Related
wm7 = no native API call, stop running of background program and many other controls
let say good bye appl like WKTASK, CPUMonitorMini and many others
we have to wait for official comments next month. however why switch to Android? The native API of WM 6.5.x will not expire on our devices. With it we can do whatever we want.
...
I can't see me now buying a wm7 device in the future and I defenitly switch to android if wm isn't supporting multitasking anymore.
The fact alone that wm7 won't be backward compatible let's me thing about switching.
Thats all really sad because my omnia 2 is actually my first smartphone and I'm very pleased with it, basically because it uses a desktop like os.
drandazzo said:
will the current WM6/6.5 applications work on WM7.. eg. TomTom?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No. No piece of WM6 software will work on WP7. Some pieces may be easier for the developers to convert to WP7 than others, but all will require code-level conversion and recompilation of some sort.
Personally I hope 6.5 apps DON'T work on WP7, it'll make developers lazy and not bother re-writing their apps for WP7.
We need a clean break and that means no backwards compatibility. I want all my WP7 apps to have the jazzy new UI, full touch control and full integration with the hubs.
I don't mind paying the devs some more cash for a WP7 version of their apps, and I'm sure they won't mind taking that money off me!
Jim Coleman said:
Personally I hope 6.5 apps DON'T work on WP7, it'll make developers lazy and not bother re-writing their apps for WP7.
We need a clean break and that means no backwards compatibility. I want all my WP7 apps to have the jazzy new UI, full touch control and full integration with the hubs.
I don't mind paying the devs some more cash for a WP7 version of their apps, and I'm sure they won't mind taking that money off me!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah when wp7 comes out thats when ill start buying my apps
Jim Coleman said:
Personally I hope 6.5 apps DON'T work on WP7, it'll make developers lazy and not bother re-writing their apps for WP7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The majority of the apps I use right now have already a kool looking ui (a lot of freeware is skinable anyway) and are fingerfriendly. And this includes stuff that is no longer in development and won't get updated.
If a developer refuses to update its app than there is a opportunity for someone else the be successful with a better product.
So why can't ms just let the market decide who got the best ui or functionality?
And for hubs, I don't really care for the new ui and would continue to use mobile shell (if still possible).
Shasarak said:
No. No piece of WM6 software will work on WP7. Some pieces may be easier for the developers to convert to WP7 than others, but all will require code-level conversion and recompilation of some sort.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I dont see why tomtom or things like igo wouldnt work.
Microsoft said that backward compatiblilty will be difficult because of making it fit in with the OS, but if its full screen it doesnt need to fit in with any part of the os.
TheGoD said:
I ... would continue to use mobile shell (if still possible).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No it won't be possible.
loomx said:
I dont see why tomtom or things like igo wouldnt work.
Microsoft said that backward compatiblilty will be difficult because of making it fit in with the OS, but if its full screen it doesnt need to fit in with any part of the os.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah but you're missing the point. Tomtom, if written correctly within the new Silverlight framework doodad, will be largely subsumed into the Hubs interface - it'll provide new menu options in People, for instance, to navigate to their home or work address. In Calendar it'll do the same for the location of an event. Etc. Perhaps it'll calculate the route in background and then add it to a route list somewhere else on the phone, who knows. But it'll only go full screen with the 3D view etc when you're actually navigating. The rest of the UI will be done via the hubs.
Jim Coleman said:
Ah but you're missing the point. Tomtom, if written correctly within the new Silverlight framework doodad, will be largely subsumed into the Hubs interface - it'll provide new menu options in People, for instance, to navigate to their home or work address. In Calendar it'll do the same for the location of an event. Etc. Perhaps it'll calculate the route in background and then add it to a route list somewhere else on the phone, who knows. But it'll only go full screen with the 3D view etc when you're actually navigating. The rest of the UI will be done via the hubs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Jim doesn't that sound ****ing awesome!?
in my opinion
winmo will be the best or the last
they have only one chance to make it the best mobile os or it will failed completly and all of us will move to android\iphone os
matckal said:
winmo will be the best or the last
they have only one chance to make it the best mobile os or it will failed completly and all of us will move to android\iphone os
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Depends on what WP7 really will be in the end, I'll switch to it, or just keep my old one. No intentions to switch to anything else, so please don't make such weird assumptions! WM 6.5.x will still be supported for a while by MS, and will be even longer on this board, so I see no reason to jump at the next opportunity because it's now suddenly hip or what?
Im done with Wm for Now...
Im done had all can take my HD2 is up for sale just picked up my Nexus one and its overclocked to 1.3ghz So fast microsoft im done....
Android is the new WinMo.
Except crappier. The slowdowns on the Qualcomm 72** series on the Android is more profound than on Win Mo. Thats how it felt to me.
I've messed around with android and it just doesn't seem that appealing to me honestly. Even though they may be locking down the WP7 UI. I love the integration it's going to have with Xbox Live and Zune. Not to mention the menu systems look very slick to me. I'll be sticking with Microsoft and I guess we will just have to wait for a crack to install our own apps if that's how it's going to go down.
after the recent Apple vs. HTC patent issues I would no longer talk so easy about bright future of Android. We never know what happens.
RAMMANN said:
after the recent Apple vs. HTC patent issues I would no longer talk so easy about bright future of Android. We never know what happens.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was going to say the same thing.
Android might have to get a complete faceleft and lose A LOT of functionality.
