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Hi!
I'm a fan of resistive touchscreens, therefore I currently to stay with WM (or I could switch to Symbian).
Would I be open to switching to a capacitive-based phone, I'd probably go for Android. Now WP7 is out and I'm curious, what does it actually offer over Android phones? A different user interface and support for M$ games (for that I have my PC), so why, in your opinion, should s user interested basically in a phone/organizer/messages/e-book reader switch to WP7 instead of another system?
I don't intend this as a clash topic like "which system is better", I'm just curious.
Thanks
If you use a lot of MS services and depend on Exchange then WP7 will be for you.
Personally I don't really like Android. It just feels overall unfinished (and often quite sluggish) and all held together with alot of different 3rd party apps, and the fact that 3rd party apps can replace the homescreen, SMS function etc.
Sir. Haxalot said:
Personally I don't really like Android. It just feels overall unfinished (and often quite sluggish) and all held together with alot of different 3rd party apps, and the fact that 3rd party apps can replace the homescreen, SMS function etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think WP7 is more of the future of the ppc. Information will presented in more of a real time and fluid manner while incorporating both work and personal agendas. Third party applications will be enhancements of course, but they won't necessary to hold an OS platform together as we see currently with WM, iOS and Android. The concept of having apps to simply have apps is kind of annoying to me. I want great applications not millions of applications.
Android wins hands down.
Apart from XBox gaming, WP7 offers absolutely nothing that Android can not do. And Android does everything better.
Android provides a much better user experience, because you can get things done much more quickly.
This is because there are no limitations that require complex workarounds and because you can customize Android much easier to get the information you want and do the things you want to do faster.
WP7 is limited and does not provide anything that Android hasn't done before.
Re vetvito: Android has better Exchange support than WP7!
Android's Exchange support is now 100%. WP7's Exchange support lacks lots of features, such as GAL.
crow26 said:
Android wins hands down.
Apart from XBox gaming, WP7 offers absolutely nothing that Android can not do. And Android does everything better.
Android provides a much better user experience, because you can get things done much more quickly.
This is because there are no limitations that require complex workarounds and because you can customize Android much easier to get the information you want and do the things you want to do faster.
WP7 is limited and does not provide anything that Android hasn't done before.
Re vetvito: Android has better Exchange support than WP7!
Android's Exchange support is now 100%. WP7's Exchange support lacks lots of features, such as GAL.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
can android pin anything to its start screen?? like fav songs, artist, albums, games, the list goes onnnn wp7 can pin pretty much anything and as far as "you can get things done much more quickly" i would think the home screen would be the simplest and fastest so not sure where you are getting you facts...
rruffman said:
can android pin anything to its start screen?? like fav songs, artist, albums, games, the list goes onnnn wp7 can pin pretty much anything and as far as "you can get things done much more quickly" i would think the home screen would be the simplest and fastest so not sure where you are getting you facts...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, but I'm pretty sure there'll be an app for it if it's actually a feature anyone wants.
Personally, I don't see the usefulness of having individual songs pinned to the homescreen, but that doesn't mean anything. Android is very customizable and it doesn't matter at all what I'd want (or what Google would want for that matter) because someone can just make it happen.
Depending on the app you use to play music, you can pin a playlist to the home screen which I could see being useful (not for me, but for others).
Games you can definitely pin to the homescreen though.
This is basically the same as Windows 7 being able to pin apps to the Task Bar. This is something that is pretty useful for me (for the apps I use all the time), but most people I know absolutely hate it.
But, if it's something people want, an app can be made. Can an app make your phone multitask?
tjhart85 said:
No, but I'm pretty sure there'll be an app for it if it's actually a feature anyone wants.
Personally, I don't see the usefulness of having individual songs pinned to the homescreen, but that doesn't mean anything. Android is very customizable and it doesn't matter at all what I'd want (or what Google would want for that matter) because someone can just make it happen.
Depending on the app you use to play music, you can pin a playlist to the home screen which I could see being useful (not for me, but for others).
Games you can definitely pin to the homescreen though.
This is basically the same as Windows 7 being able to pin apps to the Task Bar. This is something that is pretty useful for me (for the apps I use all the time), but most people I know absolutely hate it.
But, if it's something people want, an app can be made. Can an app make your phone multitask?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
here we go with the multi task again... the fact is no need for app or someone to make one in wp7 you can pin "ANYTHING" to the start screen. next on to the so called "multi task" yes you can run some services in the background on android but apps are also killed in addroid as well only they have access to certain services to kepp things seem to be running..
WP7:
1. App is running in the forderground
2. App is frozen in the RAM and only some threads are still running
3. App is frozen in the Flash memory and only some threads are still running
4. App is not running
Andriod
1. App is running in the foreground
2. App is frozen in the RAM and only some threads are still running
3. Just a portion of an app is running in the background as a service, the main app is deflated and residing in memory, or has been killed, leaving only the service.
