Develop Bugs

Pentile for the anally observant / S-LCD

Hi, I really want to buy a Desire but when I tried it in a store I could easily notice the fuziness caused by the Pentile subpixel layout. This was on white text on a medium coloured background - I've read it's worst on black/white. I also looked at the Galaxy S and the fuzziness was much less noticable - I just hate the look and feel of that phone.
The problem is I have a pretty low tolerance to small details like that and pretty good eyesight, so I was wondering if anyone here is as anal about visual flaws as me but happily lives with the Desire's screen? I want my next phone purchace to last a couple of years at least...
I also thought it might be nice to wait and see if HTC release a Desire with a S-LCD screen - sharpness wins over deep blacks for me considering the other potential flaws with the AMOLED screens. Any thoughts?
(If the Wildfire had either an AMOLED RGB screen or a higher resolution LCD then I'd just settle for that - it looks sexy enough to live with the lack of power.)

any thoughts? eh, sure. I don't see the the "potential flaws" of AMOLED screens at all. Sure a true LCD display will have sharper definition for black on white text, but I hardly would clal my Desire screen blurred or fuzzy. I think its fine. I do a lot of reading on the net too and its absolutely fine, but you are right an LCD like iPhone is sharper for text.
I prefer the colours and the perfect blacks myself. Makes using the phone for watching movies etc a pleasure. If you use it just for very small text though, get something else. If your as picky as you seem, you will definitely have problems with this one with its amoled screen. I won't even mention the over saturated colours or the pink hue when viewing grays. You won't like that either.

i compared the screen on my desire to my friends new iphone 4 and honestly i could only tell the difference when i got so close it was physically hurting my eyes to focus on it, i really think that the screen on the desire is top and i dont seem to have much trouble with it in the daylight either for some reason

By potential flaws I meant the uneven & relatively fast fading and the burn in that some people are reporting.
I looked for the pink hue in the shop but couldn't notice it. Isn't that a hit or miss thing?
OLED is a major selling point for me. But then is resolution (<3 my x50v)
Anyone think the Desire with an S-LCD would be a big improvement?
Yeah, daylight didn't seem to be an issue at all, compared to other devices I've used over the years.
I definitely see a huge difference between Desire and iPhone 4 though. Desire is actually about on par with the previous iPhones in terms of actual blurryness, but the fact the pattern is staggered makes it more noticeable.

Schmeggma said:
I looked for the pink hue in the shop but couldn't notice it. Isn't that a hit or miss thing?
Anyone think the Desire with an S-LCD would be a big improvement?
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Click to collapse
No the pink hue effects all AMOLED screens when displaying certain gray shades. I suggest you read the sticky post all about the AMOLED Pentile display and how it works.
Is the Desire available with S-LCD? If not, whats the point? Just get yourself a phone with LCD and be happy. The power drain on a desire with LCD would be significantly increased too. Sure AMOLED uses more on a 100% white screen, but it use much less on darker themed screens or coloured screens.

I've read the sticky and think I have a good grasp of the issue, but I've seen reports from people saying the pinkness varies.

I also have 20/20 vision and this screen is fine, the only times I'm disappointed is while text is scrolling there is a visable wave in the letters and outdoor in direct sunlight you need to find the good angle to read.
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App

I used to be very anal about my phone. And of course you might be different but for me trying to choose the perfect one / making the perfect one ever more perfect just does not work. Huge effort, lots of frustration, little or no results and even the ones you get are brief. That's the problem with this attitude - you'll just always find another flaw to frown upon.
What worked for me was taking positive action rather than getting rid of all the faults. I implemented Allen's GTD system and I'm using my phone as a collection/organisation tool. Works great and now my phone is a very useful tool instead of being just a gadget. Flaws don't matter anymore. And with GTD I can be as anal as I only wish and still happy
BTW totally agree on Galaxy S. It's so much better phone than Desire but it's simply atrocious. Couldn't bear the thought of carrying something that makes me wanna puke for next 2/3 years.

mcgon1979 said:
No the pink hue effects all AMOLED screens when displaying certain gray shades. I suggest you read the sticky post all about the AMOLED Pentile display and how it works.
Is the Desire available with S-LCD? If not, whats the point? Just get yourself a phone with LCD and be happy. The power drain on a desire with LCD would be significantly increased too. Sure AMOLED uses more on a 100% white screen, but it use much less on darker themed screens or coloured screens.
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Click to collapse
Pink hue is not AMOLED related since it shows also in software emulator (on PC) and varies among phones. Sticky post is wrong all around but arguments for that are buried too deep in long thread.
AS for OP, HTC announced LCD Desire, and I would like to see one. I can notice PenTile artifacts and don't like it (together with over saturated colors and pink hue), but phone is so good in other segments it is worth owning.

Lots of anal talk in this thread!
Seriously, I have never seen the pink everyone is talking about and I have had my phone since the middle of april. It's weird that some phones are affected and some are not.
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

Yeah sure the screen has some negatives about it but when compared side to side to my old iPhone's screen its blows the iPhone out of the water. I prefer AMOLED because I can turn it up full brightness and not be blinded by an annoying backlight that make sthe phone more suitable as a flashlight than a screen.

I thought I replied earlier, but it seems Opera 10.60 is a little glitchy with the forum (and in general...)
Anyway, thanks for all the replies guys. On the way home I had a look at the Desire again in another store and found the screen a lot more agreeable. I tried it sitting down, making me naturally hold it a couple of inches farther away, which makes a big difference. Plus I had more of an "how nice is this display?" attitude rather than "can I notice the flaw?"
So I came home and ordered one online. If the text bugs me that much, I can always stick to my Axim for ebooks.
edit: Still eager to see what S-LCD brings to the table, though.

Apparently, S-LCD does not stand for 'Super LCD', it is just a name of Samsung-Sony LCD factory.

