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Hi there,
I am due an upgrade on my Orange contract. In one regard I'm tempted to wait a while to see what new phones are on the horizon - but whether or not I can resist grabbing a phone straight away is another matter.
I was among the first early adopters of android and I'm very pleased with the OS. If I was to stick with it it's quite likely I'd upgrade to the HTC DESIRE HD...
BUT!!! I have been looking at videos demonstrating windows phones and I have to say I've been impressed. I love the UI and everything seems exceptionally fluid - more so than android, which is what I'm on at the moment and up until now has been what I was intending on sticking with.
A few questions I suppose;
Is there multitasking on board?
I'm aware applications are in shorter supply than its competitors - that's not a huge issue to me as long as I have the essentials covered.
How is windows getting on sales wise? Seeing as it's still early I risk going for a platform which could be abandoned by app authors and left stranded and unsuported by websites / media outlets.
So what would you say is the latest and greatest windows 7 phone?
Cheers,
V
Multi-tasking is very limited for the time being. Announcements from microsoft say this will be included in the febuary update.
Windows has said they will back this OS regardless and I believe it. It's certainly doing better than windows mobile and I'm confident that it wont be abandoned.
The best WP7 phone is hard to say. with the OS I'd always go for the biggest screen of maybe a physical keyboard.
I would go for soldered memory (way faster ) like Samsung .
I have a hd7 and it is a real good phone but I would love to play with a Samsung .
z33dev33l said:
Multi-tasking is very limited for the time being. Announcements from microsoft say this will be included in the febuary update.
Windows has said they will back this OS regardless and I believe it. It's certainly doing better than windows mobile and I'm confident that it wont be abandoned.
The best WP7 phone is hard to say. with the OS I'd always go for the biggest screen of maybe a physical keyboard.
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Click to collapse
just to supply correction...
multitasking is only capable at present for particular applications including zune (music/video), web (internet explorer), and a few of the other built in things already on the phone. there is no official word from MS as to if/when multitasking will be available, but there have been rumours (not from MS) that they have been working on some form of it, and it could be seen as early as the first update (but highly unlikely).
and now to your questions...
multitasking = covered above
essentials [apps] covered = well it's best if you tell us what your day to day use of your current Android phone is, and we can help in giving you the information available. At present though, the current APIs do limit the development and release of some of the more desired applications, but a lot have come on board, whether that be through MS doing the leg work, or the companies getting excited about it.
windows getting sales = well they (MS) are still "mum" on it (not saying), as it's still early days. i don't believe MS is out to sell as many as iPhone/Android straight out of the gate, but they have said that they're committed to getting this really going (windows mobile had 4 people employed for it's development, windows phone (it's current form) has over 400 people employed for it's development... you do the math). in terms of it being abandoned, i don't see it happening with their level of commitment. as more people get on board, it will encourage others (devs/companies) to as well.
latest/greatest phone = depends on where you live and what you're after. this is the just one of the best things about windows phone. there are several different flavours from the music/entertainment (surround/hd7), to the expandable memory [read up on this first before jumping into it] (focus), to the picture taker (mozart), to the general use (trophy/omnia 7/optimus 7). of course there are plenty more reasons for each model, but these are just examples of how you could see the phones. the experience is close to the same on each device, so you just need to find one that meets your day to day needs/desires.
hopefully this gives you a bit of insight.
z33dev33l said:
Multi-tasking is very limited for the time being. Announcements from microsoft say this will be included in the febuary update.
Windows has said they will back this OS regardless and I believe it. It's certainly doing better than windows mobile and I'm confident that it wont be abandoned.
The best WP7 phone is hard to say. with the OS I'd always go for the biggest screen of maybe a physical keyboard.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The multi-tasking will most probably be included in the updates. there is no definitive list of what is going to be included in the first update besides copy and paste.
Thanks so much everyone - all very insightful replies.
I'd be clicking thank if I could!
My take, after getting the Trophy just for having a look at the OS is that it is indeed worth it. I've actually been on of the people moaning about the change of direction and claiming to desert and go to the Android camp. However, even though this is all very new and scary, I think I'm starting to like this new platform.
I will still install Android on my HD2, but my main phone will be the trophy (until I can get a good phone with SAMOLED )
My gf is jealous of my relationship with my Samsung Omnia 7. Enough said. hehe
jhughesy said:
My gf is jealous of my relationship with my Samsung Omnia 7. Enough said. hehe
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i love my HD7, but i wish the Omina 7 was here in the states .
jz9833 said:
i love my HD7, but i wish the Omina 7 was here in the states .
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I have a feeling it will be coming to Verizon eventually. They had the previousl Omnia's and Samsung is going all in on WP7 so I think a LTE Omnia 7 may be in the future.
Omega Ra said:
I have a feeling it will be coming to Verizon eventually. They had the previousl Omnia's and Samsung is going all in on WP7 so I think a LTE Omnia 7 may be in the future.
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I'm not so sure about an LTE WP7 device. The reason why HSPA+ is on the HD7 and Venue Pro is because the processor didnt support it. I believe this will also be the case for LTE.
If it is on LTE then I might be going back to verizon even though I said I'd never do that again
jz9833 said:
I'm not so sure about an LTE WP7 device. The reason why HSPA+ is on the HD7 and Venue Pro is because the processor didnt support it. I believe this will also be the case for LTE.
If it is on LTE then I might be going back to verizon even though I said I'd never do that again
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well perhaps with the Gen 2 Chassis it will have a processor that will support it, I hope at least.
EDIT: though I would be happy with a version of the focus with 16GB and 512MB RAM. (card slot too)
So basically what we are going to get is just the "new" start screen? nothing else? like maps powered by nokia, skype integration?
I would love to know too. Almost sold my Lumia already, but I dont know which phone I get instead it. I'll keep it for a while.
Guess we will know in a few days, no one knows it right now.
Paul Thurrott has a write-up about this here:
http://www.winsupersite.com/article/windowsphone75/windows-phone-78-preview-143476
Wait.. No multitasking? Nor Skype integrated!?!?
