Develop Bugs

[Q] Difference between SHIP S-OFF & ENG S-OFF

Hi There,
I wish to flash a radio update. Currently I have ENG S-OFF. I did run the One Click Radio S-OFF tool. It succeeded. It still says ENG S-OFF. not Radio S-OFF or something. Can I still flash a radio?
Thanks in advance.
greetz, Haru

Hi,
If you flashed ENG HBOOT then that will still remain. Check your CID, Power off, Power On + Volume Down, System Info. If CID has a load of 1's, your good to go. If it says HTC_...... then the easy radio S-OFF didn't work.

andyharney said:
Hi,
If you flashed ENG HBOOT then that will still remain. Check your CID, Power off, Power On + Volume Down, System Info. If CID has a load of 1's, your good to go. If it says HTC_...... then the easy radio S-OFF didn't work.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the Info!!!!

No problem. I take it your are Radio S-OFF?

Hi,
I wasn't aware of ENG S-OFF but I already did Radio S-OFF with this (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=857537). Installed Visionary+ and gain permanent root (check in terminal with 'su'). I'm just wondering I can do ENG S-OFF. I like to flash Revolution ROM. I have the earliest Radio version and I like to update one of the two radio version as recommended by Revolution ROM. Please advise.
HTC Desire HD Stock ROM perm-rooted.

You can do ENG S-OFF using my tool, check link in my signature

ehhm... the topic says "difference between ship/eng s-off" .. so whats the difference? strange thread, topic not matching with content. plz tell me the difference!

Schneizel said:
ehhm... the topic says "difference between ship/eng s-off" .. so whats the difference? strange thread, topic not matching with content. plz tell me the difference!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you read the OP you will see what they were trying to ask. Not everyone that uses these forums has English as there first language, you're question therefore could be taken offensively.
Your question is also therefore off topic but I do concede that plenty of people will find this thread looking for the same information that you ask for.
With that in mind and put simply...
Radio S-OFF is a way of switching of a security feature that allows you to flash radio's not meant for your ROM or network.
ENG S-OFF is a replacement HBOOT (ENGineering) allowing you to flash different ROM's and Kernels. And provides a means to rescue the phone from a lot of "almost bricked" states.
For more detailed answer please search as there are dozens of threads already about this.

Mr_JMM said:
If you read the OP you will see what they were trying to ask.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Strange, I would recommend to read the author to get what is it all about, not the interpretator (who got it the way he liked answering the real problem, not the topic question, but read further for explanation).
Mr_JMM said:
Not everyone that uses these forums has English as there first language, you're question therefore could be taken offensively.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What do you see improper in his question meaning english knowing? I dont get it at all, maybe coz I'm polish. I understand either the topic and the first post.
Mr_JMM said:
Your question is also therefore off topic
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As far as I can see (and I still can see even if my eyes are so tired programming...), his question covers the topic much more than the authors question or any answer but yours.
And as I promised - back to the topic and some explanations:
Mr_JMM said:
With that in mind and put simply...
Radio S-OFF is a way of switching of a security feature that allows you to flash radio's not meant for your ROM or network.
ENG S-OFF is a replacement HBOOT (ENGineering) allowing you to flash different ROM's and Kernels. And provides a means to rescue the phone from a lot of "almost bricked" states.
For more detailed answer please search as there are dozens of threads already about this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think this answer is too simple to get the difference usable in any way. As far as I wasted two weeks to get the knowledge how and with what I do want do modify my phone, I still do not get this difference enough to say that I want ENG S-OFF or not. The author of this topic would answer to himself too if this would be clear enough. And no, there is no definitive description easily found by google when you use "difference eng s-off radio s-off" terms. First match links to this thread which is a mislead, and other won;t even link to XDA but still, no definitive clear answer.
It would be nice to have this answer here considering a fact that google "thinks" it should be here.
And thats why I argued with your opinion of being off-topic (and yes, I see that the guy was lil irritated but it has nothing to do with being off topic I assume).
So now, I kindly ask that anyone could write detailed description. For example which "almost bricked states" can be repaired (what actions could be done to cause those states too), what ROMs won't flash using only Radio S-OFF (since I've read that ROM Manager _will_ work without Eng S-OFF), why kernels could not be updated if ROMs can (or why I've found misleading information that ROMs can), and so on. As far as I've read, Radio S-OFF is a flag which HBOOT reads and sees that it should allow changes, and Eng S-OFF is a patch to HBOOT not to read this flag and just assume that it should allow changes so it should be basically almost the same thing, but I can imagine that at the early stages of booting it can matter. So... it's still a quite black magic for a noob as me even if I know what is happening coz I do not know the consequences not knowing the system (even if I'm a linux programmer).
So, I would be very happy to see answer here instead of complaining . Or at least a links to posts which will cover this topic really clearly, coz I could not find one.
PS. And sorry for advising while being noob, but as it seems, noobs are the group which needs such information and help, so I've put some effort to describe why it is important to answer real topic question... I hope it won't be considered as rude

