Related
So I have been a member on here for a while and have observed the changing trends in devices and users. But something has gotten much worse in last year and I think we need to address it in proper XDA fashion. I am not the type to complain without trying develop a solution and I am looking for some feedback from mods and users of all types, shapes and sizes here.
This forum has a real problem with people making useless posts in the wrong sections, about the wrong topics and while I think the mods do a great job they clearly can't keep up. I am no saint and will admit my own guilt on one or two occasions but some users just post meaningless post after meaningless post and really great threads are being destroyed as a result. This problem has clearly gotten out of hand and it isn't limited to just the devices I follow. A review of the forum shows this behavior in just about every device category. Just my observation...
My proposed solution to this problem I perceive is a "No thanks" button that will function in exactly the opposite way the "Thank you" button works with a few caveats I see as a huge value add.
1. If a certain post is given X amount of no thanks clicks it is automatically sent to a mod for review or perhaps even automatically deleted.
2. 1 Thanks click cancels out X no thanks clicks. This would keep trolls from using it in destructive ways if you are just someone that has a few enemies. Hopefully...
3. One thanks click cancels out X no thanks clicks.
4. After a user receives X amount of no thanks clicks they are redirected to the forums rules page for a period of 24 hours. No matter what link they click or how they access the site they will just be redirected to a page with the forum rules so they can study them.
I could go on listing things but I want to see what you guys think about something like this. It would allow all of us to some degree the ability to moderate our favorite threads and keep the BS posts to a minimum. User that continue to post things off topic or in the wrong threads will find themselves spending a lot of time studying the forum rules. Even if we don't add the enhanced features the no thanks button is long overdue. These people can wear their lack of respect for forum rules like a badge of shame the same way devs wear the thanks button like a badge of honor. It will give them more incentive to think about the things they post and will help ensure that good threads are not destroyed by the same question asked 100 times.
Moved to About xda-developers.com section
i agree it would bring alot of excitement to the forum , and the automatic mod contact would be a great idea for members who are a constant problem , also total negative points could show up in the profile and maybe have a forum top list for easy overview of troublemakers
also it has to be understood that it would bring a massive amount of work as ive never seen 2 types of thanks (or positive-negative)buttons in a vBulletin system
jnutz said:
This forum has a real problem with people making useless posts in the wrong sections
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Moved to About xda-developers.com section
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Sorry, that just made me chuckle..
This has two ways it could go.
one way:
A bury down system, if there is a post that is irrelevant or off topic and not needed in that thread users could bury it (IE: Hide for themselves) and enough votes hides it for all members of that thread.
other way:
Exactly like thanks button but instead has no thanks. Thing is this serves really no purpose as if Post A was useful and then Post B wasn't very helpful and one got "thanked", the other "no thanked" then it would balance out to zero. In the end this means nothing as XDA is about sharing, not who has the best thanks ratio.
I dont think this is the best route for XDA as we move on and mature as there are much more important issues to focus on at the moment
Bury down system seems like a good idea, since inevitably people may reply to the poster before he recives enough -1 to bury the post and if that post is then deleted it will just make the forum read flow badly
Let me suggest that not everyone should be entitled to the -1 button to bury a post, only lets say 60-70% of the members either deicded apon by join date/thanks recived andor post count.
Another problem I've seen in regards to the new 10 post rule is that people are just trolling on other forums typing random useless things in just to increase their post count to 10.
Persistant offenders that have had their posts buried should get some sort of mail to warn them if things dont improve their account will be looked at by a moderator.
arielc said:
Bury down system seems like a good idea, since inevitably people may reply to the poster before he recives enough -1 to bury the post and if that post is then deleted it will just make the forum read flow badly
Let me suggest that not everyone should be entitled to the -1 button to bury a post, only lets say 60-70% of the members either deicded apon by join date/thanks recived andor post count.
Another problem I've seen in regards to the new 10 post rule is that people are just trolling on other forums typing random useless things in just to increase their post count to 10.
Persistant offenders that have had their posts buried should get some sort of mail to warn them if things dont improve their account will be looked at by a moderator.
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Report the posts of anyone who is spamming other areas, as I'll simply ban them for spamming the board. The limit is there for good reason, and people trying to get round it will be dealt with severely.
Cheers
P
jnutz said:
So I have been a member on here for a while and have observed the changing trends in devices and users. But something has gotten much worse in last year and I think we need to address it in proper XDA fashion. I am not the type to complain without trying develop a solution and I am looking for some feedback from mods and users of all types, shapes and sizes here.
This forum has a real problem with people making useless posts in the wrong sections, about the wrong topics and while I think the mods do a great job they clearly can't keep up. I am no saint and will admit my own guilt on one or two occasions but some users just post meaningless post after meaningless post and really great threads are being destroyed as a result. This problem has clearly gotten out of hand and it isn't limited to just the devices I follow. A review of the forum shows this behavior in just about every device category. Just my observation...
My proposed solution to this problem I perceive is a "No thanks" button that will function in exactly the opposite way the "Thank you" button works with a few caveats I see as a huge value add.
1. If a certain post is given X amount of no thanks clicks it is automatically sent to a mod for review or perhaps even automatically deleted.
2. 1 Thanks click cancels out X no thanks clicks. This would keep trolls from using it in destructive ways if you are just someone that has a few enemies. Hopefully...
3. One thanks click cancels out X no thanks clicks.
4. After a user receives X amount of no thanks clicks they are redirected to the forums rules page for a period of 24 hours. No matter what link they click or how they access the site they will just be redirected to a page with the forum rules so they can study them.