Seems like MS is doing everything to loose these 1-2% of the smartphones market...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1722502
I wont buy another windows phone anymore! I liked windows phone so much, but microsoft disappoint me with no updates for first generation devices. If the old phones would also get the new kernel, app-compability and skype-integration, then would it be enough. But Microsoft is ****ing stupid and dropps the little amount of windows phone users in only one day!
luizmeme said:
So basically what we are going to get is just the "new" start screen? nothing else? like maps powered by nokia, skype integration?
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I just contacted the WinPhoneSupport:
http://www.twitter.com/WinPhoneSupport/status/215556734205435904
@WinPhoneSupport: @ChrisK91 The only thing announced for 7.8 is the change of the start screen. ^EB
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ruyzalim said:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1722502
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It's a stupid marketing bull**** from MS guy... This Belfiore guy wrote:
Windows Phone 8 is a generation shift in technology, which means that it will not run on existing hardware. BUT we care deeply about our existing customers and want to keep their phones fresh, so we’re providing the new Start screen in this new update.
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It's a complete bull****! "shift in technology"... He should try Galaxy S III first!
But the facts are:
- MS just made stupidest decision in a years. Probably next 5 month WP7 sales will fall to 0.
- also, I'm expecting the app developers (as I am) will stop developing new stuff for "outdated" WP7 platform;
- it's a painful blow to manufacturers, especially to Nokia! Who will buy "gorgeous Lumia 900" now if it become outdated old piece of hardware so shortly? Check ebay in few days - Lumia 900 price will be bellow $200...
- and, finally, the most important thing: Microsoft has lost the trust and loyalty of customers. Who will spend money for "brand new" WP8 if next year they will announce WP9?
So, my conclusion: it's a very good time to sell MS stocks right now! Don't wait and risk your money...
freddx said:
I wont buy another windows phone anymore! I liked windows phone so much, but microsoft disappoint me with no updates for first generation devices. If the old phones would also get the new kernel, app-compability and skype-integration, then would it be enough. But Microsoft is ****ing stupid and dropps the little amount of windows phone users in only one day!
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Calm down... Don't you know what a kernel change means? It's like installing linux over windows on your PC. The OEM would start from scratch, rewrite every driver on the device (cpu, gpu, display, buttons, touch, accelerometer, compass, bluetooth, wlan... And the list goes on forever), that would take about 9 months at least. The OEM would loose more money than it would get.
jessenic said:
Calm down... Don't you know what a kernel change means? It's like installing linux over windows on your PC. The OEM would start from scratch, rewrite every driver on the device (cpu, gpu, display, buttons, touch, accelerometer, compass, bluetooth, wlan... And the list goes on forever), that would take about 9 months at least. The OEM would loose more money than it would get.
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Sorry I was in rage....but an update with more features would be nice The "old" hardware can do more than only a new start screen. Apple even gives a iOS6 lite to the 3Gs and all appstore-apps are compatible...
sensboston said:
It's a stupid marketing bull**** from MS guy... This Belfiore guy wrote:
It's a complete bull****! "shift in technology"... He should try Galaxy S III first!
But the facts are:
- MS just made stupidest decision in a years. Probably next 5 month WP7 sales will fall to 0.
- also, I'm expecting the app developers (as I am) will stop developing new stuff for "outdated" WP7 platform;
- it's a painful blow to manufacturers, especially to Nokia! Who will buy "gorgeous Lumia 900" now if it become outdated old piece of hardware so shortly? Check ebay in few days - Lumia 900 price will be bellow $200...
- and, finally, the most important thing: Microsoft has lost the trust and loyalty of customers. Who will spend money for "brand new" WP8 if next year they will announce WP9?
So, my conclusion: it's a very good time to sell MS stocks right now! Don't wait and risk your money...
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Click to collapse
You shouldn't sell MS stocks right now, because of one developer summit. Of course, there are a lot of disappointed users (including me) about the way MS took. But I don't think that every point in your list is valid. I doubt that WP7 sales will drop to 0. There are a lot of people buying phones based on feel. However I guess the WP7 sales will decrease in the coming months. At least the sales of new expensive devices like the Titan or Lumia 900. I also expect the prices of current handsets to drop over a few days.
Microsofts course could harm Nokia, I totally agree. When they made Nokia Drive available to every device, Nokia lost a unique selling point. One of the reasons why I bought a Lumia 800 was the free navigation. I'm expecting that Nokia's stock will drop even further in the coming days, if there aren't any new announcements that "improve" the current situation.
I also get that developers will target new phones. However how do you develop for Windows 8 and Windows Phone 8? Most likely with C# and the .Net framework. And guess what? You can run .Net based Apps on Windows Phone 7 as well. But at first I was also skeptical about this question and asked it in a Nokia Conversations discussion. The answer of a Nokia employee is attached.
the most important thing: Microsoft has lost the trust and loyalty of customers.
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I totally agree. However they can gain (at least my) trust back by providing not only the new start screen, but other improvements as well. The rumored new notification system comes to mind.
All in all I guess this announcement did not resolve the current update situation. In a nutshell MS stated that WP8 will be based on a new kernel and that this new kernel won't come to existing devices. Most of the new announcements were hardware related. One of the software things is the start screen, and this one is coming in Windows Phone 7.8. Did did not say, that this start screen is the only thing in this update. As stated above, MS should release (and continue releasing) updates that add WP8 functionality to WP7.
jessenic said:
Calm down... Don't you know what a kernel change means? It's like installing linux over windows on your PC. The OEM would start from scratch, rewrite every driver on the device (cpu, gpu, display, buttons, touch, accelerometer, compass, bluetooth, wlan... And the list goes on forever), that would take about 9 months at least. The OEM would loose more money than it would get.
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Click to collapse
Well it's of course expensive. But if Microsoft stays coherent with the kernel they could most likely reuse the code in the future. But I think the problem is hardware related. On one side there are the NFC features. Also the SecureBoot can't be integrated (at least AFAIK) only software vise. They have special hardware requirements and current phones don't meet them. Then again, the current CPUs are very fast and can run the Windows Phone 7.8 experience.
Chris, you are optimistic guy (and it's OK!) but I believe we do have more points for pessimism now...
What's happened - it's not a hardware-related but just marketing (read - stupid marketing!) issue. Microsoft is copying Apple's strategy now (probably they planned to sell own MS handsets) but without Steve Jobs magic it's hopeless...
