Hello! I researched the Rules and did not find a clear policy on members posting .apk's on the forum, especially relating to non-market apps. I understand some members (NOT recognised as devs/themers,etc) may want to test their apps and call out a request and I see that from time to time, but I also worry that malicious code could be propagated in this manner, when there is no 'market'-like processes to vet said apps. Latest example is a post with a wallpapers app/.apk that the poster says must be pushed via adb. Could I get a clarification of the policy? TIA! Cheers!
wideasleep1 said:
Hello! I researched the Rules and did not find a clear policy on members posting .apk's on the forum, especially relating to non-market apps. I understand some members (NOT recognised as devs/themers,etc) may want to test their apps and call out a request and I see that from time to time, but I also worry that malicious code could be propagated in this manner, when there is no 'market'-like processes to vet said apps. Latest example is a post with a wallpapers app/.apk that the poster says must be pushed via adb. Could I get a clarification of the policy? TIA! Cheers!
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It's basically "you're on your own." Why? If you're not comfortable with sideloading third-party applications, you shouldn't be on XDA in the first place. I don't mean this in an offensive way.
Product F(RED) said:
It's basically "you're on your own." Why? If you're not comfortable with sideloading third-party applications, you shouldn't be on XDA in the first place. I don't mean this in an offensive way.
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Nothing to do with 'sideloading', happy to do so on apk's from known/trusted sources (esp. known dev/themers with history). So I can post any malicious code, wrap it in an .apk and post it here and things are hunky-dory?
wideasleep1 said:
Nothing to do with 'sideloading', happy to do so on apk's from known/trusted sources (esp. known dev/themers with history). So I can post any malicious code, wrap it in an .apk and post it here and things are hunky-dory?
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Sideloading = Taking an APK file and manually installing it on your device, which is what you're describing.
CAN you do that? Yes. SHOULD you do that? No.
If you get caught, will you get banned? Yes.
Do we have some sort of attachment scanner capable of scanning APKs? No.
Even if we did, would spreading malicious APKs still be possible? Yes, through external hosting sites.
Just to clarify:
You can post any APK you want to as long as it is NOT someone else's paid app (warez) nor illegal, nor harmful to a device.
If you look at the various themes and apps section, lots of Junior and Senior members post up their APKs or flashable ZIPs or what have you, and this is not against our rules. The rules just forbid you putting up a paid APK that you did not develop, because that is illegal and is basically stealing.
But there is no blanket rule against posting APKs or installing APKs.
you DO need to be careful what you install though. If you see something shady report it. I personally would NOT flash a wallpapers APK, but I would install a verified beta launcher APK or something, so you need to exercise some common sense..
Product F(RED) said:
Sideloading = Taking an APK file and manually installing it on your device, which is what you're describing.
CAN you do that? Yes. SHOULD you do that? No.
If you get caught, will you get banned? Yes.
Do we have some sort of attachment scanner capable of scanning APKs? No.
Even if we did, would spreading malicious APKs still be possible? Yes, through external hosting sites.
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Again, I understand there are risks and again my point has nothing to do with sideloading per se..my point is your statement:
"If you get caught, will you get banned? Yes. "
And I ask, How? Under what rule? If it is a banworthy offence, there should be a rule.
wideasleep1 said:
Again, I understand there are risks and again my point has nothing to do with sideloading per se..my point is your statement:
"If you get caught, will you get banned? Yes. "
And I ask, How? Under what rule? If it is a banworthy offence, there should be a rule.
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Re-read my post.
You will not be banned for posting or installing an APK unless it is warez or obviously spam or harmful.
"If you get caught, will you get banned? Yes. "
This is statement is not true unless it violates what I have just described.
There are APKs floating all over these forums. I personally use the transparent Genie Wdiget APK that you can only find in APK form, that I actually have to push to /system/app to get to work, there is NO RULE that says you cannot post it or install it.
orangekid said:
Just to clarify:
You can post any APK you want to as long as it is NOT someone else's paid app (warez) nor illegal, nor harmful to a device.
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Therein lies the problem..what is 'harmful to a device'? Auto-brick? Is harmful to the user (ID/personal info theft) not included in 'harmful'?
If you look at the various themes and apps section, lots of Junior and Senior members post up their APKs or flashable ZIPs or what have you, and this is not against our rules. The rules just forbid you putting up a paid APK that you did not develop, because that is illegal and is basically stealing.
But there is no blanket rule against posting APKs or installing APKs.
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(Devil's advocate time)..I care MUCH LESS about paid apk 'theft' than ID/personal info theft..for our members, that issue greatly outweighs some commercial interests. I understand completely XDA currently has no mechanism to police code/.apk's posted, etc. Part of my point in raising the issue is to understand what would raise a flag/ban currently and again under what rule.
you DO need to be careful what you install though. If you see something shady report it. I personally would NOT flash a wallpapers APK, but I would install a verified beta launcher APK or something, so you need to exercise some common sense..
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This is a given. I just think XDA needs a clear(er) policy on this, and is missing an opportunity to roll this into a Recognised Contributor/Developer/Themer attribute, giving our membership greater confidence when using 'unofficial' apk's/non-market apps. I think management should revisit the topic, and come up with a defined rule like other ban-able offences, and utilise existing tools (Recognised labels or other excellence-based protocol) to enhance member confidence going forward.
wideasleep1 said:
Therein lies the problem..what is 'harmful to a device'? Auto-brick? Is harmful to the user (ID/personal info theft) not included in 'harmful'?