I could go on listing things but I want to see what you guys think about something like this. It would allow all of us to some degree the ability to moderate our favorite threads and keep the BS posts to a minimum. User that continue to post things off topic or in the wrong threads will find themselves spending a lot of time studying the forum rules. Even if we don't add the enhanced features the no thanks button is long overdue. These people can wear their lack of respect for forum rules like a badge of shame the same way devs wear the thanks button like a badge of honor. It will give them more incentive to think about the things they post and will help ensure that good threads are not destroyed by the same question asked 100 times.
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Click to collapse
I love this idea. I came in to this section, getting ready to request a 'No Thanks' button myself, when I found your post. Some of the completely frustrating examples are:
1) Posting the message 'Thanks' instead of just clicking the thanks button
2) Asking what the battery life on a new ROM is, 2 minutes after the ROM has been posted
3) Asking questions that have been asked 20 times in the current thread
This problem gets exacerbated by other members posting to tell them that they're post is not useful, in the wrong place, or redundant.
If we had a way to flag these posts, maybe by adding more options to the 'report' functionality, without further polluting the thread, it would go a long way towards keeping threads clean.
Thx,
Jason
djgromit said:
I love this idea. I came in to this section, getting ready to request a 'No Thanks' button myself, when I found your post. Some of the completely frustrating examples are:
1) Posting the message 'Thanks' instead of just clicking the thanks button
2) Asking what the battery life on a new ROM is, 2 minutes after the ROM has been posted
3) Asking questions that have been asked 20 times in the current thread
This problem gets exacerbated by other members posting to tell them that they're post is not useful, in the wrong place, or redundant.
If we had a way to flag these posts, maybe by adding more options to the 'report' functionality, without further polluting the thread, it would go a long way towards keeping threads clean.
Thx,
Jason
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I understand, seeing battery related and other FAQ can be frustrating, but they are not exactly spam, and XDA is growing and new users are discovering the world of custom ROMs and flashing because of which certain excitement and stupidity at the same time.
It's in the right spirit to welcome and be good to new members, but indeed if you notice a particular member getting out of hand or a little to n00bish please do report and we the MODs will do the needful.
We all need to strive for a balance between the developers and old school XDA members part and the new members, it can be tough; but i'm sure it can be done
JM2C's.
Hola, I would have liked to quote all of you, since you all have pro´s but there are also plenty of con´s and so I´ll only quote this last ones as reference...
djgromit said:
I love this idea. I came in to this section, getting ready to request a 'No Thanks' button myself, when I found your post. Some of the completely frustrating examples are:
1) Posting the message 'Thanks' instead of just clicking the thanks button
2) Asking what the battery life on a new ROM is, 2 minutes after the ROM has been posted
3) Asking questions that have been asked 20 times in the current thread
This problem gets exacerbated by other members posting to tell them that they're post is not useful, in the wrong place, or redundant.
If we had a way to flag these posts, maybe by adding more options to the 'report' functionality, without further polluting the thread, it would go a long way towards keeping threads clean.
Thx,
Jason
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Click to collapse
I think and welcome the idea of "flagging" certain posts after it is totally clear (I know, sometimes it seems obvious) that the post is "trash" or BS (by the way, my initials). But there are also plenty of drawbacks to the way this can be done, so no hard/personal feelings get "hurt" und thus agrrevate the situation and lead to more discontent and "wrong" behaviour. Maybe anonymously after a poll? But then again, this would also mean more work for the admins or further involucration and responsibility for the OPs (which is my opinion, that they should be held more responsible for their threads and given more authoroty with that rensponsability - but that´s a different thing and not the point here).
As for your "frustrating" examples:
1.) When the "thanks" button got introduced (again), like in so many other boards, for some it´s enough just to push that button to show their appreciation, but others "need" to write a "thank you" post (which used to be the way before) - call it education, need to get the post count up, what ever... I personally think, there is nothing wrong with either method, hitting the button, or writing a thanks post. Doesn´t harm anybody, and btw, to bad the limit is 5 per day, cause a lot of times I find very usefull posts for me (mostly more than 5 per day) and I can´t thank the users for it, unless writting a thanks post. Both of these methods are positive and encouraging...
Now to the "no thanks".... It´s neither encouraging, nor positive, nor really constructive and could lead to further discussions within a thread instead of the intended result.
2.) Answered by madnish below
3.) It´s a pitty, but it´s human lazyness, sometimes not to read the posts from others (not the questions and not the answers to those questions), or simply call it egoism, wanting a personal solution, lack of time... or simply not having payed attention. I´ve answered quite some questions asked over and over again, just like a lot of other members. You can either try to help people, and remind them to use the search and/or read the thread thoroughly before posting a question...., or you can tell them their post is BS, not usefull, has been answered a million times, etc, or you can simply ignore them. All of these lead to the same result. After a while, these users tend to read, search and think before posting, so it has a positive and beneficial effect on the mid/long term...
So YES, "flagging" would be OK, depending on how it´s put into practice.
madnish30 said:
I understand, seeing battery related and other FAQ can be frustrating, but they are not exactly spam, and XDA is growing and new users are discovering the world of custom ROMs and flashing because of which certain excitement and stupidity at the same time.
It's in the right spirit to welcome and be good to new members, but indeed if you notice a particular member getting out of hand or a little to n00bish please do report and we the MODs will do the needful.
We all need to strive for a balance between the developers and old school XDA members part and the new members, it can be tough; but i'm sure it can be done
JM2C's.
