Develop Bugs

Dev. Opinions Wanted: Is the Hero *actually* a good candidate for Eclair

This is a question for all, but primarily for the devs who have been working with the various Android 2.1 builds.
I have been silently playing with many of the Android 2.1 flavours offered by the various developers posting here at XDA, and have been suitably impressed with all they have managed to accomplish, especially in the absence of the kernel source.
That said, most of the 2.1 ROMS are lacking in some manner (GPS tweaks required, battery life, bluetooth on calls, etc.) and all are slower than the optimized Cupcake ROMS (e.g. the MoDaCo ROMS).
I understand that the performance of the 2.1 ROMS is hampered in large part to the lack of the kernel source but the consistent speed discrepancy between Eclair and Cupcake leads me to the question at hand:
Even if the kernel source were available, does the Hero actually have the horsepower to run Eclair and offer performance similar to Cupcake? Would those of us who want similar performance be best advised to look at devices with a little more under the hood (Nexus One, Desire, etc)?
Devs, what do you think?

The fact of the matter is a 2.1 rom (official) is in development it has been announced and the fact there has been leaks in the CDMA hero shows that it does really exist.
If its being built for the hero then it will work.
Kernel sources will help solve a number of issues we are currently facing in the "custom" roms.
Every phone can do things differently for example 2.1 has live wallpaper support but we will never see this in any official rom as it will not work perfectly on the hero.
With every new leak we are getting closer and closer to what an "official" gsm hero rom will be like, but it will never be the same as for example a desire 2.1 rom.

I'm no dev but if the kernel source for 2.1 was released devs would be able to overclock the Hero so 2.1 ROMs would run much smoother. Also if you look at the Hero compared to its successor (the Legend) the most significant difference is the processor 528 MHz on the Hero and 600 MHz on the Legend. So I personally don't see why the Hero shouldn't get a 2.1+ ROM.

Without any doubt, YES, it does have enough power to run Android 2.1.
From what I have experienced, Eclair 2.1 WITHOUT HTC Sense works as fast as the original 1.5. If it runs like that now, I believe it will go better with an optimized kernel - when the sources will be available. As for the overclock (I would like to add that for me OC is a very important hobby), I don't see the reason why you would like to OC a mobile phone. Overclocking would make battery life go even faster than before, and to charge the Hero everyday... I don't think many of us want something like that.
What I think is the best way to improve a mobile phone performance, considering it runs Android, is to improve the software, not the hardware. After all, it's Linux.

Eclair runs on G1 better than Hero !!
even though Hero is more powerful !!
it's a Kernel and drivers issue
anyway, the update delay probably because of 2.2 (Froyo). it'll be released in May after all..
HTC didn't say that but it'll be dump (even retarded) to give us 2.1 after 2.2 is released !!

RaduG said:
Without any doubt, YES, it does have enough power to run Android 2.1.
From what I have experienced, Eclair 2.1 WITHOUT HTC Sense works as fast as the original 1.5. If it runs like that now, I believe it will go better with an optimized kernel - when the sources will be available. As for the overclock (I would like to add that for me OC is a very important hobby), I don't see the reason why you would like to OC a mobile phone. Overclocking would make battery life go even faster than before, and to charge the Hero everyday... I don't think many of us want something like that.
What I think is the best way to improve a mobile phone performance, considering it runs Android, is to improve the software, not the hardware. After all, it's Linux.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I already have to charge my phone everyday becaue I am always playing witht it or text or on the internet... and right now im running Kimera 1.6 Overclocked and it feels as if I get the same if not similar battery life.

The Hero shouldn't be doubted when it comes to being able to run 2.1, as previously mentioned its the other things like live wallpapers that were not developed for this type of CPU.
Whats the crack with the dream running it? did HTC release the sources for the kernel? or just plain ole group hacking?

Without any doubt, YES, it does have enough power to run Android 2.1.
From what I have experienced, Eclair 2.1 WITHOUT HTC Sense works as fast as the
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I already have to charge my phone everyday becaue I am always playing witht it or text or on the internet... and right now im running Kimera 1.6 Overclocked and it feels as if I get the same if not similar battery life.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same here. The Kimera 1.6 overclocked ROM is amazing. I've been using it for a few days now, and I have to agree the battery life is almost identical to stock 1.5 in my opinion.
Sent from my HTC Hero using the XDA mobile application powered by Tapatalk

Android 2.2 on TP2?