**** apple...
RAMMANN said:
after the recent Apple vs. HTC patent issues I would no longer talk so easy about bright future of Android. We never know what happens.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah, the future of Android has never been clear really. Not because the OS is bad or anything, but simply because Google doesn't really need it. That is, it's nice to have but it's not a life or death situation for them in this business. It's one of examples of their "let's throw all kinds of cool **** around and see later where it sticks" strategy. They pursue things that go easily and just as well abandon things that aren't going smooth - they just don't know where the money will come from, and don't mind that. Heck they didn't even know how to make money from their search business until they stole the context ad idea after unsuccessful attempts to buy it. But make no mistake - they are in business for the money. It doesn't mean they'll necessarily dump it, but it is an unclear and intransparent game.
So if I were an OEM I'd think a dozen times before really betting on Android, with or without the lawsuit. It's fine to use the opportunities it provides in the short run, but long term commitments? Nah.
Just to repeat myself about "tombstoning" and how it can represent multitasking as most people think of it, this article gives you an idea:
http://www.clr-namespace.com/post/Windows-Phone-7-Multitasking.aspx
Oh wow... so we can have (inaccurate) stopwatches "running" in the background on WP7? Great!
So, when I build a satellite navigation app, I set up a tombstone when the application is closed and when it's reactivated, I can calculate where the user is, because I knew where he was and how fast he was driving when he closed the app?
Awesome!
(oh and of course I don't take any responsibility for car accidents caused by my app - blame Microsoft or the idiots who said multitasking isn't needed when you got tombstones!)
You know, you would just use GPS for that
Yeah because usually it takes 0.000001 seconds to get a GPS fix!
Awesome!
Wait..... but how is my app supposed to give directions when it's closed? Hm, maybe not so awesome after all...
Satellite navigation is one of the most important things a smartphone must do and it sucks with WP7.
And have you heard that most of the mobile web traffic is porn, Pandora and Youtube?
WP7 does none of those three things! No Youtube, no Pandora, no porn... (don't know why people want porn on their phones, but I understand the Youtube part).
Seriously, how many moronic defenses can you fanboys come up with? This OS will be an even bigger failure than Kin if Microsoft doesn't change directions fast!
How are your application supposed to give directions if you're not using it?
I don't have a device to test with but I doubt it takes long for an app to get a fix. The OS probably keeps the GPS somewhat hot. Remember, Bing uses it when you search so they don't want it taking forever either.
And Bing has Satnav. Yea, I'm sure some will want a 3rd party solution but for most people, the FREE included nav will be just fine.
Fermat said:
Yeah because usually it takes 0.000001 seconds to get a GPS fix!
Awesome!
Wait..... but how is my app supposed to give directions when it's closed? Hm, maybe not so awesome after all...
Satellite navigation is one of the most important things a smartphone must do and it sucks with WP7.
And have you heard that most of the mobile web traffic is porn, Pandora and Youtube?
WP7 does none of those three things! No Youtube, no Pandora, no porn... (don't know why people want porn on their phones, but I understand the Youtube part).
Seriously, how many moronic defenses can you fanboys come up with? This OS will be an even bigger failure than Kin if Microsoft doesn't change directions fast!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well Flash is coming to the phone just after launch so that will solve your Youtube/Porn issue.
Windcape said:
How are your application supposed to give directions if you're not using it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It allows you to continue using your turn-by-turn GPS while conducting a phone call
Windcape said:
How are your application supposed to give directions if you're not using it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
By giving voice guidance in background, for example.
RustyGrom said:
I don't have a device to test with but I doubt it takes long for an app to get a fix. The OS probably keeps the GPS somewhat hot. Remember, Bing uses it when you search so they don't want it taking forever either.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When you search you don't need GPS, cell tower location is sufficient. Not so for driving. That cell tower location data helps to get the initial fix faster in modern devices, but still it's not instantaneous, which is a problem when you get an incoming phone call while using satnav in areas you don't know well. Otherwise, of course the OS doesn't (and shouldn't) keep GPS on. iOS 4 will keep it on while you're running satnav apps. WP7 won't.
RustyGrom said:
And Bing has Satnav. Yea, I'm sure some will want a 3rd party solution but for most people, the FREE included nav will be just fine.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, that will depend on where you live and where you travel. Bing Maps has horrible coverage worldwide. Apart from that, online satnav apps are an absolute taboo while roaming, you'll end up with thousands of dollars in your bill.
I think that incoming call doesn't suspend your app, the app will be allowed to keep working on foreground.
Also, GPS fix (cold) takes about 20s on my TP2, warm is instant . (Depends on if I have downloaded QuickGPS data though, but that's why I have data plan for.)
Funny how things change. When Apple did this it was the end of the world. Microsoft does it, its great, it's a new direction. Funny
vetvito said:
Funny how things change. When Apple did this it was the end of the world. Microsoft does it, its great, it's a new direction. Funny
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
when I had a iphone when I switched apps they didnt pause I had to start over when I returned to it, on wp7 it pauses it so in most cases its the best way to do it..it helps save battery while still being able to what you need to do. very few apps need to run in the backgroud besides GPS & streaming apps, once MS gives access to those apps that need to run in the background then yes it will be a great new direction. for now i dont mind it, i dont use Pandora & even on my tp2 when i use GPS i keep it on screen so i can do without it until they add it
Yeah pretty much like IOS4...
My problem with the iPhone's lack of multitasking wasn't so much with background running as with the fact that there's no easy way to switch between applications (namely, the incoming call while using satnav scenario, which is a major PITA in iPhone's case). I just need to minimize the dialer and keep using navigation. If that's handled (and it is in WP7's case) then the only issue is getting the fix again. Quite frankly, I find the recent iOS approach optimal for most cases, apart from the fact that it only has one button and an ultimately crappy task switcher. WP7 will allow me to go back to satnav with one tap of the Back button, so that'll work.
For other, more rare cases than those covered in iOS 4, I would really struggle to find real-life scenarios where a background process would really need to consume CPU cycles all the time (i.e. actually run). WM has a set of APIs called SNAPI, where background processes simply "register" for certain events and work only to process them. That can be done so that it won't really hurt either battery life or performance.
