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1st off this is not intended to be a flaming / bashing thread. If you want to do that please go elsewhere; I'm sure the vibrant forums will welcome you. If a MOD feels this belongs somewhere else, please move it.
I have been a long time WM user and recently switched to android for the past year. I am offering my take on WP7 on the pros on cons.
Interface - Finally something completely new and wonderful. Microsoft really did hit a homerun on trying to make information at a glance approach. Mail and search apps look beautiful. I thing missing, being able to quickly jump to apps in the app menu.
Lack of Landscape Support- For as great as the UI is I am shocked at the lack of landscape support. The start menu, app menu, nor Zune have lanscape support. You can not even refresh a webpage or type in a website if you are in landscape mode. Calling this anything other than an epic "FAIL" by microsoft is sugar coating it. Especially when the HD7 and Surround beg to be in landscape mode with their kick stands.
Browser - As expected from an IE browser it is pretty good. I already mentioned the lack of landscape support which is really frustrating but there is something else that gets under my skin more. Web pages do not resize to fit the screen when you zoom in. This was/is almost a deal breaking for me honestly. I love the organization of having all the buttons at the bottom and the interface is stunning but you lose way to many options in landscape mode. You can't even access favorites without first going back to portrait. MS, this NEEDS to be addressed soon. The browser is the main feature of smartphones now.
Zune - Wonderful if you have a Zune Pass. Honestly it was one of the main reasons why I bought this phone. I expected it to be awesome and it didn't disappoint. That being said they need to add a Play Now option to the market songs. When I'm browsing the market sometimes I want to queue songs and the Add to Playlist option makes sense but how could you leave out Play now? Seriously?
Another thing I don't like is I can not fast forward to a certain spot in a movie. Video files can be hours long, why should I have to hold the fast forward button to get to the point I'd like. Let me hit the progress bar and then use the rewind / fast forward buttons for getting to the exact point.
USB Storage Device- glaring admission, but I can kind of see why. It helps stop piracy, but I loved being able to hook my fuze / tilt 2 / nexus 1 / vibrant to my car stereo and play the music I had downloaded on my phone. I know I could get an audio cable and do the same, but while driving it is so much easier to use the radio head unit to control music rather than your phone. I knew this when getting in bed with WP7, but that doesnt mean I still can't miss it.
Bluetooth- for music works just like it should. however it will not play the audio from video files threw bluetooth. It keeps coming out of my phone's main speakers and there is no way to get into the bluetooth profiles to see if something is wrong. VERY ANNOYING MS. get to fixing it.
People- Wonderful. Could anyone ask anymore? I gave it my facebook and gmail accounts and I didn't have to worry about any contacts not showing up. Love the Facebook updates also.
Dailer- No smart dialer? This used to even be in my old wizard by default. How it get left out is completely beyond me.
Announced fixes- Flash, Copy & Paste, Turn by Turn navigation can't come soon enough but I am glad microsoft acknowledged they needed them.
Local Outlook Support- I knew this before hand, but I am in the crowd that says MS needs to add this ability.
Overall- I bought my HD7 without a contract and I am pretty sure i will NOT be returning it. I love my HD7 and WP7, however this OS isn't entirely complete. That being said was iOS and Android complete when they came out? To even suggest that is laughable. I can not wait for microsoft to release all the fixes for this OS because when it does it will be a powerhouse.
I will not buy that this phone is for dumbsmart phone users. I probably done more with my phones than 95% of android users who will do nothing by bash WP7 and i honestly see this for ALL users. It helps bring the powerhouse experience in an easier way without being tied down as much as iOS.
Why not just post in one of the other 50 threads? Now people will be copy-pasting replies from those into this one.
I did notice the lack of landscape mode in IE. I think that was the only thing that made me go WTF when I used the HD7.
However, the keyboard is so good that I don't think it even mattered that much.
I guess with a 3.7-8" screen it can be a bit annoying, but on anything 4" or bigger it didn't strike me as a big deal beyond the initial shock of it not being there.
Also, lots of people dont' seem to know the difference between an Operating System and an Application.
N8ter said:
Why not just post in one of the other 50 threads? Now people will be copy-pasting replies from those into this one.
I did notice the lack of landscape mode in IE. I think that was the only thing that made me go WTF when I used the HD7.
However, the keyboard is so good that I don't think it even mattered that much.
I guess with a 3.7-8" screen it can be a bit annoying, but on anything 4" or bigger it didn't strike me as a big deal beyond the initial shock of it not being there.
Also, lots of people dont' seem to know the difference between an Operating System and an Application.
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Those threads became nothing but flaming / bashing threads. I thought it would be a good idea to try to get away from that.
Also a core application can be considered part of the OS. If you can not uninstall it, it is part of the OS.
I thought it was annoying not being able to get to the address bar with all that screen space.
I don't know about you guys but my Surround goes into landscape mode IE just fine...
The only thing I don't like is lack of landscape in marketplace and Zune...
also if you want a nice photo editor, Thumba photo editor for $.099 is awesome!
EDIT: Oh i see. I can't believe I have to switch to portrait to type a URL!! WTF microsoft!
jz9833 said:
Browser - As expected from an IE browser it is pretty good. I already mentioned the lack of landscape support which is really frustrating but there is something else that gets under my skin more. Web pages do not resize to fit the screen when you zoom in. This was/is almost a deal breaking for me honestly. I love the organization of having all the buttons at the bottom and the interface is stunning but you lose way to many options in landscape mode. You can't even access favorites without first going back to portrait. MS, this NEEDS to be addressed soon. The browser is the main feature of smartphones now.
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Overall I agree with just about everything you said. Regarding the browser, I've noticed that certain areas of webpages are zoomed in more than others. For instance, on xda, the text of people's posts is HUGE compared to the buttons such as User CP, etc. at the top of the page. What I've found is a double tap in my area of interest on a page will zoom the page so that ONLY my area of interest is approriately sized. Then, when I want to switch to another part of the page, I double tap there and the page will resize, and so on. The text does not dynamically reflow a la Android, but I think it's a pretty usable system.