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I´m kinda representing the noob´s side. I´m only a simple and yes, stupid user. No dev, no technical background, but lot´s of questions... Maybe xda used to be different and only for developers, as the name states, but times have changed and also the "kind" of members. The profile is no longer only dev´s and tec´s, but also a lot of users with different expertice (less), skills (other), background, knowledge, age, education, culture, language, etc.
All users should me more responsible, but hey, we are all human and act according to different standards, believes, etc. The only way to solve this problem is by all enforcing and encouraging the rules, "helping" out the OPs, Moderatrors & Admins to keep the threads as integer, clean and "on topic" as possible. I know there are times when some posts are interpreted (and actually are) off topic, but sometimes this is also beneficial for the users and thus for the thread itself.
Basically all this is just to say, it´s not about all that can or needs to be done by rules, limitations, mods and admins - it´s about what WE can ACTIVELY do to improve the situation and avoid it becoming worse...
Btw, I would have pushed the "no thanks" button for this request. Not because I don´t think that it´s a good thing, simply because I don´t agree with it. Very good innitiative, but in my honest and humble opinion, bad judgement, so YES, thank you, but no thanks
Similar to "Thanks" button, please add "Unhelpful" or "Dislike" button
Some forums on here have grown out of control with nonsense and useless posts and it is too much and even unnecessary work sometimes, for mods to have to deal with. The thousands of users that read these posts daily are perfectly capable of judging these posts and should be able to + or - a post based on its usefulness. This +/- button could be attached to every post similar to the way the "Thanks" button is. It wouldn't require every post to be +'ed or -'ed, but usually the REALLY HELPFUL posts would be +'ed (similar to being thanked) and the real BS posts would be ranked down. Simple.
People who don't bother to read or search first before posting something are an annoyance for many in this community.. and posting stickies at the top of every page titled "PLEASE READ FIRST" or anything similar just doesn't work. Users then "flame" one another, and that doesn't help in correcting the problem either. Additionally, the mods shouldn't have to be monitoring posts like they would a kindergarten class.
Allowing users to simply rate posts with a +/- like on many other sites, would improve the visibility of helpful posts on this forum greatly, while allowing nonsense posts to be hidden. When a posts receives an overwhelming number of -'s as opposed to +'s, that post will be automatically hidden so that other users may ignore it. There is already a "Thanks" button to thank users for being helpful; I think it's unrealistic to not include a way to flag unhelpful posts as well since there are just as many of those. (These aren't always derogatory or negative posts that SHOULD be reported to mods, but instead just wasteful and nonsense posts that add nothing informative to a thread).
Yes, this is a community where we are all here to help each other. In reality though, some users just don't care about anything except what they're here for and end up cluttering the forums with questions that have been answered several times before, or posting in wrong sections, etc . Those posts should be able to be flagged or ranked down by us users (this can be limited to even junior/ senior members for those worried of abuse in such a system, which is really not a threat at all [I explain in a post further down]). Please consider this improvement.
Thoughts?
Love it.
TechReport.com does a similar thing, and if you get five downvotes the post isn't automatically displayed.
Would streamline the site immensely, although I have a sneaky feeling something along these lines may well be implemented in the future.
This would cause so many problems too... All it would take is a few pissed off kids to downrank a helpful/brutally honest/ROM post into oblivion.
I think the way it is is fine, Although I wish they had a "Report as Trolling" button so we could send those ****ers into space somewhere...
posts like this
Not at all. If other users see a post getting downranked and they think it shouldn't be, they can just + it and if the overall community thinks the post shouldn't be downranked, enough people will + it to unhide the post. You sound like you have no faith in the community to do something right. It is such a large community that it will take a large number of posters to downrank something. And the general consensus about the post will eventually trump inappropriate downranks. It's so simple but difficult to explain. Also, this wouldn't require every post to be ranked. It's just there as an option.
Check out some androidandme posts for example. It works wonderfully on there.
IISiDeK1CKII said:
This would cause so many problems too... All it would take is a few pissed off kids to downrank a helpful/brutally honest/ROM post into oblivion.
I think the way it is is fine, Although I wish they had a "Report as Trolling" button so we could send those ****ers into space somewhere...
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Good point Sidekick (Hi btw ) but I do think this would occur much less frequently than the opposite (ranking down trollers and threadcrappers, myself included )
Also, 'sensible users' could easily just rank it back up.
^^ Exactly. It's already a system in place on many sites, and it's obviously used because it works.
I'm in for this. We all know XDA has grown too fast for moderation to keep up. Let the users help out.
This is definitely a really good idea, it would bring up the quality of posts especially on the development related threads. +1 from me
Aspeds2989 said:
Some forums on here have grown out of control with nonsense and useless posts.
The issue of lazy people who don't bother to read or search before posting something annoys a lot of people in this community.. and posting stickies at the top of every page titled "PLEASE READ FIRST" or anything similar just doesn't work. Users flaming one another doesn't help in correcting the problem either. The mods also have enough on their hands to have to worry about monitoring and deleting and moving wrongfully placed posts.
So, in an effort to better the experience for everyone, why not allow users to simply rate posts with a +/- like on many other sites. When a posts receives an overwhelming number of negatives, that post will be automatically hidden (check androidandme.com for example).
I think this will be a more effective and simple way for the community to keep tabs on itself. There is already a "Thanks" button to thank users for helping one another. I think it's unrealistic to not include a way for users to rank down unhelpful posts as well. The report button just unnecessarily pushes more work onto the mods.