Schmeggma said:
I thought I replied earlier, but it seems Opera 10.60 is a little glitchy with the forum (and in general...)
Anyway, thanks for all the replies guys. On the way home I had a look at the Desire again in another store and found the screen a lot more agreeable. I tried it sitting down, making me naturally hold it a couple of inches farther away, which makes a big difference. Plus I had more of an "how nice is this display?" attitude rather than "can I notice the flaw?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did you know that PenTile OLED was in tens of thousands of cell phones for over a year before anyone noticed that they were different? If one has to be told that they are different... well that tells me that they work as designed.
Full Disclosure: I'm one of the inventors of PenTile technology.
PenTile technology was actually designed with a specific minimum distance from which to view it. Bring it too close to one's eyes, one will see the pattern. Actually the same thing also happens with the legacy RGB Stripe matrix, but since one is used to seeing that pattern, one mentally filters it out. The same should happen with the PenTile screen, once one is used to seeing it, one no longer "sees" it, if you can pardon my circular explanation, but it's true. If you use the phone at a more comfortable distance, as opposed to as close to your eyes as you can get, the screen will appear as intended.

vlasac said:
Apparently, S-LCD does not stand for 'Super LCD', it is just a name of Samsung-Sony LCD factory.
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Click to collapse
That makes me happy, if it's just another IPS or whatever then I know what to expect.
DisplayGeek said:
Did you know that PenTile OLED was in tens of thousands of cell phones for over a year before anyone noticed that they were different? If one has to be told that they are different... well that tells me that they work as designed.
Full Disclosure: I'm one of the inventors of PenTile technology.
PenTile technology was actually designed with a specific minimum distance from which to view it. Bring it too close to one's eyes, one will see the pattern. Actually the same thing also happens with the legacy RGB Stripe matrix, but since one is used to seeing that pattern, one mentally filters it out. The same should happen with the PenTile screen, once one is used to seeing it, one no longer "sees" it, if you can pardon my circular explanation, but it's true. If you use the phone at a more comfortable distance, as opposed to as close to your eyes as you can get, the screen will appear as intended.
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Click to collapse
I definitely would have noticed it if I didn't know in advance. (I'm not trying to imply there's anything good about extreme pickiness - it's a compulsive disorder and a bloody nightmare.)
I appreciate the minimum distance thing, but obviously it varies with eyesight - hence the brief controversy over Apple's 'retina' claims. It's just going to require a slight adjustment to my habits while standing to compensate for this.
As for the RGB thing, I feel that's easier to mentally filter out because it's consistent vertically whereas Pentile alternates the relatively larger red/blue subpixels. I imagine this is why the effect was less noticeable on the Galaxy S's RGBW layout, despite the slightly lower DPI?

markuz85 said:
Lots of anal talk in this thread!
Seriously, I have never een the pink everyone is talking about and I have had my phone since the middle of april. It's weird that some phones are affectewd and some are not.
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk
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So your saying the new forum theme doesn't look pink to you on your phone? All the grey bits around the forum are definitely pink in colour on mine. Maybe i have one of the affected phones.

vlasac said:
Pink hue is not AMOLED related since it shows also in software emulator (on PC) and varies among phones.
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Click to collapse
Well then it can be fixed with firmware right.
markuz85 said:
Lots of anal talk in this thread!
Seriously, I have never seen the pink everyone is talking about and I have had my phone since the middle of april. It's weird that some phones are affected and some are not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you have not noticed the pink? well then you are not anal enough. try harder
DisplayGeek said:
Did you know that PenTile OLED was in tens of thousands of cell phones for over a year before anyone noticed that they were different?
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Click to collapse
As above, I think this is subjective. Some people stare at their phones looking for dust, looking for a hint of pink, looking for a mark in the case, looking for... etc etc etc... If you want to treat it like that you will be a very miserable camper. It's a phone, it has an average lifespan of 2 years probably. Use it. It reminds of these people who own a beautiful Ferrari but on't drive it. just keep it in a garage and rub it with a cloth. whats the point?
I think the only thing thats variable on the pink hue thing is the persons opinion of how pink it is. not noticeable or noticeable. some people will say its not there, some people will say it sso pink they cannot even see any other colours.
I had my eyes colour calibrated in a 16 hour operation at an optical lab in switzerland 4 weeks ago, they now recognise 400 shades of pink and have 20/20 vision, so I KNOW my phone has pink. etc etc LOL

FSake said:
So your saying the new forum theme doesn't look pink to you on your phone? All the grey bits around the forum are definitely pink in colour on mine. Maybe i have one of the affected phones.
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The forum doesn't look at all pink on my phone, I've never seen this issue either.

mcgon1979 said:
people who own a beautiful Ferrari but on't drive it. just keep it in a garage and rub it with a cloth. whats the point?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Rubbing certain things can be very, um, therapeutic...

DisplayGeek said:
Full Disclosure: I'm one of the inventors of PenTile technology.
PenTile technology was actually designed with a specific minimum distance from which to view it. Bring it too close to one's eyes, one will see the pattern. Actually the same thing also happens with the legacy RGB Stripe matrix, but since one is used to seeing that pattern, one mentally filters it out. The same should happen with the PenTile screen, once one is used to seeing it, one no longer "sees" it, if you can pardon my circular explanation, but it's true. If you use the phone at a more comfortable distance, as opposed to as close to your eyes as you can get, the screen will appear as intended.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry, but all your arguments don't add up. On LCD screens i have perfectly straight horizontal and vertical lines, there is no need to filter out anything.
On PenTile displays i dont have straight lines because of the pattern that is used. THAT is the problem. Lines look like zigzag-lines not straight ones. And no i'm not looking at my phone from 1 cm distance, i'm looking at it from a normal distance and i can see the pentile effect on my Nexus One. I also had a Motorola Milestone which comes with an LCD that surpasses any AMOLED PenTile screen quality regarding resolution. (while both claim to have wvga)
There is a very easy test for this. Take a Motorola Droid and a Nexus One. Place them side by side and open a webpage on full zoomed out view. You will see the difference in resolution quality VERY clearly. Anybody who claims that there is no difference is lying. You can't just imply that the eye can't see an difference because there are many people out there with normal eyesight (i'm not talking about eagle eyes here) which see the pentile pattern too clearly.
The whole topic is quite frustrating because when buying a nexus one you make one step forward (generall hardware) and two steps back (pentile).