Does TP2 meet ANDROID 2.2's hardware requirements?

Nope. most devices that would get a froyo update have snapdragons under the hood something our rhodiums dont have

ive read in several places and posts frm owners that the FROYO is overhyped. or not really all that much different frm the previous releases. i know its supposedly alot faster with the JIT Compiling. i guess thats the main difference and the fact that the new flash player10 wrks great with it. people sleeping on Rhodium. its always like that with new devices. they get upgraded processors. there are ways around that, which i hope someone figures out soon ;-) just like with cars, we can tweak it to at least get closer to Snapdragon speeds.

overclocking the processer or tweaking froyo

rsmith675 said:
overclocking the processer or tweaking froyo
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well i meant overclocking the processor to where its faster and still stable. tweaking could probaly also be done on the software(FROYO) side of things. if older phones with even less processing power can port Android, then we can get the Froyo. i know its not that simple but it can be done. just depends on how much wrk someone is willing to put in on it. like for instance, i edited my startup txt to overclock my processor in the android build. im at 633MHz. stock max processor speed in windows mobile is like 528MHz. so with that overclock alone, increased the horsepower..lol, by more thn a hundred. now my live wallpapers fly across the screen instead of stuttering. i have virtually no lag now. plus i could even go up somemore on the overclocking. . it does have a drawbck. if i put the phone to sleep, it wont wake up..lmfao . who cares, just dont put the phone to sleep then. Android on Rhodium is more of a research and testing things out, at least for me. im luvin it so far, so i cant complain about what its missing at the moment. Im grateful for what wrks at the moment. this is the best cab by far that ive ever downloaded, and its free. u cant beat that. basically a free Android OS.

rsmith675 said:
Nope. most devices that would get a froyo update have snapdragons under the hood something our rhodiums dont have
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
bull****.
there is no such "requirement" for froyo.
furthermore, TP2 never had an official android release to have an official denial that it will ever be ported.
i'm sure devs are already looking at porting froyo to TP2 and other phones.

Best/easiest case solution is to backport some of the parts of compatible Froyo into the TP2 AOSP Eclair build. This has been a common practice in custom roms. There's already G1 roms with Froyo partially working. There's no reason not to have at least some Froyo features baked into TP2 Eclair.

At this point, whats the use of moving on to Froyo on the TP2? We'll migrate just to restart back to a point where nothing works? Backport some parts of Froyo onto Eclair and beef up Eclair to a point where the major issues are resolved.
<rant>
Also, there needs to be more people that have a better working knowledge of Android/linux than just the devs. Fixes, hacks, mods all come from a community effort. Not enough information is shared on this forum, and it comes at the cost of progression for our devices.
</rant>

cashless said:
There's no reason not to have at least some Froyo features baked into TP2 Eclair.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so do it. talking is easy, actually doing takes skills.

In theory 2.2 should run better on the rhodium than 2.1 ever has now that it has a huge upgrade to the Dalvik vm JIT, meaning this makes much better use of the processor, this is proven in the current builds on the nexus one. I agree that we would essentially be starting over as far as useability but the developers have already done the ground work so a full upgrade to 2.2 will not take as long as the first porting of android. So if you all just want to sit back and be happy with what you have than go ahead, but in my opinion 2.2 would be a very valuable upgrade as i'm sure that 2.3 and beyond will be.

No, It can be done on every Android Phone, so also the TP2 would be able (if you look at the specs) to run Android 2.2.
http://www.androidpolice.com/2010/0...t-even-the-g1-google-io-blitz-coverage-day-1/
And it will make the devices faster So I think there is a possability. I hope the android devs for TP2 will give it a try

Yes it can, but it will take a lot of work

rsmith675 said:
Nope. most devices that would get a froyo update have snapdragons under the hood something our rhodiums dont have
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HTC will release official froyo rom for HERO and later devices, TP2 has same hardware installed as HERO
but the key problem is drivers, HERO's screen solution is lower than TP2, so HERO have different GPU driver to TP2
i hope hackers will give us some good idea..hah

I'm ready.. been duel booting android and I have to say I like it.. Didn't think I would but I do. It's faster and easy to use

