Develop Bugs

[Q] When will a proper Sat Nav app arrive? or am i missing them somewhere?

cant find a sat nav program like tom tom anywhere. i`d rather use my data connection for surfing the internet and not using the voiceless bing maps. does this mean i should keep hold of my touch tiamond 2 and its tom tom?

don't think there is anything out there yet.
Have you contacted tomtom and asked when they are going to release a wp7 version?
I can live with telenav (tmous) until bing nav is released in the first update.

Although Bing Nav will use data as well just like Google Maps nav does.

I have Singtel Xplorer from Telmap. Works great!
Sent from my HD7 T9292 using Board Express

zard said:
I have Singtel Xplorer from Telmap. Works great!
Sent from my HD7 T9292 using Board Express
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Well... lucky you! Those of us anywhere else in the world are still waiting. Although at least we know this stuff is really coming out FAST!
What did Singtel cost?

Free for 6 months and thereafter S$5 per month.
Sent from my HD7 T9292 using Board Express

I'd imagine the 225 MB max package size for the WP7 marketplace might be a problem for offline navigation apps (unless the app downloads the maps separately).

amb9800 said:
I'd imagine the 225 MB max package size for the WP7 marketplace might be a problem for offline navigation apps (unless the app downloads the maps separately).
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you may want to petition the dev of Maverick (android) to make a pay-for app.
it's a very good OFFLINE gps app, which caches maps directly from (alphebetical order, not quality ) bing, google, mapnik, osma, others. the really nice feature is you can build your own maps from downloaded tiles, then dump them to the sdcard and have maverick use -those- tiles for your offline viewing.
caveats:
not a turn by turn app.
not a 'navigation' app.
wp7 is stupid about usb storage, so transfering files >2Gb will be a pita.
wp7 has no pre-installed navigation, so people are -not- buying the phone with this premise (no user base)
plusses:
caching (if you ever figure out the stupid sdcard issues)
it's already mature on android
the dev is stable
cheap
if / when a non-M$ application comes out, hopefully it won't be from tomtom or garmin. if you've used those in the past, you know just how bad they are on mobiles, without data. the best i've used is Google Navigation, as it caches the route once it's selected, and then all you need is a GPS signal, no data required. THIS, is a feature all phone apps should have that deal with mapping. Are you listening microsoft ? TOMTOM ? Garmin ?
Also, if/when an app is released, subscription based application is an instant FAIL. $49 apps are a FAIL. pay-for-each-region-of-maps are a FAIL. Hopefully the app makers are paying attention this time, for the wp7 users' sake.

ohgood said:
.......
if / when a non-M$ application comes out, hopefully it won't be from tomtom or garmin. if you've used those in the past, you know just how bad they are on mobiles
Also, if/when an app is released, subscription based application is an instant FAIL. $49 apps are a FAIL. pay-for-each-region-of-maps are a FAIL. Hopefully the app makers are paying attention this time, for the wp7 users' sake.
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I've used Tomtom and Navigon for years on my cell... I love them. Granted the development hasn't as great as a stand a lone unit but for having the convenience of only having to carry around ONE unit and not having a separate unit in the car for this I think they're pretty good. I use tomtom EVERY day for work going to do estimates etc.
So, subscription based is out, 50 dollar apps are out, pay per map is out.... how are these companies supposed to make money? It's one thing for google or MS to develop a free gps app for their OWN os, its another for tomtom or something to do it and just give it away for free. I cant see why they would do that. Not a very good buisness model is it
I have no doubt when they update Bing to have full on 3d Navigation like google nav on android that's what I'll be using as my main gps.

[Q] GPS application

Hey Guys! I was just wondering. I've been using "iGo8" on my HD2 all the time. I replaced iGo over my regular GPS. Simply loving it Now, I have it on android: It's almost as good as wm version. However, I'm thinking about Windows Phone 7 OS and particularly about switching to HD7. But what's pushing me back is a GPS software. So, is there any good GPS app for WP7 like iGo8?

at present no. the closest thing is Bing Maps which only provide general directions, not turn-by-turn navigation. there are carrier based ones which have subscription fees, but from what i've seen they're mainly in the US, and hence become useless for many others.

The Gate Keeper said:
at present no. the closest thing is Bing Maps which only provide general directions, not turn-by-turn navigation. there are carrier based ones which have subscription fees, but from what i've seen they're mainly in the US, and hence become useless for many others.
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Thanks for your respond! I see now.. it's a new OS and I guess we just have to wait for good gps apps. Anyway I've been using Android for a while and I love it, however I really like the speed of WP7 which makes it look perfect.

