Related
http://www.engadget.com/2011/01/18/visualized-the-glamorous-lifestyles-of-wp7-jailbreakers/
Sooo awesome
Good on you MS.
It's important nowadays for these companies to find a middle ground between locking a product down completely and opening it for everyone/anyone to mess with.
On one hand, if they lock it down, piracy will inevitably occur on a wide scale.
If they open it up, they won't make any money for future developments.
It's good to see they're taking an open approach and using there heads for a change.
its a good thing for MS open up and listen to idea.. wp7 has a bright future.. i haven't touch my droid since oct
I smell a publicity stunt. Large corporations are ran by lawyers, not good hearted people that care about what people want.
Do you actually think any thing good will come from this? I see a one sided deal happening nothing more.
So getting a 4XL T-Shirt declares WP7 as awesome.
Cool
This is great news. I was surprised that MS locked WP7 down so much, and wouldn't be surprised at all if they allowed sideloading in the future, turning the marketplace into a sort of "approved apps" store, like Apple have done on the Mac.
In response to the guy who's never had a job, large corporations are run by a CEO or equivalent, same as everything else. Microsoft would do better to welcome community support than be seen to be outsmarted by it, so I'm sure they will.
vetvito said:
I smell a publicity stunt. Large corporations are ran by lawyers, not good hearted people that care about what people want.
Do you actually think any thing good will come from this? I see a one sided deal happening nothing more.
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Nice way to think positive haha!
We'll get what we want one way or another.
vetvito said:
I smell a publicity stunt. Large corporations are ran by lawyers, not good hearted people that care about what people want.
Do you actually think any thing good will come from this? I see a one sided deal happening nothing more.
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cstrife999 8 hours ago in reply to Sang Noir
Seriously this is nothing short of a PR stunt. I would bet my bottom dollar that behind the scenes things are moving differently.
Are you this guy on Engadget?
Yep vetvito, it's me again. Calling you out on your negativity towards WP7.
I know public discourse is encouraged here but public discourse that's always negative is kinda annoying.
This is an awesome move by MS. Some other companies would've ambushed them with lawyers once they were behind closed doors.
Oh how they have learned
I actually believe that MS has learn't some important lessons prior to releasing Win 7 & Phone 7. The most important one being listen to all your customers and take on board what they are saying.
Will be interesting to see what comes of the discussions and if the OS will be opened up somewhat for customisation.
Go the Chevron guys.. Oh, they are Aussies too.
Hopefully something good comes out of this.
Businesses want the ability to side-load apps also. And I'd love to be able to play with my phone by making apps that I have no intention of trying to sell or market.
Otherwise... well, at least they got a T-shirt.
lekki said:
cstrife999 8 hours ago in reply to Sang Noir
Seriously this is nothing short of a PR stunt. I would bet my bottom dollar that behind the scenes things are moving differently.
Are you this guy on Engadget?
Yep vetvito, it's me again. Calling you out on your negativity towards WP7.
I know public discourse is encouraged here but public discourse that's always negative is kinda annoying.
This is an awesome move by MS. Some other companies would've ambushed them with lawyers once they were behind closed doors.
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What the hell is endgagdet? Who said anything negative?
Anyway, more security is all I see coming.
More awesomeness.
Brandon Watson just sent a tweet to Geohot offering him a WP7 Phone so that he could "build cool stuff" and "let dev creativity flourish."
you think microsoft is that good
they're doing a bit more
http://wmpoweruser.com/geohot-threatens-to-buy-a-windows-phone/
they are personally giving geohot a wp7 device FOR FREE
*claps* bravo microsoft!
unless, they're asking all hackers to plug in all conceivable holes which may lead to less options...
well geohot got more than a tshirt
I believe is going to try to figure out a proper way for people to make homebrew stuff for WP7. Proper meaning that there is some security that needs to go in but still let the developers do whatever they can. Is it walled? Yes, but it to some extent there needs to be security so that the people who are making applications for the marketplace don't get sh*tted on (aka piracy). Hopefully this happens. At least Microsoft is listening.
i believe microsoft is moving in the right direction. we still need to see results, but at least they're making it secure for the people who have no idea, but trying to open it up to those that actually understand what they're doing, and what the risks are for doing it.
Apple and Sony could really learn from MS... who knew that MS wasn't as backward as the media likes to make them out to be.
Brandon Watson and the MS WP7 team are incredibly insightful. Whether it's for PR or not, this is going to make WP7 look MUCH better in the eyes of the public (well, the non-Android and iPhone fanboys anyhow, but the fanboys don't matter anyways).
In the words of Admiral Ackbar.... ITS A TRAP
vetvito said:
What the hell is endgagdet? Who said anything negative?
Anyway, more security is all I see coming.
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I quit reading Engadget after seeing their Apple biased.
So do I, but I am sure that it is much more than that, I hope.
vetvito said:
I smell a publicity stunt. Large corporations are ran by lawyers, not good hearted people that care about what people want.
Do you actually think any thing good will come from this? I see a one sided deal happening nothing more.
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I've worked for large corporations for the last 15 years, and what you said is complete and total bull****. Lawyers don't run the company, they're hired to try and *protect* the company from a lawsuit-happy public. Generally speaking, the people who run large corporations are no different from anyone else.
That said, yes, there are incidents of people becoming power-happy and thinking they can use the protection of a corporation to get away with damn near anything. And more often than not, those people are slapped down like the idiots they are, as they deserve. Meanwhile, the decent people at the company are left to pick up the pieces and try to save what face they can.
It's bad ideology to lump people so blindly into groups the way you just did. It's no different than using race or religion as a basis for discrimination, and you really should think a little more deeply and look at the overwhelming majority of GOOD people who run GOOD businesses rather than tripping into trite generalizations.
I believe MS see the reasoning behind giving their audience what they want. Even though Apple are PR geniouses, MS aren't stupid either. Think of all the programs that are "leaked" to "pirates" and never seem to stop working, even though the serial is openly exchanged. They may not play the media the way Hand Jobs does, but they sure know how to create hype by going the back way - letting power users and early adopters "find" their apps. Guess who really decides which applications and platforms to use. The management? Nah...It's the system administrators.