Radio s-off: a security flag that allows/rejects you to write things permanently into the NAND. Also grants you the so called super-cid.
Eng hboot (eng s-off): an engineering bootloader with more funktions than the stock one (fastboot commands in our case)
If you look at the first line at the bootloader:
ace pvt ship s-on
Ship means stock hboot. If it says eng instead, you have an engineering hboot
S-on/off is only for the radio.
If you have radio s-off but shipped hboot it will say
Ace pvt ship s-off
Sent out of my Free Candy Van.

Flussen said:
Radio s-off: a security flag that allows/rejects you to write things permanently into the NAND. Also grants you the so called super-cid.
Eng hboot (eng s-off): an engineering bootloader with more funktions than the stock one (fastboot commands in our case)
If you look at the first line at the bootloader:
ace pvt ship s-on
Ship means stock hboot. If it says eng instead, you have an engineering hboot
S-on/off is only for the radio.
If you have radio s-off but shipped hboot it will say
Ace pvt ship s-off
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i see, so the difference between ship and eng is that eng has more functions - thanks

Yep, and it allows you to do more. For example it allows you to flash images in fastboot (like a radio or splash).
Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk

jkoljo said:
Yep, and it allows you to do more. For example it allows you to flash images in fastboot (like a radio or splash).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yup, thats what I supposed talking about "bricked states", but still... What is the difference for the user which does not harm his phone? I mean for example your kernel update tool (why doesn't it work on radio s-off? only reason is that it uses fastboot or is there other problem?)
If this all is only about a fastboot then it's obvious that Eng S-OFF is completely useless for normal user. Kernel can be upgraded in many ways - it's just a more work for tool developer (like ClockworkMod flashing for example). Am I right?
By the way, why can't "we" produce RUU or OTA or any other (if exists) updates like HTC or Google just to be downloaded and flashed - in the meaning of modded androids of course? Why not just omit S-ON like google does? Is it only a problem of cracking the place which will allow to download updates from for example different IP? We have root so... in theory it's just a matter of a good cracker job... (but this one is now not quite for this topic, i just winded up myself, sorry )

good thread guys i started one of these of my own in the sensation Q&A.
Im wondering if these eng s-off links for DHD will work for my sensation. Eng s-off seems to be the hot topic lately im trying to broaden my horizon in Customizing my device. thanks again for the info on the differences.

I downloaded the new version of Android Revolution Rom for my incredible S a few hours ago. It was also recommanded to update my radio to use with this custom ROM. It was written in help file of radio:
"Your phone must be ENG S-OFF. Radio S-OFF is also highly recommended."
If ENG S-OFF provides more functionality, why radio s-off is also highly recommanded? Or maybe radio s-off does'nt have anything to do with eng s-off. In my bootloader, it is written ship s-off and I am still confused if I can flash the radio or not. and still mixed up by the differences!