4. App is not running, but is still in Memory in a deflated state until RAM runs out.
5. App is killed and not residing in memory. It may leave call to the OS to revive it periodically when conditions are met.
and no an app cannot be made for wp7.. but when this is updated to allow 3rd party apps to access these services then what will you say??? you sure cant get an app to help the andriod slugish interface to work better or an app to correct the fragmentation in androids os.. keep trying though..
Biges said:
Hi!
I'm a fan of resistive touchscreens, therefore I currently to stay with WM (or I could switch to Symbian).
Would I be open to switching to a capacitive-based phone, I'd probably go for Android. Now WP7 is out and I'm curious, what does it actually offer over Android phones? A different user interface and support for M$ games (for that I have my PC), so why, in your opinion, should s user interested basically in a phone/organizer/messages/e-book reader switch to WP7 instead of another system?
I don't intend this as a clash topic like "which system is better", I'm just curious.
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I share your sentiments. Resistive is much better...............
I also think constantly what is the way to go.
For me a massive turn on in WP7 is consistent, simple, modern UI experience
the whole OS seems great and modern, with no fragmentation or too much eyecandy.
BUT there are cruical lacks which makes - at launch - WP7 crippled.
Android in reverse is kind of complete with functionality.
I observe how Microsoft will react and what will plan.
Definitely - I can't live without beeing able to choose whatever attachement I want in email
for instance.
So for me obesrvation, and decision to be made once these WP7 devices will come to Poland.
I have been a HEAVY Android user and promoter over the past year, I have had just about any device under the sun I could get my hands on for T-Mobile(and some unlocked european ones as well)
But honestly, I will be banishing Android to backup phone status once the HD7 comes out.
The entire OS just seems like it's still in the beta phase. The UI is extremely inconsistent across apps. You have one app that looks great, and another that looks like a 5 year old stitched it together with crayon.
Fragmentation is a huge problem with Android, Microsoft knew about this problem, hell it killed off Windows Mobile because of it. Between all the different hardware specs, and UI changes it's a nightmare to keep everything on the same version let alone run efficiently. Since Google will never remove the ability to change to core experience, each Android phone will be vastly different when changing OEMs, what works on an HTC device won't work on a Samsung. What works on a Samsung won't work on a Motorola, etc.
The hardware fragmentation is also a huge killer for android. They can't optimize the OS for specific hardware when you have to support low tiered devices as well. Not to mention the fact it is run inside a Virtual Machine, so you take a performance hit there.
Software updates are the main thing that has been turning me off from Android, both as a developer, and a user. You write an application for one version of Android, but 60% of phones don't have that version(froyo), so you start removing things or tweaking things trying to get it to work on lower hardware, and you end up with a mess. Not to mention OS updates don't come out for every device. We STILL have people stuck on Android 1.5, and they are still at the mercy of the OEM or the carrier. Custom UIs and OEM changes have been ****ing up the OS updates for a long time. I remember back when I had the Hero how long I had to wait to get 2.x, meanwhile the Droid was just launched, the Nexus One was annoucned, it was horrible when all these new apps come out that support the latest OS and you are stuck on an older version.
Sure while the customizability of android is great, some of you Android zealots have to stop and ask yourself, is too much customization a bad thing?
take a look at the iPhone(don't flame me here, is just an example ) the iPhone 3G, which released before the G1 is capable of running the LATEST version of iOS. It wasn't left behind because of some OEM changes, or because of older hardware. Apple knows that people are still in a contract with it, so they continue to support it for atleast 2 years. Sure while it may not have all the features of it's bigger brothers(3GS and 4) that is because it is limited by it's hardware and not because of semantics because Apple wants to push it's latest phone.
Honestly I'm sick of all these Android zealots bashing Windows Phone 7 because it's missing feature x, or feature y. All WP7 devices will be updated in a timely manner and on a regular basis. Hell MS even stated that Copy and Paste which couldn't make it into the launch build will be released with the OSes first update in the Spring. Not to mention the fact that rumor has it the same update will bring multi tasking as well. IF MS is as good with their WP7 updates as they are with their Xbox 360 or prior zune updates, then I have no doubts in my mind they will easily overtake Android in terms of features and usability(I think they already did the former already )
I'm glad MS chose to set a strict set of hardware requirements, as this allows us as a consumer to experience WP7 in the way it was intended, not how the OEM thought it should be. This allows EVERY device to get new OS updates, as well as makes things less likely to go wrong during an update.
With a set platform to develop for, not to mention MS created drivers, the WP7 experience will be extremely smooth, and something Android fanboys can only dream of.
Why is it my extremely powerful phone(Galaxy S) still has lag when entering and exiting menus and applications, even with lag fixes and custom ROMs? When the OS is made for a generic set of hardware you get a sub standard experience(just look at the HD2), but when the OS is created around a specific set of hardware, you get what is called "synergy"
Also to the person who said Android can do things faster than WP7, let's compare a simple task like taking a picture while something is happening and you want to get it on photo or video...
