Develop Bugs

What the...

I would suggest that the Desire forum be combined with the Nexus One and called Bravo. They are the same device with a couple small variations. Other devices (Universal comes to mind) had hardware variants but were not broken out into 2 sub forums.
-Mc

It's a different phone though, it has Sense UI and more Ram.
It's like the G1 and HTC Magic being the same apart from the Magic having no keyboard... they still have different forums.

Sense UI is a software front end (and ALL variants have different software). And the Universal also has different versions, some with double the RAM of others. It is the same device, same platform, same hardware. Since you can install the Nexus One ROM on the Desire with NO porting, it's the same device. They also have identical hardware specs with the exception of a little more RAM to accommodate Sense and the optical joystick.
The Magic and G1 were completely different in the sense that one had a keyboard and one did not. If the Desire had a physical keyboard, I'd agree with you.
This will do nothing but segment development and resources.

But it is different hardware, considering the 64mb more ram and the missing second mic and the hard buttons instead of soft touch buttons and the optical mouse.
And the porting, i think there was some kind of changes, or why else is there already alpha version 7 when not cause of the bugs?
Is this enough different hardware to give it its own forum?
Also i´m quite sure, that rooting might be kind of harder than on the nexus, or does anybody know something about it yet?

so should the developer versions of Google phones get their own forum? HTC has slightly changed devices throughout it's history but we've never given them their own subforum.
e.g.
The HTC Kaiser has a front facing camera. AT&T's does not. Did the Tilt get it's own forum?
The original Universal had 64MB of RAM. The updated T-Mobile version has 128. Did it get it's own forum?
The HTC 620, 621, and 622 had differences, one didn't have WiFi, the others did.
The HTC Wizard is different enough between some versions that if you flash a ROM from one on to the other, it will kill it.
Some devices have Sense, some do not. Should they get their own forums? And what happens if the ones that didn't suddenly get SenseUI in an update. Do they lose their own forums?
Look, I don't own XDA and those that do can certainly do what they want. But I've gone through the FCC documents and looked at the ROMimages between the two. They are the same device with differences exactly like the examples I used above (and there are many more). Segmenting the two only hampers development efforts.
-Mc

McHale said:
The HTC 620, 621, and 622 had differences, one didn't have WiFi, the others did.
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Not only that, but the S640. Telus only device, different chasis then those, CDMA, but some people were saying it should be lumped in with the other 6XX line.

I don't know about you but the HTC Sapphire Forums is littered between 32A and 32B ROMs.

Taknarosh said:
I don't know about you but the HTC Sapphire Forums is littered between 32A and 32B ROMs.
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Agreed... N1/Desire should be kept seperate!
Especially since they probaly do not share hboots and radios... So keeping the forums seperate minimizes risks of people flashing wrong stuff (as was seen on 32A/B quite often)

Epedemic said:
Agreed... N1/Desire should be kept seperate!
Especially since they probaly do not share hboots and radios... So keeping the forums seperate minimizes risks of people flashing wrong stuff (as was seen on 32A/B quite often)
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They DO share hboots and radios. They are the same phone. That's my point. Next, we'll start new sub forums for different case colors or carriers or logos or...

If they share radio/hboot they can flash the same ROMs without porting? If that is so, they should have the same section in my opinion.

The partition layouts are different on the devices. So no...you cant just take a rom from one and have it work straight away.
People have managed to get Desire Roms running on the n1, but they had to move system data to the data partition to do so.
The Desire is also unlikley to be rootable via unlocking the bootloader. If we put both devices in one section it would just confuse the nooblets.

SGTDavePwnage said:
If we put both devices in one section it would just confuse the nooblets.
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Man if we used THAT as a compass around here, we'd be better off closing the site entirely. You can confuse them no matter what you do. Again, look at the Universal threads. Different RAM sizes but both versions lived happily ever after in the same forum. This site was NEVER intended for newbs. It shouldn't. If it did, most of us would leave.
How much do you guys wanna bet that many ROM's will be made in Nexus1 and Desire flavors. How many LITE ROMS have you seen on XDA? A lite ROM will work on either device without ANY porting or special mods. Why not have them in the same thread/forum?

