Develop Bugs

Android on S620

How much will we wait until htc will public android for are S620 (if it will ever come out).
This is a call to all:
IS THERE ANYBODY WITH SKILLS THAT WOULD LIKE TO START WORKING ON ANDROID S620
I know its not easy but a lot of you have great programming skill, and I'm 100% that something will come out.

You're not going to get it from HTC if it even comes to the Excalibur. HTC have pledged not to "recycle" old Windows Mobile phones for Android. They're planning on issuing different phones with different hardware specs for each respective OS.

besides android is solely based on touch screen and i just dont see how it will work on a non touch screen device which specs are like 2yrs old...im sorry to say but the s620, while is/was a great phone (i have one), technology wise its out of date..most phones that are coming out now(well the good ones)will mostly be touch screen..they are the way of the future and im just waiting to update to the htc touch pro/ raphael
now a phone like that should be more customizable than how the s620 was!!

thedoctor1 said:
besides android is solely based on touch screen and i just dont see how it will work on a non touch screen device which specs are like 2yrs old...im sorry to say but the s620, while is/was a great phone (i have one), technology wise its out of date..most phones that are coming out now(well the good ones)will mostly be touch screen..they are the way of the future and im just waiting to update to the htc touch pro/ raphael
now a phone like that should be more customizable than how the s620 was!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unless the device have a keyboard or keypad, i would never consider a device with on-screen dialer (even the one on iPhone didn't impress me).

x2
My buddy has a HTC Touch and I hate using it. Texting is such a pain with that onscreen keyboard.

Just my own personal bias, but I'd rather see things like openmoko and qtopia take center stage. Google has the corporate money behind it to put out yet another cash cow. The only difference between Windows Mobile and Android in terms of freedom is the company behind it. There will still be deals with carriers and manufacturers as well as measures in place to limit what you can do with your phone.
I don't understand how people even have phones running Android yet. Google's license agreement for downloading the SDK is so strict, you can't even install it on current hardware without incurring legal action.

beartard said:
Just my own personal bias, but I'd rather see things like openmoko and qtopia take center stage. Google has the corporate money behind it to put out yet another cash cow. The only difference between Windows Mobile and Android in terms of freedom is the company behind it. There will still be deals with carriers and manufacturers as well as measures in place to limit what you can do with your phone.
I don't understand how people even have phones running Android yet. Google's license agreement for downloading the SDK is so strict, you can't even install it on current hardware without incurring legal action.
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Click to collapse
I like the openmoko idea but its since forever that's on beta and its a year that they sold out the beta ones. Will the openmoko OS work on S620?
I don't think that android will be available only for touch smartphones, plus I'm sure someone is going customize it for its own phone and he is going to share it.
Your right about the google corp. and restriction even with android will have them, but I think it will be much easier to go around them. I'm looking forward to by the sgh i780 (even if I prefer HTC) they said its going to be 1st phone with android I wonder what price it will hava, I heard that phones with android are going to cost much less but I'm worried about this. How much do I have to wait to see that phone in stores or internet, they said it would of been out by mid jun but still no trace on the web.

I'm doubting anything is going to be ported to the S620. The Xanadux project has been working on Linux-based software for HTC phones for years, and nothing has come out for the Excalibur yet.
I'm not looking to buy an Android phone. Some members of the Android community have said that, even this phone with a free OS, will cost almost the initial price of the iphone. I don't have one of those either

wm7... the end?

Is winmo7 gonna be the end of winmo development here at xda? It's totally new, and its gonna be really hard to port it to existing winmo phones, and its a lot more locked down...

I was wondering the same thing after watching the press event video, which is why I came here to see reaction.

As long as there is a registry it hackable... I feel sorry for HTC or cannot customise their phones to have a unique selling point over other OEM's

It seems MS have built it for the sole purpose of cracking the "consumer" market. Looks incredibly pretty and i'm sure it will "work", however, whether it will be as appealing to the xda-dev community is another question!! A bit too early to say it's the end, but just from viewing the promotional videos, I can see my love for Android growing further!!

windows phone 7 has got me quite excited.. looking fwd to use it come december 2010.