It is possible to use Navigon with European maps if you don't mind getting more familiar with jailbreaking and sideloading. It's all happening over in the Apps section.
It'll do as a stop-gap measure until Navigon start selling the app legitimately, or someone else introduces an app (Copilot perhaps?)

wheresmybeaver said:
It'll do as a stop-gap measure until Navigon start selling the app legitimately, or someone else introduces an app (Copilot perhaps?)
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Co-Pilot this week is still saying "no" to WP7, but won't say why. Maybe the API is too restrictive for them? I thought the Nokia partnership would change their minds but hasn't appeared to.

Here you will find how to use Navigon with North America maps.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=11288801&postcount=223
Read and follow the instructions carefully, and in case you need the webserver application you can get it from this post.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=11078728&postcount=151

[Q] Any News on Navigation???

I can live without custom ringtones, bluetooth file transfer, and sideloaded apps. However turn by turn navigation is a must. I have spent 3 days trawling the net for when and if we will get a working sat nav program. Obviously Navigon Select has an option for Deutsch Telekom, as does TeleNav for T-Mob and AT&T. When will these apps appear to the buying user....nobody knows. Bing Navigation has been rumoured as a free option since WP7's release, yet there is no info beyond its release for WinMo early last year.
Anyone got any new information on SatNav for the general user, as obviously sideloading the above apps is a NoGo for NoDo!

A-to-B works for me.

Jim Coleman said:
A-to-B works for me.
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Wish it did for me, seems fine for the US, not to great in Europe

But how to build a turn by turn app if the api for the compass is not available?
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App

No news for any real GPS based navigation with maps loaded etc.
All those ones incl. A-to-B are based on mobile data so in a real life they are useless, whether you enter any worse coverage area or especially roaming.
And it doesn't look like it will change soon.

Compass API isn't necessary for turn-by-turn navigation, it can serve as an enhancement (and more so on paper than in real life).
Regarding Navigon, I've read somewhere that they have an exclusivity agreement with T-Mo Germany till summer. Don't know how reliable the source is, but the info sounds reasonable.

doministry said:
No news for any real GPS based navigation with maps loaded etc.
All those ones incl. A-to-B are based on mobile data so in a real life they are useless, whether you enter any worse coverage area or especially roaming.
And it doesn't look like it will change soon.
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The route is actually calculated at the start, so only the tiles don't download if you lose signal meaning you can actually carry on with the route.
Casey

have any of you tried "Outdoor Navigation"?
http://www.wpcentral.com/outdoor-navigation-now-offers-offline-maps
I personally haven't, but could be promising?

These programs are nice but as I said, they require internet connection to be really used so they can't be really considered as full navgation programs.
But XMaps are amazing BTW.

The only real one is Nacigon select from T-Mobile Deutschlad.
If you are the adventurous type the .xap is very probably *cough* out there somewhere. But don't be tempted it's illegal you know?
Tuts how to add non German maps (If you own them!) are in the Dev forum

**mod edit**​do not post warez links​

It was asked a while back on the windows phone radio podcast and they said that they are trying to improve bing in europe before releasing a bing maps. Now with the nokia deal, I think they are going to integrate bing and ovimaps and get something released. Probably be late this year at the earliest.

doministry said:
These programs are nice but as I said, they require internet connection to be really used so they can't be really considered as full navgation programs.
But XMaps are amazing BTW.
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If you're using A-to-B and you drive through a mobile deadzone, all that happens is the map data for that area doesn't load. You still see your planned route overlaid on blank grey terrain, and you still get your directions on-screen, the only thing is you can't see other side-roads etc.
It actually works sufficiently well. and the biggest benefit, of course, is that you don't need to purchase maps, nor provide oodles of storage on the phone for those maps, and the maps are always bang up-to-date as well.
It would be nice to have voiced directions and auto-recalc, but as it is, for a free app, A-to-B works pretty damn well, with or without a signal.

chingy213 said:
Enjoy =)
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Very good idea to link to a site well known for supporting piracy. Duh.