Back in the day I was told to install a server from RIM so we could test out their hand sets. The day before sending it back I did a half-assed install just to prove it wasn't working. Didn't even want to check if it was possible Think RIM got a foot inside even though the importer were best buddies with the CEO and were part of the board? Nah...
Same thing applies here. MS knows it, and they won't **** on their user base. That's the same reasoning as not releasing their lawyers on "pirates". In other words - not run by the lawyers, but actually keeping them on a pretty tight leash.
Here is some more update hype just like the earlier hype that caused a lot of concern among WP7 users. Hype or misreporting? Nevertheless, it is reports like this that are causing a lot of anxious people to be annoyed with MS, myself included. This is a quote from Daily Tech. A link to the full story is also provided:
"Second, like Android, Microsoft is pursuing an aggressive update schedule, which should help it. It plans to deliver a pair of major updates this spring, which will bring customers copy/paste and multi-tasking. These updates will "catch it up" with its competitors, so to speak. This is definitely a positive for Microsoft, and should greatly help the platform's image."
Gadgets The Good, The Bad: Windows Phone 7 Moved 2 Million Units in Q4 2010
Sorry but without an official statement to the fact, why would anyone take this seriously? Without cold, hard facts this is just another rumour, and no one in their right mind would take this as MS's official stance. Anyone who believes everything they read on the internet, more fool them and if you have to go searching to find this info it puts it into even more doubt.
Do you spend your time hunting for WP7 defamatory information just so you can troll the forums? I mean if you hate it so bad stop wishing for android for it which wont happen and buy an android device. Enjoy the lag.
Misreporting.
People are taking the same news and statements and trying to read into it, then report it as news.
z33dev33l said:
Do you spend your time hunting for WP7 defamatory information just so you can troll the forums? I mean if you hate it so bad stop wishing for android for it which wont happen and buy an android device. Enjoy the lag.
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I'd appreciate you getting a clue and stop harassing me over stuff I AM NOT doing. According to my websites abut online harassment and abuse, I give you this warning: Do not say another word to me.
MartyLK said:
I'd appreciate you getting a clue and stop harassing me over stuff I AM NOT doing. According to my websites abut online harassment and abuse, I give you this warning: Do not say another word to me.
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And messages posted to any open venue, such as a newsgroup, a web-based board, an AOL discussion forum or a chat room, are seldom truly harassing unless they're forged to appear to come from you or contain direct threats or libelous statements.
I did not state in any way that you were in fact committing this act nor did I threaten you in any way. Please do not throw interpretations around in place of the law to avoid answering. If you so choose not to respond to my inquiry that is your right and I respect that but do not act as though it is going to turn into a threat of legal action because that's just, well, depressing.
MartyLK said:
I'd appreciate you getting a clue and stop harassing me over stuff I AM NOT doing. According to my websites abut online harassment and abuse, I give you this warning: Do not say another word to me.
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Laugh. Out. Loud.
You shouldn't post on forums if you can't handle a little flak here and there. Its not like he's threatening you physically or mentally, and he's not spreading libel. Don't hide behind a threat like that. It looks petty at best.
nova hands said:
Laugh. Out. Loud.
You shouldn't post on forums if you can't handle a little flak here and there. Its not like he's threatening you physically or mentally, and he's not spreading libel. Don't hide behind a threat like that. It looks petty at best.
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Same goes for you. You had no useful intention for saying what you said. If you only want to spread discontent and harm, I warn you: Do not say another word to me.
The Daily Tech story has been updated with a response from MS:
"Update: Thur. 1/27/2011 2:50 p.m. -
We reached out to our Microsoft press contact for more information concerning some news networks' negative depiction of this sales data and update on the phantom data issue. While the spokesperson did not provide us with answers to our specific questions, as requested, they did offer us a general statement.
They emphasized the following metrics:
• Early research indicates 93% of customers worldwide are satisfied with Windows Phone 7, and 90% would recommend to others.
• Developer engagement is excellent with customers getting access to an average of 100 new apps a day and more than 6,500 apps overall on Marketplace.
• Over 2MM licenses sold to OEMs worldwide.
And they add, "Sales are an important measure of success, but for a new platform customer satisfaction and active developer investment can be even more important leading indicators of long-term success.These early signs of satisfaction from customers and developers are reason to be bullish about the foundation for long-term success for Windows Phone 7."
We will again, try to provide an update as soon as Microsoft offers more specifics on the data usage issues that are afflicting some WP7 users."
Main link
nova hands said:
Laugh. Out. Loud.
You shouldn't post on forums if you can't handle a little flak here and there. Its not like he's threatening you physically or mentally, and he's not spreading libel. Don't hide behind a threat like that. It looks petty at best.
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Eh, I remember when I was a kid we didn't threaten legal action without foundation... or at all... all these new laws paired with kids who don't get outside much have lead to a much weaker generation as a whole. I'm glad I grew up in an era where even the teens and adults arent saying "I'm going to tell on you." for absolutely no reason...
Equally some of you have a basic problem understanding many customers are dissatisfied with WP7. And this "90% consumer satisfaction" is as true as worthless crap. I mean these general surveys are nothing.
By the way, do some of you work for MS? You behave like the multibillion giant needs your defence? Give me me a break.
doministry said:
Equally some of you have a basic problem understanding many customers are dissatisfied with WP7. And this "90% consumer satisfaction" is as true as worthless crap. I mean these general surveys are nothing.
By the way, do some of you work for MS? You behave like the multibillion giant needs your defence? Give me me a break.
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That's the idea I get. I know I and a number of people I know aren't satisfied with WP7. I do recognize, though, that I and a lot of people liked WP7 up front and believe MS might be taking that into account rather than the continued use of WP7. It's when people have used the OS for a while when they become unsatisfied.