(Devil's advocate time)..I care MUCH LESS about paid apk 'theft' than ID/personal info theft..for our members, that issue greatly outweighs some commercial interests. I understand completely XDA currently has no mechanism to police code/.apk's posted, etc. Part of my point in raising the issue is to understand what would raise a flag/ban currently and again under what rule.
This is a given. I just think XDA needs a clear(er) policy on this, and is missing an opportunity to roll this into a Recognised Contributor/Developer/Themer attribute, giving our membership greater confidence when using 'unofficial' apk's/non-market apps. I think management should revisit the topic, and come up with a defined rule like other ban-able offences, and utilise existing tools (Recognised labels or other excellence-based protocol) to enhance member confidence going forward.
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The normal rules regulate what you can post. We have an anti-warez rule, so that would include an APK.
We cannot just have a million rules on this or that permission is allowed in this APK or not, you just have to use common sense on it.
Honestly, APKs don't really cause bricks. At worst they will soft-brick a device, but the things that cause bricks are bootloader or radio flashes, or a bad kernel, but not APKs, so that's not really something to worry about.
Even some Play Store apps are found to have malware and are removed by Google, but not before infecting a phone, so it is not possible to regulate every single APK, nor is it possible to prevent all hard bricks.
As long as there are users who are not careful or who do not read and Odin flash the wrong firmware or flash an HBOOT version that was expressly told not to flash or flash an old .51 radio on a T-Mobile HD2 you will have problems.
This is a developer forum. Developers make apps and they put it in APK form. There is nothing wrong with this. Be careful what you push to /system/app, look at the permissions you are allowing. Do you want a wallpaper APK to have access to your phone records or GPS location? If not, hit cancel.
But I don't think we should ban all APKs, or APKs that want this or that permission. If you see something shady, report it.
And I don't understand what a recognized Dev, Themer, or Contributor title has to do with posting APKs, those are not related in any way, or did I miss the point on that?
How would you clarify the rules on this? What problem have you seen that needs to be solved? This seems academic unless you've seen a practical issue?
I don't really get what his (the OP's) point is, but my response was specifically addressing his question about knowingly posting malicious APKs.
Product F(RED) said:
I don't really get what his (the OP's) point is, but my response was specifically addressing his question about knowingly posting malicious APKs.
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I didn't get the malicious part. Yeah that would obviously be removed
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4
orangekid said:
The normal rules regulate what you can post. We have an anti-warez rule, so that would include an APK.
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I assert XDA lacks a rule for malware or onerous permissions, and it *should* be a 'normal rule', along with warez, etc.
We cannot just have a million rules on this or that permission is allowed in this APK or not, you just have to use common sense on it.
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I'm not requesting a million, just a CLEAR rule on XDA's policy on .apk posting, what constitutes a ban or link removal.
Honestly, APKs don't really cause bricks. At worst they will soft-brick a device, but the things that cause bricks are bootloader or radio flashes, or a bad kernel, but not APKs, so that's not really something to worry about.
Even some Play Store apps are found to have malware and are removed by Google, but not before infecting a phone, so it is not possible to regulate every single APK, nor is it possible to prevent all hard bricks.
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Agreed. My point is XDA can clarify the rule, while instilling confidence in the .apk's routinely posted within fora (especially if they come from Recognised Devs/Themers and the like, that is why I mentioned the Recog label, but I assume it was devised to control donation begging, rather than any design to add member confidence, please correct me if I'm wrong).
As long as there are users who are not careful or who do not read and Odin flash the wrong firmware or flash an HBOOT version that was expressly told not to flash or flash an old .51 radio on a T-Mobile HD2 you will have problems.
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I'm not concerned with, well, idiots..I simply think XDA could do better with monitoring it's links wrt .apk's and develop a clearer policy, as it has done for warez.
This is a developer forum. Developers make apps and they put it in APK form. There is nothing wrong with this. Be careful what you push to /system/app, look at the permissions you are allowing. Do you want a wallpaper APK to have access to your phone records or GPS location? If not, hit cancel.
But I don't think we should ban all APKs, or APKs that want this or that permission. If you see something shady, report it.
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The crux...members are MORE LIKELY to report a shady .apk IF WE HAD A CLEAR POLICY, and enforcement.
And I don't understand what a recognized Dev, Themer, or Contributor title has to do with posting APKs, those are not related in any way, or did I miss the point on that?
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Perhaps, but that would depend on what one sees as the purpose of 'Recognised' label...I assume it was to elevate the code quality and comradery of developers, but it could simply grant donation status, I suppose.
How would you clarify the rules on this? What problem have you seen that needs to be solved? This seems academic unless you've seen a practical issue?
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A clear simple rule: "Downloading and installing software in any manner on your device is AT YOUR OWN RISK. However, XDA reserves the right to remove any links or software and ban members posting any links or software, at its discretion. Members should report any suspicious links and software to staff for review, and use common sense when choosing which developers and software to use. "
orangekid said:
I didn't get the malicious part. Yeah that would obviously be removed
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Yes, it seems academic, that is why I'm surprised an explicit rule for members to refer to, doesn't exist.
I think I've exhausted my point, so I'll stop unless anyone has anything else to add. Cheers!
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4[/QUOTE]
OK, I think I get you know.
I guess I just feel like that is so obvious that it wouldn't really need to be explicitly stated.
