Develop Bugs

How can we support WP7 to make sure it succeds? ( and actually gets a version 2 even)

Ive showed my support by getting one myself, most, no, ALL people who have seen my phone are impressed with it. there are also tons of GOOD reviews for WP7 and the devices themselves have received good reviews....so what going wrong? anything we can do?

Open up the API so we can develop more useful applications for the phone!

From a uk perspective, there are 2 issues IMHO.
1) the marketing, not visible enough and not helped by sales staff in carrier shops and online not knowing about wp7 and/or actively selling against it. All the phone shops in my loca mall still have huge iPhone 4 banners in the window and that was launched months ago.
2) if anyone does get as far as thinking about getting a wp7, they come to a site like this to research it and are immediately greeted by loads of posts about wp7 being crap because you can't sync with outlook 1995 via a piece of string attached to a commodore PET running dos 1.0, and WP7 being crap cos you can't load custom roms etc.
I like wp7 and I want Microsoft to fill the gaps with the missing features, what concerns me is that if all the negativity results in poor sales, MS will have less incentive to spend money on the platform. We have to "evangelise" with positive posts on forums like this highlighting the many good features of the platform, and where we criticise, it should be constructive. I have used all the main mobile OS's, I think wp7 has the most promise and am proud to say I am a fan.

you are spot on! the UK marketing is EXTREEMLY poor and whats with 8GB?? how can we make MS take notice of whats really going on over here in the UK?

I havev16gb on my hd7, I don't use it all (only 4th at the mo).

go into t-mobile stores and tell the reps how much you like it. It seems like T-Mobile employees have been instructed to be anti-WP7. The 3 stores I went to to buy a case, screen protector, and the phone itself all seemed to bring up the problems with WM 6.5 when I was looking at the phones.
All of them were also surprised that I liked the phone alot and couldn't believe I used to have a nexus one and then a vibrant. When I bought the phone the sales rep kept trying to talk me out of it also. I've also seen plent of people posting the same comments about t-mobile here on this forum.

What are some creative apps that can be done quickly to fill in gaps?
I'd say one way to get some sustainability is to work with companies that currently have iphone/droid apps and offer services to help deliver a WP7 app - either through custom work for them directly or seeking out a new open source project/effort.
i've been communicating with NPR myself to get the framework for an open source npr app. If people go to npr.com and see a winodws phone app listed there they may feel a tad more comforatable that their phone is feature rich and relevent. Same could be said for other popular institutions that have apps available where there is no current wp7 branding

One of the things I find disheartening is the misunderstanding that 7 can't do something just because the 6.5 way to do that job can't be copied over. Case in point: MyPhone. There are plenty of threads where folk get riled up because they can't believe that MS could forget to make 7 compatible with MyPhone! What's even more disturbing is the lack of responses in those threads about how MyPhone is utterly obsolete now due to Live.
To reiterate what has been said already, those of us that have actually used 7 need to get out there a lot more and help answer questions and concerns, especially when they're just flat-out wrong or based on misunderstanding. If anything, that's what's gonna help with understanding of adoption of the platform.
As far as success goes, though, I don't really see any need for worry. MS is obviously expressing a serious desire to compete here, and is laying out the resources to do it right. They did it with the Xbox when folk thought they were crazy and couldn't possibly break into that market, and they're coming in fierce with 7 now.
At this point, we only need to be honest. Let it be known what you like and dislike, and help folk around you to make informed decisions.
Also, have lots of fun playing with the things. People respond well to information, but a smile is also very telling, and infectious.

FL5 said:
Case in point: MyPhone. There are plenty of threads where folk get riled up because they can't believe that MS could forget to make 7 compatible with MyPhone! What's even more disturbing is the lack of responses in those threads about how MyPhone is utterly obsolete now due to Live.
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That's not true. There's no document or text message backup with Live. Those are critical features that must be implemented to make it a real My Phone replacement.

jeffgeno said:
That's not true. There's no document or text message backup with Live. Those are critical features that must be implemented to make it a real My Phone replacement.
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I like how you dismissed everything pertinent in that post to pick out that one part to whinge about, managing to both miss the point entirely and not contribute to the topic.
That being said, I guess I need to look into how to back up SMS. Not something I usually worry about, as I view SMS as disposable data (and partly because winmo got me used to having to clear SMS to prevent lag. Not really relevant anymore, I suppose), but it might be handy info in case I need to answer a question.