Jim Coleman said:
If you're using A-to-B and you drive through a mobile deadzone, all that happens is the map data for that area doesn't load. You still see your planned route overlaid on blank grey terrain, and you still get your directions on-screen, the only thing is you can't see other side-roads etc.
It actually works sufficiently well. and the biggest benefit, of course, is that you don't need to purchase maps, nor provide oodles of storage on the phone for those maps, and the maps are always bang up-to-date as well.
It would be nice to have voiced directions and auto-recalc, but as it is, for a free app, A-to-B works pretty damn well, with or without a signal.
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Yes as for free app and lack of possibilities on WP7 it's quite OK. Those guys do a great job.

Silver Navigator

Appears to be the first WP7 app with voice navigation (just included in the new update). Has anyone tried it out after this new update? I'm wondering how good it is.
I'm also wondering if anyone knows what kind of approximate rate charges are involved with the use of this or other similar GPS apps (ex. 10Mb per hour).

cgibsong002 said:
Has anyone tried it out after this new update? I'm wondering how good it is.
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It can't be good by default: it uses your 3G data connection and Bing maps so it slow, inaccurate and pricey (if you exceed your data plan).
BTW, any (including most wanted to hack Navigon) currently existing WP7 gps apps a complete BS even compared with cheapest $30 standalone auto gps. My suggestion: don't try to use any of 'em in big city (like a Boston), all of 'em bad and can cost you a troubles.
So, WP7 still doesn't have gps solution at all Damn MS with closed sources & API's...

Closed Sources have nothing to do with this, and the APIs aren't closed. They just either don't exist or are hidden so deeply that developers cannot access them (Microsoft does use Native Code for much of WP7, even though 3rd party developers can not).
Also, Bing is fine in a big city like Chicago. I know because I went there with my WM6.5 device a while back and the voice nav was very much on point. Stop spreading FUD. Bing has holes in other countries, but in the US is quite good...

FYI, I'm not flooding but just publish my own impressions based on my own real experience. I've especially tried all existing solutions working in Boston (last attempt was yesterday, riding to Somerville). All these applications working very bad: no construction info at all, wrong routes, bad accuracy, awful UI. Navigon shows a little better result but still no comparison with my TomTom XL 335SE (costs me a $29.99 + tax on huge local sale) at all!
I don't know which criteria is "fine" for you (may be it's just "Oh my God, it works and showing something on map!") but it's absolutely not affordable for me (I do have an experience and example to compare).

sensboston said:
It can't be good by default: it uses your 3G data connection and Bing maps so it slow, inaccurate and pricey (if you exceed your data plan).
BTW, any (including most wanted to hack Navigon) currently existing WP7 gps apps a complete BS even compared with cheapest $30 standalone auto gps. My suggestion: don't try to use any of 'em in big city (like a Boston), all of 'em bad and can cost you a troubles.
So, WP7 still doesn't have gps solution at all Damn MS with closed sources & API's...
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1) You haven't even tried the app suggested by OP. Please don't pass judgement. I am sure developer is doing his best. Try it... if you still don't like it.. fair enough.
2) I will beg to differ about bing being inaccurate than likes of google. Navteq maps have always worked much better than teleatlas in US.
3) APIs are there and more are APIs are coming with Mango. Open or closed source has nothing to do with it.

I use A&B . But I did give this nav app a try. On the trial it only sets routes within a 4 mile radious but thats because it's the trial. Now indicators for speed and sistance sits on the top on map and it's rather small and hard to see at a glance. Where as on A&B it's on the side and much larger and easyer to see at the glance.
The maps about the same. as A&B overall the interface UI on A&B is much better. it's really a shame that WP7 does not have a full blown Nav app. I would much rather be able to download the maps and have it always on route even when I'm out of range of towers.

cgibsong002 said:
Appears to be the first WP7 app with voice navigation (just included in the new update). Has anyone tried it out after this new update? I'm wondering how good it is.
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Forget it. It's based on Bing Maps, so totally crap and inaccurate anyway (except if you live in the US).

arkavat said:
1) You haven't even tried the app suggested by OP. Please don't pass judgement. I am sure developer is doing his best. Try it... if you still don't like it.. fair enough.
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Did you read my post above? Seems like not. I don't judge anyone either, just posted my own opinion.

Nothing wrong with this application. No mapping software has 100% map accuracy, always takes time to update maps. Within the trial limitations I found the journey I planned was accurate with routing and location, but could improve the featureset.
Not sure there's too much to complain about for $3 and obviously anyone not on an unlimited data plan shouldnt be looking at offline navigation applications.

