Develop Bugs

[Q] Best Radio for CM7

What radio is everyone using or would recommend for CM7?
I can't post in the development forums yet even though i've been here awhile just a lurker though.

2.15.00.07.28 There is a newer one I believe but I haven't tried it.
This question wouldn't belong in the development forum anyways. Here or Q & A. That is exactly why they make people wait to post in there =)

Noticed a bit of a stronger signal when I flashed the 11.19 radio (newest). As I understand it all phones are different though, I would test each one and see what works best for you.

drynyks said:
This question wouldn't belong in the development forum anyways. Here or Q & A. That is exactly why they make people wait to post in there =)
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Click to collapse
Yeah but i would have just posted in the CM7 thread, but i understand.
I have the 11.19 radio right now (flashed it and hboot 92 while running SR 3.5 athena and it killed my wifi...) seems to be doing fine. Took about 3 tries to get CM7 working correctly for me though. Kept getting a boot loop forcing me to reflash.

Give each radio a test drive yourself for a few days. Asking what radio you should use is like asking someone to tell you what your favorite color should be.
Baseband performance is extremely subjective based upon your individual variables. As such, someone else's experience isn't necessarily a reliable indicator of what you can expect on your own phone in your location.

I'm running 11.19 now on rooted 2.2 and I seem to be getting better signal now than I did before. I was at Camp Old Indian over the weekend and was getting 2 bars consistently while everyone else got "no service". Anyone in Scouting that knows the upstate area of South Carolina knows exactly what I'm talking about.

I'm using 7.28. I was using 11.19 for a about a month before going back. Cell reception is the same but 3g is faster on 7.28. Atleast for me it is. I never use gps so cant speak for that.

I just flashed 11.19 and I'll be trying it out for a few days. My work has some sort of issue inside the building -- there are "dead" places all over the building and it tends to eat my battery when I spend time in those areas. It's very predictable (on the old radio) so I'll know pretty quick if any difference has been made.
There is a thread in the development forums that is a must-read if you are considering a radio flash so you A)know what to do and B)don't permanently brick your phone.
Read it...

kenneu said:
I just flashed 11.19 and I'll be trying it out for a few days. My work has some sort of issue inside the building -- there are "dead" places all over the building and it tends to eat my battery when I spend time in those areas. It's very predictable (on the old radio) so I'll know pretty quick if any difference has been made.
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Click to collapse
The next time you have to reboot your phone, go ahead and pull the battery too. It might help to completely power down the device. It may not help, but it can't hurt.

i have been using the 11.19 radio for a couple of months and it works well for me.

Flashed 11.19 and things didn't seem any different in terms of call quality, battery life, or signal strength. I flashed the 9.xx version and it didn't seem any different, either. I'm going to put all three on the phone and record signal strength in the same place at the same time of the day and do various d/l speed tests and see if I can find a definitive radio that meets my needs. If anyone has any suggestions for a testing methodology, please let me know....

U
kenneu said:
Flashed 11.19 and things didn't seem any different in terms of call quality, battery life, or signal strength. I flashed the 9.xx version and it didn't seem any different, either. I'm going to put all three on the phone and record signal strength in the same place at the same time of the day and do various d/l speed tests and see if I can find a definitive radio that meets my needs. If anyone has any suggestions for a testing methodology, please let me know....
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That sounds great actually. I am usin the new evo 4.08 radio n went from -85 on 11.10 to -78. All from my house, i tested right b4 i flashed new radio.
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App

Ok, so I ran 10 trials each for the three kernels about 1 minute apart and measured dBm and kbps UL and DL speeds using speedtest from the market....
Having testing it and reflecting on the data, it's impossible to test meaningfully with just one phone.
The upload and download speeds vary too much from moment to moment and within an hour apart, 11.19 went from an average DL speed of 480kbps to 1150kbps. This is clearly just a function of who is currently sucking up bandwidth and unless I have three phones with the three versions of the radio side by side running the tests, I don't know how I can make it meaningful.
I did compare the dBm on each kernel and they were within -1 dBm of each other consistently. The phone was placed in the exact same location and I watched for changes in the number until the screen blanked. I then opened it again and monitored it again until it timed out and so on... 10 times for each radio version. The difference was so small it would have to be considered insignificant.

donnyp1 said:
U
That sounds great actually. I am usin the new evo 4.08 radio n went from -85 on 11.10 to -78. All from my house, i tested right b4 i flashed new radio.
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Flashed 4.08 about an hour ago. *228 afterward even though it has never made a difference locally. No difference. I place my phone in the EXACT same spot facing the exact same direction and monitor the dBm level. The best I've seen from that spot is -93 dBM and worst is -99dBm. Each radio has displayed that range and pinned right at -94 to -95.
I'm beginning to believe that the radio itself has a "fixed" send/receive strength and that no amount of software can change a hardware limitation. Maybe it can change rules like how long a GPS waits to lock based on number of acceptable satellite grabs or something like that, but I'm not seeing one bit of difference in radios.

