Develop Bugs

Why can't a bricked phone be revived?

This is a question for those in the know when it comes to programming.Why isn't there a way to revive a bricked phone? Can't there be some method for a host computer to manually write the radio to the device? How does HTC fix a bricked phone for it to be a refurb?
I'm just very curious about this because I see a few people attempt to update the radio only to lose power and brick their EVO. I have no programming experience so don't know what goes on at the internal component level. Thanks in advance for your input.

It goes back to the old bootstrapping problem when computers were being developed. A computer (in this case, your cell phone) is pretty dumb at the hardware level. All it can do is run programs. That's ALL it can do. It can't even load a program, only run them. Thus the problem. It gets solved by injecting a "bootstrap" program at startup (from the phrase "pull yourself up by your bootstraps") which is a program that runs and gives access to all the I/O, and the computer can then load more programs.
When you update this bootstrapping program, it gets dicey, because if it isn't written right, or if there's a glitch during the update, this most basic of all functions gets corrupted. If the program that tells the phone how to load programs goes away, all the phone can do is... sit there. Like a brick.
Hope this helped!

That helped me, thanks.

Soylent Grin said:
It goes back to the old bootstrapping problem when computers were being developed. A computer (in this case, your cell phone) is pretty dumb at the hardware level. All it can do is run programs. That's ALL it can do. It can't even load a program, only run them. Thus the problem. It gets solved by injecting a "bootstrap" program at startup (from the phrase "pull yourself up by your bootstraps") which is a program that runs and gives access to all the I/O, and the computer can then load more programs.
When you update this bootstrapping program, it gets dicey, because if it isn't written right, or if there's a glitch during the update, this most basic of all functions gets corrupted. If the program that tells the phone how to load programs goes away, all the phone can do is... sit there. Like a brick.
Hope this helped!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the info. That is interesting. So how does HTC initially put the bootstrap in and/or how do they handle a bricked phone?

Soylent Grin said:
It goes back to the old bootstrapping problem when computers were being developed. A computer (in this case, your cell phone) is pretty dumb at the hardware level. All it can do is run programs. That's ALL it can do. It can't even load a program, only run them. Thus the problem. It gets solved by injecting a "bootstrap" program at startup (from the phrase "pull yourself up by your bootstraps") which is a program that runs and gives access to all the I/O, and the computer can then load more programs.
When you update this bootstrapping program, it gets dicey, because if it isn't written right, or if there's a glitch during the update, this most basic of all functions gets corrupted. If the program that tells the phone how to load programs goes away, all the phone can do is... sit there. Like a brick.
Hope this helped!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks good explanation appreciate that.

rafroehlich2 said:
Thanks for the info. That is interesting. So how does HTC initially put the bootstrap in and/or how do they handle a bricked phone?
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Click to collapse
There is probably a JTAG interface somewhere in there. In fact,that's how the original hack of the IPhone was done. (Better ways were since found) Most devices have a quasi standard interface for programming the flash and accessing and the hardware for diagnostics. For instance,linksys routers actually have a spot on the board to solder a header and you can make a cable that connects to the parralel port. Do a google search for "Hairy Dairy Maid Debrick" and you will find it. A similar thing is probobally possible with the Evo (Ive even seen them on Hard Drives and CD Rom drives) The problem is,its not entirely standardized,and it might not even be a connector or pads on the board. It might instead be a matter of knowing where you can connect the leads on the board to something that under the right circumstances BECOMES the JTAG connector. (For instance,a pin that controls something else might be a JTAG interface for the first few hundred milliseconds of start-up,or if a certain other pin of the chip is grounded when the power is applied. It might also be completely internal to the chip,and there be NO connectors on the board (it almost CERTAINLY has the capability,they need it during prototyping) and the chips might be programmed BEFORE they are soldered in. It might take replacing the rom chip to get it to go. There are lots of ifs
Chances are though,the factory has a special cable and a special software program that can reprogram the device. To replicate that might be relatively easy or could be next to impossible but requires a certain degree of knowledge about the hardware. What I suspect is,until someone who has the skills to make such a cable bricks their phone,they wont bother figuring out how to debrick one. In fact,when that person bricks their phone,they will probably take it back to sprint and say "I dont know what happens" In fact,even if its stuck looping in an obviously hacked boot loader he for some odd reason cant undo,hes probably going to send it back to sprint. I know someone who did exactly that to their brand new HP laptop. He found that 15kv from the flyback of an old B&W television applied to the memory slots took care of the looping and Best Buy gave him another one. As he put it "I dont know what happened,but it smells bad and wont boot up"