-R
jz9833 said:
Dailer- No smart dialer? This used to even be in my old wizard by default. How it get left out is completely beyond me.
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There is voice dialing in WP7 not sure what you mean by smart dialer???
rruffman said:
There is voice dialing in WP7 not sure what you mean by smart dialer???
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By going to the dailer and being able to spell "MOM" for example on the keys and it would automatically come up with the number for that contact.
jz9833 said:
Also a core application can be considered part of the OS. If you can not uninstall it, it is part of the OS.
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Lol, what? No, it's not. It's a stock application distributed with the OS. It is not part of the OS.
By the Logic people can say "Android is buggy because the GMail client is buggy." or "Windows Mobile is buggy because the Opera Browser HTC bundled with the HD2 is buggy." or "Linux is full of bugs because the KDE in that distro is buggy as hell."
Every OS comes with a set of stock applications, but they are just that, and are usually updatable independent of installing a new kernel or driver stack on the device.
In any case, I've already said I agree that the lack of landscape mode is an issue.
I just wanted to make that distinction, because lots of people on this forum are incapable of doing it themselves.
N8ter said:
Lol, what? No, it's not. It's a stock application distributed with the OS. It is not part of the OS.
By the Logic people can say "Android is buggy because the GMail client is buggy." or "Windows Mobile is buggy because the Opera Browser HTC bundled with the HD2 is buggy." or "Linux is full of bugs because the KDE in that distro is buggy as hell."
Every OS comes with a set of stock applications, but they are just that, and are usually updatable independent of installing a new kernel or driver stack on the device.
In any case, I've already said I agree that the lack of landscape mode is an issue.
I just wanted to make that distinction, because lots of people on this forum are incapable of doing it themselves.
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I still completely disagree with you. Froyo for Android made plenty of browser updates so would you say that wasn't a OS update?
I like most people consider stock apps part of the OS
jz9833 said:
I still completely disagree with you. Froyo for Android made plenty of browser updates so would you say that wasn't a OS update?
I like most people consider stock apps part of the OS
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Agree. Basically system is made of apps.
If email app built into it is buggy, we can say OS is buggy.
jz9833 said:
I still completely disagree with you. Froyo for Android made plenty of browser updates so would you say that wasn't a OS update?
I like most people consider stock apps part of the OS
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Doesnt meam ur right and most people are ignorant in os design and the diff between an os and an app distributed with said os.
Obviously...
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
N8ter said:
Doesnt meam ur right and most people are ignorant in os design and the diff between an os and an app distributed with said os.
Obviously...
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
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then you are going to have to disagree with almost all people. This isn't a techy vs jock debate. These are apps which are built into the os and therefore part of the os.
But anyway this thread is meant for objective evaluation of WP7. If you want to continue this debate we should continue it somewhere else.
jz9833 said:
By going to the dailer and being able to spell "MOM" for example on the keys and it would automatically come up with the number for that contact.
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Click to collapse
You can use search in the people hub for something very similar. Admittedly not an exact substitute but it works well enough for me.
jz9833 said:
I have been a long time WM user and recently switched to android for the past year. I am offering my take on WP7 on the pros on cons.
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Good post
jz9833 said:
USB Storage Device- glaring admission, but I can kind of see why. It helps stop piracy, but I loved being able to hook my fuze / tilt 2 / nexus 1 / vibrant to my car stereo and play the music I had downloaded on my phone.
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How does this increase piracy? If the files you buy on Zune are locked down they can still do this even if there is a common store of files accessible as usb mass storage. Either by drm or by using isolated storage for those files.
jz9833 said:
Local Outlook Support- I knew this before hand, but I am in the crowd that says MS needs to add this ability.
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If you do it this way, then you are working with two sets of data (email, calendar, tasks, contacts, etc.) neither of which is guaranteed to be up to date. I don't see why people think this is preferable to a server-based system.
jz9833 said:
I will not buy that this phone is for dumb smart phone users.
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Hopefully this will be true; I will keep my fingers crossed. Currently, as I see it, they are targeting people who don't understand what files are, and would be confused by files, and who believe that music consists of songs arranged by artists into albums. I.e. the dumb mass market.
CSMR said:
How does this increase piracy? If the files you buy on Zune are locked down they can still do this even if there is a common store of files accessible as usb mass storage. Either by drm or by using isolated storage for those files.
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The cintent u purchase in zune have no drm..... The piracy statement is legit.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
though given you just purchased for your zune account, you can then access it on zune desktop, and burn discs from there. so no necessarily correct.
however, what i think of a common storage area is a good idea. just have it so that the pictures, videos, music, documents are in a folder view for when you plug the phone into your PC. it would really only require a bit of mapping within the OS to make it look like a storage unit. Even if it was just more restricted down to just the documents section, that's still something. better than nothing imo as i don't have access to skydrive at work. but aye, i can live with it, it's not going to make me want to return the phone.
The Gate Keeper said:
though given you just purchased for your zune account, you can then access it on zune desktop, and burn discs from there. so no necessarily correct.
however, what i think of a common storage area is a good idea. just have it so that the pictures, videos, music, documents are in a folder view for when you plug the phone into your PC. it would really only require a bit of mapping within the OS to make it look like a storage unit. Even if it was just more restricted down to just the documents section, that's still something. better than nothing imo as i don't have access to skydrive at work. but aye, i can live with it, it's not going to make me want to return the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its 2001, people pirate with digital media. Cd piracy may still be hip in the third world, but I haven't operated a cd player in years (or used my computer to play one), much less bought or burned one.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
N8ter said:
Its 2001, people pirate with digital media. Cd piracy may still be hip in the third world, but I haven't operated a cd player in years (or used my computer to play one), much less bought or burned one.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
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how about an MP3 cd? to play in your car? to lend to a friend? or your USB stick? as soon as it's available on zune desktop you have a copy of it... there is plenty ways around it. i'm not saying you should do it, i'm saying the possibilities are there.