03hdfatboy said:
I'm ready.. been duel booting android and I have to say I like it.. Didn't think I would but I do. It's faster and easy to use
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
how did you do that?
i tried flash dual boot rom which found in TP2 CDMA, but it is always mess up during first time loading

mxxcon said:
so do it. talking is easy, actually doing takes skills.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is actually easy, I've done it and pretty much anyone can do it with simple common sense on any native Android phone. Making your very personal use ROM with backported parts is really common. It doesn't actually take that much skill because all you're doing is replacing (sometimes) compatible parts and modifying the init.rc and flashing in recovery for the most part.

bestfan said:
how did you do that?
i tried flash dual boot rom which found in TP2 CDMA, but it is always mess up during first time loading
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you using the .cab or .rar, I never got the .cab to work, the .rar works perfectly everytime and I do quite of bit of "flashing".

I am willing to stick with 2.1 for the long haul until everything is working.

seeing as 2.2 is supposed to have some drastic changes i think 2.1 is going to be the final for most things, 2.2 codebase while being similar has been drastically enhanced (in some areas)...
I myself cannot wait till the TP2 gets Android 2.2+ (and the COMPLETE ability to boot into android without having to load ANY WM aspects)

Cm6.1 nightlies?

does anyone know if they are stopping the nightlies and working on cm7? there haven't been any new ones for any model since the 17th

That's why they have stopped them. Cyanogen said that they are all working hard on Gingerbread, so it's only logical that they would stop all work on Froyo

do you think there's any more froyese to be made or is that a moot point as everything is just dumped into gingerbread? Especially now that drivers are completely different with gb?
Also I reckon once the full base is laid people will bring GB features back into froyo for the dream and other smaller devices. Or a mosh.
vision

androidcues said:
do you think there's any more froyese to be made or is that a moot point as everything is just dumped into gingerbread? Especially now that drivers are completely different with gb?
Also I reckon once the full base is laid people will bring GB features back into froyo for the dream and other smaller devices. Or a mosh.
vision
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sure most devs there will still be small updates being made to the current ROMs already out, like Enom for example. He usually releases stock ROMs with some modifications or themes, for the most part. I don't see him releasing a GB rom until the official rolls out.
Keep in mind Sense ROMs don't even factor into this. They are two different things.
Cyanogen on the other hand, won't make another update to CM6, at least for the G2 IMO. He always pushes to have the greatest and latest on our phones, hence his push for GB.
As to you mentioning people porting over features to Froyo, that may very well be true, but for the most part, I don't think much of that will happen. The Android reps from Google said that any phone that officially runs Froyo now, will run better on GB. I can only deduce that phones will run better running 2.3.
Now, while the G1 did not see a 2.2 update due to hardware requirements, the MT3G did see an official release, which is for the most part a G1 with more internal memory and lacks a keyboard. I hope that this will bring a great improvement to the device speed, and knowing Cyanogen, he will for sure bring it over to the G1.
Just my 2 cents.

tazz9690 said:
Cyanogen on the other hand, won't make another update to CM6, at least for the G2 IMO. He always pushes to have the greatest and latest on our phones, hence his push for GB.
As to you mentioning people porting over features to Froyo, that may very well be true, but for the most part, I don't think much of that will happen. The Android reps from Google said that any phone that officially runs Froyo now, will run better on GB. I can only deduce that phones will run better running 2.3.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I somewhat disagree with your point about CM6. Although all the devs are working very hard to bring GB to the G2, I don't believe Cyanogen or anyone else has said that there won't be another CM6 update. That doesn't mean they will but, imho, I think there may be at least one more update to CM6 for the G2. At least I hope so!

I do believe in the possibility of another experimental update coming to other devices maybe, but Cyanogen said himself on twitter to AndroidSpin that there will be no further stable releases for CM6 due to Gingerbread's release.
That's not to say that others of TeamDouche who manage other devices won't keep CM6 alive for a little while longer, at least.

[Q] Suggestions for Android builds suitable for gaming?

Hi all I have a HTC Fuze, I was wondering what android builds anyone recommend for gaming (angry birds, paper toss, etc.) I tried games on xdandroid 2.2.1 and it was a bit too laggy. I'm using an Android 1.3 build right now and it's way better compared to 2.2.1. I was just wondering if anyone could tell me on which build am I going to get the best gaming experience? Thank you.

the FRG83 build has the fastest 3D yet

Have you tried Blazin yet (CLICK HERE)? Of course, if you know enough about microSD partitions and know how to, you might want to go for the neopeek/FRG83 builds or even gingerbread (supposedly faster than anything out there). My experience has been that gingerbread alpha build is slowly approaching beta but not a bad concept. That and I also like the theme!

