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Guys,
I have been using HTC devices for many years now:
Pison 5MX, HP Jornada 720, HTC Alpin, HTC Trinity, HTC Kaiser and HTC Polaris!
The form factor of the new TP2 is brilliant.
HOWEVER, the keyboard is just not designed very efficiently for me because it is half of the size of the total width. Which means that the rear part is not used for the keyboard.
I would have preferred a FULL keyboard such as the one on the HTC Universal or on the Psion 5MX or Jornada 720!
I don't understand the point of designing a PDA with a built-in keyboard if the keyboard is just too small which makes it even not usuable. The one on the Kaiser was so small.
HTC produced the Universal with a full sized keyboard using the full width of the screen.
Why not on the newest models?
Any ideas?
I've had a few thoughts being a long time mini-keyboard user...
It's true that a bigger keyboard can make things easier, but for typing with your thumbs, too big is also a problem due to limited reach.
Typing with a Psion 5 was not great with two thumbs, and with a phone you want to type on the go, so this is more important than 2 handed typing while at a desk / other solid surface. As most people want to carry their phone with them a Psion 5 sized phone would not be too popular!
Having a full width & height keyboard while keeping the ability to put the keyboard away (for touch screen only use) will usually require a bulky tilt & twist hinge (like on Zaurus C series, Clie UX / NX, or HTC universal), which means the screen has to be smaller / narrower. Quickly sliding out a keyboard to hammer out a text is faster than opening and then twisting a hinge.
The Kaiser keyboard was fantastic in my opinion - I could type very quickly on it, probably not far off my Psion 5 speed (as when you didn't hit the Psion keys in the centre, they did not always work).
Have you any ideas for achieving a bigger keyboard without compromising on the screen size, usability or overall size of the phone?
I don't have a problem with the Keyboard size at all. I think it's just about perfect. My problem is the fact that they made the buttons much bigger and removed 10 keys from the original touch pro. Yeah, It makes it easier for some, but I know I'd rather have the keys. The keyboard still would have had really big buttons.
As a happy Universal owner I understand very well the point of sayborg.
As far as I know the only devices with great keyboards are:
Universal
Advantage
Shift
Toth (New)
But the last 3 options are too big...
I´m in the same interrogant? I want/need to upgrade my 2005 Universal but nothing I can see in the near future as a REAL replacement
TP2 is the closer one I can think
Hope HTC have some secret devices on that form factor, but I doub it
I don't know what to think about the keyboard yet. The buttons feel good, not slippery. The number keys at the top are a pain in the ass because the lip of the top layer is slightly overlapping making it just annoying enough to bug me. On screen keyboard is pretty tight. No complaints there.
DavidMc0 said:
I've had a few thoughts being a long time mini-keyboard user...
It's true that a bigger keyboard can make things easier, but for typing with your thumbs, too big is also a problem due to limited reach.
Typing with a Psion 5 was not great with two thumbs, and with a phone you want to type on the go, so this is more important than 2 handed typing while at a desk / other solid surface. As most people want to carry their phone with them a Psion 5 sized phone would not be too popular!
Having a full width & height keyboard while keeping the ability to put the keyboard away (for touch screen only use) will usually require a bulky tilt & twist hinge (like on Zaurus C series, Clie UX / NX, or HTC universal), which means the screen has to be smaller / narrower. Quickly sliding out a keyboard to hammer out a text is faster than opening and then twisting a hinge.
The Kaiser keyboard was fantastic in my opinion - I could type very quickly on it, probably not far off my Psion 5 speed (as when you didn't hit the Psion keys in the centre, they did not always work).
Have you any ideas for achieving a bigger keyboard without compromising on the screen size, usability or overall size of the phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the comments guys!
Well, for me, it would have been nicer to keep the SAME size of the current TP2 but with a wider keyboard, this wouldn't make the device bigger because the rear part/surface of the keyboard is even not used. A wider keyboard wouldn't cost more and wouldn't be heavier.
