Develop Bugs

Am I the only one to think that WM7 will suck?

http://pocketnow.com/tech-news/mix10-microsoft-cuts-copy-paste-feature-from-windows-phone-7-series
http://pocketnow.com/tech-news/mix1...have-a-file-manager-nor-usb-mass-storage-mode
http://pocketnow.com/tech-news/microsoft-no-windows-mobile-compatibility-on-windows-phone-7-series
http://pocketnow.com/tech-news/mix10-windows-phone-7-series-apps-will-use-new-different-drm
Is it just me, or Windows Mobile 7 will SUCK big time? It seems to me, as far as i've been reading and searching the web that microsoft is following apples way with the iphone on the new upcoming os. Where have they lost their head? ???
I don't know about you folks, but in the near future i will be buying myself an HD2 with good old WM 6.x.x. Makes sense to me! spending so much on a phone, at least it has to let me copy and paste at my own will!

MS gone Apple
Looks like WinMo7 is MS's attempt to copy everything that make the iPhone suck. If I wanted an iPhone, I would have bought an iPhone. My next one will probably be an Android.

no as time goes on i start to think that more & more but im sure as soon as i see a new video on it im prolly gonna want it again

I'm glad to read this, that at least someone has the same thoughts as mine. I really don't think WP7 will be as successful as Android OS, BB OS or even iPhone OS.

FYI it appears copy and paste will be in the RTM or most likely added shortly after.
To be fair Microsoft is trying to cater to a less advanced audience then the typical XDA user, so in that sense it may do well. From the XDA perspective as long as it gets rooted/jailbreaked/whatever, that isn't terribly different then flashing a HSPL and a custom rom. My only dislike is the lack of storage card, hopefully they will let up on this issue. The SDK is only managed code, this makes programs in general less dangerous and quicker to develop. On the other hand you loose the nitty gritty features XDA users love. Though I imagine having the phone rooted makes both of those points moot. At least you are not one of the people yammering how they are jumping ship to xxxxxx. The OS isn't RTM yet and the gurus haven't touched let a lone disabled all the sandboxing on any WMS7 phones. I somehow doubt the current windows mobile users on here griping are using a stock rom.

Theres no way WP7S will suck! This thread is pretty much useless pointing out on things which others have pointed out in 100 of such threads!

johnlujl123 said:
I'm glad to read this, that at least someone has the same thoughts as mine. I really don't think WP7 will be as successful as Android OS, BB OS or even iPhone OS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well at the moment Android isn't very wide-spread! Windows Mobile still got a bigger marketshare. But Google is great in making people use their products so we'll see in two years who will be at the top: WP7 or Android.
iPhone what?

The major issue i see with WP7S is no removable storage.
When the system gets taken apart, all of the other features we are missing (task manager, file system access, multitasking etc) will get put back in by XDA.
But... no removable storage is a biggie...
The problem is... there will be no manufacturers making WP7S devices that have micro sd card slots. Why would they?

Ev0luti0n_ said:
Is it just me, or Windows Mobile 7 will SUCK big time?...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Windows Mobile 7 did suck, that's why it got dropped for Windows Phone 7 Series
I believe eventually, Blackberry, iPhone and WP7 will be the top smartphone OS (in US) with Android going the way of WM with a small marketshare. Perhaps Android will catch WM one day now that WM was sent to pasture.
Any smartphone without a great ecosystem and super friendly OS will fail to compete with the "big boys"

I prefer not having my storage removable. I never take the card out of the phone anyway, and I hate having to decide where to put everything.
Do I put stuff on the card to preserve memory? Or in memory for speed?
If a phone ships with 8, 16 or 32GB of onboard memory, such concerns become moot, it's all one big lump of storage. This is probably why Microsoft haven't added the functionality to the Marketplace to put software onto the card - there won't BE a card in WP7S. Not only that, developers will be able to rely on the fact there'll be plenty of storage available for their games or whatever. Currently, as cards are optional, the only thing they can rely on is a couple hundred megs of RAM and that's it. So in the end I think this decision had to be made. Your average punter hates having to splash out on a memory card after spending £400-500 on a phone with virtually no storage. It is pretty silly. It would be like purchasing a laptop without a hard drive.
In any case, thus far at least, card storage capacities have not outstripped the onboard memory size of phones such as the iPhone. iPhone has 32GB on board, twice what my HD2 has.
Honestly, how many ordinary users do you think really want to faff around with memory cards? It's been nothing but a hassle for me.