pflatlyne said:
There is probably a JTAG interface somewhere in there. In fact,that's how the original hack of the IPhone was done. (Better ways were since found) Most devices have a quasi standard interface for programming the flash and accessing and the hardware for diagnostics. For instance,linksys routers actually have a spot on the board to solder a header and you can make a cable that connects to the parralel port. Do a google search for "Hairy Dairy Maid Debrick" and you will find it. A similar thing is probobally possible with the Evo (Ive even seen them on Hard Drives and CD Rom drives) The problem is,its not entirely standardized,and it might not even be a connector or pads on the board. It might instead be a matter of knowing where you can connect the leads on the board to something that under the right circumstances BECOMES the JTAG connector. (For instance,a pin that controls something else might be a JTAG interface for the first few hundred milliseconds of start-up,or if a certain other pin of the chip is grounded when the power is applied. It might also be completely internal to the chip,and there be NO connectors on the board (it almost CERTAINLY has the capability,they need it during prototyping) and the chips might be programmed BEFORE they are soldered in. It might take replacing the rom chip to get it to go. There are lots of ifs
Chances are though,the factory has a special cable and a special software program that can reprogram the device. To replicate that might be relatively easy or could be next to impossible but requires a certain degree of knowledge about the hardware. What I suspect is,until someone who has the skills to make such a cable bricks their phone,they wont bother figuring out how to debrick one. In fact,when that person bricks their phone,they will probably take it back to sprint and say "I dont know what happens" In fact,even if its stuck looping in an obviously hacked boot loader he for some odd reason cant undo,hes probably going to send it back to sprint. I know someone who did exactly that to their brand new HP laptop. He found that 15kv from the flyback of an old B&W television applied to the memory slots took care of the looping and Best Buy gave him another one. As he put it "I dont know what happened,but it smells bad and wont boot up"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow. Thanks for the detailed answer. Too bad this isn't a standardized item. I hope eventually things progress enough where this isn't even a thought. Thanks again for the good response.
Sent from my PC36100

rafroehlich2 said:
Wow. Thanks for the detailed answer. Too bad this isn't a standardized item. I hope eventually things progress enough where this isn't even a thought. Thanks again for the good response.
Sent from my PC36100
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea,it would be nice if it were. Its kinda sorta quasi standard,so it HAS been done in some cases where its necessary,but often there are easier ways around it. Personally, I have allways thought that its a pretty stupid thing to make a piece of equipment that can fail due to a bad flash. The people who designed many of the flash memory chips seemed to agree,and they added something called a "boot block" to many,but the way its implemented,when its implemented doesn't fully protect you from a bad flash. Its even worse now that everything is in ball grid array chips soldered down to the board.

[Q] Broken Galaxy SII screen

Just as bad as it sounds
I went to close my laptop and my laptop fell off my stand and the corner landed on my phone's screen and it cracked the screen significantly. (If my phone worked I would have taken a picture)
I do not have insurance and I'm in my 4th month of having it, what should I do? I figured I could attempt to do a repair myself and ordered a new screen for 179.99. I've looked up tutorials but really only found stuff relating to the I900 and not my t989.
Does anyone know if this process will be difficult? Or is there any hoops I can jump through for Samsung or T-mobile to help me out?
Thanks

Honestly, just look trough google for a repair shop.
Most places will only charge an additional 30-40 bucks on top of the cost of the screen but this way you don't have to worry about breaking anything as they will take responsibility.
After this, get insurance if you still can. Most people see those "We repair any phone for 50$" and don't realize that does not apply to Samsung owners.