The new 4.08 radio is working good for me.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1035955

kenneu said:
Flashed 4.08 about an hour ago. *228 afterward even though it has never made a difference locally. No difference. I place my phone in the EXACT same spot facing the exact same direction and monitor the dBm level. The best I've seen from that spot is -93 dBM and worst is -99dBm. Each radio has displayed that range and pinned right at -94 to -95.
I'm beginning to believe that the radio itself has a "fixed" send/receive strength and that no amount of software can change a hardware limitation. Maybe it can change rules like how long a GPS waits to lock based on number of acceptable satellite grabs or something like that, but I'm not seeing one bit of difference in radios.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As far as receiver sensitivity goes...I was an electronics technician at one time in my life, and I too believe the hardware is the limiting factor. E.g: My phone is setting in the exact same spot, facing the same direction, and I updated from 11.19 to 04.08, and only noticed -1db difference. I am using the Real Signal app. And it shows the relative strength of both signals that our CDMA phones use.

[Q] Flashing the Radio?

If someone can be kind enough to explain:
What is the reason for flashing the radio hardware?

Well, the radio allows your phone to access and relay signal from carrier towers. From what I have learned, people install different radios in an attempt to boost signal reception and data connectivity in their respective area which in turn impacts battery life. No one radio is best for everyone because various contributing factors can impact your and my cellular reception. These factors include proximity to towers, environmental obstacles (mountains, forest areas), the makeup of the building your are in, number of users connecting to those same towers, etc. The less factors in your surroundings then the less time your phone's radio spends searching for a strong signal. The stronger your connection, the better your battery life should be. For most roms your accurate signal strength is displayed in:
Settings/About Phone/Network/Signal Strength
Edit: Also, the radios that users install is software although it affects the hardware radio of the phone.

Thank you so much. I was confused about it till now.

michelbites said:
Thank you so much. I was confused about it till now.
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Click to collapse
My pleasure, feel free to ask away if you have any other questions/concerns.

SlimSnoopOS said:
Well, the radio allows your phone to access and relay signal from carrier towers. From what I have learned, people install different radios in an attempt to boost signal reception and data connectivity in their respective area which in turn impacts battery life. No one radio is best for everyone because various contributing factors can impact your and my cellular reception. These factors include proximity to towers, environmental obstacles (mountains, forest areas), the makeup of the building your are in, number of users connecting to those same towers, etc. The less factors in your surroundings then the less time your phone's radio spends searching for a strong signal. The stronger your connection, the better your battery life should be. For most roms your accurate signal strength is displayed in:
Settings/About Phone/Network/Signal Strength
Edit: Also, the radios that users install is software although it affects the hardware radio of the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good explanation.

Well said!
Sent from my ADR6300 using xda premium

Can you flash a new radio without being rooted?

joeyz400 said:
Can you flash a new radio without being rooted?
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Click to collapse
Yes but you can only reflash the current or a newer radio. Without s-off you cant downgrade to an older one. However this can only be done with an official signed ruu, which will also update the whole phone.

Does HTC document what they are changing in the radio releases?

reeseman04 said:
Does HTC document what they are changing in the radio releases?
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Click to collapse
The most documented info I've ever seen in relation to updated radios is when you read the pdf outlines on Verizonwireless.com for OS updates for Froyo and GB.

[ CDMA / Verizon ] question on bad signal issues..

I tired to search but unsure if I pulled CDMA 100% or not..
None the less, Im going to move over to Verizon and Im after the Nexus. I see people say the signal is bad etc etc. Im coming from the HTC evo and Ive always prety much ran AOSP roms. As we know ( or us Evo users ) the AOSP roms dont show " full " signal. But it shows actual signal. Is this the issue people are ***** about? IS this what they are talking about, in terms of bad radios etc?
AOSP roms show the true signal, but not a masked/boosted signal similar to HTC phones done, right?
The bad radio rumor isnt a bad radio, just the way AOSP roms show the signal... right?

