Hardware/software wise, open schematics, binary blob free?
Pretty much not open at all.
I believe it lacks mainline support, needs blobs (and they only exist for Android, so you need to use libhybris for other operating systems to work), and I'm not aware of schematics or freely licensed designs or anything of that sort.
You can unlock the bootloader, you can flash another OS to it. It's maybe on-par with a OnePlus phone in that sense, but quite a bit worse off in terms of popularity and community support.
The MediaTek SoC I think is the root of a lot of the issues. I think MediaTek devices tend to be hard to support. MediaTek themselves are probably rather anti-freedom.
The device and Planet Computers have been a pretty big disappointment in general. My Gemini collects dust at this point and is running a rather old Android version. The need of the specialized MediaTek flashing tool is quite a bother as well. Since I've got an Android and Debian dualboot on the thing, I can no longer get OTA updates for Android, and I haven't got the tool set up and working on any computers anymore.
If you don't already have a Gemini, I would suggest instead looking into the PinePhone. They're working on a keyboard addon, and it's already a lot more free than the Gemini. I run postmarketOS on a PinePhone and it's most of what I wanted out of the Gemini already, despite the rough edges.
If you do have a Gemini already, I think our best bet is someone very dedicated choosing to reverse-engineer the thing. Considering the hardware issues with the keyboard, it would take a lot to make this thing usable. If someone were willing to put in the work to make a replacement keyboard, they'd probably be better off hacking on a different device altogether. The Gemini is just e-waste at this point.
If you were interested in trying to get mainline support for it and such, it may be worth working with some of the postmarketOS guys. There's a page for the Gemini on their wiki, but support so far isn't great. Only one person is marked as owning it / working on it, and there haven't been any updates in a while. It also is replying on libhybris, which would ideally be avoided in favor of getting proper support working.
Related
Well, if HTC won't do it, someone needs to... I want to see if it can be done. Can we create our own ATi Imageon Drivers for the MSM7200/7500?
step 1: Find out which Imageon is in there...
Here's the official list
I just hope it's not some custom job!
Think it's worth a go?
^^Bump^^
This definitely needs to be done. I wish I had the know how to develop this but unfortunately I don't.
you should really try posting this somewhere else, like maybe in the development and hacking forum, since the vogue is not the only device that suffers from this.
this is really a great idea in my opinion, and im sure there are those out there that know how to get it done!
Would be awesome, but it seems like it would be a huge undertaking. I'd imagine that Qualcomm has it locked in some way, preventing it's use if the license to use that component wasn't purchased as part of the hardware platform. I really have no idea though. I'll keep hoping : )
A journey of a thousand miles begins with one step... we have a ton of talent here, HTC and Qualcomm don't seem to want to release it... I think that it might be time to start building our own.
Post copied to development and hacking but I quoted first post of this thread to give proper credit for the idea.
I remember reading somewhere that there is actually a $2000 (and growing) cash prize for the msm 7xxx drivers. Totally support the idea.
yep... I think it's up to 7 grand now.
I'm going to wait until the end of March before I start anything.
Draiko said:
yep... I think it's up to 7 grand now.
I'm going to wait until the end of March before I start anything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well if anyone could point me to link i willing to offer 200 to play quake on my phone
problem is that writing device drivers is the hardest program one can get into
the driver is limited to a very tiny mem footprint and must never be alowed to crash
even if the memory it's using is lost on the heap
and one needs access to alot of whitepapirs from the hardware maker
which is prob why htc did such a poor job writing then driver themselfs
because they were too cheap to pay qualcomm for it
Rudegar said:
problem is that writing device drivers is the hardest program one can get into
the driver is limited to a very tiny mem footprint and must never be alowed to crash
even if the memory it's using is lost on the heap
and one needs access to alot of whitepapirs from the hardware maker
which is prob why htc did such a poor job writing then driver themselfs
because they were too cheap to pay qualcomm for it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not supposed to rain on parade day...
I used to write assembly language device drivers for embedded real-time systems. Doing so requires a high level of knowledge, experience and documentation WRT:
1. Dev & testing tools and environment
2. The target hardware (detailed doc)
3. The target OS kernel and driver hooks
4. System-level programming mind-set (different from app dev)
Quite interesting and rewarding if you have the above - quite difficult, bordering on 'not gonna happen' if you don't.
Sincere best wishes to those who give it a shot!