I think if their roms are cross compatible, why not have the development sections mergered? They could have separate sections but once some1 clicks on development for N1 or Desire they are lead to the same page.

yes this could be the best as i see it. there are differences, radio buttons etc,,, there might be other differences for general question etc. but if the two of them have the same structure for roms then maedhros suggested the best, why not having them into one development section!

if any1 can proove for me that they share the exact same spl, radio and partition layout then im on it! as it could be the last extra rams that have been used for the /system partition else i think it is like mixing up da hero and sapphire as they are close, but biggest difference is software based

I agree that If the 2 are proved to be identical in development terms upon the desires release, then the forums could be merged, with perhaps a couple of stickies at the top explaining what you need to do to root the phone before you can use the roms. However this should not be done until this proven conclusively on a released phone.

IF roms that can be used on both devices using the same unlocking techniques become a reality, i will take this suggestion up with administration.
(But that won't be soon)

McHale said:
Man if we used THAT as a compass around here, we'd be better off closing the site entirely. You can confuse them no matter what you do. Again, look at the Universal threads. Different RAM sizes but both versions lived happily ever after in the same forum. This site was NEVER intended for newbs. It shouldn't. If it did, most of us would leave.
How much do you guys wanna bet that many ROM's will be made in Nexus1 and Desire flavors. How many LITE ROMS have you seen on XDA? A lite ROM will work on either device without ANY porting or special mods. Why not have them in the same thread/forum?
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This is an absolute appalling comment. Condescending and unhelpful. Everyone has to start at some point and a vast silent majority of people visit the site to learn and root... Unless one can prove that you cannot harm one of the devices by using a ROM for the other, the threads should be separated, even if it cost a few duplicates...

globiboulga said:
This is an absolute appalling comment. Condescending and unhelpful. Everyone has to start at some point and a vast silent majority of people visit the site to learn and root... Unless one can prove that you cannot harm one of the devices by using a ROM for the other, the threads should be separated, even if it cost a few duplicates...
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You either took it wrong or are being a troll. XDA is a developers and hackers forum. We are all newbs at some point but this forum isn't designed for the newb. It's designed for the hacker/developer. I'm not ripping on newbs for being newbs. Hell, I'm a newb again as I just got my AT&T Nexus One yesterday - my first Android phone. But I'm reading and searching and won't have a reason to ask a question for quite some time. All of the information is already here on XDA. Newbs are welcome but we expect them to SEARCH and READ before asking a lot of questions. Some do, some don't. But if we dumbed down the forum, it would ruin it. There'd be so much crap to wade through and so many duplicate threads it'd be too time consuming to do so. THAT was my point.
Maybe we should have separate Desire forums for the silver version and a separate forum for the charcoal version. That should help, right? Because newbs who don't read are going to ask over and over if the ROM being discussed will work on their particular color of Desire. And that won't make anything confusing, right? Some ROMS posted in one forum and some posted in the other (just like the Desire vs. Nexus One). People will continually ask if the ROM will work on their device because it was in a different forum.
And FYI, you can harm the device just as easy using the correct ROM on the same device, or by running a simple command, or... If they read everything before they start, they will have no problems. If they don't read, well, we can't hold their hands.
This forum is catered to experienced hackers. We will help newbs through every part of every process, but this is still a forum for experienced hackers. If you don't like that, find a place that spoon feeds or does things for you. And if this place ever turns into a forum that spoon feeds and everyone asks to do things for them, most of us will surely leave. Then who will help them?

the question is why not?
Why is it important to you to keep them in one section? are you thinking about server space utilizing ?
I mean what is the harm of making them in separate sections (what is the harm to you)?

windows mobile on htc desire? possible? worthwhile ?

Hi, as I am not overly fond of the android operating system,
is the hardware such that you could flash a 6.5 windows mobile rom onto the desire?
is it worthwhile trying?