Yeah I thought about that but considering that amount of time it would be between me sending out the phone and then waiting to get it back I figure I could do the repair myself without spending the extra $30-$50 and it would be a learning experience
I would like to know however if there is anything that samsung or t-mobile would do to help out or if there were some t989 tutorial

fmartine said:
Yeah I thought about that but considering that amount of time it would be between me sending out the phone and then waiting to get it back I figure I could do the repair myself without spending the extra $30-$50 and it would be a learning experience
I would like to know however if there is anything that samsung or t-mobile would do to help out or if there were some t989 tutorial
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can send it to Samsung and they will fix it for a price, but your better off having it fixed locally at a shop as recommended above.
T-mobile can't do anything for you at this point.
I wouldn't recommend you do it yourself....This is an extremely risky and difficult procedure, in particular on this phone. Even if you have done this before on another device, this is one of the toughest, so be prepared to bring your A game.
You could end up breaking the phone all together....that would be one expensive learning experience. I would just take it to somewhere local and have them do it.
I heavily researched replacing the chrome bezel on this phone and looked at tear down documentation. Discovered this phone is very hard to replace things on yourself. I have done repairs on G1's G2's but this is a whole different ball game.

I found this tutorial and figured I'll try this out in the meantime
http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Samsung-Galaxy-S-4G-Teardown/4977/2
If anyone has any advice on It would be appreciated

Fixed my galaxy s ii
Just reporting in, I received my new screen and successfully performed the transplant. I have some pics but not all of them on the screen removal I will post them ASAP.
FYI it is a fairly simple process not nearly as complicated as I feared but you have to make sure you have a fine touch and don't force any of the connections in.
In the meantime I have these two tutorials to thank
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1253969
http://www.ifixit.com/Guide/Disassembling-Samsung-Galaxy-s-2-T-mobile-T989-Phone/8179/1

Is it possible to recover data from a truly bricked phone?

I used these searches before compiling this thread;
"how to recover data from a bricked SGN"
"data extraction from a SGN that will not boot"
"removing the HD from samsung galaxy nexus"
These searches did not yield results that replicate my situation. The only search that resulted in many entries were for people with "bricked phones" that (at least somewhat) responded to input. I associate the term "bricked" with a phone that does not respond to input, or show any indication of getting power.
My phone is a Samsung Galaxy Nexus on verizon wireless. It has been rooted and is running a custom ROM by...AOKP i think. I had some assistance each time I rooted and updated my ROM.
Here is my problem, what caused it,my troubleshooting steps, and what I'm trying to do. My phone was partially submerged in water for an unknown amount of time. The battery and SIM were removed and kept in a water proof container within an hour of submersion. The water damage indicator stickers (on both the battery and the phone have not been triggered). About 24hrs later, the phone was placed in a zip lock bag with 4 desiccant silica gel packs where it will remain for the next 24. Per vzw's tech support, I tried to power the phone on using the charger and the battery removed. No change. Verizon was not advised of the partial submersion, only the non triggered water damage stickers. This phone is under warranty and a replacement has been shipped. I confirmed that my contacts are backed up to google.
The reason for this post is, I have close to 30GB of pictures and videos that I stored on this device's "internal SD" that I want to recover. Looking through the searches I mentioned above, it sounds like this isn't so much a separate card, but more of a partition on the phone's HD. I have been told by vzw that neither their branch office tech support, nor their recovery/diagnostic team that analyzes returned phones has the capability to remove and return this data.
If someone here has hardware experience with cracking open a SGN and swapping the "internal SD card" I would greatly appreciate any information available for this task.

if it cant turn on, you cant retrieve data.

