Develop Bugs

Is it worth the wait for the touch pro 3?

touch pro 2 is really awesome, but seriously, the same processor, ram and camera??
K also there are gonna be some 1 GHz phones coming up soon I read, so I htought about and well, the touch pro 2 i PERFECT, but under powered..... so, umm.. really is it worth it, if it comes to t-mobile than who knows whne a better wm phone will come around to t-mobile, so I guess that would be nice but would I be better off just to wait for a better phone and just get it unlocked, cause honestly, how would it feel to have the best phone ever and then 3 months later have it crushed by 1 GHz processors? But I really like this phone, just cant decide if its worth it or not cause othere than the processor, it is AMAZING, if only they uped it to like 700 something cause.. COME ONE 1 GHz phones???

I seriously think the only reason people think it is underpowered is because they aren't seeing a speed bump between it and the orginal touch pro. Does that mean that it's bad, insufficient, or underpowered? Not necessarily? I'm using a titan, so I haven't spent time with the TP or THD, but is more power needed? HTC has worked hard to improve the efficiency of their software and the smothness of the build. That was specifically mentioned by multiple reps at WDC (getting from vids, I wasn't there). There aren't many 3D games on these yet so really the only thing that I can image better specs making a significant difference in is video performance. How has the THD and TP done in these respects when using custom builds and being optimized?
If it's not necessary, I might prefer the lower specs as it will lead to better batter life and a lower cost. I don't want power just because it's possible. Rather, I want what is best for my overall experience.

Agreed - battery life is key and the phone looks to be powered just right for me and how I use it. I guess a phone in the hand is sometimes worth more than two in the bushes (or drawing boards...). I'm pretty sure I'm gonna go for it as soon as it's out for AT&T.
~Eric

so its going to suffer the same video issues that plague the HD, diamond and the Pro. what a bore.

i will wait for the touch pro 3 if it has a dpad and softkeys.

ekerbuddyeker said:
so its going to suffer the same video issues that plague the HD, diamond and the Pro. what a bore.
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Click to collapse
Don't have those models or have even seen them. I have the antiquated Vogue and I've never experienced a video problem unless I try to play a movie far too outsized for the device. then frames drop like mad. But if I use it sensibly the video is great. My chief complaint is that at times the audio will go perhaps a half second out of sync. Nothing intolerable.

Yeah but also if 1 GHz phones coemout a few months after this then they will all be cabable of peforming htings that this phone never will be, its not that its not enougph power, especially when your coming from a tilt, but at the same time to think that the phones could be over powered by otehre phones by such a large margin in a matter of months kinda scares me, but all the otehre thinkgsd they tweaked make me love this phone, better speakers, better touch scree, thinner phone, better battery life, and also highr resoultuion.

Link278 said:
Yeah but also if 1 GHz phones coemout a few months after this then they will all be cabable of peforming htings that this phone never will be, its not that its not enougph power, especially when your coming from a tilt, but at the same time to think that the phones could be over powered by otehre phones by such a large margin in a matter of months kinda scares me, but all the otehre thinkgsd they tweaked make me love this phone, better speakers, better touch scree, thinner phone, better battery life, and also highr resoultuion.
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Click to collapse
I don't quite get that argument. Computers in virtually every form factor have always been overpowered in a matter of months. Hence Moore's Law. That doesn't seem to me like a good reason to wait. You'll be able to make the same argument when the 1GHz phones are available. "1.5 GHZ phones are just around the corner! Don't buy now! You won't be able to use the latest mobile Java Twitter client that might be released 6 months after the new phones are available."

Or pehaps wait for the TP4
If you wait 2 years you´ll have a better device than the TP2...

my main concern is that it has the same processor as the touch pro 1 and alot of the new phones had that too so maybe just a couple monts later better phones will comeo ut but yeah this phone has a lot of great features too

Link278 said:
my main concern is that it has the same processor as the touch pro 1 and alot of the new phones had that too so maybe just a couple monts later better phones will comeo ut but yeah this phone has a lot of great features too
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Click to collapse
Perhaps, but as has been mentioned elsewhere it seems likely to me that the roadblock to faster processors is not the technology of the processor per se, but the battery life.
Would you take twice the processor at half the battery? Or 30% greater size/weight? No idea if the change is that drastic, and some people obviously would make that trade. But I don't think that phone would have the target market that this one does - and my suspicion is that such a target market would be much smaller than is practical for anything but a luxury phone. The same sort of market that spends $1000 for a wallpaper app.
In any case, while advances in batteries are being made, I'm not aware of any substantial improvements ready for production on the horizon.

ajbopp said:
Perhaps, but as has been mentioned elsewhere it seems likely to me that the roadblock to faster processors is not the technology of the processor per se, but the battery life.
Would you take twice the processor at half the battery? Or 30% greater size/weight? No idea if the change is that drastic, and some people obviously would make that trade. But I don't think that phone would have the target market that this one does - and my suspicion is that such a target market would be much smaller than is practical for anything but a luxury phone. The same sort of market that spends $1000 for a wallpaper app.
In any case, while advances in batteries are being made, I'm not aware of any substantial improvements ready for production on the horizon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess you have a pretty good point, I just hope that other phones at that are released at the same time are faster and lighter

Well, I can understand the frustration with an unchanged processor at 500 MHz and a doubling to 1GHz right around the corner. However, I think it will be sufficient. Either way, I won't be able to buy till December anyway so I'll have a pretty good idea about what's coming out next and might have more options besides the Rhodium on Sprint.
Either way, my main requirements are still there. Large and High Res touchscreen (VGA or WVGA), hardware keyboard, and a decent amount of hardware buttons (getting worse )