Android:
Take phone out of pocket
Press unlock key
Swipe to unlock or press menu
Navigate to home screen(if not already there)
Find Camera application(hope it's on your home screen)/ Or press camera button(if phone is equipped)
Take Photo(if the moment isn't over by now )
WP7:
Take phone out of pocket
Hold Camera button
Take Photo
Guess which one I and most users would want....
Sorry for my dissertation on that, but I've just become enraged by all these Android zealots who feel threatened by Microsoft's new OS. If you aren't interested in WP7 and feel like defending Android, go to the Android boards, not here.
chaoscentral said:
I have been a HEAVY Android user and promoter over the past year, I have had just about any device under the sun I could get my hands on for T-Mobile(and some unlocked european ones as well)
But honestly, I will be banishing Android to backup phone status once the HD7 comes out.
The entire OS just seems like it's still in the beta phase. The UI is extremely inconsistent across apps. You have one app that looks great, and another that looks like a 5 year old stitched it together with crayon.
Fragmentation is a huge problem with Android, Microsoft knew about this problem, hell it killed off Windows Mobile because of it. Between all the different hardware specs, and UI changes it's a nightmare to keep everything on the same version let alone run efficiently. Since Google will never remove the ability to change to core experience, each Android phone will be vastly different when changing OEMs, what works on an HTC device won't work on a Samsung. What works on a Samsung won't work on a Motorola, etc.
The hardware fragmentation is also a huge killer for android. They can't optimize the OS for specific hardware when you have to support low tiered devices as well. Not to mention the fact it is run inside a Virtual Machine, so you take a performance hit there.
Software updates are the main thing that has been turning me off from Android, both as a developer, and a user. You write an application for one version of Android, but 60% of phones don't have that version(froyo), so you start removing things or tweaking things trying to get it to work on lower hardware, and you end up with a mess. Not to mention OS updates don't come out for every device. We STILL have people stuck on Android 1.5, and they are still at the mercy of the OEM or the carrier. Custom UIs and OEM changes have been ****ing up the OS updates for a long time. I remember back when I had the Hero how long I had to wait to get 2.x, meanwhile the Droid was just launched, the Nexus One was annoucned, it was horrible when all these new apps come out that support the latest OS and you are stuck on an older version.
Sure while the customizability of android is great, some of you Android zealots have to stop and ask yourself, is too much customization a bad thing?
take a look at the iPhone(don't flame me here, is just an example ) the iPhone 3G, which released before the G1 is capable of running the LATEST version of iOS. It wasn't left behind because of some OEM changes, or because of older hardware. Apple knows that people are still in a contract with it, so they continue to support it for atleast 2 years. Sure while it may not have all the features of it's bigger brothers(3GS and 4) that is because it is limited by it's hardware and not because of semantics because Apple wants to push it's latest phone.
Honestly I'm sick of all these Android zealots bashing Windows Phone 7 because it's missing feature x, or feature y. All WP7 devices will be updated in a timely manner and on a regular basis. Hell MS even stated that Copy and Paste which couldn't make it into the launch build will be released with the OSes first update in the Spring. Not to mention the fact that rumor has it the same update will bring multi tasking as well. IF MS is as good with their WP7 updates as they are with their Xbox 360 or prior zune updates, then I have no doubts in my mind they will easily overtake Android in terms of features and usability(I think they already did the former already )
I'm glad MS chose to set a strict set of hardware requirements, as this allows us as a consumer to experience WP7 in the way it was intended, not how the OEM thought it should be. This allows EVERY device to get new OS updates, as well as makes things less likely to go wrong during an update.
With a set platform to develop for, not to mention MS created drivers, the WP7 experience will be extremely smooth, and something Android fanboys can only dream of.
Why is it my extremely powerful phone(Galaxy S) still has lag when entering and exiting menus and applications, even with lag fixes and custom ROMs? When the OS is made for a generic set of hardware you get a sub standard experience(just look at the HD2), but when the OS is created around a specific set of hardware, you get what is called "synergy"
Also to the person who said Android can do things faster than WP7, let's compare a simple task like taking a picture while something is happening and you want to get it on photo or video...
Android:
Take phone out of pocket
Press unlock key
Swipe to unlock or press menu
Navigate to home screen(if not already there)
Find Camera application(hope it's on your home screen)/ Or press camera button(if phone is equipped)
Take Photo(if the moment isn't over by now )
WP7:
Take phone out of pocket
Hold Camera button
Take Photo
Guess which one I and most users would want....
Sorry for my dissertation on that, but I've just become enraged by all these Android zealots who feel threatened by Microsoft's new OS. If you aren't interested in WP7 and feel like defending Android, go to the Android boards, not here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nice Read!!! you really tell it like it is. I personaly never owned an andriod but i have had friends and you are correct about the apps i tried to install wifi teather on my friends phone and ALL of the apps i could never set the encrypton and 2 out of 3 didnt even work!!! so i can understans where you are comming from..
I too stated for all the droid fanboys to post their comments in the android boards...
chaoscentral said:
I have been a HEAVY Android user and promoter over the past year, I have had just about any device under the sun I could get my hands on for T-Mobile(and some unlocked european ones as well)
But honestly, I will be banishing Android to backup phone status once the HD7 comes out.
