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Hey everyone,
This question was bound to come back sometime, and since I have one day left to return the Galaxy Nexus, I wanted to re-raise the issue.
First of all, the GPU of the Galaxy Nexus is the PowerVR SGX540 clocked at 307mhz. Other phones that have come out relatively close to the Galaxy Nexus are the Samsung Galaxy S ll , HTC EVO 3D and finally the iPhone 4s (or the iPad in the site below) have much better benchmark scores compared to the Galaxy Nexus. Now I know the performance heavily depends on the drivers/etc installed but would that make any difference from a phone like the Galaxy S in terms of gaming performance?
According to these benchmarks: here the phone with the PowerVR SGX 540 at 300mhz (Optimus 3D) performs pretty horribly, and I have this phone for another 14 months. Since I consider myself an avid gamer, I want to know if you guys think this phone can last 14 months in terms of the GPU. I know its found in plenty of older devices such as the Galaxy S and the Nexus S, but there are so many games already optimized for it so do you guys think developers will continue to support this fairly dated GPU for the 14 months to come?
Now I'm no technology expert, so I'd appreciate if someone else could help me out here
Thanks,
Mosh
benchmarks don't really mean much to be honest. you could run the exact same test 10 times and get a different result each time.
as far as what this phone can handle... well, i have tried the following:
Shadow Gun
Sentinel 3
Samurai II
Fruit Ninja
Field Runners HD
Shinobi Barrage
all those games play fine for the most part, just a lil slow down here & there in the more graphically intense games like Shadow Gun(this game also makes the phone run very hot). as far as other phones go, i have tried all those games on my Rezound and they played just fine on that phone to. actually, Shadow Gun was a bit smoother on the Rezound(but only slightly).
i'd say as far as 'top-of-line' phones go(on Verizon at least) the 2 tops are the Nexus & the Rezound.
as for the future, supposedly Asus & HTC have quad-core phones with Tegra 3 GPU's coming out 1st Q 2012, but who knows how soon that actually will be(most likely will be push backs & won't see the light until summer or later)
First, the GN GPU is clocked at 384 MHz, second there is not yet a single game (game, not benchmark!) out there that comes close to utilizing the Tegra2 GPU (which is not "very good" either) to its fullest. Draw your own conclusions.
Mine are that the GN GPU will be more than enough until the phone is "old tech" anyway.
Valynor said:
First, the GN GPU is clocked at 384 MHz, second there is not yet a single game (game, not benchmark!) out there that comes close to utilizing the Tegra2 GPU (which is not "very good" either) to its fullest. Draw your own conclusions.
Mine are that the GN GPU will be more than enough until the phone is "old tech" anyway.
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Umm.. no.. its actually clocked at 307MHZ. Only way to see it clocked at 384MHZ is if you OC to 1.4 GHZ (CPU) which many Nexus become unstable or become slower for some reason. The Rez plays games better but its not a huge upgrade either. If you want a stronger GPU, wait for the Adreno 225+ or the new Galaxy S3. The Tegra 3 from what I remember reading seems to be still slower than the Exynos chip which to me is a dissappointment.
If we get games like Real Racing 2 graphics or better, our GPU's will not be strong enough to support them. The iPad 2 at times slightly stutters on Real Racing 2 even with its strong GPU.
voxigenboy said:
benchmarks don't really mean much to be honest. you could run the exact same test 10 times and get a different result each time.
as far as what this phone can handle... well, i have tried the following:
Shadow Gun
Sentinel 3
Samurai II
Fruit Ninja
Field Runners HD
Shinobi Barrage
all those games play fine for the most part, just a lil slow down here & there in the more graphically intense games like Shadow Gun(this game also makes the phone run very hot). as far as other phones go, i have tried all those games on my Rezound and they played just fine on that phone to. actually, Shadow Gun was a bit smoother on the Rezound(but only slightly).
i'd say as far as 'top-of-line' phones go(on Verizon at least) the 2 tops are the Nexus & the Rezound.
as for the future, supposedly Asus & HTC have quad-core phones with Tegra 3 GPU's coming out 1st Q 2012, but who knows how soon that actually will be(most likely will be push backs & won't see the light until summer or later)
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Valynor said:
First, the GN GPU is clocked at 384 MHz, second there is not yet a single game (game, not benchmark!) out there that comes close to utilizing the Tegra2 GPU (which is not "very good" either) to its fullest. Draw your own conclusions.
Mine are that the GN GPU will be more than enough until the phone is "old tech" anyway.
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The only game that I've tried to play other than Words with friends and Hanging with friends is Airport Mania 2 HD, which runs horribly on my Galaxy Nexus (with and without GPU rendering forced). Just food for thought. I'm wondering if 4.0.3 will help it out any. If it does, good, if not, oh well as I really don't play games that often, but it would still be nice to be able to play it on a "top of the line" phone. Other than that, I still like my phone.
I noticed the slow downs in Shadow Gun too. Which prompted me to try overclocking. My phone stutters at 1.4 but very smooth at 1.35. Games play better too. And they're just getting started, who knows what they can do... I think its gonna work out great.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
mohitrocks said:
Other phones that have come out relatively close to the Galaxy Nexus are the Samsung Galaxy S ll , HTC EVO 3D and finally the iPhone 4s (or the iPad in the site below) have much better benchmark scores compared to the Galaxy Nexus.