For the most rare cases where programs actually do need to run in background - well, I see lots of reasons why those can be really restricted, but, like with native APIs, MS could actually make exceptions in certain cases without allowing them by default - at least I would certainly agree with such a policy.
Maybe all this will be done with time, they never said multitasking won't be implemented, they'll just need to think about how to approach it better.
I personally think that lack of multitasking may be a problem, but it's actually the least of my worries with this OS. Much more relevant and serious issues are lack of c&p and lack of ways to register applications as system-wide filetype handlers. These are real bummers (apart from miserable language support and marketplace coverage of course).
vetvito said:
Funny how things change. When Apple did this it was the end of the world. Microsoft does it, its great, it's a new direction. Funny
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Except iOS didn't have a "pause" API from vanilla. They introduced something like tombstoning in iOS 4.
Windcape said:
Except iOS didn't have a "pause" API from vanilla. They introduced something like tombstoning in iOS 4.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They did, since the OS 2 release in 2008
In WP7 there's an Application_Deactivated event fired when the user is leaving the app, in the iPhone pre-iOS4 the event function was called applicationWillTermimate but the purpose was exactly the same : allowing the developper to save data before the app shutdown. Some apps were implementing it before iOS4.
In iOS4, the OS save the application state when you leave it (pretty much like Windows hibernation), whereas in WP7, the developper has to do some work to support tombstoning (and i'm not sure all of them developpers will)
I just hope that, when they support background running services API, the task manager won't be as lame as Apple one, showing programs that aren't even running...
My 2 cents
@kooled: Ah, my iPhone knowlegde is flawed then. Thanks for the clarification.
I think we can expect to see a background-service API, once they figured out how to design one that prevents from the phone lagging out entirely, like all Android phones does these days.
Android have taken over Windows role as the OS that requires constant restarts
Windcape said:
Android have taken over Windows role as the OS that requires constant restarts
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is really funny - it looks like you really believe these fantazies.
It's a really stable OS.
Fermat said:
And have you heard that most of the mobile web traffic is porn, Pandora and Youtube?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you need porn on your mobile device I suggest you better get a girlfriend
I think it's only US people who care about Pandora since it's not offered over here in Europe. Hey and we are all still alive over here even without it
Anyways: A Pandora app IS being developed, they were called out as a partner (see http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/15/microsoft-announces-windows-phone-7-series-dev-partners-sling/ ).
I think they might be able to integrate into the Zune hub and use the zune player API too.
The difference between the 2007 iphone and 2010 wp7 not having c&p and multitasking, is that when asked Apple's response was that you didn't need it, and Microsoft's response is that it's done not yet.
1st off this is not intended to be a flaming / bashing thread. If you want to do that please go elsewhere; I'm sure the vibrant forums will welcome you. If a MOD feels this belongs somewhere else, please move it.
I have been a long time WM user and recently switched to android for the past year. I am offering my take on WP7 on the pros on cons.
Interface - Finally something completely new and wonderful. Microsoft really did hit a homerun on trying to make information at a glance approach. Mail and search apps look beautiful. I thing missing, being able to quickly jump to apps in the app menu.
Lack of Landscape Support- For as great as the UI is I am shocked at the lack of landscape support. The start menu, app menu, nor Zune have lanscape support. You can not even refresh a webpage or type in a website if you are in landscape mode. Calling this anything other than an epic "FAIL" by microsoft is sugar coating it. Especially when the HD7 and Surround beg to be in landscape mode with their kick stands.
Browser - As expected from an IE browser it is pretty good. I already mentioned the lack of landscape support which is really frustrating but there is something else that gets under my skin more. Web pages do not resize to fit the screen when you zoom in. This was/is almost a deal breaking for me honestly. I love the organization of having all the buttons at the bottom and the interface is stunning but you lose way to many options in landscape mode. You can't even access favorites without first going back to portrait. MS, this NEEDS to be addressed soon. The browser is the main feature of smartphones now.
Zune - Wonderful if you have a Zune Pass. Honestly it was one of the main reasons why I bought this phone. I expected it to be awesome and it didn't disappoint. That being said they need to add a Play Now option to the market songs. When I'm browsing the market sometimes I want to queue songs and the Add to Playlist option makes sense but how could you leave out Play now? Seriously?
Another thing I don't like is I can not fast forward to a certain spot in a movie. Video files can be hours long, why should I have to hold the fast forward button to get to the point I'd like. Let me hit the progress bar and then use the rewind / fast forward buttons for getting to the exact point.
USB Storage Device- glaring admission, but I can kind of see why. It helps stop piracy, but I loved being able to hook my fuze / tilt 2 / nexus 1 / vibrant to my car stereo and play the music I had downloaded on my phone. I know I could get an audio cable and do the same, but while driving it is so much easier to use the radio head unit to control music rather than your phone. I knew this when getting in bed with WP7, but that doesnt mean I still can't miss it.
Bluetooth- for music works just like it should. however it will not play the audio from video files threw bluetooth. It keeps coming out of my phone's main speakers and there is no way to get into the bluetooth profiles to see if something is wrong. VERY ANNOYING MS. get to fixing it.
People- Wonderful. Could anyone ask anymore? I gave it my facebook and gmail accounts and I didn't have to worry about any contacts not showing up. Love the Facebook updates also.
Dailer- No smart dialer? This used to even be in my old wizard by default. How it get left out is completely beyond me.
Announced fixes- Flash, Copy & Paste, Turn by Turn navigation can't come soon enough but I am glad microsoft acknowledged they needed them.