MS public persons explanations - it's a bull****, don't trust 'em! It's like a "4 GB limitation of x86 OS'es" (what is an outrageous lie). I'm 99% sure it's happened because of two reasons:
- they want to "save" (he-he) some money for dropping old handsets support ;
- but the primary reason (I think so): they want to sell their own handsets
Also, unsuccessful WP7 marketing campaign during last two years should open our eyes...
I'd like to be optimistic but...
@sensbottom: let me correct your two mistakes there:
a) 4GB is really limit of 32bit operating systems. PAE requires the applications to support it => almost none do.
b) Supporting another system takes more money than upgrading them to the same one. Long term.
@OndaTer, first of all, I'm sensboston (Boston - it's a city on the East cost of US)
Second, read this: http://www.unawave.de/windows-7-tipps/32-bit-ram-barrier.html?lang=EN You may google for more if you want...
Third, what do you mean by "another system"? What "another" system? WP8 devices will have same CPU (arm) as current handsets; of course, adding support of current handsets should cost some money! But loosing the trust (finally) is much more expensive, you'll see it by the end of this month (even week). Just mark today's MS stock price...
Sorry, I always read it that way
a) Yes, it is called PAE, which is exactly what I wrote. Read it again! It is NOT possible to address >4GB with 32bit addresses. PAE uses 36bit addressing, but the application HAS to be compiled to be able to support the extra space!
b) "It is more money consuming (long term) to work on 7.8 line and 8.0+ line."
// I mean - application itself has only 4GB virtual space. Yes, the rest of the system can move the base of each application and thus use >4GB RAM. But note that also drivers must support it and that's why it is usually targetted at servers and it is disabled on desktops!
// ah I see what you mean - I thought that they removed it after SP2 or SP3 of XP (the issues with driver compatibility with PAE enabled).
sensboston said:
Chris, you are optimistic guy (and it's OK!) but I believe we do have more points for pessimism now...
What's happened - it's not a hardware-related but just marketing (read - stupid marketing!) issue. Microsoft is copying Apple's strategy now (probably they planned to sell own MS handsets) but without Steve Jobs magic it's hopeless...
MS public persons explanations - it's a bull****, don't trust 'em! It's like a "4 GB limitation of x86 OS'es" (what is an outrageous lie). I'm 99% sure it's happened because of two reasons:
- they want to "save" (he-he) some money for dropping old handsets support ;
- but the primary reason (I think so): they want to sell their own handsets
Also, unsuccessful WP7 marketing campaign during last two years should open our eyes...
I'd like to be optimistic but...
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Click to collapse
Well, we don't really have a choice here. I cannot return my phone and I have to live with it until 2013. At the moment we should wait what Microsoft announces about the 7.8 update. The Nokia Conversations Post mentioned multiple changes in the Windows Phone 7.8 update. They also reassured that they will stay committed to delivering updates. And it's not like that our phones will suddenly stop to work. Everything will be as integrated as before.
ChrisKringel said:
Well, we don't really have a choice here. I cannot return my phone and I have to live with it until 2013. At the moment we should wait what Microsoft announces about the 7.8 update. The Nokia Conversations Post mentioned multiple changes in the Windows Phone 7.8 update. They also reassured that they will stay committed to delivering updates. And it's not like that our phones will suddenly stop to work. Everything will be as integrated as before.
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THIS!
Im a little annoyed that my titan wont get the full WP8 update but im sure it will still get some new features! they've only shown WP8 once so far at a dev summit and people are saying they are going to sell there phones its mad! also i dont get people complaining that there first gen phones are getting WP8! they will be 2 years old!!! You are getting a update like apple would basically so stop complaining! If you were on android you would be out in the cold with a two year old handset most likely
WP 7.5 lacks a lot of features and we're going to be left out just like that.
This is just great. It's been like 6 months since I bought my phone and it's already outdated. Thank you MS. My phone is now nothing but a brick!
luizmeme said:
WP 7.5 lacks a lot of features and we're going to be left out just like that.
This is just great. It's been like 6 months since I bought my phone and it's already outdated. Thank you MS. My phone is now nothing but a brick!
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ok your getting a WP7.8 update arent you? you dont know what thats going to contain yet! also by the time this comes out your phone will actually be 12 months old almost and oh yes last time i checked the phone isnt suddenly going to stop working is it!
Of the lumia 900 owners, how many of you feel cheated and angry over how Microsoft is handling WP8.
1. Yes
2. No
A little cheated. Glad MS tried with 7.8 but I'm just worried about how that will fare down the line with 22 months left on my contract. Don't think I'll be waiting to find out.
pgsxdjp said:
A little cheated. Glad MS tried with 7.8 but I'm just worried about how that will fare down the line with 22 months left on my contract. Don't think I'll be waiting to find out.
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I believe it's a very good point for the class action against MS and AT&T. Just keep googling for that and be ready to join
Won my lumia 900, and I planed to get an updated wp8 device anyway, so, to answer your question, no I don't feel cheated. I might be angry at myself anyway for buying one knowing dual core was coming in a few months (if I had signed a contract)
Considering all the features coming for WP8 and 7.8 haven't been announced yet, I don't feel cheated at all. I imagine more is coming in 7.8 than they stated today. Joe Belfiore was very specific that they have MANY great things to talk about with consumer features, but that wasn't the point of the conference today.
I'll feel pretty cheated if the only features WP7.8 gets is the new start screen...
pgsxdjp said:
A little cheated. Glad MS tried with 7.8 but I'm just worried about how that will fare down the line with 22 months left on my contract. Don't think I'll be waiting to find out.
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Click to collapse
Im going to sell.
The technoweenie in me wants to buy a WP8 when it comes out, but the realistic human in me feels cheated...
I just bought the Lumia 900, and to hear that a new version of the OS is coming out soon and that the product I just bought will be un-supported and development ceased (for the most part) pisses me off...
I'm pissed off enough that I'm still waiting for a purple screen fix, and now this?
If I were a Lumia owner I'd definitely feel cheated.
Looks like the Lumia 900 is going to be the Galaxy S+ of the Windows world.
Thrown to the market and 2 months afterwards you got outdated software because the manufacturer never planned to provide updates.
Not receiving updates seems to get normal in the mobile industry in some way.
This would be the point to switch to Android for me, but I'm not a big WP7 fan I have to admit.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA
land.apfel said:
If I were a Lumia owner I'd definitely feel cheated.