Lets keeps things on topic, please.
MartyLK said:
That's the idea I get. I know I and a number of people I know aren't satisfied with WP7. I do recognize, though, that I and a lot of people liked WP7 up front and believe MS might be taking that into account rather than the continued use of WP7. It's when people have used the OS for a while when they become unsatisfied.
Lets keeps things on topic, please.
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I do find the figure of 93% being extremely high, but not completely unreasonable. Just looking at my own friends and relatives, whom are mostly average consumers - that is, they come to me for advise on things technical - none have so far come back and given me crap about the piece of **** phone I convinced them to buy, and let me tell you, they would have given me grief about it if they weren't satisfied. I still remember the HDDVD vs BluRay war, where I was clearly on the losing side.
It's still a hard one though, because as you say it's after using the OS for some time you really get the feeling for those little niggly things that are really wrong about it, and due to a huge shortage of devices locally (for weeks after launch) many of the people I know haven't had them for more than perhaps a month to six weeks so far. I dunno though, I picked up a HD7 at launch, didn't like it, got a Omnia 7 which I returned as it only had 8GB storage and no SD slot and finally a 16GB Omnia 7 - point is, I've used the OS since launch (and sort of before by use of the emulator and dev devices) in some capacity or another and really I think it took less than a week for me to realise everything that was wrong with it. To the best of my recollection nothing has cropped up in the weeks or months since, that I hadn't already noticed and accepted.
Now, as an old WM user do I find the OS to be lacking in certain aspects? Sure I do, but what they've delivered they've generally delivered really well. It's given me what no WM or Android phone could - an experience that just works, just like the iPhone (and had the iPhone been available on different hardware I may still have been an iPhone user). Of course I am looking forward to the day we can utilize the camera API on WP7, or the day we can integrate the users contacts into our apps. Likewise I'm looking forward to certain bugs being fixed and promised features to become available, but if I was asked if I liked the platform as is I would have to say yes, Yes I do.
If you feel the lack of functionality is so bad, you're simply chosen the wrong OS and you would probably be much better off using Android or WM (which I personally preferred out of the two). You're never going to get a product that fits everyone in every way possible - apart from perhaps in North Korea where you really don't have a choice
emigrating said:
I do find the figure of 93% being extremely high, but not completely unreasonable. Just looking at my own friends and relatives, whom are mostly average consumers - that is, they come to me for advise on things technical - none have so far come back and given me crap about the piece of **** phone I convinced them to buy, and let me tell you, they would have given me grief about it if they weren't satisfied. I still remember the HDDVD vs BluRay war, where I was clearly on the losing side.
It's still a hard one though, because as you say it's after using the OS for some time you really get the feeling for those little niggly things that are really wrong about it, and due to a huge shortage of devices locally (for weeks after launch) many of the people I know haven't had them for more than perhaps a month to six weeks so far. I dunno though, I picked up a HD7 at launch, didn't like it, got a Omnia 7 which I returned as it only had 8GB storage and no SD slot and finally a 16GB Omnia 7 - point is, I've used the OS since launch (and sort of before by use of the emulator and dev devices) in some capacity or another and really I think it took less than a week for me to realise everything that was wrong with it. To the best of my recollection nothing has cropped up in the weeks or months since, that I hadn't already noticed and accepted.
Now, as an old WM user do I find the OS to be lacking in certain aspects? Sure I do, but what they've delivered they've generally delivered really well. It's given me what no WM or Android phone could - an experience that just works, just like the iPhone (and had the iPhone been available on different hardware I may still have been an iPhone user). Of course I am looking forward to the day we can utilize the camera API on WP7, or the day we can integrate the users contacts into our apps. Likewise I'm looking forward to certain bugs being fixed and promised features to become available, but if I was asked if I liked the platform as is I would have to say yes, Yes I do.
If you feel the lack of functionality is so bad, you're simply chosen the wrong OS and you would probably be much better off using Android or WM (which I personally preferred out of the two). You're never going to get a product that fits everyone in every way possible - apart from perhaps in North Korea where you really don't have a choice
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LOL...I've had that experience myself with things I recommended. Then I go running for cover. Ewww...just remembered the $400 I talked my brother into spending on the Palm Treo 680...the unlocked one - not carrier supported. We both bought one when they first came out and turned out to be the worst pile of doo we ever threw money at. I will never live that down. When the iPhone came out, not too long after the Treo 680, I was praising it to my brother but didn't dare recommend it...lol.
I have praised WP7 to him. He has yet to know how I currently feel about it, though. I still like the OS as a skeleton. One which has potential. But I certainly hope MS won't "kin" us all.
Honestly, I think if you are on this phone. You have "higher" expectations for the platform than average users would. In the tech community satisfaction may be mediocre, but with the everyday community. People love this platform.
MartyLK said:
That's the idea I get. I know I and a number of people I know aren't satisfied with WP7. I do recognize, though, that I and a lot of people liked WP7 up front and believe MS might be taking that into account rather than the continued use of WP7. It's when people have used the OS for a while when they become unsatisfied.
Lets keeps things on topic, please.
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Dude, you were all for WP7 until you were against it. What gives?
You chose to be a beta tester, you did, no one forced you to give money away.
Yeah it sucks that the update isn't here yet but it was YOU who chose to believe the hype and rumors that it was coming in January.
When it comes down to it, WP7 as is is a complete smartphone OS.
Unfortunaely for MS, there are other OSes out there that have more features have grown accustomed to having, some of these features were even on their previous OS.
Let me tell you something though, you like the features on the other OSes so much? Why the hell didn't you buy a phone with one of those OSes instead of making threads that make you sound like countless other self-entitled brats in the world today?
Damn, learn a little patience and maybe, just maybe, you'll be rewarded for it. Or don't, a be viewed as a brat, your choice!
Well it's an informative thread, so I will not delete it.
But as only generates flames, I'm closing.