The entire OS just seems like it's still in the beta phase. The UI is extremely inconsistent across apps. You have one app that looks great, and another that looks like a 5 year old stitched it together with crayon.
Fragmentation is a huge problem with Android, Microsoft knew about this problem, hell it killed off Windows Mobile because of it. Between all the different hardware specs, and UI changes it's a nightmare to keep everything on the same version let alone run efficiently. Since Google will never remove the ability to change to core experience, each Android phone will be vastly different when changing OEMs, what works on an HTC device won't work on a Samsung. What works on a Samsung won't work on a Motorola, etc.
The hardware fragmentation is also a huge killer for android. They can't optimize the OS for specific hardware when you have to support low tiered devices as well. Not to mention the fact it is run inside a Virtual Machine, so you take a performance hit there.
Software updates are the main thing that has been turning me off from Android, both as a developer, and a user. You write an application for one version of Android, but 60% of phones don't have that version(froyo), so you start removing things or tweaking things trying to get it to work on lower hardware, and you end up with a mess. Not to mention OS updates don't come out for every device. We STILL have people stuck on Android 1.5, and they are still at the mercy of the OEM or the carrier. Custom UIs and OEM changes have been ****ing up the OS updates for a long time. I remember back when I had the Hero how long I had to wait to get 2.x, meanwhile the Droid was just launched, the Nexus One was annoucned, it was horrible when all these new apps come out that support the latest OS and you are stuck on an older version.
Sure while the customizability of android is great, some of you Android zealots have to stop and ask yourself, is too much customization a bad thing?
take a look at the iPhone(don't flame me here, is just an example ) the iPhone 3G, which released before the G1 is capable of running the LATEST version of iOS. It wasn't left behind because of some OEM changes, or because of older hardware. Apple knows that people are still in a contract with it, so they continue to support it for atleast 2 years. Sure while it may not have all the features of it's bigger brothers(3GS and 4) that is because it is limited by it's hardware and not because of semantics because Apple wants to push it's latest phone.
Honestly I'm sick of all these Android zealots bashing Windows Phone 7 because it's missing feature x, or feature y. All WP7 devices will be updated in a timely manner and on a regular basis. Hell MS even stated that Copy and Paste which couldn't make it into the launch build will be released with the OSes first update in the Spring. Not to mention the fact that rumor has it the same update will bring multi tasking as well. IF MS is as good with their WP7 updates as they are with their Xbox 360 or prior zune updates, then I have no doubts in my mind they will easily overtake Android in terms of features and usability(I think they already did the former already )
I'm glad MS chose to set a strict set of hardware requirements, as this allows us as a consumer to experience WP7 in the way it was intended, not how the OEM thought it should be. This allows EVERY device to get new OS updates, as well as makes things less likely to go wrong during an update.
With a set platform to develop for, not to mention MS created drivers, the WP7 experience will be extremely smooth, and something Android fanboys can only dream of.
Why is it my extremely powerful phone(Galaxy S) still has lag when entering and exiting menus and applications, even with lag fixes and custom ROMs? When the OS is made for a generic set of hardware you get a sub standard experience(just look at the HD2), but when the OS is created around a specific set of hardware, you get what is called "synergy"
Also to the person who said Android can do things faster than WP7, let's compare a simple task like taking a picture while something is happening and you want to get it on photo or video...
Android:
Take phone out of pocket
Press unlock key
Swipe to unlock or press menu
Navigate to home screen(if not already there)
Find Camera application(hope it's on your home screen)/ Or press camera button(if phone is equipped)
Take Photo(if the moment isn't over by now )
WP7:
Take phone out of pocket
Hold Camera button
Take Photo
Guess which one I and most users would want....
Sorry for my dissertation on that, but I've just become enraged by all these Android zealots who feel threatened by Microsoft's new OS. If you aren't interested in WP7 and feel like defending Android, go to the Android boards, not here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK - taking photo is faster with WP7. And what about copying music to your phone? Is Zune Syncing faster than drag-and-drop? And what if I want to copy something from a friend's computer? Installing Zune just to do that? It's the "Apple aproach" that's just a deal breaker for me. I never believed that MS will drop so low. Telling people what thay are allowed to do and what they are not allowed to do (a change of the UI is absolutely forbidden by MS) is just the thing that turned me off the iPhone and made me stick with WM (android was in the very early stages back then). I can't understand why so many people here didn't like the iPhone and are now exited about the WP7?!? I did't miss application consistency with WM, why on earth will this be so important with WP? And you think that OS fragmentation is just an Android flaw? Well guess what - it's WP7 1.0 now. Do you honestly think that all the manufacturers will offer ROM upgrades when they are released from MS? Like the Touch HD ever got WM6.5 officialy?