Samsung & PenTile Displays

So I see lots of threads/posts about PenTile. Found this to be interesting, sharing it. It's mainly in regards to Samsung Galaxy S3 but as we know, Galaxy Nexus uses PenTile as well. So it would apply for our phones as well.
Samsung's Philip Berne explained to me that the blue subpixels on AMOLED displays actually degrade the fastest - quicker than the red or green subpixels. With a PenTile layout, the subpixels are arranged RGBG (red, green, blue, green), so they feature more green subpixels and fewer red or blue subpixels than an RGB stripe layout with the same resolution. Because of this, AMOLED displays that have the PenTile layout tend to have a longer lifespan than those with RGB layouts. Since Samsung is selling its phones to users that usually keep them for 18 months or longer, it has to be sure that the display will still offer peak performance at that time. According to the company, PenTile AMOLED displays have proven to be more reliable than those with RGB layouts.
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Click to collapse
Source: http://www.mobileburn.com/19548/new...ed-displays-last-longer-thats-why-we-use-them

Thanks. Saw a few links to this. I don't really see what the issue is with PenTile. In normal use, its next to impossibile to see.
I think what people have bigger issues with are banding/discoloring/streaking, not necessarily the PenTile arrangement. Its just a nice 1-word "catch all" for not liking a display.

Motorola gave PenTile a bad name using rbgw arrangements. Now everyone assumes they will get screendoor effects.

adrynalyne said:
Motorola gave PenTile a bad name using rbgw arrangements. Noe everyone assumes they will get screendoor effects.
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Click to collapse
The RAZR coming out ~same time as the Nexus with that god-awful display definitely gave a negative connotation to "PenTile".

Pentile was somewhat noticeable on the first SAMOLED display that they had in the SGS lineup, but only when it was text on a solid background. With SAMOLED HD, the pixel density is so high that I have yet to be able to see a jagged edge on text anywhere. I wonder what people would think if Apple used a Pentile matrix on an iProduct. Probably be the best thing in display technology rather than the most hated if it happened.

I love my galaxy nexus and my friend got a htc one x and it does look really good but I prefer my nexus maybe cause I like dark colors
Sent from my Sprint Galaxy Nexus CDMA using Tapatalk 2

Yeah I agree with Motorola giving PenTile a bad name. When I first saw the Galaxy Nexus screen, I didn't even notice any differences. I don't know the technical terms on why it's different but compared to my previous phones, Nexus S / Galaxy S1 (Vibrant).. I don't really see any difference, in fact the GN looks even better but that might just be Super AMOLED HD. But whatever it is, it looks amazing.
The people criticizing about PenTile without even looking at the phone or trying it for a week or two need to re-evaluate themselves.

Ya, but Samsung still has not found a good enough manufacturing process to make regular "Super AMOLED+ HD" Screens at 4.6inch+ (hence the pen tile). That's why the screen's pen tile.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA

imnuts said:
I wonder what people would think if Apple used a Pentile matrix on an iProduct. Probably be the best thing in display technology rather than the most hated if it happened.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hopefully apple wont make a mistake like that.

nohcho said:
Hopefully apple wont make a mistake like that.
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Click to collapse
I doubt apple would I still remember that first iphone and the screen was amazing phone kind of suck tho
Sent from my Sprint Galaxy Nexus CDMA using Tapatalk 2

Y'know, I always thought that PenTile would bother me too much to ever use a phone. I'd seen some devices that used older or low-end versions of it, and they looked terrible.
I was apprehensive at best of getting the Galaxy Nexus. PenTile and the lack of an SD card slot bothered me, to say the least. Over time, I've grown to love the phone. Much of that is because while there are some issues with the PenTile display, such as some banding and purplish greys at very low or lowest brightness settings, these issues aren't noticed even at a slightly raised brightness settings. Otherwise, the display is one of the best performing displays I've ever had the pleasure of using. The colors are bright and vibrant, the blacks are black, there are no light bleeds common with backlit displays and the outdoor performance, while not the best, is still excellent.
Super AMOLED HD isn't perfect, but it's certainly a good step forward in the evolution of display technology.

nohcho said:
Hopefully apple wont make a mistake like that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Didn't you know? Apple never makes mistakes
When I was looking at new phones, Pentile bugged the hell out of me every time I saw it. I swore I'd never buy a phone that used it. After Google started selling the Galaxy Nexus, I took a look at the VZW model just for kicks, and I honestly couldn't tell the difference unless I held it point-blank.

jgalan14 said:
I love my galaxy nexus and my friend got a htc one x and it does look really good but I prefer my nexus maybe cause I like dark colors
Sent from my Sprint Galaxy Nexus CDMA using Tapatalk 2
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Click to collapse
Owning both devices, I actually prefer the one X screen over the nexus. Not by
a drastic margin though. Pentile displays are pretty atrocious on smaller resolution
screens (qhD or below).
It's a non-issue on the nexus.

I can tell occasionally but the high Res far outweighs the small nuance of seeing it in certain situations and being HD it still looks great. :thumbup::thumbup: for HD rgbg pen tile.
...of the people, by the people, for the people...

I thought the issues of the blue sub-pixels degrading faster than the red and green ones had been, basically, sorted - at least in as much that the degradation, whilst still faster than the other sub-pixels, was now slow enough that it was not particularly perceptible over the lifespan of the device (at least for the likes of phones, which are replaced much quicker than most consumer electronics devices).
I mean, according to Wikipedia the typical time for blue sub-pixels to degrade to half their original brightness is 14,000 hours - or 8 hours a day for 5 years.
Now I don't know about the rest of you but I don't have my handset's screen on for anywhere near 8 hours a day nor do I expect to still be using it in 5 years time.
And on top of that, it talks about 'experimental' blue OLED panels which can sustain 400 cd/m2 for over 62,000 hours - and that was in 2007.