From: http://www.winrumors.com/microsoft-...itterwp&utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitter
“Many of you are making critical comments here which are certainly fair. First, I was wrong when I said “most people have received the February update.” There are many of you who have yet to receive it, and I don’t blame you for speaking up and pointing out my mistake. Second, I referred to our updates as “complete” because I was thinking of the internal process where we pass completed software to another group who delivers them – but of course no update is complete until you all have it. Plus, at the time I did the interview we had started the NoDo (“march update”) delivery process and I knew “it was going well” from our perspective: people were officially getting it, the success rate of its deployment on real-world phones was looking good, and we were happy that the process had STARTED well. Still—these are NOT the same as all of you getting it and I’m sorry that I came across as insensitive to that fact.
I am a very, very big advocate for all our end-users and developers, and it bothers me a lot if I sounded out of touch. I wasn’t as prepared for this interview as I should have been—I walked into the studio with an informal state of mind, thinking about MIX and what we WILL be talking about, and I didn’t have the right up-to-date information to give a good explanation on updates which I know to be a very high-interest topic right now.
I have read all of the comments here (and many of them on the other blogs) and so has pretty much everyone in our management team. We know it’s been frustrating to wait for features/fixes and (probably worse) to hear little from us on specific dates. We are sorry the process has been rocky. The “where’s my phone update” table is our first step to try to remedy this in the face of technical problems that have made our first wave of updates take longer than we expected. We know the table would benefit greatly from more detail, and we are hoping to add more to it by working with the Operators who own the “testing” phase to get more clarity. If your phone is shown in “scheduling”, it’ll be worth checking the table next week.
In the spirit of “MIX as a conversation” – I will make sure that when I show up in Vegas that I’m well prepared to give an update in person and to try to answer your questions as best I can. You folks are obviously a very important audience for us and it’s right for you to expect us to communicate and execute better. I know at this point it’s our actions that matter… The main thing we are trying to do is to get the updates out to everyone in a way that is reliable and works, and then make our process better and more transparent in the future.”
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awwwwwww im not mad at them anymore. vattay cutie
let's be real. I wasn't mad, but is this enough to shut the burn microsoft to the ground crowd away? I'm not sure...
Transparency is always better than non transparency.
It's really, really nice to hear that they know they have made it wrong. I love it. Everybody does.
But it would be better to hear that the update is going right, and we gonna receive it in the next few days.
mikeeam said:
It's really, really nice to hear that they know they have made it wrong. I love it. Everybody does.
But it would be better to hear that the update is going right, and we gonna receive it in the next few days.
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Admitting you were wrong doesn't make it any less wrong.
I'm through with them.
They had to admit after seeing all the comments pretty much everywhere online and from the bloggers. Here's where it started. http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Coun...-Joe-Belfiore-Talks-Phone#c634367845660000000
N8ter said:
Admitting you were wrong doesn't make it any less wrong.
I'm through with them.
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+1
Fool me once........
I cannot accept it. My HD7 is non-brand and doesn't receive the NoDo update til now.
I don't rally care about excuses, and I am still pissed, and I have still not got the NoDo. However, I give MS some credit, since at least they show their customers they care by making statements like this, and admit everything is not always sunshine and cloudless skies. Compared to Crapple (Apple), who always denies- or don't say a word to their "customers" that they actually do **** up sometimes.
And that Joe Belfiore I really like, he seems to be the perfect guy as Director of Windows Phone 7. And he's funny to.
Halle said:
I don't rally care about excuses, and I am still pissed, and I have still not got the NoDo. However, I give MS some credit, since at least they show their customers they care by making statements like this, and admit everything is not always sunshine and cloudless skies. Compared to Crapple (Apple), who always denies- or don't say a word to their "customers" that they actually do **** up sometimes.
And that Joe Belfiore I really like, he seems to be the perfect guy as Director of Windows Phone 7. And he's funny to.
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Whatever Crapple says they deliver which is exactly why they are kicking everyone's ass whether you hate to admit it or are totally in denial. You give MS credit because they finally admitted after being cornered by WP7 users and had no way out BUT to admit it. It's like saying well let the bank robber go free because he at least admitted his crime. So you like Belfiore because he is funny and can entertain you? WOW!! Maybe MS should hire Jerry Seinfeld or (choose your favorite comedian) to be the Director of WP7. It's become a joke anyway so might as well hire comedians!
I respect Joe Belfiore for admitting his/Microsoft's mistake. But as that as for Eric Hautala, he is a complete joke.
Look at all the complains ppl have made over at Windows Phone Blog, hundreds after hundreds and he doesn't even stands up to say a single word.
What kind on a General Manager, Customer Experience Engineering is he???
f1restarter said:
Whatever Crapple says they deliver which is exactly why they are kicking everyone's ass whether you hate to admit it or are totally in denial. You give MS credit because they finally admitted after being cornered by WP7 users and had no way out BUT to admit it. It's like saying well let the bank robber go free because he at least admitted his crime. So you like Belfiore because he is funny and can entertain you? WOW!! Maybe MS should hire Jerry Seinfeld or (choose your favorite comedian) to be the Director of WP7. It's become a joke anyway so might as well hire comedians!
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I'm going off topic here, but..
Well yes, Apple deliver updates flawlessly. However, they totally deny any design flaws of their hardware in their products - witch cannot be fixed with software. The iPhone 3G/S, cracks everywhere on the plastic backside and it got tons of dust under the screen. Also, the Macbook cracks. The Iphone 4 antenna design flaw - very well known but Apple denies there is anything wrong. Their response is simply "don't hold it that way" and a short while after, they kick the responsible person for the antenna design out of the company, lol. I guess the guys at Apple is the real comedians.
Halle said:
Well yes, Apple deliver updates flawlessly.
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People seem to forget that Apple had growing pains with iOS as well and had major issues when they first started to push out version 3. When it all happened they just shrugged and kept quiet. At least MS acknowledges it, this is a step int eh right direction. Now they just need to move fast and fix it all or quit telling people when something is coming out.
N8ter said:
Admitting you were wrong doesn't make it any less wrong.