Poke_N_PDA said:
Either way, my main requirements are still there. Large and High Res touchscreen (VGA or WVGA), hardware keyboard, and a decent amount of hardware buttons (getting worse )
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Heh...my requirements are almost the opposite, except for the screen. The Rhodium would be perfect for me if it just didn't have that damn keyboard. Maybe Sprint will come out with something like the HD2 for me, but it's not looking like it'll be 2009 if they do.

ajbopp said:
Heh...my requirements are almost the opposite, except for the screen. The Rhodium would be perfect for me if it just didn't have that damn keyboard. Maybe Sprint will come out with something like the HD2 for me, but it's not looking like it'll be 2009 if they do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think we'll see more hit in 2009 (not necessarily from HTC). Also, I really think we'll see the screens keep getting bigger as they can continue to shove it closer to the edge of the device and make the device thinner. Eventually, I wouldn't be surprised if we maxed out at a 4.1 inch WVGA screen. You could do it in a device the size of the iPhone, we just probably aren't quite there technologically.

Well yeah ur right technoledgy will alwaye become better, so i think I would just get this phone unless there are better phones out thwne it comes out which i doubt will hapeen

ajbopp said:
Perhaps, but as has been mentioned elsewhere it seems likely to me that the roadblock to faster processors is not the technology of the processor per se, but the battery life.
Would you take twice the processor at half the battery? Or 30% greater size/weight? No idea if the change is that drastic, and some people obviously would make that trade. But I don't think that phone would have the target market that this one does - and my suspicion is that such a target market would be much smaller than is practical for anything but a luxury phone. The same sort of market that spends $1000 for a wallpaper app.
In any case, while advances in batteries are being made, I'm not aware of any substantial improvements ready for production on the horizon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not relevant: a fast processor car throtle down its speed to spare energy
Besides the new 1 Ghz processor will be engraved with a smaller process --> should also save energy. I havent checked the power consumption of the new Ghz processor but I can bet it is likely to be the same
It's quite likely HTC just wnated to save money (Or was not ready yet to integrate the new processor in its product)
About video issues: it's not a matter of speed of the processor but if I recall well video drivers issues (Hopefully they fixed it with the Rhodium but I doubt it. It seems HTC doesnt care)
What would be exciting to wait for is a phone with the new Tegra from nvidia. It will actually probably come out in the next few months

ajbopp said:
Heh...my requirements are almost the opposite, except for the screen. The Rhodium would be perfect for me if it just didn't have that damn keyboard. Maybe Sprint will come out with something like the HD2 for me, but it's not looking like it'll be 2009 if they do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why dont you go for the Diamond2 then ?

Alcibiade said:
Not relevant: a fast processor car throtle down its speed to spare energy
Besides the new 1 Ghz processor will be engraved with a smaller process --> should also save energy. I havent checked the power consumption of the new Ghz processor but I can bet it is likely to be the same
It's quite likely HTC just wnated to save money (Or was not ready yet to integrate the new processor in its product)
About video issues: it's not a matter of speed of the processor but if I recall well video drivers issues (Hopefully they fixed it with the Rhodium but I doubt it. It seems HTC doesnt care)
What would be exciting to wait for is a phone with the new Tegra from nvidia. It will actually probably come out in the next few months
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
but since thats not a htc phone doesnt that mean it wont be on xda's website, and if thats the caase, im not sure its worth the 472 MHz lol

Alcibiade said:
Why dont you go for the Diamond2 then ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Smaller screen.

[Q] Few Questions About The Processor

Since it's release date on October 10, I've been debating on whether or not I should get this over the Amaze 4g and after 4 days, I decided that the galaxy s 2 is the best choice for me. Now after watching some videos of the original galaxy s 2, I want to know what things were left out in terms of processing power. All I know is that it uses the snapdragon s3 processor which runs on an a8 cortex as opposed to the a9 in the exynos processor. I know that speed is one of the things that the exynos has over snapdragon and also the fact that it's asynchronous as opposed to qualcomm running one core at a time (correct me if I'm wrong here, not savy on processors). The biggest things I know I will use on this phone is Internet, photos, media, and some gaming here and there. On YouTube I saw the original galaxy s 2 capable of running an N64 emulator with virtually no lag, though I don't know if sound was included, and the same goes for the psx emulator. I also saw how it was able to play multiple video formats (including 1080p mkv files) with no issues whatsoever. I want to know if the snapdragon processor would still be capable of running emulators at similar speeds and still have support for multiple video formats even though it's not as fast as the exynos processor. Help is definitely appreciated.
P.S. This was typed on an iPod so sorry if there are any typos and grammar mistakes.

The Qualcomm chip is asynchronous.
Right now, I don't know how much Samsung did to fine-tune the system to accommodate the hardware differences....but like you said, the Qualcomm chip is A8 and the Exynos is A9.
That speaks for itself.

PoisonWolf said:
The Qualcomm chip is asynchronous.
Right now, I don't know how much Samsung did to fine-tune the system to accommodate the hardware differences....but like you said, the Qualcomm chip is A8 and the Exynos is A9.
That speaks for itself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have no idea in the difference care to enlighten me or post a link?
Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk

Mudkip said:
I have no idea in the difference care to enlighten me or post a link?
Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Essentially, the Qualcomm chip is running on an older architecture relative to the Exynos, which is typically why the Exynos outperforms the Qualcomm even at lower clockspeeds. I'm guessing T-Mobile needed the SGS2 to be on par with with its siblings thus the higher clockspeeds (1.5ghz) to accommodate the older architecture.
The iPhone 4 and iPhone 4S if I'm not mistaken are also running chips that are based on the A9 architectures.
There is a difference when using the original SGS2 with the T-Mobile version...but it's not too drastic. What the CPU makes up in lack of speed, the big screen more than makes up for it.

I'm quite new to this forum, therefore I can't post external links yet. However, perform a google search for "How Samsung's chip change-up affects the T-Mobile Galaxy S II" the first link is an interesting article.