Jim Coleman said:
Honestly, how many ordinary users do you think really want to faff around with memory cards? It's been nothing but a hassle for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is true... your average punter would think that removable storage is nothing but extra hassle.
However... when your phone goes tits up and you lose all of your files because you didnt have a backup, the advantage of removable storage becomes abundantly clear.
I for one would rather simply take my micro sd card out of the phone and place it directly into another device to get instantly up and running again.

Yes but it won't be an advantage with WP7 anyway as it won't have file system access and you won't be able to take programs installed on that card from one phone and simply plug it into another. So in WP7 as it is now storage cards are nothing but a hassle.

vangrieg said:
Yes but it won't be an advantage with WP7 anyway as it won't have file system access and you won't be able to take programs installed on that card from one phone and simply plug it into another. So in WP7 as it is now storage cards are nothing but a hassle.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah... but you sort of missed the point of my first post....
what i am saying is.... eventually, WP7S will be taken apart and file system access would be possible. So would installing apps outside of the microsoft marketplace.
Therefore... removable storage becomes extremely useful once more,... but there would be no devices running wp7s that actually have micro sd slots.
Forget looking at wp7s as it is now (shockingly bad)... im looking towards the future somewhat...

I hope they put 32 and 64gb chips in phones and not all go with the 8gb minimum.

Kloc said:
I hope they put 32 and 64gb chips in phones and not all go with the 8gb minimum.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
At least one manufacturer will, just to stand out amidst the crowd.

Musicman247 said:
At least one manufacturer will, just to stand out amidst the crowd.
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Click to collapse
Well let me go a little further. I hope HTC puts 32 or 64GB chips in a phone. I hope such phone has a slide out keyboard, and comes to TMO USA.

Audio Oblivion said:
what i am saying is.... eventually, WP7S will be taken apart and file system access would be possible. So would installing apps outside of the microsoft marketplace.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No doubt about it, but you can't expect MS to cater to that, can you? Me, I will miss SD card if I do switch to WP7, but built-in flash has its benefits as well, it's faster, actually. I need to be able to copy files there though.

Kloc said:
Well let me go a little further. I hope HTC puts 32 or 64GB chips in a phone. I hope such phone has a slide out keyboard, and comes to TMO USA.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And it needs to be super thin.
AND, it needs to come to Sprint.

vangrieg; said:
No doubt about it, but you can't expect MS to cater to that, can you? Me, I will miss SD card if I do switch to WP7, but built-in flash has its benefits as well, it's faster, actually. I need to be able to copy files there though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should still be able to files to and from wp7s although it does not use any storage card. I do that with iPhone now and there's no reason to think it will be any different here.

You can do it on the iPhone after jailbreaking. Without it you can only transfer certain types via sync interfaces. And then you cannot choose which application will use those files.

Some WP7 phones will feature a "SD card slot underneath the battery cover"

Interesting.....
Some Windows Phones have a Secure Digital (SD) card that's used to expand the amount of storage space on the phone. If your phone has one, it's in an SD card slot underneath the battery cover on the back of your phone.
Windows Phone uses a special high–performance SD card that works differently than SD cards in other devices. When your phone is built and first set up, its internal storage and SD card are combined and recognized as one storage system.
Warning
You should not remove the SD card in your phone or replace it with a new one because your Windows Phone won't work properly. Existing data on the phone may be lost, and that SD card can't be used in other devices or Windows Phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seems pretty bogus to me that they're unique to WP7 mechanically. Maybe just the file system is special? Should allow upgrading/replacing I would think.
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsphone/en-us/howto/wp7/basics/sd-cards-and-my-phone.aspx

RustyGrom said:
Interesting.....
Seems pretty bogus to me that they're unique to WP7 mechanically. Maybe just the file system is special? Should allow upgrading/replacing I would think.
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsphone/en-us/howto/wp7/basics/sd-cards-and-my-phone.aspx
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes you could but would have to re-flash your rom.

rruffman said:
yes you could but would have to re-flash your rom.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Source? All we have is rumors but the MS page implies that it's not that easy.