N8ter said:
The cintent u purchase in zune have no drm..... The piracy statement is legit.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If the files are not DRMed, and Microsoft wants to protect them, either it can DRM the files, or it can keep them in isolated storage. The existence of common storage doesn't exclude isolated storage.
Not sure of the validity here, but WMPowerUser and WPCentral are both reporting that a user has a new update of the OS. One with the search icon for apps...
http://wmpoweruser.com/build-7753-of-windows-phone-7-being-pushed-out-to-some-people/
Would be glad to hear if there is a built-in task switcher.
To me its crazy that there are people out there with leaked Mango builds and we don't know a single feature that they haven't announced. That's why I don't buy it at all.
PG2G said:
To me its crazy that there are people out there with leaked Mango builds and we don't know a single feature that they haven't announced. That's why I don't buy it at all.
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That's a pretty retarded reason why not to buy. And to be honest, this is probably not Mango. Not even close. It's probably a progression of what we currently have, IF it's real, and just includes a tiny icon. We've seen Microsoft have different branches and those branches work on different features... I honestly don't think Mango is going to be the only update this year, and feel as though there will be 2-3 more minor ones along the way...
this is fake look at the color of the icons. And its blurry, you can see its photoshop.
PG2G said:
To me its crazy that there are people out there with leaked Mango builds and we don't know a single feature that they haven't announced. That's why I don't buy it at all.
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Click to collapse
Why there should be feature they havn't announced？
People a buying products with announced feature not implemented, why not buy a device with announced feature working.
tfouto said:
this is fake look at the color of the icons. And its blurry, you can see its photoshop.
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Pretty sure that's not the users picture, wasn't that the picture of the April Fools Mango?
Sent from my HD7 using Board Express
FiyaFleye said:
Pretty sure that's not the users picture, wasn't that the picture of the April Fools Mango?
Sent from my HD7 using Board Express
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
nop...............
amtrakcn said:
Why there should be feature they havn't announced？
People a buying products with announced feature not implemented, why not buy a device with announced feature working.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because its a fact that the announced features aren't all that are coming in Mango? If someone has a build of Mango, they damn sure better be digging through it looking for something.
I sure hope that search icon is for a global search instead of an application search. I really don't know why MS doesn't make the app list like the contacts list, or songs list, with click-able letters. That would seem like the most logical and theme-oriented solution to the absurd list of all apps that we have now
jmerrey said:
I sure hope that search icon is for a global search instead of an application search. I really don't know why MS doesn't make the app list like the contacts list, or songs list, with click-able letters. That would seem like the most logical and theme-oriented solution to the absurd list of all apps that we have now
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Click to collapse
+1 on that. Same goes for the pictures hub, which needs some way to sort it anyways.
FiyaFleye said:
Pretty sure that's not the users picture, wasn't that the picture of the April Fools Mango?
Sent from my HD7 using Board Express
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure if this one is true but this one is different from the Apr 1st pic...
amtrakcn said:
Not sure if this one is true but this one is different from the Apr 1st pic...
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Click to collapse
of course its fake... why are only pictures of the icon, why are not photos or videos with the new feature? its a joke and someone is laughing really bad.
UPDATE: Windows Phone Italy has discovered that this user's device was updated to build 7.0.7753.0, which is definitely a higher number than the normal 7390 build that we equate with the NoDo March update.
so it's not fake at all
jmerrey said:
I really don't know why MS doesn't make the app list like the contacts list, or songs list, with click-able letters. That would seem like the most logical and theme-oriented solution to the absurd list of all apps that we have now
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Click to collapse
This.
Let me say that again. THIS.
I realize that early on Microsoft was going for a "new" paradigm where apps were a secondary benefit of using the phone, but that has obviously changed. With over 13000 apps already in the marketplace, and many more coming, a better app launching mechanism NEEDS to be implemented, and soon.
At the very least, there should be tappable letters to jump to a section, PLUS an app-specific search (to completely follow the model of the People hub). But even better would be to also provide the option to display apps in a 3-column format (with small labels beneath the icons). Even better still would be to implement a third page of the start screen that would allow me to pin favorite apps in a 3- or 4-column format (no live tile support needed, just app icons).
Oh, and the same changes should be made to the Games hub.
So, more like Android or IOS then?
dkp1977 said:
+1 on that. Same goes for the pictures hub, which needs some way to sort it anyways.
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Click to collapse
Well you can jump through the pictures by date if you sort by date
Why not integrate search for app in the BING search button?
Wyn6 said:
So, more like Android or IOS then?
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I guess if that's the way you want to look at it, you can. It just seems kind of silly to me.
The fact that a feature or behavior might exist on Android or iOS doesn't make that feature better or worse. But if there is a feature that is commonly used, and it can be easily adapted to the metro interface, it makes no sense to me to go out of your way to avoid it, simply so you can call yourself "different". That would be like designing a car where you have to use your nose to activate the turn signals, just so you could claim that you are different from all of the other manufacturers.
I don't think that's what his implication is. Rather I believe he's saying something along the lines of, "but this is Windows Phone though and it has certain design and decisions the developers, at the time, thought were distinguishing and possibly efficient."
My words of course assume he's speaking to your wish for a 3 or 4 column grid format
http://www.netbooknews.com/43643/why-i-left-windows-phone-7/
The reviewer here, left WP for Android after using it for 7 months.
Key issues that deterred here from using it beyond 7 months:
Lack of multitasking like Android where apps actually run in background
It did not connect to people as well as Android
Display resolution of 480 x 800
IE9 giving an error twice a month that - browser is out of date (new to me!)
Inability to share locations
You can't zoom in the maps (on pinned locations)
Can't share pics on Twitter (it's a **** experience -probably compared to iOS/Android?)
Now I for one know that I would disagree and can prove that those claims are wrong other than 3rd and 4th one as I've never had those issues. So they might be there waiting for me to discover it?
Anyone have similar issues after using the phone for more than a month or even better if you've used it over half a year!