Local Outlook Support- I knew this before hand, but I am in the crowd that says MS needs to add this ability.
Overall- I bought my HD7 without a contract and I am pretty sure i will NOT be returning it. I love my HD7 and WP7, however this OS isn't entirely complete. That being said was iOS and Android complete when they came out? To even suggest that is laughable. I can not wait for microsoft to release all the fixes for this OS because when it does it will be a powerhouse.
I will not buy that this phone is for dumbsmart phone users. I probably done more with my phones than 95% of android users who will do nothing by bash WP7 and i honestly see this for ALL users. It helps bring the powerhouse experience in an easier way without being tied down as much as iOS.
Why not just post in one of the other 50 threads? Now people will be copy-pasting replies from those into this one.
I did notice the lack of landscape mode in IE. I think that was the only thing that made me go WTF when I used the HD7.
However, the keyboard is so good that I don't think it even mattered that much.
I guess with a 3.7-8" screen it can be a bit annoying, but on anything 4" or bigger it didn't strike me as a big deal beyond the initial shock of it not being there.
Also, lots of people dont' seem to know the difference between an Operating System and an Application.
N8ter said:
Why not just post in one of the other 50 threads? Now people will be copy-pasting replies from those into this one.
I did notice the lack of landscape mode in IE. I think that was the only thing that made me go WTF when I used the HD7.
However, the keyboard is so good that I don't think it even mattered that much.
I guess with a 3.7-8" screen it can be a bit annoying, but on anything 4" or bigger it didn't strike me as a big deal beyond the initial shock of it not being there.
Also, lots of people dont' seem to know the difference between an Operating System and an Application.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Those threads became nothing but flaming / bashing threads. I thought it would be a good idea to try to get away from that.
Also a core application can be considered part of the OS. If you can not uninstall it, it is part of the OS.
I thought it was annoying not being able to get to the address bar with all that screen space.
I don't know about you guys but my Surround goes into landscape mode IE just fine...
The only thing I don't like is lack of landscape in marketplace and Zune...
also if you want a nice photo editor, Thumba photo editor for $.099 is awesome!
EDIT: Oh i see. I can't believe I have to switch to portrait to type a URL!! WTF microsoft!
jz9833 said:
Browser - As expected from an IE browser it is pretty good. I already mentioned the lack of landscape support which is really frustrating but there is something else that gets under my skin more. Web pages do not resize to fit the screen when you zoom in. This was/is almost a deal breaking for me honestly. I love the organization of having all the buttons at the bottom and the interface is stunning but you lose way to many options in landscape mode. You can't even access favorites without first going back to portrait. MS, this NEEDS to be addressed soon. The browser is the main feature of smartphones now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Overall I agree with just about everything you said. Regarding the browser, I've noticed that certain areas of webpages are zoomed in more than others. For instance, on xda, the text of people's posts is HUGE compared to the buttons such as User CP, etc. at the top of the page. What I've found is a double tap in my area of interest on a page will zoom the page so that ONLY my area of interest is approriately sized. Then, when I want to switch to another part of the page, I double tap there and the page will resize, and so on. The text does not dynamically reflow a la Android, but I think it's a pretty usable system.
-R
jz9833 said:
Dailer- No smart dialer? This used to even be in my old wizard by default. How it get left out is completely beyond me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is voice dialing in WP7 not sure what you mean by smart dialer???
rruffman said:
There is voice dialing in WP7 not sure what you mean by smart dialer???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
By going to the dailer and being able to spell "MOM" for example on the keys and it would automatically come up with the number for that contact.
jz9833 said:
Also a core application can be considered part of the OS. If you can not uninstall it, it is part of the OS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol, what? No, it's not. It's a stock application distributed with the OS. It is not part of the OS.
By the Logic people can say "Android is buggy because the GMail client is buggy." or "Windows Mobile is buggy because the Opera Browser HTC bundled with the HD2 is buggy." or "Linux is full of bugs because the KDE in that distro is buggy as hell."
Every OS comes with a set of stock applications, but they are just that, and are usually updatable independent of installing a new kernel or driver stack on the device.
In any case, I've already said I agree that the lack of landscape mode is an issue.
I just wanted to make that distinction, because lots of people on this forum are incapable of doing it themselves.
N8ter said:
Lol, what? No, it's not. It's a stock application distributed with the OS. It is not part of the OS.
By the Logic people can say "Android is buggy because the GMail client is buggy." or "Windows Mobile is buggy because the Opera Browser HTC bundled with the HD2 is buggy." or "Linux is full of bugs because the KDE in that distro is buggy as hell."
Every OS comes with a set of stock applications, but they are just that, and are usually updatable independent of installing a new kernel or driver stack on the device.
In any case, I've already said I agree that the lack of landscape mode is an issue.
I just wanted to make that distinction, because lots of people on this forum are incapable of doing it themselves.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I still completely disagree with you. Froyo for Android made plenty of browser updates so would you say that wasn't a OS update?
I like most people consider stock apps part of the OS
jz9833 said:
I still completely disagree with you. Froyo for Android made plenty of browser updates so would you say that wasn't a OS update?
I like most people consider stock apps part of the OS
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agree. Basically system is made of apps.
If email app built into it is buggy, we can say OS is buggy.
jz9833 said:
I still completely disagree with you. Froyo for Android made plenty of browser updates so would you say that wasn't a OS update?
I like most people consider stock apps part of the OS
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Doesnt meam ur right and most people are ignorant in os design and the diff between an os and an app distributed with said os.
Obviously...
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
N8ter said:
Doesnt meam ur right and most people are ignorant in os design and the diff between an os and an app distributed with said os.
Obviously...
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
then you are going to have to disagree with almost all people. This isn't a techy vs jock debate. These are apps which are built into the os and therefore part of the os.