I think you're right that it's just too early to tell. I hope you're right about the registry/hackable comment, though.

I am wondering would Microsoft be so stupid to create almost a totally new OS. If they do, i believe there will some sort of migrator to migrate apps to the new os. However i am seriously disappointed if they decide to remove mutiltask.

6.5.3 will remain alive and well for enterprise and developing markets, so even if we can't port winmo 7 there will still be updates to 6.5. Either way, MS has pretty much destroyed new app development for 6.5, as many of the major players will probably wait to develop exclusively for 7. I'm definately excited about 7 though; in the meantime it looks like android will be your friend if your looking for apps.

I think it will be a new beginning. However, the new SDK will likely be based on WPF or Silverlight, so the .NET knowledge of the current developers can be applied (however, WPF has IMHO a steep learning curve) and some code can be transferred. Game development will likely be based on XNA (you can already create Zune XNA games).
The big question for me is: Is publishing/installation of new applications as easy as it is currently the case? The worst case scenario would be a mandatory marketplace and you have to pay a fee to get your application added. However, I think that Microsoft will be going a developer-friendly way, because the third party applications will make or brake the OS.

The worst case scenario would be a mandatory marketplace and you have to pay a fee to get your application added.
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That's exactly what's happening...

i just hope, that the multi billion dollar companies, make everything in the phone work the way it has to, and not wait till some regular people on this forum turn the phone into a good device.. seriously, i buy a WM knowing that its crap, just cause i know that here on XDA i can fix it and make it how i want it...

I just hope m$ has not gone the apple way blocking all development !
that will be a really really sad day on XDA.
Too early to say.
First few leaks should arrive some months hence.

irdawood said:
As long as there is a registry it hackable... I feel sorry for HTC or cannot customise their phones to have a unique selling point over other OEM's
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Click to collapse
I think you didn't paid attention to what was said in the conference.
They said, on top OEM's can customize it to add their experience to it. So HTC and other can customize it, but not to the extend of WM 6.5's case. That's because to give a consistent experience to us ( users ).
Please don't get into conclusion's without understanding what was said.

well here's a video
http://www.engadget.com/2010/02/15/windows-phone-7-series-hands-on-and-impressions/

yerand said:
Is winmo7 gonna be the end of winmo development here at xda? It's totally new, and its gonna be really hard to port it to existing winmo phones, and its a lot more locked down...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
no dev's have even gotten their hands on this yet. How the heck would you know what's possible with is and what's not?

Well, it is new, Microsoft stated that it has more restrictions, and its pretty much a brand new os, because microsoft also stated that its built from the ground up, therefore its like porting android to a winmo phone. It has very little of its older winmo roots.

ibsa03 said:
i just hope, that the multi billion dollar companies, make everything in the phone work the way it has to, and not wait till some regular people on this forum turn the phone into a good device.. seriously, i buy a WM knowing that its crap, just cause i know that here on XDA i can fix it and make it how i want it...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I totally agree with u the reason i bought my htc fuze and sold my nokia phone was because i love how cuztomizeable wm is and even if they become like apple there is always android

But wasnt there supposed to be an OEM version of Windows Mobile 7 that could be customized by third party's such as HTC? From what I saw of the press coverage, we were just seeing the "interface" much like titanium and Touchflo.....but who knows....

semmtexx said:
no dev's have even gotten their hands on this yet. How the heck would you know what's possible with is and what's not?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It may well be that it is the most easy to crack ever, However, i dobt that
@Microsoft, WHY!!!???! if i wanted an consumer OS, i would of purchased an iBrick
Why not kill 6.6, make 6.9 with the winmo 7 kernal and code in some .NET support and let HTC work it's magic
Badwolve1

for a long time, the older phones (wizard old) have been able to run the newest versions (6.5.3). i think this is gonna end development on those old phones. hopefully we will get it to run on the new phones like the hd2