It is impossible, android is open source and thus can be modified to run on diffrent hardware, windows mobile isnt, plus we have diff bootloaders to winmo phones so a flash wud be impossible
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

Do people literally NEVER use the search feature then?
How many people are going to post the same ridiculously foolish question?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=693158
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=697718
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=6731090
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=677930
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=675647
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=6183231
Use the bloody search.

its not a foolish question, i have been active on various sections of xda developers forums and have contributed and gained from each of them, tinkering with a variety of models, I was thinking of buying a desire but wanted to see just how much I can mess with it first .
I have found the majority of people on these forums to be helpful and whilst I understand your frustration, I will be new to this part of the site. And with so many threads its not always easy to find exactly what your looking for
What differs in the hardware to make it impossible? is it just partitioning of the space on the phone? surely if someone wrote a bootloader it would be possible?

If you want to dual boot, you might want to get a HD2 instead, my understanding is that the android rom is in developement.
The desire is pretty much a pure Anroid phone, im not sure that there would be much demand to get winmo workingon it since most people have switched from winmo out of choice and don't really feel the need to go back, but thats just my slant on it. crazier things have happened on this forum.

For starters the drivers were written using the android open source project, every single driver for every tiny piece of hardware would habe to be rewritten lol
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

i have read your other posts and understand your frustrations but the whole reason I buy each model is to see how much I can mess with it
would be interesting to see such development in the ROM developement section
but if there is a technical reason why its impossible ( apart from the lack of SPL)
then someone please tell me, as I have not brought the handset yet hehe
what I always say is where there is a will there is a way
as for why ? i dont know... just to see if it can be broken - whats the point in having system you cant break or change Zzzzz
although I do appreciate somethings are impossible.
Can some one explain (if any) the differences in hardware from the hd2 to the desire that will make this task impossile ?
would be much appreciated xxx thanks

I doubt it'd be impossible - but it's take a huge ammount of R&D and developers on here don't have that sort of time/money to undertake such a task...
Just get an HD2 if you want WinMo (can buy my old one if you want? )

The rock bottom is it wud be illegal, it would be in violation of microsofts intelectual rights and for that matter is neva gunna happen here, when we owned windows phones we bought a licence to use windows mobile, with our desire we get no such licence, this would also make it piracy
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

With that argument surely baking and distributing custom ROMs would also be illegal? Do that on a Windows PC and you'd get sued!!
But yeah, agree with you

Microsoft have tried to shut xda dwn for that reason many times, but they have always backed down, if a project lyk this was started on a non winmo phone i guarantee they wudnt
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

bungle2k3 said:
its not a foolish question
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It is when it's been asked and answered multiple times. Being such a long standing XDA user you'd think you'd have had a gander at the rules by now or at least attempt to adhere to them.
bungle2k3 said:
And with so many threads its not always easy to find exactly what your looking for
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The 6 posts I posted were found with a single search of "Windows Mobile, Desire" up in that search box you completely ignored. So, yes, it is easy...you just didn't even try.

EddyOS said:
With that argument surely baking and distributing custom ROMs would also be illegal?
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Android is open source...Windows Mobile isn't.

I have seen many questions asking if windows mobile can be ported to the desire. But this post explains it better than any other why it can't.
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App

Aitese said:
Android is open source...Windows Mobile isn't.
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That's what I meant, Microsoft sueing chefs for distributing custom WinMo ROMs...I know Android doesn't matter

Aitese said:
It is when it's been asked and answered multiple times. Being such a long standing XDA user you'd think you'd have had a gander at the rules by now or at least attempt to adhere to them.
The 6 posts I posted were found with a single search of "Windows Mobile, Desire" up in that search box you completely ignored. So, yes, it is easy...you just didn't even try.
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Aitese, I do understand your frustration, multiple posts are a no no yes, but I was putting a different slant on it. ie I didnt really grasp from the other threads technically what was stopping us from achieving this task so thats not stupid in my opinion and hasnt been broken down in major detail. My curiosity is that the HD2 and desire seem exactly the same in terms of hardware, yet people suggest that swapping operating systems is impossible.
however, I do now accept that it may not be worth doing
but none of the previous threads seem to explain why that is in any great technical detail (no doubt ul find this now haha), at least now we have discovered whats stopping some one from doing it.
ps I reserve all right to be a lazy noob, to my knowledge I have not broken any other forum rules, as this is not exactly a double post, similar subject yes but if anything this thread would save a curious person like myself from attempting something that might be infringement ..
at least now I wont try