ENG S-off & RADIO S-off

I'm just confused... I'm new to Android and i was just wondering if ENG S-off is the same as Radio S-off... my phone is currently Rooted and have ENG S-off do i need to the One click radio S-off? -noob- here

I am with the same condition as you and asked a similar question here and here is the answer :
jkoljo said:
Yes that is right, you need to use this tool (or script methods in forum) if you want to flash using kernel update utility.
Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So for Kernel flashing or similar issues, yes we need extra ENG S-Off which I would recommed you to use the tool on the link above If you are a newbie like me.

eozen81 said:
I am with the same condition as you and asked a similar question here and here is the answer :
So for Kernel flashing or similar issues, yes we need extra ENG S-Off which I would recommed you to use the tool on the link above If you are a newbie like me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you meant to say we need the extra radio s-off, not eng s-off. Just to avoid any confusion.

I´ve got the same problem. I don´t realy know the difference between ENG S-Off and SHIP S-Off.
I have have ROOT and ENG S-Off, but after I run Easy-RADIO-S-Off everythimg is the same like before.
Is there maybe another way to get Radio-S-Off?
For my ENG S-Off, I´ve made a step by step way with the terminal Emulator.
I need your Help

If you do Radio S-OFF on top of ENG S-OFF, nothing else is supposed to change but bootloader>system info CID. If you did full Radio S-OFF, which contains SuperCID and SimUnlock, the CID should be 11111111.
The differences of both S-OFFs:
- Radio S-OFF is more permanent, safer
- ENG S-OFF allows to use fastboot commands, such as fastboot flash radio
- Radio S-OFF (with SuperCID) allows downgrading from anything, it disables device version checking. If HTC has "banned" a certain downgrade from one version to the other, Radio S-OFF allows it.

@jkoljo
thx for your reply
I still have root and ENG S-Off. How can I get Radio S-Off and SuperCID too?
I´ve searched in the forum up and down. It seems that the Easy-Radio-S-Off Tool doesn´t work... ? Do you have another way for me?

Didn't the CID change (bootloader system info)? Because nothing else is supposed to change in the bootloader after you run the tool. Check Radio S-OFF tool troubleshooting. There is also a manual method posted by Apache, which uses older unlock code version than my tool.

jkoljo said:
If you do Radio S-OFF on top of ENG S-OFF, nothing else is supposed to change but bootloader>system info CID. If you did full Radio S-OFF, which contains SuperCID and SimUnlock, the CID should be 11111111.
The differences of both S-OFFs:
- Radio S-OFF is more permanent, safer
- ENG S-OFF allows to use fastboot commands, such as fastboot flash radio
- Radio S-OFF (with SuperCID) allows downgrading from anything, it disables device version checking. If HTC has "banned" a certain downgrade from one version to the other, Radio S-OFF allows it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this explains everything... thnx so much for the reply... mind my ignorance... xD

SEW580 said:
@jkoljo
thx for your reply
I still have root and ENG S-Off. How can I get Radio S-Off and SuperCID too?
I´ve searched in the forum up and down. It seems that the Easy-Radio-S-Off Tool doesn´t work... ? Do you have another way for me?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi SEW580,
I had the same problem, apeared to be the wrong option/choice I made when I used te tool. you have to use the FIRST option ("Radio S-OFF, Super-CID an Sim Unlock"), this worked for me.
Let me know if it also did for you...
Jan

I would 100% get radio s-off. That way if Htc screw you over with an update which breaks root you aren't stranded.

jverven said:
Hi SEW580,
I had the same problem, apeared to be the wrong option/choice I made when I used te tool. you have to use the FIRST option ("Radio S-OFF, Super-CID an Sim Unlock"), this worked for me.
Let me know if it also did for you...
Jan
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Tool is great, but it doesn´t work at mine. I tryed every option from first to last. I´ve got SU, Root and ENG S-OFF. I did everything whats needed. I run the Tool, it asked for permission, I confirm, it finished succesful, but nothing changes - no Radio S-Off or SuperCID :-(

Please try the 2.2 version, it tells you what went wrong.
By the way if you have a new radio in your phone, you have to downgrade first before running the tool.

jkoljo said:
Please try the 2.2 version, it tells you what went wrong.
By the way if you have a new radio in your phone, you have to downgrade first before running the tool.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, its done. After i´ve downgraded the RADIO, I used Version 2.2 and it works.
I´´m the proud Owner of a SuperCID

cool.....................