The normal clockspeed for this processor is 1.5GHz

kosnarf said:
I'm quite new to this forum, therefore I can't post external links yet. However, perform a google search for "How Samsung's chip change-up affects the T-Mobile Galaxy S II" the first link is an interesting article.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What I took away from that article is that they went Snapdragon in order to use another modem chip to be able to do 42Mbps. The sacrifice is graphics performance.
Hmm, it plays my HD movie great. Not sure I will ever play a first person shooter on it...

heygrl said:
The normal clockspeed for this processor is 1.5GHz
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i was about to point out the same
the Qualcomm CPU stock speed is 1.5 Ghz, the same CPU on HTC Sense was actually under clocked to 1.2 Ghz
so the new HTC Amaze is using the CPU at is normal speed like on our phone

toy4x4 said:
What I took away from that article is that they went Snapdragon in order to use another modem chip to be able to do 42Mbps. The sacrifice is graphics performance.
Hmm, it plays my HD movie great. Not sure I will ever play a first person shooter on it...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It also sacrifices general OS performance, at least in its current state. Looks like Samsung did no optimization on this guy for the qcom SoC. As it currently stands, I find it more laggy than my (admittedly) highly optimized Epic (single core). Hopefully things will improve with devs, etc.

I had the original and was using it on att gophone,
and sold it to get this. I needed to be on a contract and Tmobile was my only option so I got this
User interface was faster and smoother, apps opened and closed in the blink of an eye
games also ran with no lag whatsoever
Screen is bigger, no hardware buttons, and faster data is a plus for me
Tmobile is very spotty in my area tho
Sometimes I feel like I should have stayed
This phone has been behaving differently
The user interface is nearly as smooth and some of my favorite games lag
(Dragon fly, modern combat 2)
Still a great phone but these 2 Arras are disappointing for me
Sent from my SGH-T989 using XDA Premium App

Krooked22 said:
I had the original stay.
User interface was faster and smoother, apps opened and closed in the blink of an eye
games also ran with no lag whatsoever
This phone has been behaving differently
The user interface is nearly as smooth and some of my favorite games lag
(Dragon fly, modern combat 2)
Still a great phone but these 2 Arras are disappointing for me
Sent from my SGH-T989 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To be clear, gaming performance will never be as good on this platform. The GPU is severely weaker than the exynos models. What remains to be seen is if the rest of the OS can be optimized though.

ap77 said:
To be clear, gaming performance will never be as good on this platform. The GPU is severely weaker than the exynos models. What remains to be seen is if the rest of the OS can be optimized though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The OS definitely can be a little more optimized for this processor. This phone isn't a slouch though.
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda premium

OuncE718 said:
The OS definitely can be a little more optimized for this processor. This phone isn't a slouch though.
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is a slouch relatively speaking, to the people who forked out full retail for this phone.
I might get this phone, if and only if, FULL hardware acceleration is not announced on the Prime, even then, I shall hunt it for free via retentions.

PoisonWolf said:
It is a slouch relatively speaking, to the people who forked out full retail for this phone.
I might get this phone, if and only if, FULL hardware acceleration is not announced on the Prime, even then, I shall hunt it for free via retentions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am one of the people who forked out full retail. I can take a picture of my receipt to prove. We nit pick at every single phone that comes out. Trust me when I say this phone isn't a slouch. Yes it stutters once in a blue, but its fast and pretty smooth. All we need is an official update from Samsung to fix the issue or get a few custom roms. I've owned literally every smartphone that came out for T-Mobile this year and the previous years and I can honestly say this happens to be the fastest, even with the slight stutter it gets every now and then. It's just a slight software issue. I believe that this processor is capable of getting the job done.
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda premium

this is my third phone this year and im done .nothing to complain about if i start worrying about milliseconds then i would never buy another phone again because the galaxy s3 will be a few milliseconds faster than this one and so on and on. i made a promise to myself that im done till the end of nex year

tigerz0202 said:
this is my third phone this year and im done .nothing to complain about if i start worrying about milliseconds then i would never buy another phone again because the galaxy s3 will be a few milliseconds faster than this one and so on and on. i made a promise to myself that im done till the end of nex year
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol. I don't think your done. I think we all say this same thing. I bet I'll probably see you over at the Nexus Prime forum. I really love this phone and would like to say I'm done for the year too, but I think what makes some of us go for the next best thing is A. its the next best thing and B. we realize that our dev community gets smaller whenever the next best thing comes out so we want to be back in the loop of things. I'M JUST A PHONE SLUT!
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda premium

OuncE718 said:
II've owned literally every smartphone that came out for T-Mobile this year and the previous years and I can honestly say this happens to be the fastest, even with the slight stutter it gets every now and then. It's just a slight software issue. I believe that this processor is capable of getting the job done.
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I also paid full retail (pending Prime announcement), but I can tell you that my highly optimized Epic is smoother than this phone is right now in day-to-day use. Now, hopefully that means that there is a lot of room for improvement as this chip is theoretically faster and dual-core, but it is an open question of whether that promise will be realized.

ap77 said:
I also paid full retail (pending Prime announcement), but I can tell you that my highly optimized Epic is smoother than this phone is right now in day-to-day use. Now, hopefully that means that there is a lot of room for improvement as this chip is theoretically faster and dual-core, but it is an open question of whether that promise will be realized.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We will be rewarded by both Samsung and the devs soon.
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda premium

OuncE718 said:
Lol. I don't think your done. I think we all say this same thing. I bet I'll probably see you over at the Nexus Prime forum. I really love this phone and would like to say I'm done for the year too, but I think what makes some of us go for the next best thing is A. its the next best thing and B. we realize that our dev community gets smaller whenever the next best thing comes out so we want to be back in the loop of things. I'M JUST A PHONE SLUT!
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This ^

This processor is the same one used in the now defunct HP touchpad. People have successfully overclocked their touchpads to 1.7ghz with minimal to no additional drain on battery but a noticeable speed boost. I imagine our phones will react much the same way

[Q] Should I get a Rezound or Spectrum?