Yes, this is a community where we are all here to help each other. In reality though, some users just don't care about anything except what they're here for and add nothing positive to the community. Those posts should be able to be ranked down by us users.
Thoughts?
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How about a [Solved Button]? For those Damn threads you read about a Million Replies to just to find out Help is No Longer Needed!
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1178716
PMGRANDS said:
How about a [Solved Button]? For those Damn threads you read about a Million Replies to just to find out Help is No Longer Needed!
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There is actually another thread about this in here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1178716
Unksi said:
There is actually another thread about this in here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1178716
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I know... Sorry!
I actually Started the other thread!
Lol, just trying to Promote the Idea!
Yea.. I didn't think anyone would listen either :-! Oh, well. I tried.
Preach it! This system would be extremely helpful for everyone, especially since there is alot of cluttering going on.
Ehh.. I think writing an essay was enough for me. If people like this maybe they can just keep bumping it until it catches attention.
Aspeds2989 said:
Ehh.. I think writing an essay was enough for me. If people like this maybe they can just keep bumping it until it catches attention.
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I Hear that... I Feel the Same way as you do with my Idea! I actually thought I'd have a lot More comments than I have in my thread. But oh well... Lol!
meeeowww..
Potential for abuse = Huuuge...
Sent From My Fingers To Your Face......
Realistic threat of abuse = Non-existent
Again, I refer to a site like Yahoo that uses this in their comments section that sees multiple times the amount of traffic than does this site and.. EDIT - nevermind
Aspeds2989 said:
Realistic threat of abuse = Non-existent
Again, I refer to a site like Yahoo that uses this in their comments section that sees multiple times the amount of traffic than does this site and.. EDIT - nevermind
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First off, I apologise, I did not pay attention and therefore my last post was irrelevant, allow me to respond properly....
Also, I hope that you didnt decide to edit your post because you noticed I was a mod, contrary to popular belief, users DO NOT receive bans/infractions for speaking their minds
Aspeds2989 said:
People who don't bother to read or search first before posting something are an annoyance for many in this community.. and posting stickies at the top of every page titled "PLEASE READ FIRST" or anything similar just doesn't work. Users then "flame" one another, and that doesn't help in correcting the problem either. Additionally, the mods shouldn't have to be monitoring posts like they would a kindergarten class.
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Click to collapse
Couldnt agree more....
Aspeds2989 said:
That is why allowing users to simply rate posts with a +/- like on many other sites, would improve the quality of posts on this forum greatly. When a posts receives an overwhelming number of negatives, that post will be automatically hidden so that other users are aware and may ignore it (check androidandme.com or any Yahoo news articles for examples). I think this will be a more effective and simple way for the community to keep tabs on itself. There is already a "Thanks" button to thank users for helping one another. I think it's unrealistic to not include a way for users to rank down unhelpful or even negative posts as well. It's like not wanting to acknowledge the fact that there are a lot of nonsense posts throughout the forums. And the report button just unnecessarily pushes more work onto the mods and the majority ignores it, so it's not effective.
Yes, this is a community where we are all here to help each other. In reality though, some users just don't care about anything except what they're here for and add nothing positive to the community, and end up cluttering the forums with questions that have been answered several times before, or posting in wrong sections, etc . Those posts should be able to be flagged or ranked down by the community. Please consider this improvement.
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Im not sure if this is possible with the version of VB that XDA uses. It probably is but then there is always the possibility that it may not work smoothly due to the existing amount of tweaks to the system that are already in place.
The problem you describe is due to the "gimme gimme gimme" mentality of the current userbase and we are currently taking steps to address this.
In the meantime please alert us to any such posts and we can remove duplicates and tag items as [SOLVED]. We dont mind doing it if people are willing to let us know that it needs to be done.
IISiDeK1CKII said:
This would cause so many problems too... All it would take is a few pissed off kids to downrank a helpful/brutally honest/ROM post into oblivion.
I think the way it is is fine, Although I wish they had a "Report as Trolling" button so we could send those ****ers into space somewhere...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It could be an issue, there will always be a certain "fanboi" mentality that would be inclined to abuse such a system. Some of the developers can be quite blunt (and rightly so) when it comes to people asking dumbass questions in a thread, I would hate to see for threads to be tarnished with downvotes (even if it is just one) all because some asshat wasnt happy about receiving a public dressing down.
There is already a Report button... Use it, we dont like trolls, they will be promptly escorted off the premises.
Aspeds2989 said:
Not at all. If other users see a post getting downranked and they think it shouldn't be, they can just + it and if the overall community thinks the post shouldn't be downranked, enough people will + it to unhide the post. You sound like you have no faith in the community to do something right. It is such a large community that it will take a large number of posters to downrank something. And the general consensus about the post will eventually trump inappropriate downranks. It's so simple but difficult to explain. Also, this wouldn't require every post to be ranked. It's just there as an option.
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As much as I hate to say it, I have to agree with the bold part at the moment.
I think that too much of the current userbase just want the easy option and want it now.
I think that we would need to adress the issue of discipline and improving the content of posts before we could implement a system like this, we are currently doing this but it will take time.
karnovaran said:
I'm in for this. We all know XDA has grown too fast for moderation to keep up. Let the users help out.
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Click to collapse
If you want to help, drop us a PM when you see something that needs attention or use the report button.