And for the last part of your post - it's been 3 days since MS released the WP7 and already some people are trying to say what others should do or not... you catch up pretty quick.
tkolev said:
Do you honestly think that all the manufacturers will offer ROM upgrades when they are released from MS? Like the Touch HD ever got WM6.5 officialy?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that is the nice thing of wp7 , microsoft is dealing with the updates , you don't have to wait for the OEM'S to get your updates .
If you use a lot of MS services, especially some mail/file exchange service, like outlook,
wp7 should be nice to you.
but I am an android guy
------------------------
No, I am not a X Man, I am a XDA Man
ceesheim said:
that is the nice thing of wp7 , microsoft is dealing with the updates , you don't have to wait for the OEM'S to get your updates .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They could probably handle patches, but I seriously doubt that they will handle ROM upgrades. You will still be dependant on your OEM to make a ROM specific for your device. And knowing HTC's policy that's something not very likely to happen.
tkolev said:
They could probably handle patches, but I seriously doubt that they will handle ROM upgrades. You will still be dependant on your OEM to make a ROM specific for your device. And knowing HTC's policy that's something not very likely to happen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think there isn't any nead to update the whole rom , you can update almosed everything in the rom.
I think it will be the same as wm6.5 , the option was there but never used .
Here is a link of how it works on wm6.*
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=520009
chaoscentral said:
I have been a HEAVY Android user and promoter over the past year, I have had just about any device under the sun I could get my hands on for T-Mobile(and some unlocked european ones as well)
But honestly, I will be banishing Android to backup phone status once the HD7 comes out.
The entire OS just seems like it's still in the beta phase. The UI is extremely inconsistent across apps. You have one app that looks great, and another that looks like a 5 year old stitched it together with crayon.
* Some more text*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is exactly the impression I've got from Android, and is the reason that I'll go to WP7 instead of an Android option.
Jailbroken WP7 would be the best!
Guys its just the ui that matters.. Android offers everything that wp7 is now beginning to offer. Only problem with android is the ui which is unable to display the information to the user the way wp7 does.. But I guess if wp7 has a better ui then android will put on a fight with gingerbread. Only problem with android is that all of us ain't using a nexus hence the experience will be different to all of us. And software updates in android are a joke when it comes to the consumer end... Still waiting for froyo.... May end up buying wp7 because of the experience
Just love that ui... Makes android look old and fragmented.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
ceesheim said:
I think there isn't any nead to update the whole rom , you can update almosed everything in the rom.
I think it will be the same as wm6.5 , the option was there but never used .
Here is a link of how it works on wm6.*
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=520009
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I still find it hard to believe that MS will update the hardware-related parts of the ROM. Now it's easy - there is one processor, one resolution, etc. but these are the minimum specs the phones must meet. I guess will have to wait a couple of years to see what's going to happen. My feeling is that the update system will never be as efficient as Apple's and will have all of it's drawbacks. In the end WP will be as fragmented as Android and as closed as iOS. I hope I'm wrong!
I would like to begin an initiative to port the Android Dalvik JVM to Bada. This would open up access to Android applications on the Bada platform and even allow for the creation of hybrid applications.
If you are interested in the project please put forward your advice and offer your assistance.
I am personally quite busy with other side projects but would love to create a bit of momentum and get this off the ground.
Hope this finds you all well.
Comment away
sabianadmin said:
I would like to begin an initiative to port the Android Dalvik JVM to Bada. This would open up access to Android applications on the Bada platform and even allow for the creation of hybrid applications.
If you are interested in the project please put forward your advice and offer your assistance.
I am personally quite busy with other side projects but would love to create a bit of momentum and get this off the ground.
Hope this finds you all well.
Comment away
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Grt.......i am tester basically and i dont have any knowledge on programming...plz let me know if i could help you in anyway....
I think this could create a lot more work than intended because:
Bada would have to somehow support Intents/Activities
Same can be said about the UI (this could open up a can of worms) trying to match up Android UI with Bada UI aspects such as lists, menus etc
How can a dalvikvm based app be executed - we're talking about multilayers - am not sure if Bada can launch an app in this way
Dalvikvm machine under Android, is the main engine, under Bada, the C++ Runtime executes the binary, we're talking about a binary launcher launching a dalvikvm, in turn to launch a dalvikvm bytecode, that kind of process could consume far too much memory.....
Its too early to say yet at this stage on the bada SDK if it has the necessay support in place to enable this project to get off the ground
Just my 2cents
Good points. We need to establish how exactly android launches applications using Dalvik.
Does anyone know which libraries and dependencies Dalvik relies on in android?
We could create a wrapper which allows dalvik to be launched as a standard Bada app and then run a given application. Thoughts?
I did try port python 2.6 to bada last year and failed miserably due to the limited api's in place, unfortunately for bada, the majority of the API's are not there because the underlying architecture is nucleusRTOS which has a hacked up newlib and also a crappy compiler by codesourcery.
so does that mean that bada platform is not good?
I would not jump to that conclusion either...
Bada SDK has a lot of "growing up" to do... give it a chance
Who knows.... maybe bada 2.0 might have linux in place, instead of nucleusRTOS, for full head on linux sdk compatibility, multitasking.... who knows... just watch this space and wait and see....