I'm in the market for a new device as my contract is up and I my Dinc isn't doing it for me anymore, even with ICS installed. I want to know what some of you guys with experience with both of the phones think I should do. The main improvements that I want out of my next smartphone are in order:
1 - Display - mainly size
2 - Microhphone - I'm a songwriter and record song ideas to my phone all the time. the Dinc's mic is awful and distorted at anything louder than a speaking voice.
3 - Battery - I realize that with batteries not getting much bigger and LTE coming on board that this may be a pipe dream ... but I'd like to get an 8AM to midnight day out of my next phone.
4 - On board speaker - I miss calls regularly on my Dinc because it isn't loud enough and I've had to replace the speaker once already.
Here are my winners of the two after handling them in the store:
1 - Display - LG
2 - Microphone - LG by long shot (noise cancellation) - Rezound's is just as bad as my Dinc's
3 - Battery - have no clue. anyone have any insight for me? I am crazy to think getting a full day out of either of these phones is possible? I don't know if the screen/mic/data speed upgrade would even be worth it if I'm going to be tethered to the wall every 6 hours.
4 - Speaker Volume - LG
Here are a couple things I'm unsure about that I've loved about my Dinc. Any insight would be appreciated.
DEV Support - Rezound wins this by long shot, but the Spectrum is brand new, so there's no real telling what the Dev community will look like. What are the chances the Spectrum gets CM9?
WIFI Tether - I assume LG is rootable, since most LGs have unlocked bootloader & NitroHD has been rooted. Am I wrong to assume it will be rooted or does anyone know if it's happened yet?
Extra Points:
LG also had random issue of GPS not connecting while in verizon store. That could be seriously annoying.
Rezound's camera also kills LG's but I never take pictures, so it doesn't matter to me. The Mic superiority would make it easy for me to make this trade-off.
Here's a video review by wirefly that confirms most of my observations:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTMVfhLIc48

I too have an AMOLED DInc and am considering using my upgrade. I was looking at Verizon's latest crop of HD LTE phones, including the Galaxy Nexus, RAZR (qHD is not True HD), Rezound, and Spectrum. Out of all of them I personally prefer the Spectrum; I prefer its display (IPS RGB LCD beats PenTile SAMOLED or SLCD IMO), and there's something about the phone I just like despite being able to put my finger on it.
That being said, will I use my upgrade for it? NO.
Why? Phones using Qualcomm's Snapdragon S4 SoC will be coming out soon, like 2Q. The chipset is 28nm, which will offer better performance while using less power, and includes one radio chip that covers all standards and thus will will use less power itself.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4940/qualcomm-new-snapdragon-s4-msm8960-krait-architecture/1
I really want the Spectrum and keep finding myself drawn to it for the reasons you outlined. And the Spectrum will be able to do the few things that my DInc can't, like HDMI out via MHL over microUSB.
If I can hold out until May or June, I should be able to get an even better phone. And I won't mind paying $300 for a phone that I will keep for almost two years, versus a $200 phone I will want to replace before the end of the year. Yeah, I know waiting always will get me better hardware. But why use my upgrade so few months before a new generation of chips come out?
Look at it this way: would someone who bought a DROID Bionic have pulled the trigger knowing that the RAZR was right around the corner? What about those people who recently got a DROID 3 only to find out the DROID 4 is coming soon?
I'm pretty sure a new phone in June will be able to go at least a year before an incremental increase in performance hits the market, and even then it won't be a big enough increase to justify replacing your phone. While the jump from Snapdragon S1 to S3 is huge, a few months later the jump from S1 to S4 will be even bigger and will come with less of a battery-usage penalty.
I think if you're definitely going to get a new phone, get the Spectrum. Root it, debloat it, and run a different launcher (I tried LauncherPro on it in the store and it worked fine). But if you can wait, just hold on a bit longer...
p.s. I wouldn't worry too much about GPS connectivity INSIDE OF A BUILDING. ;-)

Thanks for talking me off the ledge. It seems like neither phone is worth it with the battery gains that are on the horizon. I tried to do the same for a friend who got the bionic and he regrets not listening.
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App

vantagejuan said:
I'm in the market for a new device as my contract is up and I my Dinc isn't doing it for me anymore, even with ICS installed. I want to know what some of you guys with experience with both of the phones think I should do. The main improvements that I want out of my next smartphone are in order:
1 - Display - mainly size
2 - Microhphone - I'm a songwriter and record song ideas to my phone all the time. the Dinc's mic is awful and distorted at anything louder than a speaking voice.
3 - Battery - I realize that with batteries not getting much bigger and LTE coming on board that this may be a pipe dream ... but I'd like to get an 8AM to midnight day out of my next phone.
4 - On board speaker - I miss calls regularly on my Dinc because it isn't loud enough and I've had to replace the speaker once already.
Here are my winners of the two after handling them in the store:
1 - Display - LG
2 - Microphone - LG by long shot (noise cancellation) - Rezound's is just as bad as my Dinc's
3 - Battery - have no clue. anyone have any insight for me? I am crazy to think getting a full day out of either of these phones is possible? I don't know if the screen/mic/data speed upgrade would even be worth it if I'm going to be tethered to the wall every 6 hours.
4 - Speaker Volume - LG
Here are a couple things I'm unsure about that I've loved about my Dinc. Any insight would be appreciated.
DEV Support - Rezound wins this by long shot, but the Spectrum is brand new, so there's no real telling what the Dev community will look like. What are the chances the Spectrum gets CM9?
WIFI Tether - I assume LG is rootable, since most LGs have unlocked bootloader & NitroHD has been rooted. Am I wrong to assume it will be rooted or does anyone know if it's happened yet?
Extra Points:
LG also had random issue of GPS not connecting while in verizon store. That could be seriously annoying.
Rezound's camera also kills LG's but I never take pictures, so it doesn't matter to me. The Mic superiority would make it easy for me to make this trade-off.
Here's a video review by wirefly that confirms most of my observations:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTMVfhLIc48
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I get 15 hours or so on average with medium usage. The battery life for the LG is good, but it really depends what you're doing.
As for the GPS, this is the best GPS I've used in a smartphone BY FAR.
Is the Rezound camera that much better? The LG camera is pretty good too, especially the 1080p recording.
And yes, I tested the noise cancellation and recording quality myself. I'd have to say that it's nothing short of fantastic.