I thing the problem is that the producers of such devices are usually not consumers. I doubt that poeple who have designed such devices have as much usage experience as us. They sometimes lack of subtilty I think.
I also think that there is no perfect repalcement of the HTC Universal which is sad.
There is also the Acer M900 which has an OK keyboard but it is not tilting and again the keyboard is not designed efficiently/optimally for me but again this is a personal opinion!
For me there is no point to have a 2,8 " PDA whith a build-in keyboard. Keys are just to small...
Maybe one day, we will see the perfect HTC Device...
sayborg said:
Maybe one day, we will see the perfect HTC Device...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's true that we aren't there yet, but as far as hardware I think the Rhodium is getting pretty dame close. Huge screen, sturdy construction, physical slideout keyboard, and a large enough screen that the onscreen finger keyboard is very usable. These are many things that I've been waiting for. The only thing that can make the design better is to make it thiner which will take so time in tech advancement.
I still think they shouldn't be losing some of the buttons they had on the titan/tilt style phones (d-pad and soft key hardware buttons). However, I'm probably not giving the usability of the touch interface enough credit.
As long as the software is up to par (hadware acceleration and strong usability) then it's all gravy. This is the device I've been waiting for for a long time. I'm also thinking that once it's been out a year or so The Android roms for it will be pretty advanced and very capable. Overall, this has a TON of potential and I think it will be the first phone I don't constantly look forward to the next version on.
I just hope against hope that they have enabled hardware acceleration on this phone. If we have another non-implemented 2D/3D driver while relying on CPU power for rendering gsnarfle... I'd be most unhappy.
That's one of the big reasons I'm looking to move away from my Mogul... while it's a decent phone, they seem to have shot it in the leg and then told it to go run a marathon.
It may be my ignorance to the matter, but I hope that all the touchflo3D phones have full hardware acceleration support!
sayborg said:
Thanks for the comments guys!
Well, for me, it would have been nicer to keep the SAME size of the current TP2 but with a wider keyboard, this wouldn't make the device bigger because the rear part/surface of the keyboard is even not used. A wider keyboard wouldn't cost more and wouldn't be heavier.
I thing the problem is that the producers of such devices are usually not consumers. I doubt that poeple who have designed such devices have as much usage experience as us. They sometimes lack of subtilty I think.
I also think that there is no perfect repalcement of the HTC Universal which is sad.
There is also the Acer M900 which has an OK keyboard but it is not tilting and again the keyboard is not designed efficiently/optimally for me but again this is a personal opinion!
For me there is no point to have a 2,8 " PDA whith a build-in keyboard. Keys are just to small...
Maybe one day, we will see the perfect HTC Device...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well honestly I think I think if they used the whole width it would take up to much space be harder to reach the keys on the ends of the keyboard with your thumbs., and also the kaiser keyboard is not bad, it is very easy to type on for me and I can type fast, adn honestly I think they are making hte keyboards smaller cause its easier to use them on the go,
but look at a pic of the touch pro 2 keyaboard they did make it use mroe space, so they know what you mean it does make typing easier, but for phones with HUGE keyboards.. well most people dont want a phone that big but honestly they used almost all of the space on the touch pro 2 for the keyboard
The only thing that worries me is the lack of the windows key and the ok button. Those two will be missed greatly. Otherwise, I think the keyboard will be a huge improvement over my Mogul's.
sayborg said:
I also think that there is no perfect repalcement of the HTC Universal which is sad.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Eh sorry. While i havent used any touch device yet, i looked at the Universal, and one word jumped out at me.. Bulky. That thing just looks to big and clunky to be of any fluid use.
I was actually happy when i saw a pitcure of the TP2 keyboard. They keys look like a good size, and the bit of space between them i was happy to see because i toyed with the fuze/tilt and i fat-fingered with that keyboard enough to annoy me.
As far as removing keys... as Ranch Wilder would say..."Less is more". Just because a device as more keys/buttons doesn't mean its better. Take the Logitech G11 keyboard. They dumped a bunch of Macro keys on it, most of which never got used, and only made the keyboard take up more space. Their next version of the G15, the removed alot of the G keys (macro keys) to cut the size down, but there's still plenty to be useful.