I think its unfair to say that XDA has grown too fast for the mods to keep up, we have a highly dedicated and hard working team of many moderators who give up their free time to keep this place running. New moderator applications are being processed at the moment as well, so expect to see a few more jackbooted, goosestepping, uptight internet rent-a-cops strutting around sometime soon.
The problem lies not with the amount of users we have to deal with, it is the amount of stupidity and ignorance displayed by some (too many) of them.
I guess that is going to come off as a pretty negative post but I am not against such an idea, I just think there are more pressing matters to attend to first.
If you havent already done so I suggest you read the forum announcement by Svetius outlining the roadmap for the site.
/rant
First of all I apologise if this suggestion has been already said and discussed. I haven't noticed it in some other thread.
I'm sick and tired of watching 10posters or just spammers to flud developers sections with their idiotic repeatable questions which are already answered in stickies, faqs, etc.
I guess since everyone in our days can buy a smartphone or tablet, this is a situation that we can not avoid that easy. But what we can do is to keep the unworthy out of dev areas at least until the prove otherwise.
10 post count is just rubbish...anyone can just troll these posts out at the OT section and he's done in 2 minutes.
Instead of post count, make it "thanks" count. If anybody has something worthy to say or is a new promising dev he can be "chosen" by the others by his thanks count.
I read many suggestions about dislike/nothanks buttons and such. This is much simplier and imho it could prove much more effective to filter out the noobs and take in the newbies that they deserve it and also can make the mods do their tracking through the forums easier.
Keep the noobs at the general section and out of the dev areas and let in those who have really something good to do or say. Everyone in here, from the users up to developers are trying to help the most they can but Jesus!!! this is not a shelter for retards or something.
I'm trying to remember when it was the last time a saw a proper dev thread not getting noob raped but I don't have so deep memories
Again I'm sorry if this has been said already
+1...ive seen people post stuff like "im trying to get 10 posts" over and over again. this will bring an end to that
but on the other hand, ive seen people with hundreds of posts and only one or two thanks
sweetnsour said:
+1...ive seen people post stuff like "im trying to get 10 posts" over and over again. this will bring an end to that
but on the other hand, ive seen people with hundreds of posts and only one or two thanks
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Click to collapse
That's the point!
Everyone can raise their post count with one way or another. This doesn't mean that they have something useful to contribute. There are members for example 1000 posts and 5 thanks and other members (devs almost everyone) with 100 posts and 500 thanks to say the least.
I haven't seen any noob (at least in the subforums I read ) no matter how old member he is or how many posts he has, to have a high thanks count and that's because he doesn't say anything usefull to actually make other members hit that thanks button.
We got the evaluation variable, so let's use it!
Instead for thanks button to be just a cosmetic in the forums, it can really be used as an evaluation measure.
I think it should be 15 or even 20 thanks
Sent from my SCH-I400 using XDA App
I actually like that idea. Interestingly enough I've been working on my 10 posts but I've been doing it the right way.I hate spamming and its a shame that people do that.
Tapped from my CherryPi Atrix
The person who rooted the D3 on this board had to spam in a general forum to get his post count high enough to post in the dev forum.
Excellent idea. A huge +1 to this..
Sent from my HTC Sensation Z710e using Tapatalk
Actually there are still some ppl who can post some usefull thoughts or questions...
Not everyone is a newbie who cant use the search button.
B-Ace said:
Actually there are still some ppl who can post some usefull thoughts or questions...
Not everyone is a newbie who cant use the search button.
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Click to collapse
Of course there are. But for each new contributing member in here, come other 100 lamers that just want to turn their phone into a space shuttle or something. Those are the ones who make the dev threads unsufferable to follow properly. 1 good post among 50 whining and asking lame things.
Either someone should find a proper way to filter them out of the dev sections or could might as well remove completely this useless 10 post count. It serves absolutely no good.
We have the same problem on the forum I mod at, we lowered it to 5 posts and it's better this way, but still there is no perfect solution.
Right now, I'm stuck in a situation where I want to download a file linked here and I can't until I reach 10 posts, that's pretty frustrating.
It's true that even people with higher post counts don't always have many thanks, but you must also take in to consideration that the Admin/Mods recently added the "Thanks" feature. I already had around 4k post before the thanks feature was added in, and I've helped many people in different sections. It's hard to actually get around the spam on the forum, you just have to hope people have common sense to not post non-sense in the wrong section.
Abradax said:
The person who rooted the D3 on this board had to spam in a general forum to get his post count high enough to post in the dev forum.
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And as a DROID3 owner I'm so glad that he was able to get his post count up so he could post in the developers section. I also understand being frustrated with people who don't search. Even tho i don't post here often I'm here often reading threads so i can learn more about developing. If you make the requirements stricter you may want to have a way for people to bypass said requirements if deemed worthy by a mod.
I would wholeheartedly agree to this, even being new here myself, however I was browsing through 20 or so Q&A threads, and I saw one person thanked for giving an answer. There aren't a whole lot of thanks being given outside the dev forums...
Part 2... spammers making a 2nd account to thank themselves. Slightly more work ending in the same result... and more work for the mods
I've seen this idea raised before, and I love it. 100%.
The only issue is that 'thanks' are completely subjective. Someone may 'thank' a completely useless, inflammatory or derogatory post because it's funny or because they've stated the obvious, but may completely dismiss an actually useful post, with no recognition whatsoever.
Posts, on the other hand, are objective. They're universal. Whether they're **** or not, everybody gets them.
Until the 'thanks' feature gets utilised properly by all users (but remember this is a huge ask) it'll be quite difficult to implement effectively. While the 'I'm getting 10 posts' posts will disappear, the 'Why wasn't I thanked for...' will go through the roof.
juzz86 said:
I've seen this idea raised before, and I love it. 100%.