Thanks guys. I agree and I have a Garmin. I'm very upset that there's no map based GPS's out as of now, since I'm on a limited data plan. I was just curious. If it was a really good app, it might be worth to use in the event that I need it in an emergency. If it's no better than A-B though, why bother. Thanks for the input guys.

Message from the developer
Hi guys,
I´m the developer of Silver Navigator. Thanks a lot for your comments.
Any question or suggestion is really welcome.
SN do not pretend to be a perfect replacement for full GPS navigation devices like TomTom, etc, but I think for the price it´s a very useful option, when no TomTom is available.
In addition to that, it´s able to calculate your aprox. position from cell tower triangulation, pretty useful when no GPS reception is available. I´m also already adapting it to Mango (next release of Windows Phone), which will include digital compass and a much more precise calculation of position and orientation. It works perfectly, and it´s particularly useful for navigation when walking, as you don´t need to move to know what direction you are headed.
Later this week, I´m releasing v 1.2, which includes many more improvements. Among others:
Local Searches (business, shops, etc), improved user interface, "clear route" function included, improved GPS accuracy, voices volume increased, etc.
You can follow SN progress at Facebook. Just search for "Silver Navigator".
Thanks !!!!

Needs orientation via the compass, ie like tomtom, google nav, in order to be useful while driving.
As it is its unusable while in a car unfortunately.

GraphicDNA said:
In addition to that, it´s able to calculate your aprox. position from cell tower triangulation, pretty useful when no GPS reception is available.
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How about "no cell tower reception" (for me it's happened much more frequently; GPS signal is available everywhere except downtowns with skyscrapers)? And did you tested your app with cell tower triangulation in places like a downtowns of big cities?

I just tried it this morning (Birmingham UK)
I have a good data connection but the map downloading is way too slow to be used for driving. All I had was a yellow arrow against a blurry background.
It could really do with being able to cache map data possibly via WiFi before you set off to avoid these issues.
Also the screen was North up instead of being track up and the unfortunately the quality of the speech/instructions was very poor.
But it does work and apart from buying Navigon this is the only other real sat nav application for WP7. I have seen posts for A-to-B but you cant download from the marketplace so hopefully it will improve.

It seems that when mango is released that more turn-by-turn apps will come out.

Nice
I have used this for a month now and like it. I suggest that the triangle indicating the cars position point in the direction and orientation of the phone, and that there be an option for the display to point either north or in the direction of travel. Just a suggestion to improve an already good application.

This really does look to be one of the better nav programs available right now. I'd by this if it had support for 3d view much like tomtom, navigon, magellen etc. A - B had this and it was by far the best angle to get directions in when driving.
Any plans on adding this feature and if so is there a timeline?

Can I be really picky and ask for a slicker looking tile?

@ GraphicDNA
Very nice work..!
will do you a view 3D with this program of style A to B..?
maybe a multilanguage too..?

Just heard from the developers of Drive on.... they arent implementing the 3D driving mode for at least 4 months... here's hoping Silver Nav gets it WAY sooner!

Finally! I voice guided nav - NavFone

Guys, I just saw this in Zune software. NavFone by Bali. The description says it's a voice guided navigation app for WP7 devices.
http://www.marketplacebrowser.com/291557/navfone-bali-gps

MartyLK said:
Guys, I just saw this in Zune software. NavFone by Bali. The description says it's a voice guided navigation app for WP7 devices.
http://www.marketplacebrowser.com/291557/navfone-bali-gps
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I use Navi Ninasus for voice guided navigation. Maybe it's not available outside of Germany.

Not available in the UK.

MartyLK said:
Guys, I just saw this in Zune software. NavFone by Bali. The description says it's a voice guided navigation app for WP7 devices.
http://www.marketplacebrowser.com/291557/navfone-bali-gps
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Not available in Australia... and in description it says its for Bali.
But it surely prove the implementation of voice guided navigation.....

What about silver navigator? Voice turn by turn navigator.
Sent from my OMNIA7 using Board Express

rajivshahi said:
Not available in Australia... and in description it says its for Bali.
But it surely prove the implementation of voice guided navigation.....
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Hehe...I thought that was the brand name. I need to get out and see the world someday.

Until they can fully multi-task I don't see them being that good. I tried the other one after I seen something about it on Twitter, and I just can't deal with it unless it can multi task and pop up when you need to do something on screen in voice with a Toast-Like notification (think the Zune Controls when the phone is locked).