Zepius said:
if it cant turn on, you cant retrieve data.
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Click to collapse
Well..OK. I'm not ready to give up just yet. When my desktop PC's power supply failed, the PC was unusable, and didn't indicate power. I swapped that out and it now it works fine. This seems like it could be a similar situation. I at least want to exhaust every option I have before throwing in the towel.
Those 30GB contain hundreds of pictures of the first 2 years of my kid's life.
It seems to me that data recovery should still be possible if an replacement power source is utilized. Maybe more than just the power source has failed. Maybe every other hardware component in my wet phone has failed. But maybe, that "internal SD" is recoverable.
If anyone here knows what the "internal SD" looks like, and has successfully swapped one, I'll risk it. I know I can't trust vzw with such a task.
I realize this is a developers forum, and I'm asking for hardware failure advice. If anyone can refer me to a different forum that is more specialized to my specific task, I'll gladly take my trouble there.
Thanks for reading,
Jef

you're assuming 1 thing. the nand that houses the storage is in good health. When water is introduced, you have the unknown factors of what it does to circuitry.
im sure there is a ifixit teardown showing where the nand is. The problem is its soldered to the mainboard of the phone. You might be able to unsolder it, but thats a stretch.

Zepius said:
you're assuming 1 thing. the nand that houses the storage is in good health. When water is introduced, you have the unknown factors of what it does to circuitry.
im sure there is a ifixit teardown showing where the nand is. The problem is its soldered to the mainboard of the phone. You might be able to unsolder it, but thats a stretch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you very much Zepius. I googled "ifixit teardown samsung galaxy nexus" which lead me to a page (that I'm not able to paste here as a new user).
which is exactly what I was looking for. I wouldn't go so far as to say that I'm assuming the nand is in good health, just wishful thinking.

Anncoco - sorry, I don't remember what I did with this. It's been about 4 years, and this was 3 phones ago. I think I had some of the photos backed up somewhere else, enough that I never went to the trouble to disassemble the Nexus. From my notes - I remember the phone did not indicate it was getting power when plugged in.

[Q] Samsung Captivate Blank Display

Hello,
Captivate Glide i927 replaced cracked screen
I replaced the cracked screen assembly and installed a new ribbon. The lower lights (home, search, back button etc) work and also the keyboard lights. The ATT chime sound works too but the display does not light up when powered on.
Connected the phone after replacing ribbon/ screen to the comp for Kies to back up and it is saying the phone is locked. It is the lock code that you set to keep others from accessing. Since the display does not light, the correct code can not be placed in. Can someone please place a picture of the unlock screen mode here? The display touch pad works so if the position of the numbers can be acquired, this may help me to get the phone files accessed and reset hoping to get the display working.
The phone is not rooted and upgraded to the ICS as of October 2012.
Up $86 for the ribbon and new screen and the repair shops want $100 plus the cost of possible parts needed. Would like to try my best so this route can be avoided.
Cheers,
Robert

By now the phone SIM is locked out. I believe there is a way to reboot the phone through a computer?

mer80cedes said:
By now the phone SIM is locked out. I believe there is a way to reboot the phone through a computer?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The only way I can think of is rebooting via adb. If you're not rooted (the "reboot" command in shell requires root, i don't know if "adb reboot" wants it), or haven't even turned on USB Debugging at all, then you're doomed.
However, since Odin-ing is not that hard (only requires several key pressing), you could try Odin in a custom recovery (or not, if you already have one), back your system up to external SD in tar or other formats, and then extract the data you want from the backed-up packages (I've done this with tar packages). If you ever need the screenshot of a particular version of recovery, ask again in this thread and I think we'll be more active (and easier) to help.
Sent from Samsung Captivate Glide @ CM10.1.2