vantagejuan said:
Thanks for talking me off the ledge. It seems like neither phone is worth it with the battery gains that are on the horizon. I tried to do the same for a friend who got the bionic and he regrets not listening.
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HI, could you elaborate on these battery gains on the horizon you mention?
It's my understanding the upcoming quadcore phones can't manage batteries any better and as far as my research goes, the only new battery tech on the horizon is lithium-air technology.

OP: I'm talking myself off the ledge too.
I REALLY want the LG Spectrum, and I need to keep reminding myself why I should wait. I think I'll read that link quite a few times before I upgrade to an S4 Krait processor.
Sent from my AMOLED DInc using XDA App

scott0 said:
HI, could you elaborate on these battery gains on the horizon you mention?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ICS + s4 + trending towards bigger batteries (razr maxx)= my feeling that we'll have a device that can surf 4g all day before too long
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App

liteon163 said:
OP: I'm talking myself off the ledge too.
I REALLY want the LG Spectrum, and I need to keep reminding myself why I should wait. I think I'll read that link quite a few times before I upgrade to an S4 Krait processor.
Sent from my AMOLED DInc using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If either of us gets the spectrum, the one that does owes the other an extended battery. Deal?
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App

DEAL! :-D
Sent from my AMOLED DInc using XDA App

vantagejuan said:
ICS + s4 + trending towards bigger batteries (razr maxx)= my feeling that we'll have a device that can surf 4g all day before too long
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I will be the one to break it to you- This is not a forward movement in tech, fact is, there's no real data to back this up.
putting a bigger gas tank on a sports car is not a tech advancement. any device can connect with brick of a battery. that's not anything new. quad core will use the same battery technology that we all have access to.

scott0 said:
I will be the one to break it to you- This is not a forward movement in tech, fact is, there's no real data to back this up.
putting a bigger gas tank on a sports car is not a tech advancement. any device can connect with brick of a battery. that's not anything new. quad core will use the same battery technology that we all have access to.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I mentioned nothing about quad core. Qualcomm's s4 chips will have 28nm size and a tightly integrated radio that will use battery power much more efficiently.
I will be avoiding the exact scenario that you're describing with the new quad core phones that will be gobbled up by the masses just because they have quad in their name. Google it or click the link provided by liteon163 above.

vantagejuan said:
I mentioned nothing about quad core. Qualcomm's s4 chips will have 28nm size and a tightly integrated radio that will use battery power much more efficiently.
I will be avoiding the exact scenario that you're describing with the new quad core phones that will be gobbled up by the masses just because they have quad in their name. Google it or click the link provided by liteon163 above.
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Click to collapse
Thank you for expanding, sorry I lumped quad core into your comment/view.

scott0 said:
Thank you for expanding, sorry I lumped quad core into your comment/view.
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Click to collapse
You're welcome. No problem. I can understand the confusion between s4 and quad core.

vantagejuan said:
You're welcome. No problem. I can understand the confusion between s4 and quad core.
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Click to collapse
also I think I am just frustrated at the lack of battery development overall & it especially hits a nerve with these devices.

Android Wear 2

Anyone think we will get this for our Moto 360's? I hope so.
Sent from my Nexus 6 using XDA-Developers mobile app

Already being discussed here.

That had been deleted.
Sent from my Nexus 6 using XDA-Developers mobile app

alryder said:
Already being discussed here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, its been deleted.
Sent from my Nexus 6 using XDA-Developers mobile app

I dont think we are http://www.phonedog.com/2016/06/11/moto-360-1st-gen-wont-get-android-wear-20-update
Sent from my SM-N920P using XDA-Developers mobile app

Is any dev gonna try to port it?

sohansonu said:
Is any dev gonna try to port it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Gosh, I hope so. I seriously doubt Android Wear 2 is simply too strenuous on the processors to not be ported. I understand the TI processor in it is rather proprietary and no other Wear devices use it, but I can't believe Wear 2 would warrant new hardware.

I don't think I'll be able to buy another moto product again. I just don't trust them anymore to do things right. I own a nexus 6 and that has a screen flicker when charging, red tint on low brightness, and a speaker that crackles on low battery. I'm on my second moto 360 due to a cracked back (seriously glass back? Are you kidding me?) and the one I have now has a cracked back too after a few months. The first one was due to my wrist movements cracking it, and the second due to the metal band hitting the glass back. I hate apple products just because they are overpriced, have terrible batteries, and the screen is designed to break when dropped. HOWEVER, Apple is #1 at supporting their products until the very end with software updates and they never have an issue that isn't caused by user error (even tho the media says the bend on iphones is an issue, that only happens to the stupid people who throw their phones and sit their fat rear end on them constantly).
Hopefully one of you awesome developers out there ports it over for us. Otherwise I think I may be done with smart watches for a while. The only good looking one is the huawei watch but its too expensive and doesn't have 4g. The lg watch urbane has an LTE model... But it is ugly.
Oh android makers and their obcession with shooting themselves in the foot...

