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Just out of curiosity, how many of you are holding out on buying a new WP7 phone until 2nd generation? I know for the average user, these specs may seem amazing, but for the advanced/techy users, it seems under-powered.This is especially because they're using a 2 year old CPU when a more recent one that has better 3d performance and battery life is out in the market.
I, for one, will be holding on to my Touch Pro until 2nd generation WP7 comes out. Anyone have any idea when that will be?
would like to hold out, but the problem here is my touch pro's backspace, space, 1, tab, and fn key has basically died out on me
You should use the swype keyboard. I never went back to the physical keyboard once I started using swype.
tried it
don't really like it
i still prefer physical keys though
but yah, i'm looking to get the venue pro. but it seems to look like the tp's keyboard, and frankly, i do dread it a little
If i had a decent phone today i would wait for second gen, but i'm on an HTC Magic now, running Android 2.1 and everything is soooooooo slow i feel like throwing the phone into the wall. Can hardly scroll on this forum on the phone because it's so laggy.
Have set my eyes on an HTC Mozart.
I'll definitely be waiting for the 2nd gen. All the phones looks pretty ugly IMO, not to mention the old processors....and the AT&T selection sucks.
I'd like to wait, but my Fuze is on life support. As much as I would like for the specs to be better for this first gen of WP7 phones, they handily beat the Iphones specs and most WM phones. I am buying a gen one knowing that I will be buying a gen two next summer. I am considering my gen one as a 'get aquainted' with the OS phone while I hold out for a stunner in '11.
http://designfabulous.blogspot.com/2010/07/htc-1.html
Well, we can dream. HTC just needs to hire this guy.
I think people that hold out aren't as tech savvy sad they think.
Understand that android is optimized to run on various hardware specs. While windows phone 7 was designed for this specific hardware.
The same spec phone running both operating systems won't be comparible. The overall speed of wp7, the quality of the apps, and the games will be superior to android even after the dual core phones release.
The only thing that could bump the android back up is strong min specs of the new version of the OS and market apps that are only available to phones with those specs. Developers need to also commit to designing apps for a very small market of those top-of-the-line phones.
Those are the reasons why my rooted nexus one, car dock, and desktop dock will be on ebay within a month.
I love android, but I am always excite to test new things. After all, one could always ebay the phone and buy another extremely easily. I don't see any reason not to try wp7 unless you are locked into a contract and unwilling to buy an unsubsidized phone.
Nah I'm gonna get the HD7 as soon as my contract expires in late spring. Currently have the Moto Cliq with Android. If MS makes a Zune HD2, than I might think about getting a 64gb version of that and get the latest and greatest Android phone, Iphone, or Palm Phone.
Definitely not digging android anymore;
*sluggish, having to constantly kill apps and restart the phone
*Multiple OS fragmentation means I missing out on a lot of apps
*No app quality control (sick of buying an app thats sluggish or just plain buggy)
*No Easy Desktop Sync like Itunes or Zune
*NO AUTOMATICALLY UPDATING MUSIC PLAYLIST - A biggy for me.
Also I have a zune pass and hate having to convert my music just because Android doesn't play WMA DRM.
WP7 minimum specs aren't all that, but better than the minimum of Android which is still 528mhz processor for Android 2.1
The little angel sitting on the right shoulder is saying "Wait, wait!"
The little devil sitting on the left shoulder is saying "Get it, what are you afraid of? Offline Outlook Sync?"
Oh it is so hard!
But on a serious note, as soon as I am sure that it will Sync with Offline Outlook or I have a non cloud solution that I can trust, I will get it.
There isn't going to be an ideal phone for me in the first wave, but I'm gonna get one soon. Ideally I want the Dell Venue Pro but with Super AMOLED instead of AMOLED, and a MSM8255 SoC instead of the QSD8250's. But besides that, I think I will be happy with the Dell. "Dude, you're getting a Dell"
Also I really want WP7 to succeed. So in order to get a phone those next 2nd Gen phones with the Dual Cores and 32GB of memory, that means the 1st gen's need to succeed. So I'm gonna buy one to support my long term goals.
the QSD8250 has still more than enough horsepower to be used today. don't just look at what speeds and GPU does a processor holds but also take into the fact how well the OS utilizes the processor.
IMO its best to get the first wave. By the time the second wave hits (say this time next year), none of the apps/games will be fully utilising the power of the new processors anyway (since majority of WP7 handsets would have the QSD cpu and that'd be where the money for devs is). So you'll have all this power yet nothing to make use of it (basically like the Galaxy S). It'll take about 6 months imo til games start utilising the newer processors and run somewhat subpar on first gen devices.
So IMO that gives first-devices from launch about 18months of excellent performance, before it starts feeling 'old in the tooth'. By the time first gen buyers upgrade in approx. 24months, there'd be the third generation CPU's hitting the streets, and that'd be able to run second gen apps with ease, and the whole cycle starts again.
I'm definitely waiting until this gets jail broken. And if Htc comes out with a slide out keyboard for it. Not enough good phone options for me. When phones similar to the tilts come back wp7 has got my full attention then.
At the moment, I just can't justify giving up my HD2.
It'd be amazing if WP7 gets ported to the HD2 and I will, for sure, boot it up. I'm sceptical about some aspects of WP7 and so would like to see what impact (if any) these aspects have on my day-to-day usage.
If all goes well, then I will consider a WP7 device early next year. Hopefully, by then we'll have had a round of updates for stability issues (inevitable) and some missing features added.
So, in short, I think I'll hold out till wave 2 (or at least until the OS has settled a bit).