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The A5 in the iPhone 4s and iPad 2 has a dual-core SGX543MP2, which is why it benchmarks a lot higher. If you want a mobile device that will give the best gaming experience, the iPhone 4s is your best bet as it has the most powerful GPU out of all phones available.
i thought the gpu was 308 mhz? aaaand you don't need to oc to 1.4ghz for 384 mhz. i'm running 384 mhz stock and uv'ed. and yeah the 543mp2 suck up juice when you push them. but so does the 540. i'm happy with it. great balanced phone. should last two years. and somebody supposedly oc'ed the the 540 to 512mhz but i haven't seen a followup or proof yet so who knows.
You want a great gaming device, get a tablet, or better yet, the PS Vita, which will have much better software titles from A+ game studios.
I hear all of this talk about how well or how poorly these devices (i4s included) do with gaming, but I say, who cares? There are good games on Android and iOS, but hardly anything worth investing 30-40 hours of time in, like the Vita will have. The way I see it, if I really wanted to have an amazing portable gaming experience, the 250 dollar Vita will give me Uncharted, Killzone, Metal Gear Solid, God of War, LittleBigPlanet, etc etc. The list goes on. Plus that 250 dollars will, as a console, last me more than 2 years. Plus it actually has buttons and thumbsticks and such, things that are pretty important IMO.
Thanks for all the replies guys!
One thing to be noted though: The GPU can be overclocked without overclocking the CPU.
Another thing though, I'm actually not going to return it because I realized that I barely need to play a 20+ hour game on my phone. At home I have a computer (With an i5 2500k and a GTX 560 Ti), Ps3, xbox 360, etc so there's no room for a mobile device in terms of gaming at home, and when I'm out I'm usually at school so I barely game, and when I do, casual games are sufficient for my needs.
Thanks again guys
The gs2 epic touch gets the Mali 400 I think. Its an older but still very fast gpu. My wife's gs2 pulls 4200+ quadrant stock. Considered one of the best on the market...even w age.
stkiswr said:
The gs2 epic touch gets the Mali 400 I think. Its an older but still very fast gpu. My wife's gs2 pulls 4200+ quadrant stock. Considered one of the best on the market...even w age.
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Quadrant doesn't mean much, it isn't optimized for ICS yet.
The Mali 400 is a newer and much faster GPU than the SGX540, the 540 is a leftover from the original Galaxy S and Nexus S. The Exynos CPU is nothing short of amazing. I did some side by side testing of the Nexus and the GS2 today and it wasn't even close the GS2 smoked it in every test and game.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium
cbpagent72 said:
The Mali 400 is a newer and much faster GPU than the SGX540, the 540 is a leftover from the original Galaxy S and Nexus S. The Exynos CPU is nothing short of amazing. I did some side by side testing of the Nexus and the GS2 today and it wasn't even close the GS2 smoked it in every test and game.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium
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I wasn't trying to come off that quadrant was THE benchmark but over 4k stock seems nice.
I knew the gs2 was a beast but had no idea til we bought it. No buyers remorse here. It can stay on gbread forever for all I care. It runs better than anything I have used.
Haters gonna hate, but if you want a device for gaming, you should honestly look at an Apple device. The native nature of iOS apps gives Apple an advantage over Android right from the get go. Java apps will always be slower than apps written in C (or in this case Objective-C) for any given level of coder skill. Then you have to consider that Apple's current iPhone/iPad platform are running hardware that is uncharacteristically powerful compared to not only what Apple is notorious for using, but to most Android devices as well. Finally, the grim reality is still that the big name studios prefer to develop for iOS.
If you are ok with giving up many of the freedoms you may have become accustomed to with Android in exchange for gaming performance and selection, then the 4S is probably a good choice.
Sent from my Gummy Charged GBE 2.1 using XDA App
vash1053 said:
Haters gonna hate, but if you want a device for gaming, you should honestly look at an Apple device. The native nature of iOS apps gives Apple an advantage over Android right from the get go. Java apps will always be slower than apps written in C (or in this case Objective-C) for any given level of coder skill. Then you have to consider that Apple's current iPhone/iPad platform are running hardware that is uncharacteristically powerful compared to not only what Apple is notorious for using, but to most Android devices as well. Finally, the grim reality is still that the big name studios prefer to develop for iOS.
If you are ok with giving up many of the freedoms you may have become accustomed to with Android in exchange for gaming performance and selection, then the 4S is probably a good choice.
Sent from my Gummy Charged GBE 2.1 using XDA App
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But can you play super nintendo on a bigger screen?
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Lol you can get a gs2, pair a Bluetooth mouse and keyboard to the phone and play and game u want. Can't get closer than that
stkiswr said:
Lol you can get a gs2, pair a Bluetooth mouse and keyboard to the phone and play and game u want. Can't get closer than that
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overstatement, but close. you can do the same with the nexus too.
mohitrocks said:
Thanks for all the replies guys!
One thing to be noted though: The GPU can be overclocked without overclocking the CPU.