nascar48 said:
I don't think I'll be able to buy another moto product again. I just don't trust them anymore to do things right. I own a nexus 6 and that has a screen flicker when charging, red tint on low brightness, and a speaker that crackles on low battery. I'm on my second moto 360 due to a cracked back (seriously glass back? Are you kidding me?) and the one I have now has a cracked back too after a few months. The first one was due to my wrist movements cracking it, and the second due to the metal band hitting the glass back. I hate apple products just because they are overpriced, have terrible batteries, and the screen is designed to break when dropped. HOWEVER, Apple is #1 at supporting their products until the very end with software updates and they never have an issue that isn't caused by user error (even tho the media says the bend on iphones is an issue, that only happens to the stupid people who throw their phones and sit their fat rear end on them constantly).
Hopefully one of you awesome developers out there ports it over for us. Otherwise I think I may be done with smart watches for a while. The only good looking one is the huawei watch but its too expensive and doesn't have 4g. The lg watch urbane has an LTE model... But it is ugly.
Oh android makers and their obcession with shooting themselves in the foot...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Moto support comes 2nd place in the worst support after Apple, now that lenovo owns Motorola. Things just went from bad to worse

"Motorola has confirmed that the original Moto 360 will not be receiving the Android Wear 2.0 update"
http://m.androidcentral.com/original-moto-360-will-not-receive-android-wear-20-update
As mentioned before; hopefully some developer will fix this anyway.

sohansonu said:
Moto support comes 2nd place in the worst support after Apple, now that lenovo owns Motorola. Things just went from bad to worse
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would typically rip on Samsung and their lack of updates, but I really can't because their only android wear watch got the 1.5 update and they don't even support android wear anymore!

So does anyone have any plans to port 2.0 over?
I would be eternally grateful.

That's the support early adopters get from Motorola... none. Us users who had to go through cracked backplates, screen burns, software glitches and patches will not get further official support. Team Moto -10 points.

L4WL13T said:
So does anyone have any plans to port 2.0 over?
I would be eternally grateful.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I second that! a ported ROM would be the dream, and the maker will be the king of Moto 360 fans!

jihadinhorocks said:
I second that! a ported ROM would be the dream, and the maker will be the king of Moto 360 fans!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
is not that easy.
main problem is that you would need to flash it through the factory cable (I think 2% moto 360 users have one)
second, this watch is based on TI OMAP cpu, and is the only one with this SoC. porting without a similar device is hell. and this porting would make happy 2% moto users. not worth
G watch is more likely going to have a porting, it has standard s400 SoC.
fortunately I never sold my g watch, battery and performance is much better than moto 360.....
go on guys, buy next one or wait for qualcom 2100 chips for wearables

throcker said:
is not that easy.
main problem is that you would need to flash it through the factory cable (I think 2% moto 360 users have one)
second, this watch is based on TI OMAP cpu, and is the only one with this SoC. porting without a similar device is hell. and this porting would make happy 2% moto users. not worth
G watch is more likely going to have a porting, it has standard s400 SoC.
fortunately I never sold my g watch, battery and performance is much better than moto 360.....
go on guys, buy next one or wait for qualcom 2100 chips for wearables
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The cable is not that big of an issue: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=q3a2fdTy_6A
Howeve, what you described makes it sound really difficult. Still, if there's a will there is a way!

jihadinhorocks said:
The cable is not that big of an issue: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=q3a2fdTy_6A
Howeve, what you described makes it sound really difficult. Still, if there's a will there is a way!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah, ok, I already got myself informed about it, but not anyone can make such connector, and even if he can, is so risky.....

throcker said:
is not that easy.
second, this watch is based on TI OMAP cpu, and is the only one with this SoC. porting without a similar device is hell. and this porting would make happy 2% moto users. not worth
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Only an issue if Wear 2.0 requires new kernel features. As long as the changes are only in userland, the specific SoC is not that big a deal.
Adding my voice to the choir, happy to contribute towards some smart Moto 360 hacker doing the port when the time comes.
I get that I can continue to use the watch with old firmware, but then I'd have different UI's on my different watches and it would get very confusing. I just want latest Wear on all of them. These ultra-short support cycles go against the grain especially for watches. Big thumbs down to Moto/Google on this one.

mbecroft said:
Only an issue if Wear 2.0 requires new kernel features. As long as the changes are only in userland, the specific SoC is not that big a deal.
Adding my voice to the choir, happy to contribute towards some smart Moto 360 hacker doing the port when the time comes.
I get that I can continue to use the watch with old firmware, but then I'd have different UI's on my different watches and it would get very confusing. I just want latest Wear on all of them. These ultra-short support cycles go against the grain especially for watches. Big thumbs down to Moto/Google on this one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't say it's short, it just hit the 2 years standard support. it's time to drop. maybe we bought it recently and we're disappointed (I bought it 6 months ago. and I felt a 6 month support) but is definitely not short

Exynos 9820 Performance

There's too much misinformation around and once I get my unit I will have about 28 days to decide if to keep it or skip this generation, I would like to use this thread to build evidence on how good or bad the international version of this device is, if Samsung scammed 90% of the world then they don't deserve our money.
I'm getting mixed feelings about this chip, In speed test G the 855 beats it by a huge margin, so most people went back spitting at it for being a badly optimized SoC.
Anandtech's Comparisons Show super disappointing scores for the S10 Exynos version, but many of the scores presented make no sense, with older hardware of the same OEM scoring better than the newest, I don't know how much to believe that review and I hope it is fake or badly executed, to my interest, my pre-order comes with the Exynos version and there's no way to have warranty on a 855 in the UK.
Then, the positive evidence we have is that it beats every other released phone on the market in battery usage, there's no such video about the 855 yet so we can't compare them, but that's all I found about the battery of this chip.
In a S10+ vs iPhone XS Max, the S10+ again Exynos beats the iPhone on almost every application, I didn't expect that to happen since it almost never happened, the apps are supposedly the same most of the time and they might as well have completely different algorithms to do the same task done superficially, but generally iOS apps are cleaner inside and their developers have higher standards of work, so how can Exynos be THAT much better?