Buy games and apps on the marketplace. If this phone is going to survive we need developers writing quality apps. When you do download an app/game rate it and leave comments. Even if the app/game is free let the developer know there's interest in it.

this thread is a repeat of before... but as i said before... the best way to get people into windows phone is to let them use yours. i've shown my phone to a lot of my friends and all of them really like it. a lot of them iPhone users. let them play with your phone, the messaging, email, even facebook app. it's a risk to you cause they could do stuff to your wall but in the end it shows them what it's like. sure, they're not rushing out to buy it now, but at least it's now in their sights and they can think whether they'll stick with the sea of icons, or have a river of them (jokes of course, river being the app list... come on MS implement serach...).

It's really up to MS and the hardware partners.
Case in point..the new Nexus phone for Android from Samsung. The prototype for this phone has been around for a while. Why wasn't this also the Samsung's WP7 offering? 16 GB storage and a sweet body.
Don't get me wrong, I love my Focus, but seeing that Nexus made me cuss a bit.
HD7 - screen issues. HTC surround - speakers are a gimmick and again, lousy screen - compared to the S-Amoled of the Focus. Kick ass hardware is a must.
MS needs to get on the ball and get updates out fast and regular. They have to keep WP7 users interested and invested. That means better communication with us. Let us know in no uncertain terms what is being worked on and it's progress.
If people are confident that MS will keep upgrading/updating the OS, they will jump on board.
Get those missing features into the OS. Roll out those performance enhancements - for God's sake fix the issues with MarketPlace! It's hard enough to be behind on features, MS also has to integrate stuff that's ahead of the competition.
Advertising - the ads for WP7 are not getting the job done. Granted, it's tricky to advertise a brand new OS that's suppose to get MS back in the game while the OS itself is behind the others in features, but there is a huge market out there that won't miss those features. Show the People and Photo hubs in action..show the FB integration in greater detail.
Of course, open up the APIs. I cannot fathom why this is seemingly not a priority.

WP7 suffers from the same issues as Zune did. If they don't open the API then WP7 will fall by the wayside just like Zune.

votum said:
WP7 suffers from the same issues as Zune did. If they don't open the API then WP7 will fall by the wayside just like Zune.
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Don't know what you're talking about but I love my Zune HD and use it daily.
As for Zune falling by the wayside, it's on Xbox and WP7. It's all around and it's somehow on the wayside somewhere? Be real.
As for the APIs, devs seem to be so lazy anyway, I doubt open APIs will bring about the AP revolution you think will happen.
Even offerings from MS have been half-hearted. A lot of APs really could have benefited from the Live Tile technology but for some reason, chose not to implement it.
Devs need to love or at least appear to love what they're doing if we want quality apps.
Apps done right are a joy on my HD7 and I do not regret buying this phone at all. It's just pleasant surprise after pleasant surprise with this OS and I expect the manufacturers of handsets to step up to the bar after they realize it's here to stay. MS will continue to invest heavily in mobile as it is the way of the future. We've only had WP7 for not even 2 months, give it time!

lekki said:
Don't know what you're talking about but I love my Zune HD and use it daily.
As for Zune falling by the wayside, it's on Xbox and WP7. It's all around and it's somehow on the wayside somewhere? Be real.
As for the APIs, devs seem to be so lazy anyway, I doubt open APIs will bring about the AP revolution you think will happen.
Even offerings from MS have been half-hearted. A lot of APs really could have benefited from the Live Tile technology but for some reason, chose not to implement it.
Devs need to love or at least appear to love what they're doing if we want quality apps.
Apps done right are a joy on my HD7 and I do not regret buying this phone at all. It's just pleasant surprise after pleasant surprise with this OS and I expect the manufacturers of handsets to step up to the bar after they realize it's here to stay. MS will continue to invest heavily in mobile as it is the way of the future. We've only had WP7 for not even 2 months, give it time!
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I dunno man,
ask 100 people if they have a Zune or an iPod and or use Zune or iTunes and see what the response is...

orangekid said:
I dunno man,
ask 100 people if they have a Zune or an iPod and or use Zune or iTunes and see what the response is...
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you have a point in that the market is flooded with iPod/iPhone which results in more people using iTunes (so it's a bit of a loaded question).
but yea, as good as the Zune is for those that have it, the marketing that Apple does is just a lot better. I think it was wise that MS move their Zune to windows phone. It is a really good peice of software and many find it better than iTunes (on Windows). But of course, if you have an iPhone (or i product) you're locked into using iTunes, as you are with windows phone. So this is why the numbers for iTunes are so high. If that wasn't the case, there would be far fewer people using iTunes that's for sure.

blahism said:
What are some creative apps that can be done quickly to fill in gaps?
I'd say one way to get some sustainability is to work with companies that currently have iphone/droid apps and offer services to help deliver a WP7 app - either through custom work for them directly or seeking out a new open source project/effort.
i've been communicating with NPR myself to get the framework for an open source npr app. If people go to npr.com and see a winodws phone app listed there they may feel a tad more comforatable that their phone is feature rich and relevent. Same could be said for other popular institutions that have apps available where there is no current wp7 branding
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there is a npr app in the marketplace. good reviews too.