The bar reading was jacked up a notch in 4.0.4 (2 bars of signal in 4.0.1/2 will show up as 3 or even 4), but the db reading in Settings is still correct (though, read issue #2 below). The phone is fine hardware wise. What confuses (or convinces) people are three things:
1) Some people got duds. This will be very obvious because you won't get signal even in areas where other people on VZ can connect. You need to get the phone swapped.
2) The GN has a weird way of reporting signal strength. They completely over-do the hysteresis, so if you test/compare with another phone, you have to keep the GN in one spot for 10-20 seconds before you get the same reading.
3) Software bugs in the baseband which will crash the radio interface and leave you without data for up to a minute. There also appears to be some hand-off issues that may keep you on 3G when you should be on 4G.
The GN has no worse reception than any other Verizon handset, aside from the fixable bugs in the baseband, which really aren't "reception" issues anyway.

So with what you said, all the apparent issues that are there, are fixable in terms of ROMs or official fixes? I like to tinker with my phone, but not to keep it running correctly, ya know?
Is this issue still reported on the current batch of Gnex's?

I just got my Nexus a week ago, but it has worked perfect in terms of signal and data. No dropouts. My radio is whatever it came with, but my ROM is BAMF Paradigm

mroneeyedboh said:
So with what you said, all the apparent issues that are there, are fixable in terms of ROMs or official fixes? I like to tinker with my phone, but not to keep it running correctly, ya know?
Is this issue still reported on the current batch of Gnex's?
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Click to collapse
Personally, I've had fewer issues with the Galaxy Nexus than I did with the Nexus One (that phone DID have bad reception. Great call quality though) or the WinMo phone I had before that. Whenever I have connection issues, I just turn on and off airplane mode and the phone will come back and reconnect to 4G in ~15 seconds. Nothing serious beyond that.
Some people have had more serious issues, and I can't say if it was their phone or the network equipment used in their area or what. Only way to be sure is to try one out. I have little doubt that ~99% of GN users have little/no issue, but the ~1% that do have problems are vocal about them (they should be, this thing isn't cheap).
EniGmA1987 said:
I just got my Nexus a week ago, but it has worked perfect in terms of signal and data. No dropouts. My radio is whatever it came with, but my ROM is BAMF Paradigm
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ROM has nothing to do with signal. Only the baseband matters.

ATnTdude said:
ROM has nothing to do with signal. Only the baseband matters.
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Click to collapse
Actually, if they have updated telephony, it can. For example, there are signal improvements in 4.0.4, but you must run the rom and the radios.
That said, Paradigm has made no telephony changes from aosp 4.0.3.

adrynalyne said:
Actually, if they have updated telephony, it can. For example, there are signal improvements in 4.0.4, but you must run the rom and the radios.
That said, Paradigm has made no telephony changes from aosp 4.0.3.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was really simplifying things since this was a non-technical question. If you go from 4.0.2 to 4.0.3+, you may have more hooks into the kernel and from there into the baseband, but jumping randomly from ROM to ROM isn't the best way to solve a signal problem. Changing the baseband is the best way, kernel the next, and finally the Android version. Basically go in order of distance from the hardware, noting that each level is significantly less likely to cure you.

ATnTdude said:
I was really simplifying things since this was a non-technical question. If you go from 4.0.2 to 4.0.3+, you may have more hooks into the kernel and from there into the baseband, but jumping randomly from ROM to ROM isn't the best way to solve a signal problem. Changing the baseband is the best way, kernel the next, and finally the Android version. Basically go in order of distance from the hardware, noting that each level is significantly less likely to cure you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
After reading hundreds of posts on connectivity issues, yours is the first to bring some lucidity and sanity to the hardware issue. Now someone needs to focus on the BS from the carriers and the inadequacy of their distribution systems.