The only issue is that 'thanks' are completely subjective. Someone may 'thank' a completely useless, inflammatory or derogatory post because it's funny or because they've stated the obvious, but may completely dismiss an actually useful post, with no recognition whatsoever.
Posts, on the other hand, are objective. They're universal. Whether they're **** or not, everybody gets them.
Until the 'thanks' feature gets utilised properly by all users (but remember this is a huge ask) it'll be quite difficult to implement effectively. While the 'I'm getting 10 posts' posts will disappear, the 'Why wasn't I thanked for...' will go through the roof.
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Yes you're right, usage of the thanks button is completely subjective and this is obvious all around the forums.
But still, even under those circumstances there is a pattern even if it is a bit loose.
Contributing active users and devs especially tend to have more thanks than the rest of the mass. Maybe this "trend" it could be used in a way to clear out dev forums and keep it this way.
This is how I originally thought of its application and imho I believe it's making more sense.
mprou said:
Yes you're right, usage of the thanks button is completely subjective and this is obvious all around the forums.
But still, even under those circumstances there is a pattern even if it is a bit loose.
Contributing active users and devs especially tend to have more thanks than the rest of the mass. Maybe this "trend" it could be used in a way to clear out dev forums and keep it this way.
This is how I originally thought of its application and imho I believe it's making more sense.
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You are 100% correct.
Devs and solid members tend to have a much higher 'thanks' count than others. It would be a good way of thinning down the crap in the Dev forums, for sure.
It could even be broadened, so that you had to have X number of posts, and X% of your total post count 'thanks'.
neilrl79 said:
And as a DROID3 owner I'm so glad that he was able to get his post count up so he could post in the developers section.
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I ended up here too because I have a D3 and wanted to just thank the person who posted about getting root access. Signed up just to do so. But apparently I can't, either because I haven't existed long enough or haven't made enough posts.
I also see people with less than 10 posts posting in the dev forums, asking the same redundant questions that the 10 post limit is supposed to detour. x.x
While I do agree, I don't think it will rid us of the scourge of noobs with entitlement issues. I literally saw someone post and ***** about the 10 post limit saying "I'm a customer of that product and I should be able to tell him what to do" <-- verbatim.
I just don't want to see the kids who think they are entitled to everything, also the thanks being subjective is completely true, I have helped around 50 people total in the past month or 2 and yet only 19 thanks. That proves people really only thank you if they feel like it or if they are actually grateful rather than just "Oh cool some dude on the internet helped me" *leaves xda forever* No, I am not complaining about my amount of thanks, I'm glad I was able to help people regardless, I'm just showing it's completely subjective.
Indirect said:
While I do agree, I don't think it will rid us of the scourge of noobs with entitlement issues. I literally saw someone post and ***** about the 10 post limit saying "I'm a customer of that product and I should be able to tell him what to do" <-- verbatim.
I just don't want to see the kids who think they are entitled to everything, also the thanks being subjective is completely true, I have helped around 50 people total in the past month or 2 and yet only 19 thanks. That proves people really only thank you if they feel like it or if they are actually grateful rather than just "Oh cool some dude on the internet helped me" *leaves xda forever* No, I am not complaining about my amount of thanks, I'm glad I was able to help people regardless, I'm just showing it's completely subjective.
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Thanks Indirect!
Seriously, we had a similar issue on another board of which I am an admin, what we did is put a 50 post count limit on new accounts in addition to a throttle of course for daily limits. It sort of works but the quality of the posts went down significantly.
The thanks idea is better but as stated a few posts above it's really subjective.
Instead of thanks I might suggest reputation levels. When the users rep level is zero or when it hits a new "low" the section moderator can chose to make his perms go to read only. The user can protest and or try and improve on it by helping or keeping in the general sections.
I am not too particularly fond of these types of comments either.
"I didn't need that file jackass!"
or
"I need help now because I am Chuck Norris dammit!"
By using that system peers can get pretty mean but it really starts to get people to think about what they post. Everybody has to start somewhere.
That's my 2Cents.
Well, I actually don't like the idea of reputation because on another forum there are "repwhores" and rep becomes kind of like a commidity. I'm not saying that's what will happen here, it's just a chance it could. It happened with alot of the 13-15 year old members and though they aren't common here, that doesn't make it impossible for them to be here. D:
Hi!
I really enjoy the forum but why is it so hostile to new users? For example, being forced to do a CAPTCHA every time I write a new post, and when I wanted to share my desktop in the share your desktop thread in the Galaxy Tab 10.1 forum I was blocked because I'm new, and then when I went to fix a typo in a post I'd just made, it told me I had to wait FIVE minutes! Believe me, I understand what a problem spammers are. I am a moderator on another tech forum and I used to be a moderator for MTV. I get it. But treating all your new users as if they are spammers and making them jump through hoops or blocking them from being able to do simple things like share a screenshot just gives off a "we hate new users, we know you're all evil spammers so we hope this frustrates you enough to drive you away" vibe.
I understand that your rules are your rules and respect that, and I like it here. I just wanted to put in my two cents about the impression it gives new users.
BretonGirl said:
Hi!