WP7 is easy coding!!

Coding wars: iOS vs Android vs Windows Phone 7
Just saw this one getting RT on twitter. we need more discussions here. so i brought it over to see what you all thinks.
The gist of the competition is that the Windows Phone 7 trounced everyone. Whereas the iOS and Android groups had created one page of the app, the WP7 team created "...a mostly working application with most features implemented". In addition, the Androiders had problems with Compiz (a Linux window manager), which kept crashing.
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sadoway said:
Coding wars: iOS vs Android vs Windows Phone 7
Just saw this one getting RT on twitter. we need more discussions here. so i brought it over to see what you all thinks.
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I don't know why, but that set me in fits of laughter XD

Back when the WP7 SDK was still in beta Microsoft held a competition to see who could write the best app. The person who won wrote a streaming music application that he spent less than a day coding on with no prior WP7 experience. He said the same app with a few more features on it took him over 2 weeks to develop on android.

From everything I've been reading. I actually think wp7 sounds like a good platform for beginners. I used to do some coding in highschool. Nothing to advanced, but forgot most everything except maybe logical thinking. Just need a few days to research some resources. Been on xda for a couple years. Might be time to become a contributed
Sent from my LG Optimus 7

I'd prefer World War 3 being a Coding war. quick and painless.

To bad the wp7 user base can't be considered a nation yet.

WP7's design/api is very good for consuming data, this is why the majority of apps are just "lists of something", however it's not good at anything else...

id have to argue that. ive had mine for a week. sure some of the apps are super simple "lists"
but there are a handfull of other apps that the UI is not even close to metro and completely custom. and there are a bunch of games already that are more than simple puzzle games, doodle. like the iphone. im personally really bored with puzzle games, bejewled exluded because i love that game.
it really is a matter of developers making the software. its coming. i had android when it first came out. and aside from the apps that came from the google contest. if was ****. and honestly. most of the apps on android are **** still. so much spam apps. like 200 are just flags. they have so many repative apps that just have maybe one tiny thing changed. where all of those 200 flag apps. could be 1. its an imflated app system. demo and full apps. microsoft was smart where these demo and full apps are typicaly concidered 1 app.
who cares about how many apps each OS has. android is mega inflated and not at all realistic. microsft WILL have a "smaller" number. simoply because demo and full apps are the same.
honestly. how many apps do u scroll thru till you find one you download? 3? 11? 157?
WP7 barely has ANY apps yet. so of course the first ones out of the gate are going to be simple lists. give it 3 months at least. there will be ports of everyones favourits from other platforms. and probably a few new ones that people will drool over wp7.
not a fan with the quick judgments on this platform. i follow my phone closely, the trends, yeah microsoft does have alot of work ahead of them. but it has to start somewhere.
nobody knew about android when it came out. Microsoft does have a larger base. they just need to win everyone back. and IMO it wont be that hard once you use the platform for a couple hours.
I have pc/mac/android/iphone/ipad/WP7
each have there advantages. and not even close to the end of the game for WP7. they really are just getting warmed up.
sorry. went on a rant

though i agree with sadoway, this is also evident in windows phone marketplace (as is iTunes). You can't really get around it unless they really do enforce it's use. Though in some cases I wish they did. I saw like 20 apps a few days ago all from the same company, with the same logo, just different title. I didn't even bother to see what it was, but yea, it's existant in windows phone as well.

im just happy to see that at least the "trial" button. it makes market a bit user friendly. it will cut down on the amount of apps they say they have... (for the people who actualy care but dont know what it means) imo its just a number
its like saying u have 6gb or ram on a winxp computer. most of it is useless anyways, it just sounds impressive when its not.

Once you're doing something else than hammering simple data into lists, it'll show whether you can code your way out of a wet paper bag or not.
Certain limitations in .NET like lack of union structures or pointers (pinning objects will automatically fail certification, due to unsafe code) requires people to get creative to squeeze performance out of algorithms.