Casey
diego1985 said:
I'm definitely waiting until this gets jail broken. And if Htc comes out with a slide out keyboard for it. Not enough good phone options for me. When phones similar to the tilts come back wp7 has got my full attention then.
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Click to collapse
then you should wait for the htc 7 pro this looks amazing and i don't think it will be long before someone jailbreaks it.
Both
Gonna get the new WP7 phone out of the gate, for sure. Then I'll be in a great position to sit back and wait for a 'dream device,' which I'm not sure will make it out before the holidays next year. If it does, I'll get it, but if not I'll have gotten my money's worth with the phone I'm going to get shortly.
I have no choice but to wait. I am on Sprint, so I can't even begin to think about getting one until they release theirs. And "sometime in 1st half of 2011" is pretty vague. So for now, I have to sit back and read about everyone's experience.
So hopefully, I will be reading good reviews.
lumpaywk said:
then you should wait for the htc 7 pro this looks amazing and i don't think it will be long before someone jailbreaks it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Microsoft updates WP7 so any exploits will be patched in record time.
You can prolly refuse the OTA, but it can suck if that fix is bundled with a fix/enhancement you need...
Clear ur jailbreak and get copy and paste, or go without? Lol...
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
powersquad said:
the QSD8250 has still more than enough horsepower to be used today. don't just look at what speeds and GPU does a processor holds but also take into the fact how well the OS utilizes the processor.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a truth with some modifications. Yes, the 8250 is more than powerful enough to run the OS and any games/apps released for it - it is however not powerful enough to playback [most] HD video and this is the reason why I'm disappointed by the current wave of devices.
I have terabyte upon terabyte of [mostly] HD video stored on my server which I am unable to view on the phone without re-encoding them. This is a process I go thru at the moment with my HD2 and I was really looking forward to a little more horsepower in WP7 devices so I could simply import then rather than spend a lot of time re-encoding them first.
Personally, I have to get a 1st wave device for development purposes, but I very much doubt it will replace my current HD2 or Evo as the day to day phone. Not only for reasons of hardware but also due to lack of services offered locally (no localized bing search, no XBL integration, no 'full' marketplace, no Zune pass and the list goes on).
Its this Windows better than other mobile OS?
Why?
Why I have to choose Win phone 7 instead of Android?
Can some one tell me please?
thanks
For me, one sentence will answer all...because we want to try something new and fresh.
However,the usability and satisfaction towards the OS or device are depends on your personal preference.
IMHO, I'm not really satisfied with this new OS,it is still in premature stage.
Much better user experience than WM and Android. More restrictions than both though, but most people aren't affected by this.
WP7 is smooth, clean and simple. It's generally very fast and elegant in operation. But right now it has bugs...at least for the pre-nodo devices. It currently lacks the higher-end hardware associated with the latest Androids and the iPhone, such as no front camera or dual-cpu. It doesn't use a plug & play expandable memory card...though you can expand the system memory with a little complexity on some devices...without voiding the warranty.
MO, its nice and fast with good apps. Big and easy to the eyes fonts.
But the weak point it gave you the feeling the phone is tied down as if you rent instead of owning it e.g. cant transfer documents to pc(not everyone have sharepoint),
no backups on anything(apps with user data or sms..anything) shud the phone needs to be reset or repaired.
If you are a patience type, then waiting for updates will not be an issue for you.
DatDereX1 said:
Much better user experience than WM and Android. More restrictions than both though, but most people aren't affected by this.
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Click to collapse
Well, if you're going to confuse User INTERFACE with User EXPERIENCE, than your post is correct. Unfortunately, you are confused. The Experience goes beyond the interface. I'm not going to put my huge list in yet another thread. I'll leave it at that.
@ OP:
In the end it depends on your requirements and how you use your phone. The way I'd rank them, depending on what you need most:
Phone/Battery Life: Nokia (Symbian) > Blackberry
Media: WP7 > iOS (Phones with Bigger Screens, Zune Pass/Zune, etc.)
Gaming: iOS > WP7 > Android (Too many Android games are of terrible quality/bug-riddled).
Browsing: Android > iOS (More Browser Choices, bigger screens, 4G devices, etc.)
Communication (SMS/MMS/IM/eMail and Business Communications): Symbian > Blackberry > Android (WP7 would be in last place here, IMO)
Business User: Windows Mobile > Symbian > Blackberry (BB loses points due to needing BES for decent Exchange support - WM gains points for supporting every Exchange Policy and having Office Mobile 2010)
If having Voice Nav is a huge thing than Android > Symbian > Windows Mobile
If you're an Appaholic: iOS > Android > Blackberry
Since I know where you're probably (even if secretly) coming from, I'll just cut to the chase here... WP7 isn't as good as Android. The User Interface is better and it performs better in many cases (this is device dependent, to a large degree), but the level of services integration in addition to the functionality drop-off going from Windows Mobile to Windows Phone 7 is just not good when compared to other platforms. Microsoft failed to capitalize on their Windows Live services with WP7 (billed as a consumer device) and then they failed harder by locking down the platform so tight that the development community can't even help them close these gaps.
WP7 is a necessary step forward for Microsoft, but the platform is Beta in functionality and Release Candidate in User Experience. From what has been coming out of Microsoft, it also seems like nothing more than a transition platform. Don't get it until Mango releases to all carriers if you are coming from iOS or Android. You never know what the functionality gap is until you actually use this device on a daily basis. Using it for 20 minutes in a carrier store is not enough.
However, for those moving up from a feature phone and don't really want all the extra fluff of a true smartphone OS, then WP7 may suite them well...