My entire impetus for this thread was to start gathering people with the skills and talent needed to tackle driver construction. If open-source maniacs can do it, we can too. I have some experience with assembly... the tricky part is going to be finding out the specific commands, paths, and function calls for the embedded hardware. There's going to be a LOT of trial and error involved.
I'm starting to look for the Windows CE DDK right now. Come April 1st, if there is no word from HTC, Qualcomm, or Sprint on this driver issue, I'm going to round up as many capable people as I can and try to hammer this out.
Something that might shed some more light on the entire driver issue... Uh oh
Big Uh oh...
if this ever comes together fully it will be really cool but i still dont get why SE didnt include drivers in the first place??
comeradealexi said:
if this ever comes together fully it will be really cool but i still dont get why SE didnt include drivers in the first place??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As posted before, they probably bought it at a cheaper price by having the drivers restricted. If they were to pay full price then maybe the driver would have been included. It's kind of what Palm did back in the day when they could have spent the extra $.05 for a higher quality speaker but didn't on the Palm III series. I'm pretty sure this is a cost cutting technique used by most electronics manufacturers.
if im paying £500 for a device why not stick $0.5 on the bill! thats a shame
Damn right. I agree with all you guys.
The fact that I cannot get graphics hardware acceleration from a 500 USD+ device is absolutely ridiculous.
I love my Xperia X1, but in hindsight, I would've NEVER supported any product like this had I known it was the case.
Shame on HTC and Sony for swindling their customer from the "rich, multimedia experience" they promise so much.
Bastard Sony/HTC.
well boot android and youll have more qualcomm support..since they own the gpu chip msm7xxx devices uses now, thats what chipset all official android handsets use, even non htc android phones.
ajclai08 said:
well boot android and youll have more qualcomm support..since they own the gpu chip msm7xxx devices uses now, thats what chipset all official android handsets use, even non htc android phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and thus, there is driver support natively in android for us?
If that's true, what's stopping us from reverse-engineering the android driver and building a WinMo driver?
If we had a starting point, it's feasible--but without a starting point (or white papers), it's impossible.
i completely agree with this we have waited enough for the garbage companies to put out. Ive gone through three HTC phones already with graphics Acceleration turned OFF... WTF!!!
* Mod EDIT *
Thread closed until moderation team has had an opportunity to properly review as a result of soliciting donations.
Hey everyone,
As you may all know, there’s a fairly large demand to put Android on the Omnia. After researching it myself, I decided since no one else is doing it I’ll take the incentive and give it my best shot. Don’t get too excited, since I may not get very far. But before I begin, there’re three questions I have to ask:
*NOTE: I own a Verizon i910 Omnia*
1. How do I extract the bootloader, kernel, and rom from the device? I’ve tried all sorts of rom kitchens and utilities and the things I get are either useless or work but only with i900 roms I downloaded and therefore not very helpful.
2. I need to disassemble WM’s device drivers (for the screen, touchscreen, buttons to start), and port them to a custom Linux kernel (that’s what Android will be placed on top of). What software do you recommend (for disassembling WM drivers for ARM in PE format)? A day’s worth of google searching turned up little to nothing.
3. This will involve flashing my one and only Omnia with bootloaders, kernels, and roms that, in all likelihood, will brick my device as I test it. I read in certain places something about a “jtag” cable. Can I use this to flash data directly to the chips without any kind of software running on the phone? If so, what kind of information can you provide? I don’t really care about my warranty, considering what I’m going to do to it To rephrase the question, what options (besides returning the phone) do I have to recover it if it gets bricked?
If anyone wants to offer their support I’d really appreciate it. I need people experienced with the inner workings of a WM device and also people experienced in Linux, specifically device drivers.
it would be great if you could install the Android OS. but i think we need to wait for the official drivers for Android, even if they would be released by Samsung. i start thinking it is impossible.
I honestly doubt Samsung will go the extra mile for a single product (even one as awesome as the Omnia) and port an entirely different operating system to just one of their products. This is one we're gonna have to do ourself. It is possible to do, I'm just stuck right now because I don't know how to dump the i910's rom, which contains all the device drivers I need to make a full-featured port of Android possible. This is what I need help with. It's really not that impossible, it just takes a bit of work.
Mods, could you move this thread to "development and hacking"? It would probably be seen by the people I want it to be seen by there. Thanks.
hey..dude.. checkup this from this group of ppl @
forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=431329
may be u can join ..
Hey Guys, I've got an Omnia as well and really really want Android on it. Although I am unable to script. I thought of a way to contribute a bit as well. I set up a website to raise money for the first person or organisation that pulls it off to run Android on the Omnia.