Smokeey said:
Ya, but Samsung still has not found a good enough manufacturing process to make regular "Super AMOLED+ HD" Screens at 4.6inch+ (hence the pen tile). That's why the screen's pen tile.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA
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Click to collapse
Wrong. Galaxy tab 7.7 . If Samsung put samoled HD plus in sgs3 the price for the phone would be too damn high and the difference between screens quality is not that big as people who haven't even used it or used sgs1 with small resolution are trying to tell.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

beeboss said:
Wrong. Galaxy tab 7.7 . If Samsung put samoled HD plus in sgs3 the price for the phone would be too damn high and the difference between screens quality is not that big as people who haven't even used it or used sgs1 with small resolution are trying to tell.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Galaxy Tab 7.7 is using a SAMOLED+ screen that is ~7". It is not a SAMOLED HD screen despite having an HD resolution. At least they do not advertise it as SAMOLED HD, it is listed as an HD resolution SAMOLED+ display.

When the g nex first came out all I say was the horrible screen. So I bought the t mo gs2 which had the ugliest screen resolution ever so I got a nexus. The screen on the phone is awesome dark blacks deep colors this is a great screen. The super LCD 2 is nice but I prefer this

beeboss said:
Wrong. Galaxy tab 7.7 . If Samsung put samoled HD plus in sgs3 the price for the phone would be too damn high and the difference between screens quality is not that big as people who haven't even used it or used sgs1 with small resolution are trying to tell.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bingo. I think Samsung is just trying to get the most value out of their current process-level.
The panel in my (oft mentioned) ET4G SGS2 is roughly the same exact dimensions as the GNex screen....though if you multiply 800x640x12 (subpixels) you come up with the same exact number you would if you multiplied 1280x720x5 .....and that 5 is where the damning "Pentile" moniker comes from.
So, that means these two (oft compared) panels have the same amount of subpixels arranged in the same amount of space in a slightly (or vastly, depending on how you looked at it) configuration.
So, for solid colors--aside from calibration differences and luminance (brightness) differences--the panels are effectively identical. I know I simplified a lot of the dynamics away with those qualifications, but, in this scenario we have the same amount of subpixels in the same exact density making the same exact color...
Before I decided to swap up to the GNex I marched down to the Sprint store and did the nerdiest side-by-side comparison I could and there wasn't a single moment where I had any question which screen I'd rather be looking at all the time....It's the GNex. The only thing I noticed was that it wasn't as cornea scarringly bright....big deal....after 30 seconds of screen-on maxed out the SGS2 screen turns itself down to prevent damage or something.....and then it's dimmer than the GNex anyway.

nohcho said:
Hopefully apple wont make a mistake like that.
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Click to collapse
Apple is anal. They do alot more testing than Samsung because people will actually use + buy there phones well past its 18 month life span.

Found black blotches on my screen

Okay. so I have a few black blotches on my screen, but I can only see them on a certain kind of black, but here's how to tell if you have this issue go to phone click on the menu key than call settings now go to call rejections from in there look at your phone screen at all every angle possible, if you don't see black blotches than you don't have an issue like I do.
Good luck
Also try doing this in the dark

Andrew149 said:
Okay. so I have a few black blotches on my screen, but I can only see them on a certain kind of black, but here's how to tell if you have this issue go to phone click on the menu key than call settings now go to call rejections from in there look at your phone screen at all every angle possible, if you don't see black blotches than you don't have an issue like I do.
Good luck
Also try doing this in the dark
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Looks like a manufacturing defect, the blotches are in the same place on everyone s phone.

Weird mine are on the bottom half of the screen
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2

It's normal. Samoled at its finest.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2

I don't see them on that screen because the blacks are too black also I'm in a brighter lit room. But if I am watching a movie and it goes dark I can see minor blotches.

I noticed this and I took it to warrenty but they refused to replace or fix it. I dunno what to do. Is this breach of contract?
lalala SGS3 lalala

You would have to LIVE WITH THE STAINS AND BLOTCHES...
This is widely known issue known as OLED "mura" effect
It has stains and many black dots affecting the Galaxy S2, Note, S3, PS Vita and even some of the Galaxy S1 devices...
This is due to cheap manufacturing and QA ...

mms6 said:
This is due to cheap manufacturing and QA ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is it this, or is it a limitation of the AMOLED manufacturing process? My blotches are very minimal and I very rarely ever see them. I would much rather have the contrast of the AMOLED tech with the blotches than have my S3 equipped with an LCD.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2

Definitely not an limitation of the manufacturing process.. My first-gen Samsung Captivate's screen blacks are actually deeper than the my Galaxy S3 with maximum brightness, displaying the same completely black #000000 screen in a completely dark bedroom at night...
Also what I have realized is that on my Captivate's screen, it do not has any of the stains or the dots on it when viewed in a dark room.. It has a little bit of "banding" problem on the top portion of the screen, but it is less noticeable than the stains and especially the "black dots" effect...
I have the EXACTLY same problem with my PS Vita similar to my Galaxy S3, but the PS Vita has much more stains than dots than the GS3 (more imperfection) although the PS Vita is lower resolution, and slightly bigger screen. The PS Vita uses the Samsung Super AMOLED Advanced (pentile matrix)...
Also, the screen production is not consistent on the GS3. My first GS3 has Wi-Fi random disconnection issues, so I exchanged it under the 15 days policy from Rogers, for another GS3.. The original GS3 has a lot of "black dots" (approx around 15 or so) and slightly stained on the top right corner.. The exchanged GS3 was slightly better and had no stain marks and only a few black dots and a slight pink spot (when viewed on white #FFFFFF).. Also I had to exchange my second one back to the store because my battery cover had some hairline cracks within a week of usage or so..
The THIRD AND FINAL GS3 I received did not have any stains, but suffered a more severe "black dot" effect (approx. 15-20 dots).. But my Wi-Fi issue was fine, and there are no pink spots, so I have been using it until now and did not really bother an exchange....
If you are extremely lucky, you might get a "perfect" or "near perfect" AMOLED in the current generation... But still the QA is going down the toilet when compared to my First Phone with Super AMOLED, my Samsung Wave S8500 (the screen was PERFECT on this one, NO stains/dots/smudges etc...)
Samsung is cutting costs and lowering QA because it is fulfilling more AMOLEDs for other manufacturers such as themselves (its is not just the top of the line Galaxy S# series using AMOLED, mid-end and some lower ends Galaxy series are using AMOLED as well) Also Samsung has to supply for Motorola, HTC (fewer models though), Sony (only for PS Vita), Fujitsu (for the Japanese Keitai smartphone from KDDI and Docomo) and so on.....
Now all this happened in quite short period of time, Japanese keitais with OLEDs came on the market last year... Samsung Wave came onto the market in 2010, there is only a 1 - 1.5 years in between here... The demand exponentially increased as smartphone sales went up, and more manufacturers are contracting Samsung to build OLEDs..
Personally, I do not think the process of making OLEDs have improved....
THE ONLY area it might have improved is probably the PRINTING... Printing higher resolutions has allowed Samsung to increase the pixel density and decreasing the subpixels (and this is probably why the Super AMOLED HD screens are dimmer than the original Super AMOLEDs at the same maximum brightness)
That is all I can say for now...
Live with the miniscule defects such as stains, dots, smudges etc on your OLEDs.... These problems are minor issues anyways since you have to be in a very dark environment with almost complete black #000000 image to be able to pick up the "defects".... Wait for a few more generations and allow the manufacturing process to improve more and still be able to fulfill Samsung's own demands and contracted demands for other manufacturers..... (Or other companies might finally bring more and more of their own technologies in OLED to the consumer masses)...
END OF RANTS...
-----------------------------------