If you knowingly post malware, you will be banned.
But I do see your point, and it makes sense. Would you care to hazard a suggestion on how it would be worded and implemented?
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4
orangekid said:
OK, I think I get you know.
I guess I just feel like that is so obvious that it wouldn't really need to be explicitly stated.
If you knowingly post malware, you will be banned.
But I do see your point, and it makes sense. Would you care to hazard a suggestion on how it would be worded and implemented?
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4
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I think what I posted above; "Downloading and installing software in any manner on your device is AT YOUR OWN RISK. However, XDA reserves the right to remove any links or software and ban members posting any links or software, at its discretion. Members should report any suspicious links and software to staff for review, and use common sense when choosing which developers and software to use. "
is a good starting point, but I would also prefer language specifically about malware and onerous permissions. Presently, it seems to be a free-for-all to post anything (non-warez) at whim (throw it against the wall and see what sticks) based on the rules presently. I can see where staff might not 'be on the same page' in responding to member reports on this topic without the clear rule. Even the warez rule itself could be expanded to include malware and onerous permissions...whatever works best for staff, and clarifies the rule for members. I would expect staff-specific rules about what constitutes onerous permissions (like your example about contacts for a wallpaper app) and would like those in the public rule as well, but detail isn't absolutely necessary (it begins to obscure rather than clarify at some point). When the time comes for members to see/report, and staff to delete/ban, this rule should be the reference. Cheers!
Related
Why was this thread closed?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=834623
Usually when a mod closes it they always have the last post and have some sort of explanation as to why it is closed.
gqstatus0685 said:
Why was this thread closed?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=834623
Usually when a mod closes it they always have the last post and have some sort of explanation as to why it is closed.
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MOD EDIT: Removed link requiring registration to download, per rule 11
read much ?
It looks like they were looking for a reason to shut him down out of some spite.
Secondly you don't have to post a smart ass comment. I understand you're shielded behind your monitor and keyboard but that doesn't mean you have to act like a jerk.
There are plenty of ROM threads with members posting stuff they shouldn't have posted. They could have simply edited the offenders post or did a temporary ban. Anyone else care to chime in?
gqstatus0685 said:
Anyone else care to chime in?
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I didn't know the thread got closed but I think its appropriate to do so.
Leaving past drama in the past I still think its wrong for someone to post a link/thread on XDA that intends to direct traffic away from XDA, requiring registration on another website in order to enjoy the author's work. If DD wanted to be part of the XDA community then he should post and, to some degree, support his work ON XDA.
I don't care wether or not his thread was shut down. I just thought the whole thing was a little shady - some guy comes out of nowhere to offer this amazing thing that this other guy has, but you can only have it if you come into the alley with him because he can't show you in the light.
That thread was hijacked with bickering back and fourth anyway.
nukedukem said:
I don't care wether or not his thread was shut down. I just thought the whole thing was a little shady - some guy comes out of nowhere to offer this amazing thing that this other guy has, but you can only have it if you come into the alley with him because he can't show you in the light.
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lmao......
So what... the Rom rocked.
Just register at his forum, that's what I did. I have been running the rom since day one and it is the best rom I think I have ever used. There are a few bugs here but I use it everyday and love it. Google search "the ultimate droid evo" and it's the first link.
I didn't see anyone actually answer your question.. the second time the thread was closed was because the rom contains swype.
nukedukem said:
I don't care wether or not his thread was shut down. I just thought the whole thing was a little shady - some guy comes out of nowhere to offer this amazing thing that this other guy has, but you can only have it if you come into the alley with him because he can't show you in the light.
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LMAO! Thats too funny! Makes sense...(no pun)
...and now the 2.1 thread has been locked in the EVO forum. Yet, identical threads in the Desire and Motorola forums are still open. Mod(s) please explain this?
jobryan26 said:
...and now the 2.1 thread has been locked in the EVO forum. Yet, identical threads in the Desire and Motorola forums are still open. Mod(s) please explain this?
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Are you freaking kidding me! I just went to the development section and the thread is gone. This is getting really stupid.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
It was shut down the first time because it linked another sign up site to download it. Second time because it included warez. Third time, may have been due to warez(ex fancy widgets) or maybe even because of the $2 monthly fee for nighties. Hell it may have just been to all the crying the tread seem to bring.
gqstatus0685 said:
Are you freaking kidding me! I just went to the development section and the thread is gone. This is getting really stupid.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
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Here is where the thread was.. forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=849986 which now the link redirects you to the "Forum & Marketplace Rules". It was stated in the subject line that the thread was not in compliance with #8
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8. Donations.
We appreciate all donations to xda-developers.com, it keeps our forum online and well maintained. As a user you're allowed to ask for donations in your signature as a thank you for your hard work. However donations up front are not allowed, this forum is about sharing, not about getting paid to do something, that's what your job is for.
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Here is the currently still open thread in the Desire forum:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=849992 which is an exact copy of the page which was locked.
This is getting ridiculous....
The Ultimate Droid 2.1.0
THIS IS NOT MY WORK! This is an AOSP rom brought to you by Blackdroid. If you like his work, PLEASE donate.
The forums no longer require membership to download. Additionally, in order to comply, Swype has been removed from the rom.