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Why? We don't even know the Windows Phone 7.8 features?
land.apfel said:
Thrown to the market and 2 months afterwards you got outdated software because the manufacturer never planned to provide updates.
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Click to collapse
We've received two manufacturer updates already. And there have been at least two announced future updates... Tango and Windows Phone 7.8.
dtboos said:
Considering all the features coming for WP8 and 7.8 haven't been announced yet, I don't feel cheated at all.
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This is an interesting concept. So you think we should actually wait and see what updated features we will be getting before criticizing them? Great idea!
gbjohnson said:
Of the lumia 900 owners, how many of you feel cheated and angry over how Microsoft is handling WP8.
1. Yes
2. No
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Once all Windows Phone 8 and 7.8 are out why don't you ask this question and add a poll to your thread? Make it a good poll with at least one option that says I'm satisfied.
There is still a chance that Nokia will provide WP8 on the Lumia 800/900 isn't there? I wouldn't jump to any conclusions just yet.
Before anyone starts ranting about the announcement, Nokia is not Microsoft. Stop, think. Avoid replying anyway.
at45 said:
There is still a chance that Nokia will provide WP8 on the Lumia 800/900 isn't there? I wouldn't jump to any conclusions just yet.
Before anyone starts ranting about the announcement, Nokia is not Microsoft. Stop, think. Avoid replying anyway.
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I don't know about the Hardware requirements. I haven't watched the keynote, but I don't think they've given a NFC requirement for all phones. Interesting thought. I guess it could happen. I don't think it will, although it would be nice, of course. Then again, maybe WP7.8 will be better than thought. Who knows?
I don't understand what it is people think they will be missing. WP8 brings support for dual core, high def screens, and NFC hardware. Does your phone have any of that? No. So you wouldn't be able to enjoy those features anyway even if WP8 did run on your phone.
Ok so we may not get the true multi tasking and Skype running in the background - we don't actually know yet - but did you buy your phone only on the basis that you would definitely get that one day? Is your phone suddenly going to stop working the day WP8 comes out? Are app developers all suddenly going to abandon the installed base of users for a new OS that doesn't have one yet?
When I got my Lumia two weeks ago, I knew that there was Skype coming with "serious" integration and VoIP API for others. I also knew that Microsoft bought Skype so I was expecting it.
At least that the Lumia 800 was for free.
OndraSter said:
When I got my Lumia two weeks ago, I knew that there was Skype coming with "serious" integration and VoIP API for others. I also knew that Microsoft bought Skype so I was expecting it.
At least that the Lumia 800 was for free.
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Its always been said that skype couldnt work on WP7 due to the way the OS operates and while its not great im still happy they released some sort of app rather then not bother at all
sensboston said:
I believe it's a very good point for the class action against MS and AT&T. Just keep googling for that and be ready to join
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Click to collapse
You can't be serious?!
Zero. Give thanks that you get 7.8. Try to image Android users still stuck on Froyo or Gingerbread. Or 3GS or iPhone 4 users moving to iOS6.
Get over it and move to the future. 8 looks to be a fantastic competitor to iOS and Android.
bmstrong said:
Zero. Give thanks that you get 7.8. Try to image Android users still stuck on Froyo or Gingerbread. Or 3GS or iPhone 4 users moving to iOS6.
Get over it and move to the future. 8 looks to be a fantastic competitor to iOS and Android.
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Click to collapse
This is different. The Lumia is a flagship that just came out. I'm amazed at how some of you are okay with this.
"Get over it and move to the future."?
Wtf man, what about all the people who got this on contract? You expect them to just "move to the future" and buy a new device off contract this early on?
Sent from my HTC PH39100 using xda premium
LOL... I think Nokia gonna do something to help out the customer who did bought the Lumia product recently... I got what you mean...
Da, it sucks to register for a device for 2 years and then stuck with it (that is why i never sign the damn contract). But i believe Windows Phone 7.8 is actually Windows Phone 8 BUT without all the functions that require the physical hardware to handle.
Time will tell. Personally, i don't feel any lost, i changed phone almost every holiday season of the year. 2010 = First Windows Phone (HD7), 2011 = Mango Windows Phone (Eternity) , 2012 = Windows Phone 8. I am curious about what HTC has to offer for us.
redwhiteandblue said:
I don't understand what it is people think they will be missing. WP8 brings support for dual core, high def screens, and NFC hardware. Does your phone have any of that? No. So you wouldn't be able to enjoy those features anyway even if WP8 did run on your phone.
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I think you may have just described Microsoft's reason for not updating existing phones i.e. not because they are too old or too slow but because they won't benefit enough from the new features to justify the investment.
"Microsoft’s Greg Sullivan revealed the reasons behind the company’s choice not to offer a direct upgrade from Windows Phone 7.x to Windows Phone 8.
Describing some of the latest hardware changes in Windows Phone 8, that we outline here, Sullivan explained that "the nature of the investment [in Windows Phone 8] is primarily in areas that are not exploitable by existing hardware." Windows Phone 8 introduces support for multi-core processors, amongst other things, so the "Lumia 900 getting support for using dual-core or NFC doesn't mean a lot," says Sullivan, "because it doesn't have the hardware to take advantage of that." Microsoft decided to focus its efforts on Windows Phone 8 to make it as good as it possibly could. "To do the work to bring all of those elements to a platform that can't exploit them wasn't necessarily the most efficient use of resource," explains Sullivan."
Source
I really regret the day I switched to WP. What's up with all these platform instability since WM 6.5? Why do they keep on changing stuff that worries poor consumers. A lot of people really need to be sacked from MS for making stupid decisions.
I really don't care about the stupid looks they announced.....all I care about is being supported.
Microsoft has confirmed that WP8 apps WILL NOT RUN in WP7.x. How many developers do you really think are going to design for WP7 now? To tell y'all the truth, there will be no support for WP7.x when WP8 comes out. I need support for apps not stupid looks.