I figure you might get a chance to swap the card properly before first boot, i.e. right after unboxing.
--edit: On the other hand, might these be those new SD cards with additional contacts to allow very highspeed IO. (new UHS-I standard)

Tom Servo said:
I figure you might get a chance to swap the card properly before first boot, i.e. right after unboxing.
--edit: On the other hand, might these be those new SD cards with additional contacts to allow very highspeed IO. (new UHS-I standard)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes they are so if you get your hands on one then you are correct before boot 1st time or if you reflash your phone. i read it on a few blogs awhile back will have to find it again and repost it here...

RustyGrom said:
Interesting.....
Seems pretty bogus to me that they're unique to WP7 mechanically. Maybe just the file system is special? Should allow upgrading/replacing I would think.
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsphone/en-us/howto/wp7/basics/sd-cards-and-my-phone.aspx
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The cards themselves might not be that special other than having a correct SN range or something. The Barnes and Noble NOOK which runs android does this. The main on board memory is a microsd card that you can actually pull if you rip your nook apart, but it wont accept other microsd's even if they were cloned from the original card.

julienrl said:
The cards themselves might not be that special other than having a correct SN range or something. The Barnes and Noble NOOK which runs android does this. The main on board memory is a microsd card that you can actually pull if you rip your nook apart, but it wont accept other microsd's even if they were cloned from the original card.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Interesting. Thanks. I guess the difference here is that WP7 is made by a bunch of different people so it would be harder to code in this sort of restriction.

Just saw this in an article about the Samsung Focus...
It's also the only Windows Phone that can expand with memory cards, according to an AT&T spokesman.
All the new Windows Phone 7's work similarly, as they're all based on Qualcomm's 1-GHz QSD8250 chipset with very similar hardware stats, including HSDPA 7.2, Wi-Fi, and a 5-megapixel camera. The Focus has 8GB of memory built in, but an AT&T spokesman at the launch said a MicroSD card up to 32GB could be added, provided you factory reset the phone when you do. If that's true, the Focus can expand up to 40GB.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2370586,00.asp

Pocketnow is concurring that WP7 supports upgrading the card.
http://pocketnow.com/windows-phone/windows-phone-7-does-support-removable-storage-proof

I have a request.
ANYONE who is lucky enogh to get their hands on a WP7 device. If possible, check if there is a memory card uner the battery.
I do not understand what the **** MS is doing. Currently there's only one phone on the market with more than 8GB storage, and this will be rare, hard to get because I don't think I'm the only one that want one.

Sir. Haxalot said:
I have a request.
ANYONE who is lucky enogh to get their hands on a WP7 device. If possible, check if there is a memory card uner the battery.
I do not understand what the **** MS is doing. Currently there's only one phone on the market with more than 8GB storage, and this will be rare, hard to get because I don't think I'm the only one that want one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Blame it on the hardware vendor. MS state that the min is 8GB, so they all quickly built phones with 8GB naturally. There's no stopping them from building a 16 or 32GB. They should have figured out we'd spend a few more dollars to get those extra storage

Wandy_1974 said:
Blame it on the hardware vendor. MS state that the min is 8GB, so they all quickly built phones with 8GB naturally. There's no stopping them from building a 16 or 32GB. They should have figured out we'd spend a few more dollars to get those extra storage
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is true, I am in love with what Microsoft have made, but they have been let down badly by the hardware manufacturers. I really hope there is options for more storage ie like the iphone when they go on sale and the 8gb models where just used for showing of the handsets. One bit of hope for this is that the storage capacity is not shown on the wp7 websites handset specs. I would kill for a 16/32gb mozart or omnia 7.

lumpaywk said:
This is true, I am in love with what Microsoft have made, but they have been let down badly by the hardware manufacturers. I really hope there is options for more storage ie like the iphone when they go on sale and the 8gb models where just used for showing of the handsets. One bit of hope for this is that the storage capacity is not shown on the wp7 websites handset specs. I would kill for a 16/32gb mozart or omnia 7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I want 16GB min but hoping to have the option for 32GB +. Hope they wake up soon as I love the look of winm7.
But without better storage, I will not be upgrading anytime soon.