I'm through with them.
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Does this mean you'll be through with the wp7 found as well??? ;-)
Sent from my HTC HD7 using Board Express
Well hopefully they will get their **** together, and to get people happy may push out the mango update sooner?? Who knows.
Sent from my Defy
DaFlake said:
People seem to forget that Apple had growing pains with iOS as well and had major issues when they first started to push out version 3. When it all happened they just shrugged and kept quiet. At least MS acknowledges it, this is a step int eh right direction. Now they just need to move fast and fix it all or quit telling people when something is coming out.
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Yeah, even Apple make mistakes. And they don't admit. There is a lot of examples of that. Still, sooner or later, they fix it. And most of the time, sooner. And when they say that they have an update, well, I envy that, everyone is able to download and update their iPhones when they want, not when carrier want, or when it is available for you.
And yes, I didn't forget that Apple just handle one phone. With just one single phone they choose the way of the whole smartphone market. And they are good at that.
Let's not forget that they learn with their mistakes. And it is really nice.
Apple was able to release iOS update before schedule and a patch shortly after all through the same carrier that Microsoft has problem to push through, AT&T.
In my book, Microsoft dropped the ball big time. And they still have no clue how to fix this. Sorry to say, at this time Microsoft lost all the credibility to me for their ability to successfully push the WP7 platform forward. Yes, WP7 will still survive - in the form of millions of cheap, low end, low resolution Nokia phones that most of us simply don't care about.
I'd love to see MS show me otherwise. But I doubt it. Big corporations don't turn around quickly unless they have a strong leader. Steve B is simply a corporate bean counter, not a leader.
Halle said:
I don't rally care about excuses, and I am still pissed, and I have still not got the NoDo. However, I give MS some credit, since at least they show their customers they care by making statements like this, and admit everything is not always sunshine and cloudless skies. Compared to Crapple (Apple), who always denies- or don't say a word to their "customers" that they actually do **** up sometimes.
And that Joe Belfiore I really like, he seems to be the perfect guy as Director of Windows Phone 7. And he's funny to.
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They don't care. They just could not talk their way out of it. If they could, they would.
Apple supports their products, so I can give a flying crap what they say. I don't care what a company says, I care what they actually do.
Halle said:
I'm going off topic here, but..
Well yes, Apple deliver updates flawlessly. However, they totally deny any design flaws of their hardware in their products - witch cannot be fixed with software. The iPhone 3G/S, cracks everywhere on the plastic backside and it got tons of dust under the screen. Also, the Macbook cracks. The Iphone 4 antenna design flaw - very well known but Apple denies there is anything wrong. Their response is simply "don't hold it that way" and a short while after, they kick the responsible person for the antenna design out of the company, lol. I guess the guys at Apple is the real comedians.
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WP7 has poor reception issues, which is worse than Antennagate because for an iPhone all you needed was a bumper or a case. You can't fix the poor reception in WP7 devices so easily.
I routinely get 3 bars in an HSPA+ market where my Vibrant has 5 bars and a 3.3+ mbps download speed. Call quality is noticeably worse (not even comparable, TBQH) and download speeds are much slower. I know one other person with an HD7 and he said "the phone is okay, but the call quality is ****."
http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...ng-focus/5b7bc221-2982-4813-95f1-a8c88bfd2e86
http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...software/cf6cb222-7fe7-4c0c-92c0-357bf4cc44d1
Also, the HD7 exibits the same issue as the iPhone 4, except it has poorer reception/signal quality overall:
http://www.gsmdome.com/htc/htc-hd7-antenna-problems-explained-by-companys-spokesman_20065
Focus, Omnia 7, HD7 (I experience the bad signal quality personally). I'm willing to bet the issue is Microsoft's coding, and not the hardware. WP7 makes a worse phone than the iPhone, and a worse Smartphone than pretty much anything barring some feature phones.
Dunno where the Apple hate is coming form, but clearly some people only count the negatives of the platforms they don't like. Microsoft's handling of WP7 is making Apple look like a champ.
nrfitchett4 said:
Does this mean you'll be through with the wp7 found as well??? ;-)
Sent from my HTC HD7 using Board Express
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Maybe if you learned how to write cohesive and comprehensible statements I'd be able to answer that.
You're not from out of the country, so there's no excuse for your inability to do so...
Have you read about Brandon Watson's challenge to Molly Wood? What about her first impressions? Do you feel her complaints are valid?
Please don't derail this thread into an Android/W7 argument (again!), she happens to have lots of followers and any of her criticism will resonate with many and in my opinion will help address some things faster (some things she hasn't discovered yet so try to give a her break on that).
I'm not running Mango so I'd like to hear from people who do and know if they agree with what she has to say.
http://news.cnet.com/molly-rants/
The only problem with her review is that too many of her "cons" are simply based on ignorance (and I don't mean that in a pejorative sense). She didn't know the correct way to do something on WP7, and tried to apply Android techniques. When they didn't work, she assumed that the feature was either broken or missing.
If her followers read those criticisms and assume she is right, it may prevent them from giving WP7 a fair chance on their own.
Yep. Tis already begun. Two commenters have said they won't buy based on "Molly's impressions" and "little annoyances" she's described.
Her only real beef should be with the navigation. Outside of that, she has an argument as to comparitive number of apps. Yet, she hasn't explored the marketplace thoroughly enough to actually talk about what's there. She just knows two apps she uses aren't there.
I'd give her some time with it and I'm certain she'll clear up some of the things she's already posted which are incorrect.
She will... She complained before on her podcast about not having an app for facebook chat then corrected it on her blog after she was told it's built-in. Hopefully the listeners also read the blog, otherwise some might be a lost cause already.
Sent from my Samsung Omnia 7 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
I'm really glad she's made such a fuss over the navigation and I really hope Microsoft pay attention. It's bloody stupid as it is - not matter what the reasons may be (I've heard licencing issues?) Microsoft need to sort this out.