I think its more a matter of people being use to so many keys, however i think the touch interface will more than make up for it. Plus i guess that puts me at and advantage where this will be my first phone with a keyboard.
If you feel the keys are too small, tell this to the Blackberry users.
I think the keyboard was stretched pretty close to the edges, I think its fine. the universal has a different target audience than the touch pro 2 if you want the PERFECT universal replacement I suggest this phone:
http://www.htc.com/www/product/shift/specification.html
but I never used or saw a universal so im not sure, but the shift is a really nice phone with a big keyboard and it has ALOT of speed, but it costs alot more than most phones and is wont fit in your pocket either but it seems like the perfect replacement plus it runs windows vista! a real os not a mobile one
and it has a finger print scanner built in whats not to like about that.
CAPS & Function Keys
I cannot imagine why the CAPS(shift) and Function keys are not reversed! Didn't the designers look at a computer keyboard?
So my question is - can the key functions be changed in the software and can the keycaps be popped off and switched?
orb3000 said:
Hope HTC have some secret devices on that form factor, but I doub it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Alas, I have been wishing this for years...
when the original Universal came out, as a college student, I didn't have the means for a Universal...
All I can do now is hope...
Tell me guys.
Went from a tytn2 to a Raphael...
Should I go for the Hero or TP2 ?
Never used a Hero.
The TP2 from T-Mobile is hands-down the best WM-based device I've ever had my paws on. You can pry it from my cold, dead fingers.....
Macedon2000 said:
Should I go for the Hero or TP2 ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you want a Windows Mobile phone with a brilliant physical keyboard and lots of neat business features that also does a reasonable job of multimedia, or do you want an Android-powered, multimedia-oriented device with a capacitive touchscreen that supports multi-touch, and which also does a reasonable job of business-oriented stuff? The two are really very different. It would make more sense to be having trouble deciding between a Hero an iPhone - they're much more similar in philosophy (IMO).
i dint really get the difference between the two types of screens...capacitive and resistive.
I played a bit with an iPhone 3GS today and it felt really good...i like the iPhone because everything just works... but I got bored after 3min of playing with it.
just the thought of not being able to flash new roms etc. makes me puke.
I like my RAPH but i would like a bigger screen, better(faster/smoother) handling of multimedia(pics/music/video) like iPod on iPhone, sort of.
so its down to winmo or android.
I was also thinking weather to go for hero or the touch pro2 but the touch pro2 has an amazing keyboard and watching movies on it look pretty impressive and i dont mind it not using a 3.5 mm jack as i use a stereo bluetooth headset. So i went for the touch pro2 and WOW im glad i did, im writing this from my touch pro 2 now.
It also has a reasonably good stock rom, the stock rom on my wizard was hopeless and if it wasnt for xda-developers i would never of had it for so long.
TP2 definetly, because the hardware keyboard that for me is a must!
The telephone conferencing and voice features are really good. Easy to setup and to use. Sound is good too. Credit to HTC for adding features that are fundamental to a what a good business phone should have.
I really don't like the way the Hero looks. Just for that I would go with the TP2.
Macedon2000 said:
i dint really get the difference between the two types of screens...capacitive and resistive.
I played a bit with an iPhone 3GS today and it felt really good...i like the iPhone because everything just works... but I got bored after 3min of playing with it.
just the thought of not being able to flash new roms etc. makes me puke.
I like my RAPH but i would like a bigger screen, better(faster/smoother) handling of multimedia(pics/music/video) like iPod on iPhone, sort of.
so its down to winmo or android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
capacitive screens are designed for finger-friendly touches. when you touch the screen with your finger, the press generates an electric stimulus that the phone reads as a press. capacitive screens can't use normal styli, so there is a loss in accuracy
resistive screens are designed for accuracy, due to the use of styli
I got the Tmobile Touch Pro2 and I am very happy with it - awesome screen size and acceptable thickness for a fullsize keyboard. hulu.com on skyfire for this screensize totally rocks. I have heard that the flash browser of Hero is slow, but then again - it hasn't been XDA-fied yet (not that I know of, anyway).