Another thing though, I'm actually not going to return it because I realized that I barely need to play a 20+ hour game on my phone. At home I have a computer (With an i5 2500k and a GTX 560 Ti), Ps3, xbox 360, etc so there's no room for a mobile device in terms of gaming at home, and when I'm out I'm usually at school so I barely game, and when I do, casual games are sufficient for my needs.
Thanks again guys
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Agreed. I've found that I've tried to play more involving games on my phones, but I just have trouble finding a groove. I'd much rather play stuff like NFL flick QB and cut the rope.
Sent from my GSM Galaxy Nexus on TMoUS using Tapatalk
pukemon said:
overstatement, but close. you can do the same with the nexus too.
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Haha to me if you really had the time to pair all that to a phone...you shoulda bought a laptop hahhaha
Hello Everyone I have a Galaxy Nexus and love it. My only question is how will this GPU hold up in the long run. Right now it does pretty well (not as well as my 4s though) but also can sometimes stutter and lag. It runs nearly every game pretty well. My question is how soon will it be when it will no longer be able to handle higher end games? So I guess the question remains is it worth waiting for tegra 3. I do not need the best graphics ever but do enjoy for the games to run well.
njkeys4 said:
Hello Everyone I have a Galaxy Nexus and love it. My only question is how will this GPU hold up in the long run. Right now it does pretty well (not as well as my 4s though) but also can sometimes stutter and lag. It runs nearly every game pretty well. My question is how soon will it be when it will no longer be able to handle higher end games? So I guess the question remains is it worth waiting for tegra 3. I do not need the best graphics ever but do enjoy for the games to run well.
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Are u on 4.0.2? The stuttering isn't due to the gpu being weak it has to due with the sw. 4.0.3 adds some performance enhancements which will mostly fix the lag and stuttering.
4.0.3 will help stuttering in games?
njkeys4 said:
Hello Everyone I have a Galaxy Nexus and love it. My only question is how will this GPU hold up in the long run. Right now it does pretty well (not as well as my 4s though) but also can sometimes stutter and lag. It runs nearly every game pretty well. My question is how soon will it be when it will no longer be able to handle higher end games? So I guess the question remains is it worth waiting for tegra 3. I do not need the best graphics ever but do enjoy for the games to run well.
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The SGX540 is older, but it is also clocked higher than before and integrated in new ways into the OMAP4460. Now, as a comparison to the 4S? Not even close. Apple went all out, the SGX543 MP2 blows the Nexus' GPU out of the water. Completely. If gaming is your primary focus, it is the wrong phone. That said, I have experienced zero lag in games, and I've tried all the major titles. I haven't modified my phone at all. I think the phone will start to show its age in about a year or so, when the next Nexus device is released. However, the same will happen with the 4S. I don't think it will be the GPU in that device, but rather the RAM, the 3G speeds, etc.
All technology has a short lifespan.
edit: Typos.
njkeys4 said:
4.0.3 will help stuttering in games?
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I'm not sure what game(s) you are trying to play, but so far I've just tried out Sentinel 3 on my Nexus. While I was on 4.0.2, overall system performance seemed to be sluggish. Now that I am on 4.0.3 it's improved. Sentinel 3 was indeed laggy on 4.0.2 yet it's mostly gone now on 4.0.3 The game did perform better on my old phone, but I feel it's just a matter of the developer improving support for this phone's GPU.
As for Tegra 3, the question is.. "when?" Asus & HTC have stated they have new Tegra 3 devices in the works but vague ETA's on them. For all we know it could be like the Bionic and get released many months after they were supposed to be. Only time will tell.
voxigenboy said:
I'm not sure what game(s) you are trying to play, but so far I've just tried out Sentinel 3 on my Nexus. While I was on 4.0.2, overall system performance seemed to be sluggish. Now that I am on 4.0.3 it's improved. Sentinel 3 was indeed laggy on 4.0.2 yet it's mostly gone now on 4.0.3 The game did perform better on my old phone, but I feel it's just a matter of the developer improving support for this phone's GPU.
As for Tegra 3, the question is.. "when?" Asus & HTC have stated they have new Tegra 3 devices in the works but vague ETA's on them. For all we know it could be like the Bionic and get released many months after they were supposed to be. Only time will tell.
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ASUS Transformer Prime is already out in some retailers/etailers, but it is not mainstreamly sold due to demand. My friend got one from Frys the other day. Also, Amazon has started shipping some Transformer Primes to preorderers.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834230218
Pros: Great screen,fast,light weight,plenty of memory.Newegg has great service. Ordered it 4:00 pm, received it at 10:30 am the next morning
Cons: Not ice cream sandwich
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.. So yeah, they're already being shipped out.
Thanks I am aware of Transformer Prime but I am looking phones. And the main game I noticed lag was GTA III. And if I can get 8 months with it I would be more then happy.
zephiK said:
ASUS Transformer Prime is already out in some retailers/etailers, but it is not mainstreamly sold due to demand. My friend got one from Frys the other day. Also, Amazon has started shipping some Transformer Primes to preorderers.
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I thought the Transformer Prime was a tablet though, not a phone?
voxigenboy said:
I thought the Transformer Prime was a tablet though, not a phone?
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You mentioned ASUS. When it comes to ASUS, first thing I think about is their recognition in tablets. I know they're making a phone but no one really thinks about phones when people say ASUS.