Opinions on the general state of WP7 market

So here we are - Windows Phone 7 has been around for a (short) while now, and the amount of apps has grown to a significant level. Obviously the marketplace isn't as extensive as on iOS or Android just yet, but we're getting there.
Now what I'm wondering is, what do you think about the current state of the market?
Do you think there are enough free apps? Or aren't they that important, because of the trials available?
And do you think that the general quality of the apps is higher than on other platforms, or not? And so on.
I'm really interested in your experiences so far, and I think many others are too.
So please, describe how you feel about the apps on this new platform!

I'm personally very satisfied based on what's available to the developers. It would be unfair to judge them based on factors that are out of their control... But as far as what the API allows, I'm pleased, especially in the games department. I would like better alarm applications and more live tiles, but all of that will come in due time. The trial ability is the best part of the whole marketplace experience.

I don't like the feel of the Market place. I went from and HD2 to an HD7. I use the phone for both work and play. I do a lot of both. As far as apps for work it is really amazing. What ever it is i want to do i can find an app that works well and improve my productivity. As far as apps for play not so much. the I.M. software is weak. I do love the Pro Football Weekly app. I definitely feel there is a lot of room for improvement.

Ive foud the wp7 market to be much better than the android market but obviously not up to par with iOS. There is of course a bunch of garbage in all 3 but i dont feel that wp7 has as much useless crap as android. I want to say i have no problem with android or iOS on a whole. Just stating my opinion on the markets.

as of right now I'd say the market is a mess, but I fully expect it to get better:
1. search is absurd: if I search for an app, I also get a list of songs, playlists, etc; rumored to be fixed in first update
2. live tile inconsistency: some work all the time, so won't work at all, some stop working for weeks; I assume this is a developer-driven problem and will get better over time, though i'm a bit concerned with the 15 live tile limit, as i'm already over the limit
3. trials: very happy with this feature, I have tried and purchased many apps I never would have looked at if they were 1.99 with no trial
4. quality: hit and miss, as with android and iOS markets; I suspect the developers are a bit hamstrung with some of the limitations of wp7 at the moment
5. stability: app store crashes, lockups, etc are a bit frustrating, but again I assume that will be fixed in an upcoming update
(keep in mind, I'm not a dev, these are the views of a consumer)

I like what is available now. Most of the apps I tried had very good quality with a very nice use of the Metro UI.
I hate that some apps are called "X for free", you know straightaway these are ports from another OS. Just give your app a damn name and put it in the Free section .
I also hate apps that are optimised for the US and don't work or crash constantly in Europe.
Overall it's progressing well, I'm hoping for quick must have apps like Amazon, Paypal, Live Messenger (Come one Microsoft, the iPhone has the best Messenger app around and you made it!) or TV Guide.
Also waiting for must have games we all know but with Live enabled (Words with Friends, Angry Birds, Cut the rope, Game devs story...).
By the summer it should be an important market, the updates just need to be up to par.

I think it sucks and it's terrible. The browser is very slow and either crashes, freezes or worse ends up rebooting the phone after a while. The browsing experience is the worst, I hardly browse anymore now.. because most of the time I end up waiting and waiting until I just leave before it crashes or locks up.
As far as applications, there still aren't any major hitters on the market yet apart from games, no decent instant messaging app really hurts, very few productivity apps compared to the blackberry and 90% of the time the new apps are a complete waste of time (made worse by the horrible market place browser).
There are some good apps there though but again the browser needs a update very badly.

There's no point having more vocal opinions about the Marketplace app, everyone knows it's broken, Microsoft included. We're just waiting for an update.
I only use the Zune client and Bing Visual Search to browse the apps now, I don't see why I would use the phone app when I know it's broken.
The OP is asking about the apps and games themselves and that's what we should comment on really.

I think its just decent Could be better, but what can u expect from 1.0!?
Im satisfied many bugs are getting fixed, and developers are busy. Would be more satisfied if MS made an offer on RIM, soo WP7 would get more media-attention/techinfo etc and grows bigger. More users --> More attractive for Developers. But Microsoft will have their reasons
Like now Appaloosa is cancelled because of the high cost vs expected return. If WP7 was bigger, developers can invest more because of a higher expected return. Would be awesome

EDIT: Thread reopened and will be moved to the appropriate section.
(It is nice to see someone pay attention and ask politely.)
~~Tito~~