[Q] Replacing Android

So, I've been looking around pretty hard recently and I have yet to see an answer on this that either applies to my phone or is not out of date.
My question is: Is a dev willing to attempt to replace android with Windows Mobile (6.1-6.5) or Windows Phone? Or is this not possible? ( Had seen previous answers stating we needed an unlocked bootloader for this to be an option...which we now have.)
Now some of you may be asking why the hell I'm wanting to replace the OS, and that comes down to the new privacy policy of Google's services and that there are no WM devices w/in the past two years that have a physical keyboard which use the 1700 MHz band for data.
Thanks so much for the help.

hobbiteer said:
So, I've been looking around pretty hard recently and I have yet to see an answer on this that either applies to my phone or is not out of date.
My question is: Is a dev willing to attempt to replace android with Windows Mobile (6.1-6.5) or Windows Phone? Or is this not possible? ( Had seen previous answers stating we needed an unlocked bootloader for this to be an option...which we now have.)
Now some of you may be asking why the hell I'm wanting to replace the OS, and that comes down to the new privacy policy of Google's services and that there are no WM devices w/in the past two years that have a physical keyboard which use the 1700 MHz band for data.
Thanks so much for the help.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is very hard to port a different OS. Possible, but very hard.
But as for the privacy policy, you understand that it basically makes Google have the SAME policy as Microsoft and Apple right? And you can opt out of many of the changes?
The media got that story and turned it into something it wasn't. Google can use your data to improve your experience in its other services. Just like Microsoft says it does.....only difference is they hide it in a wall of text, Google came out and told you.

Also, think that Windows Mobile/Windows Phone are closed-source OSes, while Android is Open Source. Even though, look how hard it is to port Ice Cream Sandwich to our device - an Android OS.
Porting another system with no drivers or access to source code would be next to impossible.

This has been asked a bunch and always answered with either no it can't work or why would you want to.
Don't think its possible
And its not that ics is super hard to port..its the fact that it hasn't been released for more than a couple devices. As soon as htc releases the official dhd ics things should go a lot smoother
Sent from my HTC Vision using xda premium

Nospin, I do know that the policy is basically the same for Google as it is for Microsoft or Apple. And i really do like that they came out and said it as opposed to the EULAs of the others. I am also aware I can opt out of Google's services by not signing in on my desktop, but not on Android. I am required to be logged in to use things on the device like the market. Even for free apps, I have to be signed in to download them. Then, most of them also only provide downloads via the market, so I can't go to their site and buy them or get them (or updates.)
I am well aware it is difficult to port a different OS to a device, but I also know it's not impossible (just next to it.) I also know the question had been asked multiple times. I found 4 different threads under 4 different devices. All of them had different answers. Either "we need an unlocked bootloader", "yes it can be done", or "not possible." Were the answers. With each of the threads being years old I figured asking was the easiest way to get an updated answer.
If open source is the issue, how about loading memo 5, or even a full on version of Linux (vnc solutions don't count.)
I appreciate the responses so far, but I'd also like to hear from a dev on the subject if possible.

HTC HD2 is multiplatform (android,WM 6.5, WP7, ubuntu, meego) but doesn't have keyboard (only bluetooth)

Oh god, the mention of WM 6.X on our device made me throw up in my mouth a little. So obsolete, laggy and unstable. I don't know why you would go anywhere near that garbage.
Porting WM or WP, not "impossible" per se. But so much would have to be built from scratch. No hardware drivers for WP to work on our device, so they would have to be written from scratch. It would be a huge effort, and the fact that WP is closed source, makes it all the more difficult. "Impossible", technically no. But hundreds, probably thousands of hours worth of work. Nobody is really interested in putting that much effort into such a project. And for the reason that you just don't like Google's privacy policy? Sorry, not going to happen.

Damage control suggestions for Microsoft/Nokia in light of all this?