I really enjoy the forum but why is it so hostile to new users? For example, being forced to do a CAPTCHA every time I write a new post, and when I wanted to share my desktop in the share your desktop thread in the Galaxy Tab 10.1 forum I was blocked because I'm new, and then when I went to fix a typo in a post I'd just made, it told me I had to wait FIVE minutes! Believe me, I understand what a problem spammers are. I am a moderator on another tech forum and I used to be a moderator for MTV. I get it. But treating all your new users as if they are spammers and making them jump through hoops or blocking them from being able to do simple things like share a screenshot just gives off a "we hate new users, we know you're all evil spammers so we hope this frustrates you enough to drive you away" vibe.
I understand that your rules are your rules and respect that, and I like it here. I just wanted to put in my two cents about the impression it gives new users.
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even though ive given you a thanks or this, i do believe its set correctly. This forum has soooooo many existing users plus the new ones joining everyday its very suprising how little advertising,spamming goes on here and i do think its contributed by the new user rules.
I myself have only ever been a mod for a 200+ forum and the amount of spam we had to delete each day was a joke, imagine how many links around the web lead to xda....the amount of spam this site would be suffering had they not placed these rules the xda maybe not what we all cherish today
edit "NOTE", lol just wait until you accidentally post in the wrong section
I understand your situation, considering that you have been a forum moderator in other forums
But when I was a new user i never got to enter any captcha or so !
I have no clue that Captcha was being used on XDA to be honest!
But one thing that can help you is that you can answer others's questions in the Q and A forum of the device(s) you own. Helps to get that 10 post thing done early, especially if you know enough to help someone else out
Anyways all the best and you can PM me if you need any more help or you may contact a senior admin
just my 2 (+1) cents p) and Peace!
I've never been a moderator for any forum and even I know the effect spammers can have if the proper procedures don't take place.
But you gotta know, it's only for a few posts...it's not like you'll be entering captcha codes in forever and never be able to share weblinks or screen shots.
Just ride it out, we all had to
Well, this is a touchy subject.
Being such a high traffic forum we really do need aggressive anti spam measures.
As for the restrictions on the development sections.... We'll that's also a touchy subject but for entirely different reasons.
Once upon a time XDA was populated solely by developers, developers who developed for no other reason than the love of developing. Then the smartphone became accessible to more and more people, which led to more and more members who weren't developers. This led to lots and lots of questions, many of which were placed in the development forums, which isn't the right place for non development related questions. Therefore a system was put in place which prevents new users from posting in the development sections with the intention of giving them the opportunity to get to know how XDA works before jumping straight in and spamming up the hallowed halls of the development forums.....
That's about it really.. Check out the sticky in this section for a more detailed explanation
Sent From My Fingers To Your Face.....
I appreciate everyone's replies. I have no problem with the 10 posts before getting access to the developer's section. You certainly don't want anything but quality in a section like that.
I also understand the spam issue. One of my day jobs is as a staff writer for a blog hosted by a company that makes anti-spam software. I know more than I ever wanted to on the subject!
This is a great forum!
I agree
The forum is very anti-noob. I hate entering capta images that I can hardly read, can only post every 5 minutes, this really sucks. I hope when I hit 10 posts this crap goes away
I like the spam features that this site has in place, I think more forum sites need to put something like this in place. It's not that hard to get 10 posts if you're helping people out.
Chaotic Peace said:
I like the spam features that this site has in place, I think more forum sites need to put something like this in place. It's not that hard to get 10 posts if you're helping people out.
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most new users on this forum are looking for help , so i guess most users first 10 post will be for asking help and not giving .
i kind of like the idea of captcha on the first few post i may use it on my site. i have a xbox modding site and it generates a bit of spam from time to time.
webjunky said:
most new users on this forum are looking for help , so i guess most users first 10 post will be for asking help and not giving .
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Yep, and at the same time most new users don't understand the concept of searching the forums so their first 10 posts which are asking rather than helping would probably have already been asked previously. i.e. forum gets cluttered up, which is pretty much a form of spam.
Chaotic Peace said:
I like the spam features that this site has in place, I think more forum sites need to put something like this in place. It's not that hard to get 10 posts if you're helping people out.
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Yeah exactly! And making ten posts isn't that time consuming either at the same time.
webjunky said:
most new users on this forum are looking for help , so i guess most users first 10 post will be for asking help and not giving .
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This is true as well. But if they need help they should be posting in the Q&A sections of their device not the development section.
I think the rules are there for a reason and the MODs and Admin have thought a lot on this issue and its only for first 10 posts.
It's not too bad, it's worth it.
---------- Post added at 10:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:35 PM ----------
I think if people were able to sign in with their google accounts though there wouldn't be need for all this...
conantroutman said:
This led to lots and lots of questions, many of which were placed in the development forums, which isn't the right place for non development related questions. Therefore a system was put in place which prevents new users from posting in the development sections with the intention of giving them the opportunity to get to know how XDA works before jumping straight in and spamming up the hallowed halls of the development
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And now they post Questions in the general forums =.=
Sent from my E15i using Tapatalk
We're always trying to make things better on the forums. This means we have to try stuff to see if it works. It's basically trial & error for the most part.
The spamming has decreased alot the past couple of months with the new captchas and 10 post rule. Still, we need to find a way to make it less difficult to join our forums and more difficult to post spam. Ideas are always welcome of course.
Annoying for non noobs
I still haven't made my 10 posts because all the stuff I want to respond to is in the developer forums so now I have to search the boards for things to reply to to actually find something to respond even though I've been a member for over a year and a user of this website for a few years!
Whilst I understand the reasoning security vs usability can sometimes be a massive P.I.T.A
Slotty_AU said:
I still haven't made my 10 posts because all the stuff I want to respond to is in the developer forums so now I have to search the boards for things to reply to to actually find something to respond even though I've been a member for over a year and a user of this website for a few years!