Peew971 said:
There's no point having more vocal opinions about the Marketplace app, everyone knows it's broken, Microsoft included. We're just waiting for an update.
[snip]
The OP is asking about the apps and games themselves and that's what we should comment on really.
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Thanks, that is what interests me most.
I'm slightly surprised by the spread in positive and negative replies (and votes in the poll). It's roughly 50/50, with a slight advantage to the positive experiences.
This surprises me so much because the apps I've seen trough blogs like PocketNow, Engadget, Gizmodo and WMPoweruser looked pretty awesome, and I could only think of one thing I was missing: a mobile app called 'Reisplanner Xtra' for the trains in the Netherlands (currently available on WM, Android and iOS). This is a very specific app only useful to Dutch users, so I kinda blindly expected that most people could find what they need.
Also I'm somewhat shocked that there is no good Live Messenger app available on their own platform. Luckily, this is something we can be sure of that it's bound to improve. Maybe they're waiting for the right API's to be released
Jokes aside, which apps would you like to see more? I see people mentioning IM applications (among others) not only in this thread - but what else do you think is missing?

I said that I'm satisfied but it's nothing special.
Why I'm satisfied:
rapid growth - the selection is great considering how long it's existed
decent quality apps - overall, the apps look decent. I guess the standardized design language has made it easy
big name apps - a lot of the big names are on board already
XBOX LIVE is actually pretty cool. Even though you can't play in real time vs XBOX friends yet.
Why it's not special... yet:
Search is still messy - It needs search filters. Fortunately, it's one of the things being fixed in the first update.
app store size - while a somewhat unfair criticism, it still lacks much of a selection of high quality apps. But at this rate of growth, that criticism will go away in no time.
Still a few bugs - unable to update some apps in Trial mode. crashing back to main screen. etc..

I am satisfied for the most part and although it is not up to level with iOS (obviously, no operating system is up to iOS par and I don't expect that to change), the quality of the apps is really good. The search can be a little over the place, but I like how you can trial some apps. I have probably downloaded more apps on WP7 than Android.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/216954/groupon_discount_doesnt_bode_well_for_windows_phone_7.html
Not selling well?

Isnt that usual marketing?
In Germany they are doing pretty much marketing. MS is touring through many universities presenting shows of a known comedian and of course advertising wp7 really big.
Sent from my HTC Mozart using Board Express

No mention of WP7, but lack of apps not a weak point

It has been another extraordinary year for technology products, with companies trying to gain the upper hand in an evolving market.
Smartphones, e-readers, apps and tablets have all been vying for our attention.
Rory Cellan-Jones reviews the gadgets that made waves in 2011, with bloggers Stuart Miles of Pocket-lint and Kat Hannaford of Gizmodo UK, at London's Olympic Park.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16309042
She said, she only uses about 3 apps on any single day. Windows has nearly 75,000 now! - Just a thought.
Please don't flame this!

But the speed at which new apps are being published.. marketplace is sure going the good way

drupad2drupad said:
It has been another extraordinary year for technology products, with companies trying to gain the upper hand in an evolving market.
Smartphones, e-readers, apps and tablets have all been vying for our attention.
Rory Cellan-Jones reviews the gadgets that made waves in 2011, with bloggers Stuart Miles of Pocket-lint and Kat Hannaford of Gizmodo UK, at London's Olympic Park.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16309042
She said, she only uses about 3 apps on any single day. Windows has nearly 75,000 now! - Just a thought.
Please don't flame this!
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i'm not flaming... your article has no mention of wp7 at all (as you stated), and that puts wp7's presence in perspective for calendar year 2011. A quick search of the comments also showed no references to "wp7" for me. Maybe the fans haven't woken up yet for commenting, or don't care about the 'year in review' or overview, if you will.
A more focused user-based collective opinion about wp7's success or lack of it via adoption numbers is on slashdot, this morning:
http://mobile.slashdot.org/story/11...el-on-why-windows-phone-still-hasnt-taken-off
there are the usual trolls and fans, but the consensus is what we've all seen debated here on xda before. give the comments a read after the 'article' and you may get some more insight as to why there was no mention of wp7 in your linked article.
happy early new year !