SilverNavigator shows promise. All it needs is local business search and voice input for searching and I think it would be great.

anyone else find this interesting? somewhere down the line microsoft is going to bring out navigation for bing maps like in 6.5 for free right?
in the meantime private developers can make some money by providing apps that fill in those feature gaps. (don't get me wrong, I'm willing to pay, i need a navigation app asap).
I was just wondering if any of you thought it was microsoft giving those folks a bone or their software is just not prepared at all and they're like oh dang we're too slow everyone else is making apps...

gkoonjul said:
anyone else find this interesting? somewhere down the line microsoft is going to bring out navigation for bing maps like in 6.5 for free right?
in the meantime private developers can make some money by providing apps that fill in those feature gaps. (don't get me wrong, I'm willing to pay, i need a navigation app asap).
I was just wondering if any of you thought it was microsoft giving those folks a bone or their software is just not prepared at all and they're like oh dang we're too slow everyone else is making apps...
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With MS, nothing is sure. I'm of the mind to think they just aren't smart enough to do it. But any number of scenarios could be true. However, from all I've understood of MS, deception is certainly high on the list. MS isn't a consumer oriented company and they don't seem to know how to deal with the public to make them happy. Personally, I believe this ethic will cost them again like it has with Zune and WinMo. I figure stuff like free Bing nav in WinMo 6.5 was a last ditch effort to try to stave off the bleeding. I believe if MS could take your money and give you nothing in return, that is their highest business goal.

I couldn't have imagined that Microsoft would launch WP7 without any GPS app available at launch.
Turn-by-turn is an essential feature on a smartphone.
MS have been working for 2 years on WP7. I thought they would work hand in hand with a major GPS software developer. But no. Nothing.
More than 6 months after launch there is still nothing. Navigon is not available in my country, Google Maps is not available, Tom Tom is not interested in WP7... and I can't stand Bing Maps which is unusuable.

arturobandini said:
I couldn't have imagined that Microsoft would launch WP7 without any GPS app available at launch.
Turn-by-turn is an essential feature on a smartphone.
MS have been working for 2 years on WP7. I thought they would work hand in hand with a major GPS software developer. But no. Nothing.
More than 6 months after launch there is still nothing. Navigon is not available in my country, Google Maps is not available, Tom Tom is not interested in WP7... and I can't stand Bing Maps which is unusuable.
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I think that is a little bit of an over-reaction. To my knowledge, the only smartphone with a bult in turn-by-turn app is Android (wich technicaly is a free downloadable app, not built in). The free app for WM6.5 only worked on phones with the correct resolution display (still doesn't work on my Vogue).
Although I don't like Bing as much as I did google maps, it actualy works fairly well.
I think the biggest issue is multi-tasking. How can you run a Turn-by-Turn app, then after answering the phone, the app has to re-load.

arturobandini said:
Navigon is not available in my country, Google Maps is not available, Tom Tom is not interested in WP7... and I can't stand Bing Maps which is unusuable.
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I have been testing Navigon in France since two weeks.
The software is basic, but it does the job.
All you need to do to make it work you will find in this forum. For the files... Google will be your friend.

Higherflight said:
I have been testing Navigon in France since two weeks.
The software is basic, but it does the job.
All you need to do to make it work you will find in this forum. For the files... Google will be your friend.
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Thank you very much for the help.
If only Bing Map could be as efficient.... : http://youtu.be/8UT0wJ1Go7A
I just discovered it, and I am amazed. Maybe I chose the wrong OS

arturobandini said:
Thank you very much for the help.
If only Bing Map could be as efficient.... : http://youtu.be/8UT0wJ1Go7A
I just discovered it, and I am amazed. Maybe I chose the wrong OS
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Your call. Bing Maps won't be the solution, I strongly doubt that.
LE: I stand corrected, MS is at it, apparently they're looking into it
Microsoft already announced its partnership with Nokia and Ovi maps are okish (something to read here)
As for the Google Maps... needs Android. And for that, ask yourself: do you think it's perfectly ok for someone else to know everything you've done, browsed, phoned, texted, etc? Also to be able to control what apps you install, eventually block or uninstall them remotely without your interaction? Not for me...
Personally I've used both TomTom and iGo, and I prefer the later. Hopefully one of these solutions will be here for WP7. One can dream
Btw, there is a thread here about Navigon on HD2 WP7

Thanks a lot EnderPsp