But I am in the same boat as you - want the Hero too!!!
Good news is that I have a work ATT phone that will be up for renewal in October, hopefully when the Hero comes in!
Can't really help you with your choice except say - go to the Tmobile store and see the TMobile touch pro2 in person.
And don't count out the diamond2 either.
It truly is a great time to have HTC shares....hmmm maybe I should be looking into that! lol!
poppinpengawen said:
capacitive screens are designed for finger-friendly touches. when you touch the screen with your finger, the press generates an electric stimulus that the phone reads as a press. capacitive screens can't use normal styli, so there is a loss in accuracy
resistive screens are designed for accuracy, due to the use of styli
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Resistive screens need to be pressed quite hard, while capacitive ones only need to be touched lightly. Capacitive screens tend to be more responsive, so they will probably track your finger better when scrolling, and there's less likely to be any ambiguity about whether you've pressed something or not. But the most significant difference (aside from the fact that you can't use a stylus with a capacitive screen) is that a capacitive screen, given appropiate OS support, can support multi-touch - that is, it can detect being pressed in more than one place at once.
So, on the Hero and iPhone if you're running (say) Google Earth, you can rotate the map by putting your thumb and forefinger on the screen and twisting your hand. You can also zoom in and out by putting thumb and forefinger either side of a section of the screen, then moving them together or apart. This is much more convenient and intuitive than the TP2's zoom bar.
Macedon2000 said:
I played a bit with an iPhone 3GS today and it felt really good...i like the iPhone because everything just works... but I got bored after 3min of playing with it.
just the thought of not being able to flash new roms etc. makes me puke.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A jail-broken iPhone is actually pretty flexible.
I almost bought an iPhone rather than a TP2. It was really only the cost that put me off in the end. (Not the absolute cost, but it's too expensive for what it is). The user-interface design on an iPhone really is beautiful - it's not just that everything works, it's that everything works intuitively and quickly and neatly. The lack of a physical keyboard was also a problem for me (as I'm rather clumsy and have short, fat fingers) but the on-screen keyboard on an iPhone is the best I've seen; and the lower resolution of the screen (on iPhone or Hero) niggles a bit - for mobile web-browsing the extra screen res on a TP2 or Diamond2 really makes a difference for reading small text.
The call quality is also very good on a TP2 - I need phones to be clear and loud as I'm partially deaf. People hear you very clearly on the TP2 as well, thanks to the high-quality soise-cancelling microphones.
I was just wondering whether the pad has uses other than games? (navigating around the droid conventionally perhaps?)
Is there an app or perhaps already something added by SE into the PLAY that allows me to re-purpose the pad and it's buttons as say a shutter key or whatever else I might think of when not in game?
Does something have to be Xperia PLAY optimized for it to recognize the pad?
I'm asking these questions because I'm trying to decide between this and the Neo. I'm into emulation and gaming BUT that's not the only thing I do on a phone so I don't want to put up with all that extra bulk and a worse cam and no radio if the PLAY's only benefit over the Neo is all the PLAY optimized stuff. I'd then rather put up with struggling around on the touchscreen for the games like 95% of the other droid users out there, I'm sure the experience can't be that much worse.
SCHUMI_4EVER said:
I was just wondering whether the pad has uses other than games? (navigating around the droid conventionally perhaps?)
Is there an app or perhaps already something added by SE into the PLAY that allows me to re-purpose the pad and it's buttons as say a shutter key or whatever else I might think of when not in game?
Does something have to be Xperia PLAY optimized for it to recognize the pad?
I'm asking these questions because I'm trying to decide between this and the Neo. I'm into emulation and gaming BUT that's not the only thing I do on a phone so I don't want to put up with all that extra bulk and a worse cam and no radio if the PLAY's only benefit over the Neo is all the PLAY optimized stuff. I'd then rather put up with struggling around on the touchscreen for the games like 95% of the other droid users out there, I'm sure the experience can't be that much worse.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah the pad can be used for navigation of the UI. The X button is select and the O button is back. And trust me until you try it, you can't understand how bad gaming is on a touch screen compared to the play
Thanks but that's not quite enough.
