n7 said:
It has been a while since waiting for answers and nobody had replied yet... Or just the silence might mean no..
Click to expand...
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There is no way. Every theme requires an x86 exe file. RT only support ARM exe files

Qiangong2 said:
There is no way. Every theme requires an x86 exe file. RT only support ARM exe files
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But these .exe can be recompiled for arm
https://www.xda-developers.com/how-to-compile-and-port-win32-apps-for-windows-rt/

thandiBear said:
But these .exe can be recompiled for arm
https://www.xda-developers.com/how-to-compile-and-port-win32-apps-for-windows-rt/
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Yes, but the themes he was talking about are not available for ARM

Qiangong2 said:
Yes, but the themes he was talking about are not available for ARM
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Click to collapse
How about win86emu

thandiBear said:
How about win86emu
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That doesn't support low level calls that themes require. That's also the reason you cannot run a full version of microsoft office.

Qiangong2 said:
That doesn't support low level calls that themes require. That's also the reason you cannot run a full version of microsoft office.
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Hmm I see
But I'm still content with what I've got. Only earlier this week did I come to know that Windows RT could be jailbroken. Up until now I used my surface only as a power bank for my phone, or occasionally for editing a word document.
I had almost given up on it, but it's good to see an active XDA community even for such an old device.

thandiBear said:
Hmm I see
But I'm still content with what I've got. Only earlier this week did I come to know that Windows RT could be jailbroken. Up until now I used my surface only as a power bank for my phone, or occasionally for editing a word document.
I had almost given up on it, but it's good to see an active XDA community even for such an old device.
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My surface 2 has been my only laptop for the past 3 years and I haven't needed anything more. I have my linux desktop for dev purposes, but I mainly use my surface 2 for work.

Qiangong2 said:
My surface 2 has been my only laptop for the past 3 years and I haven't needed anything more. I have my linux desktop for dev purposes, but I mainly use my surface 2 for work.
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Yep. Surface RT has been my only windows device for the last 3.5 years as well. I got it as a gift. Initially I was skeptical about whether it would be of any use for me apart from light web browsing or documents editing and I was right for the most part.
But Android has come a long way and to be honest I haven't missed windows as much as I had thought I would. I'm not a developer, so having an Android phone as a daily driver is just enough for me.
However it's always better to use every device you own to it's full potential. A potential that windows RT could never achieve under Microsoft's money minded approach towards it

Windows 10 Mobile more dead than alive

How you guys enjoying upside-down camera in Skype app (after latest update)? :laugh:
Are you still waiting for "WP internals 2.2"? Are you necromancers (or necrophils)? :laugh:
So, trust me (to a man who has and used WP much earlier than you heard about it), WP/W10M platform is almost dead, and damn M$ do everything to kill it (even hardware isn't too outdated). Best we can do, is to sell these damn handsets on eBay (while they cost at least a few bucks). I predict, this summer you'll not be able to sell L-950/Xl even for a $50!
Will be glad to hear any real-life arguments about latest M$ "bugdate"... BTW, if you really enjoy upside-down camera in Skype - please do not reply...

As i said in reddit, gonna quote myself.
The Microsoft CEO has no clue on what to do. Maybe Satya has some aces up his sleeve but at this point i serously doubt it. Like when you are watching The voice and you're waiting for Jesus Christ to come down and blow your head off... but Jesus Christ doesn't come.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Still happy for what my Lumia is....just a companion
The death of platform forced me (a complete Windows user without any other platform) to use my laptop most of times. For example, using Word for college work and some websites like my college one dosen't load properly on my Lumia 730. That times, when most of my friends use their phones for those tasks, I take out my trusty laptop. Even for Spotify, I hate the Mobile app but the desktop app and web works fine. So for me, the phone is just a companion not more than that at all, like others who use phones and iPads for little work.
Waiting for Surface Phone to change that and I want it to be more productive than Android/iOS.

ops
this is zambi
not dead

i hope my 950XL works one year more no (big) problems, camera is excellent...
btw... is easy to get back to AU and have less problems

dxdy said:
i hope my 950XL works one year more no (big) problems, camera is excellent...
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I thought so but looks like M$ have a different plan Skype is a primary functionality (at least for me). What bug we should expect next? Impossibility to make phone calls or send SMS?
dxdy said:
btw... is easy to get back to AU and have less problems
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This will not solve Skype issue. And w/o updates many apps become non-working...
But the worst news is: this showstopper means - there is ABSOLUTELY NO QUALITY ASSURANCE for releases, nobody at M$ testing/care about W10M releases! What if student-intern or outsourced contractor from Bangalore, India will add a rootkit/troyan/malicious code to the next release?!
W10M become very dangerous OS, it's not safe to use it anymore...