Can't flash radio

Hi everyone,
I'm using leedroid rom and it's very nice of him to produce such an excellent rom.
After flashing rom, I continued to flash "radio 12.54.60.25_26.09.04.11_M2" as he recommended.
I just wondered how to flash this radio version.
Please help!

Head to my site, into Radios, then Radio Flasher Packaged. You will see that radio version.
Download that, unzip & run. It will guide you through the whole process.

I would like to say thank you to what you have provided.
I followed your steps then checked my radio version on Bootloader screen. The results are as follow:
"ACE PVT SHIP S-OFF
HBOOT - 0.85.0007
........
RADIO-26.03.02.26_M"
That means Radio version is still the same.
someone says that I have to do the two work simultaneously: eng S-Off and Ship S-Off.
What exactly do I have to do?

Search for 'one click eng s-off' and use the tool
Once thats done you'll be able to flash a new radio via fastboot

Also, don't post your question twice.
Use the search function too. If you did, you'd know you had to have S-OFF.
Closed.

[Q] Radio flashing problem!!!

Hello
I am using ARHD 6.1.2 and i have a radio flashing problem.
I start the cmd and write "adb reboot bootloader" and when it is in bootloader i type "fastboot flash radio radio.img"
then it starts to flash. Everything is okay before the writing part starts. It says FAILED Remote: not allowed
Radio is 12.62.60.27_26.13.04.19_M.
What should i do?
When i go to the bootloader it says ACE PVT SHIP S-OFF, so that means i have radio s-off anfd eng s-off?
please help me!

I believe this means that you don't have ENG S-OFF. I flashed that same radio yesterday with the same method and it worked fine.

thank U very much.
My friend told me wrong then.
So i downloaded the eng s-off tool and everything went fine.

Hi How do u get the S-OFF tool to work on ARHD6.1.2/3 ?
I tried and it says "Incompatible kernel"

best way to flash without ENG OFF IS TO DOWNLOAD THE RADIO FILES IN "PD98IMG.ZIP" format (search the forum for them) place them in root folder of sd card power off the phone then holding vol down and power key enter the bootloader the device automatically prompts for radio update press vol up button voila you are done. most important is you make sure you checksum the file after you copy to to sd card...

Thanks tommy , i tried that and it worked.
Just curious, is there any way to get Eng Bootloader and Radio S-Off once I am on AR HD 6.1.3? Those tools seems to only work on the stock rom.

zereox said:
Thanks tommy , i tried that and it worked.
Just curious, is there any way to get Eng Bootloader and Radio S-Off once I am on AR HD 6.1.3? Those tools seems to only work on the stock rom.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this method worked for me
i ran the tool as administrator on windows 7, clicked "I have radio s-off" (which you must already have since you have a custom rom on your phone) then clicked "s-off it!" and it was done.
read the thread thoroughly before trying, YMMV

Ah thanks maatsby! Guess all i needed to do was tick the checkbox.
My bad for not reading the requirements clearly.

[Q] Alpharev and Revolutionary

Hi all,
I have a couple of questions, I'm trying to understand Revolutionary and Alpharev. First of all, the revolutionary flashes a new bootloader which is S-OFF right, or isn't the secureflag in the bootloader?
On alpharev.nl I read that if you are already S-OFF you can flash a new HBOOT (which is the same as a bootloader right?) right away. But with alpharev you can first S-OFF your phone. This is confusing to me, the way I interpret it is: First you flash a new bootloader with the instructions including the livecd etcetera, and next, you flash another unlocked bootloader to your phone optimized for your ROM. So you flash two bootloaders after eachother, the first being necessesary to S-OFF, but in theory you could use the live cd to flash the right bootloader right away the first time?
My main question:
Can I S-OFF with revolutionary (for it being much easier) and then use a HBOOT from alpharev without a risk of those two possibly interferring in a bad way with eachother?

quick answer: yes
alpharev and revolutionary both achieve s-off (just check you meet the requirements), which is basically disabling NAND security
alpharev is just older, you are right to choose revolutionary as it is newer and easier.
the hboots you flash from alpharev are partition tables, flash them depending on custom rom requirements (needs to fit in system partition)

Yes, thank you for that reply I needed that