R^7Z said:
Have you tried Blazin yet (CLICK HERE)? Of course, if you know enough about microSD partitions and know how to, you might want to go for the neopeek/FRG83 builds or even gingerbread (supposedly faster than anything out there). My experience has been that gingerbread alpha build is slowly approaching beta but not a bad concept. That and I also like the theme!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think gingerbread will kick a**es because is in alpha 2 and is fast
If it'll be done well we'll get the fastest bulid

Suggestions..
Thanks for the suggestions guys i'll check them out and see how they run, thanks again

what rom is best for me?

okay, folks, so, i got clockwork mod, the lastest version, i have no idea what my radio is.
what rom would work best for me?
i just want
gingerbread
Sense
decent camera (not choppy like the default rom)
and decent speed
that's about it. basic stock with fast responses in a nutshell of the post.

For a fast, gingerbread sense 2.1 ROM I would try either newts optimized shift or Wild Stangs pure speed.

Any reason why you need gingerbread? I'm running one of Chingy's Gingerbread ROMs on my Thunderbolt, OC'd to 1.41, and that about what it takes to make it work smoothly. I tried a GB rom on my old dInc a few weeks ago. It was the herky-jerkiest thing I'd ever put on there. If you HAVE to have Sense, avoid Sense 3.0 elements and avoid anything 3D. AOSP like CM7 or the like is, in my experience, the only smart way to run GB on a dInc or EVO. GB in itself isn't the killer, it's Sense running on top of it.

loonatik78 said:
Any reason why you need gingerbread? I'm running one of Chingy's Gingerbread ROMs on my Thunderbolt, OC'd to 1.41, and that about what it takes to make it work smoothly. I tried a GB rom on my old dInc a few weeks ago. It was the herky-jerkiest thing I'd ever put on there. If you HAVE to have Sense, avoid Sense 3.0 elements and avoid anything 3D. AOSP like CM7 or the like is, in my experience, the only smart way to run GB on a dInc or EVO. GB in itself isn't the killer, it's Sense running on top of it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
why are you bashing?, i asked a question about roms, not for people to bash stuff.

Kiboe said:
okay, folks, so, i got clockwork mod, the lastest version, i have no idea what my radio is.
what rom would work best for me?
i just want
gingerbread
Sense
decent camera (not choppy like the default rom)
and decent speed
that's about it. basic stock with fast responses in a nutshell of the post.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To check your radio go to
Settings > About Phone > Baseband Version
I'll have to give you fair warning that the Sense GB's are a drainer on performance and battery - I would first suggest you try out SkyRaider (http://rootzwiki.com/showthread.php?1314-ROM-SkyRaider-Sense-4.2-UPDATED-6-28-11)
This is Froyo but it's sense and very stable, smooth, quick, and great battery life. I used it for a long while before I made the switch to CM7.
From personal experience if you're going gingerbread I say CM7 or OMFGB. Also MIUI is another popular choice (if you're into it- very different from any other ROM).
ADW launcher comes with CM7, and at first that was the whole reason I stopped using CM7, then I figured out you can change the launcher.. haha
Launcher Pro+ was a much better choice for me, so if you go that route and you don't like ADW- you know where to turn
Kernel's are another very major part of how well your phone performs and also your battery life. Chad's incredikernel are by far the top choice for both Sense and AOSP kernel's.
As always, if you have bad luck with one ROM or kernel, get suggestions and try another. There IS a perfect combination waiting for you

From experience, I would have to agree with loonatik78 about Sense 3.0's effects on phone performance. With that said, I absolutely love Sense and stayed on Sense 2.1/3.0 roms until 3.0 roms received proper treatment and I subsequently switched over to Pure 3.0 roms several weeks ago. I agree with loonatik78 in the sense that you should avoid a pure 3.0 rom IF you want generally less lag but as development continues they get better everyday.
I would suggest Synergy rom from Incubus26jc, Optimized Shift from Newtoroot, AND Nils Business Gingersense 2.1/3.0 +3d. I respect these dev's work and recommend them with ease. As far as the camera, I don't take pics often so I can't provide much insight there. I know Nils' rom is in the process of including hdr and panorama as a setting in the camera app courtesy of Newtoroot (who included it in his Hybrid Sense 3.0 rom I believe). Hopefully you peak in and see what each Sense 2.1/3.0 rom available has to offer and find your daily.