But anyway this thread is meant for objective evaluation of WP7. If you want to continue this debate we should continue it somewhere else.
jz9833 said:
By going to the dailer and being able to spell "MOM" for example on the keys and it would automatically come up with the number for that contact.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can use search in the people hub for something very similar. Admittedly not an exact substitute but it works well enough for me.
jz9833 said:
I have been a long time WM user and recently switched to android for the past year. I am offering my take on WP7 on the pros on cons.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good post
jz9833 said:
USB Storage Device- glaring admission, but I can kind of see why. It helps stop piracy, but I loved being able to hook my fuze / tilt 2 / nexus 1 / vibrant to my car stereo and play the music I had downloaded on my phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How does this increase piracy? If the files you buy on Zune are locked down they can still do this even if there is a common store of files accessible as usb mass storage. Either by drm or by using isolated storage for those files.
jz9833 said:
Local Outlook Support- I knew this before hand, but I am in the crowd that says MS needs to add this ability.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you do it this way, then you are working with two sets of data (email, calendar, tasks, contacts, etc.) neither of which is guaranteed to be up to date. I don't see why people think this is preferable to a server-based system.
jz9833 said:
I will not buy that this phone is for dumb smart phone users.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hopefully this will be true; I will keep my fingers crossed. Currently, as I see it, they are targeting people who don't understand what files are, and would be confused by files, and who believe that music consists of songs arranged by artists into albums. I.e. the dumb mass market.
CSMR said:
How does this increase piracy? If the files you buy on Zune are locked down they can still do this even if there is a common store of files accessible as usb mass storage. Either by drm or by using isolated storage for those files.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The cintent u purchase in zune have no drm..... The piracy statement is legit.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
though given you just purchased for your zune account, you can then access it on zune desktop, and burn discs from there. so no necessarily correct.
however, what i think of a common storage area is a good idea. just have it so that the pictures, videos, music, documents are in a folder view for when you plug the phone into your PC. it would really only require a bit of mapping within the OS to make it look like a storage unit. Even if it was just more restricted down to just the documents section, that's still something. better than nothing imo as i don't have access to skydrive at work. but aye, i can live with it, it's not going to make me want to return the phone.
The Gate Keeper said:
though given you just purchased for your zune account, you can then access it on zune desktop, and burn discs from there. so no necessarily correct.
however, what i think of a common storage area is a good idea. just have it so that the pictures, videos, music, documents are in a folder view for when you plug the phone into your PC. it would really only require a bit of mapping within the OS to make it look like a storage unit. Even if it was just more restricted down to just the documents section, that's still something. better than nothing imo as i don't have access to skydrive at work. but aye, i can live with it, it's not going to make me want to return the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its 2001, people pirate with digital media. Cd piracy may still be hip in the third world, but I haven't operated a cd player in years (or used my computer to play one), much less bought or burned one.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
N8ter said:
Its 2001, people pirate with digital media. Cd piracy may still be hip in the third world, but I haven't operated a cd player in years (or used my computer to play one), much less bought or burned one.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
how about an MP3 cd? to play in your car? to lend to a friend? or your USB stick? as soon as it's available on zune desktop you have a copy of it... there is plenty ways around it. i'm not saying you should do it, i'm saying the possibilities are there.
N8ter said:
The cintent u purchase in zune have no drm..... The piracy statement is legit.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If the files are not DRMed, and Microsoft wants to protect them, either it can DRM the files, or it can keep them in isolated storage. The existence of common storage doesn't exclude isolated storage.
First, let me explain my frustation:
I just cant deal the idea that MS screwed WP7 so badly when it comes about multitask. I cant have a decent chat with my friends in WhatsApp because when I leave the app and someone talk to me, I cant touch the Toast Notification because it will take about 5 seconds to reload the whole app. However, I could "just" hold back button and select the app with a choppy image in the card view to instant resume (which will take me 3~5 seconds too).
So, Microsoft hates multitask or what?
What I want: a hack, a registry edit that makes opening a Toast Notification or a Tile to resume the instance and bring me the app instantly.
If you can make this really works, I pay you $150 USD. And I mean it.
mikeeam said:
First, let me explain my frustation:
I just cant deal the idea that MS screwed WP7 so badly when it comes about multitask. I cant have a decent chat with my friends in WhatsApp because when I leave the app and someone talk to me, I cant touch the Toast Notification because it will take about 5 seconds to reload the whole app. However, I could "just" hold back button and select the app with a choppy image in the card view to instant resume (which will take me 3~5 seconds too).
So, Microsoft hates multitask or what?
What I want: a hack, a registry edit that makes opening a Toast Notification or a Tile to resume the instance and bring me the app instantly.
If you can make this really works, I pay you $150 USD. And I mean it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks. You can send it over to me via Paypal.
No seriously. If you are interop unlocked just disable Dehydration with any registry Editor! It sits over at HKLM\Software\Microsoft\TaskHost\DehydrateOnPause. If you set that to 0, its faster with switching
It dont work when you open the app using the notification or tiles.. just using back button too.
Microsoft hasn't done anything to multitasking, just wait for WhatsApp to release a mango update that can handle the multitasking. I don't know if you noticed, but WhatsApp is lacking a ton of features. The developers just wanted to push out a release, they will fix it eventually. You must be patient.
Diablosblizz said:
Microsoft hasn't done anything to multitasking, just wait for WhatsApp to release a mango update that can handle the multitasking. I don't know if you noticed, but WhatsApp is lacking a ton of features. The developers just wanted to push out a release, they will fix it eventually. You must be patient.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, WhatsApp is mango compatible. So are Wonder Reader, and many others. Every app has this problem. Gchat, Evernote and others.