To be fair, he said "no mention of WP7".

ohgood said:
i'm not flaming... your article has no mention of wp7 at all (as you stated), and that puts wp7's presence in perspective for calendar year 2011. A quick search of the comments also showed no references to "wp7" for me. Maybe the fans haven't woken up yet for commenting, or don't care about the 'year in review' or overview, if you will.
A more focused user-based collective opinion about wp7's success or lack of it via adoption numbers is on slashdot, this morning:
http://mobile.slashdot.org/story/11...el-on-why-windows-phone-still-hasnt-taken-off
there are the usual trolls and fans, but the consensus is what we've all seen debated here on xda before. give the comments a read after the 'article' and you may get some more insight as to why there was no mention of wp7 in your linked article.
happy early new year !
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vetvito said:
To be fair, he said "no mention of WP7".
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LOL why did I just know you guys will comment
Yeah, the only reason to share the video was to show that even though they accept the fact or millions of apps on different platforms, they do acknowledge like most of us that daily we only need 3 apps or so. That is what I mentioned somewhere else in the forum saying - after I moved from android, I thought with only a few thousand apps I will never find apps I used on android, but to my surprise I found everything apart from SMSbackup+ and Titanium back up. But turns out we dont have back up facility yet and hence no apps of that kind. Again my 'need' of app on day to day basis was very little so I might have found the transition easier.

amritpal2489 said:
But the speed at which new apps are being published.. marketplace is sure going the good way
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this i feel is also their downfall, most apps are crap. there is like 25 kama sutra apps, but only 2 google talk apps...
how many HD babe apps does one market place need anyhow?

The quality of apps is an issue though. My nephews got an ipod touchand frankly i was shocked how lame the games on windows phone were compared to ios ones. I think developers need to concentrate on making quality apps.

drupad2drupad said:
Windows has nearly 75,000 now! - Just a thought.
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You keep saying this, but it is simply not true. WP7 just passed the 45000 app mark a couple of weeks ago. And, depending on which site you query, the current total is somewhere between 47000 and 50000.

RoboDad said:
You keep saying this, but it is simply not true. WP7 just passed the 45000 app mark a couple of weeks ago. And, depending on which site you query, the current total is somewhere between 47000 and 50000.
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Lol sorry I keep doing that I know! I think it follows some tweet prediction when it hit 40,000 in November saying with Lumia's launch around end of Dec-early weeks of Jan it will steep to 75,000 (speculation, I know!). But again I think pocketnow tweeted recently of it crossing 50,000 mark this month? Not sure :s

i would rather have 500 QUALITY apps over the 50,000 HD Babes and kama sutra apps that the marketplace now has.
devs are waay too interested in making a quick buck with tons of low quality simpleton apps that took them 1 day to develop that they throw on the market for 99cents. when they could spend some time on making 1 really good app and selling it for $4.99 and they would probably make a lot more money. but instead, they are just looking for a quick buck.
huge problem with windows marketplace. they need to do some app house cleaning instead of just inviting anyone with $99 to put whatever app they want on the market. sure it drives up app numbers, but seriously attracts crappy apps.
look how the itunes app store was. you had to apply for an sdk license, only so many were given out and apps had to be approved. they still had a huge increase in app numbers, but the apps were a lot better quality.

I think it's not a number of apps which is the problem
It's the lack of important ones.
Skype, Opera, Google.... To name just a few.

I'm not sure I understand what makes these big names make apps for certain platforms? Is it solely market shares?

drupad2drupad said:
I'm not sure I understand what makes these big names make apps for certain platforms? Is it solely market shares?
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And quality.

doministry said:
And quality.
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quality of what?

drupad2drupad said:
quality of what?
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I think I misunderstood your previous answer.
I think those big names make apps for the platforms which they perceive as successful and profit making plus they receive all the needed dev tools.
And reach agreements..

svtfmook said:
look how the itunes app store was. you had to apply for an sdk license, only so many were given out and apps had to be approved. they still had a huge increase in app numbers, but the apps were a lot better quality.
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JFYI, WP's developers need to pay an annual fees of 99 USD to be able to submit apps to marketplace, and MS DID make some checking before the apps approved.
And I believe that either Android market or iOS appstore had the same problems with thousands (or maybe millions) of crapwares and only hundred (to thousands) of quality apps. I think you should see the whole picture by refering the ratio of good apps vs bad/crapwares then you might be able to figure out that WP is actually doing quite OK for now.
And maybe my statement is wrong because I'm not some kind of app whore (no offense means).
Cheers.

Anyone seen NBA game time? This is really pushing it, and very frustrating... :/

Lack of apps is a huge weakpoint for many people. I don't care what people say about "quality" being the issue. Most people don't even KNOW what quality even means and they use their slow Facebook and Twitter apps anyway. It's simply the lack of choices involved. If there was simply an app for nearly everything people use, people would happily switch, regardless of app quality. Once people start owning the devices and complain about quality, THEN you'll see the quality go up.
The biggest issues keeping WP down are the lack of marketing here in the US, the lack of quality handsets, and the lack of API's available to developers, who would happily make apps for a platform like Windows.