No, it isn't dead. In fact, Microsoft released the new build 15254.158 a few days ago.

mikevespa said:
No, it isn't dead. In fact, Microsoft released the new build 15254.158 a few days ago.
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That's a security patch... meltdown protection and other stuff... It's not like a new version of the os with features.

Sensoboston, i wat to buy your 950 xl. Detail on PM.

@augustinionut, I don't have XL. 950 only. And I'll sell 'em (we have 2) on eBay only.

I have no skype problems.
I just turned my head upside down

I suggest to the moderator of this forum, to close this thread, because it's useless and misleading. W10M is still supported and updated!
If you don't like W10M anymore, just don't use it!

mikevespa said:
I suggest to the moderator of this forum, to close this thread, because it's useless and misleading. W10M is still supported and updated!
If you don't like W10M anymore, just don't use it!
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Click to collapse
No reason to close the thread honestly, if you have evidence that it is supported and updated, then post up and let's get a real conversation going. Prove the OP wrong and let's see what MS is doing that you like, or could do better.
We can keep an eye out but I haven't seen anything in this thread that would warrant it being closed.

Windows 10 Mobile really IS more dead than alive.
If I remember correctly MS promised to backport new APIs to W10M, so it could use new or updated UWP apps. This seems like just another broken promise.
As Microsoft has removed Windows 10 Mobile from the Windows 10 SDK, this is the last nail in the coffin.
"Without presence of Mobile in the SDK, no new apps can be developed, and developers can’t update their apps anymore."
"As PC moves on, Mobile has got stuck on Redstone 2. So if a developer wants to update his UWP app, he has to split it into two versions, one for Mobile and the other for rest."
"Microsoft has already stopped updating many of their apps, and it is a matter of time before other developers follow suit."
Source: https://www.windowslatest.com/2017/12/29/mentions-windows-10-mobile-removed-windows-10-sdk/

The PRODUCT_MOBILE_CORE definition is no longer needed because the core is the same and shared among PC, mobile, XBOX, HoloLens and IoT

mikevespa said:
The PRODUCT_MOBILE_CORE definition is no longer needed because the core is the same and shared among PC, mobile, XBOX, HoloLens and IoT
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Source?

DECEMBER 2015 - Build 11082
https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexperience/2015/12/16/announcing-windows-10-insider-preview-build-11082/
This includes the changes that have also been going out as cumulative updates through Windows Update on your PCs running the Windows 10 November Update as well as on phones running Windows 10 too. We’re also working on some structural improvements to OneCore, which is the shared core of Windows across devices. Essentially, OneCore is the heart of Windows, and these improvements to OneCore make building Windows across PC, tablet, phone, IoT, Hololens and Xbox more efficient. We’re doing some code refactoring and other engineering work to make sure OneCore is optimally structured for teams to start checking in new features and improvements in the new year."
JANUARY 2016 - Build 11099
https://blogs.windows.com/windowsex...ncing-windows-10-insider-preview-build-11099/
"this build does not include big noticeable changes or new features yet. Our focus through the holidays was on structural improvements to OneCore, which is the shared core of Windows across devices. The code refactoring and other engineering work we’ve been doing to optimize OneCore is nearing the point where we will be ready for teams to begin checking in new features and improvements. It will still be a few builds before any really noticeable changes show up, depending on when teams begin lighting up new features in their areas. We’re excited for Insiders to use this build to validate the work we’ve been doing to OneCore, so give this build a try and let us know of any issues you run into via the Windows Feedback app."
AUGUST 2016 - Anniversary Update
https://blogs.windows.com/windowsex...indows-10-insider-preview-build-14901-for-pc/
"We are focusing on making some structural improvements to OneCore which is the shared “heart” of Windows across PC, tablet, phone, IoT, Hololens and Xbox. We’re doing some code refactoring and other engineering work to make sure OneCore is optimally structured for teams to start checking in new features and improvements in a few months. As a result, these builds may include more bugs and other issues that could be slightly more painful for some people to live with"
APRIL 2017
https://blogs.windows.com/windowsex...er-preview-build-16176-pc-build-15204-mobile/
"We are also releasing Windows 10 Mobile Insider Preview Build 15204 to Insiders in the Fast ring. As we release new builds from our Development Branch for PC, we will also be doing the same for Windows 10 Mobile just like we have been in the past. However, Windows Insiders will likely notice some minor differences. The biggest difference being that the build number and branch won’t match the builds we will be releasing for PC. This is a result of more work we’re doing to converge code into OneCore – the heart of Windows across PC, tablet, phone, IoT, HoloLens, Xbox and more as we continue to develop new improvements for Windows 10 Mobile and our enterprise customers."