MartyLK said:
WP7 is smooth, clean and simple. It's generally very fast and elegant in operation. But right now it has bugs...at least for the pre-nodo devices. It currently lacks the higher-end hardware associated with the latest Androids and the iPhone, such as no front camera or dual-cpu. It doesn't use a plug & play expandable memory card...though you can expand the system memory with a little complexity on some devices...without voiding the warranty.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1 on this.
N8ter said:
However, for those moving up from a feature phone and don't really want all the extra fluff of a true smartphone OS, then WP7 may suite them well...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, I personally moved from a "true smartphone OS" (WM) to iOS to WP7 with a couple of brief stops with Android, and it suits me very well. Because I can do more with it, and better, including work (which for me is primarily communication via email and checking/quick editing office documents). While I will 200% agree that WP7 isn't a "PC in your pocket" in terms of power/flexibility/features by any stretch of imagination, and it isn't a business powerhouse, whether and how platforms fit your specific needs is what matters. Each platform has its own specific bugs or quirks which you may not notice at all or they can turn your phone ownership into hell.
You're going to have the "hate it"s and the "love it"s, with a good mix of fanboys in the middle, so my advice is to get an actual device in your hands and play a while with it.
Read about its features and current limitations and if it fits your needs, it has the apps you require and you enjoy it, take it... I know I did.
Avandor said:
my advice is to get an actual device in your hands and play a while with it.
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Click to collapse
Actually, this is a crucially important piece of advice. As uniform as WP7 devices are, I had a very difficult time getting a phone for myself. My major problem with the current crop is miserable amount of storage. I had to go for a carrier branded Mozart to get at least 16GB, and while it wasn't SIM locked and doesn't cause too much hassle, I would advise that you avoid branded handsets if possible. You won't get any added value from them but updates will be delayed, among other things.
vangrieg said:
You won't get any added value from them but updates will be delayed, among other things.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In some cases carrier locked models do come at cheaper prices, which is crucial to some people when choosing their phones.
scionXda said:
Its this Windows better than other mobile OS?
Why?
Why I have to choose Win phone 7 instead of Android?
Can some one tell me please?
thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
IMO you are asking the question wrong. It's a bit like asking if a Hummer is a better car than a Prius? With no qualifiers you will get as many answers saying the Hummer as you get people saying the Prius.
Now, let me add some more information. I live in the country, have three dogs (who like going for drives), we get ****loads of snow in the winter and them side roads leading up to the property are not exactly prioritized when it comes to removing snow.
For me it (Hummer) definitely is, but for them there city folks probably not so much
If you'd like to add some more information about what you use your phone for, i.e. what is important to you - I'm sure we'll get you some good reasons why you should (or not) pick WP7.
N8ter said:
Well, if you're going to confuse User INTERFACE with User EXPERIENCE, than your post is correct. Unfortunately, you are confused. The Experience goes beyond the interface. I'm not going to put my huge list in yet another thread. I'll leave it at that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The interface is indeed better, and the user experience is also better in general. MUCH better than WM's user experience; you can't deny that.
Similar to how the iphone couldn't do nearly as much as WM when it was released, but the user experience was much better. Everything "just worked" as they say. Some people have issues with WP but most don't have or care about any. It "just works".
Windows Phone 7 is by far the best OS I have used.
Android is very laggy. I can't tell you how many times I went to answer a call and couldn't because my Android device wouldn't respond in time.
Interface is unmatched. Way better than anything Android or iOS has to offer.
iOS is a good OS if you have the latest hardware (iPhone4), but the interface kills it for me. It's very boring.
Gaming experience is really awesome on WP7. Love the XBox Live integration/achievements.
Mostly everything just works without a hitch.
There are still bugs... but as an early adopter, I couldn't be happier.
Having both I say choose Android but watch WP7 for the future.
Currently WP7 offers very little to the customers.
It has very easy and nice interface but equally boring and dull to be honest.
Almost every thing this device can do is limited, maybe besides Zune and Xbox.
If you don't care about any more advanced features WP7 may be for you.
After 3 months of liking it I couldn't stand it anymore.
Limitations driving me crazy, stupid inconsistencies in performance plus Interface which is just a little bit too primitive (even if it's so easy to use).
Many people wrote here alot about both OS'es. Almost everything has been said.
For me WP7 is a massive disappointment. I gave it huge credit, bought my WP7 device for cash in December. But honestly the current situation is simply unacceptable at all.
Crippled features + no support in most countries with Marketplace, Maps, Bing and native Keyboard. If I think of it now I see it's ridiculous.
WP7 definitely is something worth interest because MS has all the services to make a perfect ecosystem in every possible area and that may be amazing. That was one of the reasons I bought it. But they don't do it now at all. You can do 100 times more on any other platform.
I suppose WP7 may be big hit once Nokia will jump on the market and WP7 will be much more opened. I think after Mango update this can be better and better.
But not now. Apparently MS has huge problem with the upgrade system what is not positive. My device still can't be updated although preNoDo was OK.
So a really competitive and finished product can be available around beginning of next year. Not before and it's too long to wait for me - I buy device to do the job!
I guess current WP7 is like an advanced beta where MS has it's learning curve.
And regarding the fluidity I say - people tell myths here.
WP7 lags sometimes terribly and current Android interations are really snappy.
I had a iphone then a Desire HD (which I still have) and now a samsung omnia 7 16gb, I also have a Ipad 1 so have a good idea of all of the OS's. All three are good phones, and getting any of the 3 different OS you can't go wrong really.