Although I understand why WP8 will not be compatible with existing devices, the bad PR is not exactly helping Microsoft/Nokia. The consolation prize of WP7.8 is not enough to dispel the Osborne Effect that is very likely to occur between now and the time WP8 devices are released.
So let's use this topic to suggest some damage control possibilities based on what's happening NOW, not what Microsoft coulda/shoulda/woulda done (there are plenty of other topics covering the latter).
I think Microsoft/Nokia/carriers should have a trade-in program: trade in a WP7 device for credit off of a new WP8 device. Depending on the trade-in amount, it may or may not stop the bleeding from the Osborne-inflicted wounds, though.
Any other suggestions?

killerb255 said:
I think Microsoft/Nokia/carriers should have a trade-in program: trade in a WP7 device for credit off of a new WP8 device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why? They gave you a Lumia 900 or free. What more do you want?

An expansion of the "Registered Enthusiasts" program that would give us carrier locked stock images of a stripped down WP8 build or a $100 credit from Microsoft upon request.

sitizenx said:
Why? They gave you a Lumia 900 or free. What more do you want?
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Click to collapse
Aside from the word "you" in the second sentence, good point. Many people got the Lumia 900 for free with contract, so it's not like they're being totally shafted.
Other suggestions or rebuttals? Keep in mind that the PR is still bad, and people are not exactly thinking "well, I got a free phone, I should be grateful." They're thinking "OMG, M$ jus skrewd mez!"

Look at the big picture.
The market share wasn't going to get any bigger in the next 3 to 5 months, especially with no new flash ship devices on the horizon.
With Windows 8 and this kernel, there will be a surge of developers. Tons of amazing apps, the market share will explode.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2

I think they should stop talking to us as if we're retarded. Just that. Come clean and say "we're not updating you to WP8 because we don't want to". Enough with the "kernel re-write" stuff, it doesn't make sense. It's like saying you can't run Windows 8 on a Windows XP PC with enough power to run it because it has a different kernel.

I think trade in is the way forward. Based on IMEI they would know what phones were sold free, subsidized or full price. Pay the trade in value accordingly.
Sent from my Titan using XDA Windows Phone 7 App

I am thinking along the lines of put as many goodies in the WP7.8 build and that way the consumers get a taste of the new OS and then go out and buy a new WP8, Not far from what's already in the pipeline I know but just exactly the way I would now treat this situation, Not everyone will be happy, But then again when is everyone ever happy

guilhermedsx said:
I think they should stop talking to us as if we're retarded. Just that. Come clean and say "we're not updating you to WP8 because we don't want to". Enough with the "kernel re-write" stuff, it doesn't make sense. It's like saying you can't run Windows 8 on a Windows XP PC with enough power to run it because it has a different kernel.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A better analogy would be comparing Windows 9x (95/98/Millennium) with NT (2000/XP/Vista/7/8). Those have different kernels, but can run on the same x86 processors.
Either way, your point has merit. Windows RT is being written for ARM architecture...why not Windows Phone 8? One possibility could be that current hardware is just too dang slow, and we could have another early-gen Android-like situation, where single-core Android phones that aren't optimized (i.e.: rooted, Wi-Fi turned off, kill unused background apps, etc) run slow.
If the problem is more of a political/financial one, rather than a technical one, then I'm sure the fine cooks here at XDA will eventually come up with a way to run a Windows Phone 8 ROM on existing hardware.
AndyFZ1S said:
I am thinking along the lines of put as many goodies in the WP7.8 build and that way the consumers get a taste of the new OS and then go out and buy a new WP8, Not far from what's already in the pipeline I know but just exactly the way I would now treat this situation, Not everyone will be happy, But then again when is everyone ever happy
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hopefully they release a complete list of updates to be put in Windows Phone 7.8, if for no other reason than to try and pacify the masses.
...of course this is assuming that the complete list consists of more than just the WP8 UI update...
vetvito said:
Look at the big picture.
The market share wasn't going to get any bigger in the next 3 to 5 months, especially with no new flash ship devices on the horizon.
With Windows 8 and this kernel, there will be a surge of developers. Tons of amazing apps, the market share will explode.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True, but I wonder if Nokia can afford to wait that long...