Currently we (WP7.x) users are still fighting and praying for apps to come out, now with the announcement of this, I guess all ideas will be dropped and shifted to WP8...WTF! Is this some sort of Marketing strategy or what? Why didn't they decide all this kernel change before releasing WP7? We would have all be able to upgrade peacefully. With this I really think they'll change the kernel again when WP9 comes out and the cycle continues again.....why Microsoft? Are you guys some college and high school dudes with no PhD holders amongst you? Thus accounting for the stupid decisions you make to hurt our feelings and steal our money. I don't buy phones cheap because phones here are not carrier based and on contract....they are all unbranded and expensive. When will I ever get a WP8 device? My current phone is less than 14months old and you really wanna make me buy an expensive phone again or still use my device like a Symbian phone? This is just stupid.
I now understand and know that using a WP7.x was really a beta test.
I'm really pissed and just gonna throw my Stupid WP away and even switch. What's up with all these stupid changes and instability with the platform
I was unaware a PhD was required to be capable of of making intelligent decisions. They had to make these changes to remain competitive, and the current hardware is incapable of supporting the majority of them. Chill out. If you weren't on a 3 year contract, this wouldn't be a problem now would it? It's just as much your fault as Microsoft's..
Sent from my SGH-i937 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
WP7.x apps WILL work on WP8 so why should developers stop developing at all for WP7.x when WP8 is still 6 months away?
What I see is, developers will try to make use of the multicore capabilities of WP8. With this, you can not develop an app for both WP8 and 7.x and they'll will probably be developing those new apps on a WP8 device later this year. You just can't develop a multicore app on WP7.x. The android boys now have something to laugh at....FRAGMENTATION....welcomed at last.
What happens after WP7.8 upgrade? NOTHING? DEAD END I guess. Your fresh Lumia 900 is obsolete now.
Get over it. Its progress that has to happen.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2
Kenzibit said:
What I see is, developers will try to make use of the multicore capabilities of WP8. With this, you can not develop an app for both WP8 and 7.x and they'll will probably be developing those new apps on a WP8 device later this year. You just can't develop a multicore app on WP7.x. The android boys now have something to laugh at....FRAGMENTATION....welcomed at last ;(
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Also
Kenzibit it seems you are using HTC HD7 released in 2010, October which will make it exactly 2 years to date till WP8 so I am not sure what you are complaining about....
Kenzibit said:
Microsoft has confirmed that WP8 apps WILL NOT RUN in WP7.x.
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That's not true. Only apps that use native code will not run on WP7.8!
64GUNSHIP said:
It's just as much your fault as Microsoft's
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Absolutely agree!!!
To everyone who is complaining, you guys bought your devices without any guarantee by AT&T, T-Mobile, Samsung, HTC, Nokia or Microsoft that these phones would be upgradable to WP8. You people knew that WP8 was being released this fall and a whole slew of new devices would be offered with better resolutions, nfc, NT kernel and native support yet you still went out and bought these devices. You have NO reason to be upset about this because it was entirely your decision to buy these devices before first knowing what would happen...
So stop whining, enjoy what you currently have and wait till you're eligible for an upgrade... if you want to switch, you can do that, too!
v_garg said:
Also
Kenzibit it seems you are using HTC HD7 released in 2010, October which will make it exactly 2 years to date till WP8 so I am not sure what you are complaining about....
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The thing is my phone is not a contract phone so this 2 year thing ain't affecting me. I'm not a carrier based phone holder...bought my phone $500 back then and now they want me to buy a $1000 WP8 device? I'm broke already.
crav4speed said:
That's not true. Only apps that use native code will not run on WP7.8!
Give me the source
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Even if - all future ports between iOS, Android and now WP8 will be in native code. See the problem there?
I told y'all the cycle will repeat itself oneday...
Look what just came out:
"While current Windows Phones – even those that just launched this year – will be cut off with Windows Phone 7.8, future Windows Phone 8 devices will get at least 18 months of software updates. However, Apple has historically provided iOS updates for its various devices over a much longer timeframe – the iPhone 3GS, introduced back in 2009, will receive iOS 6 later this year, plus minor updates after that, which makes for over 40 months of updates. If the Windows Phone team sticks to its yearly release schedule, 18 months would mean only one major update plus six months of additional minor updates.
Right after 18 months, So called WP8 will be ****ed just like WP7.x now.
Read the cooments too.
http://wmpoweruser.com/windows-phon...s-of-over-the-air-updates-but-is-that-enough/
Kenzibit said:
The thing is my phone is not a contract phone so this 2 year thing ain't affecting me. I'm not a carrier based phone holder...bought my phone $500 back then and now they want me to buy a $1000 WP8 device? I'm broke already.
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It's been TWO YEARS!!! How much Starbucks are you drinking chief? If you put $20 a month in a jar you can afford a new phone. If you sell your current phone you will need even less money to get a new Windows 8 Phone. You cannot buy a phone and expect for it to get the new kernel update two years later. MSFT got screwed on Windows Mobile because it clung to it for too long. They could have done a reboot long before the iphone hit and they would have been in a perfect position... but they didn't. It is far better for them to do this reboot now along with their Surface and new desktop OS than keep clinging to Windows Phone 7.5.
Anyway you've been b-tching about Windows Phone for months. It just may be time for you to move on.
Kenzibit said:
crav4speed said:
That's not true. Only apps that use native code will not run on WP7.8!
Give me the source
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http://wmpoweruser.com/windows-phone-8-slide-gallery/
Look at slides 28 and 29. There will still be app development in XAML/C#
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/microsoft...hone-8-finally-gets-a-real-windows-core/12975
“New applications compiled specifically for Windows Phone 8 will not be made available for Windows Phone 7.x devices.”
The key words being "compiled specifically for Windows Phone 8".
The developers have choices in how to develop their apps. Only apps written in native code will not run on WP7.8. I think the majority of applications to be written in native code will mostly be games and VOIP apps. Do you really think Microsoft will completely abandon WP7.8??? Ok, it's possible but most likely in another 18-24 months when your HD7 is 5 years old!
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^ I bet you no one will be developing for WP7, it just doesnt make sense. WP8 will just be easier.
Its all cupcakes and strawberries when Apple does it, but Microsoft does it and its a problem?