Have a look here:
I chipped in a €100 myself as well to make a start. I hope you guys can contribute some money as well so that it motivates the developers even more.
For the developers out there: "We know you can do it!"
* Mod EDIT *
Link Removed
How can an project be real. If Basics are unknown?
Qualcomm, QCT Tools, Firmware structure etc...
For study:
http://www.4shared.com/file/108584795/bb49ee52/I900_090226.html
Big thanx to barisyalcin.
For Android on Omnia. Good Luck.
The way is the Destination.
Best Regards
Why even bother installing a shell?
the android on the omnia only installs a shell compound, it does not actually convert the omnia into a full fledged Android phone.
I would just scrap it and pick up an actual android phone.
I know xda developers is mostly a windows mobile and android sit but I would like a n900 section on xda developers it would really boost the hacking scene because we all know this is the best place for smartphone hacking and the n900 is the best device to hack it would almost be like love. What do you guys think.
Welcome to forums
This has been discussed many times and answer remains no. (as far as I know)
I love the idea!
I am thinking in moving on to this weird and wonderful device/os.
Even though it seems to have only a few applications available directly I've read that the Linux on it is based on Debian and if you know your way around linux you can download almost any Debian app. and what I often see here is people wanting to get their hands on some phone with linux in it or some version of linux for their phones. In a way this one offers all this but, yes, it is a Nokia device, so what?
I will still keep one of my HTC/Wimo devices but will scrap the rest!
I want always on full internet and other geeky stuff.
So there Orb! Put it in your pipe and smoke it!
Hey all,
I am a happy owner of a n900 and it is the first time I am so excited with a mobile device since my first symbian phone. What amazes me with the device is its 'open' character, meaning that you buy the hardware, with maemo ofcourse, but the device is meant to be exploited. you can dual (triple) boot running android, meego and maemo, you can port many applications (Qt 4.6.2 Gui required), you can compile yourself stuff, run a debian VM with easy-debian.
Since most of applications are linux ported, there is loads of stuff you can do. Am example I enjoy is you can run an x11vnc server on your n900 and remote access it from anywhere with a vnc client. Other fancy stuff such to connect the n900 to your tv, run an Amiga emulator, bind your ps3 controller over BT, and start playing.
It's (very easy) overclockable, GPU runs great, VoIP services as a charm (Skype Video is now added), and most important in a really good multitasking environement. And ofcourse the moment you want to call your phone will response very very fast.
While it does all of the above, it does give you an iPhone feeling in terms of ease of use and device polishing.
On the downside, until today the software was limited except if you were a linux pro as very well mentioned above. The new 1.2 upgrade with Qt support broadens the range and posibiliteis quite a lot. For me, only support for Flash 10 is also a big issue for now, and i really hope it gets addressed soon.
It is bulky (related to iPhone likes) - nothing new here.
Bottom end, I tend to agree it doesn't fit to this forum. this forum was always about smartphones. This is one a tiny marvelous computer that can make GSM calls too. I think its a bit advanced for this site ;-)
rGrds
George
phones with resistive and cheap plastic like feeling screens always put me down.....
go to MAEMO.Org its all for n900 and whatever u want to do with it..
ruslanriad said:
go to MAEMO.Org its all for n900 and whatever u want to do with it..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
there you go then if you have a n900 and want to tweak it!
better talent here than maemo.org. still have my htc hd and the n900, just can't part with my htc yet.
Please make it, its a way to promote a lot of staff and give one opportunity for this system, *if nokia* gives the same "status" as Google with Android probably it will be the best system for mobile ever. A simple example, Maemo as conceited to support Open GL 2.0, Android not. Maemo was made for gives a new way to do the things, Android is only a WinMO more social and user-friendly. Now with MeeGo, the system haves a new chance, but XDA could help because Nokia still sucks with support.
So, please make it, i will appreciate it as well.
WoW!
I am now running nearly ALL my dearest Palm OS apps of yore (from my Treo650) in a VM inside N900.
Gotta looove open platforms!
If interested, follow here.
how comes there`s a new Kin forums and nothing for the N900 thats just BS
i suppose the n900 is linux and we've tweaked with linux here at xda before so.... if you contact the administrator he might say yes!
Both Communities have amazing minds, and i'm sure that there could be some overlap of usefulness stuff if there was an included section.
At the very least it would generate new interest for the site as a whole.