However I am loving WP7 so far even with the little quirks, the UI is really awesome and I much prefer it to Android in that regard, I spent hours using launcher pro and icons and lock screen mods and was never happy with how it looked whereas WP7 does all i need on that front and beautifully.
Also it's a lot smoother than android, though to be fair Android is as smooth as you need, the very little lags and jerks you get when scrolling are not big deals and I didn't actually notice them till I had both phones side by side, not sure why people make such a big deal about tiny jerkiness sometimes in the scrolling on Android.
IOS was a little too bland for me and I really wanted a better notification system as well as a bigger screen 3.5 was too small for web pages and gaming, though the amount of good quality apps was amazing, however I had my iphone for 3 years and I really only had about 20 apps, A few games to play when really bored and not at my PC.
Zune is awesome, million times better than Itunes, never used it before WP7 but now I am hooked, will be going from the trial to a paid zune pass too, works very well the streaming.
I also am impressed with the gaming on WP7 some very cool games in the market place, just a pity they are normally a lot more expensive than what you get on the iphone or android.
So overall WP7 does what I need (email, calendar, phone calls, and music with the odd game) and in a beautiful UI, for some people it wont do what they want and that's fine but for me it's great.
The Desire HD isn't used much at all anymore and I will probably ebay it soon. Really hope WP7 gets bigger as in my opinion it deserves a place in the the market even at this early stage of it's life
It completely baffles me as to why people continue to point out that WinPhone doesn't use dual cpus as though it has some negative affect on the phone or it's experience, even going as far as to compare it to Android phones which do use it. With it's first generation processor it still outshines newer Android devices. Performance? WP7 outperforms those dual cpu Android devices. Battery life, as so many have argued is the biggest positive? WP7 still gets better battery life. Also, how many people actually use front facing cameras? Really? I know quite a few people with MyTouchs and iPhone4s who have never done a video chat, and they've owned the devices since launch.
Just had to get that out there.
Really the only things where it suffers are in the app department....once the OS gets it legs(another year or so) it will be on par if not better than iOS. It doesn't beat out the Iphone 4(definitely better than the 3G and 3GS) and some android phones. I say some because Android is highly dependent on the phone you get. With Windows Phone you can pretty much go with any phone and they all work well. Im on my 3rd month with it and I still love it. Ive been through sony android phones, the iphone 3GS and a bada phone as well.
FiyaFleye said:
With it's first generation processor it still outshines newer Android devices.
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Click to collapse
Absolutely not true, actually just the opposite.
scionXda said:
Its this Windows better than other mobile OS?
Why?
Why I have to choose Win phone 7 instead of Android?
Can some one tell me please?
thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it's ok .
Since the thread was closed, I'm opening a new one to respond to Marty K and N8ter and the others that think just because something looks better on paper it must be better.
My coworker had a Samsung Infuse but she we having issues with the battery not lasting through a work day. She had installed several utilities to to deal with the situation but it didn't get a lot better. Then I showed her my Samsung Focus (running a developer build of mango) and we ran the HTML5 mobile speed test on the microsoft website.
http://ie.microsoft.com/testdrive/mobile/Performance/FishIETank/Default.html
Her phone got 10 fps and mine gets 30 fps. Plus my screen looks a hell of a lot better than hers did, even she admitted that. In fact, her's looked like ass. Maybe because the screen is so giant that the pixels get pix-elated due to the same resolution? Whatever the reason, my focus screen looks superior to hers. So just because it has a Super Amoled + doesn't automatically make it a better screen.
BTW, she returned her infuse after this comparison and went back to an iphone4 (which she had before). She didn't get a WP because Mango was far from RTM at the time, much less carrier released. This must have been back in June.
Next, the CPU. I read several users talking about the Infuse 1.2 humming bird. Well a side by side comparison of scrolling through photos revealed her superior processor showed no signs of being faster. In fact, the scrolling of photos revealed sluggishness. Compared to my little 1ghz snapdragon, my photos zoomed through a lot smoother.
It also didn't seem to help with the html5 fishbowl test. BTW, I don't think her faster processor helped with her short battery life either.
Finally, the OS. IMO, Android is garbage. The OS and the applications aren't stable (compared to other platforms - [except WinMo which was probably more unstable]), it's laggy, and it has a terrible UI that is not consistent from device to device.
Think about this. An average user, would they want an OS that can do a 1000 different things they'll actually never use, but that crashes more than it should, that's laggy and has a clumsy interface? Or would they want an OS that does much less things, things they actually need, but does them flawlessly, does them quickly, and with a streamlined simple intuitive interface that is the same amongst all WP devices?
If you truly answer that question objectively, you would say WP. No doubt the RTM of WP had a lot missing, but Mango compared to Android is no competition for AN AVERAGE USER.
You can't look at things on paper and say well that phone has this so it's automatically better. That just doesn't work. It's a shame that the majority of consumers have been duped into thinking that way because Android is currently by far the market SHARE leader in mobile OS. But I do believe that is going to change, and soon.
Finally with MartyK's belief that WP will be a dead system before long is ridiculous. Mango proves that isn't the case. If it were dying, Mango wouldn't have been released. If that's not enough evidence, look at Windows 8. They're using basically the same interface, Metro, from WP to Windows 8. That will make it far from dead, because once Win8 is released, that interface is on millions of devices. So that makes WP Apollo all the more relevant when it's released around the same time as Windows 8 in about a year from now.
Not only that, the WP apps are probably going to run on Windows8 and vice versa. Enough said.
It was closed because it had become nothing more than another WP7 Vs. Android thread.
Rest assured that if a thread is closed then it is for a reason.
No need to create another.