But any regards, gaming on a tablet would probably be more preferable because the screen is so much bigger. At least for me, so you might want to look into that and see if it is something you'd want to invest your money in.
zephiK said:
You mentioned ASUS. When it comes to ASUS, first thing I think about is their recognition in tablets. I know they're making a phone but no one really thinks about phones when people say ASUS.
But any regards, gaming on a tablet would probably be more preferable because the screen is so much bigger. At least for me, so you might want to look into that and see if it is something you'd want to invest your money in.
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oh... me?... well, i was planning on getting a transformer prime myself(eventually). but yeah they have their "padafone" cell phone that's tegra 3 and supposedly coming out 1st q 2012. curious on how that progresses.
that padafone looks very uncompelling with the exception of the tegra 3. Would much rather nexus
I have not seen any games yet that don't perform well.
Sent from my GSM Galaxy Nexus on TMoUS using Tapatalk
same GPU as nexus s, approx 20% higher performance but needs to push 2x as many pixels. Performance (framerate) is notieceably worse than my nexus s. For example, that backbreaker game runs at 60fps on my NS, its prolly around 40ish
Its not a big deal for me since I mostly play simple time waster games on my phone. I ave a PS3 and laptop for when I really want to game.
Honestly, I kind of laugh at the whole Tegra 3 thing. Because I ask myself "why?"
Nvidia is rushing out the door with their quad core (there's even a secret fifth core as well!) Tegra 3 when most of us still remember the Tegra 2 and how crappy it was on that first-generation of Honeycomb tablets.
I owned an original Transformer with the Tegra 2 and couldn't even play 720p videos properly. Of course part of the issue is codecs as well and the Galaxy Nexus as a vanilla Android device isn't great on that front either... still, I can't help but feel Nvidia is rushing forth with this quad-core thing when nobody else is there yet simply because their previous offering was so mediocre.
I mean they had to devise the whole unnecessary "optmized for Tegra" games thing to make it look like the Tegra SoCs are something special when they are at best competitors to other SoCs.
I hope they fix the live wallpaper stutters. It's just ridiculous bad
Typed from my kickass LTE Galaxy Nexus running AXI0M 2.2 combined with the HON3Y(S)CR3AM theme. ON3 ROM TO RUL3 TH3M ALL.
Some food for thought,,
Is Qualcomm cheating in Vellamo?
A few days ago we were happy to report about the first set of leaked HTC One X scores on an American device powered by Qualcomm’s new 28nm S4 chip.
The scores look quite good for Qualcomm, but since we got hold of an Asus Transformer Prime we decided to dig a bid deeper. Both Nvidia and Qualcomm do not want to get involved in official fight but we were quite surprised with what we learned. We also talked to some engineers that want to remain unnamed and we came up with a few interesting things.
The fastest CPU in Quadrant is Hummingbird S5PC110 from Nexus S as tested here.
Since we have tested this phone you can easily tell that this benchmark doesn't really use two or four cores properly. In this test S4 scores 4920 where the Tegra 3 based Transformer Prime scores 3954 and Tegra 2 scores 2154 on a custom ROM Optimus 2X.
The second test is the Vellamo benchmark was a bit more disturbing as once you run it you see Qualcomm ads all over it. This didn't give us much confidence and it turns out that Qualcomm has a lot of power over this particular benchmark.
Asus Transformer Prime scores 1408, while Qualcomm in Vellamo scores over 2000, our guess is between 2200 and 2300 as we didn't see the full number. Our good buddy Anand compared the One S powered by the S4 as well as the One X powered by Tegra 3 and you can see that Tegra 3 on this phone usually ends up faster or tied with the S4. It is faster in Sunspider Javascript benchmark 0.9.1, loses by a few points in Browsermark to S4 based HTC One S and dominates GLBenchmark. There is no 2X performance lead that we saw in the leaked S4 benches and frankly we see no point in taking Vellamo seriously until the issue is addressed.
Our engineering friends are telling us that Velamo disables some hardware acceleration in compositing Deap Sea Canvas and See the sun canvas subtest. Honeycomb and ICS support hardware acceleration by default and disabling this probably hurt the general score. One can argue that it hurts S4 scores as well, but it definitely hurts Tegra 3 more. The benchmark isn't flushing commands in the Pixel Blender subtest and there is a suspicion that this might help Qualcomm S4 to gain a better score.
The most important issue is the fact that it is unclear how Vellamo scores sub test scores. In Third party benchmarks such as Sun Spider and Google V8 it turns out that Vellamo penalizes high Google V8 scores and if your score gets too high in V8, the general score gets lower. There are a lot of benchmarks out there and some of the ones that like more cores include Antutu, CF benchmark and Moonbat.
French enthusiasts managed to run Antutu here, and Tegra 3 phone scores 10597, while the S4 based HTC One S scores 6458. This doesn't look so good for the phone that is based on S4 cores that should go after ARM’s upcoming A15 and it looks like that it cannot really beat the A9-based Tegra 3. In the real world, as long as the application is aware of four cores, there is a good chance that Tegra 3 will end up faster than the S4.