Wandy_1974 said:
Blame it on the hardware vendor. MS state that the min is 8GB, so they all quickly built phones with 8GB naturally.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, since this isn't surprising anyone then I think MS could have expected it. And I will still blame them because they didn't make 16GB the minimum.

lumpaywk said:
This is true, I am in love with what Microsoft have made, but they have been let down badly by the hardware manufacturers. I really hope there is options for more storage ie like the iphone when they go on sale and the 8gb models where just used for showing of the handsets. One bit of hope for this is that the storage capacity is not shown on the wp7 websites handset specs. I would kill for a 16/32gb mozart or omnia 7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the SAMSUNG FOCUS is currently the only phone that will allow for upgrading the storage you can simply insert your 32 gb sd card before youfirst start you phone on 40gb it is... or insert it at a later time and hard reset and you are good to go...

i would thus jump on the focus but alas i live in england and so we get the rubbish. It seems they are holding all the good handsets for the USA (by good i mean with more than 8gb storage). This is a real kick in the balls as i was hoping i wouldn't need to replace my stolen zune hd as i was going to get a wp7 but it would seem this will actually still have to be the case.
Saying this i did have a little hope with "the device can be picked up in 8GB and 16GB capacities." from http://www.mobiletor.com/2010/10/12/samsung-makes-a-mark-with-new-omnia-7-smartphone/ though tbh i once again don't think this will be the case in the uk.

16GB as a minimum sounds a little high. I am not sure who is really to blame for this storage fiasco, but how can they expect the multimedia users to work with only 8GB storage? And when I say they I mean phone makers and MS.
But an intriguing question would be why does one handset allow the removable storage to be upgraded and not the others?

So my question is about the type/class SD card that we can use to upgrade the Focus. I can only find an SDXC USH-I 64GB card for over $300. If the phone is using some kind of Raid 0 storage implementation, does it require a memory card that costs almost 50% more than the phone will cost?
What kind of SD card will the Focus require?

lavike said:
So my question is about the type/class SD card that we can use to upgrade the Focus. I can only find an SDXC USH-I 64GB card for over $300. If the phone is using some kind of Raid 0 storage implementation, does it require a memory card that costs almost 50% more than the phone will cost?
What kind of SD card will the Focus require?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
microsoft did say something about "high speed" cards but did not give what they were.. however the focus will only support up to 32gb not sure why..

Sir. Haxalot said:
I have a request.
ANYONE who is lucky enogh to get their hands on a WP7 device. If possible, check if there is a memory card uner the battery.
I do not understand what the **** MS is doing. Currently there's only one phone on the market with more than 8GB storage, and this will be rare, hard to get because I don't think I'm the only one that want one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
there are multiple phones with more than 8GB of storage on the market
Several Nokia N series have 32GB of storage N97 and N900 for example and both have the ability to add up to 32GB more

Removable Storage Confirmed In Windows Phone 7

http://wmpoweruser.com/expandable-storage-confirmed-in-windows-phone-7-required-a-hard-reset/
We have finally had some confirmation, via Paul Thurrot, who is writing a book on the subject after all, that Windows Phone 7 does support the replacement of the installed microSD card (for devices which have them) with others of larger capacity.
Due to the way data is spanned across volumes in Windows Phone 7 however removing the card will almost certainly result in data loss, which means replacing the card means a hard reset needs to be performed to restore normal function again.
Most of HTC’s Windows Phone 7 devices feature microSD cards. Does this change readers opinion on the desirability of these 8 GB handsets? Let us know below.

The Paul Thurrott's post is interesting. But Paul Thurrott did NOT said "Most of HTC’s Windows Phone 7 devices feature microSD cards". wmpoweruser.com did. But I don't know where they had this information.
In Paul Thurrott's post, we can read in the comments
"Paul Thurrott says:
October 13, 2010 at 9:57 am
I’m not sure which phones have slots and which don’t, beyond the Focus."

hopefully most phones will have it *leers at htc*
you better not fumble this

Can't find it now, but yesterday read an article that confirmed removable media under the battery for some devices, but it was not microSD but a new much faster type of card and replacing it would require a factory reset.
Seemed fairly convincing, but can't find it now.

His!...
plastix said:
Can't find it now, but yesterday read an article that confirmed removable media under the battery for some devices, but it was not microSD but a new much faster type of card and replacing it would require a factory reset.
Seemed fairly convincing, but can't find it now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsphone/en-us/howto/wp7/basics/sd-cards-and-my-phone.aspx
Greetings

Buscamina said:
His!...
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsphone/en-us/howto/wp7/basics/sd-cards-and-my-phone.aspx
Greetings
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That sounds like it is an SD card with some form of "special" formatting.
So how long before XDA cracks it, and allows you to take your phone's 8GB SD card, and copy/move the data to a new 32GB one and have the phone working just fine?