The start screen isn't the only update in 7.8; its just the only one we KNOW about. Microsoft didn't completely release WP7.8 to the public because they aren't done with it. So don't jump to conclusions because you might just be happy with what's in the update.

If the problem is more of a political/financial one, rather than a technical one, then I'm sure the fine cooks here at XDA will eventually come up with a way to run a Windows Phone 8 ROM on existing hardware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hoping that the current hardware will work on 8... but they could throw all the hardware under the bus... as we saw from 6.x to 7.
Other than us 'enthusiasts', does the casual phone user really care whether their 900 will work with WP8 (other than the availability - or lack therof - of apps)?
The fact that none of the 6.x programs will work on 7 tells you that usoft is in it for the long haul (either that, or they made a SERIOUS miscalculation)! I know... it's a total re-vamp of the software.. had to do it... is 8 going to be as drastic of a change?
At least they are saying 'WP7 programs might have to have a 'minor' tweak' to run on 8... will give WP7 users some hope.
(I'm on the edge of getting a 900 (still running my tilt 2), but I'm not happy about some of the aps that I use on the t2 aren't available for WP7). The developers say 'they are looking into it'...
Tim

Nokia has done trade-ins before. I remember them doing it for at least the last 2 years.
At least this would be an option for those are complaining that they are stuck with the same phone for the remaining of their contract. Plus, it would help generate some momentum when the new devices are introduced. Microsoft is going to need to WP8 users right away and cannot wait multiple years to reach 2%. So give people who were loyal a discount when the phones are launched.
Microsoft, Nokia, and others could very well do nothing like when WP7 replaced Windows Mobile. We also know that there were large numbers of people who left permanently when this happened.

eeeelliott said:
The start screen isn't the only update in 7.8; its just the only one we KNOW about. Microsoft didn't completely release WP7.8 to the public because they aren't done with it. So don't jump to conclusions because you might just be happy with what's in the update.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, Microsoft have apparently said that WP7.8 is the start screen only. See links below.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=PLEB8CC228C5239441&v=fTNHgfy7lY8&feature=player_detailpage#t=5052s
http://www.winsupersite.com/article/windowsphone75/windows-phone-78-preview-143476

tim051 said:
The fact that none of the 6.x programs will work on 7 tells you that usoft is in it for the long haul (either that, or they made a SERIOUS miscalculation)! I know... it's a total re-vamp of the software.. had to do it... is 8 going to be as drastic of a change?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No. WP7 programs will still work on WP8.
tim051 said:
Hoping that the current hardware will work on 8... but they could throw all the hardware under the bus... as we saw from 6.x to 7.
Other than us 'enthusiasts', does the casual phone user really care whether their 900 will work with WP8 (other than the availability - or lack therof - of apps)?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No.

HTC One M8 W/ Win 8

Hey guys! I was reading an article that shows a M8 running windows mobile 8. I saw it pop up on multiple sites so it must be really comming. I was just wondering what if the device had the same specs as ours. Doesn't that nean that in the future we may be able to run it on ours. Not that I would ditch android but just the thought of having the best of both worlds gets me excited. How about you? Any thoughts?

Windows phone 8.1 not mobile
I'm not interested in using Windows phone as my daily driver but would be cool if we can dual boot wp and android.
Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk

kirdroid said:
Windows phone 8.1 not mobile
I'm not interested in using Windows phone as my daily driver but would be cool if we can dual boot wp and android.
Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry lol I don't keep up that much with windows but hey it would be cool to dual boot just because why not. Using another os without having to commit to it sounds great.

I'd love a dual boot, but if I recall it's sort of a legal grey area. Windows phone isn't free like android, so it's possible that the m8's that ship with windows phone will get unofficial android support, those of us that have them that shipped with android haven't "paid" for a windows license for the phones, so we may not get unofficial WP support.

It's going to be a re-release of the m8 as the w8 running wp8.1. It's not a dual boot phone just a "new" device apparently.
But if there were certain developers that got curious and dedicated to porting wp to the Android m8 it would just be a matter time. Identical hardware only rebranded as a Windows phone with working drivers. Techically a working hboot/boot loader similar to magldr for HD2 would do it.
But that's all what ifs on a device that's not the m8.