Wdforty's Inc2 Remix hands down. Its a Sense 2.1 ROM with the nice 3.0 bits added in and the battery life is pretty good. It's pretty stable as well.
For the full Sense 3.0 experience I would give Nils Gingersense 3.0 a try. He does great work as well and his ROM is quite snappy for 3.0.
To be honest, flashing on the Incredible is so easy you can try them all out for yourself to see which ROM satisfies YOUR needs. As long as you stick with ROMS towards the top of the Developement forum (shows many people are using them) you will be fine. Read the threads for serious bugs that are reported that may sway you from using a rom.
/rant

k, i am close, i's just trhat i talked to a freind who put cm7 or a rom on his droid 1, and he said he had to reset it.
i guess i am just afraid of bricking the phone, booted cm7 the last time throuh rom manager, and it kept botting in bootloop, well, i got the rom back, but, i don't want to go through that again.

POQbum said:
To check your radio go to
Settings > About Phone > Baseband Version
I'll have to give you fair warning that the Sense GB's are a drainer on performance and battery - I would first suggest you try out SkyRaider (http://rootzwiki.com/showthread.php?1314-ROM-SkyRaider-Sense-4.2-UPDATED-6-28-11)
This is Froyo but it's sense and very stable, smooth, quick, and great battery life. I used it for a long while before I made the switch to CM7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
okay, the thing is, is there really that much of a noticable difference bewteen 2.2 and 2.3? i already tested out flash and it works flawlessly o this default dinc (after i cleared the bloatware out, THANKS TITANIUM BACKUP!) i'm not going to use blockbuster, or netflix (as much as people like that, i don't watch movies on a 3 1/2 scren.

okay, i may just try oput skyraider to start with, like i said i'm new to flashing.

Kiboe said:
okay, i may just try oput skyraider to start with, like i said i'm new to flashing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I like Nils Business Gingersense 3d-2.3 for a Sense rom. It is stable, quick and battery life is good. I use Conaps DualRom x2 so I'm able to load CM7, OMFGB, Evervolv and Miui (all Aosp roms) also. They are all very stable, quick and very good battery life using Chad's incredikernel on all except OMFGB on which I use invisiblek kernel.
I think in the end, it is mostly a matter of personal preference.

Kiboe said:
why are you bashing?, i asked a question about roms, not for people to bash stuff.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Holy Sh#t! Are you for real??? All I was doing was giving you an honest impression of my personal experience with a gingerbread Sense ROM built by one of the most experienced devs on the dInc. I used a LOT of ROM's on that phone. The absolute fastest Sense experience you will find is Incredibly Re-Engineered 2.3.2 using Ziggy's BFS 4/10 overclocked to 1.153GHz, smartass gov. setCPU to sleep at 245. The better way to do it would be to use the sysfs interface with a script to undervolt it more, set the smartass to be more conservative, and overclock it. If the smartass is tweaked correctly, the thing will do most of it's work around 768MHz or less, but will still have the overhead to ramp up to 1.153GHz if the load demands. I've been looking at all the GB kernels available and the sysfs on them isn't set up to do all that I've described on any of them. That's not to say they're not very well appointed kernels. They are, to the point I'm jealous. The TB has 2 GB Sense kernels. And the second one is based off the tree of the first.
My Tbolt took a mean hit in performance moving from froyo to GB. It's muscular enough hardware that it makes little impact on user experience. I put the same ROM ported for the dInc on the dInc and it was simply painful to watch. Aside from full Sense with Sense 3.0 elements, that ROM was stripped to the bone. That's why I asked if you really need GB. If you don't, there's far faster stuff out there in the land of Froyo. I run GB on the dInc now, and it's just as stupid-fast as the Tbolt, but it's AOSP. In fact, it would probably out-score my Bolt on benchmarks.
I like my Sense too. My dInc runs AOSP because that's what the gf likes. It'll probably go back to Sense when I give it to my wife. It's nice being able to get some AOSP experience now, since I don't have to live with the thing. Sorry if my opinion of my experience with GB Sense made it look like I was hating on the dInc. I'm not. You should have seen a lot of the first GB builds for the Bolt. You'd be lucky if the thing even booted. And they crawled along like sloths on opium. Maybe when some more developed GB leaks come along, it will work like it should. It's not there yet. Go try some and let me know. I'd love to think I'm wrong.