The writing was on the wall on launch day, no one would believe me though. There was absolutely no multi core support from the beginning. This had to happen.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2
Grow up complainers. WP7 is still the best OS out there. 7.8 is just an added bonus. Do we really need NFC and dual cores? It runs well on single core. WVGA although not fantastic is perfectly fine for mobile screens. Not far a tablet but for mobile screens is fine. Microsoft can't be expected to magicialy upgrade your hardware specs over the air and will only provide only the features that current hardware can support. WP7 will not die when WP8 comes out. It will just be the 2nd best OS out there (WP8 being the 1st) ;-)
vetvito said:
^ I bet you no one will be developing for WP7, it just doesnt make sense. WP8 will just be easier.
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I honestly would not be surprised if Microsoft forced developers to use C# when developing apps and native code when developing games. They can't afford to piss off early WP7 adopters!
The SDK will ask you what type of app you are developing and if you choose "app", you need to use C# and if you choose "game", native code will be allowed. There are a number of ways to enforce this as well, an example being Marketplace Certification.
crav4speed said:
Kenzibit said:
http://wmpoweruser.com/windows-phone-8-slide-gallery/
Look at slides 28 and 29. There will still be app development in XAML/C#
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/microsoft...hone-8-finally-gets-a-real-windows-core/12975
“New applications compiled specifically for Windows Phone 8 will not be made available for Windows Phone 7.x devices.”
The key words being "compiled specifically for Windows Phone 8".
The developers have choices in how to develop their apps. Only apps written in native code will not run on WP7.8. I think the majority of applications to be written in native code will mostly be games and VOIP apps. Do you really think Microsoft will completely abandon WP7.8??? Ok, it's possible but most likely in another 18-24 months when your HD7 is 5 years old!
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Good, you have an intelligent point though.....but I'm still sad, drinking my 5th bear now...gotta go sleep.
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Kenzibit said:
The thing is my phone is not a contract phone so this 2 year thing ain't affecting me. I'm not a carrier based phone holder...bought my phone $500 back then and now they want me to buy a $1000 WP8 device? I'm broke already.
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I just picked up another HTC Trophy for $109 on ebay so I wouldn't have to renew the contract for the other line on my account. But not being able to afford a new phone if you're broke is more of a personal finance issue.
crav4speed said:
. They can't afford to piss off early WP7 adopters!
.
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Hmm, yes they can, and they did. Its not the first time they have done this.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2
This thread is full of misinformation.
1. Windows phone 8 apps will NOT run on WP7.x
2. WP7.x apps will be automatically recompiled to run on WP8. They did this to claim they still have a 100,000 apps in their app store for WP8.
3. C++/XAML will be supported on WP8, to not break WP7.x apps on WP8.
4. WP8 apps will not, cannot be recompiled to WP7.x
5. WP7.x uses the CE Kernel!. It's a completely different kernel for WP8.
WP7.x is a deadend platform with deadend os. The only good thing is developers won't have to redo their existing apps, however all developers will start learning the new Windows RT API.
I don't see anyone bothering with xaml anymore, hence wp7.x apps will dry up fast. Everyone will be switching.
Isnt it simple to call Verizon or whatever to cancel the contract and get a refund? Just asking, It just seems that after the announcement, Every single WP user went ALL RAGE!!!! But, hasnt anyone thought of contacting the carrier instead?
OptimusLove said:
Isnt it simple to call Verizon or whatever to cancel the contract and get a refund? Just asking, It just seems that after the announcement, Every single WP user went ALL RAGE!!!! But, hasnt anyone thought of contacting the carrier instead?
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Doesn't breach any contract by the carriers, hardware manufacturers or software vendors. Don't see why would Verizon, HTC/Nokia or MSFT is liable for any refund.
OptimusLove said:
Isnt it simple to call Verizon or whatever to cancel the contract and get a refund? Just asking, It just seems that after the announcement, Every single WP user went ALL RAGE!!!! But, hasnt anyone thought of contacting the carrier instead?
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How exactly are the carriers responsible that they should nullify the contract? It's been no secret that there was an extreme likelihood that current WP7 phones would not get the Apollo upgrade. There was nothing official. Prudence would dictate that you wait for an official statement or wait until something is actually released before committing to a 2 year contract. Some people just didn't want to wait and now feel "entitled" to something they never deserved. Gonna be dumb, ya gotta be tough.
fatclue said:
How exactly are the carriers responsible that they should nullify the contract? It's been no secret that there was an extreme likelihood that current WP7 phones would not get the Apollo upgrade. There was nothing official. Prudence would dictate that you wait for an official statement or wait until something is actually released before committing to a 2 year contract. Some people just didn't want to wait and now feel "entitled" to something they never deserved. Gonna be dumb, ya gotta be tough.
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Its the user that will request to nullify so that, they(the user) can sell the phone, save the money to buy a new one.
OptimusLove said:
Its the user that will request to nullify so that, they(the user) can sell the phone, save the money to buy a new one.
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I know it's the user who wants to cancel. What I meant was why would the carrier agree to nullify? Buyer's remorse? Sorry, make an informed purchase like the rest of us or pay the unsubsidized price if you want to swap devices on a whim.
Let us start a petition to end all the petitions.
nicksti said:
Let us start a petition to end all the petitions.
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Count me in!
nicksti said:
Let us start a petition to end all the petitions.
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Agreed, I bet those petitioners dont know their carriers phone numbers.
nicksti said:
Let us start a petition to end all the petitions.
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Agreed. Not to sound mean or insensitive, but man am I sick and tired of all the whiny, prissy, entitled little asshats stamping around like a deranged toddler who's parent says no to the damned coco puffs.
I bought my Samsung Focus almost 2 years ago, and in that time MS has given me numerous updates for free, ALL of which have not just added features but actually IMPROVED the performance of the device and reduced the memory footprint. We already know Tango will do the same, and it's a safe bet that the new Start screen won't dramatically impact memory usage.
Contrast that with my Apple experience, where for 2 years every new version of iOS became more bloated and made my phone run slower and slower, each and EVERY time claiming the new OS version number as newer devices, yet NEVER giving me all the features of those devices, and ultimately ruining--yes, RUINING--my device to the point where it was unusable due to the slowness of its bloated, hackneyed OS.
When Microsoft finishes the run of WP7 devices, each and EVERY phone that runs the OS will continue to be usable, will continue to run better than it ever has in its lifespan, and will continue to be supported by a marketplace that currently has more than 100,000 apps.
Let me be plain: there is NOTHING HERE TO WHINE ABOUT. Grow up, accept that you're never going to own a piece of technology that will be "future proof," and move forward with your life.