From my experience with the exynos galaxy s9+ I can tell you that exynos chips are more designed for daily usages. Snapdragon is for those who are looking for the higher geekbench scores and better graphics in games.

Corv0 said:
...if Samsung scammed 90% of the world then they don't deserve our money.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How did they scam anyone?

Outbreak444 said:
How did they scam anyone?
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Click to collapse
By selling a higher priced, inferior version of the product without mentioning any sort of difference, when the differences are huge.

Corv0 said:
By selling a higher priced, inferior version of the product without mentioning any sort of difference, when the differences are huge.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, I'm located in the US and my carrier is Verizon, which heavily relies on CDMA. For half a decade I've had to get what Samsung sells in the US (Snapdragon) and I've never complained about it, even with every generation I've had to deal with Exynos users bragging about how theirs is better. The phones have always worked for what I needed them to. No need for every Exynos fanboy to go up in arms over speed test results. These phones aren't high end gaming computers and I seriously doubt the differences between the two processors will be noticeable in everyday use. Also, it's obvious there's a difference by the Exynos being an 8nm processor and the Snapdragon being a 7nm. Doesn't necessarily mean one is better than the other by default but the technology is different. I think you'll be satisfied with how well your phone performs, regardless of the processor.

Outbreak444 said:
Well, I'm located in the US and my carrier is Verizon, which heavily relies on CDMA. For half a decade I've had to get what Samsung sells in the US (Snapdragon) and I've never complained about it, even with every generation I've had to deal with Exynos users bragging about how theirs is better. The phones have always worked for what I needed them to. No need for every Exynos fanboy to go up in arms over speed test results. These phones aren't high end gaming computers and I seriously doubt the differences between the two processors will be noticeable in everyday use. Also, it's obvious there's a difference by the Exynos being an 8nm processor and the Snapdragon being a 7nm. Doesn't necessarily mean one is better than the other by default but the technology is different. I think you'll be satisfied with how well your phone performs, regardless of the processor.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If there was a 10% difference in speed or battery usage I wouldn't mind, the problem is that according to some tests, it scores worse than the previous gen 845.
Don't get me wrong, I really want to be an Exynos fan and I wish it becomes the dominant choice worldwide since Samsung benefits from it and so do the developers, but I can't support it being worse than a competitor's 2018 SoC while I paid the premium price for it.

Meanwhile, another video where the Exynos has insane battery life, the 6T beats it by one minute, but considering the fact that S10+'s screen is denser and the video recording at the end probably drains more due to the higher quality, it's pretty much a winner.

LavaSnake54 said:
Snapdragon is for those who are looking for the higher geekbench scores and better graphics in games.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Naw, Snapdragon is much better, it's the new 7nm beast, which beats the Exynos. It need less mAh for more power, cuz GPU destroy Mali GPU from Exynos.
Nothing to do with benchmark, just a cheaper SoC for EU and better SoC for rest.

klanac8901 said:
Naw, Snapdragon is much better, it's the new 7nm beast, which beats the Exynos. It need less mAh for more power, cuz GPU destroy Mali GPU from Exynos.
Nothing to do with benchmark, just a cheaper SoC for EU and better SoC for rest.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Comparing node density at these levels is not better than bragging about having 1 extra centimeter somewhere, irrelevant if not implemented properly, and node density improvements are supposed to bring theoretic improvements, there's no guarantee they always do.
Look at Kirin's 7nm, very early product and poorly implemented, Apple's jump from 10 to 7 nm also showed quite unimpressive improvements, completely insignificant in real world usage singe iPhone's battery life sucks unless the phone is locked.
And no, it's not a cheaper SoC for the EU, you can literally count how many countries get the Snapdragon on a single hand. The whole rest of the world gets Exynos, stop thinking you're in the center of the universe.

@klanac8901 @Corv0 I was trying to not turn this thread into a d*** measuring contest, I would suggest the two of you follow suit and keep your preferences and opinions to yourselves or else this thread is worthless.
Corv0 said:
If there was a 10% difference in speed or battery usage I wouldn't mind, the problem is that according to some tests, it scores worse than the previous gen 845.
Don't get me wrong, I really want to be an Exynos fan and I wish it becomes the dominant choice worldwide since Samsung benefits from it and so do the developers, but I can't support it being worse than a competitor's 2018 SoC while I paid the premium price for it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Corv0 said:
Meanwhile, another video where the Exynos has insane battery life, the 6T beats it by one minute, but considering the fact that S10+'s screen is denser and the video recording at the end probably drains more due to the higher quality, it's pretty much a winner.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Samsung heavily advertised their new chip as being efficient. With that said, you should get better battery life as well as a great chip at a minimum. Then, for dev's and users like yourself, there will be the ability to tweak every little thing on your phone to improve speed and keep that efficiency. Sure, right out of the box you may not be the best but you're damn close. Give a developer the tools needed and it could, and probably will, become what you want it to be or even greater.
Samsung doesn't scam people, they've made a name for themselves and I would think they want to keep it that way. The Exynos is their baby, you don't think they'd make a crap product for the majority of their users do you? How else would they get their customers to return?
I did see that video earlier, looks pretty sweet if you ask me. I'm excited to see what this phone is capable of in the long run.