Lets not focus on the kernel space for a second, at a user space level what BSD libraries are there?
i really thinkt hat one of the fastest ways to get a new OS on all waves mobiles is to collect some money and put it as a bounty for the releaser
i mean, it's already a LOT of work to port a new OS on a mobile phone, it's even harder if it's free D:
http://www.engadget.com/2011/02/08/myriad-alien-dalvik-runs-android-apps-on-any-phone-starting/
This company proved my point. Nice working being interested in something that is clearly worth being interested in guys.... *Facepalm*
@sabianadmin : really it would be great if it could happen to bada. Your idea was great to port dalvik on bada. Are you working on it?? just curious !!
Maybe this http://www.engadget.com/2011/02/08/myriad-alien-dalvik-runs-android-apps-on-any-phone-starting/ will be ported to Bada, too...
Yep been working on it for a couple of days. talking to a few people and getting and trying to figure out how to make a self contained dalvik wrapper (Myriad use Qt, we could do the same if someone ports Qt to Bada :-/ ). it really shouldn't be *that* hard to do.
@anghelyi i posted that link like 2 posts ago?!
It'd be pretty sweet if you could get in touch with Myriad and find out about their Alien Dalvik
Damn If you want to Port android to the Samsung wave go to the androidport site
We gonna port android 2.2 to the samsung wave (and we finally got an working ARM7 tool)
Just if you want this go to us
Just wait for that we been finished and you'll can do anything you want
wavedroid said:
Damn If you want to Port android to the Samsung wave go to the androidport site
We gonna port android 2.2 to the samsung wave (and we finally got an working ARM7 tool)
Just if you want this go to us
Just wait for that we been finished and you'll can do anything you want
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sabianadmin started this topic with the intention of discussing about the possibility of porting Dalvik VM to bada and not the whole android. That topic has been discussed and closed elsewhere.
wavedroid said:
Damn If you want to Port android to the Samsung wave go to the androidport site
We gonna port android 2.2 to the samsung wave (and we finally got an working ARM7 tool)
Just if you want this go to us
Just wait for that we been finished and you'll can do anything you want
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Once again proving your sheer stupidity. I am talking about running the Dalvik JVM to run android applications. Did you even read what we have been talking about here? This has nothing to do with porting the Android platform to the Wave.
Go troll on your own forums buddy.
I dont' know, but it seems that porting Myriad it would be more easy, interesting and powerful for run android apps, than porting android OS.
When they would release the source code?
The only problem is that Myriad uses Qt and so far we have not ported Qt to bada... Anyone want to give it a go? (yeah i know about the bada-lighthouse project)
Myriad
I'm new to this forum and just found this discussion via Google while looking for some related details on Dalvik.
Isn't the Turbo Dalvik from Myriad closed source, seems like a commercial product aimed at companies?
Hi,
Does anyone have any solid info on when MS will officially update tethering on the phones...this is a huge deficit for people who use phones at their workplace for data as well.
Impossible to switch to WP7 as it stands because of this.
LIP
No official word yet. We don't know if they will ever add this to the OS, although it would be pretty stupid not to, seeing how all the other platforms will have it.
the wp7 os fully supports tethering, it is the oem/provider that need to make an app.
so don't blame MS that it's not in the os .
this is the same for the upcoming nodo update , everybody blame MS that the update isn't ready
tha fact is that it is ready long time ago but our providers/oem have asked/demand that MS sould wait with it .
Is there anyway to do this without XAP? Without Microsoft developer tools?
ceesheim said:
the wp7 os fully supports tethering, it is the oem/provider that need to make an app.
so don't blame MS that it's not in the os .
this is the same for the upcoming nodo update , everybody blame MS that the update isn't ready
tha fact is that it is ready long time ago but our providers/oem have asked/demand that MS sould wait with it .
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Updates != features. MS is fully capable of making tethering part of the OS itself; just like Android & iOS. There doesn't need to be any involvement or special "app" from the OEM/provider.
There is a way to tether :
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=929868
However, since I'm trying to get our company to deploy these devices to the sales force it's unlikely they would go this route when it seems it would void the terms and conditions of our provider(Bell Canada)...
I'm beside myself as I need a new phone for work and will end up having to go with an iphone...love the iphone hardware but I'm not a fan of the OS at all...
HELLO Xda !!!
I am a Noob from Germany !!
We all who use Bada Os have a serious Issue with the APPS !! so i want to know whether U guys (the great guys who Ported Android to Bada) can Create an APP for Launching an Android app on BADA powered Devices ! !! (atleast for S8500 and S8530) !!!!!!!!!!!!
PLEASEE GUYSSSS U CAN DO ITTTTTT !!!!!!!!!!!
Try it yourself? You make others happy with that
wilmervanheerde said:
Try it yourself? You make others happy with that
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yeah ! but I just started with C and C++ !!! so I cant !! only the Experts like XDA can handle this !!
lol why you write random words with capital letters any emulator requires countless hours of developing and does never reach the performance of the original system. and android apps have many rights that bada apps don't have so it would be impossible to run these without adjustments in the app itself. if you need these apps buy android.
shadowkavi said:
HELLO Xda !!!