EddyOS said:
I doubt it'd be impossible - but it's take a huge ammount of R&D and developers on here don't have that sort of time/money to undertake such a task...
Just get an HD2 if you want WinMo (can buy my old one if you want? )
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.. how much ; )
ps what varies from the desire to the hd2 in terms of hardware
looks like nowt

love this thread!
ive been trying to get away from my touch HD to android - had to go via a free HD2 upgrade to get here......trust me, windows needs a major overall to tempt me to go back

thats what everybody says .. but my curiosity is that in terms of hardware specs the hd2 and the desire look the same, apart from a bit more ram on the desire ?!?
so... er ... why would the drivers vary that much ?
pls be patient with me I just like messing with stuff
on further playing with android I must say it does seem to have the edge over win mob

persisting with this annoying thread (sorry guys) but what is to stop me using mtty to format my device and flashing the hd2 stock rom to the desire?
ie what would the compatibilty issues be? (as by looks of it hardware is the same give or take a bit of extra ram)
could this be done, and would it just be a case of using a tweaked RUU that would ignore the model number? would this work?
I am guessing the buttons would have to be remapped but what other compatibilty issues would there be ? basically is it possible or is the file structure totally different in a way that would not allow it?
(ps sorry if its something obvious and im making myself look a dummy but from what I can see the HD2 and the Desire are very similar in spec)

[Q] CDMA Desire (US Cellular)

I just saw a video review of US Cellular's new CDMA version of the HTC Desire. No doubt the people who buy this phone will discover all sorts of information on this forum... info that could (I'd imagine) seriously harm their phone if they try to flash their CDMA Desire with a GSM Desire ROM!
Might it be appropriate to give this variant its own subforum? Or failing that, post some prominent warnings that the US Cellular HTC Desire is a significantly different piece of hardware?

I guess nobody with one of these has discovered the forum here yet?

(noob here). Can it really cause that much problems? I'm going to be picking up the Desire from Telus soon. Are you saying that I won't be able to use the current custom ROMS?

couto607 said:
(noob here). Can it really cause that much problems? I'm going to be picking up the Desire from Telus soon. Are you saying that I won't be able to use the current custom ROMS?
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The Telus Desire is not CDMA - it's GSM/HSPA like all the others. Custom ROMs will work as long as they support the SLCD screen (some are written only for AMOLED screens).
I'm specifically talking about the US Cellular HTC Desire, which is the first CDMA version to be released.

And so it begins...
http://androidforums.com/htc-desire/147600-us-cellular-desire-available-aug-27th.html
I have mine as well. Can we root with the guides using the desire from other carriers?
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http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=7873651
Kcarpenter said:
My brother just picked up a desire and wants to root it.
...
And has anyone who has gotten the new USC Desire, have you tried the current root method to see if it works. I have doubts that it will.
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Click to collapse

agree with the OP.
just like the sprint hero and the GSM hero.
need to be a subsection. like you said it could seriously damage the phones if they flash the wrong things. hope a mod creates a different section soon.

+1 on that. There's a lot of people out there who don't even know the different between GSM & CDMA.

Also, it would help for development in general (root and roms.)

I really think the mods should open seperate forums for Desire GSM and Desire CDMA, because as both phones use completely different radios, chances are it will wreck the phone if you put a GSM ROM on a CDMA phone.

Anyone know who any of the mods for the Desire forum are? I would just PM them but I'm not sure who they are.

[Q] Suggestion for making HTC Desire CDMA/GSM in seperate threads

Ever since I got this phone when it came out in the US I came on here and all I was seeing was GSM this and that. Now its even harder to find anything.
I used to work on phones with the help with the XDA forums. since last year I haven't found crap..well not much to get anywhere.
Just a suggestion.
I believe HTC Desire in the UK hit number one beating the iPhone so yes this phone is very popular and I really think there should be two threads for GSM Phones only and CDMA Phones only.
I spent hours on here and really didn't come up with anything that would help because by the time i finish reading it says for GSM phones only. URGH!!