The Ultimate Droid 2.1.0 can be downloaded from HERE
The Ultimate Droid 2.1.0 Changelog:
- New popup changelog on startup (anderweb/blackdroid)
- New updated themed with images from gingerbread (blackdroid)
- Added new launcher (new customized version of adw with new features, anderweb/blackdroid)
- Added option to turn toggle overscroll and change weight of effect (rmcc)
- Reverted to 1.0.0 Phone UI untill updates are made to new UI. (Will be send out as and update)
- Newer more customizable live wallpapers (kmobs - make sure to donate)
- Updated all apps on the Ultimate Droid Servers
- Fixes for camera contious focus (droid)
- Updated Overhauled music app
- Updated News and Weather
- Updated Google CarHome
- Updated Google Talk
- Updated Marketplace
- Updated Google Maps
- New Kernel for Inc (cyanogen)
- Fixes for bluetooth
If you like this ROM and would like to help further development:
PLEASE DO NOT FEED THE DEVELOPER!
A donation link can be found HERE
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The cached link: http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...wthread.php?t=849986&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us
So let me get this right... because the OP posted "If you like this ROM and would like to help further developmentLEASE DO NOT FEED THE DEVELOPER! A donation link can be found HERE" outside of his/her signature this caused the thread to get locked and it's not even the OP's rom??? Not sure I understand how #8 even applies to the thread since the rom wasn't the OP's and he was trying to stay in compliance with rule #12
12. Using the work of others.
If you are developing something that is based on the work of another Member, you MUST first seek their permission, and you must give credit to the member whose work you used. If a dispute occurs about who developed / created a piece of work, first try to settle the matter by private message and NOT in open forum. If this fails then you may contact a moderator with clear evidence that the work was created by you.
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I mean com'on it's not like the OP hacked a phone (which is illegal), stole the the UI off the phone aka: "porting" (like HTC Sense, Acer Liquid, or etc which ARE NOT open source therefore "illegal" as they are covered by copyright as stated in you HTC Sense software menu>settings>about phone>legal information>HTC legal>
1.
Copyright
Certain software contained in this device is contributed or developed by HTC Corporation
Copyright @ [2006-2010] HTC Corportation
All Rights Reserved.
The works ("Works") herein refer to the software developed or owned by the HTC Corporation ("HTC") and not separately released under the terms of an open source software license. The information contained in the Works is the exclusive property of HTC. HTC grants the legal user of this device the right to use the Works solely within the scope of the legitimate operation of the device. No further right is granted under this license including but not limited to, distribution, reproduction, modification, and transmission. Any other usage shall be subject to the written consent of HTC
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Which means nearly EVERY developer here is direct violation of rule #6 ("Do not post warez") of the site unless someone has posted a copy of the authorization from HTC to redistribute their software. Yes, I use custom ported roms like most of xda, and I fully support advancing development of the mobile platform. My lack of understanding is not over this, but over nitpicking "some" developers and using rules when it fits ones specific agenda. Whatever agenda that might be. I am not here to start a war with admins or mods, but to get a more clear understanding of intent. It seems not only unclear to myself but to others as well. Thanks John
bwcorvus said:
It was shut down the first time because it linked another sign up site to download it. Second time because it included warez. Third time, may have been due to warez(ex fancy widgets) or maybe even because of the $2 monthly fee for nighties. Hell it may have just been to all the crying the tread seem to bring.
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2$ monthly fee HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA what bullsh*t is that
phatmanxxl said:
That thread was hijacked with bickering back and fourth anyway.
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That's all this thread is as well.
gqstatus0685 said:
It looks like they were looking for a reason to shut him down out of some spite.
Secondly you don't have to post a smart ass comment. I understand you're shielded behind your monitor and keyboard but that doesn't mean you have to act like a jerk.
There are plenty of ROM threads with members posting stuff they shouldn't have posted. They could have simply edited the offenders post or did a temporary ban. Anyone else care to chime in?
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they did the same thing to kingklick.
It's favoritism, that's all.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
if my memory serves me right XDA has some kind of right to host Sense roms with all the Sense things , someone made that argument before.
XDA the wonderful forum it is, but it has gone too big. Not that i'm complaining, but you're post seems to be lost many times because 100 other people posted after you especially in hot threads or ROM releases. So if you quoted someone or someone quotes you many times you skip it, or have to do a painful searches spanning 10's of pages...
Slickdeals.net (another big forum like XDA) has a wonderful system, that whenever someone quotes you're post you get a pop-up next time you log in with a link which takes you straight to the reply. I was wondering if such a system is possible here also?
Regards
BUMP
This feature would be really nice to have!
I like to idea, but I think it depends on the forum system. As I remember XDA uses vBulettin, you should check if it's possible to do this and if so you could ask one of the admins to set it. So to answer your question it's possible, but the admins won't change the source of the forum to do this.
Sent from my GT-I5700 using XDA Premium App
I like this idea too. It might be too resource-intensive (we never want to add a feature that slows down the site). I'll ping our server admin to see if this would be possible.
I am really missing this type of feature!
Specifically, I know many other vBulletin forums that have a /whoquotedme.php page - it shows a list of the latest posts in which you were quoted. It greatly helps in discovering who's trying to communicate with you, answer a question you might've had, or ask one of you [without specifically sending a pm].
I believe something like http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthread.php?t=255285
I think it checks every post to see if there is a user id present when there is a quote in the post, and then associates a link to that post with the user who was quoted.
I haven't specifically heard of it being a resource hog, but then again I am not a vBulletin admin
ivolol said:
I am really missing this type of feature!