There is NO SUCH THING as future proof. It's a marketing lie, and if you're dumb enough to believe it that's nobody's fault but your own.
equal refidera
In the U.S., if you get a subsidized phone you could always leave before the contract expires. However, you are obligated to pay an early termination fee. Exact amount depends on how long you stayed so far. People who bought the 2nd generation Windows Phones probably started their 2 year term not too long ago and would pay a relatively high fee.
As far as the number of petitions goes, I think it shows that users are not happy seeing their relatively new device already obsolete because it cannot run any WP8 apps. It is not just the most-demanding apps or ones that demand better hardware. It is all of them.
Even if this sort of thing happens with Android or Apple, it is still a problem here because there are so many petitions/complaints. Add to this that there was a platform reset just 2 years ago with Windows Mobile and the fact that there are not too many Windows Phone users to begin with, I think this is an issue in which Microsoft has to be proactive and find a workable solution. Google and Apple can afford to piss off a few customers as their base is huge. Unfortunately, Microsoft does not have that luxury. Likewise, it does Microsoft no good if their users are complaining at the same time MS is trying to get these same people onto WP8.
Microsoft, Nokia, and whomever else should just implement some type of trade-in program where current WP7 users can get a WP8 device with a fair discount. Then if people want a WP8 device right away, they do not have to wait over a year until your contract ends. I am sure Microsoft wants tons of WP8 users immediately to attract app developers. With a trade-in, this would certainly happen. If Microsoft does nothing, people could very well stay angry and go to Android or Apple when their contract is up. Even if everybody suddenly accepts the current WP7 situation and became happy with MS, it would still take a long time (if ever) for WP8 to get reach a decent sized userbase. That is why I believe Microsoft should do something to get almost everybody using WP7 onto WP8 come this fall.
jasongw said:
Agreed. Not to sound mean or insensitive, but man am I sick and tired of all the whiny, prissy, entitled little asshats stamping around like a deranged toddler who's parent says no to the damned coco puffs.
I bought my Samsung Focus almost 2 years ago, and in that time MS has given me numerous updates for free, ALL of which have not just added features but actually IMPROVED the performance of the device and reduced the memory footprint. We already know Tango will do the same, and it's a safe bet that the new Start screen won't dramatically impact memory usage.
Contrast that with my Apple experience, where for 2 years every new version of iOS became more bloated and made my phone run slower and slower, each and EVERY time claiming the new OS version number as newer devices, yet NEVER giving me all the features of those devices, and ultimately ruining--yes, RUINING--my device to the point where it was unusable due to the slowness of its bloated, hackneyed OS.
When Microsoft finishes the run of WP7 devices, each and EVERY phone that runs the OS will continue to be usable, will continue to run better than it ever has in its lifespan, and will continue to be supported by a marketplace that currently has more than 100,000 apps.
Let me be plain: there is NOTHING HERE TO WHINE ABOUT. Grow up, accept that you're never going to own a piece of technology that will be "future proof," and move forward with your life.
There is NO SUCH THING as future proof. It's a marketing lie, and if you're dumb enough to believe it that's nobody's fault but your own.
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This post deserves a medal.
Sent from my SGH-I777 using xda premium
MikeyMike01 said:
This post deserves a medal.
Sent from my SGH-I777 using xda premium
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Lool.
Here's a email I sent to Microsoft's [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
Hi Everyone,
I'm sending this email for two reasons. First I have been a Windows Phone user since 2004 when HP released the first pocket pc phone, HP 6315. I then purchased the HP 6515 and HP 6915. I then purchased the HTC Touch P4000 windows 5.0 and then HTC Touch diamond 6.1, HTC Touch Pro 2 windows 6.5.
And when Microsoft released Windows Phone 7, I purshased HTC Surround and then just last week I purchased for my wife the new Nokia 900 and the HTC Titan2 for my self, plus my two kids have a HTC Surround and HTC HD7S.
The reason that I mentioned all these phone is to show my dedication to the windows phone platform, and just two let you know I have been a long time Windows user as well. My first Windows desktop was Windows 1.0.
I heard this week that our second generation phones won't get the Windows Phone 8 upgrade, Considering we just bought that latest phones and they will be outdated in a couple of months, I feel for the first time ripped off considering Apples Iphone 3 will upgrade to os6.
I would thing that you would want to keep your loyal customers, and for the first time I'm debating if we don't get the update to Windows Phone 8 to change phone platforms, and this really hurts considering how much I believe in Microsoft's products. THanks again I look forward to your response.
Yours Truly,
Mark Connors
MC Engineers
Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer
NSCSA Safety Certified 2012
[email protected]
Here is Peter Chou for HTC reply:
Dear Mark,
Thanks for supporting HTC products for so long and so many years. Win8 is a big step so we are not able to upgrade to win 7 devices. However we will have a win7 upgrade version which will have most of the win8 experience.
Regards.
Peter
Here's Steven Rlop for Nokia reply:
Dear Mark,
There are advances in hardware in future devices that will enable new experiences that will not be available on the existing devices. And yet, you will see some of the WP8 features on WP 7 devices, and, on the Nokia devices, there is a wide array of additional capability being provided. Just as with an older Apple product that cannot do many of the new things, we will continue to enhance what can be done.
Regards,
Stephen
Here's my reply back to everyone.
Hi Everyone,
Thanks for your quick reply. I'm a PLC programmer and software developer myself so I know how it works with hardware and software. That being said when Microsoft released Windows 7 they created Windows starter for pc's with minimum hardware specs,
So why doesn't Microsoft create Windows Phone 8 for the new devices and Windows Phone 8 light for the older devices. I realize that Windows Phone 7.8 is that lighter version but in the public's eyes they look at it as not getting the next version of Windows Phone 8. And last I think if Microsoft rolls out the lighter version and calls it Windows Phone 8 for first and second generation phones plus explain it has most of the functionalities as the new phones, the majority of Windows Phone users would understand. Thanks again for your response.
Mark Connors
MC Engineers
Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer
NSCSA Safety Certified 2012
[email protected]
Peter Chou response was.
Mark, this is a good idea. We can look into that direction. Thanks again.
The interesting thing was the fact that Microsoft has never responded to any of my emails, so again it's like Microsoft really doesn't care about their customers.