Please don't troll.
drupad2drupad said:
Lack of multitasking like Android where apps actually run in background
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Yeah he has a point there, although I think Microsoft's solution (toast notifications and Live Tiles) is better for the user and the battery life. However this limits the options of small developers.
drupad2drupad said:
It did not connect to people as well as Android
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drupad2drupad said:
Display resolution of 480 x 800
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At least for WP7 every app runs on (almost) every device, the only thing that's missing from some devices in the front facing camera.
drupad2drupad said:
IE9 giving an error twice a month that - browser is out of date (new to me!)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Newer happend to me either.
drupad2drupad said:
Inability to share locations
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You can share locations on Facebook or using foursquare, WhatsApp etc.
drupad2drupad said:
You can't zoom in the maps
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I don't really know what that means, in the maps app you can zoom in.
drupad2drupad said:
Can't share pics on Twitter
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You can, Twitter is built right in.
I have been using WP7 since April 2011.
slimshady322 said:
Yeah he has a point there, although I think Microsoft's solution (toast notifications and Live Tiles) is better for the user and the battery life. However this limits the options of small developers.
At least for WP7 every app runs on (almost) every device, the only thing that's missing from some devices in the front facing camera. You can share locations on Facebook or using foursquare, WhatsApp etc. I don't really know what that means, in the maps app you can zoom in. You can, Twitter is built right in. I have been using WP7 since April 2011.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you planning on moving away from WP anytime soon though?
A centralized notification area is definitely needed - probably within the 'ME' tile?
Never had any issues since Mango really, When I first started using WP7 on the HD7 early Jan 2011 I soon got bored with the lack of customisation as I had been using a HD2 and there was so much difference, I did go back to using my HD2 again but liked the new easy to use WP7 OS & after updating to mango I became more interested. I admit I don't fiddle with the phone as much any more but know it will do whatever I want when I want, Am happy with WP7 for now but eagerly await future updates to improve the few "lack of" features, I can't see me moving away just yet.
I personally do not agree with any of the issues listed and believe them to be false as far as useful experience. WP7 has been doing great for what I want and need since Mango and I actually have no plans to look at anything else. I use it for work as well and it fulfills it purpose and then some.
I have come from WM6 to Crackberry to this.
My family (4 of us) all have WP7 since VZW first released them and everyone is happy. I am the "IT" department for my family and we all came from RIMs and I have not had any "support" needs for the WP7 (same can not be said for RIM); it just works.
On a possessive note, as much as I grip and complain about WP 7; I have never had issues with IE 9 and find multitasking easy to use and don't see what people complain about. Twitter??? I personally don't use it on the phone nor the PC because it basically sucks. And about the display, well I see nothing wrong with it at all. There are so many other aspects of the phone that would have had made valid points for leaving WP which I will not bring up because I don't want to feed the troll/fanboys.
Been using it since Feb 2011. Am very happy with the platform and look forward to added functionality & features with Apollo.
I've not had any issues as he described. You can zoom in on maps. I've never seen that IE error. Sharing location is all over the place in WP and so is twitter sharing including pictures.
The resolution? Ok. Thats up to him if that is a platform killer. Can't argue with his preference on that.
Doesn't connect to people as well? Sorry I'm scratching my head here lol.
Apps running in background? Thats a preference as well, but I prefer the way MS has implemented it. When I was on Android it was a constant headache with stuff running my battery down when they shouldnt be running.
sinister1 said:
On a possessive note, as much as I grip and complain about WP 7; I have never had issues with IE 9 and find multitasking easy to use and don't see what people complain about. Twitter??? I personally don't use it on the phone nor the PC because it basically sucks. And about the display, well I see nothing wrong with it at all. There are so many other aspects of the phone that would have had made valid points for leaving WP which I will not bring up because I don't want to feed the troll/fanboys.
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THAT is such a change from your remaining posts through out the forum, thanks!
drupad2drupad said:
Are you planning on moving away from WP anytime soon though?
A centralized notification area is definitely needed - probably within the 'ME' tile?
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Click to collapse
No I'll stay with my LG Optimus 7 for some time. At some point I will upgrade and I will probably again chose a WP7 device, but before I upgrade I would like MS to provide an option to backup my LG Optimus 7 and transfer all the data to another phone. Even though most stuff is in the cloud, I have tree stars in every Angry Birds level and I don't want to loose that
But I agree with you that the notifications should be stored somewhere.
slimshady322 said:
No I'll stay with my LG Optimus 7 for some time. At some point I will upgrade and I will probably again chose a WP7 device, but before I upgrade I would like MS to provide an option to backup my LG Optimus 7 and transfer all the data to another phone. Even though most stuff is in the cloud, I have tree stars in every Angry Birds level and I don't want to loose that
But I agree with you that the notifications should be stored somewhere.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think your wish will come true with Apollo as a 'total' back up is scheduled to be introduced. You will be able to back up 'everything' - unlike Android full back ups like Titanium where game scores are not backed up and neither are progresses!
Probably Apollo is where WP will stop 'catching up' and start adding things
That reviewer must be on some kind of crack or something. I have not had issues with anything that he has mentioned and I have used WP since march 2011 and used all the mango betas. Only issue I have is with the disappearing keyboard and that you can't upload from the browser. I would also want a backup solution,Skype and integrated public transit directions (already found a semi-integrated solution) to be 100% satisfied.
13 month user, I didn't like WP for a week, but never put my SIM back in my HD2..that's all I'll say about that ...
Sent from The ACSyndicate Tower using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
11 months Mozart user here, since changing to WP, i had lots of free time to do my reading due to i spent less (actually almost none) time on tinkering or flashing my phone...
IMHO, I prefer the way MS integrated the "FAKE" multitasking method which I found it very suit my taste, and I can have total control on which apps I gave permission on background task, feel like I had total control of the phone (don't flame me because I know that some others had a different definition on Full Control of their device)
I find all of his accusations false except maybe 9. I think he means auto sharing location. There is some app i've seen peeps complain about because windows phone will only report your location automatically if it is in the foreground. From a security standpoint though, i'd be glad it doesn't but if you like that kind of app i guess that would be an issue.