[R&D] Replacement Radio

Its well known that the D720 has a crappy radio. I'd like help researching radio images with the intent of developing replacement radio/baseband software. I'll keep this post updated with discoverys, insights and information about the radio.
Radio Description
The Radio firmware is actually a set of operating systems that runs on the phones physical processor. This includes a "Microvisor" (Think, Xen Dom0) and a set of Operating systems that run on it (Think Xen DomU). The microvisor for the D720 is NICTOKL4, The full version string is:
NICTOKL4 - (provider: Open Kernel Labs) built on May 19 2009 00:21:02 using gcc version 3.4.4.
The radio is loaded by NICTOKL4 as is androids boot code. The exact process is unknown, but I speculate that fastboot and the radio are started at the same time, and fastboot executes what needs to be run on the android side, while the radio waits to be initialized externally.
The radio can preempt Android, and has real time priority. The radio itself is a small part of radio.img
Theories
I've read in several places that Deep Idle really doesn't work, And I'd like to speculate as to why in the hopes it will help someone else.
Since the Radio requires real time priority, and halting a CPU and bringing it back up is an expensive process, it cannot be allowed. I speculate that the lack of savings from Deep Idle is because the radio keeps running while android (because of the microvisor) thinks the CPU is halted.
This apparently does not apply to GSM models.
Other Information
The radio appears to be unencrypted, which is strange considering its almost always encrypted.
Android is a Guest OS in a virtualized phone.
So is the radio.
The radio and baseband that most people think of, Is mostly software. Its no different than any other embedded device. Just because it does things with the hardware, doesn't mean that its implemented in hardware.
Recent Discoveries
GSM Models have a separate baseband processor that is responsible for handling AT Commands, phone calls, SIM interaction, etc.
What is the "baseband" software image responsible for on GSM Models? Why is it run as an OS, instead of being implemented in the RIL libs?
Thanks
Harbb - For the delightful discussion regarding the inner workings for the radio, You say you know less than you do, and your challenging my theories and pointing out errors helps me further not only this cause, but my own knowledge as well. I appreciate it.

Interesting. I'm going to be keeping an eye on this for sure
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using xda premium

plaguethenet said:
Its well known that the D720 has a crappy radio. I'd like help researching radio images with the intent of developing replacement radio/baseband software. I'll keep this post updated with discoverys, insights and information about the radio.
Radio Description
The Radio firmware is actually a set of operating systems that runs on the phones physical processor. This includes a "Microvisor" (Think, Xen Dom0) and a set of Operating systems that run on it (Think Xen DomU). The microvisor for the D720 is NICTOKL4, The full version string is:
NICTOKL4 - (provider: Open Kernel Labs) built on May 19 2009 00:21:02 using gcc version 3.4.4.
The radio is loaded by NICTOKL4 as is androids boot code. The exact process is unknown, but I speculate that fastboot and the radio are started at the same time, and fastboot executes what needs to be run on the android side, while the radio waits to be initialized externally.
The radio can preempt Android, and has real time priority. The radio itself is a small part of radio.img
Theories
I've read in several places that Deep Idle really doesn't work, And I'd like to speculate as to why in the hopes it will help someone else.
Since the Radio requires real time priority, and halting a CPU and bringing it back up is an expensive process, it cannot be allowed. I speculate that the lack of savings from Deep Idle is because the radio keeps running while android (because of the microvisor) thinks the CPU is halted.
Other Information
The radio appears to be unencrypted, which is strange considering its almost always encrypted.
Android is a Guest OS in a virtualized phone.
So is the radio.
The radio and baseband that most people think of, Is mostly software. Its no different than any other embedded device. Just because it does things with the hardware, doesn't mean that its implemented in hardware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is very interesting I hope you can get this up & going for us Nexus S4G users! & I live in Worcester myself
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using xda premium

Nice, MA FTW I am in Malden lol.

oh man id do ANYTHING to actually have reliable service with the phone hahah 1 bar inside maybe 2 outside... good luck guys! i hope its a smooth ride whatever this may be lol

Lol Salem. MA here baby
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using Tapatalk

adamw1101 said:
Lol Salem. MA here baby
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using Tapatalk
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rasengan82 said:
Nice, MA FTW I am in Malden lol.
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Click to collapse
Killasmoke said:
This is very interesting I hope you can get this up & going for us Nexus S4G users! & I live in Worcester myself
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using xda premium
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Click to collapse
Holy crap, Alot of MA Users. We should have a phone meetup someday
Also, Killasmoke:
It will be a rather tedious process, as this is like, trying to reverse engineer the NT Kernel. I'm not saying its impossible, but its highly complex, and nearly completely undocumented (Or in our case, COMPLETELY undocumented) I hope I can do something too, but I'll need more insight from other hardware hackers as well. There is alot to be reverse engineered here.