MrGaius said:
Lack of apps is a huge weakpoint for many people. I don't care what people say about "quality" being the issue. Most people don't even KNOW what quality even means and they use their slow Facebook and Twitter apps anyway. It's simply the lack of choices involved. If there was simply an app for nearly everything people use, people would happily switch, regardless of app quality. Once people start owning the devices and complain about quality, THEN you'll see the quality go up.
The biggest issues keeping WP down are the lack of marketing here in the US, the lack of quality handsets, and the lack of API's available to developers, who would happily make apps for a platform like Windows.
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There is such a discrepency with opinions about wp7. One side says they don't need apps, because wp7 has them all at the core. The other side says apps are needed and will come if/when the platform comes mainstream... but its often the same people saying both.
I've seen wp7 commercials on tv, the internet, stores, billboards, even flashing jumbotron-like LED signs on the way home from work. What I haven't seen is interest from folks. The occasional person using a wp7/zune device in the wild is so rare.

In my opinion WP7 doesn't only need apps. It sure does, but there's way more than that. Since it's a Microsoft product, WP7 should tie in deeper Windows 7, XBox, Skydrive and such. WP7 has to have more "uniqueness" than the UI.

Lets talk... Why are there so many lackluster apps on the marketplace?

I was recently pondering this question of "Why are there so many lackluster apps on the marketplace?" while I was looking into improvements for my app.
It really does seem that there are only a hundred or so, really inspiring Metro based apps on the WP7 marketplace, and Im not sure why. Even many of the developers who are active with their apps have truly un-inspiring visual apps, or downright stripped functionality. Im not sure why, granted you see a similar pattern with Android, which from what I can tell is much worse, but WHY? These developers are just one-off releasing apps, they are most commonly very active.
Just thought I would see if anyone had any input on this.

Its like that on all market places. Did you think there was over 500,000 aw inspiring apps?
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2

How many things
I have pondered the high number of apps for quite some time as well, but I approached it from another angle:
Think about it like this: How many different things can you possibly do with a smartphone? Well, quite a lot, obviously, but interestingly as soon as I start to enumerate, I run into problems to continue pretty soon. Maybe I can name 100 different things to "do" with a smartphone.
Now, say I forget a lot of things, and other people do other things than me anyway, and there will be new things that nobody has thought of so far, so let's take this times 10 and proclaim that you can use a smartphone for a full one thousand different things. (I would really love to see this list.)
If you cover each thing with, say, 10 different apps, so people have choice and can take the app the like, and there is healthy competition, we arrive a grand total number of 10'000 apps that make sense - ever. Anything beyond that is simply too much.
If you think 1'000 things to do with your smartphone is way too low I would challenge you to list 1'000 things that you do in your daily life, overall and in general, with your smartphone or otherwise - our lives are quite interesting, but there are limits of what we all do.
Ok, now let's be generous and throw in 50'000 different games which are not subject of things that must make sense, after all you can just invent and invent new variants of games.
That absolute upper limit of 60'000 apps or so is pretty low compared with the contents of the app stores, isn't it?

^ it is low, but you have to add in the different region apps too, different languages, and all of their variations. Thus the huge number of apps.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2

rbrunner7 said:
I have pondered the high number of apps for quite some time as well, but I approached it from another angle:
Think about it like this: How many different things can you possibly do with a smartphone? Well, quite a lot, obviously, but interestingly as soon as I start to enumerate, I run into problems to continue pretty soon. Maybe I can name 100 different things to "do" with a smartphone.
Now, say I forget a lot of things, and other people do other things than me anyway, and there will be new things that nobody has thought of so far, so let's take this times 10 and proclaim that you can use a smartphone for a full one thousand different things. (I would really love to see this list.)
If you cover each thing with, say, 10 different apps, so people have choice and can take the app the like, and there is healthy competition, we arrive a grand total number of 10'000 apps that make sense - ever. Anything beyond that is simply too much.
If you think 1'000 things to do with your smartphone is way too low I would challenge you to list 1'000 things that you do in your daily life, overall and in general, with your smartphone or otherwise - our lives are quite interesting, but there are limits of what we all do.
Ok, now let's be generous and throw in 50'000 different games which are not subject of things that must make sense, after all you can just invent and invent new variants of games.
That absolute upper limit of 60'000 apps or so is pretty low compared with the contents of the app stores, isn't it?
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1:Manage your bank account....how many different banks are out there.
2:Follow your local news....how many tv station, radio station, newspapers.
3:Follow your favorite sports team...how many teams out there.
4:Manage you reservations....for every hotel, rental car, airline.
5:Stream video....from every network, internet service, cable/satellite provider, your own network at home.
Now, how many tens of thousands of apps would it take just to cover those 5 functions that you can do with your smartphone?