A regular SD card would be slow compared to the one that comes with the phone. I don't even think they SD cards it requires are available to purchase yet.
cyclical said:
That sounds like it is an SD card with some form of "special" formatting.
So how long before XDA cracks it, and allows you to take your phone's 8GB SD card, and copy/move the data to a new 32GB one and have the phone working just fine?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Any news on which phones will have the expandable storage slot?

I read in an article somewhere that it uses a form of Raid (0 I would think) across the device and it's storage card but it never mentioned a new type of card, although that would make sense

Micro SD for hd7 and trophy, not mozart
This is the first time posting in xda since the forum revamp, but when i realised you guys werent aware of which devices support user accessible micro sd i felt i had to post here.
The htc trophy and HD7 will have expandable memory (the option of replacing memory). HTC themselves are listing memory accessories to buy on their website, however the mozart will not have the ability 9or access) to the micro sd card slot.
important points
Micro SDHC Class 2
Available for HD7
Available for Trophy
Not available for HTC Mozart
HTC are selling memory here for HD& and Trophy but you will notice, not for mozart.http://www.htcaccessorystore.com/uk/p_htc_phonecat.aspx?i=204561&c=13

levi3man said:
This is the first time posting in xda since the forum revamp, but when i realised you guys werent aware of which devices support user accessible micro sd i felt i had to post here.
The htc trophy and HD7 will have expandable memory (the option of replacing memory). HTC themselves are listing memory accessories to buy on their website, however the mozart will not have the ability 9or access) to the micro sd card slot.
important points
Micro SDHC Class 2
Available for HD7
Available for Trophy
Not available for HTC Mozart
HTC are selling memory here for HD& and Trophy but you will notice, not for mozart.http://www.htcaccessorystore.com/uk/p_htc_phonecat.aspx?i=204561&c=13
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nice find! I'm really hoping this is true. If that's the case then I'll easily grab the HD7 16GB then upgrade to 32 gb. 48GB in one device, Now I can finally hold all my music without needing a HDD based IPOD/Zune.

Oh crap! No expandable memory for the Mozart means i'll be buying the Trophy.
I'm surprised to see that they sell class 2 cards. Wasn't it supposed to be a very fast card in wp7 devices? If this class 2 card gets integrated with the existing storage it would probably slow it down right?

This changes everything for me! I had my heart set on the omnia7 with the proviso that if i can only get 8gb i would go for the Mozart instead, but now it looks like there is no way i can justify 8gb and the sexy mozart is out and it looks like the omnia is to expensive esp if the trophy and hd7 have expandable memory. I may still look at the omnia if i can get a good deal on a 16gb version otherwise its a case for the ugly phones.

lumpaywk said:
This changes everything for me! I had my heart set on the omnia7 with the proviso that if i can only get 8gb i would go for the Mozart instead, but now it looks like there is no way i can justify 8gb and the sexy mozart is out and it looks like the omnia is to expensive esp if the trophy and hd7 have expandable memory. I may still look at the omnia if i can get a good deal on a 16gb version otherwise its a case for the ugly phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Haven't all leaks about the Omnia 7 so far stated wither 8GB built in memory or 8GB built in and a microSD slot for additional memory expansion (without memory loss)?

Sir. Haxalot said:
Haven't all leaks about the Omnia 7 so far stated wither 8GB built in memory or 8GB built in and a microSD slot for additional memory expansion (without memory loss)?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i have not seen this, i was told by one person that it had a card but so far all i have seen is that the focus will but the omnia 7 wont but instead will have 2 versions. If i can have expandable memory or find a 16gb on eon a good deal i will jump on it faster then flash gordon.
mind you i have been using Google to search, could there be a conspiracy theory here lol

I sent an email to HTC and asked about HD7 and Trophy regarding the possibillity to expand the memory, since they sell sd-card as accessories to those models, and i got this answer:
"Dear ********,
you cant use SD card in theese phones, they all have internal memory on 8 GB (europe) 16 GB (asia)
its a mistake on our website, it will be fixed very soon - thank you for your attention.
Sincerely,
**********
HTC"
Maybe the sd-slot is there but they don't officially support it? I guess we have to wait until someone can actually take a look at a device so we can get confirmation.

Wow, no expandable slot for the Mozart, huh? I really liked the way it looks. Oh well.. Trophy it is.
EDIT: At least it's got a 3.8 inch screen!