At first I thought it was developer's choice. But it is the system.
The reason for this is quite simple:
A Toast has a deep link to the app, and therefore starts a new instance of the app.
I guess they didn't think about it, that this would be a problem. Or possible there are some issues in how developers had to change their apps.
So, sorry, I don't think you can change this at the moment (easily).
As a side note: AFAIK each app can specify to NOT launch a new instance when it is started and is already running. Though I think that is an option that is not allowed for custom apps. But I'm not sure about that and if so, maybe it will change some day...
Hades32 said:
The reason for this is quite simple:
A Toast has a deep link to the app, and therefore starts a new instance of the app.
I guess they didn't think about it, that this would be a problem. Or possible there are some issues in how developers had to change their apps.
So, sorry, I don't think you can change this at the moment (easily).
As a side note: AFAIK each app can specify to NOT launch a new instance when it is started and is already running. Though I think that is an option that is not allowed for custom apps. But I'm not sure about that and if so, maybe it will change some day...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok, but why not resume when opening through tiles? And deep link is optional. So reload when it's deep link and resume when its not. Makes sense, I guess.
Either way, I want it to resume whenever I open the app.
Hope someone can find a solution to this problem.
mikeeam said:
Actually, WhatsApp is mango compatible. So are Wonder Reader, and many others. Every app has this problem. Gchat, Evernote and others.
At first I thought it was developer's choice. But it is the system.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think I understand what you are talking about, once you click to open the application through a tile it reloads the application? To me, that makes sense. Quite frankly, I believe the iPhone behaves this way as well. You're telling the system to reload the application, so I guess if you look at it this way it could be considered a design flaw. However, I feel that this is how it should work.
I don't mean to troll or anything, but here's how I see it: If I go off and do something else on my phone and then hours later return to the application, I don't want that application to be stored into memory for hours on end, that will kill the battery.
I do agree with you entirely that toasts should resume the application, not reload it like you've stated. However, I haven't run into this issue so for me it doesn't bother me. It could be possible that it gets patched in the next update. Perhaps add a suggestion to the WP7 suggestion board.
Diablosblizz said:
I think I understand what you are talking about, once you click to open the application through a tile it reloads the application? To me, that makes sense. Quite frankly, I believe the iPhone behaves this way as well. You're telling the system to reload the application, so I guess if you look at it this way it could be considered a design flaw. However, I feel that this is how it should work.
I don't mean to troll or anything, but here's how I see it: If I go off and do something else on my phone and then hours later return to the application, I don't want that application to be stored into memory for hours on end, that will kill the battery.
I do agree with you entirely that toasts should resume the application, not reload it like you've stated. However, I haven't run into this issue so for me it doesn't bother me. It could be possible that it gets patched in the next update. Perhaps add a suggestion to the WP7 suggestion board.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The problem is, the next update should happen 5~6 months from now. If they change it, wouldnt be in a minor patch.
I understand your point, but hey, not hours after, maybe it could have a time limit to stay on memory. Like.. 30 minutes without using it, the OS kills the app. The only thing the OS is killing right now is me.
Not that I want one iPhone, but since you mentioned, iPhone resumes the app. Doesnt matter if you use the fast switch or the app icon to launch it. It just kill the app when you close it on fast switch menu.
This is the biggest issue by far in Windows Phone! The multitasking is extremely confusing.
I tried to explain it here: http://windowsphone.uservoice.com/f...285744-change-or-fix-the-back-button-concept-
but couldn't explain it really well.
Please, someone make a detailed suggestion of this on Windows Phone Uservoice (http://windowsphone.uservoice.com/forums/101801-feature-suggestions) !
You will get 3 votes from me.
I wonder if Resumable XAP works for this application...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1136330
singularityduo said:
This is the biggest issue by far in Windows Phone! The multitasking is extremely confusing.
I tried to explain it here: http://windowsphone.uservoice.com/f...285744-change-or-fix-the-back-button-concept-
but couldn't explain it really well.
Please, someone make a detailed suggestion of this on Windows Phone Uservoice (http://windowsphone.uservoice.com/forums/101801-feature-suggestions) !
You will get 3 votes from me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not confusing. I understand it very well. It just works when you use the back button. If you dont use it, so you are reopening the app (when it is about third party apps).
Lumic said:
I wonder if Resumable XAP works for this application...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1136330
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It didnt work for me.
Diablosblizz said:
I don't mean to troll or anything, but here's how I see it: If I go off and do something else on my phone and then hours later return to the application, I don't want that application to be stored into memory for hours on end, that will kill the battery.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But it doesn't kill your battery. Having the app in memory uses no more battery that not having it there. Also, the app IS stored in memory for all those hours on end as long as it's within the 5-app count.
WP does NOT do third-party multitasking, it does fast-app-switching. This means the app cannot perform any work in the background, hence it's not using any more battery.
I actually agree with the OP - if the app is already loaded it should be resumed. The OS is fully capable of doing so, they've [MS] just decided to not offer it to third-party devs.
emigrating said:
I actually agree with the OP - if the app is already loaded it should be resumed. The OS is fully capable of doing so, they've [MS] just decided to not offer it to third-party devs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeap, and why not implement? I mean.. what damages would it do? The system would be faster, without lots of loadings.
The titlet of the topic remain. I still pay for someone fix this dumb decision from MS.
emigrating said:
WP does NOT do third-party multitasking, it does fast-app-switching.
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Click to collapse
This.
Probably the most disappointing thing about Mango.
The only phone that does true multitasking is the Nokia N900 and N9. Everything runs in the background just like a PC.
But there is no Whatsapp or anything similar. N9 only has Skype, Facebook Chat, Gtalk and SIP for chatting so far. (N900 has more but still no Whatsapp)
I also got really annoyed with my Omnia 7 and Whatsapp. It takes too long to load everytime.