I'm working on a CDMA Megathread, because it will hopefully bring in more development to our phones.

Thank you very much. I'm sure others will appreciate it as well.

Jereso said:
I'm working on a CDMA Megathread, because it will hopefully bring in more development to our phones.
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So I'm assuming it's a no go?
I just want to root my phone. I'll keep reading more.

Nevermind I think I found what I need to read that you posted
[CDMA][TUTORIAL SET]CDMA Desire Informational Thread
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1182853

Should Virgin Mobile Desire 816 have its own Forum?

I was going through the threads and what really bugs me is the virgin mobile desire development is mixed up with the Europe version. I know the phones are identical but we have a different Hboot and Software. We should separate the two versions in two different threads making it easier for users to follow the development phase.

Would make a lot of sense, however I feel like there's not enough development on this device to even bother with the separation. Plus I feel like in the future, developers who might want to make stuff for the 816 would go for the other (dual sim) versions, so the VM one would either get way less development, or all its development a lot later, when our favorite devs were asked to port it to the VM version.

I agree with this as well. Merging the types has caused irreversible bricks for people who aren't savvy in these things especially if they haven't backed up their original software via Nandroid. Now you may think just download an RUU but those are not available for the Virgin Mobile model and finding and using someone else's nandroid isn't a simple drag and drop process including the fact that they can't boot the system. They would indeed have to use for example Cyanogenmod but then people aren't even sure if its possible to restore an original backup from Cyanogen.
On top of that there is a custom kernel but no one has uploaded an original for those who want to go back to stock for squaretrade insurance purposes maybe? I would possibly hear, this sounds like a "you" problem but regardless of the device they were produced and people do use them and some people do like to mod them to the fullest extent to call it "theirs". You might say just learn but it isn't that simple for everyone. What takes an expert a few minutes/hours to arrange may take a new person months or years and with risk that they cannot restore the device in the case of a bad flash. Just saying to consider everyone not just the general population. Minorities in society deserve a chance no?
Me? Saying; I am one of these people but I can understand the difficulty when navigating through something and when their using purely codenames such as a5_dug it makes it no simpler.
One reason for this phone.
Its available in payments on the shopping websites. 199 and 6 months to pay it off with no credit check? Yes please.
Sent from my 710C using XDA Free mobile app

FoxyDrew said:
Would make a lot of sense, however I feel like there's not enough development on this device to even bother with the separation. Plus I feel like in the future, developers who might want to make stuff for the 816 would go for the other (dual sim) versions, so the VM one would either get way less development, or all its development a lot later, when our favorite devs were asked to port it to the VM version.
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My thoughts exactly :good:

kr338r said:
My thoughts exactly :good:
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From March 2014 to now. Rarely spoken of out of 100's of Androids. Because of the price now development is increasing. Your really telling me separating the two forums would cost you enough time to not do it? There are phones that have no development on here and are completely sectioned out amazingly.

jaysoblitzed said:
From March 2014 to now. Rarely spoken of out of 100's of Androids. Because of the price now development is increasing. Your really telling me separating the two forums would cost you enough time to not do it? There are phones that have no development on here and are completely sectioned out amazingly.
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Funny!!!
Talk @ confusion, I saw this in the CM11 thread?
"One question; how the F*** for the life of day and night do you restore this device back to stock without an official RUU for Virgin Mobile? "
Just messin w/ ya, splitting development would not be a good idea IMHO, more of these phones were sold for months outside of US.
VM owners are probably a small minority, so most devs probably wouldn't be bothered with our ROM, give it time, if there's market penetration, we could think @ a split from WW dev.
(as it is, there isn't much going on in dev right now anyway, I'm thankful for the CM11 port we have from Grarak & v_superuser)