I was just thinking today about how my TMobile galaxy s handled data much more efficiently than sprint. I could talk while surfing the web over 3g and never any buffering or loading on Pandora (now it's between every song).
You without me is like Harold Melvin without the Blue Notes...

plaguethenet said:
The full version string is:
NICTOKL4 - (provider: Open Kernel Labs) built on May 19 2009 00:21:02 using gcc version 3.4.4.
The radio appears to be unencrypted, which is strange considering its almost always encrypted.
Android is a Guest OS in a virtualized phone.
So is the radio.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So, that message means it was compiled with gcc, is the radio itself open source? Are there other sample radios to base work off of? If it's unencrypted, can it be decompiled relatively easily?
At any rate, saying it can be built with gcc at least means it has the potential to be built by anyone with the proper environment and source.
Any updates yet?

Bruce lee roy said:
I was just thinking today about how my TMobile galaxy s handled data much more efficiently than sprint. I could talk while surfing the web over 3g and never any buffering or loading on Pandora (now it's between every song).
You without me is like Harold Melvin without the Blue Notes...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Different radio and technology. GSM Inherently supports simultaneous voice and data, CDMA does not. Thats merely a difference in the radio software and hardware.
A good way to think of the two is HTTP vs FTP.
Both work over TCP/IP, and both do similar (albeit different) things. (Serve files)
How they go about serving those files, and how the client gets those files is different. That's more or less the difference between CDMA and GSM (UMTS Really). They use different radio bands and a different protocol to accomplish the same thing. Just like how HTTP and FTP use different ports and different protocols to do the same thing.
Also, HSDPA and HSDPA+ Are much faster than 1xRTT and EvDo

mondokat said:
So, that message means it was compiled with gcc, is the radio itself open source? Are there other sample radios to base work off of? If it's unencrypted, can it be decompiled relatively easily?
At any rate, saying it can be built with gcc at least means it has the potential to be built by anyone with the proper environment and source.
Any updates yet?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Before disassembly, i'd have to split the binaries apart. (Extract OEMSBL, SBL, PBL and AMSS.BIN from Radio.img) then I could disassemble them. I wonder if ODIN Images are any different. It may be worth looking at and i'll see what I can dig up.
In hindsight, Some of the bootloaders may be in bootloader.img. I'm pretty sure bootloader.img is just fastboot and Samsung's boot software, Worth looking into.
It is and is not open source. K4 is a Microkernel (Very similar to, if not based on, MACH). It can be built with GCC. The radio itself is seperate from NICTOKL4, NICTOKL4 is just a hypervisor. The radio runs underneath that, and so does android. In short, think of it this way. The radio software, and Android are just programs running on an operating system. NICTOKL4 is that operating system.

I'll be following this, I've never had good reception at all with any radio...

Wow, nice. If I'll be able to contribute with my knowledge at any point, I'll be sure to pitch in. Good luck.

how about baseband ??
and last stories about this thread,are i lost somethings ?

thanks for this. ill keep an eye out

Does Nandroid Backup Radio?

i want to flash a new radio onto my phone but just want to double check if a nadroid backup backs up the radio too?

no pretty sure it dosent, check an old backup and see whats in there to be sure

Ok, also, when I change my radio, do I need to change my rll?
Sent from my HTC Vision using xda premium

try it both ways and see what works best. so far im on testing my third radio, a couple days with out replacing the files and a couple days with them replaced. so far havent found much of a difference between reception or battery life or internet speeds. this of course is somewhat unique to me as others swear replacing the lib-ril files makes a difference.
id just say dont for the first few days then replace and compare

It does not backup your radio, no.
You should change your radio to match your current rils, rather than the other way around. There is an automatcher in the the development section.
Changing your radio to match your rils may or may not affect reception or battery life, but I am almost certain it will remove echoes if that is a constant problem in phone calls for you on your rom.

Again just my findings, no echos when I change radios without changing ril files or when I match them. Again have only tried 3 radios so far and no one has proved any better then the next. But I also haven't traveled to far away from home over the past few weeks that I have been doing testing. And I have always had amazing reception and such with any device. Right now I'm in my basment where many on other carries can't even get a phone call. Have 3 bars and just ran speedtest getting over 3mbps. Same finding as always
Sent from my HTC Vision using xda premium