I believe that Microsoft could have created two versions of Windows Phone 8, with support for new and old devices and if the first and second devices didn't support the particular software it wouldn't be activited in the first or second phones.
Mark Connors
MC Engineers
Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer
NSCSA Safety Certified 2012
[email protected]
I've got an idea. Let's allow the free enterprise system to do its thing. Those of you who feel "cheated" by Microsoft can go ahead and switch to another platform of your choosing. Those who switch to Android, be careful of what you wish for..... Those who switch to iOS, same goes for you too. When the dust settles and Google releases Jelly Bean, let's see how many existing handsets get the update. When OS6 comes out, let's see how slow and buggy your precious iPhone becomes. Be proactive, do what you need to do. But for God's sake do it and STFU already!
I'm sorry for my reply; I only wanted to express my concerns for the way Microsoft is dealing with the first and second generation devices. I wasn't trying to start a battle. Again I'm sorry, and your right it's hard to type and reply on a small screen without making mistakes..
mcsc said:
Apparently you missed the hole reason for the letter and if you could read between the lines and how long I have been with microsoft you would realize that I would never change platforms. That being said a a Engineer, microsoft could have released this differently. My letter was a point out that Bill, and Steve didn't even have the decently to reply.
And last if you can't reply with dignity using a acronym STFU, then you should post.
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(1) I wasn't referring to you.
(2) You should be embarrassed to sport your credentials so ostentatiously when you can't go a full sentence with either a spelling or grammatical error. Literally, not one correct sentence in your post.
(3) You and I have different methods to show angst. You write letters, I use acronyms. My dignity is intact.
BTW, I have credentials too. I have responsibilities within the healthcare field that you can't possibly fathom. My state & federal licensing credentials are quite impressive as well. I just like to let my hair down on these boards.
Gotta agree with fatclue...
The grammar in that post would be an embarrassment if the audience was 4th graders, and it was directed to 4 senior executives. Maybe the author should pursue a credential in business writing.
Also, why would anyone expect a reply from Bill Gates? Isn't he off feeding kids with malaria or something? I would hope that the rest have better things to do.
Respectfully,
Rev. Dr. Thaddeus James O'Pootertoot III, MD, JD, CPA, Ph.D, MBCP, MCA, MCAD, MCAS, MCDBA, MCDST, MCITP, MCLC, MCM, MCNE, MCP, MCP+I, MCP+SB, MCP+SB, MCPD, MCSA, MCSD, MCSD, MCSE, MCSE+I, MCT, MCTS, MCTs, MOS, MOUS, and all-around nice guy
:good::good::good::good::good:
@mcsc: I see your mistake: you think that because the iPhone 3GS will receive "iOS6" that means it'll be receiving the same OS as the later iPhones. I get the mistake--I made it myself, once.
But the fact is this: iPhone 3GS will NOT be receiving the same OS as later models. It'll show the same VERSION number--merely a string of text--but in no sense can it be called "the same OS." Instead, it contains a subset of what the newer version of the OS (which, let's face it, is itself a minor iteration of a stale OS) will have on newer devices, and if you want to get the full set of features, you WILL have to buy the iPhone 5, make no mistake. Even 4S will lack some of the features that iOS 6 will deliver to iPhone 5.
Essentially, Microsoft and Apple do the same thing, but with a clear distinction: Apple tells a lie-"look! We're giving you the latest OS!", and Microsoft tells the truth--"Sorry, your device won't support the new OS, but we'll make sure you get a few of its features."
The question is: do you prefer a pretty lie or a less pretty truth?
Your so right, I didn't look at it this way. I am quite happy with my phone and getting the windows phone 7.8 update, I just thought that microsoft should have released it as windows phone 8 for everyone, minas the enhancements that the first and second generation devices didn't support.
Forget about the 3GS, how old is it, really?
iPhone 4 and iPhone 4S, one year apart. The only thing the 4 didn't receive when the 4S came out was Siri, one exclusive feature for new model. If you want to look at the 3GS, it lacked facetime, one feature announced with the iPhone 4.
Here MS and Nokia have, what? Soon to be 6 months old L900 before a major update. What'll it receive? only one new visual feature while the functional rest is left out vs. "hey we are saving one new feature for our new model." Don't quote me where I got WP 7.8 only has the startscreen, if you want to believe WP and Nokia it's on you, not me, I'm done believing. What's more? the 3GS, while being 3 years old (released June 2009), is not considered a beta device and it served well, it still retains some value. Lumia 900? From $99 to free in 2 months (I don't count the $100 credits post launch), much like a feature phone. Plus, the thing is hyped this and that despite the OS isn't fully matured at this point of the competition, while iOS and Android can out-function WP any way. If not for loyalty and hope, who have been buying WP up until 6/20? After this treatment, I know many will be very skeptical about buying WP8. I myself will wait until WP8 truly establishes itself as a complete OS before buying. Can you confidently recommend WP? I know I no longer can't.
And before someone tells me to go buy an iOS or Android, think again. Is there anyone to tell people to "go buy a WP"? MS and Nokia, i am sure, don't want their consumer base to tell others to buy products from their primary competitors. iOS and Android don't care, because no one says go buy a WP. People would just be like, "what's that?," anyway. If WP users think the other consumers are missing out goodies in WP, then MS and Nokia are missing out their market share.
jasongw said:
@mcsc: I see your mistake: you think that because the iPhone 3GS will receive "iOS6" that means it'll be receiving the same OS as the later iPhones. I get the mistake--I made it myself, once.
But the fact is this: iPhone 3GS will NOT be receiving the same OS as later models. It'll show the same VERSION number--merely a string of text--but in no sense can it be called "the same OS." Instead, it contains a subset of what the newer version of the OS (which, let's face it, is itself a minor iteration of a stale OS) will have on newer devices, and if you want to get the full set of features, you WILL have to buy the iPhone 5, make no mistake. Even 4S will lack some of the features that iOS 6 will deliver to iPhone 5.
Essentially, Microsoft and Apple do the same thing, but with a clear distinction: Apple tells a lie-"look! We're giving you the latest OS!", and Microsoft tells the truth--"Sorry, your device won't support the new OS, but we'll make sure you get a few of its features."
The question is: do you prefer a pretty lie or a less pretty truth?
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