I also think that an N900 section would compliment the already excellent forums of XDA. As you are probably aware there is a lot of development currently underway of porting Froyo to this device.
We are all like minded and are trying to get the most out of our mobile devices. The nokia N900 is linux based as with the andriod system.
Thanks
I stupidly started a thread on this subject without searching earlier, apologies for that, should know better.
I see that there's a few of us wanting to see the N900 represented here.
I'd be happy to do some articles on the power mangement system and other bits I've learned since getting my N900, if only there was an appropriate place to put them.
Please don't say the obvious "put them on <insert-name-of-maemo-forum>". I trust this community to dissect and disseminate information in a constructive way. Other forums just don't give me the same confidence.
I think it'd be a smart move to add it for a few reasons:
1. It is a great way to combine the minds from here to another powerful device
2. With major companies now backing the Meego OS for there vehicle systems, this would be a great way to get the foot in the door as this OS gains some ground in the coming year or so.
3. The community here is exceptionally constructive...it's not about what can't be done, it's about discovering what can. What better tool to use than an fairly open sourced/linux based device.
4. My biased reason: Now that it's my only device, I miss xda :-(
I'm sure there are also some seasoned programmers familiar with the OS differences that would be able to bring up some more in depth reasons on why programming for this device wouldn't be a huge stepping stone from Android/Win Mo.
I would believe that breaking down all of the positives on the programming side of things might be a way for the admin's to make a thoughtful/final decision on whether or not it's worth XDA's resources to add the phone.
i had a n900 and i loved and even overclocked it, my youtube video was on engadget and got 50000 hits
anyways great device and hardware but letdown by nokia, i then bought the desire as i got bored of n900. so happy i got rid of it it had a major price drop in the second hand market.
I would really like to see one as well since I just got the N900. I really like the community here and doesn't want to leave this forum because I bought a n900.
hi together i also own a N900 since Nokia decided to choose Meego and Maemo5 is dying i play around with Nitdroid for the N900 its an Android Port for the N900 and works very well the only Problem is that the Phone radio dont works. The Nitdroid Port for the N900 is done by 3 People so far maybe some good Devs from here could help to get the Phone or GPS working for this, that would be amazing.
I guess nobody cares about the N900 anymore .. since Nokia goes to Meego i just hope about the Nitdroid Port.
Consider this just morbid curiosity. I don't care if it's a bad idea.
I know I can run a chrooted Linux on these things, but I want to see just how far you can take it. I thought about it and realized we have an impressive amount of hardware in these little devices. A decent CPU+GPU+DSP, hardware support for USB hosting, HDMI output, two built in cameras, etc. I should be able to use my Evo as a full-fledged computer, albeit with a little work.
I started Googling around. Maybe my Google-fu is weak right now, but it seems hard to come across solid information about the hardware in the Evo, and what kind of support you'd find in a vanilla (non-Android) Linux kernel. Every hit I come across is specifically Android related.
Basically, I want to run a vanilla kernel, uCLibC and Busybox, and built a rudimentary software stack on top of that for accomplishing some basic things. Where I go from there really depends on my success getting just that to run.
Can anyone turn up some solid info for what kind of support the Linux kernel has for the Evo's hardware? I don't care about cell connectivity, but it would be pointless if I couldn't get good support for the CPU, GPU, USB controller, wifi controller, HDMI output (hopefully), and touchscreen (I really don't want to lug a keyboard around -- yes, I plan to actually use this). I'll go as far as hacking drivers in that aren't already present, and even developing my own window manager with a soft keyboard, but I can't even find solid info on whether or not all the Evo's hardware has open source reference drivers, or if they're already in the mainline kernel.
Any help at all would be appreciated. Any links that point in the right direction, or any advice from developers who've had to mess around with drivers during ROM/kernel work.
Thanks.
sounds great
I can see that Unofficial Working Twrp is now up, and even the Kernel Source Is released, But Why is no developer starting to make ROMs for this device?
I am interested in it, too...
I explain this lack with multiple reasons:
first, unequivocally the golden age of modding is over (not necessarily a bad thing... finally there are several actors (smartphone producers) which promise good devices...)
this is not a top device (i.e. S22) neither of a mainstream producer (i.e. OnePlus)
the stock ROM is fairly good, lightweight, un-intrusive (not perfect, probably the little work it needs, it does not worth it)
any difficulties in providing a complete custom ROM (i.e. managing multi-camera is a common issue...)
anyway, something is moving... https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/realme-gt-master-edition-custom-rom-support.4419047/ let's cross our fingers!