Specifically, I know many other vBulletin forums that have a /whoquotedme.php page - it shows a list of the latest posts in which you were quoted. It greatly helps in discovering who's trying to communicate with you, answer a question you might've had, or ask one of you [without specifically sending a pm].
I believe something like http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthread.php?t=255285
I think it checks every post to see if there is a user id present when there is a quote in the post, and then associates a link to that post with the user who was quoted.
I haven't specifically heard of it being a resource hog, but then again I am not a vBulletin admin
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I know of a similar addon for the correct version of vBulletin that does something like this...
pulser_g2 said:
I know of a similar addon for the correct version of vBulletin that does something like this...
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So why not post / install it?
ivolol said:
So why not post / install it?
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Discussed it with other mods, but we don't think it is needed at this time.
pulser_g2 said:
Discussed it with other mods, but we don't think it is needed at this time.
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Wow really, is it because is it too resource intensive? Slickdeals, is also hosted on vBulletin platform..
Sorry for the late reply and digging this thread up but ironically, I forgot to keep track of this thread
Mafioso said:
Wow really, is it because is it too resource intensive? Slickdeals, is also hosted on vBulletin platform..
Sorry for the late reply and digging this thread up but ironically, I forgot to keep track of this thread
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Yes, it was determined to be very resource intensive, for a site with 4 million users, as every post would have to be checked as it was made, to see if it mentioned someone...
pulser_g2 said:
Yes, it was determined to be very resource intensive, for a site with 4 million users, as every post would have to be checked as it was made, to see if it mentioned someone...
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how about allowing users to jump to their last posts in a thread?
having to search for your own post in a thread, especially a popular ROM thread for example, is a very annoying...
vis80k said:
how about allowing users to jump to their last posts in a thread?
having to search for your own post in a thread, especially a popular ROM thread for example, is a very annoying...
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Agree, nice idea. coul be also nice to have a better implementation of the actual search in a topic... Right now it is a bit confusing
That would be cool, but I'd be happy if notifications worked at all. Mine quit working two updates ago and haven't worked since.
PieceKeepr said:
That would be cool, but I'd be happy if notifications worked at all. Mine quit working two updates ago and haven't worked since.
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Are you referring to notifications to new replies on subscribed threads or new PMs? Those are definitely working. If your having an issue with that, we can certainly help you get to the bottom of why your not receiving yours.
When I want to go back to recent conversations I was involved in I use the "Find all posts by" link.
Click on your user name at the top right, select Statistics and there's the link - "Find all posts by your username". I've bookmarked this for easy access.
That way, if I've taken part in a conversation then I can carry on where I left off. If I don't want to see what people responded with then I obviously don't care, and that's up to me to choose. It's the easiest way to keep track of what you were involved in.
svetius said:
Are you referring to notifications to new replies on subscribed threads or new PMs? Those are definitely working. If your having an issue with that, we can certainly help you get to the bottom of why your not receiving yours.
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Hmmm. Well I just upgraded to a new phone yesterday so let me see if they work on the new one or not. I didn't turn them on assuming it was broken. I had an Eris and a lot of Eris users were complaining that the notifications had quit. I'll let you know.
Thanks
My notifications definitely are not working. I wiped all app caches, uninstalled the xda app, wiped data/dalvik cache and cache/dalvik cache and rebooted twice. I then reinstalled xda app, logged in and set preferences. Still no notifications and I have no idea why. Email and text messages work.
Sent from my ThunderSheded Thunderbolt using XDA Premium
all very good suggestions!
I hope they find a way to realize that.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium
pulser_g2 said:
Yes, it was determined to be very resource intensive, for a site with 4 million users, as every post would have to be checked as it was made, to see if it mentioned someone...
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If you think of it like that way, it is...
However at slickdeals I think its implemented like whenever someone quote's, a notification is being sent to the ID whose post was quoted...that notification later pops up at bottom when that user logs on, similar to PM dialog which pops, you don't make an actual search in the post that if mentioned someone, so not that resource intensive I feel
What was wrong with bonsai masterkee unlock? Sorry if threads on this topic are against the rules (i thought only links were), so I am sorry if I broke the rules, if so a mod may delete this thread but I just want an explaination.
Did the news get around about a guy named butcher pete?
Idk but why go to another method when one-click is simple and fast
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
bmx_boi32 said:
Idk but why go to another method when one-click is simple and fast
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
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Idk, idc, idgaf, im just wondering.
Did the news get around about a guy named butcher pete?
Currently the advantage of using their tool for me anyways is that I think their Recovery is > cwm 3.0.2.5 . In future updates this tool will install ROM's and will work on multiple devices is what i heard.
marcusant said:
What was wrong with bonsai masterkee unlock? Sorry if threads on this topic are against the rules (i thought only links were), so I am sorry if I broke the rules, if so a mod may delete this thread but I just want an explaination.
Did the news get around about a guy named butcher pete?
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This probably best as a discussion in the General thread. It seems a little more lenient as long as links to a site that is free and only requires a registration to download is forbidden unless you are Android Central which also requires registration to download. But that must be different ??????
links to android central downloads are against the rules also... but discussing bonsai stuff is not. there are a few threads here. but announcing their releases here will usually get locked, since you cant link them, and they dont support them here. I havent used the unlocks yet, i downloaded them to take a look but havent had a chance, but when gingerbread comes they will have to make changes anyway.
chris41g said:
links to android central downloads are against the rules also... but discussing bonsai stuff is not. there are a few threads here. but announcing their releases here will usually get locked, since you cant link them, and they dont support them here. I havent used the unlocks yet, i downloaded them to take a look but havent had a chance, but when gingerbread comes they will have to make changes anyway.