Tachi91 said:
It's going to be a re-release of the m8 as the w8 running wp8.1. It's not a dual boot phone just a "new" device apparently.
But if there were certain developers that got curious and dedicated to porting wp to the Android m8 it would just be a matter time. Identical hardware only rebranded as a Windows phone with working drivers. Techically a working hboot/boot loader similar to magldr for HD2 would do it.
But that's all what ifs on a device that's not the m8.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But see, the HD2 came with windows phone first, so it technically had the license for it. The M8 android edition doesn't have the windows licensing so I'm not sure if a developer would want to undertake that task and risk the wrath of microsoft.

I think if this wp8 phone had identical hardware and a stock RUU were to appear one could flash this ROM with S-OFF.
Technically speaking sense is not open source and that doesn't stop people from attempting to port it other devices. Almost always OEM ports are proof of concept.
Unless Windows/HTC were to issue a cease and desist letter to the dev community (which I don't see happening considering at this point they would be thrilled people would have an interest period) I don't see this being an issue if hardware specifications are the same or equal enough

md1008 said:
I think if this wp8 phone had identical hardware and a stock RUU were to appear one could flash this ROM with S-OFF.
Technically speaking sense is not open source and that doesn't stop people from attempting to port it other devices. Almost always OEM ports are proof of concept.
Unless Windows/HTC were to issue a cease and desist letter to the dev community (which I don't see happening considering at this point they would be thrilled people would have an interest period) I don't see this being an issue if hardware specifications are the same or equal enough
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Partition layout are different between the two different OS. An RUU would not flash and if it did you would screw up your phone emmc so brick.

I am by no means an expert but I know the partition are different from GPE and Sense and with soff you can still flash. In theory wouldn't that be the same? I maybe way off.
If this had the support of Nexus community I bet you a working wp8 could work. For instance if their was a nexus 5 that happened to run WP8.
In any case I would love to at least try a try WP8. I am sure I will be running back to android a weeks tops though

TriBeard said:
I'd love a dual boot, but if I recall it's sort of a legal grey area. Windows phone isn't free like android, so it's possible that the m8's that ship with windows phone will get unofficial android support, those of us that have them that shipped with android haven't "paid" for a windows license for the phones, so we may not get unofficial WP support.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Windows announced a couple months back that all devices under 8 or 9 inches are free now. No need to pay for a license. I'll have to look up the article I read, but I'm sure a quick Google search would yield done results.
Sent from my LG-D851 using XDA Free mobile app

Harmtan2 said:
Windows announced a couple months back that all devices under 8 or 9 inches are free now. No need to pay for a license. I'll have to look up the article I read, but I'm sure a quick Google search would yield done results.
Sent from my LG-D851 using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Looks like you are spot on! Which answers the question and makes it more plausible.
Free Windows phone for devices < 9" Save your jokes!
This almost makes me feel like Microsoft should make it easier to convert an Android version for people that are curious to use their OS. Furthermore, it would be brilliant to help adoption rate if they give free licenses and encourage existing devices to convert to Windows in a simple easy way. Starting to see some light here.

A ROM like the gpe one coming? But w8
Sent from my Nexus 7 using XDA Free mobile app

md1008 said:
I think if this wp8 phone had identical hardware and a stock RUU were to appear one could flash this ROM with S-OFF.
Technically speaking sense is not open source and that doesn't stop people from attempting to port it other devices. Almost always OEM ports are proof of concept.
Unless Windows/HTC were to issue a cease and desist letter to the dev community (which I don't see happening considering at this point they would be thrilled people would have an interest period) I don't see this being an issue if hardware specifications are the same or equal enough
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
MS already went after XDA, hence all the windows phone software on the site was removed.

Is this true?

Oops posted in wrong forum...

I would love the idea of dual boot, but honestly I would do Android/UbuntuPhone