It's normal ever since the hd samoleds came out. Same problem across many manufacturers. My razr was horrible with this stuff.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2

robstunner said:
It's normal ever since the hd samoleds came out. Same problem across many manufacturers. My razr was horrible with this stuff.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2
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Mine has the defect but I only see it when in a very dark environment and only on a certain black type of screen. Normally the black screen that shows up when starting a Netflix video I will see it for a moment. It doesn't bother me that much but do agree that it looks like s***! Other than the blotches in a dark environment though, you'd never see it.

I also noticed these spots too. I do not think it is a big deal foudn a few threads talking about other phones and most people agree it is common and only effects the screen when theres nothing moving on it. In other words yes you will notice it but no your screen is not damaged.

How do you feel about Samsungs Display?

I first found this forum when I got my SGSII and read about the yellow tint issue, bad colour banding etc. It drove me insane the first month because I couldn't get over it. I eventually got over it after some time due to it getting "old".
I hoped my Note II would have a good screen but it seems the tint can be found in all AMOLED screens. It was easy to notice the yellow tint in my SGSII but it was very weak compared to others so I were happy. On my Note II you can notice it (I think) if you concentrate really hard and it saddens me. You also have the weak lines (colour banding?).
So, how do you feel about this? Is it something you can get over and just accept that Samsung make worse screens but with awesome hardware? The reason I stick with Samsung is because I love them and I wouldn't want to choose another brand. But still, it hurts me when I realized that Note II still has these issues. I understand all manufacturers has their problems but we're in 2012, is it impossible to create a screen that is "perfect"?
Please no "I don't have this problem, my screen is perfect". We all know everyone's phone have some kind of this issue. Is it a issue or is it something you have to accept?

I don't have this problem, my screen is perfect. I'm saying this because it is. I don't see any tint or anything.

For me the screen is georgious. I like it very much, the screen doesn`t have that flickering sometimes the Note1 had. The colours are vivid, full and the screentones are custimizable.

gee2012 said:
For me the screen is georgious. I like it very much, the screen doesn`t have that flickering sometimes the Note1 had. The colours are vivid, full and the screentones are custimizable.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is indeed awesome, but the issue is still there. I don't like to have brightness on because of possible burn in, I keep it at 0%.

SweFox said:
I first found this forum when I got my SGSII and read about the yellow tint issue, bad colour banding etc. It drove me insane the first month because I couldn't get over it. I eventually got over it after some time due to it getting "old".
I hoped my Note II would have a good screen but it seems the tint can be found in all AMOLED screens. It was easy to notice the yellow tint in my SGSII but it was very weak compared to others so I were happy. On my Note II you can notice it (I think) if you concentrate really hard and it saddens me. You also have the weak lines (colour banding?).
So, how do you feel about this? Is it something you can get over and just accept that Samsung make worse screens but with awesome hardware? The reason I stick with Samsung is because I love them and I wouldn't want to choose another brand. But still, it hurts me when I realized that Note II still has these issues. I understand all manufacturers has their problems but we're in 2012, is it impossible to create a screen that is "perfect"?
Please no "I don't have this problem, my screen is perfect". We all know everyone's phone have some kind of this issue. Is it a issue or is it something you have to accept?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is it true the Note II screen is brighter than Note 1?
I didn't have a chance to compare.
On the other hand, Note 1 colours are definitely more vivid and more awesomelicious!
And mine after 6 months, have a strong yellowish tint together with a burnt screen.
I'm not impressed with AMOLED's longevity.

Livebyte said:
Is it true the Note II screen is brighter than Note 1?
I didn't have a chance to compare.
On the other hand, Note 1 colours are definitely more vivid and more awesomelicious!
And mine after 6 months, have a strong yellowish tint together with a burnt screen.
I'm not impressed with AMOLED's longevity.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My own Note II aren't very strong in brightness but others might be. My SGSII definitely have stronger brightness! My SGSII didn't have any burn in, maybe due to the fact that I keep the brightness at 0%. To scared for anything else hah.

Livebyte said:
Liar.
Sent from my GT-N7000 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think mod really have to see a solution of your random rant on this section all you do is saying bad things about the note, I'm really sorry that you had bad experience with your note 2 but no one is forcing you to keep using it, get over it and stop trolling for god sake...

Hell Guardian said:
I think mod really have to see a solution of your random rant on this section all you do is saying bad things about the note, I'm really sorry that you had bad experience with your note 2 but no one is forcing you to keep using it, get over it and stop trolling for god sake...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I doubt his screen is perfect, I asked nicely for no such posts because we all know it's not true.