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Thanks Chris for the explanation. I guess the Android Central links are not as controversial as the Bonsai so don't get the same publicity when they are removed. Thanks again.
No Bonsai links Allowed
marcusant said:
What was wrong with bonsai masterkee unlock? Sorry if threads on this topic are against the rules (i thought only links were), so I am sorry if I broke the rules, if so a mod may delete this thread but I just want an explaination.
Did the news get around about a guy named butcher pete?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know that XDA does not allow bonsaigeek links due to the fact that Bonsai requires you to register at their site to get thair code. XDA views this as against the liberties granted through the GPL license.
I do not think they allow Bonsai announcements either.
The latest posters who were shutdown were flamers, extremely critical of XDA and their policies. If you do not like XDA policies, do not sign up & post.
They should not sign up, accept the policies, and then flame XDA, basically asking for a ban.
That's my opinion anyway, FWIW.
...to put it bluntly. I've only had 2-3 occasions recently to use it since it was changed, in all cases, I think, to suggest a thread be moved to a more appropriate forum. Now, I have to remember to copy the URL before, click the 'report post' link, click "I need a thread moved...", click the link for the list of mods, have a Google Doc open, and then try and locate the forum. When I do find the name of the mod, I have to memorize it (remember, I have the URL already copied to the clipboard) and then go through the normal steps for sending a PM.
Really ? Sure makes it seem like you don't want people using that function !!
I do know of a shorter method, but many may not. They're likely to (try and) use the standard vBulletin route. If they're like me, many will probably say "screw this !".
Also, what if that mod isn't around for a while ? Granted, the issue likely isn't urgent, I understand, but as I understand with the old functionality, per vB design, reported post messages go into a queue and ANY mod can see it and act on it.
To some extent I appreciate what you say. However, all the Mods are volunteers and much of the copying of thread links and working out what forum a thread should be moved to etc had to be done by them.
The enormous membership that we now have meant that the volume of reports being directed to a central location was just too high to cope with. We felt that reports should be directly sent to the Moderator who will act on it. What you say about reports in the old system being acted on by any available Mod is untrue. A report for a forum was always meant to be acted on by that forum's Moderator. However, due to the volume of reports going into an enormous list of reports meant it was difficult for Mods to pick out what was for them and what was not.
This s a community, we need to share the load and yes it will require the effort of knowing who the Mod for your forum is!! It will mean you need to prioritize what is reported and maybe you'll have to copy a link. This is about sharing the load, but spare a thought fo the Moderators who give their time entirely for free. You might say, why don't you just add more Moderators? Well, we already have around 100 and of course adding more requires more administration, bureaucracy and continual monitoring. All that has to be done by a couple of part time Administrators. If anybody feels that due to our size we must be a wealthy site who could employ more paid staff; think again, Forums are notoriously poor at generating advert clicks for banner adverts!
So, I agree the changes we made, do require some additional effort on behalf of the Members for some of the less urgent tasks. You may need to find out who your forum Mod is, and copy a link or two. We appreciate you taking the time and effort to do that. The Mods and Admins, spend the day copying links and doing other similar things, so we know what it is like - in fact we really really know what it's like!!
MikeChannon
Forum Admin
Sorry, but this new method is truly awful.
You have taken a useful reporting system and completely made it useless!
I don't get how PM'ing a mod a link to the thread is better than the report system?
With the report system it automatically notifies the mods of the exact post you're reporting.
I have gone from reporting posts almost daily on the old system, to literally never reporting posts now because it's a giant pain in the ass.
Seriously;
Old method:
1) Click report button on offending post
2) Select reason, type in an explanation if necessary
3) Click submit
4) Mod gets report, clicks link directly to the post in question, and deals with it.
New method:
1) Click report button on offending post
2) Click a link with the reason you're reporting
3) Get taken to a message about having to PM a mod
4) Click the back button twice to get back to the thread you were in
5) Copy thread URL
6) Try and figure out who the hell the forum mods are
7) Navigate to your PM box and create a new message to the mod
8) Paste in the thread URL, then try and explain what is going on and who is breaking the rules
9) Send PM
10) Then the mod has to read through the thread and try and disect out exactly which posts the person making the report was talking about, and deal with it.
In what backwards world do you live in that the new method is better?
The new reporting system is a detriment to XDA and the community as a whole.
I'm going to have to agree with the others who've said this new approach is a major step backwards. In fact, the last time I reported something, it went something like this:
Click report post button
Use the list of mods to figure out which one I needed to PM (not even a link to their profile to make it a bit less work)
Explain what was going on in a PM with links and all that fun stuff
Get a PM back from the mod later telling me to report such posts in the future
I replied that I wasn't anymore thrilled than they were that I had to PM them but the reporting feature no longer works and we're now required to do it this way
They were nice enough to apologize and say they must have forgot about that.
Sure sounds to me like he was in favor of the new process
I agree with the OP that the new method is truly a PITA! I use to report with the old method regulary, but now I'm not reporting at all!
It is far easier to send a PM directly to the Moderator of a forum than it is to try and use the 'Report' tool... I don't wish to use the Report tool that often, but the steps required just make me not want to report anything.... I hope Management here believes we are trying to help them make a better/cleaner forum via Reporting.