Naturally if you are reading this from the US and you really like your LTE from AT&T or Verison, I guess that you won’t have much choice and you will get the HTC One X with Qualcomm S4 as this chip also supports LTE. In the US it’s all about LTE and in Europe despite the fact that countries like Austria have LTE for more than a year now, even at €50 for 40GB there is almost no interest whatsoever. Networks need to put more advertising money and make 4G cool and it might happen. Of course, the lack of 4G devices is also an issue, but technology has a way of catching up.
The story gets even better when you know that there are lot of former ATI employees who take care of Adreno graphics and if natural selection and theory of evolution have taught us anything, it is that Nvidia and ATI are sworn enemies in any universe. Some readers might see a pinch of poetic justice in all of this, as Nvidia was accused of tweaking its GPU drivers to score more in PC benchmarks years ago.
Tudor Brown, the president of ARM that we meet a few years back at GlobalFoundries Dresden fab, once said that ARM does not want to get involved in GHz fight and this is now exactly what is going on, as punters are using benchmarks to prove of A is faster than B. Frankly I would be more concerned about battery life that I can get from a brand new phone as we got from five day battery life on feature phones to a day or so of battery life, and with LTE and heavy use, even this can go down to a few hours at best. If I found myself in Qualcomm’s shoes, this is what I would emphasize, the new 28nm process and energy efficiency, not skewed benchmarks.
Phones should be about the overall user experience, but how can you benchmark experience? It's a very subjective category and can hardly be expressed with cold numbers and statistics. We are not talking about PC components and the race for more performance, smartphones should be viewed as a complete package, battery life, build quality, UI and design come into play. Sheer performance is just one aspect and for many users it is still not the deciding factor and we believe it should not be.
In any case, watching the phone market will definitely be fun in the months to come.
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Source: Here
arthasz said:
Some food for thought,,
Source: Here
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haha fun stuff ill quote some of it in my thread if you don't mind thanks
to be honest this is exactly what i felt the moment i thought the score, its ridiculous
glad we got confirmation from some devs too
---------- Post added at 12:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:56 AM ----------
speaking of which, their Adreno3x series is far from ready
Qualcomm has Imagination
Apparently they might go with PowerVR for the windows s4 devices, i find this hard to believe
Semi accurate is part of this fud game
Now things make sense. That's why people don't blindly trust these benchmark score. Try real work applications you'll better idea of the device like running 12 HD video in T3 etc.
I've always trusted Antutu
& apparently, the tegra 3 version is a beast, scoring over 10,000!
My SGS2 scores just 4,700 on gingerbread & around 5,700 on ICS.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk
My overclocked (1,4 GHz) Desire Z (ICS with Sense 4.0A) got around 1 200 points in Vellamo, in graph it was just above Transformer Prime. Qualcomm must cheating.
Edit: added screenshots (due to my bad memory - it was just above while at 1,4 GHz ), at 1,6 GHz it is will be better than Prime (according to benchmark)
Reremnu said:
My overclocked (1,4 GHz) Desire Z (ICS with Sense 4.0A) got around 1 200 points in Vellamo, in graph it was just above Transformer Prime. Qualcomm must cheating.
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hahaha now that is crazy, disappointed that qualcomm took this direction they always been more transparent
actually its wrong that they make a test themselves it can never be considered impartial
snapdragon 4 cores are impressive as they are they don't need this kind of fud just because they don't have a quad ready
If this is really true, how about other benchmarks with other devices? can they be trusted?
heyyy... anyone can give me a review about gaming performance in note 8.... i found article say it stutering when play real racing 3... and this gadget have a poor performance in gaming??
can anyone give me a review about that...
i want to buy this n5100...
sorry for my bad english...
devilzzzz said:
heyyy... anyone can give me a review about gaming performance in note 8.... i found article say it stutering when play real racing 3... and this gadget have a poor performance in gaming??
can anyone give me a review about that...
i want to buy this n5100...
sorry for my bad english...
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For this time. Playing Games on Note 8.0 is ok. I have Fifa 2012, MC4, Fieldrunner 2, Real Rancing 3 and them run ok. But, I think for a longtime isn't good choice.
My son just got this tablet and I can tell you every game we have put on it has worked flawlessly. For us any game that works on my 10.1 has played as well if not better on the note 8 (including real racing 3).
duyminhphan said:
For this time. Playing Games on Note 8.0 is ok. I have Fifa 2012, MC4, Fieldrunner 2, Real Rancing 3 and them run ok. But, I think for a longtime isn't good choice.
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Can I know, what do you mean by for a long time isn't good choice? Is it become laggy if keep playing for a long time maybe 1-2 hours....
rpmbnsf said:
My son just got this tablet and I can tell you every game we have put on it has worked flawlessly. For us any game that works on my 10.1 has played as well if not better on the note 8 (including real racing 3).
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Do you mean everything that work on note 10.1 also work for. Note 8???
I also have note 10.1 but that's to big for me...
devilzzzz said:
Can I know, what do you mean by for a long time isn't good choice? Is it become laggy if keep playing for a long time maybe 1-2 hours....
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I think he means the shelf life... that it wont take long for games to start demanding more than what the note 8 has.
not that i agree completely..
devilzzzz said:
Can I know, what do you mean by for a long time isn't good choice? Is it become laggy if keep playing for a long time maybe 1-2 hours....
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All devices with Exynos 4412 are proved to be great in stability test, almost no throttling.