Outbreak444 said:
@klanac8901 @Corv0 I was trying to not turn this thread into a d*** measuring contest, I would suggest the two of you follow suit and keep your preferences and opinions to yourselves or else this thread is worthless.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have no preference or opinion, all I'm sharing is neutrality and I want unbiased facts.
I decide if this thread is worthless or not, so I don't really see what you're trying to moderate here, don't discount on me.
Without going off topic, Here the S10+ shows some odd behaviour, most of the time when it loses you can see the app taking even 0.5-1s to launch after the icon is tapped, other times it launches and it spends too much in a black screen, it wins every other speed test when that doesn't happen.
Some youtubers mentioned having issues when running these speed tests, some apps kept continuously crashing and they had to select specific shared apps for the tests.
All I can think about is that the Exynos lacks optimisation, on the kernel side or the scheduler, since it is actually newer than the 855.
We spotted 855 reference devices months ago and it had plenty time to mature regarding software support, plus it's a shared platform that doesn't need specific hacks from a single manufacturer.
Even with the node deficiency in mind, the Exynos looks way better on paper than its counterpart, raw single core performance and the super low memory latency show how much silicon power and efficiency there is thanks to proper cache placement this time, hopefully they get their software fixed before the public gets away with a negative impression.

Corv0 said:
I have no preference or opinion, all I'm sharing is neutrality and I want unbiased facts.
I decide if this thread is worthless or not, so I don't really see what you're trying to moderate here, don't discount on me.
Without going off topic, Here the S10+ shows some odd behaviour, most of the time when it loses you can see the app taking even 0.5-1s to launch after the icon is tapped, other times it launches and it spends too much in a black screen, it wins every other speed test when that doesn't happen.
Some youtubers mentioned having issues when running these speed tests, some apps kept continuously crashing and they had to select specific shared apps for the tests.
All I can think about is that the Exynos lacks optimisation, on the kernel side or the scheduler, since it is actually newer than the 855.
We spotted 855 reference devices months ago and it had plenty time to mature regarding software support, plus it's a shared platform that doesn't need specific hacks from a single manufacturer.
Even with the node deficiency in mind, the Exynos looks way better on paper than its counterpart, raw single core performance and the super low memory latency show how much silicon power and efficiency there is thanks to proper cache placement this time, hopefully they get their software fixed before the public gets away with a negative impression.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All I was saying was that a "mine is better than yours" doesn't promote a good discussion. I'm not moderating anything, but I doubt you want this thread to become "the big debate between SD and Exynos".
Back on topic though, I honestly think you'll end up with the superior processor in the end. As I said earlier, you will have the ability to tweak settings that I'll never be able to get close to changing. It's a new chip and it will take some time for developers to find what works better, within Samsung and even here on XDA. Don't base your opinion upon your first use of the device.
In regards to the videos you mentioned of YouTubers having issues, I've seen users saying that the pre-release models they're using are not equivalent to what will be commercially available. I'm not sure if that's true but I could see that being a possibility.

Outbreak444 said:
All I was saying was that a "mine is better than yours" doesn't promote a good discussion. I'm not moderating anything, but I doubt you want this thread to become "the big debate between SD and Exynos".
Back on topic though, I honestly think you'll end up with the superior processor in the end. As I said earlier, you will have the ability to tweak settings that I'll never be able to get close to changing. It's a new chip and it will take some time for developers to find what works better, within Samsung and even here on XDA. Don't base your opinion upon your first use of the device.
In regards to the videos you mentioned of YouTubers having issues, I've seen users saying that the pre-release models they're using are not equivalent to what will be commercially available. I'm not sure if that's true but I could see that being a possibility.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not really a debate between the two since Snapdragon's not accessible to most people and I wouldn't want a censored platform either , he just sounded bad with the usual "uh but 7nm is better than 8".
I checked the demo versions in stores multiple times and they work flawlessly, it makes the whole benchmark drama looks overblown, let's hope it becomes a reliable platform.

Corv0 said:
Not really a debate between the two since Snapdragon's not accessible to most people and I wouldn't want a censored platform either , he just sounded bad with the usual "uh but 7nm is better than 8".
I checked the demo versions in stores multiple times and they work flawlessly, it makes the whole benchmark drama looks overblown, let's hope it becomes a reliable platform.
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Click to collapse
Exactly why I said that.
Light use of those phones may not have resulted in any noticing issues tough.

I have an Exynos S10+ right now (retail unit) and would be happy to share any information you guys want. benchmark numbers, camera samples...anything. just reply to my post

disturbedrhythm said:
I have an Exynos S10+ right now (retail unit) and would be happy to share any information you guys want. benchmark numbers, camera samples...anything. just reply to my post
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please run all PCmark's benchmarks

Corv0 said:
Please run all PCmark's benchmarks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Here you go

How is this a scam? Samsung clearly tells you the specification they're selling you. They aren't hiding nothing lol. Your definition of scam is flawed yo.

MrPhilo said:
How is this a scam? Samsung clearly tells you the specification they're selling you. They aren't hiding nothing lol. Your definition of scam is flawed yo.
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Click to collapse
Specifications are meaningless, the only info they shared is simple superficial stuff that we already knew, there's no guarantee of same performance levels across all variants and there clearly is a difference at the moment.
If you sell "octa core processor" around while half of the units have worse performance than the previous generation, that's a scam.

Corv0 said:
Specifications are meaningless, the only info they shared is simple superficial stuff that we already knew, there's no guarantee of same performance levels across all variants and there clearly is a difference at the moment.
If you sell "octa core processor" around while half of the units have worse performance than the previous generation, that's a scam.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's not a scam. Your definition of scam doesn't make sense.
If they wanted to sell something slower than last generation, that's fine, you got your information, don't buy it. They aren't hiding anything from you, they are pretty much giving you all the information before you buy it. You're the one at fault for buying it. Plus this is faster than last Exynos generation, so it's actually valid for the continent it sold at.