The rest is BS. I've been using Windows phone since i got my surround for 180.00 off ebay (wasn't sure if i would like windows phone and my contract was up soon so i didn't want to waste my upgrade in case i didn't like it.) I used my upgrade to get a titan and my wife uses the surround to play games and use facebook. (she has a flip phone and didn't want to pay for data even though i swear to her i can shut the data off... i just got a purple case coming in from ebay so i may sway her )
i dont have any problems of them maybe the problem is the girl who tested DD
I have been using WP for a year. I still have my Nexus One that I used to use while travelling for Wifi hotspot and Navigation reasons. Mango and Navigon have resolved these issues. I still miss the notification tray/center and I sincerely hope WP gets it soon. Those who have used Android will vouch for me about importance of a good notification system.
Having said that, WP is my daily driver. The one thing that WP offers, that Android lacks, is the peace of mind. With Android, it was flash a ROM every week. Most of these ROM upgreades were not for features but for stability or improving some feature that google didn't integrate properly. Android reminds me of my WM days. Powerful but not a stable, cohesive experience.
I plan to stay with WP at least till beyond Apollo. I am curious to see how they integrate Windows 8, Xbox and WP8.
ive admitted only had my windows phone a week but after a serious play over the weekend when ive not been working - videos, photos, borwsing, messages etc.. you name it.
my only gripe is the volume/vibrate with no optin for silent and no vibrate.
Tother than that - coming from my HD2 which had been modded, my Titan seems very polished and smooth.
The article is BS, the only valid point is the screen resolution one.
[
my only gripe is the volume/vibrate with no optin for silent and no vibrate.
.[/QUOTE]
go to settings/sounds and ringtone/ set vibration to off
then on home screen you can toggle between ring and "silent"
pakure said:
my only gripe is the volume/vibrate with no optin for silent and no vibrate..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
go to settings/sounds and ringtone/ set vibration to off
then on home screen you can toggle between ring and "silent"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is true, but it is a far from optimal workaround. Changing that setting doesn't just affect silent mode, it affects both ring and silent mode. I think what Symondo is asking for is a way to conveniently toggle between ring+vibrate, vibrate-only, and complete silence without resorting to opening the settings app.
So I'm working on a post for my site. It's going to be a list about things a developer does with an application that frustrates us as users. The goal is to highlight common complains from the community about practices devs use in their apps and to hopefully encourage them with feedback to improve.
This is the list I've got so far. Please feel free to chime in if you agree or disagree and ADD any things that bug you as a USER.
--Lack of a live tile: One of the biggest differences on our platforms and others is the inclusion of live tiles. If it makes sense for the application, a live tile is a must. I'm hard pressed to find a large category of apps where a live tile wouldn't make sense at some basic level.
--No fast app switching: No explanation needed, devs get with it.
--Not playing nice with Metro: You make an app for iOS or Android and now you want to port it Windows Phone as fast as possible...so fast you don't think about the design. Great apps on Windows Phone are those that capitalize on the principles of the design language.
--Have both a paid and free version of an app: Do a search for an app in the Market or App Store and you'll get two versions for a lot of popular apps: the free and paid version. There is NO reason why you would need to do that with Windows Phone. Devs have the ability to implement a 'trial' state of an application where they can do everything and more a 'free' version of an app could. Stop cluttering the Marketplace.
--Redirecting to a website: I once downloaded a sports app that had potential. I opened the app and played around. There was a pivot page that had a section for news. Clicked it...and bam. IE is opening up. Nope, no thank you. I want to use your app now your website.
These are some of the big themes that I've encountered more than I should when playing around with apps. This is not a major problem, but it's there and it really shouldn't be.
Also I'm not trying to put developers down, I know it's hard work and I myself am trying to learn as well. But we should strive for something better.
Alright, sound off with some feedback guys. Any other 'sins against users' I've missed that you encounter? I'd like to see what you think before I write the post on my site.
ALSOOOO.... How about you list some apps that contain these 'sins against users'. That way we can politely invite the developer to hear our thoughts and implement changes that benefit everyone. Happy users = $, $= happy dev.
All these are minor.. My biggest complaint is when push notification is either delayed or doesnt come at all. I've missed some important whatsapp messages cause it was delayed 10 mins.
Sent from my T8788 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
samsabri said:
[...]
--Have both a paid and free version of an app: Do a search for an app in the Market or App Store and you'll get two versions for a lot of popular apps: the free and paid version. There is NO reason why you would need to do that with Windows Phone. Devs have the ability to implement a 'trial' state of an application where they can do everything and more a 'free' version of an app could. Stop cluttering the Marketplace.
[...]
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As I agree with what you are posting, I think you missed the point on this one.
It's true that this is cluttering the marketplace, but people like to hand out a "FREE" version from a marketing persepective. There is a seperate column with "free" apps, hence it will be easier to stand out with both a free and paid app...
Also if you have a fully functional free trial (with only an add) it is still being noted as paid app, so you miss everybody who has no credit card, they will automatically overlook a paid app, even if it has a free unlimited trial (well there are always exceptions of course, but those account mostly for "high profile" apps/games).
This is the main reason, that without uploading 2 apps, there is an unfair disadvantage for the dev.
But I agree it is annoying but from a developer perspective it makes a lot of sense why people do this.
Marvin_S said:
As I agree with what you are posting, I think you missed the point on this one.
It's true that this is cluttering the marketplace, but people like to hand out a "FREE" version from a marketing persepective. There is a seperate column with "free" apps, hence it will be easier to stand out with both a free and paid app...
Also if you have a fully functional free trial (with only an add) it is still being noted as paid app, so you miss everybody who has no credit card, they will automatically overlook a paid app, even if it has a free unlimited trial (well there are always exceptions of course, but those account mostly for "high profile" apps/games).
This is the main reason, that without uploading 2 apps, there is an unfair disadvantage for the dev.
But I agree it is annoying but from a developer perspective it makes a lot of sense why people do this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree. Some devs don't mention what the trial offers(time-limited or function-limited) and hence I stay away from such paid apps. Sometimes the trial is fully functional with ads. Agreed that the devs were lazy to not include it in the description, but some users are lazy too. That would be the reason for two versions of the app.
it not being available at all.
or how about it's free on android or ios, but $3 on wp7... wtf?