I must admit I am very disappointed that most phones only have 8 GB memory and a few will have 16 GB.
It's a bit of a flop if you want to compare it to Apple with 8 GB, 16 GB, 32 GB and 64 GB.
I hope the manufactures change there thinking here as cloud storage is fine if you have an unlimited data plan and do not travel.
But data in Asia is expensive and using data can run into hundreds of dollars very fast.

Sledgeman said:
I sent an email to HTC and asked about HD7 and Trophy regarding the possibillity to expand the memory, since they sell sd-card as accessories to those models, and i got this answer:
"Dear ********,
you cant use SD card in theese phones, they all have internal memory on 8 GB (europe) 16 GB (asia)
its a mistake on our website, it will be fixed very soon - thank you for your attention.
Sincerely,
**********
HTC"
Maybe the sd-slot is there but they don't officially support it? I guess we have to wait until someone can actually take a look at a device so we can get confirmation.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just called them and was talking to a lady. I'm waiting for a call-back to know if the HD7 will have accept SD cards and I also made a complaint about the fact that Europe is left behind with a 8gb version of the HD7 in favor of Asia and if it remains so, I'll buy one on the Internet or by somebody I know in Asia. She seemed to be aware of the problem and told me to wait until november the 2nd when it's officially released in Austria. Nevertheless, she insisted to write down everything I was saying and promised me to call me back on these 2 issues.
****TO BE CONTINUED****
f.

it does seem to be a kick in the balls that they treat the European market as less worthy of more than 8gb why are we treated like we don't matter is the bigger question.

MicroSD card support when Windows 7 was being developed

Forgive me if this had been discussed before, but does anyone have any idea why Microsoft would program an OS that supposedly was built from the ground up to NOT support external MicroSD cards? It would seem that in this day and age that it would have been in the top 5 list of "had to be included." Instead they gave the manufacturers their specs for 8GB of internal RAM and that was it. What in the world was Microsoft thinking?
I'm actually happy that Samsung said "screw that" and made a MicroSD slot that was user accessible. That basically forced Microsoft to rethink their strategy, especially after the first patch "fiasco."
Does anyone here have any inside information as to why the MicroSD card wasn't on their list of "must have" for Windows 7? Do you think they were trying to pull an Apple strategy where they can sell an 8GB phone, a 16GB phone, and a 32GB phone to try to make more money?

MicroSD cards ARE supported by WP7, in fact all but a few WP7 devices have them.
What you are looking for is called "removable" & "user-accessible"/"upgradeable" storage.

Scrtcwlvl said:
MicroSD cards ARE supported by WP7, in fact all but a few WP7 devices have them.
What you are looking for is called "removable" & "user-accessible"/"upgradeable" storage.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well all the HTC ones use microSD, as well as the DELL Venue Pro, where as all LG phones use NAND, and Samsung uses NAND (with the exception of focus offering an external microSD slot).
The main reason why MS didn't want it exposed is because of the way it uses the microSD card. The use of it in an actual secured RAID 0 format means that it makes the card unusable by any other means making the data secure on the chip. And they knew that people would complain so they didn't want the OEMs to offer it as a user accessible slot, but they didn't enforce it. Not sure if that's a good or bad thing though.

The Gate Keeper said:
And they knew that people would complain so they didn't want the OEMs to offer it as a user accessible slot, but they didn't enforce it. Not sure if that's a good or bad thing though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess now that the genie is out of be bottle it appears that Microsoft will now need to address this dilemma. It appears that people are okay with the idea that once the microSD card is used by a WP7 phone that it can't be reused in something else. I know I'm okay with it if the phone is functional with more space to save music, videos, games, etc. I currently have a 8GB card in my phone, but what I really wanted was a 32GB card but after hearing how unstable it was I held back. It was the inability to use the 32GB card that made me ask the original question.

nathantw said:
I guess now that the genie is out of be bottle it appears that Microsoft will now need to address this dilemma. It appears that people are okay with the idea that once the microSD card is used by a WP7 phone that it can't be reused in something else. I know I'm okay with it if the phone is functional with more space to save music, videos, games, etc. I currently have a 8GB card in my phone, but what I really wanted was a 32GB card but after hearing how unstable it was I held back. It was the inability to use the 32GB card that made me ask the original question.
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Click to collapse
Samsung Focus' implementation of SD is flawed either in hardware level or software level or both. There is no problem using any size or type of SD cards in any other WP7 phones not made by Samsung. MicroSD cards have been around for very long time. There is really no reason for a phone, especially one that is designed to take user removeable SD card, to not support all kinds of cards.
Now you have Samsung Focus not only doesn't support majority of SD cards out there but also refuses to accept updates from Micrsoft. It sounds like Samsung has a hatrate against WP7

I think MS saw the problems that Android had with removable storage and decided to require a minimum of 8gb and do away with any sort of removable storage. This makes the OS more stable as a whole.

i think MS did not want ppl to load android on WP7 dvice thats why they did this to the memory card...