Seems like my decision has been made for me anyways since locally the PLAY came in at a much higher price point than the Neo preventing it from being available on my contract (and putting it right in the firing line of the flagships if I were willing to pay extra) which mean it's just plain a no-go.
Eventually you can browse in websites with it, and some apps will recognize it as a joystick or a trackpad. Still, the Neo is better value for money if gaming is not your top priority.
Gaming is high on my list but the camera comes first. I'm not happy with the everyday 5MP phone cam and want something better and Neo's cam is definitely that even it's outclassed by other 8MP cams. I do tend to like passing the time playing games on my phone though, but o well, the PLAY has been priced out of my range anyways as I said.
PLAY is great for gamers
Not sure how neo looks but if your not into gaming neo and arc are wayyyy better =/
I used the XDA App to post this, what did you use?
I use the gamepad to navigate whilst browsing and to position the cursor much easier when typing.
If you want to emulate games, you have no chance of playing them on a touchscreen. Its not just bad, it's impossible.
SCHUMI_4EVER said:
Gaming is high on my list but the camera comes first
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That seals the deal. You're better off with a Neo.
Emulatoring like a Boss | "Now you're playing with real Pow... Buttons!" #Turnand
Super Mario Vs Ash - the struggle was real.
Let me take the elephant out of the Room. We (@Turnand) have designed a Smart, Smartphone Case that can turn your Phone, into a Game Boy. With that outta the way:
So, if you’re reading this post, you probably have used an emulator before. Amiright? Well, emulating any handheld console on a Computer, works like a charm; albeit with one exception. These systems are not that demanding-“advanced”, to begin with, but the feeling a large monitor speaks when we are talking 160x144 awesome pixelated Pokémon art, is just wrong. Your 20ish inch FHD monitor has no power here. Your phone on the other hand; well that’s a whole other story. A story, with much more ups and downs, and options to explore, dare I say. Let’s jump in:
As a child I’d swear by my Game Boy, but in my teens, it got lost. It got lost, by a kid 2 blocks away from my place. Luckily, at around that time I got my first smartphone. A Samsung Omnia!
An amazing phone at the time- it was 2008 or so. It could emulate Pokémon, Super Mario, and even Final Fantasy ([email protected]) IX! Yep, a PS1 game! Ok, its specs would be laughable by today’s standards, but still. It was an amazing Pokémon-machine! But, anything out of the turn-based RPG genre and maybe puzzle games, was totally unplayable. Why? Well blame that resistive, smallish touchscreen.
Now fast-forward almost a decade. It’s 2016, and my daily driver is a LG G Flex 2. A 4G, octa-core, 5.5 inch, fHD monstrosity. So, why am I still complaining? Well, cause my original problem still persists! Smartphones and tablets were made with throwing birds to pigs in mind. None will ever consider them a real alternative to a console, until they get proper controls.
Ten-year-old me, beat Super Mario World Advance 2, on the GBA with no problems at all. To this day though, I’ve never even reached world 3 using an emulator, on any phone I’ve ever owned. A PC got’s proper controls, but simply doesn’t feel right to me. On the other hand, yeah, I have paired a Bluetooth controller to my Android phone before, but I love to see you balancing your 5inch phone, or even tablet, on your laps while holding a gamepad, on your daily commute. Everything game-boy-ish is called a hand-held, instead of a lap-top, for a reason!
That’s the need Turnand’s cases try to solve. That’s how the original idea spurred into our minds. This was a real life pain for us, and we believe that we are not alone in this. Gamers, and retro enthusiasts unite! Let’s take things in our hands for once. Literally grab yours now. We can’t change the past, but we can game comfier in the future – lol. We’ll be on Kickstarter on 29 June, 2016!