I'm doing a complete thumb suck here, but I expect the mali400 gpu that's in the Note 8.0 to start showing it's age in a year to two years.
What I mean by that is top games will still be very playable... But lag will become more and more noticeable in certain areas of the game. Either that or some of the bells and whistles will be turned off in the version that's 'officially' available to us on the Play Store.
After all... There will be a never ending push for ever more demanding games to 'show off' just how much better flagship devices are to previous generations. The Note 8.0 has a weaker gpu than the phone I bought 2 years ago... It can't be *that* much longer before it can no longer keep pace...
Just sayin....
FaeMinx said:
I'm doing a complete thumb suck here, but I expect the mali400 gpu that's in the Note 8.0 to start showing it's age in a year to two years.
What I mean by that is top games will still be very playable... But lag will become more and more noticeable in certain areas of the game. Either that or some of the bells and whistles will be turned off in the version that's 'officially' available to us on the Play Store.
After all... There will be a never ending push for ever more demanding games to 'show off' just how much better flagship devices are to previous generations. The Note 8.0 has a weaker gpu than the phone I bought 2 years ago... It can't be *that* much longer before it can no longer keep pace...
Just sayin....
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True, but this applies to almost all new technology. Always something new coming out. I'll keep mine for a year and sell it when I upgrade to the next greatest thing
ok thanks... now i just wait for the gadget come hope everything work perfectly... gaming,browsing,watching... and the battery life i hope just from morning till afternoon or night... :laugh:
duyminhphan said:
For this time. Playing Games on Note 8.0 is ok. I have Fifa 2012, MC4, Fieldrunner 2, Real Rancing 3 and them run ok. But, I think for a longtime isn't good choice.
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Note 8 OR Nexus 7 Which one is good for gaming? Which is future proof (1 year atleast) in terms of gaming?
livetech2 said:
Note 8 OR Nexus 7 Which one is good for gaming? Which is future proof (1 year atleast) in terms of gaming?
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I think note 8.0 better. And maybe 6 month for heavy game. Normal games is no problems. Sorry for my bad English.
Sent from my GT-N5100 using xda app-developers app
The note 8 is very fast but uses the Mali 400 GPU, an older (is it two years old now?) GPU.
For gaming, I'd hold off until after Google I/O to see what devices are announced. If the N7 is refreshed with the Mali 604 or so (and/or a Tegra 4) and a decent display, you might want to wait until it can be ordered.
In ordinary use, the GN8 is the fastest Android device I've used, and has the least lag of any Android device I've used. The Nexus 7 is very good, but it's just not playing in this league. I'm sure there are some Tegra optimized games that the N7 will do better on, but the UI overall is not this quick.
Incredibly fast in my use, and I play numerous graphics intensive games. DEFINITELY better than n7, trust me, I've owned both
Sent from my GT-N5110 using xda app-developers app
Can the Mali 400 GPU be overclocked with a custom kernel in order to squeese a little more performance from it?
Overclocking the Tegra 2 GPU on my ASUS Transformer as well as the CPU made a big difference in its gaming performance.
roustabout said:
The note 8 is very fast but uses the Mali 400 GPU, an older (is it two years old now?) GPU.
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I'm having a little trouble tracking down exactly when the Mali-400 MP gpu was first released, but here's an article on it from 2008: !!!
http://beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=48319
It was still a pretty beefy gpu in the Galaxy SII in 2011... But as far as I know was upstaged by the Adreno 220, which was to be found in the HTC Sensation (the phone I bought in 2011).
Some more info from back then:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4760/arms-mali400-mp4-is-the-fastest-smartphone-gpufor-now
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1050968
Hello everyone,
This thread will be used as a hub where I share some discoveries/observations which I stumbled upon mostly during working on my kernel projects.
I´ll clone the same thread over to the Pixel 7 forum as well. So without much further ado let´s just dive right into it.
A year ago everyone was excited for the Google SoC called Tensor 1 called GS101. One year later there is Tensor 2 called GS201.
I suggest to read about the differences, updated modem, ISP, TPU and GPU in various tech related articles.
Here´s a table so everyone gets up to speed on cores used, max freqs and other details:
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But how does that translate on the devices?
There were quite a few rumors before the actual release of the Tensor 2 SoC being manufactured on 4nm Samsung node instead of 5nm. However that was just wild speculation and unfortunately turned out to be not accurate. Tensor G2 is still manufactured in the 5nm process as confirmed by Google. This was quite a negative surprise to myself, as I don´t have good experiences from SD888 that´s also being manufactured in Samsung 5nm node and is quite a hot chip. While the switch to Samsung 4nm node, wasn´t all that great either (check sd8 gen1 on samsung 4nm vs sd8+ gen1 on tsmc 4nm) it would still have been an improvement.
While I was very excited for the Tensor G1 when the Pixel 6 devices launched, that excitement ebbed down the work I worked on the Pixel 6 series. The more I learned about the source, the more I stumbled upon Exynos driver over exynos driver, some are just left exactly like on Exynos device, some were "re-branded" by Google. Some Google did customize, but most of the drivers are just very much Exynos.
So all in all the following excerpt from Andrei Frumusanu´s article here sums it up pretty fitting:
While Google doesn’t appear to want to talk about it, the chip very clearly has provenance as a collaboration between Google and Samsung, and has a large amount of its roots in Samsung Exynos SoC architectures.