A few days ago I was thinking Microsoft was taking too much time with Mango and with improving the OS in general but after seeing the iPhone 4S I think Windows Phone is pretty much one (massive) update away to match Apple.
Really all they need to do is support higher resolutions and dual-core processors and the rest should follow (e.g. Unreal Engine). Question is, are they willing to do that already with Apollo (Tango will be minor)? I'm not so sure...
To be honest, I was hoping for the Iphone 4s to be good. It would keep Microsoft and Google on their feet. But jesus, the Iphone 4s is terrible. There is NOTHING on the 4s that can't be found on a high end android of 6 months ago.
Thanks. Just said what was in my mouth.
I must thank Apple too. My WP7 looks lot better now.
It is good. Look at the internals. The iPhone 4 external design is already excellent. They didn't really have to change that. No one was complaining when they used basically the same chasis on the iPhone, 3G, and 3GS TBQH.
The internals, however, are excellent.
Keep it in perspective:
iPhone 3GS 8GB - Free on Contract
iPhone 4 8GB - $99 on Contract
iPhone 4S 16/32/64 GB - $1/2/399 on Contract
The iPhone 4S will be on 3 US carriers.
iTunes is now up to 20 Million Tracks in their Library.
That's not even touching on the changes in iOS5 that are coming, which seem about as big as the Mango update, and it'll be going to devices back to iTouch 3rd Gen and iPhone 3GS.
This is good for apple, not so good for their competitors.
How does HTC expect to sell Titan/Radar for the prices we've seen thus far and compete with that, seriously?
---------- Post added at 02:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:10 PM ----------
Peew971 said:
A few days ago I was thinking Microsoft was taking too much time with Mango and with improving the OS in general but after seeing the iPhone 4S I think Windows Phone is pretty much one (massive) update away to match Apple.
Really all they need to do is support higher resolutions and dual-core processors and the rest should follow (e.g. Unreal Engine). Question is, are they willing to do that already with Apollo (Tango will be minor)? I'm not so sure...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apollo is at least a year away, going by their NoDo (Tango) and Mango (Apollo) update schedules.
By the tiem Apollo is out, Apple will be getting ready to Announce iOS 6 and Google will have moved up 2-3 versions in Android.
The whole point of the first year of WP7 was for them to position themselves in a way where they didn't have to play catch up so much.
From watching what has happened in Mango and iOS 5, Honeycomb, RIM QNX, etc... There is still a lot of innovation to be done for smartphones and tablets - bother in hardware and software.
EDIT: Forgot to mention, the iPhone 4S will be bother CDMA and GSM, so it will be probably the only phone that allows you to go between carriers (Sprint, AT&T, Verizon) without losing 3G capabilities, in addition to being a "World Phone." That will sell highly to businesses, people who travel, and consumers who aren't devout to any single carrier.
That being said, the only way I'll get it is if I switch carriers. I'm moving soon, so that's not completely out of the quesiton. But it's not worth ETFing and running after it withouto at least a 4" screen. I already have an iTouch 4.
albertleao said:
To be honest, I was hoping for the Iphone 4s to be good. It would keep Microsoft and Google on their feet. But jesus, the Iphone 4s is terrible. There is NOTHING on the 4s that can't be found on a high end android of 6 months ago.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Came here to say this exactly.
/Apple fail
People are so wrong writing 4S off...
It's a huge upgrade over 3GS, so folks on expiring two year contracts are in for a treat. Check.
It's better than 4, while still being awesome, so new adopters will get what they want. Check.
Apple also covers all [subsidized market] price points, so it'll be impossible to beat them on the price for anyone. Check.
Apple has a winner on their hands.
And no, nothing is lost for WP7, but for different reasons.
N8ter said:
It is good. Look at the internals. The iPhone 4 external design is already excellent. They didn't really have to change that. No one was complaining when they used basically the same chasis on the iPhone, 3G, and 3GS TBQH.
The internals, however, are excellent.
Keep it in perspective:
iPhone 3GS 8GB - Free on Contract
iPhone 4 8GB - $99 on Contract
iPhone 4S 16/32/64 GB - $1/2/399 on Contract
The iPhone 4S will be on 3 US carriers.
iTunes is now up to 20 Million Tracks in their Library.
That's not even touching on the changes in iOS5 that are coming, which seem about as big as the Mango update, and it'll be going to devices back to iTouch 3rd Gen and iPhone 3GS.
This is good for apple, not so good for their competitors.
How does HTC expect to sell Titan/Radar for the prices we've seen thus far and compete with that, seriously?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree, it is bad for now (although people might be tired of the iPhone design) which is why I was talking future prospect. Microsoft has a huge opportunity with Apollo, they could easily match what Apple is doing and more.
They do need a flagship device though.
albertleao said:
To be honest, I was hoping for the Iphone 4s to be good. It would keep Microsoft and Google on their feet. But jesus, the Iphone 4s is terrible. There is NOTHING on the 4s that can't be found on a high end android of 6 months ago.
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Well, that may be true but what about performance? Android needs so much CPU power to be smooth. An iP4 just needed 1GHz and now this thing has a dualcore. No phone on the market today will match the smoothness and graphics power of the 4S. Even the speech recognition on iOS5 seems to be superior to the one in WP7.
That Siri voice assistant thing looks pretty neat, still wouldn't buy an iphone though, screen too small for my ageing eyes!
Peew971 said:
I agree, it is bad for now (although people might be tired of the iPhone design) which is why I was talking future prospect. Microsoft has a huge opportunity with Apollo, they could easily match what Apple is doing and more.
They do need a flagship device though.