So this is Turnand’s take on the matter: The smartphone case we’ve created can transform your smartphone into a Game Boy; and trust us, oh it feels good. But no, we are not suggesting that you compromise your smartphone’s usability. In the end of the day, that social-media- feeder / cat-photos- viewer you call my phone, still has to and should always be ready to receive calls and texts.
Side Note:
We are a Start-Up taking its first baby stepps. So our website is still under development, but you can take a look, and we'd love to have you join us on Social Media! So our Facebook is awaitng, so does our Twitter, and some we also got some jazz going on Instagram !
Let me guess something, before wrapping this up!
And, if my guess is correct, then you will read the next paragraph! ‘Ere it goes: You also used up all the batteries from the TV remote, and the wall clock to feed your Game Boy!
Amiright?!
With that out of the way, allow me to clarify that our case / controller thingy, won’t need no batteries, charging, not even Bluetooth, Wi-Fi; no nothing! It’s just works, take my word for it. Or don’t, you can ask for a Beta Prototype, here!
Get the Gamepad at Indiegogo by searching for the "Sidepad Mod"
We've just launched our Indiegogo and hit over $1,000 in support! And we're just getting started! We want to bring you the ultimate Moto Mod gamepad! We really want to help create an awesome gaming phone. We're really excited about modular phones and what they are capable of. A mod transforms a super powerful smartphone with swappable extensions that suit the user better. We want to transform our phone into a super-dope portable gaming console! And we want to give game makers a reason to make more console level games in the Google Play Store.
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This is kind of cool but I'd rather have the buttons on one side (NES style). Also, how are you guys planning to manufacture these? What is the 15k for? Not too clear in the video, just sounds like you want to get Lenovo's attention (not necessarily a bad thing but still).
What our campaign pays for!
Hey thesm4rt1!
Good question! The $15k is to go towards the first run of mods. We already have a manufacturing partner in place as part of the Mods Partner Program, we're just working out the final deal. We won the Hackathon in NYC and we also won the opportunity to do this indiegogo campaign with the help of Motorola/Lenovo. We want to sell as many gamepads here to show Lenovo that this is a product worth collaborating on. We're also updating the design of the gamepad as we go based on supporter payback. We have a secret perk here in the forum for $10 off the super early bird Sidepad Mod Plus! Grab yourself one and let's make this gamepad a reality!
thesm4rt1 said:
This is kind of cool but I'd rather have the buttons on one side (NES style). Also, how are you guys planning to manufacture these? What is the 15k for? Not too clear in the video, just sounds like you want to get Lenovo's attention (not necessarily a bad thing but still).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To confirm, this is a separate project from the gamepad mod that Lenovo/Motorola just announced a MWC 2017. Correct?
http://www.androidauthority.com/moto...-alexa-752769/
http://www.stuff.co.za/motorola-part...ises-new-mods/
http://www.stuff.co.za/wp-content/up...amePad-Mod.jpg
As a previous owner of an Sony Ericsson Xperia Play, I find this rather intriguing. It appears that you are attempting to make the controls slide out from the sides. How will everything fit when the controls are slid in? Also could there be an issue of the controls sliding in while gaming? Is there anything to will lock them in place while in use? Lastly, will there be L3/R3 or Select/Start buttons? I do not see those listed in the images.
gostack said:
Get the Gamepad at Indiegogo by searching for the "Sidepad Mod"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Glad you posted about this so I could make some comments. I'm not sure the media buttons are very useful. For example, a gamepad is mostly used... for gaming. I can't see a reason for someone to snap on this gamepad for the only purpse to listen to some music or play a video. I think it is an extra cost, that has little benefit in real world applications.
Secondly, I'm not a fan of the whole sliding mechanism thing. I get it, to make it more compact. But the more moving parts you introduce, the more ways for this thing to break. I also can't foresee a person leaving the gamepad on their phone while not gaming with it. It is a nice idea, but looking at those renders, this thing is going to be pretty bulky folded in on itself. Probably most people would snap it on, play some games, then remove it to reduce the bulk of their phone.