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The same is true for the Tensor 2, despite minor upgrades there. As I learned over the time, Tensor shares a lot of Exynos characteristics, one of those is performance vs thermals as hinted by in the linked Anandtech article. So let´s just jump into that first topic I want to cover.
I will cover more topics, those will also be probably interconnected to each other, but we have to start somewhere.
Thermals, Thermal Ceiling, Exynos Roots and Maximal Performance
To start things of: Thermals is a term that actually sums up a few mechanisms. Lets split this into two main areas.
The thermal ceiling (let´s call it that) that´s being implemented in the kernel, as the maximal temperature the SoC is allowed to be operated at.
The thermal-hal uses combined sensors, also virtual sensor, and restricts different subsystems, based on the temperature of those sensor. Those can be called skin temps, shell-temps, battery temperature, modem temperature etc.
First let´s explore the thermal ceiling on the two SoCs:
GS101 on Pixel 6 devices is allowed to be operated at 90°C. GS 201 on Pixel 7 devices raised the thermal ceiling by 10°C to 100°C.
If changes to the internal design allowed them to raise this, without further increasing heatup of the device, or if they just applied changes to the thermal-hal to better keep this in check I don´t know at this moment.
Let´s get back to the Exynos characterstics. I talked to a few other developers I met along that way with Exynos "experience". Exynos SoCs reach the thermal ceiling extremely quickly, as I learned. This means, the SoC can´t keep its max CPU freqs for more than a few seconds without touching the thermal ceiling and getting restricted. This is in a way also the case for other SoCs, but Exynos is very extreme in this regard. But it´s just the characteristics of the SoC, like previously mentioned.
That means in turn: The thermal ceiling is setting the maximal performance allowed, to a great extent. If the thermal ceiling is raised, the maximum performance can be held longer.
Here´s a demonstration of this:
Pixel 6 Pro in its default configuration running at 90°C temp ceiling:
New video by freak 07
photos.app.goo.gl
Pixel 6 Pro with temperature ceiling raised to 100°C, instead of 90°C running at Pixel 7 Pro clocks
New video by freak 07
photos.app.goo.gl
Pixel 7 Pro, with the default configuration of 100°C
New video by freak 07
photos.app.goo.gl
Now what´s interesting, the big cores get the hottest at the quickest rate. Once the ceiling is reached, the max performance drops, as maximal performance will be restricted by restrict max cpu freqs.
That´s the case after a few seconds on both SoCs, in typcial Exynos fashion.
Let´s make the next connection:
Although I´m not necessarily a friend of benchmark apps, how does that change the results of a CPU oriented benchmark like Geekbench you might ask yourself. There are other benchmarks, but I want to keep this simple for now.
The answer is: The Pixel 6 Pro with GS101 gets pretty close to the results of the Pixel 7 Pro with GS201.
So for comparisons sake:
On the left Pixel 6 Pro in its default configuration running at 90°C temp ceiling.
On the right Pixel 6 Pro with temperature ceiling raised to 100°C, instead of 90°C running at Pixel 7 Pro clocks.
The kernel used was the same, no changes to anything that could impact performance.
The left screenshot above was taken from the Pixel 7 Pro review from XDA, while the right one was taken on my Pixel 7 Pro running my kernel.
Please don´t start benchmark contests now, It´s just for comparisons sake.
It makes sense for single-core to be less impacted, as single core benchmarks don´t put as much thermal pressure on the SoC -> not touching the thermal ceiling as much and therefore no cutback are applied.
Geekbench applies a series of short benchmarks to the device. Usually not longer than 3-8 seconds, which is ideal for a SoC like the Tensor. Short bursts with max performance, so it can run "nearly" without touching the thermal ceiling.
If a benchmark is structured differently, like the CPU stress test you will see QCOM SoCs holding their max-freqs for minutes, instead of seconds.
Well that´s the first part. More to come. I hope everyone enjoyed this little writeup so far.
I wish everyone a nice evening.
Thermal Ceiling/Maximal Performance - A comparison between QCOM Snapdragon and Tensor
Now you might ask yourself, how does QCOM´s Snapdragon behave in the little test we conducted above.
You can find the answer below.
For this a Zenfone 9 with the Snapdragon 8 + Gen 1 is used.
Pixel 6 Pro in its default configuration running at 90°C temp ceiling:
New video by freak 07
photos.app.goo.gl
Pixel 7 Pro, with the default configuration of 100°C:
New video by freak 07
photos.app.goo.gl
Asus Zenfone 9, with the default configuration of 110°C temp ceiling:
New video by freak 07
photos.app.goo.gl
As you can see the Zenfone 9 with SD 8+ Gen 1 can hold the max-freqs for minutes. It doesn´t touch the thermal ceiling when running under max load for a minute, while Tensor immediately scratches the ceiling.
I´m not a SoC expert and I think only engineers with insider knowledge know the exact reason why Exynos based SoCs behave that way. They just seem to work totally different in that regard.
Another point is, since the SoCs are different we can´t compare the temperatures one to one. There´s no way for me to know the exact placement of the temperature sensors, all I can say for sure is the SD 8+ Gen 1, does not touch the thermal ceiling in this test and there seems to be a lot of headway after one minute of maxed out CPU.