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I don't think people care about the design, TBQH. They care more about the ecosystem. Most people I know with iPhone - maybe all of them - have it in an Otterbox. They don't even get to see the actual build of the device after the first 10 minutes of taking it out the box.
---------- Post added at 02:37 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:30 PM ----------
morpheuszg said:
Well, that may be true but what about performance? Android needs so much CPU power to be smooth. An iP4 just needed 1GHz and now this thing has a dualcore. No phone on the market today will match the smoothness and graphics power of the 4S. Even the speech recognition on iOS5 seems to be superior to the one in WP7.
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The person you quoted is wrong, anyways.
Android performs well on 1GHz processors. It's badly coded TouchWiz interfaces, for example, and ill-optimize apps that bog it down. The same thing happens on iOS when an app is badly coded. There is lots of complaints in the app store about the "sluggish" performance of Facebook's latest app update, for example... However, iOS (and WP7) are saved by the way they "Multi-Task" applications. That means once you tombstone a sluggish application, it won't bog your system down. That's not the case on Android, Blackberry, or Symbian. A Rogue Application (and especially system component) can bring your (or any) system to a halt.
Samsung Fixed TouchWiz in TW 4.0. It stays out of your way a lot. That's why the Galaxy S II flies while getting some incredible battery life on top of that (8.5+ hours of continuous video on the AT&T variant, which is almost comparable to an iPhone and better than OS7 Blackberries)... That shows that good hardware and decent coding in Android can produce a top-notch phone. That's why they're selling like hotcakes.
The issue Microsoft ran into with WP7 is that they released it missing a few too many things off the bat, so when they worked on Mango, they STILL had to make concessions are pretty expected things just to make sure they could make good time. They already had their consumers waiting for almost a year, so even though they "finished" it early, there was no good PR benefit in holding out a couple/few more months to add in more stuff because of that. People would have been way too pissed. They will be really reliant on Word of Mouth to propagate WP7 in the face of Apple's onslaught - Android was similar, in the beginning. However, Android was playing in a much different market. RIM was still HUGE here, and Apple was on the iPhone 3G back then...
One of the biggest features in iOS 5 is the new Notification System. That's pretty ironic, becuase WP7 basically lacks a decent notification system. Also, Apple stole WP7 Toast Notifications and made them like 10x better.
But Like I said, the lack of a 4" screen is a bit of a stopper for me. Maybe I'll get used to that size from using the iTouch. I'm not sure, though. It's a ***** to type on a screen that small...
morpheuszg said:
Well, that may be true but what about performance? Android needs so much CPU power to be smooth. An iP4 just needed 1GHz and now this thing has a dualcore. No phone on the market today will match the smoothness and graphics power of the 4S. Even the speech recognition on iOS5 seems to be superior to the one in WP7.
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There android phones out now with dual core processors what improvements did tha tbring? To date none developers aren't using the extra core so its pointless.
vicious2500 said:
There android phones out now with dual core processors what improvements did tha tbring? To date none developers aren't using the extra core so its pointless.
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Ever heard of tegra zone?
vangrieg said:
People are so wrong writing 4S off...
It's a huge upgrade over 3GS, so folks on expiring two year contracts are in for a treat. Check.
I supposed, but that's not the point.
It's better than 4, while still being awesome, so new adopters will get what they want. Check.
It's almost the same phone. I don't think there has been such a thing as an Apple early adopter since the 80's.
Apple also covers all [subsidized market] price points, so it'll be impossible to beat them on the price for anyone. Check.
I'm not sure where you are, but here in Canada the iPhone is ridiculously overpriced. The 15 month old 4 is still on for like $170 on a THREE YEAR contract.
Apple has a winner on their hands.
Probably a winner yes, but just because that's the way it's been. Nothing really groundbreaking here to deserve having a winner.
And no, nothing is lost for WP7, but for different reasons.
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My replies above in blue.
I love my hd7 but iphone & android is far ahead of wp7. I feel as though windows phone is still playing catch up. For me the mango update was just about everything that should've been in its initial release, as if it was rushed to market
BlackDino said:
Ever heard of tegra zone?
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Thats just games.
All I can say is that Apple have just convinced me to buy a Windows Phone, most likely when Nokia's hit the shelves.
I have an iPhone 4 at the moment, and my contract is up for renewal next month..if they had bothered to release an iPhone 5, I would renew there and then and upgrade to that..no question. Instead they released the 4S, which has practically zero advantage for me over the 4. Faster CPU + GPU? Big deal, my iPhone 4 never lags with what its got..so I don't need that. Siri? Purely a gimmick, the few times I would have a use for this are not worth £500. I will still have an iPhone 4 for work, but for my personal phone..i'm jumping ship as soon as I spot a Windows phone that's worth it.
Definitely an epic failure by Apple when it comes to existing iPhone 4 owners..great for new adopters and 3Gs owners, but for the rest of us? We have no reason to upgrade.
Oh, and about iOS 5. Whats so great about it?
Notification center is just a copy from Android. You can tweet from almost everywhere (i give a **** to twitter).
What else? iMessage? Really, I would like something like that, but I still prefer multiplatforms like WhatsApp or Kik. Or even Facebook (though MS should have added some option to message too).
iOS 5 still an pretty app launcher and nothing more.
tmak22 said:
I love my hd7 but iphone & android is far ahead of wp7. I feel as though windows phone is still playing catch up. For me the mango update was just about everything that should've been in its initial release, as if it was rushed to market
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The problem is Microsoft schedule. They're in a pretty good spot with Mango but if they stick to that one big update a year they will always play catch up. At least for the first couple of years they should have had fast, regular updates like they promised. Still they could be in a position to have a iPhone 4S-like device in a year if they go all out on Apollo.