I love the forum, but this function is broken.
Guys, I can appreciate it may take a *little* more work, but is it really so difficult to have a look at the bottom of the particular forum page where the problem is to find the forum mods:
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
Then all you have to do is send a PM to those mods. heck you can even click on their name to go to their profile, which you can then PM them from....
the_scotsman said:
Guys, I can appreciate it may take a *little* more work, but is it really so difficult to have a look at the bottom of the particular forum page where the problem is to find the forum mods...
Then all you have to do is send a PM to those mods. heck you can even click on their name to go to their profile, which you can then PM them from....
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Wow, the tone of your post and the lack of understanding for how this affects members are more frustrating than the issue itself. Maybe we came across as whiny but that was not my intention in the least. I personally just wanted to give some feedback on the change. What I gather from MikeChannon's post is that a change was needed due to the large size of this master, unsorted list of reported posts where the mods had to find what was relevant to their forums. I understand the importance of the mods, appreciate that they've volunteered, and know their time is valuable which is exactly why making it easy for all members to easily report issues to them is essential. This change feels like a poorly thought out and convoluted "fix" that will discourage the reporting of posts by new and previously committed members.
I would bet money that there have been far fewer posts reported under this new structure and it wouldn't be because the rules are suddenly being followed. In fact, I would say the number of belligerent/rude/demanding/junk posts is only increasing and needs to be cleaned up which will require a post reporting system that works smoothly for both mods and members and is agreeable to everyone.
As you say, the forum mods are listed at the bottom of the forum's thread list...but it doesn't do me much good when inside a thread and wanting to report a post. Since they are known/listed for each forum though, why can't they be listed on the report post screen? Or better yet, automatically fill in a PM with the appropriate forum mods as the recipients and a link to the post that we want to report since that is easily known as it is done with quoting.
I'm interested in what the forum mods themselves think about all of this since they are the ones actually getting the PMs. Do they find it to be less work/easier than before? Do they get a proper post link and a decent explanation? Sorry for the long post.
Oh... there is actually a topic on this. I will be blunt:
- overcomplicated, overengineered, confusing like hell and plain sucks goat's nuts. People get lost in the options, and some of those redundant options sending people to check Google docs for a list of moderators is just a WTH. Why on earth Google Docs, why is it not a plain HTML here on the site and why should anyone check manually for a moderator when the forum DB already has that information available to assign the moderation rights?
If you felt the need to add code to stock vBulletin since the bundled moderating functionality was not fitting your complex needs, either code it properly and completely, or do not code it at all. Do not send me to GDocs to look up a moderator.
Grrrrh.
The enormous membership that we now have meant that the volume of reports being directed to a central location was just too high to cope with. We felt that reports should be directly sent to the Moderator who will act on it. What you say about reports in the old system being acted on by any available Mod is untrue.
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To add something constructive here, all it takes is a freaking improved DB select hacked into the vB report post functionality. Like, where forum is X and offense type is Y and ... blah (whatever criteria you need), then take the post's $URL (which you already have in stock functionality since someone clicked on the ! in the post) and send it to the appropriate moderator via PM.
the_scotsman said:
Guys, I can appreciate it may take a *little* more work, but is it really so difficult to have a look at the bottom of the particular forum page where the problem is to find the forum mods:
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Just to clarify, when I said this
I do know of a shorter method, but many may not. They're likely to (try and) use the standard vBulletin route. If they're like me, many will probably say "screw this !".
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that's what I was referring to. It isn't ideal though...
In total agreement here
I'm sorry, but saying it's just a 'little bit of work' to report a post is a gross understatement.
I am a moderator on several forums (one is very large, like this one, and chatty, with a varied, opinionated membership, just like this one), and I know, for a fact, how difficult it is to deal with reports. However, they are the key to keeping things civil on a forum. Is your membership large? Absolutely. Then bring on more staff. That is the only way to handle this, it isn't by crippling the report system. Now, with this new system, making a member jump through hoops to report things means they won't - if that's your goal, then you have succeeded marvelously. Really? Is that really what you want? I can't believe that, but from the tone of the answers from moderators here it would seem to be the goal.....
reinbeau said:
I'm sorry, but saying it's just a 'little bit of work' to report a post is a gross understatement.
I am a moderator on several forums (one is very large, like this one, and chatty, with a varied, opinionated membership, just like this one), and I know, for a fact, how difficult it is to deal with reports. However, they are the key to keeping things civil on a forum. Is your membership large? Absolutely. Then bring on more staff. That is the only way to handle this, it isn't by crippling the report system. Now, with this new system, making a member jump through hoops to report things means they won't - if that's your goal, then you have succeeded marvelously. Really? Is that really what you want? I can't believe that, but from the tone of the answers from moderators here it would seem to be the goal.....
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Thanks. I would like to elaborate on this. We had a working workflow and procedure. Now, we have manual hack at best, which makes the process annoying to the point that people simply will not bother. Let me explain what I mean.
Say - you are a vendor and write some nifty application. Since you want your users to report bugs to improve it, you include a function that produces a pop-up when the application encounters fatal error/crashes. In there, you let users fill in (optional) comment and their email contact, and then you submit the crashdump automatically to [email protected]
Now, the application becomes immensely popular and [email protected] email becomes a mess. What to do?