She has some other valid points, but she hasn't (as she admits) touched upon a lot of the more unique features of WP7.5
Casey
Apparently turn by turn is indeed due to licensing issues but with Nokia owning Navteq this should be sorted in Tango (hopefully) or Apollo.
Sent from my Samsung Omnia 7 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Peew971 said:
Apparently turn by turn is indeed due to licensing issues but with Nokia owning Navteq this should be sorted in Tango (hopefully) or Apollo.
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I sure hope it is, because as it now stands, you can guarantee that it will be the cause of a lot of mocking from Android users. And comments such as this one I read on the article page aren't going to help much either:
Well Molly I have to say I actually enjoy the navigation. Think about it, if everyone's satnav did this, that commercial where the guy is driving his car and his wife calls and then the satnav (which is a woman's voice, btw) goes, 'Motel is on the right' and the wife goes, 'MOTEL?!? **CLICK**' that would never happen. While I agree it is a bit of an annoyance, I like it better. And it's fun when it congratulates you. Didn't you say you like the "pretty sounds?" Well when you do something right, it makes a pretty sound. so, please don't harp on what is probably the best implementation of navigation in the history of cell phones. Also, The thing I don't like about other satnav implementations, is that they get annoying. "In 1.5mi. turn left onto Camino St. then turn left onto Avery Avenue" then .25 mi later it says nearly exactly the same thing. For me what's great about the Mango implementation is that you only have to listen to the annoying computerized lady voice when you forget what your next turn should be. That's the brilliance of the Mango implementation.
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It's one thing to defend Microsoft for having no choice but to implement the system as it is due to licensing issues, but it's quite another to try to make the absurd claim that this system is better in any way. It's not.
it wasn't a biased or negative critique. id say it was spot on, by a regular user trying to use it as a daily driver. speaking of daily driver, I had no idea navigation was so broken. ugh !
yes, ios and android are mentioned .... if you are surprised or annoyed by this, smell some coffe. ios and android are dominating the market for a few reasons, this review sheds light on them.
improve and enjoy some success microsoft !
The verdict is in, it's a 50/50. I read what she had to say and find her point about Skydrive fair. It needs to have a proper app and a desktop client with better functionality. For techies it might be fine but for an average user it's a bit of a mess.
Off to watch her video now...
http://news.cnet.com/8301-31322_3-20094766-256/windows-phone-7-challenge-week-2-the-verdict/?tag=mncol;title
Peew971 said:
The verdict is in, it's a 50/50. I read what she had to say and find her point about Skydrive fair. It needs to have a proper app and a desktop client with better functionality. For techies it might be fine but for an average user it's a bit of a mess.
Off to watch her video now...
http://news.cnet.com/8301-31322_3-20094766-256/windows-phone-7-challenge-week-2-the-verdict/?tag=mncol;title
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And also how can an average user FIND OUT that Facebook chat has an inbuilt Messenger?
Sorry guys, but this review was amature at best. If you are going to call yourself a writer, and agree to do a test drive of a device, you owe to your readers to find the correct answers to any concerns or misunderstood features of said device. This is where she failed, and this is where CNET always fails.
This is nothing more than letting your Mom or Sister borrow your phone and you then ask them for an opinion. They are not allowed to seek actual advice, from an actually knowledgeable source.
This type of review is a disservice to technology in general. That is my opinion and that is why I do not use CNET for anything important.
I agree completely. She made so many mistakes and it was obvious she didn't bother researching any of her so called problems. The majority of the stuff she said wrong was corrected in her comments which she clearly didn't read. What a joke.
naplesbill said:
Sorry guys, but this review was amature at best. If you are going to call yourself a writer, and agree to do a test drive of a device, you owe to your readers to find the correct answers to any concerns or misunderstood features of said device. This is where she failed, and this is where CNET always fails.
This is nothing more than letting your Mom or Sister borrow your phone and you then ask them for an opinion. They are not allowed to seek actual advice, from an actually knowledgeable source.
This type of review is a disservice to technology in general. That is my opinion and that is why I do not use CNET for anything important.
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was Molly Wood ever a man ?
Professor Simon Peach said:
was Molly Wood ever a man ?
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I dunno, but the poor girl looks 10 years older than she really is.
And a little less sex in the city marathons with a jar of burbon/jug of martini, and a little more technology knowledge would be nice. Especially for a CNET writer.
Outlook and calendar
Watching a relative of mine having the Galaxy II, then I really understand how far behind email and calendar is... I just can't believe that she couldn't see that!!!
Merging mailboxes with threaded email... Outlook, Gmail, Live and Facebook calendar all in one with different colors... even better than the pc-version
Someone should have assisted her with this... someone who understands the value of it...
All that being said maybe it also means WP7 is not as simple as we all think for an average user.
Don't get me wrong, WP7 is very simple and intuitive but if you need a manual to understand some features then it means it could be made simpler.
Maybe it's because she was coming from Android rather than say a feature phone and had expectations but the point remains. And she's right about Skydrive/Turn by Turn.
if she got final mango like everyone else, there is a nice book to help the transition. right in the programs menu. with videos and text to speech for every, single, thing.
Peew971 said:
All that being said maybe it also means WP7 is not as simple as we all think for an average user.
Don't get me wrong, WP7 is very simple and intuitive but if you need a manual to understand some features then it means it could be made simpler.
Maybe it's because she was coming from Android rather than say a feature phone and had expectations but the point remains. And she's right about Skydrive/Turn by Turn.
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I agree.
If a person is coming from a standard phone to WP7 their impressions will be different, then those coming from another platform. I personally don't find any of the OS's easier or harder to use they're just different, with their own learning
curve. All reviewers bring their own personal bias into reviews IMO. The question is whether you think WP7 is better, not equal to other platforms. If you ask that type of question you have to take the good with the bad.
The map directions tapping is silly, MS should have known better then to even bother to include such a poorly implemented feature. If they don't have the rights to do it properly then don't do it.
phoneguy 4567 said:
The map directions tapping is silly, MS should have known better then to even bother to include such a poorly implemented feature. If they don't have the rights to do it properly then don't do it.