In the end the result will be the same. After a while the device will heat up and the thermal-hal will throttle the ZF9 back as well, as with only passive cooling that´s inevitable.
this one is mine too
this one too
number 5
and the last one
Interesting, thanks for this explanation and comparison. Learned something new today.
so tensor is just Exynos but rebranded and more ai performance
w_tapper said:
so tensor is just Exynos but rebranded and more ai performance
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I´m not sure if it´s that easy in the end. It´s not just simply rebranded, there´s a lot of custom stuff in it, but at the core it´s based on the Exynos that´s clear.
I guess it´s just not possible to come up with a real custom chip in only a few years. It´s probably the beginning of that.
A few thoughts on tensor, that already allow google to better tune software to hardware which results in real life benefits:
The 4+2+2 design. That´s unique to the tensor and greatly favors those short performance boosts that are really critical in everyday usage. Everyone is constantly opening apps, if those apps launch a fraction faster, that´s a good real world benefit. (typical app launch times are between 0.2s and 0.7s.)
Tensor is not lacking behind the competition, let´s take the SD8+ Gen1, at all in that regard as just looking at benchmark scores would suggest.
I guess that´s a good section for another in depth post, that investigates real world usage.
The other is the TPU and the ISP.
Last year I used a Sony Xperia 1 III with SD888 (Sony more or less uses very relaxed thermal and basically unleashes full perf of SD888) vs the Pixel 6 Pro to edit the same video file and cut it.
The Pixel 6 Pro finished the task quite a bit faster. If I recall around 10-15 second faster.
There are other examples, but this will do for now.
updated the second post, with a comparison between QCOM´s Snapdragon and Google´s Tensor
Interesting since I wonder if a switch from P6P to P7P is worth it.
Utini said:
Interesting since I wonder if a switch from P6P to P7P is worth it.
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I like my P7P even better than the P6P, although I had no particular issues with the P6P. The USB 3.2 Gen 2 versus Gen 1 USB-C port pushed me over the edge.
Utini said:
Interesting since I wonder if a switch from P6P to P7P is worth it.
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In the end you have to decide yourself.
I can give maybe a few experiences. I think there´s not a single real regression going from p6pro to p7pro for me. That´s an important point, considering that´s not always the case in such upgrade scenarios.
I like the slightly lower placement of the buttons, they´re easier to reach for me. The FP might be a tad faster, but I was one of the lucky ones that never really had trouble on the p6pro. I like the face unlock.
What I really enjoy is the macro mode in GCAM. It works quite well and fills a gap.
While I never had any real problems with mobile network on the p6pro there are three areas I regularly drive through. All phones struggle there in a way. Some lose signal there, amongst them the p6pro, other can barely keep it. Though you never know with latency and "cheating" with the signal icons. Each OEM handles that differently.
However usually I notice I can´t call anyone there and spotify playback gets interrupted due to signal loss on p6pro. With the p7pro I´m able to make and receive calls in those areas and also no other kind of signal loss. If that´s the case for everyone or just a border case for me I don´t know. It´s just an observation.
There are lots of small improvements that add up. Is it worth it for you, you have to decide.
Freak07 said:
In the end you have to decide yourself.
I can give maybe a few experiences. I think there´s not a single real regression going from p6pro to p7pro for me. That´s an important point, considering that´s not always the case in such upgrade scenarios.
I like the slightly lower placement of the buttons, they´re easier to reach for me. The FP might be a tad faster, but I was one of the lucky ones that never really had trouble on the p6pro. I like the face unlock.
What I really enjoy is the macro mode in GCAM. It works quite well and fills a gap.
While I never had any real problems with mobile network on the p6pro there are three areas I regularly drive through. All phones struggle there in a way. Some lose signal there, amongst them the p6pro, other can barely keep it. Though you never know with latency and "cheating" with the signal icons. Each OEM handles that differently.
However usually I notice I can´t call anyone there and spotify playback gets interrupted due to signal loss on p6pro. With the p7pro I´m able to make and receive calls in those areas and also no other kind of signal loss. If that´s the case for everyone or just a border case for me I don´t know. It´s just an observation.
There are lots of small improvements that add up. Is it worth it for you, you have to decide.
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Ye I have read about the new "features". I loved face unlock on the 4XL and all the other new changes on the P7P are very welcome as well. But those aren't enough for me atm to switch to a new device. Especially since I first want thermals (e.g. 4k 60 fps video recording or while using the phone in the summer), radio signal and battery to be improved.
Radio signal seems to be better for now. My problems with the P6P seem to be the same that you have/had
Maybe that also helps slighty with battery, especially in dual-sim mode.
But I guess ultimately I will wait for the P7P and hope that it is going to be a "bigger" jump. The P6P is really fine for a phone. Jesus, I would even be fine with the P4XL.
Nice research and information. Was very interested in taking a deeper dive into the core differences between the G1 and G2. Thanks for sharing and laying this all out in a way that makes sense. Interested to see what else you can uncover!
Wait ... how did you change the temperature control threshold? I have been working on this. After the surface temperature of the phone exceeds 39 ° C, the operating frequency of Tensor will drop sharply, making the game experience very bad ... I think there is something like Magisk module to increase temperature control? Translate form Google.