AMOLED is juvenile technology. It's definitely not ready for public use. Pentile displays look horrible, even at a higher resolution, burn in occurs incredibly quickly and colours are over saturated to disguise the quality. Personally haven't seen the colour banding myself but enough people report it to make it a real issue.
AMOLED is the way forward, but it is not ready for everyday use. Samsung need to put their heads together and get production rates sorted out. Only when they can start churning out RGB displays that are correctly calibrated and don't suffer from burn in or tinting after a year can they really consider AMOLED suitable for mainstream consumption.

Hell Guardian said:
I think mod really have to see a solution of your random rant on this section all you do is saying bad things about the note, I'm really sorry that you had bad experience with your note 2 but no one is forcing you to keep using it, get over it and stop trolling for god sake...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's the point... he doesn't even have a Note II... he's just complaining about a Note I...

Haven't noticed any problem with the screen because I am not looking for it. If you have to concentrate that hard to find it, maybe you should concentrate on something else entirely like going out and enjoying the day?

achusaysblessyou said:
That's the point... he doesn't even have a Note II... he's just complaining about a Note I...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes. I am complaining about Note 1. I'm glad they solved the issues in Note II. I saw my friend's Note II a while ago. Indeed they solved most of the issues.
IM IMPRESSED.
But I still suspect longevity is an issue.
EDIT: BLUE TINT.
Sent from my GT-N7000 using xda app-developers app

Won't it be possible to tune the colour of the screen when roms become more developed?
My SGS used to have a yellow tint too. Increasing the blue in the built in colour tuning app changed it to pure white.
I think a while ago I remember reading someone using an app from the play store to tweak the colour of their SGS 2 screen too. I'll try & find it.
---------- Post added at 09:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:06 AM ----------
Here it is. It's called screen adjuster.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.netmanslab.sa
Try increasing the blue or lower the red & green and see if that gets rid of your yellow tint. You have to be rooted.

Well, I have to agree that Note has "burned mark" stain like on the screen. Mine was the first batch for Malaysia. I also noticed the same stain like effect on the Samsung's Technician's Note. But I have no problem asking Samsung to change the display for me. After replaced, there is no problem with it for about a year now. Could it be that the first batch of display have such problem?
For Note II, it's crystal clear. No stain mark. I suggest that anyone who is not satisfied with the screen should either exchange the phone or have the display replaced.

Guess some had unlucky screens, but i really like the Note2 screen. And I got one white and one grey, both have np with tints, flicker or bad colors.
But i am not the one to speak after years off use tho, as I change mobile quite often. But Note i use longer then I usually use any mobile as the functions and Spen on note is hard to find on other devices.
Skickat från min GT-N7100 via Tapatalk 2

After using the original Note for over 8 months I had no issues with its screen at all except for the very light black clipping under very specifc conditions,.And now almost after one month with my Note II, I can confidently say that this is the best screen I have ever had,no yellow or black issues,so the OP either has a faulty unit or he is a troll.
Sent from my Note II using the Spen.

There is not a single AMOLED screen which is problem free. Be it tint or any other thing. It's quite true that people who are saying my screen is 'perfect' either don't know what a perfect screen is or simply lying.
And yes, my Note 2 screen has Yellowish tint, but it's on a much lower level than my S2 and spreaded all over the display unlike S2's only left side area. So I'm more or less happy with it. This is my 5th OLED displayed phone and NONE was perfect, NONE. Only which was my favorite and near perfect was Wave S8500 screen.
Sent from my GT-N7100

Livebyte said:
Liar.
Sent from my GT-N7000 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Trolling again? For someone without the note 2, you sure spend a lot of time whining about it.
If people arent happy with it, they should get it replaced or sell and move on.
We have two n7100's in the house. Both are fine.
Note I didnt say perfect because its very rare that something is perfect. But we arent going to stare at the screen from 2mm away checking every pixel.
And everything will have a flaw in someone elses eyes.
So going by the op's logic, anyone that says otherwise is a liar?
Sent from my GT-N7100 using xda app-developers app

jujuburi said:
There is not a single AMOLED screen which is problem free. Be it tint or any other thing. It's quite true that people who are saying my screen is 'perfect' either don't know what a perfect screen is or simply lying.
And yes, my Note 2 screen has Yellowish tint, but it's on a much lower level than my S2 and spreaded all over the display unlike S2's only left side area. So I'm more or less happy with it. This is my 5th OLED displayed phone and NONE was perfect, NONE. Only which was my favorite and near perfect was Wave S8500 screen.
Sent from my GT-N7100
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Furthermore Im mot really happy if someone has to tell me to lower down my brightness. Its unacceptable. AMOLED's are what I call still in the beta stage. Its not ready for primetime.
Sent from my GT-N7000 using xda app-developers app

To be honest my screen has no tinting like what the op said.
Also, I don't get why people don't use it at a normal brightness level. If it burns in then have it replaced while it's under warranty. That's what I did with the s2.
Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk 2

Tab S 8.4 vs. Xperia tablet z

I currently have a tablet z and I am wondering how does this compares to Tab S 8.4.
I am thinking about buying this one on account of the superb screen but seems that there are a great deal of lag happening, is it so?
Thanks in advance!
Sent from my SGP311 using Tapatalk

So, no opinions?
Sent from my SGP311 using Tapatalk

AllanJacques said:
I currently have a tablet z and I am wondering how does this compares to Tab S 8.4.
I am thinking about buying this one on account of the superb screen but seems that there are a great deal of lag happening, is it so?
Thanks in advance!
Sent from my SGP311 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is by no means the fastest tablet out there. Though I love the screen and my aosp ROM is working better everyday and has eliminated any lag issues I had.