I don't care how much you shoot down apple for making a safe move, it's a smart one. Plus Siri takes the mick out of WP7 voice commands, the only use I have for voice texting is when I want a laugh, it doesn't pick up any slight accent. I'm from the north east england and it's translations are just embarrassing. I can almost guarantee that Siri will have no problem, Microsoft needs to work a little harder!
Peew971 said:
The problem is Microsoft schedule. They're in a pretty good spot with Mango but if they stick to that one big update a year they will always play catch up. At least for the first couple of years they should have had fast, regular updates like they promised. Still they could be in a position to have a iPhone 4S-like device in a year if they go all out on Apollo.
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When they will be competing with the iPhone 5 and Android God-knows-what. The cycle will just continue.
Consumer expectations tend to move with the market. 2 years ago Mango would have been a slam dunk, and it would have decimated iOS and Android around those time frames, but as always... When you wait, the competition doesn't stand still.
They needed to Update a bit faster. I'd say the first 2 years or so they should have taken the Google Route of 1 major update per ~6 months and after that they could have backed off to 1 major update a year.
An iPhone 4S like device in a year is like an iPhone 3GS now.
For the person above... Get your WP7 device. iPhone 4S basically is an iPhone 5 from a hardware standpoint. The only thing they kepc, was the chasis design (i.e., the general look). The iPhone, 3G, and 3GS all looked very similar and no one *****ed about it. What matters is how it performs and what's inside. That's what you're paying for. Most people put these things in a case anyways, cause those iPhones with Glass on teh Front and back are fragile, expensive devices. They don't care how it looks, as long as the internals and the software is new - which they are.
Apple knows this, better than you. That's why they are able to make this move confortably. Don't think they have had any issues making some design changes if they didn't feel that way...
Microsoft, a titan of the software industry, entirely unmatched. Nokia, once THE hardware giant in the mobile industry, fallen from graces due to poor software. Sounds like a romance etched in the stars for bards to write soliloquys about until time dth end, right? Well, according to the press, this is just a terrible idea.
Earlier this year, Microsoft announced an exclusive partnership with Nokia granting them more power over an already beautiful OS. Numerous jobs were lost, the bad press was everywhere, but Elop and Ballmer were smiling for the camera. Things died down, a few even began to see the bright side of what such a merger might offer, but with the release of the technical specifications of nokia's new windows phone devices, windows phone users everywhere froze. They seemed to offer nothing that the other OEMs couldn't. Some were expecting Nokia to blow us away with the use of a dual-core processor on a windows phone flagship device, my only thought, why?
Nokia is a hardware company not known for excessive hardware, but rather how they use it. While android was running sluggish on a 1 GHz snapdragon, symbian was smooth on a much lesser chipset. Nokia never was the greatest manufacturer for the power in the phone, just great execution be it their battery life which is absolutely phenomenal opposed to that of most smartphones, or their build quality, which provides a durable, polished, and attractive device. Don't even get me started on the camera's they've so often been praised for since the early days of smartphones. Nokia is a hardware company to be revered, even if not for their power.
Now, with WP7's strict hardware limitations allowing very specific chipsets in their devices, the chipset is not the issue by any means. What Microsoft needs now is a beautiful device with a great camera to take advantage of the fastest camera app out there, a great battery life to provide hours of smooth, lag-free browsing, and a polished build quality to match the polished OS.
Do I think WP7/Nokia could be a game changer? I'd like to think so, but only time will tell. For now, I'll just continue salivating over the new Nokia 800.
They will bring a lot - great build quality, great reception, great camera and free worldwide navigation with Nokia Maps. Not sure about the battery life but maybe there is going to be something in that part too.
z33dev33l said:
Microsoft, a titan of the software industry, entirely unmatched. Nokia, once THE hardware giant in the mobile industry, fallen from graces due to poor software. Sounds like a romance etched in the stars for bards to write soliloquys about until time dth end, right? Well, according to the press, this is just a terrible idea.
Earlier this year, Microsoft announced an exclusive partnership with Nokia granting them more power over an already beautiful OS. Numerous jobs were lost, the bad press was everywhere, but Elop and Ballmer were smiling for the camera. Things died down, a few even began to see the bright side of what such a merger might offer, but with the release of the technical specifications of nokia's new windows phone devices, windows phone users everywhere froze. They seemed to offer nothing that the other OEMs couldn't. Some were expecting Nokia to blow us away with the use of a dual-core processor on a windows phone flagship device, my only thought, why?
Nokia is a hardware company not known for excessive hardware, but rather how they use it. While android was running sluggish on a 1 GHz snapdragon, symbian was smooth on a much lesser chipset. Nokia never was the greatest manufacturer for the power in the phone, just great execution be it their battery life which is absolutely phenomenal opposed to that of most smartphones, or their build quality, which provides a durable, polished, and attractive device. Don't even get me started on the camera's they've so often been praised for since the early days of smartphones. Nokia is a hardware company to be revered, even if not for their power.
Now, with WP7's strict hardware limitations allowing very specific chipsets in their devices, the chipset is not the issue by any means. What Microsoft needs now is a beautiful device with a great camera to take advantage of the fastest camera app out there, a great battery life to provide hours of smooth, lag-free browsing, and a polished build quality to match the polished OS.
Do I think WP7/Nokia could be a game changer? I'd like to think so, but only time will tell. For now, I'll just continue salivating over the new Nokia 800.