Marvin_S said:
As I agree with what you are posting, I think you missed the point on this one.
It's true that this is cluttering the marketplace, but people like to hand out a "FREE" version from a marketing persepective. There is a seperate column with "free" apps, hence it will be easier to stand out with both a free and paid app...
Also if you have a fully functional free trial (with only an add) it is still being noted as paid app, so you miss everybody who has no credit card, they will automatically overlook a paid app, even if it has a free unlimited trial (well there are always exceptions of course, but those account mostly for "high profile" apps/games).
This is the main reason, that without uploading 2 apps, there is an unfair disadvantage for the dev.
But I agree it is annoying but from a developer perspective it makes a lot of sense why people do this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, I understand the marketing angle. I guess I live in some fantasy land in my head where the world is clean and organized. Hopefully with the Windows 8 Marketplace offering devs simliliar options in how they can implement trials we'll see less "free" apps because users may come expect every paid app to come with a trial.
svtfmook said:
it not being available at all.
or how about it's free on android or ios, but $3 on wp7... wtf?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is something I missed, I how they determine the price difference between platforms?
Off the top of your head, do any apps come to mind where there is a big price difference in platforms? Exclude Xbox Live enabled games for a moment, the reason being I can see the inclusion of achievements, leaderboards, etc to be the cause of the price bump.
I'm in need of a map/location/gps app, that supports offline map caching . while I found couple of them on marketplace, ones that had nice design an functionality, all of them where online only and ones that had offline map caching had terrible design an absolutely no functionality. thats sad
design and functionality should be put first IMO
Inconsistent Resuming and Lack of Tombstoning
Once an app leaves the foreground you have two methods of returning to it: use the app switcher or hitting the tile on your Start screen. Going from the app switcher resumes as expected, but going from the Start screen restarts the app, even if it's already sitting in the background. Now this is probably something Microsoft has to fix, but I feel that if more apps tombstoned, then it could make things more consistent.
samsabri said:
That is something I missed, I how they determine the price difference between platforms?
Off the top of your head, do any apps come to mind where there is a big price difference in platforms? Exclude Xbox Live enabled games for a moment, the reason being I can see the inclusion of achievements, leaderboards, etc to be the cause of the price bump.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes if they would note next to the price tag of each app wheter it contains a Trial version, it is less needed for devs to release a seperate "Lite" version. However the problem is now you have to click the app first than wait until the buttons show up in order to find out wheter an app has a free trial.
This should be there on the big scroll list so a user will see at first glance wheter he/she can try the app for free. At the moment I can't blame dev's for introducing their own workarounds.
But what is more annoying to me is that if devs follow metro design and don't use the margins correctly. Hence the app looks odd in comparison to the native apps, i.e. a lot of chat apps mimick the messaging app but don't pay attention to the margins, the bubble sizes and the bubble alignments, which will make them look very unprofessional. This is sad because they did take the effort to stylize the app like Metro, but they ruined the experience because of not "understanding" the fundamentals of the design language. Which is not just typography but also clever and precise use of margins, shapes and spacings. And since there is not much chrome, every tiny offset or error stands out to a trained eye instantly.
Marvin_S said:
Yes if they would note next to the price tag of each app wheter it contains a Trial version, it is less needed for devs to release a seperate "Lite" version. However the problem is now you have to click the app first than wait until the buttons show up in order to find out wheter an app has a free trial.
This should be there on the big scroll list so a user will see at first glance wheter he/she can try the app for free. At the moment I can't blame dev's for introducing their own workarounds.
But what is more annoying to me is that if devs follow metro design and don't use the margins correctly. Hence the app looks odd in comparison to the native apps, i.e. a lot of chat apps mimick the messaging app but don't pay attention to the margins, the bubble sizes and the bubble alignments, which will make them look very unprofessional. This is sad because they did take the effort to stylize the app like Metro, but they ruined the experience because of not "understanding" the fundamentals of the design language. Which is not just typography but also clever and precise use of margins, shapes and spacings. And since there is not much chrome, every tiny offset or error stands out to a trained eye instantly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think going forward an ideal scenario would be a user expects to have a trial mode for any app that a dev is asking money for. It's a win-win for both consumers and developers. Check out this post from Paul Laberge explaining some of the benefits of a trial mode.
Seems like your second paragraph is echoing the statement to follow metro design language/principles and aim for higher quality control in regards to the design.
It's interesting, I feel like 5 years ago software was all about being functional with no regard to design. Now we not only demand, but expect applications to function well and look beautiful. Exciting times
karan1203 said:
All these are minor.. My biggest complaint is when push notification is either delayed or doesnt come at all. I've missed some important whatsapp messages cause it was delayed 10 mins.
Sent from my T8788 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are those faults of the developer or the platform itself? I ask because I don't know a lot of the technical workings behind the push notification system. My limited knowledge tells me it might be a mix of both parties to blame.
Can anyone clarify?
apps?
For sure about Notifications part.
Push Notification can be useful "ONLY" when you have the phone right in front of your face. Because right after that, they are gone forever.
Second, Push Notification usually have a delay , about a half to 2 mins, from the actual event.
Like my friend can post a thing on my Facebook Wall, and the phone took about 2 mins to update it to the ME title. Same with all other Applications.
I used to try hacking the ROM and Registry of the Phone to reduce the delay of the Title Update. But failed so hard because Microsoft really locked it up hard.
I think most of the annoyances are captured already in the initial post but I'll also add
-That some apps are still being released without mango capability.
-Some apps are just the mobile site (for example the tagged app wtf?)
prohibido_por_la_ley said:
I think most of the annoyances are captured already in the initial post but I'll also add
-That some apps are still being released without mango capability.
-Some apps are just the mobile site (for example the tagged app wtf?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was hoping I'd cover the most obvious complaints, but wanted to reach out and see if anything was missing. Also venting is good for us
And regarding Tagged...? Wow... I just looked at it on the web Marketplace and I won't let something that hideous touch my phone. It's just lazy and doesn't add any value to users or devs. Users get nothing out of it and as a dev what have you accomplished?