AllanJacques said:
I currently have a tablet z and I am wondering how does this compares to Tab S 8.4.
I am thinking about buying this one on account of the superb screen but seems that there are a great deal of lag happening, is it so?
Thanks in advance!
Sent from my SGP311 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't compare with the tablet Z, but I own a Tab S 8.4, a Nexus 7 2013 and a Note 8.0. I will try to answer your questions based on my experience:
The tab S 8.4's screen is a huge disappointment to me. It looks awesome in bright environments, the high pitch and vivid colors are pleasant to my eyes. However, for someone with high expectations as I did, it suffers from several issues that used affect previous AMOLED generations and totally ruin my experience:
- Smearing on black backgrounds. An issue that was already reported on Galaxy S4, and that seem to affect Tab S 8.4 as well: A dark red smear is visible when watching movies on black backgrounds. It looks like black pixels are slower at displaying a color than already lit pixels. The result is not obvious on first watch, but once noticed becomes a nightmare in dark movies.
Here is a fix for this issue: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2259775
While this seem to be pretty efficient fixing the smearing issue, the result is not perfect, it is rather annoying to use AND we lose the benefits of perfect blacks in the darkness. And it impacts battrery life, as a dark grey pixel is powered, while a black one is not.
- Mura effect. Basically, dark (but not black) colors are not homogenous on the screen. It is only really noticeable in the darkness, wich is my main usage for the tablet. Rather annoying, especially since the fix for the smearing issues induces replacing all "black" by "extremely dark grey", which reveal this issue.
More information on mura effect: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2108073
- Yellow/greyish tint. This one is'nt the worst, but can be felt on white backgrounds. This one becomes obvious when compared directly to a more natural white screen: the middle of the screen seems more yellowish and darker than the borders. It seems like the glass could be dirty, or tinted by years of heavy usage, which it is not.
None of these issues are obvious to someone who doesn't set his standards very high. They are for me though, and will probably be noticed by people willing to use the tablet in the darkness.
As a bottomline, I actually prefer the display offered by my Nexus 7 or iPad mini retina rather than the Tab S 8.4's. They lack the "wow" effect of vivid colors and the perfect blacks, but provide a more homogenous experience, especially in the darkness.
Now for the performances, I don't know what's wrong with this tab. I was thinking about putting the blame on TouchWiz, but alternative launchers don't help. Rooting and turning off as many services as possible didn't either. Here is what I noticed:
- System zoom effects are subjects to stuttering (opening new app/window, for example). None of my other android device suffers from similar issues, and zooming in other apps such as web browser works flawlessly. The issue is not reliable, and seems to reduce when the same window is opened and closed several times in a row. Memory access issue causing stuttering ?
- Overall system doesn't feel as smooth as it should. Even my elder Note 8.0 feels butter smooth compared to the Tab S 8.4, which I can hardly explain. It is fast enough, but the FPS seems to be lower.
- Two of my favourite apps suffer from low FPS when scrolling: Perfect Viewer and Moon+ Reader. The poor performances make the experience with these apps less enjoyable than on N7 or Note 8, which his hard to explain considering how much more powerful the Tab S 8.4 should be.
- 3D gaming is not at its best either. Performances are clearly below N7, and maybe even lower than on Note 8. There, I guess this is the cost for the extreme pixel density of the display panel.
If you are satisfied with the services offered by your Sony tablet, I'd suggest to stick with it. The Tab S 8.4 is a very decent tablet but not perfect, and its major strenghts are also its main weaknesses.

My 10.5 tablet doubtlessly has the best screen I've ever seen on any device. Sure, a k1 is faster CPU and GPU wise, but for my mainly media consumption and Web browsing it's amazing. Haven't experienced any of the issues mentioned above so I guess pentile does detract a bit.
Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 5 alpha

ukael said:
I can't compare with the tablet Z, but I own a Tab S 8.4, a Nexus 7 2013 and a Note 8.0. I will try to answer your questions based on my experience:
The tab S 8.4's screen is a huge disappointment to me. It looks awesome in bright environments, the high pitch and vivid colors are pleasant to my eyes. However, for someone with high expectations as I did, it suffers from several issues that used affect previous AMOLED generations and totally ruin my experience:
- Smearing on black backgrounds. An issue that was already reported on Galaxy S4, and that seem to affect Tab S 8.4 as well: A dark red smear is visible when watching movies on black backgrounds. It looks like black pixels are slower at displaying a color than already lit pixels. The result is not obvious on first watch, but once noticed becomes a nightmare in dark movies.
Here is a fix for this issue: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2259775
While this seem to be pretty efficient fixing the smearing issue, the result is not perfect, it is rather annoying to use AND we lose the benefits of perfect blacks in the darkness. And it impacts battrery life, as a dark grey pixel is powered, while a black one is not.
- Mura effect. Basically, dark (but not black) colors are not homogenous on the screen. It is only really noticeable in the darkness, wich is my main usage for the tablet. Rather annoying, especially since the fix for the smearing issues induces replacing all "black" by "extremely dark grey", which reveal this issue.
More information on mura effect: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2108073
- Yellow/greyish tint. This one is'nt the worst, but can be felt on white backgrounds. This one becomes obvious when compared directly to a more natural white screen: the middle of the screen seems more yellowish and darker than the borders. It seems like the glass could be dirty, or tinted by years of heavy usage, which it is not.
None of these issues are obvious to someone who doesn't set his standards very high. They are for me though, and will probably be noticed by people willing to use the tablet in the darkness.
As a bottomline, I actually prefer the display offered by my Nexus 7 or iPad mini retina rather than the Tab S 8.4's. They lack the "wow" effect of vivid colors and the perfect blacks, but provide a more homogenous experience, especially in the darkness.
Now for the performances, I don't know what's wrong with this tab. I was thinking about putting the blame on TouchWiz, but alternative launchers don't help. Rooting and turning off as many services as possible didn't either. Here is what I noticed:
- System zoom effects are subjects to stuttering (opening new app/window, for example). None of my other android device suffers from similar issues, and zooming in other apps such as web browser works flawlessly. The issue is not reliable, and seems to reduce when the same window is opened and closed several times in a row. Memory access issue causing stuttering ?
- Overall system doesn't feel as smooth as it should. Even my elder Note 8.0 feels butter smooth compared to the Tab S 8.4, which I can hardly explain. It is fast enough, but the FPS seems to be lower.
- Two of my favourite apps suffer from low FPS when scrolling: Perfect Viewer and Moon+ Reader. The poor performances make the experience with these apps less enjoyable than on N7 or Note 8, which his hard to explain considering how much more powerful the Tab S 8.4 should be.
- 3D gaming is not at its best either. Performances are clearly below N7, and maybe even lower than on Note 8. There, I guess this is the cost for the extreme pixel density of the display panel.
If you are satisfied with the services offered by your Sony tablet, I'd suggest to stick with it. The Tab S 8.4 is a very decent tablet but not perfect, and its major strenghts are also its main weaknesses.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your answer was perfect for my needs as my main utility for Tab S would be perfect viewer and moon reader as well.
Reading all sorts of experiences I'm beginning to wonder if I should buy a new tablet or not and it seems that I will rain check this purchase for now...
Sent from my SGP311 using Tapatalk