Millions of apps
66stang351 said:
Now, how many tens of thousands of apps would it take just to cover those 5 functions that you can do with your smartphone?
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Yeah, I know, let me guestimate that there are maybe 10'000 large cities on this planet. Then you have 10'000 "Map of City x" apps, plus another 10'000 "Public Transport Time Table for City x", and again 10'000 "Coming Events in City x", and on and on.
Of course this brings up all kinds of questions, e.g. whether it really makes sense to turn all these things into an app where a website would perfectly do, but anyway, I concede you have a point.
I developped the habit to check all the new apps that appear in the Marketplace daily, and of course I see many apps of this type appear, but in my estimate at least half of the apps are just "garbage".
And what really makes me sad: Usually many days pass until I find a new app that really surprises me, an app with a real idea if you know what I mean, where somebody found something new - a rare gem of creativity. All that time spent building apps, what must amount to man centuries even, and then this meager result - it's a shame.

It's a growing thing. When Android and iOS were first released, there weren't many lackluster applications for awhile. Currently, developers are just trying to get everything on Windows Phone 7 that is already on Android and iOS...to include tools, games, instant messaging platforms, etc. Once they've caught up, then the developers will start using creativity.
It's not really a problem, just give it time

PoorCollegeGuy said:
It's a growing thing. When Android and iOS were first released, there weren't many lackluster applications for awhile. Currently, developers are just trying to get everything on Windows Phone 7 that is already on Android and iOS...to include tools, games, instant messaging platforms, etc. Once they've caught up, then the developers will start using creativity.
It's not really a problem, just give it time
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Don't you think its due to lack of API restricted by MS that not want to allow developer to work on!!

Just me maybe but i hardly even look at the market anymore.
Sent from my LG-P920 using xda premium

Well I rather lackluster apps than the other side of things shown here. Kind of explains why if you do not have one of the really popular Android phones why you may see more force closes than someone holding a SGS2.

taruian said:
Don't you think its due to lack of API restricted by MS that not want to allow developer to work on!!
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I totally agree with the API restrictions. It has kept me from making an app i really want to but on the other hand I as a developer feel that having eye candy in your app is a must. My specific type of apps for WP7 make the Android and iPhone users jealous as they dont have eye candy apps in that genre in their marketplaces. Also a lot of devs try to push many apps out for the money. Like if you include ads in your apps. The more apps the revenue you can earn as its a numbers game. So i think they rush on the design part.

vetvito said:
Its like that on all market places. Did you think there was over 500,000 aw inspiring apps?
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^This. Is there any objective evidence the amount of dross in the MSFT app store is any more than any other OS' app store?
People like to see their name in lights. It's as simple as that. Someone barely cobbles together an app with their meager programing skills and uploads it just to see their name in the app store.

sitizenx said:
^This. Is there any objective evidence the amount of dross in the MSFT app store is any more than any other OS' app store?
People like to see their name in lights. It's as simple as that. Someone barely cobbles together an app with their meager programing skills and uploads it just to see their name in the app store.
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Apple apply quality control on submitted apps. They will reject any apps that are buggy, crash or which don't serve a useful purpose. They are notoriously strict, causing quite a few famous publishing issues.
Mean while, Microsoft also have a submission possess, but not sure what it actually does? I remember reading on here about as developer that submitted 6 WP7 apps, that all just displayed a block on screen (each app was a different colour) and they all got published. A paid appstore should be no place for test apps; It's almost like MS don't care, and just want to boost their numbers..
Android market has no QA; anyone can submit anything. Most wild-west like app-store, but stuff doesn't get pulled off the store randomly like the above two.

^ you're joking about Apples QC right? That has got to be joke of the day.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2

whodisname said:
Just me maybe but i hardly even look at the market anymore.
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pretty the same here. For quite some time now I have found all the apps I need and I only look for new ones (or alternatives f.e. different twitter apps etc.) very rarely, maybe when "super new, awesome app blabla" is featured on some news website.
The majority of apps I use work fine and aren't "lackluster". Just 3 or 4 I wish they would make improvements/alternative app.
Of course there are many not so good apps in the marketplace but thats a problem of every device, not even only phones. just look how much crappy software or games are available for pc.