Optimized shift is my favorite just wish it had 2.1 lockscreen.. pure speed is fast just the lockscreen call bug irritated me... I'm on omfgb and have had a fast and stable experience.. using incredikernel with fast charge.. sense is nice but way too laggy for me.. guess I'm just picky..
Once a fast stable 3.0 sense rom comes out I'll probably switch to it... I try every rom I think is good but usually sense lets me down..
Well that's my 2¢…
Btw dude wasn't bashing he was telling you his experience... NOT everyone on here are a$$ holes lol
Sent from my Incredible using XDA Premium App

Kiboe said:
okay, i may just try oput skyraider to start with, like i said i'm new to flashing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a good one to start out with.
CM7 is nice but some people just prefer Sense.
I'd suggest that you stay away from ROM manager just because it can be buggy often.
Really not too big of changes from 2.2 to 2.3
Most notable is the over-scroll effect and they put in some security patches.
Eventually I'm sure you'll want to try out Sense 3.0- but just giving out my opinion in that it doesn't run too great on the INC compared to other ROM's. Bunches of people use it all the time and love it, so who knows, it may be for you. It's what's so great about android.
@loonatik78 / Kiboe
The problem isn't so much the fact that it's GB, it's because Sense GB adds on a whole lotta more bloat to your phone. Our phones just weren't designed to handle the newer Sense versions, and although you can flash it and you can use it as a daily you won't get the best performance or battery out of your phone.
DEV's are making this situation better with each new release but I think you get what I'm saying.
Also know that if you update to GB on AOSP you will lose your 720p video recording- not important to most people but if it is to you then you should clear away.
thebasuke said:
Btw dude wasn't bashing he was telling you his experience... NOT everyone on here are a$$ holes lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think OP was still mad at him for his other 10 posts of pure bashing and douche-baggery that he made in a couple other threads.

yep, just flashed skyraider and...so far i love it, i just have the itch to flash over to gingersense due to gb, but like you said, i may hold off on that for a while.

"@loonatik78 / Kiboe The problem isn't so much the fact that it's GB, it's because Sense GB adds on a whole lotta more bloat to your phone. Our phones just weren't designed to handle the newer Sense versions, and although you can flash it and you can use it as a daily you won't get the best performance or battery out of your phone."
That really is the exact point I was trying to make. Sorry if my opinion of the dInc, based on experiences just like this, bothers some folks. I really am. For the record I got quite caustic in 2 other threads concerning "what's next" and "dInc verses bolt". If I didn't have a really good experience with the dInc, I wouldn't have got a dInc2 and a Tbolt. Though the basic specs look quite similar for all 3, the little details make the big difference. For example, the Tbolt and dInc2 use the same chip. It's a snapdragon, but fabbed on a smaller process. It's got more on-die cache and RAM. They use more efficient radios. They both use a more advanced GPU.
Maybe gingerbread sense ROMs will get more efficient. That would be nice. But that isn't reality today. I doubt that will ever be reality regarding Sense 3.0 ROMs. They ask a lot from hardware that phone hasn't got. Therefore, I call the Tbolt and dInc2 better and what's next. It's just facts. Nothing people should be getting worked up over. I'll try to disagree a bit more diplomaticly in the future.

loonatik78 said:
"@loonatik78 / Kiboe The problem isn't so much the fact that it's GB, it's because Sense GB adds on a whole lotta more bloat to your phone. Our phones just weren't designed to handle the newer Sense versions, and although you can flash it and you can use it as a daily you won't get the best performance or battery out of your phone."
That really is the exact point I was trying to make. Sorry if my opinion of the dInc, based on experiences just like this, bothers some folks. I really am. For the record I got quite caustic in 2 other threads concerning "what's next" and "dInc verses bolt". If I didn't have a really good experience with the dInc, I wouldn't have got a dInc2 and a Tbolt. Though the basic specs look quite similar for all 3, the little details make the big difference. For example, the Tbolt and dInc2 use the same chip. It's a snapdragon, but fabbed on a smaller process. It's got more on-die cache and RAM. They use more efficient radios. They both use a more advanced GPU.
Maybe gingerbread sense ROMs will get more efficient. That would be nice. But that isn't reality today. I doubt that will ever be reality regarding Sense 3.0 ROMs. They ask a lot from hardware that phone hasn't got. Therefore, I call the Tbolt and dInc2 better and what's next. It's just facts. Nothing people should be getting worked up over. I'll try to disagree a bit more diplomaticly in the future.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's more the way you argue for them than the fact that they are. Everyone knows those are newer phones with better upgraded hardware, but compared with the evolution of Android- they aren't that big of a step from INC even though they are still a step up. 4G is nice but a very small percentage of people have that, and when they leave that area it's gone.
idk why this has to be my 3rd time telling you this *facepalm*