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stigma:
the stigma amoung developers will remain, i would imagine. bitten by a company doesn't make you want to turn around and work for/with them again when they smile and announce a new product with a new partner. but that's only a few thousand people. they certainly won't be doing any dev'ing out of shear joy or passion. maybe for a job, but i doubt the flashy new hardware will dull their memory of being wronged by nokia, and now microsoft.
hardware:
despite the marketing and constant suggestion that nokia will be revolutionary hardware, or a great relationship with microsoft, or something 'new' and 'invigorating' - to the common consumer, it's a yawner:
another phone.
it's green.
big camera.
wp7.
more yawns, wp7 has been available for a while. 5-6Mp cameras have been available. dual cores, NFC, big and bright touch screens, it's all out there, right now.
so, what is the draw for just another manufacturer releasing another phone here ?
enlighten me
"Nokia/WP7- Is anything new being brought to the table?"
Yes, of course, huge huge impressive 16gb storage.
HTC and Samsung and LG have learned immensely during the last two years about both software and hardware in the new smart phone era. It would be difficult to outdo their current offerings.
But there is really a chance, due to their partnership, that they may come up with something new and interesting. Let's just wait a few days.
lekhwani said:
But there is really a chance, due to their partnership, that they may come up with something new and interesting. Let's just wait a few days.
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I bet a lot of people will be disappointed.... Probably mainly low end devices
I also predict many issues/bugs/problems. Nokia haven't the experience that HTC have.
According to engadget "possibly the most beautiful phone ever made". But I guess without tri-cores they really arent any different from the giants that are HTC and Samsung. /S
Those blue and pink phones look great with similar-colored live tiles!
arturobandini said:
I bet a lot of people will be disappointed.... Probably mainly low end devices
I also predict many issues/bugs/problems. Nokia haven't the experience that HTC have.
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um wat? lol. Nokia has more experience than just about any other phone manufacturer out there.
As far as what Nokia brings:
1. Excellent build quality & durability
2. Still best in class camera optics (at least on the high end phones).
3. Very good quality radios / cell reception
4. Typically very good battery life
5. Very stylistic designs well beyond what most manufacturers put out
6. Nokia services such as Ovi Maps (this will be huge for Bing Maps outside of US/UK)
7. Very large reach into lots of countries. More reach = more exposure = more people = good for platform.
dtboos said:
um wat? lol. Nokia has more experience than just about any other phone manufacturer out there.
As far as what Nokia brings:
1. Excellent build quality & durability
2. Still best in class camera optics (at least on the high end phones).
3. Very good quality radios / cell reception
4. Typically very good battery life
5. Very stylistic designs well beyond what most manufacturers put out
6. Nokia services such as Ovi Maps (this will be huge for Bing Maps outside of US/UK)
7. Very large reach into lots of countries. More reach = more exposure = more people = good for platform.
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It's totally true besides one thing:
Since introduction of touchscreens their own Symbian OS bacame disaster,
which just couldn't catch the leaders, even if it was offerring more features than iOS and Android some time ago.
They couldn't manage this and develop this OS properly, even having such great experience and potential and money.
So take nothing for granted. I am not so sure WP7/Nokia will give such amazing results everybody hopes for.
arturobandini said:
I bet a lot of people will be disappointed.... Probably mainly low end devices
I also predict many issues/bugs/problems. Nokia haven't the experience that HTC have.
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Anyone want to bet that the Microsoft Hero Phone will come from Nokia?
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using xda premium
I agree the specs I've seen so far are not wildly inspiring, but maybe that's not the point. Whilst the sort of people who read XDA will probably be more excited by phones such as the samsung focus s etc., perhaps typical consumers look more at brand / aesthetics / contract price than processor specs, and Nokia still have a name somewhat synonymous with mobile phones for a lot of people. Even though I probably won't one myself, I see the Nokia influence doing wonders for windows phone as a platform as it will get it into the hands of many people who might not have considered it otherwise.
My last Nokia phone was the n80 and it was a great piece of hardware. 3.2mp camera was unheard of back then.
The software is the only thing holding Nokia back. With WP they have the potential to release premium phones as well as low end smartphones . Nobody has the worldwide reach lke Nokia. They are the biggest phone company in the world.
Sent from my T8788 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
This is something of a do or die situation, Nokia has to awe us.
The N9 is one great looking device. Meego also looked great.
They need to quit ditching OS's.
vetvito said:
The N9 is one great looking device. Meego also looked great.
They need to quit ditching OS's.
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devving for meego direct was hell so all we'd really get was ports and that's only from those who wanted to take the time to port. No matter how it went the best meego could've been is a second-rate android and they didn't want that.
We all know Nokia is going to make incredible hardware. What I'm mostly excited about are the OS changes Nokia has made.
vetvito said:
The N9 is one great looking device. Meego also looked great.
They need to quit ditching OS's.
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They ditched 1 OS.
brummiesteven said:
They ditched 1 OS.
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??? Are you kidding.
They dropped Symbian as well.
I admit i only read a few posts on this thread so if this point is made already im sorry.
The way i see it is that spec sheets are worthless as each manufacturer can buy up the same bits from the same places and bung them in a shell. WP7 is always a constantly fast smooth OS the expiriance unlike droid is the same from one device to another. So what does Nokia bring???? They bring the style! I dont see the spec sheets blowing us away at all or some super new tech but i ask you this when was the last time you looked at a phone without all the specs and that and thought wow that is one sexy beast? The only time i can remember really thinking that was over 11 years ago when Nokia baught the 8850 to the table. I dont care what the specs are i need the 800 (searay) in my life.