AndyYan said:
The only way I can think of is rebooting via adb. If you're not rooted (the "reboot" command in shell requires root, i don't know if "adb reboot" wants it), or haven't even turned on USB Debugging at all, then you're doomed.
However, since Odin-ing is not that hard (only requires several key pressing), you could try Odin in a custom recovery (or not, if you already have one), back your system up to external SD in tar or other formats, and then extract the data you want from the backed-up packages (I've done this with tar packages). If you ever need the screenshot of a particular version of recovery, ask again in this thread and I think we'll be more active (and easier) to help.
Sent from Samsung Captivate Glide @ CM10.1.2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you AndYan.
This Captivate has only been upgraded to the Sandwich version. Non-rooted nor modified in any other way. The only reason to remove the files is due to it having solar cell module prototype designs and concepts on it (Reason why it can not be shipped out for professional repairs). Since most of the information was wrote on paper, it's best to just wipe the phone out completely to get it back to working condition for use again.
This is quite interesting learning about programming and such since I have never done this before. Just like building cars, took many many years to do and this programming is just another cool thing to learn about

It takes a special knowledge and experience to understand the programming of Odin and phones which I do not comprehend, I will be destroying the motherboard with a hammer and tossing it out. It is way too much to understand how to set coding and such. Best off investing in another phone and moving on.
The parts that will be saved if anyone can use will be the ribbon strip and also brand new display screen.
Paid $86 for the display and will sell for $75 free shipping with insurance.
Ribbon strip will be $20 free shipping with insurance. If both are wanted $95 free shipping.
Since I do love the Captivate so much another will be purchased.

mer80cedes said:
It takes a special knowledge and experience to understand the programming of Odin and phones which I do not comprehend, I will be destroying the motherboard with a hammer and tossing it out. It is way too much to understand how to set coding and such. Best off investing in another phone and moving on.
The parts that will be saved if anyone can use will be the ribbon strip and also brand new display screen.
Paid $86 for the display and will sell for $75 free shipping with insurance.
Ribbon strip will be $20 free shipping with insurance. If both are wanted $95 free shipping.
Since I do love the Captivate so much another will be purchased.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You mean you smashed your Glide?! God, I just had mine 5 days ago. Anyway, hope my tip still helps when you're in any smaller trouble next time.

AndyYan said:
You mean you smashed your Glide?! God, I just had mine 5 days ago. Anyway, hope my tip still helps when you're in any smaller trouble next time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No way lol! Only the mother board will be smashed to save the data on it from being used again. All of the other parts will be saved since another Captivate will be getting purchased.

mer80cedes said:
No way lol! Only the mother board will be smashed to save the data on it from being used again. All of the other parts will be saved since another Captivate will be getting purchased.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's still sad to see. Why not just solder off the storage chip, somehow destroy it, and find a similar model chip to replace it?
EDIT: I guess the Samsung-proprietary partition table and some data on special partitions like EFS are not reconstructible on a blank new chip. Then you did the easiest choice possible.
Sent from Google Nexus 4 @ CM10.2

Is it cool for someone to take a photo of their Captivate i927 when it is at the display for the personal unlock code (PIN). It will make a good reference point enough to possibly use my touch screen to unlock my cell to reboot. Just have to get the location of the numbers and also the OK button.

After many hours research (great learning experience), the phone was done on master reset without needing to see the screen. At least now it can be sent out to get repaired without the personal information being potentially taken by another.
Done

mer80cedes said:
After many hours research (great learning experience), the phone was done on master reset without needing to see the screen. At least now it can be sent out to get repaired without the personal information being potentially taken by another.
Done
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Woohoo, so no need to smash anything? You did an awesome deed to keep a nice phone alive