Whilst I understand the reasoning security vs usability can sometimes be a massive P.I.T.A
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Is it so much to ask that you read for a bit first, pick up some knowledge and experience, help a few people in the 90+% of the site which is completely open to you such as your devices General or Q&A forums or any of the General discussion forums, to participate with quality posts instead of BS posts, in return for being able to post into any of the ROM threads from any dev on this site?
I've had the immense privilege of watching this site grow since just a couple months after it introduced a few new phone models to the original O2 XDA. I actually get my soap opera fix and tech fix all in one! I'm hooked.
It's not just spam. I was a horrendous new user, posting in the wrong forum, responding to emotional posts enough to encourage them, I even chewed out a guy for blasting a noob. The problem is organic, and though spam has become part of that (probably the hugest part, now) it's that organic nature of this forum that makes it so great. Really tough problem to grow something cleanly without squelching it.
I was wondering if XDA could track a user's searches, or forums "read" for more than a minute, and after 30 or so, then stop the captchas. It seems like over the years it's folks who don't search & read (spammers or otherwise) that are the detraction. Maybe something like being in "reader" status as a step to becoming a new user & able to post at all.
1. I could have used it.
2. I'm putting this here, in the weird forum for this topic it's in, to see what people think. Wanting to have input as a developer is definitely a magnification of the problem. I'm glad it's here.
(ThinkPad Tablet:Tapatalk 2)
I can understand the ten post rule to both assure the integrity of your forum and allow genuinely useful threads to grow without meaningless and unrelated questions posted. That is perfectly acceptable.
My issue is that I can't even respond to a thread I've started myself, which a solution was provided, but doesn't work.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=27978835#post27978835
When I attempt to post a reply to follow up, I get blocked by the site's ten post rule. Can this be relaxed at least a little? Surely I should be able to respond to my own threads.
kilowattcommando said:
I can understand the ten post rule to both assure the integrity of your forum and allow genuinely useful threads to grow without meaningless and unrelated questions posted. That is perfectly acceptable.
My issue is that I can't even respond to a thread I've started myself, which a solution was provided, but doesn't work.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=27978835#post27978835
When I attempt to post a reply to follow up, I get blocked by the site's ten post rule. Can this be relaxed at least a little? Surely I should be able to respond to my own threads.
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The 10 post rule should be a 100 post rule IMHO we get a endless flood of ridiculous posts without users first searching. They also post questions and other such offtopic crap in dev areas.
But to answer your question, the 10 post rule is supposed to be for dev areas not general so it looks like there is an error.
kilowattcommando said:
I can understand the ten post rule to both assure the integrity of your forum and allow genuinely useful threads to grow without meaningless and unrelated questions posted. That is perfectly acceptable.
My issue is that I can't even respond to a thread I've started myself, which a solution was provided, but doesn't work.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=27978835#post27978835
When I attempt to post a reply to follow up, I get blocked by the site's ten post rule. Can this be relaxed at least a little? Surely I should be able to respond to my own threads.
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Your thread is in the device General subforum so you should be able to reply. Give this thread a bit, one of the mods will notice it as they hang out here a fair amount and they can look into it.
what the hell (and so on)
hi xda-developers,
i'm Mobile Device Specialist, Linux Professional and Microsoft Certified Engineer and i'm new to this forum .. and i can't post some stuff to Developers Forums? i know there are many "noobs" as well cause i cannot understand why this is restricted.
Some Peoples without technical knowledge can post some **** without having any glou about it.
Whats going on?
fine77
---
I like your noob video
fine77 said:
hi xda-developers,
i'm Mobile Device Specialist, Linux Professional and Microsoft Certified Engineer and i'm new to this forum .. and i can't post some stuff to Developers Forums? i know there are many "noobs" as well cause i cannot understand why this is restricted.
Some Peoples without technical knowledge can post some **** without having any glou about it.
Whats going on?
fine77
---
I like your noob video
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You need 10 posts for the dev forums, sorry. The alternative is every forum filled with spam. Getting to 10 good posts really isn't difficult.
Sent from my HTC Sensation 4G using xda premium
fine77 said:
hi xda-developers,
i'm Mobile Device Specialist, Linux Professional and Microsoft Certified Engineer and i'm new to this forum .. and i can't post some stuff to Developers Forums? i know there are many "noobs" as well cause i cannot understand why this is restricted.
Some Peoples without technical knowledge can post some **** without having any glou about it.
Whats going on?
fine77
---
I like your noob video
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If you truly know your stuff, getting to 10 helpful posts should in theory be a piece of cake. It's true that 10 posts doesn't make you a dev but it certainly helps stop spam in the most important forums
kilowattcommando said:
I can understand the ten post rule to both assure the integrity of your forum and allow genuinely useful threads to grow without meaningless and unrelated questions posted. That is perfectly acceptable.
My issue is that I can't even respond to a thread I've started myself, which a solution was provided, but doesn't work.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=27978835#post27978835
When I attempt to post a reply to follow up, I get blocked by the site's ten post rule. Can this be relaxed at least a little? Surely I should be able to respond to my own threads.
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Click to collapse
You should be able to reply to it.
If you agree, please pm me, and I will reset your password to try this out and see what's going wrong.
Likely your account got stuck, or there's a permissions error we need to sort.
If that's ok, drop me a pm. I'll send you a new password to your registered e-mail once done