Apps like that should not pass certification. It seems draconian, but it's ok for us to demand and expect quality work.
wixostrix said:
...but going from the Start screen restarts the app, even if it's already sitting in the background.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is (or was pre-Mango) a requirement to have your app certified. The rules say/said that a user returning to a task via the Back button is trying to complete an interupted task; a user launching the app from Start is starting a new task and shouldn't be presented with abandoned work from earlier.
I have a calculator app that maintains full state across invocations. I was worried that MS would reject the app because it preserved state even upon restarting. They did accept it, though.
Worst thing for me is wasted screen space.
A good example is the official WP7 Facebook app. Go to the "wall" screen, and you have "FACEBOOK" then "Most Recent" then "What's on your mind?" all permanently stuck at the top. Space is also wasted at both sides, meaning that only 50-60% of the screen is actually available to display your friends wall posts.
I thought the idea of Metro is to "put information first", so this is ridiculous. I have a phone with a 3.7" screen, yet the facebook app is more readable on my friends 3" non-widescreen Blackberry.
Aphasaic2002 said:
Worst thing for me is wasted screen space.
A good example is the official WP7 Facebook app. Go to the "wall" screen, and you have "FACEBOOK" then "Most Recent" then "What's on your mind?" all permanently stuck at the top. Space is also wasted at both sides, meaning that only 50-60% of the screen is actually available to display your friends wall posts.
I thought the idea of Metro is to "put information first", so this is ridiculous. I have a phone with a 3.7" screen, yet the facebook app is more readable on my friends 3" non-widescreen Blackberry.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hear you on that Facebook app. Thankfully the integration with Windows Phone makes it so that I haven't opened it in months. I check FB once a day on the browser at home before bed, but that's about it.
But I'll chalk this complaint under the 'design abuse' category.
Anyone have any other apps that violate some of our sins in the original post in this thread?
I'd like to see improvements with the sound handeling. Most games have a 'music volume' and a 'FX volume' it seems the volume % is boolean, 0% is silent, 10%-100% is full volume. I'd like to listen to my music while gaming without the Pew Pew causing my ears to bleed
http://wmpoweruser.com/iphone-theme-gives-a-taste-of-windows-8-on-a-smartphone/
Apple fanboys so excited for windows 8 they have a full theme on iphone first... but aren't they supposed to be supporting Apple products? LOL
Besides, the whole theme is wrong. I asssume Apollo will look exactly like WP7 metro interface, only with background colors and whatever just as long as its not horizontally positioned.
Tap that!
Looks nice! You gotta give iOS users, hackers, and developer props for being able to do amazing stuff with Apple's OS. All fanboyism aside, this Win8 iPhone theme truly showcases iOS' power and capability.
KimWinter said:
Looks nice! You gotta give iOS users, hackers, and developer props for being able to do amazing stuff with Apple's OS. All fanboyism aside, this Win8 iPhone theme truly showcases iOS' power and capability.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's too bad we can't do that with WP.
man those ios guys are quick !
not a bad looking or responding theme either.
sinister1 said:
It's too bad we can't do that with WP.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Of course we can. We just need Windows Phone to become as popular as iPhone. Hackers seem to be able to get into anything man made nowadays.
From what I saw I did not see the tiles being live. Yes, I saw labels on the tiles but that does not make them live. Give me live tiles!
I don't know about live tiles - that Win8 theme was a Dreamboard theme, which takes a lot of memory from the phone. If you try to play iOS games that are memory intensive e.g. Infinity Blade 2 or Dungeon Defender, the game will crash (if Dreamboard is enabled). So if you try to add live tiles to your Dreamboard theme, your iPhone might explode.
KimWinter said:
I don't know about live tiles - that Win8 theme was a Dreamboard theme, which takes a lot of memory from the phone. If you try to play iOS games that are memory intensive e.g. Infinity Blade 2 or Dungeon Defender, the game will crash (if Dreamboard is enabled). So if you try to add live tiles to your Dreamboard theme, your iPhone might explode.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And that also means that the iPhone needs to be Jailbroke.
I got kind of excited, because i would love the larger tiles/icons on my iPhone, but am not going to jailbreak a work issued iPhone.
There are other Windows Phone 7 themes for it as well, but the same issue. Phone must be jail broke.
sinister1 said:
http://wmpoweruser.com/iphone-theme-gives-a-taste-of-windows-8-on-a-smartphone/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Probably because OSX Lion is a remake of Windows Millenium.
Apple has been doing themselves such a disservice sticking with such a static, boring UI. it makes me wonder why.
nicksti said:
Apple has been doing themselves such a disservice sticking with such a static, boring UI. it makes me wonder why.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because it sells in outragous numbers, without changing anything ?
ohgood said:
Because it sells in outragous numbers, without changing anything ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, Apple doesn't really have to worry about making a theming app or whatnot because hackers and other developers are more than happy to do all those (customization, tweaks, hacks, etc) for FREE. I mean look at redsn0w, greenpoison, ultrasn0w, and other jailbreaking tools for iPhone - they're FREE!!
Still, it makes you kinda wonder why with all the power of iOS and WP7 as a stable and working mobile OS, they chose to limit it's customizability - even the most basic functions (like custom themes or background wallpapers or the ability to change icons).
ohgood said:
Because it sells in outragous numbers, without changing anything ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Complacency is one way to end up bankrupt (general statement). And Apple did see the need for a notification center and a camera from lockscreen.
Every iOS that has that UI is another year that opens the door for Android and WP to gain more customers.
nicksti said:
Complacency is one way to end up bankrupt (general statement). And Apple did see the need for a notification center and a camera from lockscreen.
Every iOS that has that UI is another year that opens the door for Android and WP to gain more customers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
complacency= yes, look what that did with wm6.x.
The ios ui , I don't know... maybe it's great, or maybe people don't care and it isn't. Either way, it has developer mindshare, I haven't heard of devs falling away in droves to android or wp.