I am a Noob from Germany !!
We all who use Bada Os have a serious Issue with the APPS !! so i want to know whether U guys (the great guys who Ported Android to Bada) can Create an APP for Launching an Android app on BADA powered Devices ! !! (atleast for S8500 and S8530) !!!!!!!!!!!!
PLEASEE GUYSSSS U CAN DO ITTTTTT !!!!!!!!!!!
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Click to collapse
I don`t think that anybody would develop anything like that but everybody is waiting for Oleg`s release of the Android 2.3.3 for the Samsung Wave, so soon there could be a stable version of Android working on Bada. It works already but with a couple of bugs which make it impossible to use the phone for a long period.
In fact, this could be done with enormous efforts. As on the new BlackBerry PlayBook there will be android application support, it is not impossible from technical point of view. There are two different project for this, one is AlienDalvik (I think this will be on BB PlayBook, but it's just a hunch) and the other is IcedRobot (this one is in the very begining of the project). Google them for more information.
I think the biggest problem for us is the Bada SDK, as it is nowhere near ready to accomplish this big tasks... Of course this is just my 2 cents.
Edit: you can find some information about porting Dalvik here: http://groups.google.com/group/android-platform/msg/a177b156d338c513?
But I'm sure I'll not start it...
OK, just trying to make something else out of the bull**** about how cool would be to have a Dalvik port, can anybody say what API would be missing to have a Dalvik VM as a bada application? I know Dalvik is far more than JDK, but I never seen any deep analysis. Back several years ago I played on some embedded platform to put J2ME there (I do get the difference) and porting KVM to hello world level took me something like a weekend or so. Again, comparing KVM to Dalvik makes no sense but honestly, to say that porting makes no sense, we should at least have an estimate of effort and missing API.
BADA should open up then for its own good
If Samsung ever decides to open up more apis for an android apps emu
it will be best for BADA. Bada doesnt even have PSX, N64 emus like android has.
Im missing out on a lot of exciting apps like the ones mentioned because there is no developer working on these apps for BADA.
If bada ever comes out with an emu for Android Apps then ill be in line
im even willing to pay for it.
As for not performing at native speed thats what they said for the psx and N64 emus on android but look at where they are now.
BADA isnt that different from Android it just needs to open up more APIs to
take up the slack.
Thats all reliant on samsung.
the app could possibly emulate these apis too like calendar etc or what else is missing (dont know what it is). so for calendar just create an empty one...
or (to make the point clear) instead of using camera it could show a picture and the android app would work and just think that camera is not moving
...but i'd really appreciate an n64 emu for bada
If I wasn't precise enough I'll just put that in one question:
What exactly (as specific as possible) is missing in the API?
mijoma said:
If I wasn't precise enough I'll just put that in one question:
What exactly (as specific as possible) is missing in the API?
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I think you were clear enough, we just doesn't have answer to your question. I barely developed anything with the Bada SDK, just played with the different versions. But I know that there were no sprintf, sscanf, qsort etc. when I tried it. Maybe this is not issue with Dalvik. And I saw that SDL was ported to Bada (even if it's not free and/or publicly available) so big scale ports can be done, but I can't see the developer community which is capable and willing to do it...
anghelyi said:
I think you were clear enough, we just doesn't have answer to your question. I barely developed anything with the Bada SDK, just played with the different versions. But I know that there were no sprintf, sscanf, qsort etc. when I tried it. Maybe this is not issue with Dalvik. And I saw that SDL was ported to Bada (even if it's not free and/or publicly available) so big scale ports can be done, but I can't see the developer community which is capable and willing to do it...
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I don't think any library functions are to be the problem. Most of them are either easy to replace or source code is publicly available. I rather tend to think what hardware abstraction / OS interface might be missing. It is repeatedly brought up that there is missing API, but noone gives any detail. What I suspect is that missing API is far less important than memory requirements, but it'd be nice if someone actually had a look.
About the community I share the opinion that it'd be difficult to get the right people doing this. There is much discussion on XDA how to bring this forum back to developers, so we can finally see more people working than whining.
There is much discussion on XDA how to bring this forum back to developers, so we can finally see more people working than whining.
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oh so you think it is so bad to have a lot of testers who are ready to kill their phones to prove that you are working in the right direction???
i noticed the disappearance of the Devs like you, Adfree , larieto(but he is in vacation) , Oleg and others
i still don't get it
Is XDA bad forum for the Devs now???
Best Regards
mijoma said:
I rather tend to think what hardware abstraction / OS interface might be missing.