Well, what you should do is to improve the crash reporting code so that it gets smarter. Say, you let your users fill in a survey letting them select from multiple-choice list of options about what they were doing when the crash occured etc., maybe do some intelligent automated parsing of the crash log and - according to their answers and the analysis - you send the crashdump only to the people resposible for that part of the code that is involved.
What you absolutely should NOT do: Abandon the nice automated crash reporting and tell users something like: "Oooooh, I crashed. Never mind we already have the info related, we are getting too many reports, so in case you want to report this so that it would eventually get fixed, go, move your lazy ass, dig up the crash dump, find a relevant part of it pertinent to the crash, then go to our website, download a DOC with a list of developers, find the one responsible for the part of the code involved and report it to him via email."
Generally noone will bother since it is way too much work to do. Additionally, the few reports that you still get will miss vital info (such as the crash dump), will get mis-sent since people suck at searching for relevant developer. That is NOT an improvement, that is actually a huge step back.
An eloquent enhancement to my point, doktornotor. Thank you.
Just wondering if this is a dead issue as far as the mods are concerned. I'd at least like to hear an actual response/explanation for the issues raised here. Both responses so far have avoided the real problems. It worries me about the future of XDA if this change really was thought to be the best solution to the "reported issue" master list being large and unsorted. Also, telling us it's now on us to do a *little* more work and play secretary for the forum is a cop out and will result in people to not report anything and allow the increasing flame wars to become much more prominent.
MongooseHelix said:
...and will result in people to not report anything and allow the increasing flame wars to become much more prominent.
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I suspect this is the case. I haven't went through the steps to "report" a post since this change. As I mentioned above, I started to 2 or 3 times and then gave up. Call me "lazy", but it's too much effort....
I will say that I frequently used the function, mainly to get non-development questions/threads moved to the appropriate forum. Not any more...
hallstevenson said:
I suspect this is the case. I haven't went through the steps to "report" a post since this change. As I mentioned above, I started to 2 or 3 times and then gave up. Call me "lazy", but it's too much effort....
I will say that I frequently used the function, mainly to get non-development questions/threads moved to the appropriate forum. Not any more...
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This frustrates and saddens me for the reasons you and others have outlined. Unfortunately running a forum means dealing with all of these issues on the admin/mod side - this really seems as though they've just decided it's too much work. Rather than just throw their hands up in the air, they need to bring on staff. Also, come up with an infraction system (automated), with points assigned to each infraction, once a threshold is reached, a ban is put into place that lasts for a specified period of time. We're doing this right now on Backyard Chickens (don't laugh, it's a huge forum with 95,000 members, chicken people can be quite unruly ). If any mod or admin wants the notes on our system I'd be happy to share them, we're hopeful it will cut down on our work there.
Reports are a pain, but it's the only way you can keep your finger on what's going on, if users find it too difficult to do, they won't.
MongooseHelix said:
Just wondering if this is a dead issue as far as the mods are concerned. I'd at least like to hear an actual response/explanation for the issues raised here.
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+1 on this
(And ROTFLMAO @ unruly Backyard Chickens )
MongooseHelix said:
Just wondering if this is a dead issue as far as the mods are concerned. I'd at least like to hear an actual response/explanation for the issues raised here. Both responses so far have avoided the real problems. It worries me about the future of XDA if this change really was thought to be the best solution to the "reported issue" master list being large and unsorted. Also, telling us it's now on us to do a *little* more work and play secretary for the forum is a cop out and will result in people to not report anything and allow the increasing flame wars to become much more prominent.
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The new RP system was designed to make it easier for our mods to action on the most important issues by reducing the noise and sheer number of RPs, while secondarily sharing a bit of the work with the membership. This is a community, certainly, and we all take part in the efforts to keep it moving smoothly. Each and every mod is a volunteer who moderate out of a true passion for the site and for mobile development, they do the best they can.
Now, we're also flexible and willing to change should anyone have a specific suggestion that would still achieve the goals above while making RPs less cumbersome for members. We can't let members *easily* report anything, anytime, because guess what happens...hundreds of RPs flow through, and the important ones get lost because of this. In our previous system, all it took was a simple click and a post was reported. That got taken advantage of.
But you don't address the fact that now people aren't going to bother. There were pictures in the Post Your Home Screen thread I tried to report, but I gave up - and I'm not a stupid user - that's obviously the way you guys want it now. Sad, I guess the concerns raised here are falling on deaf ears.
You say you tried, but gave up? What did you try? What made you give up? Just curious...
XDA Is not the site where users ask for hacks or warez...Log off and try other places, XDA is NOT the answer....FSM Naddict has approved this message.
Wow, I don't even know where to start with you.
First (and most obvious), settle down with the huge font size. You're not going to get a better answer just because you highlighted and supersized the text. You're just being obnoxious.
Second. This forum is not a place for "hackers," as you're likely thinking it is. Please take a look at the Forum Rules. We are not a bunch of Scipt Kiddies who just want to mess with others privacy and screw around on their accounts. What we are is a group of developers and enthusiasts who want to get the most out of their phone's hardware and software. Posting this type of crap on our forum sullies our good name.
I look forward to when this thread is locked and deleted.
Triniconda said:
Can somone create an instagram hack so you can get someone password or create a way that you can see anyone private photos.
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Again like I said in your other post. Private photos are made private for a reason. Likewise, xda will not help you hack a password. This community is not about what you ask. Go to your local jail and ask the criminals for help.
Sent from my blue galaxy