[Q] Working device, dead screen

A friend recently sent me her "retired" Galaxy Note II. She replaced it because at some point the screen stopped turning on altogether, but she still wanted me to see if I can salvage it somehow. I've tried, with no luck, and searches on the topic don't seem to suggest any solutions other than the fact that it may be a hardware issue. While I can accept this possibility, I'm really hoping that it is not the case because at this point I don't think it would be worth investing the time and money to buy the parts, learn how to replace them, and attempt it. If anyone has any ideas I'd be very grateful. Here are the symptoms:
The display NEVER turns on. It is in a constant state of pitch black.
The sounds are working fine. When I get an email, for example, it notifies me.
The hardware button works
The software buttons do not work
Upon connecting the device to a monitor, keyboard and mouse, the monitor works, however the keyboard and mouse do not. (I use the same monitor, keyboard and mouse with my Galaxy S4 and they all work fine.)
Touch interaction with the screen is working properly. Using the monitor, I am able to use the device, but it is very tricky, as it is simply a matter of trial and error. I tap on a black screen and have to look on the monitor to see if I hit my target.
The device is on the stock TouchWiz that came with it, and is not rooted. Since I am pretty sure that doing any mods without a working display would be more difficult than I could tolerate, I opted to take an OTA instead, despite the fact that it may make rooting and flashing ROM's impossible in the future. I hope I didn't screw myself by doing that but I had to make an executive decision. Here is what I've tried so far:
Factory reset
Update to the latest software (Android 4.3)
Pulled battery, held power button for 10 seconds while battery was out, replaced battery and powered device on.
I'd greatly appreciate any suggestions. Ideally, here is what I'd like to happen: get the display to turn on and restore functionality to the software buttons. This may not be possible without replacing some hardware components, which as I mentioned is not an option, but if it is I'd really like to give it a shot. Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

My initial guess would be a digitizer failure...
A phone drop or water damage can easily render a phone dead...
You have the option of replacing the screen and digitizer at a cost of about $225.00 for the needed parts...but it's still no guarantee that the fix would be 100% successful...
My honest opinion is this...
Given the unknown history of the device...you are taking an expensive chance in attempting a repair...
And given the age of the device....the repair if performed by a qualified repair service would push the cost very near to the overall value of the device...
For the same dollars spent...you can obtain any number of working devices and save yourself the hassle...and the unknowns associated with a repair that will likely work...but again may not...
You are of course free to attempt the repair...but....
The skill level needed to perform a "proper" repair of the device is high...and you would need to study up on the process extensively before cracking open that case...
If I were in your situation...the choice would be to sell the device for parts....and put that cash back into a working device...
Others will chime in I'm sure with their recommendations....but I would choose to move on...g
Sent from my NOTE 2.750...
Courtesy of our amazing developers...

gregsarg said:
My initial guess would be a digitizer failure...
A phone drop or water damage can easily render a phone dead...
You have the option of replacing the screen and digitizer at a cost of about $225.00 for the needed parts...but it's still no guarantee that the fix would be 100% successful...
My honest opinion is this...
Given the unknown history of the device...you are taking an expensive chance in attempting a repair...
And given the age of the device....the repair if performed by a qualified repair service would push the cost very near to the overall value of the device...
For the same dollars spent...you can obtain any number of working devices and save yourself the hassle...and the unknowns associated with a repair that will likely work...but again may not...
You are of course free to attempt the repair...but....
The skill level needed to perform a "proper" repair of the device is high...and you would need to study up on the process extensively before cracking open that case...
If I were in your situation...the choice would be to sell the device for parts....and put that cash back into a working device...
Others will chime in I'm sure with their recommendations....but I would choose to move on...g
Sent from my NOTE 2.750...
Courtesy of our amazing developers...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the reply, and sorry I didn't see it sooner (I always forget to subscribe to threads). I figured this was probably not a fixable problem (at least not easily/economically fixable). But I wanted to see if there were any quick fixes I could try, and it sounds like there aren't. With that said, if anyone does want it for parts I'd let it go for a reasonable price (considering the damage and lack of functionality) through Swappa. (Sorry if I'm not supposed to make these kinds of offers here, if that is the case I'll gladly remove it.)