mikevespa said:
APRIL 2017
https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexp...-15204-mobile/
"We are also releasing Windows 10 Mobile Insider Preview Build 15204 to Insiders in the Fast ring. As we release new builds from our Development Branch for PC, we will also be doing the same for Windows 10 Mobile just like we have been in the past. However, Windows Insiders will likely notice some minor differences. The biggest difference being that the build number and branch won’t match the builds we will be releasing for PC.
This is a result of more work we’re doing to converge code into OneCore – the heart of Windows across PC, tablet, phone, IoT, HoloLens, Xbox and more as we continue to develop new improvements for Windows 10 Mobile and our enterprise customers."
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Click to collapse
Your info is from when Windows Mobile 10 was pulled out of Windows 10 "main" branch with the "feature2" branch and was basically frozen at Redstone 2. Which of course means that any further development and improvements of OneCore from there on will never reach W10M. Just like other parts of the OS will never get updated, W10M is stuck with Edge version 40 and won't get any new Cortana features.
W10M has not been part of the OneCore development since it was left behind in "feature2".
That's the reason why Microsoft said they would backport some APIs from Redstone 3 (Fall Creators Update) and Redstone 4 to W10M "feature2" / Redstone 2. But the question now is if they changed their minds, when they are already removing W10M from the Windows 10 SDK.
BTW, the "PRODUCT_MOBILE_CORE" definition has nothing to do with OneCore / Windows kernel. It's a definition in the GetProductInfo function which tells a program which product type of Windows it's running on. "_CORE" in this case is just used for basic / consumer editions, like "PRODUCT_CORE" is used for Windows 10 Home and "PRODUCT_PROFESSIONAL" is used for Windows 10 Pro. There even was a "PRODUCT_MOBILE_ENTERPRISE" for Windows 10 Mobile Enterprise.

sensboston said:
How you guys enjoying upside-down camera in Skype app (after latest update)? :laugh:
Are you still waiting for "WP internals 2.2"? Are you necromancers (or necrophils)? :laugh:
So, trust me (to a man who has and used WP much earlier than you heard about it), WP/W10M platform is almost dead, and damn M$ do everything to kill it (even hardware isn't too outdated). Best we can do, is to sell these damn handsets on eBay (while they cost at least a few bucks). I predict, this summer you'll not be able to sell L-950/Xl even for a $50!
Will be glad to hear any real-life arguments about latest M$ "bugdate"... BTW, if you really enjoy upside-down camera in Skype - please do not reply...
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It is in ones perspective.
From a consumer standpoint the Devices dropped off and the OS is crawling along instead of running with the other builds like before. Unfortunately W10M is heading to a dead end. Fortunately for me it has no bearing either way. My phone calls still work, email, data, wifi etc. No need to move to something else, or declare my device obsolete. Ya Microsoft is not officially supporting W10M with no builds and features, but it is still supported with patches and such. For me to have a 4 year old device (in some cases) still running the latest and greatest Microsoft has to offer is fine by me. We all have different needs. If it aint working for you then it is fine to find what you need that does work. I personally really enjoy the basic functionality out of the box of the Lumias. Plus it is easy and cheap to find parts if something fixable on them breaks
From a developer standpoint, I bet this feels like a shot in the foot though from Microsoft in some ways. They basically drove off all their developers by not pushing out newer mobile devices or ways to make the Windows OS stick on phones. But maybe that was their plan since 2015...That is the way I see it anyway

nate0 said:
My phone calls still work, email, data, wifi etc.
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But what do you do with a Skype, may I ask you? Do you do acrobatic stunts and meet other people via Skype on your head?
I believe, my 9 yo "dumb phone" from Motorola still can receive phone calls, emails etc. (but I never tried since 2010) if I'll find working and active "big" SIM-card. But this definitely not a point! My point is: Lumia 950 (handset costs me about $650 - via 2 years contract extension with AT&T) become unusable for most common tasks. I can't use Skype, I can't control quadcopter with it, I can't even unlock a bicycle from VBikes company! And can't do a lot of other things...
And, finally, I'm really tired from the usual L-950 customers "prayer": "But the camera is outstanding!" No, sir, nothing outstanding for the current times.