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Than, they'd complain there's no default/built-in Turn by Turn Navigation. This is a no win scenario. People have to realize that MS was severely neutered by that anti-trust law suit. Now they are alot less aggressive & very careful so they are not sued again in this manor. Besides, people forget the 3rd Party apps like Garmin/etc & the fact that Nokia's map app is coming. The Mango Turn by Turn Navigation is nothing more than a way to tie people over till that comes.
Now, don't get me wrong, WP7 & Mango are far from perfect, but MS is working on it. They just posted a job listing to bring better PC/WP7 USB syncing of docs/etc.
Finally! Microsoft planning to connect Windows Phone and the desktop
Molly is supposed to be a power user btw, & she got so many things wrong in her review. I have to wonder if she even tried. It took her 2 weeks to set up WP7, it took me 2 hours tops. She must of never looked in the Office/Pictures Hub as she claims there's no Skydrive integration. Her review is nothing more than a joke. Scott Adams did a better review & he's an "average user," go figure.....
I think the only thing Molly can do now is to read up and post another review along the lines of "When I learnt how to use it" which should correct most of her errors.
Of course, as has been pointed out, if she genuinely made these errors then there must be a reason...(and I'm not going to say she's stupid).
For those of you who don't agree with me on my oppinions about WP please take a look a this; the numbers speak for them selves.
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/hardware/gartner-windows-phone-market-share-crashes/16279
Genius. Linking to an article dated November 15. Try harder please.
FACEPALM
sinister1 said:
For those of you who don't agree with me on my oppinions about WP please take a look a this; the numbers speak for them selves.
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/hardware/gartner-windows-phone-market-share-crashes/16279
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I soooo resisted to write a word in this thread because in general I am sick of you moaning like a woman. But here it goes..
DATE: 15 NOV 2011 - of the article.
The Microsoft sales - DONT MEAN WINDOWS PHONE sales. Microsoft does 40,000 other things than Windows Phone. Windows Phone is new venture. Hope you are literate enough to know this.
Thus, showing me something 2 months old, means crap to me.
After that Nokia has launched Nokia Lumia 800 and 710 in India and USA and probably Hong Kong - not sure. Those are markets with huge numbers. Not UK! So wait and give me figure after 2 months.
I think we've gotta start a bounty thread to get you an Android phone. That's going to be well worth it that teaching you facts about Marketing, Sales and Corporate policies.
Tip: Microsoft isn't owned by one man.
I decided to reply to Sinisters Moaning.
Old article so troll somewhere else...
Now for the more recent good news (and note Gartner is mentioned)
http://techcrunch.com/2012/01/19/is...gartner-windows-phone-to-surpass-ios-by-2015/
http://www.networkworld.com/news/2011/013111-phone-7-market-share.html
http://www.wpcentral.com/windows-phone-overtake-ios-2015
http://www.wpcentral.com/nokia-lumia-900-wins-awards-ces-2012
http://wmpoweruser.com/analysts-estimate-1-3-million-nokia-lumias-shipped-in-2011/
Those projections are certainly possible, but you have to bear in mind that they are based on what is known today. For example, no projections that were made two years ago gave Microsoft any hope of being more than a blip on the radar in the mobile space, because WP7 hadn't been unveiled yet. Similarly, no analysts making projections today can know what Apple or Google may or may not accomplish within the next 3 years.
So, while these projections should make people optimistic for the future of the OS, that optimism should be realistically cautious (as should any optimism for any of the major players - a lot can happen in three years).
LOL, while it might be from November 2011 (a few months ago) but the projections are still the same and won't get any better, well at least anytime soon; maybe like Microsoft it's self-predicted in 2015 or maybe even 2018 but as of now there is no way. I'm pretty sure that if you were too look up todays stats they would be no different at all. Don't get me wrong I'm with you guys in the sense that I would like to see MS succeed but they just don't get it. I have a WP and I honestly can say I do not know one other person who has one at all.
Guys as I have stated before, this is not to feed trolls or single out one person for their opinions, MS needs to listen to both sides, positive and negative. So don't take my personal comments to personal. With that being said let's see what this year will bring, hopefully I'm wrong but as a WP user I have the right to voice my opinion and will continue to do so until either MS gets it or the go bust whichever one comes first.
ROCOAFZ said:
I decided to reply to Sinisters Moaning.
Old article so troll somewhere else...
Now for the more recent good news (and note Gartner is mentioned)
http://techcrunch.com/2012/01/19/is...gartner-windows-phone-to-surpass-ios-by-2015/
http://www.networkworld.com/news/2011/013111-phone-7-market-share.html
http://www.wpcentral.com/windows-phone-overtake-ios-2015
http://www.wpcentral.com/nokia-lumia-900-wins-awards-ces-2012
http://wmpoweruser.com/analysts-estimate-1-3-million-nokia-lumias-shipped-in-2011/
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Thanks for posting, I took a look at those charts and they look like they are predicting the future; I wonder how they do that? Do they have some kind of crystal ball over a MS or something? How do they figure that they will even sale these may phones in the future? Maybe they are listening and changing stuff around, boy I really hope so.
drupad2drupad said:
I soooo resisted to write a word in this thread because in general I am sick of you moaning like a woman. But here it goes..
DATE: 15 NOV 2011 - of the article.
The Microsoft sales - DONT MEAN WINDOWS PHONE sales. Microsoft does 40,000 other things than Windows Phone. Windows Phone is new venture. Hope you are literate enough to know this.
Thus, showing me something 2 months old, means crap to me.
After that Nokia has launched Nokia Lumia 800 and 710 in India and USA and probably Hong Kong - not sure. Those are markets with huge numbers. Not UK! So wait and give me figure after 2 months.
I think we've gotta start a bounty thread to get you an Android phone. That's going to be well worth it that teaching you facts about Marketing, Sales and Corporate policies.