They're trying to stop piracy, there's many Android sites out there on the internet that'll give you APKs of premium android apps that have been ripped off people's memory cards and uploaded.
It doesn't help that with Android you have 24 hours to request a refund and therefore can buy, rip from memory card and refund.
It may seem bad to you but from a developer point of view it's awesome. And before anyone goes on about encryption etc, people will find a way to hack through that they always do.

brummiesteven said:
It doesn't help that with Android you have 24 hours to request a refund and therefore can buy, rip from memory card and refund.
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i believe this is now only 15 minutes, which a lot of people think is a bit too short of a time frame as well. this is why the setup MS did was quite smart, offering the capabilities for devs to implement a trial mode within their full app.

^ care to check facts first. 24 hours?
..........edit .... gate keeper beat me to it.
You can also say the same for IOS, and WebOS. Piracy will come, there is no stopping it.

The Gate Keeper said:
i believe this is now only 15 minutes, which a lot of people think is a bit too short of a time frame as well. this is why the setup MS did was quite smart, offering the capabilities for devs to implement a trial mode within their full app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
which is still enough time to rip the apk and still get a refund.
And as I sit here being frustrated that more devs are going to an ad supported model, I think I have found the reason why....

yea it is enough time to perform that. but to a general user 15 minutes isn't enough time to see if the app was worth the purchase.
the market place needs better search capabilities for trial apps, that's all. once they are there, then more people will start using the trial apps and if they deem it worth it they would buy it.

Mango Device : HTC "Radar" and HTC "Titan"

http://wmpoweruser.com/htc-omega-is-htc-radar-htc-eternity-is-htc-titan/
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Tezawaly from Nanapho.jp has dug up some UAProfs files from HTC’s website which rather conclusively show that the final names of the HTC Omega will be the HTC Radar, and that of the HTC Eternity would be the HTC Titan.
The UAProfs entries plus leaked codenames from the WP Bench app show the HTC Radar C110e is HTC Omega and HTC TITAN X310e is HTC Eternity. Long time Windows Mobile users will remember the HTC Titan as a small screened slider, but of course the HTC Eternity, which is expected to sport a 4.5 inch screen, is the furthest possible from that design.
With the HTC Radar having a front-facing camera I think we can now safely assume the HTC Titan will come with that feature also, with the leaked specs saying it sported a 1.3 megapixel front-facing camera.
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So, basicly they just change the name of it? So that mean, this is the confirmation for Eternity?

Hmmm... I prefer Omega and Eternity over the current names...

I will be buying the Eternity/Titan if no other large screen model comes along... and the name change is one I do welcome.
Omega was cool... but Eternity, yuck !

sign me up for the Eternity/Titan. Im anxious for the follow up to the HD7
Sent from my HD7 using Board Express

Apparently the Titan has only 16GB storage...
It makes it totally useless.
I hope Nokia can do better than this. I need 32GB

any reason why all htc wp7 phones share an identical design?

the second one looks awful.
but the first.. mmm

Cotulla said:
the second one looks awful.
but the first.. mmm
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Click to collapse
Second one is an HD7
n1mr0dwp7 said:
any reason why all htc wp7 phones share an identical design?
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Most of their Android ones look the same too

"Second one is an HD7 "
No the second one is an HTC Eternity and imo the HD7 has a beautiful design .

I like the white one. I wish they would make another titan with a 4.3 screen and a keyboard.

qsr786 said:
"Second one is an HD7 "
No the second one is an HTC Eternity and imo the HD7 has a beautiful design .
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Wow, I guess I do see some subtle differences.

mike21pr said:
sign me up for the Eternity/Titan. Im anxious for the follow up to the HD7
Sent from my HD7 using Board Express
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same...
Tomorrow is my birthday, and just a few days away from Call of Duty XP and HTC talks about new Windows Phone , and soon, Battlefiled 3 Beta.
to much fun stuffs for the end of August and the beginning of Sep.