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Yep, you can be right. And according to this :
http://justanapplication.wordpress.com/category/dalvik/
"Implementing a large part of what is approximately Java 5 plus a large part of some version of the Android APIs (which version is of course another problem) is not exactly trivial given that many of the Android API methods are actually native methods, or call native methods almost immediately, and they often use Android platform specific features, for example, Skia and Surfaceflinger to name but two. In fact it is quite difficult to see how it can run the majority of Android applications unmodified unless it actually contains what amounts to a largish chunk of, not to put to fine a point on it, Android." (it's about AlienDalvik)
DalvikVM itself is pretty big and it needs a few libs to be able to run .dex files and a lot more to run Android apps. With the bada 2.0 we have approx. 240-250 MB free RAM after boot, if I'm not mistaken. This might be enough for some stripped-down Android libs+dalvik+app as we have around 70 MB for apps when booted into Android... I may try to compille dalvik alone if I had some time...
One more thing: there's a project to port DalvikVM to iOS with some progress: http://code.google.com/p/in-the-box/ so this is definetly not just a dream. In fact they have DalvikVM ported. (video here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhyd18h_as4&feature=player_embedded)
mylove90 said:
oh so you think it is so bad to have a lot of testers who are ready to kill their phones to prove that you are working in the right direction???
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I don't feel satisfaction when an unaware 'tester' bricks his phone.
I'd prefer people that would contribute their time and knowledge instead. With large number of people unaware what they're doing and later messing forums with requests/DEMANDS for help we are not getting any further. When I asked for help in relatively simple task of downloading and checking bootloaders with a PC app there was little response.
mylove90 said:
i noticed the disappearance of the Devs like you, Adfree , larieto(but he is in vacation) , Oleg and others
i still don't get it
Is XDA bad forum for the Devs now???
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Click to collapse
Well, apart from me actually working hard in RL for past 3 months, I won't say much about others here at bada forum. Generally, XDA is going through hard times with developers being bashed and flooded with excrements from growing number of people feeling that clicking 'donate' is same as buying someone's time and other groups that think developers simply owe anything to users.
With going further down this path at some point the forum would have to change the name to 'xda-noobs.com' as all the devs would be gone leaving all that whining behind. Fortunately, the mods and admins do care and take actions, so I hope it will stimulate more hard-facts discussions.
anghelyi said:
DalvikVM itself is pretty big and it needs a few libs to be able to run .dex files and a lot more to run Android apps. With the bada 2.0 we have approx. 240-250 MB free RAM after boot, if I'm not mistaken. This might be enough for some stripped-down Android libs+dalvik+app as we have around 70 MB for apps when booted into Android... I may try to compille dalvik alone if I had some time...
)
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Wait a Minute !!! YOU CAN DO IT ??? Where can I buy the Time for you ?? Man thats an awesome News !!!!!!!!!!! I love to hear that !! !! what about the APIs and the things that other guys are talking about ?? Is it possible to bring it on BADA ??? AleinDalvik??? REPLY MY FRIENDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD !!
Hold your horses as you're simply misinterpreting and clearly should go look up what is Alien Dalvik.
VM is one thing, runtime is the other. While compilation should not take too much time, creating runtime environment won't be that straightforward.
mijoma said:
Hold your horses as you're simply misinterpreting and clearly should go look up what is Alien Dalvik.
VM is one thing, runtime is the other. While compilation should not take too much time, creating runtime environment won't be that straightforward.
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Yes, indeed! I just wanted to say that I'll check if the core libs could be compiled at all without much modification if I had time. But Dalvik alone is not barely more than having a console based java re...
mijoma said:
Hold your horses as you're simply misinterpreting and clearly should go look up what is Alien Dalvik.
VM is one thing, runtime is the other. While compilation should not take too much time, creating runtime environment won't be that straightforward.
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let android apps run on non android devices
this is what Alien Dalvik does ,right ??
it runs on N900 !! cant we make it to run on Bada ?? Yes or No ??
shadowkavi said:
let android apps run on non android devices
this is what Alien Dalvik does ,right ??
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First of all, Alien Dalvik is a commercial PRODUCT, not a general concept. Dalvik as it is does not really require android to run.
shadowkavi said:
cant we make it to run on Bada ?? Yes or No ??
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When you say 'we' who do you really have in mind? What will be yours input?
If you wish to ask the question in that tone and receive a binary answer, then your answer is No.
Are there any exploits that have been found in addition to spoofing that allow unsigned apps to be executed?
look at this:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1193694
wac apps can be run, but i still dont know what these are able to
Anything else?
I am bumping this thread.
I don't think that you will get something
bada is still new and its hackers (excuse me for saying this) are still inexperienced or just lazy
Unlike IOS which gets its jailbreak after the release of its new version by 3-4 days
Also the developers hate sp**fing or jailbreaking
So bada is not the right platform to jailbreak
Best Regards
Why do they hate jailbreaking?
Because if bada is jailbreaked they won't sell their apps
Most of bada app developers are free lances
Let's hope that will change with bada 2.0
Best Regards
When I say jailbreak, I mean being able to run unsigned apps, not pirated apps.
in fact it means the same...
Same action, different purpose.
Does spoofing still work?
With lastest official firmwares (KF3, JL2) spoofing doesn't work now.
Thank you.
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