I think Kik was a little better however. So I've been using Kik instead. (it's better of the 2 on WP7 so far)
Originally Posted by Lumic
I wonder if Resumable XAP works for this application...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/show....php?t=1136330
It didnt work for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That was what I talked about earlier. Somewhat surprising that it doesn't work. But then I guess it is really not possible. As this is a quite fundamental change this means you probably have to wait until Tango or Apollo. Sorry.
jakiman said:
The only phone that does true multitasking is the Nokia N900 and N9. Everything runs in the background just like a PC.
But there is no Whatsapp or anything similar. N9 only has Skype, Facebook Chat, Gtalk and SIP for chatting so far. (N900 has more but still no Whatsapp)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It might be true but win 6.5 was true multitasking before Ihonne,N900...Try an HD2 and see for yourself...true task manager also...
I recently helped a friend to flash back to stock his HD2, I wonder how come for a pair on new shoes Microsoft had to learn how to walk again, ups I meant they are learning how to stand up-walking later, it seems...
You could try this;
Resumable XAP Tool v0.1 Release
I would think you could take that method to edit an already installed app to do it. With a file explorer, browse to the installation directory & find the file, "WMAppManifest.xml." Copy it out to your PC & edit it. Find the line, "<DefaultTask Name="_default" NavigationPage="PivotPage.xaml" />" & add "ActivationPolicy="Resume"" to it so it looks like this, "<DefaultTask Name="_default" NavigationPage="PivotPage.xaml" ActivationPolicy="Resume"/>." Now copy it back into the installation folder of your device & reboot. See if that works.
drkfngthdragnlrd said:
You could try this;
Resumable XAP Tool v0.1 Release
I would think you could take that method to edit an already installed app to do it. With a file explorer, browse to the installation directory & find the file, "WMAppManifest.xml." Copy it out to your PC & edit it. Find the line, "<DefaultTask Name="_default" NavigationPage="PivotPage.xaml" />" & add "ActivationPolicy="Resume"" to it so it looks like this, "<DefaultTask Name="_default" NavigationPage="PivotPage.xaml" ActivationPolicy="Resume"/>." Now copy it back into the installation folder of your device & reboot. See if that works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No lucky here. Frustating.
http://www.netbooknews.com/43643/why-i-left-windows-phone-7/
The reviewer here, left WP for Android after using it for 7 months.
Key issues that deterred here from using it beyond 7 months:
Lack of multitasking like Android where apps actually run in background
It did not connect to people as well as Android
Display resolution of 480 x 800
IE9 giving an error twice a month that - browser is out of date (new to me!)
Inability to share locations
You can't zoom in the maps (on pinned locations)
Can't share pics on Twitter (it's a **** experience -probably compared to iOS/Android?)
Now I for one know that I would disagree and can prove that those claims are wrong other than 3rd and 4th one as I've never had those issues. So they might be there waiting for me to discover it?
Anyone have similar issues after using the phone for more than a month or even better if you've used it over half a year!
Please don't troll.
drupad2drupad said:
Lack of multitasking like Android where apps actually run in background
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah he has a point there, although I think Microsoft's solution (toast notifications and Live Tiles) is better for the user and the battery life. However this limits the options of small developers.
drupad2drupad said:
It did not connect to people as well as Android
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
drupad2drupad said:
Display resolution of 480 x 800
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Click to collapse
At least for WP7 every app runs on (almost) every device, the only thing that's missing from some devices in the front facing camera.
drupad2drupad said:
IE9 giving an error twice a month that - browser is out of date (new to me!)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Newer happend to me either.
drupad2drupad said:
Inability to share locations
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Click to collapse
You can share locations on Facebook or using foursquare, WhatsApp etc.
drupad2drupad said:
You can't zoom in the maps
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Click to collapse
I don't really know what that means, in the maps app you can zoom in.
drupad2drupad said:
Can't share pics on Twitter
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can, Twitter is built right in.
I have been using WP7 since April 2011.
slimshady322 said:
Yeah he has a point there, although I think Microsoft's solution (toast notifications and Live Tiles) is better for the user and the battery life. However this limits the options of small developers.
At least for WP7 every app runs on (almost) every device, the only thing that's missing from some devices in the front facing camera. You can share locations on Facebook or using foursquare, WhatsApp etc. I don't really know what that means, in the maps app you can zoom in. You can, Twitter is built right in. I have been using WP7 since April 2011.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you planning on moving away from WP anytime soon though?
A centralized notification area is definitely needed - probably within the 'ME' tile?
Never had any issues since Mango really, When I first started using WP7 on the HD7 early Jan 2011 I soon got bored with the lack of customisation as I had been using a HD2 and there was so much difference, I did go back to using my HD2 again but liked the new easy to use WP7 OS & after updating to mango I became more interested. I admit I don't fiddle with the phone as much any more but know it will do whatever I want when I want, Am happy with WP7 for now but eagerly await future updates to improve the few "lack of" features, I can't see me moving away just yet.
I personally do not agree with any of the issues listed and believe them to be false as far as useful experience. WP7 has been doing great for what I want and need since Mango and I actually have no plans to look at anything else. I use it for work as well and it fulfills it purpose and then some.
I have come from WM6 to Crackberry to this.
My family (4 of us) all have WP7 since VZW first released them and everyone is happy. I am the "IT" department for my family and we all came from RIMs and I have not had any "support" needs for the WP7 (same can not be said for RIM); it just works.