Tip: Microsoft isn't owned by one man.
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Click to collapse
My moaning is not directed towards you so that means I wasn't talking to you in perticular. My grips are with MS and I am just pointing out somethings is all and if you don't like it too bad simply ignore my coments, it's not that hard to do. I don't go around directing anger towards you when you make your coments or voice you opinons even if they are stupid or not because you have the right to just like I do. Again if you don't like it, ignore it; I know I would.
sinister1 said:
My moaning is not directed towards you so that means I wasn't talking to you in perticular. My grips are with MS and I am just pointing out somethings is all and if you don't like it too bad simply ignore my coments, it's not that hard to do. I don't go around directing anger towards you when you make your coments or voice you opinons even if they are stupid or not because you have the right to just like I do. Again if you don't like it, ignore it; I know I would.
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Most browsers, including that of wp7, have spell check. Please, stop trolling and use it.
z33dev33l said:
Most browsers, including that of wp7, have spell check. Please, stop trolling and use it.
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IE 9 desktop version doesn't so here is a link to an add on just in case... www.speckie.com
Completely free.
ROCOAFZ said:
IE 9 desktop version doesn't so here is a link to an add on just in case... www.speckie.com
Completely free.
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oh no! What another blunder by MS, huge blunder. Now WP is so going to fail, a complete flop. I cant be bothered to wake up tomorrow. MS ruined my life. I'm thinking of jumping ships. This is utter BS by MS!
Sent from my TITAN X310e using Board Express
Honestly I can't stand IE9 in its desktop version. If it was as clean, light and intuitive as the mobile version then I'd go for it anyday, but right now the only browser with that simplicity and clean design (or at least it's close) is Chrome. I can't stand anything else.
Wooops, we're trolling and spamming this useful thread, shame on us
vnvman said:
Honestly I can't stand IE9 in its desktop version. If it was as clean, light and intuitive as the mobile version then I'd go for it anyday, but right now the only browser with that simplicity and clean design (or at least it's close) is Chrome. I can't stand anything else.
Wooops, we're trolling and spamming this useful thread, shame on us
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Actually IE9 is much cleaner with it's inbuilt contents filter. Have you tried it? It's tracking contents blocked thing. You can download simple 1 or 2 lists of adblockers and it becomes so much cleaner! You don't even need to run add ons on it! I din't realise it till someone tweeted this to me
Oh I'm such a troll!
I guess I'll give it another go then, trololol...
@sinister1
From your posts I see you as a big Windows Mobile fan. I understand if others think you're trolling on WP7 forums as 90% of your posts are pure negativity on WP7. I googled Windows Mobile for reviews and almost all of them were negative. WM was dissected and lambasted and all reviewers agreed on one thing - WM sucks.
Fast forward to WP7: it won three awards with mostly positive reviews from all major and reputable tech sites.
I understand your right to voice your opinions but stop preaching your hack and slash doctrine on what OS everybody should have...
sinister1 said:
LOL, while it might be from November 2011 (a few months ago) but the projections are still the same and won't get any better, well at least anytime soon; maybe like Microsoft it's self-predicted in 2015 or maybe even 2018 but as of now there is no way. I'm pretty sure that if you were too look up todays stats they would be no different at all. Don't get me wrong I'm with you guys in the sense that I would like to see MS succeed but they just don't get it. I have a WP and I honestly can say I do not know one other person who has one at all.
Guys as I have stated before, this is not to feed trolls or single out one person for their opinions, MS needs to listen to both sides, positive and negative. So don't take my personal comments to personal. With that being said let's see what this year will bring, hopefully I'm wrong but as a WP user I have the right to voice my opinion and will continue to do so until either MS gets it or the go bust whichever one comes first.
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So then maybe you should direct your venting where it might do the most good, a Microsoft support site for WP7. Most posters here either have something to contribute or are in discovery of various aspects of WP7 os. Pissing and moaning just doesn't play well in a forum dedicated to development. If you so need a phone that meets your every whim perhaps you should build it.
gentry33 said:
So then maybe you should direct your venting where it might do the most good, a Microsoft support site for WP7. Most posters here either have something to contribute or are in discovery of various aspects of WP7 os. Pissing and moaning just doesn't play well in a forum dedicated to development. If you so need a phone that meets your every whim perhaps you should build it.
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You hardcore fanboys are just too much, it's funny how you get all pissy and mad when someone comes on here and tells the truth about a divce that for some reason you seem to worship, but you do make a vaild point I will search for MS websites and direct my whims and trolls towards them. Thanks for the advise and P.S. spreading the truth is not trolling.
sinister1 said:
You hardcore fanboys are just too much, it's funny how you get all pissy and mad when someone comes on here and tells the truth about a divce that for some reason you seem to worship, but you do make a vaild point I will search for MS websites and direct my whims and trolls towards them. Thanks for the advise and P.S. spreading the truth is not trolling.
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Posting outdated rubbish for the sole purpose of instigation is.
sinister1 said:
You hardcore fanboys are just too much, it's funny how you get all pissy and mad when someone comes on here and tells the truth about a divce that for some reason you seem to worship, but you do make a vaild point I will search for MS websites and direct my whims and trolls towards them. Thanks for the advise and P.S. spreading the truth is not trolling.
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I love to travel on horses and bullock carts too. I am going to go and write this on BMW's website. Why doesn't BMW come with horns and tail? Why don't BMW **** and piss on the road? Why won't BMS eat my lettuce and grains!? PS: I am not trolling BMW forums, I am just stating the facts
"Add sinister1 to Your Ignore list"
I've always wanted to know how well these ignore features worked. Great time to find out!
---------- Post added at 11:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:06 PM ----------
drupad2drupad said:
Why doesn't BMW come with horns and tail? Why don't BMW **** and piss on the road?
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Does leaking oil count? (I have BMW car and bike so i'm allowed comment )
BTW my bike doesn't leak oil... my local BMW garage just said it did to try and get loads of money out of me... but that's a discussion for a different forum...