Thirdly, will this thing have any speakers like the official moto z gamepad they teased at MWC? I don't know where they would be located, but supposedly it will have 4 speakers built in. One thing I did notice though, was they are apparently not front-facing(at least it didn't seem to be from that render they showed). If you are going to include some speakers like that one, that would be my #1 request. having them front facing, dual stereo speakers.
The Sidepad is the FIRST gamepad concept for Moto Mods
We are working on a new design that uses magnetic pins so the wiring inside of the sliding parts does not move. The game pad Motorola announced is not ours, despite the similar design. We created ours at the Motorola Mod The Future hackathon back in December of 2016. See that article here: https://techcrunch.com/2016/12/16/moto-mod-2/
MechaBouncer said:
To confirm, this is a separate project from the gamepad mod that Lenovo/Motorola just announced a MWC 2017. Correct?
http://www.androidauthority.com/moto...-alexa-752769/
http://www.stuff.co.za/motorola-part...ises-new-mods/
http://www.stuff.co.za/wp-content/up...amePad-Mod.jpg
As a previous owner of an Sony Ericsson Xperia Play, I find this rather intriguing. It appears that you are attempting to make the controls slide out from the sides. How will everything fit when the controls are slid in? Also could there be an issue of the controls sliding in while gaming? Is there anything to will lock them in place while in use? Lastly, will there be L3/R3 or Select/Start buttons? I do not see those listed in the images.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Sidepad is the FIRST gamepad concept for Moto Mods
Thank you for your comment. The short answer is, we are taking notes from our backers and will do everything to make this the best gamepad for gamers, (think Alienware but for mobile gaming) this is a new product and a new company. We would love to make multiple version of the Sidepad given the chance.
Now for the long answer
We have not yet put any work into the design for adding speakers, however, it is an interesting thought.... we will consider it. We are solving the size and durability issues by using magnetic pins. Similar to the Nintendo switch, except when our side pad snaps into place, the magnetic pins create the connections directly to the phone so there will be no need for any wireless protocols. The parts will also be cheap to replace just in case one is lost. The side pads will then slide in and magnetically snap into place on the back of the phone. Our new, coming soon, the design will also reduce the bulk of the gamepad.
x000x said:
Glad you posted about this so I could make some comments. I'm not sure the media buttons are very useful. For example, a gamepad is mostly used... for gaming. I can't see a reason for someone to snap on this gamepad for the only purpse to listen to some music or play a video. I think it is an extra cost, that has little benefit in real world applications.
Secondly, I'm not a fan of the whole sliding mechanism thing. I get it, to make it more compact. But the more moving parts you introduce, the more ways for this thing to break. I also can't foresee a person leaving the gamepad on their phone while not gaming with it. It is a nice idea, but looking at those renders, this thing is going to be pretty bulky folded in on itself. Probably most people would snap it on, play some games, then remove it to reduce the bulk of their phone.
Thirdly, will this thing have any speakers like the official moto z gamepad they teased at MWC? I don't know where they would be located, but supposedly it will have 4 speakers built in. One thing I did notice though, was they are apparently not front-facing(at least it didn't seem to be from that render they showed). If you are going to include some speakers like that one, that would be my #1 request. having them front facing, dual stereo speakers.
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gostack said:
We are working on a new design that uses magnetic pins so the wiring inside of the sliding parts does not move. The game pad Motorola announced is not ours, despite the similar design. We created ours at the Motorola Mod The Future hackathon back in December of 2016. See that article here: https://techcrunch.com/2016/12/16/moto-mod-2/
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Thanks for the response. Considering I just recently upgraded to a Sony Xperia X Compact, I probably won't be getting a Moto Z anytime soon. However, having this available for it would make it far more tempting.
Even if I don't buy it in the Indiegogo campaign, as someone who has wanted a full and proper replacement to the Xperia Play, I can tell you that there are certain things that I would look for:
1. Full console-level button layout support: Directional pad, 4 face buttons, 4 shoulder buttons, 2 analog clickable joysticks (or sliding analog pads with L3/R3 buttons close to them), and Select and Start buttons. This should assure that any emulator (except maybe N64) or PS2 port should be fully represented without needing specific touch screen controls.