On a possessive note, as much as I grip and complain about WP 7; I have never had issues with IE 9 and find multitasking easy to use and don't see what people complain about. Twitter??? I personally don't use it on the phone nor the PC because it basically sucks. And about the display, well I see nothing wrong with it at all. There are so many other aspects of the phone that would have had made valid points for leaving WP which I will not bring up because I don't want to feed the troll/fanboys.
Been using it since Feb 2011. Am very happy with the platform and look forward to added functionality & features with Apollo.
I've not had any issues as he described. You can zoom in on maps. I've never seen that IE error. Sharing location is all over the place in WP and so is twitter sharing including pictures.
The resolution? Ok. Thats up to him if that is a platform killer. Can't argue with his preference on that.
Doesn't connect to people as well? Sorry I'm scratching my head here lol.
Apps running in background? Thats a preference as well, but I prefer the way MS has implemented it. When I was on Android it was a constant headache with stuff running my battery down when they shouldnt be running.
sinister1 said:
On a possessive note, as much as I grip and complain about WP 7; I have never had issues with IE 9 and find multitasking easy to use and don't see what people complain about. Twitter??? I personally don't use it on the phone nor the PC because it basically sucks. And about the display, well I see nothing wrong with it at all. There are so many other aspects of the phone that would have had made valid points for leaving WP which I will not bring up because I don't want to feed the troll/fanboys.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
THAT is such a change from your remaining posts through out the forum, thanks!
drupad2drupad said:
Are you planning on moving away from WP anytime soon though?
A centralized notification area is definitely needed - probably within the 'ME' tile?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No I'll stay with my LG Optimus 7 for some time. At some point I will upgrade and I will probably again chose a WP7 device, but before I upgrade I would like MS to provide an option to backup my LG Optimus 7 and transfer all the data to another phone. Even though most stuff is in the cloud, I have tree stars in every Angry Birds level and I don't want to loose that
But I agree with you that the notifications should be stored somewhere.
slimshady322 said:
No I'll stay with my LG Optimus 7 for some time. At some point I will upgrade and I will probably again chose a WP7 device, but before I upgrade I would like MS to provide an option to backup my LG Optimus 7 and transfer all the data to another phone. Even though most stuff is in the cloud, I have tree stars in every Angry Birds level and I don't want to loose that
But I agree with you that the notifications should be stored somewhere.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think your wish will come true with Apollo as a 'total' back up is scheduled to be introduced. You will be able to back up 'everything' - unlike Android full back ups like Titanium where game scores are not backed up and neither are progresses!
Probably Apollo is where WP will stop 'catching up' and start adding things
That reviewer must be on some kind of crack or something. I have not had issues with anything that he has mentioned and I have used WP since march 2011 and used all the mango betas. Only issue I have is with the disappearing keyboard and that you can't upload from the browser. I would also want a backup solution,Skype and integrated public transit directions (already found a semi-integrated solution) to be 100% satisfied.
13 month user, I didn't like WP for a week, but never put my SIM back in my HD2..that's all I'll say about that ...
Sent from The ACSyndicate Tower using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
11 months Mozart user here, since changing to WP, i had lots of free time to do my reading due to i spent less (actually almost none) time on tinkering or flashing my phone...
IMHO, I prefer the way MS integrated the "FAKE" multitasking method which I found it very suit my taste, and I can have total control on which apps I gave permission on background task, feel like I had total control of the phone (don't flame me because I know that some others had a different definition on Full Control of their device)
I find all of his accusations false except maybe 9. I think he means auto sharing location. There is some app i've seen peeps complain about because windows phone will only report your location automatically if it is in the foreground. From a security standpoint though, i'd be glad it doesn't but if you like that kind of app i guess that would be an issue.
The rest is BS. I've been using Windows phone since i got my surround for 180.00 off ebay (wasn't sure if i would like windows phone and my contract was up soon so i didn't want to waste my upgrade in case i didn't like it.) I used my upgrade to get a titan and my wife uses the surround to play games and use facebook. (she has a flip phone and didn't want to pay for data even though i swear to her i can shut the data off... i just got a purple case coming in from ebay so i may sway her )
i dont have any problems of them maybe the problem is the girl who tested DD
I have been using WP for a year. I still have my Nexus One that I used to use while travelling for Wifi hotspot and Navigation reasons. Mango and Navigon have resolved these issues. I still miss the notification tray/center and I sincerely hope WP gets it soon. Those who have used Android will vouch for me about importance of a good notification system.
Having said that, WP is my daily driver. The one thing that WP offers, that Android lacks, is the peace of mind. With Android, it was flash a ROM every week. Most of these ROM upgreades were not for features but for stability or improving some feature that google didn't integrate properly. Android reminds me of my WM days. Powerful but not a stable, cohesive experience.
I plan to stay with WP at least till beyond Apollo. I am curious to see how they integrate Windows 8, Xbox and WP8.
ive admitted only had my windows phone a week but after a serious play over the weekend when ive not been working - videos, photos, borwsing, messages etc.. you name it.
my only gripe is the volume/vibrate with no optin for silent and no vibrate.
Tother than that - coming from my HD2 which had been modded, my Titan seems very polished and smooth.
The article is BS, the only valid point is the screen resolution one.
[
my only gripe is the volume/vibrate with no optin for silent and no vibrate.
.[/QUOTE]
go to settings/sounds and ringtone/ set vibration to off
then on home screen you can toggle between ring and "silent"
pakure said:
my only gripe is the volume/vibrate with no optin for silent and no vibrate..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
go to settings/sounds and ringtone/ set vibration to off
then on home screen you can toggle between ring and "silent"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is true, but it is a far from optimal workaround. Changing that setting doesn't just affect silent mode, it affects both ring and silent mode. I think what Symondo is asking for is a way to conveniently toggle between ring+vibrate, vibrate-only, and complete silence without resorting to opening the settings app.