POQbum said:
It's more the way you argue for them than the fact that they are. Everyone knows those are newer phones with better upgraded hardware, but compared with the evolution of Android- they aren't that big of a step from INC even though they are still a step up. 4G is nice but a very small percentage of people have that, and when they leave that area it's gone.
idk why this has to be my 3rd time telling you this *facepalm*
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I guess I'm just not seeing that a small percentage are LTE covered. I can drive 100 miles many places with LTE coverage. Most of a drive from Detroit, MI to Cincinnati, OH is covered with LTE. I can drive from Cocoa to Tampa with LTE the whole way. Fostoria, OH has it. Who's even heard of Fostoria, OH? I WISH this thing had a display like the dInc2. It doesn't. It kinda sucks actually. What comes after this will be a fairly marginal, incremental improvement as well. Dual core? That's not gonna be 2 big, beefy Scorpion cores like what they're using now. The primary purpose of dual cores is power consumption. Each will use less cache and resources. Together they should perform about as well as a Tbolt Scorpion clocked up around 1.91GHz (Very possible, believe it or not) and use much less power. The really cool thing about the dInc is it was so powerful there was just about nothing it couldn't do given the resources outside of the device. Everything else had to catch up to what it could do. It STILL makes the iPhone4 look dated! That's a HUGE compliment. But, now devices will have to catch up to what LTE can do. It's not just faster. You can do things with the phone that were impossible before, simply because the speed wasn't there. That's made my user experience noticeably better. Other people see it too when they ask you to use your phone for something because it's just too slow on their 3G device. That's my opinion. It's been more than marginal improvement for me and a few of my friends, even if the actual hardware isn't radically improved. Ya'll can take it for what it's worth, go try one out, tell me to **** off, whatever. You're gonna be in the same boat as me eventually.

loonatik78 said:
I guess I'm just not seeing that a small percentage are LTE covered. I can drive 100 miles many places with LTE coverage. Most of a drive from Detroit, MI to Cincinnati, OH is covered with LTE. I can drive from Cocoa to Tampa with LTE the whole way. Fostoria, OH has it. Who's even heard of Fostoria, OH? I WISH this thing had a display like the dInc2. It doesn't. It kinda sucks actually. What comes after this will be a fairly marginal, incremental improvement as well. Dual core? That's not gonna be 2 big, beefy Scorpion cores like what they're using now. The primary purpose of dual cores is power consumption. Each will use less cache and resources. Together they should perform about as well as a Tbolt Scorpion clocked up around 1.91GHz (Very possible, believe it or not) and use much less power. The really cool thing about the dInc is it was so powerful there was just about nothing it couldn't do given the resources outside of the device. Everything else had to catch up to what it could do. It STILL makes the iPhone4 look dated! That's a HUGE compliment. But, now devices will have to catch up to what LTE can do. It's not just faster. You can do things with the phone that were impossible before, simply because the speed wasn't there. That's made my user experience noticeably better. Other people see it too when they ask you to use your phone for something because it's just too slow on their 3G device. That's my opinion. It's been more than marginal improvement for me and a few of my friends, even if the actual hardware isn't radically improved. Ya'll can take it for what it's worth, go try one out, tell me to **** off, whatever. You're gonna be in the same boat as me eventually.
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Well there's still no 4G in VA at all so it's got a ways to go before it's considered coverageable.
The CPU speed was what I was trying to say to you before, it takes a lot of power to rev the CPU faster- and with dual cores they can both run slower yet outperform a beefier CPU clocked at faster rates. That's really the upgrade I'm waiting for, a good phone with dual core with root available.
this is going horribly offtopic.
I think it's pretty amazing how there really are no mods here.
It's like they all just abandoned.