I've got 8 on my Focus, with an extra 16GB card for a total of about 23GB after formatting. It's FAR from totally useless, that's just nonsense. Most I've ever filled the thing up was about 12GB. What the hell do you use it for, a backup drive?

jasongw said:
I've got 8 on my Focus, with an extra 16GB card for a total of about 23GB after formatting. It's FAR from totally useless, that's just nonsense. Most I've ever filled the thing up was about 12GB. What the hell do you use it for, a backup drive?
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jaja I agree, people expect their phones to be like portable hard drives or something, we've been given 25GB of storage on SkyDrive for a reason as well as the Zune pass streaming. these phones are very far from useless. I'm also seeing design complaints, these phones aren't meant to be a fashion show if one thinks they can do better they should apply to HTC and do better otherwise stop complaining on forums to people who may be excited about these phones.

jasongw said:
I've got 8 on my Focus, with an extra 16GB card for a total of about 23GB after formatting. It's FAR from totally useless, that's just nonsense. Most I've ever filled the thing up was about 12GB. What the hell do you use it for, a backup drive?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agree, I had a 4GB SD Card in my old TP2 & that was more than enough. Ok, yes 8GB is kind of small for WP7 considering how big some apps are & if you're an app junkie, but it's far from useless. I'll agree to the person you're responding to on 1 aspect. OEM's need to learn to create different versions, 8/16/32 GB to give people the choice of size over price like Dell did. My only complaint in SD Card size is that the desktop Zune client is setup to auto sync music, media, etc. I have 30+ GB of music alone nevermind movies/documents/pictures. I need to pick & choose what I want on the device (16GB). I also hate if you move a music file, the auto sync will remove it from your device. Sure it can be turned off, but you have to know how & go into settings. I made a huge mistake when I first got my WP7. I didn't know exactly how the different sync options works. So, I choose, "Items I choose." I copied all the music I wanted most to the device. Well a couple months later I decided to delete all the music off my PC & re-download it. I had way too many duplicates. Well, everything on my device was deleted too. Yes, user error, I know, but still annoying all the same. Now I have it set to "Manually" but if trying to flash mango & have to uninstall Zune Client to succeed, have to remember to set this setting again.

Count me in for the "16 is enough" crowd. I've got 16, and I still have about 8 free.
However if we could actually watch AVI/XviD's, I might have less room, but still, how many movies would you keep on your phone??

sure haven't said:
.... how many movies would you keep on your phone??
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Not many, 1-3 maybe. They'd quickly steal your free space. Plus, I only ever watch movies on it if I have to take my elderly disabled mother to a doctor's appointment & have to wait long in the waiting room & get bored.

drkfngthdragnlrd said:
Agree, I had a 4GB SD Card in my old TP2 & that was more than enough. Ok, yes 8GB is kind of small for WP7 considering how big some apps are & if you're an app junkie, but it's far from useless. I'll agree to the person you're responding to on 1 aspect. OEM's need to learn to create different versions, 8/16/32 GB to give people the choice of size over price like Dell did. My only complaint in SD Card size is that the desktop Zune client is setup to auto sync music, media, etc. I have 30+ GB of music alone nevermind movies/documents/pictures. I need to pick & choose what I want on the device (16GB). I also hate if you move a music file, the auto sync will remove it from your device. Sure it can be turned off, but you have to know how & go into settings. I made a huge mistake when I first got my WP7. I didn't know exactly how the different sync options works. So, I choose, "Items I choose." I copied all the music I wanted most to the device. Well a couple months later I decided to delete all the music off my PC & re-download it. I had way too many duplicates. Well, everything on my device was deleted too. Yes, user error, I know, but still annoying all the same. Now I have it set to "Manually" but if trying to flash mango & have to uninstall Zune Client to succeed, have to remember to set this setting again.
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Dude, you changed your avatar again?

Meh, I've got an 8gb Omnia 7 and i've never filled it so 16gb isn't exactly a problem for me.

Freypal said:
Meh, I've got an 8gb Omnia 7 and i've never filled it so 16gb isn't exactly a problem for me.
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Click to collapse
That is what i used to think before Windows Phone 7.
Basicly, i hate the media player on Windows Mobile 6.5 because it is just so laggy, but when i came to WP7, i superised about media power of it and i started to transfer movies and video clips in my Schubert.
Far from now, i have used only 12GB