Truth be told, things would be easier for us if there was a separate sub forum but it wouldn't favor us as far as development goes.
To the best of my knowledge there are a handful of devs who work with VM phones. I'm not exactly sure if any of them have jumped on the 816.
Until that happens I think it's in our best interest to hang out and wait. Right now we're dependent on those that have had the phone for about 6 months longer than we have..
v_superuser and Garak have posted their CM11 in a cl;ear enough way that DLing and running that rom should be pretty straightforward. If any future roms are posted in the same way there should be no confusion.
That being said, I can see a VM specific subforum being helpful for people who may be starting out and aren't sure about general stuff relating to VM bloatware etc.

kr338r said:
Funny!!!
Talk @ confusion, I saw this in the CM11 thread?
"One question; how the F*** for the life of day and night do you restore this device back to stock without an official RUU for Virgin Mobile? "
Just messin w/ ya, splitting development would not be a good idea IMHO, more of these phones were sold for months outside of US.
VM owners are probably a small minority, so most devs probably wouldn't be bothered with our ROM, give it time, if there's market penetration, we could think @ a split from WW dev.
(as it is, there isn't much going on in dev right now anyway, I'm thankful for the CM11 port we have from Grarak & v_superuser)
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Lol . I bricked this phone 4 times going back and forth; from the Stock ROM, to the Chinese sort of stock ROM, to Cyanogen. Done erased my /sdcard to where it wasn't mountable and brought it back with Cyanogen and sideload. (Luckily, the bootloader wasn't affected by the amount of **** I threw at it.) Tested 3 different recoveries only to find out the old version from the CM11 post was the only one that really worked the properly.
I was able to start it back up and continue to put the backup onto the internal storage since I didn't have an external SD on hand; BUT then I found out that the backup was 1.96 GBs and needed to be in the /data/media/clockworkmod/backup section of the device which was inaccessible via normal USB methods since your stuck in /data/media/0 and is considered basically a completely different partition. This phone has 8GB internal and uses 4.xxGB with its normal software when installed (yes even with Cyan) then I just put a 1.96 GB file so it was basically stopping me from copying the whole folder which was just ever so slightly annoying since I had to use ES file explorer, make a new folder with the same name, then; one by one Cut and Paste each file into the new folder in the /backup folder. This might seem like a simple process but with absolutely no guides out there for a guideline this really sucked. It's basically like; if you have this device then you know how to flash/root/etc as the norm. Trial and error. -_-
Then after looking around and seeing that VM had 55$ for their plan. I saw that Straight Talk was able to accept the MEID of this VM device without a hitch, but then I looked into different carriers for even better alternatives and saw that Ringplus had $17.99 for Unlimited Talk/Text/400MB 3G/4GLTE. I thought **** why not? Turns out Ringplus doesn't accept VM devices. (Sucks)
SO then I decided to "spoof" the IMEI/MEID/ESN with DFS/QPST (Experience) and I was able to get the MEID/ESN to change and get EvDo Rev.A service but to no avail with LTE since the IMEI is "unspoofable" without S-Off. I thought well why not $17.99 for unlimited T&T w/data? Signed up with my new "S3". lmfao
Purpose of this post?
There was at least 3-10 topics I could cover for VM Desire devices now.
:victory::victory::victory:

Maybe this is a dumb question but if the VM version isn't capable of dual numbers or being ported or used anywhere else why does VM advertise this as dual sim on their site as part of the device name? What would be the point of the false advertising.

carnivalrejectq said:
Maybe this is a dumb question but if the VM version isn't capable of dual numbers or being ported or used anywhere else why does VM advertise this as dual sim on their site as part of the device name? What would be the point of the false advertising.
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I just checked out the VMUSA site and couldn't find anything about dual sim. I did however see "Dual Mode" used for the phone. Dual mode is just a term to say that the phone uses both CDMA and GSM. CDMA for 3G and GSM for LTE.

An answer could be to have a thread under "Desire 816 General" called "Virgin Mobile Issues" or something similar. I'm guessing there could be enough traffic to keep it on the first page for a while. For example I'm still curious exactly how the -chl is best classified. Is this hybrid best thought of as a single or dual sim? Will getting s-off allow the phone (with some rom work) to be used by another carrier? Having all these VM specific questions and answers in one place would be a plus and it shouldn't interfere with the Q&A being done on the true dev work here in other threads.