2. Directional pad should be responsive and detect 8-directions with ease. D-pads that are mushy or sit too high often have trouble detecting diagonal directions and prove ineffective for fighting games. The Xperia Play had the best D-pad I've ever seen for a phone and even beat the one used on the PSP. Nobody has replicated that level of quality in another phone controller yet.
3. Shoulder buttons should be comfortable to use and easy to reach. Having them on the back may be rather awkward to use. I hope you playtest those well for comfort.
4. Focus should be made for the gaming controls over media buttons. The media buttons sticking out of the bottom look like they would be more in the way. I would prefer that the gamepad be as compact as possible and avoid anything that unnecessarily sticks out of the main unit.
5. I wouldn't worry about any other features except for maybe the extra battery as gaming does sap away power pretty quickly. It sounds like you're already planning to make the battery removable to reduce bulk, so I think this is a really good idea. Giving the user the ability to choose between portability and longevity is a good one.
These are the kinds of things that I would find important. To date, there still hasn't been a decent replacement for what the Xperia Play offered in terms of compact gaming. But it was also far from perfect. Your project sounds very promising as a potential replacement and I hope it does well. Even though I have no ability to use it yet, I will consider contributing to it if it develops in a direction that I like. Thank you.
MechaBouncer said:
5. I wouldn't worry about any other features except for maybe the extra battery as gaming does sap away power pretty quickly.
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I agree with everything except this. Why make the ultimate game pad, but then hamstring it with a lame, mono speaker that the moto z comes with? At the very least I'd substitute the media controls for an audio out jack for headphones. But even then, the supposed quad speaker setup with the 'official' moto gamepad is very appealing to me. Audio (for me) is very important in gaming, although I have my doubts that the controls on the official gamepad would be very good. So it comes down to (probably) better controls with this one vs better audio with the other one. Not sure if the official one from moto will have an extra battery or not.
gostack said:
We have not yet put any work into the design for adding speakers, however, it is an interesting thought.... we will consider it. We are solving the size and durability issues by using magnetic pins. Similar to the Nintendo switch, except when our side pad snaps into place, the magnetic pins create the connections directly to the phone so there will be no need for any wireless protocols. The parts will also be cheap to replace just in case one is lost. The side pads will then slide in and magnetically snap into place on the back of the phone. Our new, coming soon, the design will also reduce the bulk of the gamepad.
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I like the idea of magnetic pins. I was thinking in 'old' terms with some ribbon cables or something If it is switch-like, then this would come in 3 pieces?
I can't tell if the gamepad will sit under the phone, like this https://i.imgur.com/Kd0DXUN.jpg
or if it will be designed to sit flush with the phone, like this https://i.imgur.com/IABLsWr.jpg
if it sits flush, I wondered about is having a usb pass-through. Not sure if it could be possible, but being able to charge while playing might be a useful feature.
edit: looking more closely at the renders, it seems to sit under the phone. I'm trying to think of a way to have a usb cable plugged in w/o interfering with the controller buttons/stick
I have to agree with some of the sentiment on here: do not make it a slide-out design. You can make it a dock design of even a clamshell design, but please please refrain from doing a slide-out design. As an owner of three devices that have slide-out mechanisms (HTC Apache, HTC Mogul, Sony-Ericsson X10 mini pro), I can tell you first-hand that they are not worth the trouble to manufacture.
Slide-out mechanisms require more moving parts, are more prone to breakage, add weight, increase the time + cost to manufacture, result in increased support costs down the road, and even if you get everything right, they will still break down faster compared to other designs from the gunk that will collect in between the moving parts over time.
Since you guys don't have the manufacturing prowess of HTC or Sony, please spend your effort on the ergonomics of the mod casing and quality of the gamepad buttons, joysticks, triggers, and underlying micro switches instead of trying to make a reliable, robust slide-out mechanism, which like the other poster mentioned will likely be a lost benefit anyway because I reckon most people will remove the mod when game over.