If/when you see that mass exidous, something is up.
ohgood said:
complacency= yes, look what that did with wm6.x.
The ios ui , I don't know... maybe it's great, or maybe people don't care and it isn't. Either way, it has developer mindshare, I haven't heard of devs falling away in droves to android or wp.
If/when you see that mass exidous, something is up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think with the iPhone, alot of people have invested alot of money in other hardware that works very well with the iPhone.
docking stations, car mounts, chargers, cases, etc.
It's one reason why people stay iPhone customers, once they are iPhone customers.
I even considered buying a new car stereo, because I could not get A2DP Bluetooth audio to play from my iPhone into my Pioneer DEH7000BT car stereo.
I have since found info on how to do it. I made a YouTube video illustrating how. There were a couple not obvious steps. It still isn't perfect. AVRCP does not work (can't control the iPhone - next / prev from the deck) and I need to manually go through a process on the stereo and the phone every time I want to use it.
In the end, the fact that there is app to accomplish almost anything is still the big seller.
We use PGI at work for creating teleconferences. I never can remember my host code or participant codes for others or even the number to dial. Sure enough, on the iPhone, there's an app for that. It starts the conference and calls you either on the iPhone, or a number you enter at the time. It even lets you invite others to the call. And you can store participant codes for others and join with it. It is difficult to join a teleconference on the road without this, because you need to memorize the participant code. Now it is a 1 button deal.
There's an app for webex that streams the video.
The other day, I bought ForumRunner, so that I can post on xda when away. It works great.
When companies make apps, they almost always target the iPhone first.
I really hope that attitude changes with Apollo.
I personally think alot of the restrictions that will remain in place until Apollo has contributed to developer reluctance. Devs know how to dev for iPhone. It has not changed in a long time. They know how to dev for Android. Same thing. Windows Phone 7 prevented devs from doing things the way they knew how to do them. So, it was either relearn alot to get your app to a small percent of the smart phone market. Or just dev for iPhone and Android and see if Windows Phone gains enough market share to care.
I love Windows Phone 7 with Mango. I never would have tried an iPhone if work had not forced me too. And now, I also love using my iPhone. There's a few things that are annoying (AVRCP and dismissing every email). But it does a good job.
Really hoping that when the Apollo SDK is released, we see a surge in quality app development.
But which would you guys choose:
1. iPhone with a grid of boring icons from screen to screen
2. iPhone with a more dynamic UI like Android or Windows Phone
The iPhone sells inspite of the UI, not because. I remember all the rumours floating around that iOS 5 would come out with this dazzling new UI. That was a letdown to me.
I think if a blank slate customer saw 3 phones on display, the iPhone would not grab that customer like the rest. However, there are no blank slate customers.
nicksti said:
But which would you guys choose:
1. iPhone with a grid of boring icons from screen to screen
2. iPhone with a more dynamic UI like Android or Windows Phone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're giving the launcher, or home screen, or start, or desktop (whatever) way too much eye-time. No one stares at live tiles, or app lists, for 20 minutes. They use applications, and do things. The app list, tiles, whatever are only an icon, yes a shortcut, to the main event. It doesn't matter if the tile/icon flips in 3D, spins, or does cart wheels, its still very limited in what it can do. You have to access the application to _do_ things.
Let the icons/tiles/shortcuts/whatever debate die.
ohgood said:
You're giving the launcher, or home screen, or start, or desktop (whatever) way too much eye-time. No one stares at live tiles, or app lists, for 20 minutes. They use applications, and do things. The app list, tiles, whatever are only an icon, yes a shortcut, to the main event. It doesn't matter if the tile/icon flips in 3D, spins, or does cart wheels, its still very limited in what it can do. You have to access the application to _do_ things.
Let the icons/tiles/shortcuts/whatever debate die.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with much of this. Turn on the phone do what you want. Move on. I don't turn on my phone to stare at animations because they are cool, just like I don't buy a car because its shiny and red. Anything distracting should not be just to be flashy. It should serve a purpose as well.
But there is something to having the ability to display some information with current data on the icon / tile / widget.
Apple's response is the curtain, which solves most of the problem, but differently.
Constantly seeing 73 degrees and sunny could eaily be replaced with an icon that accurately reflects the current weather conditons for a default or current area. This is one reason people used HTC Sence with the home screen weather. A double wide icon for this would be great.
It would be nice to have the clock icon display the next alarm time, not 10:15:00 or the very least have that on the curtain. A double wide icon for this would be cool too.
An icon for music that reflects the Album art would be nice, but doen't really help you do anything. A contact pic on the email pic for the last unread email would be really cool.
Microsoft solves those problems with Live Tiles and Hubs, but does not solve the problem of seeing all missed notifications in one place. For me, there never has been a time when I missed any notification that was important.
Apple doesn't have any double wide icons. And other than the Calendar, the only thing that can be modified on an icon is a number
I think both Apple and Microsoft have areas to improve on both of these aspects.
ohgood said:
You're giving the launcher, or home screen, or start, or desktop (whatever) way too much eye-time. No one stares at live tiles, or app lists, for 20 minutes. They use applications, and do things. The app list, tiles, whatever are only an icon, yes a shortcut, to the main event. It doesn't matter if the tile/icon flips in 3D, spins, or does cart wheels, its still very limited in what it can do. You have to access the application to _do_ things.
Let the icons/tiles/shortcuts/whatever debate die.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To each his own, but I rather look at a home screen and see information instead of having to launch something. And widgets and tiles deliver useable information without having to press.
After all, that is the point of Siri right?
nicksti said:
To each his own, but I rather look at a home screen and see information instead of having to launch something. And widgets and tiles deliver useable information without having to press.
After all, that is the point of Siri right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Useful information is great.
I think most people agee that Siri is more of a cool bell and whistle to get people to buy the iPhone. It's good at somethings, but bad at others. In the end people play with it for a while, and then go about normal phone usage.
Some go so far as thinking each icon on the phone needs to be exciting or unique, but many are really just to launch an app.
I will never want an animated background.
But, useful info on the icons on my iPhone, would be very welcomed.