since in some country you can like send it back if you not satisfy kind of sale.. and if it apply to you why dont you test it. i dont have any problem like being mentioned above. and in this short period... i think the QC of the device are kind of loopy... some got great functionality without any problem and sadly some does.

Zamboney said:
My 10.5 tablet doubtlessly has the best screen I've ever seen on any device. Sure, a k1 is faster CPU and GPU wise, but for my mainly media consumption and Web browsing it's amazing. Haven't experienced any of the issues mentioned above so I guess pentile does detract a bit.
Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 5 alpha
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Regarding the screen, I couldn't find reports about the issues I mentioned above for the Tab S 10.5. It looks like the screen on the 10.5 is using a newer technology that would fixe these issues. I so wish it would be the same for 8.4 !
Not everybody is noticing these issues on 8.4, but then I believe it to be related to lower sensitivity to the issues. They are not obvious at all, and basically impossible to notice in lightened environments and/or watching colored images.

ukael said:
Regarding the screen, I couldn't find reports about the issues I mentioned above for the Tab S 10.5. It looks like the screen on the 10.5 is using a newer technology that would fixe these issues. I so wish it would be the same for 8.4 !
Not everybody is noticing these issues on 8.4, but then I believe it to be related to lower sensitivity to the issues. They are not obvious at all, and basically impossible to notice in lightened environments and/or watching colored images.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not having any of the issues you highlighted with the screen. If you have already voided your warranty it would be interesting to see if you have the same issue with my asop build.

Not having any issue with my tab s 8.4 here... love this tablet.. i was a user of nexus 7 2nd gen..
Sent from my SM-T705 using Tapatalk

eousphoros said:
I'm not having any of the issues you highlighted with the screen. If you have already voided your warranty it would be interesting to see if you have the same issue with my asop build.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As a newb at flashing roms, I didn't go further than rooting at the moment.
Regarding the screen, while I am surprised that people report not noticing the issues at all, I am convinced many just don't notice them.
The smearing is actually more felt, guessed than seen. But once noticed, it becomes an annoyance.
The green/yellow tint is only visible on white backgrounds and when comparing to other screens or looking at it for a duration (reading e-books or internet webpages). It's far from being obvious on first sight.
The Mura effect however should become obvious to anyone looking for it. You can try with the follwing steps:
- Download and install screen adjuster.
- Get in the complete darkness
- Launch Screen adjuster, and set Red, Green and Blue to +5. Make sure it's switched on
- Look at a completely black background
=> The black background won't be black anymore but very dark grey. This is what Screen adjuster did by adding +5 in each color. If the screen is affected by mura effect, some areas will be lighter grey and others darker.
This is an issue that affects the 3 tab S 8.4 I tried (I exchanged it twice), as well as my Galaxy SII and my PS Vita. I just wish it wouldn't be the case, but I have yet to see an amoled display that isn't affected, and can hardly beleive I would be cursed badly enough to always get faulty units.

No issues on mine. The screen is superlative!

ukael said:
As a newb at flashing roms, I didn't go further than rooting at the moment.
Regarding the screen, while I am surprised that people report not noticing the issues at all, I am convinced many just don't notice them.
The smearing is actually more felt, guessed than seen. But once noticed, it becomes an annoyance.
The green/yellow tint is only visible on white backgrounds and when comparing to other screens or looking at it for a duration (reading e-books or internet webpages). It's far from being obvious on first sight.
The Mura effect however should become obvious to anyone looking for it. You can try with the follwing steps:
- Download and install screen adjuster.
- Get in the complete darkness
- Launch Screen adjuster, and set Red, Green and Blue to +5. Make sure it's switched on
- Look at a completely black background
=> The black background won't be black anymore but very dark grey. This is what Screen adjuster did by adding +5 in each color. If the screen is affected by mura effect, some areas will be lighter grey and others darker.
This is an issue that affects the 3 tab S 8.4 I tried (I exchanged it twice), as well as my Galaxy SII and my PS Vita. I just wish it wouldn't be the case, but I have yet to see an amoled display that isn't affected, and can hardly beleive I would be cursed badly enough to always get faulty units.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've already tested mine T800 for mura with many shades of grey and no issues found.

Zamboney said:
I've already tested mine T800 for mura with many shades of grey and no issues found.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, from my readings here and there, T800 screens whouldn't suffer from the same issues. They use a different technology though, I wish T700 would be using the same.

yes. me too.
"ukael" is right.
I had this problem on my both two Samsung Tab S 8.4 LTE T705.
on first I thought it is related to that one, but after purchased 2nd Tab S 8.4 T705, I noticed screen going yellowish.
specially in middle screen while in horizontal rotate specially reading something that has white background.

prssdghrzmhmd said:
yes. me too.
"ukael" is right.
I had this problem on my both two Samsung Tab S 8.4 LTE T705.
on first I thought it is related to that one, but after purchased 2nd Tab S 8.4 T705, I noticed screen going yellowish.
specially in middle screen while in horizontal rotate specially reading something that has white background.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you realize you replied to a thread from August 2014? LOL.
Sent from my SM-T800 using XDA-Developers mobile app