Related
Clipboard:
- http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms589129(v=VS.95).aspx
- http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/system.windows.uielement.mouserightbuttondown(VS.95).aspx
- http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/system.windows.controls.primitives.popup(v=VS.95).aspx
See? All supported in Silverlight 4. Once the phone runs Silverlight 4, it'll support these.
There, done, now you can shut up and stop complaining about it missing. Thank you.
Why stop complaining? It's still missing. What about you shutting up until they finally add it?
Windcape said:
Clipboard:
- http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms589129(v=VS.95).aspx
- http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/system.windows.uielement.mouserightbuttondown(VS.95).aspx
- http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/system.windows.controls.primitives.popup(v=VS.95).aspx
See? All supported in Silverlight 4. Once the phone runs Silverlight 4, it'll support these.
There, done, now you can shut up and stop complaining about it missing. Thank you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Who's to say it'll run Silverlight 4?
darkmurder said:
Who's to say it'll run Silverlight 4?
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Click to collapse
Microsoft?
When? 2-3 years or later...
Sent from my Hero CDMA using the XDA mobile application powered by Tapatalk
does it support c&p now? no, well untill(if) they add those features, I will complain.
RustyGrom said:
Microsoft?
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Click to collapse
does they say when? seriously I don't want to wait few years untill ms add this.
We can complain here as much as we want.
Our right as customers.
I will never agree to beeing limited yet forced to acknowledge this as having
more possibilities.
RustyGrom said:
Microsoft?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Got a quote thats from their mouth saying itll get Silverlight 4? Cheers mate!
They will add Silverlight 4. Don't know where I heard them say that, but they did.
Nevertheless, copy&paste isn't there now and who knows how long it will take them to add it?
darkmurder said:
Got a quote thats from their mouth saying itll get Silverlight 4? Cheers mate!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pretty sure they said it at MIX. I'm not going to dig through hours of video to find it though. And jeeze, you act like it's some sort of crazy idea. It's already running Silverlight 3+. Silverlight 4 was just finished recently. They don't have time to include it before launch.
It's rather illogical to say a phone based on Silverlight, wouldn't be upgraded to the latest version of Silverlight eventually.
And yes, SL4 was released 2 months after the WP7 preview
And it is silly to think that phone based only on silverlight won't support silverlight in Internet Explorer. Oh, wait
Copy and Paste took only 3 major versions of iPhone OS upgrades to be implemented. Why in 2010 I need to go back in time and live without C&P, while iPhone, Android and even Windows Mobile have it.
You know the Android implementation of copy&paste is terrible broken right? But feel free to get a Android, I'm sure the "no paid apps in Europe" makes it a GREAT alternative.
It never ceases to amaze me that people keep focus on the smallest of small issues, instead of the actual problems. I guess the truth is people are just annoyed about the alternatives being so crappy, that they have to complain about something to justify not buying the phone at first possible option.
RustyGrom said:
Pretty sure they said it at MIX. I'm not going to dig through hours of video to find it though. And jeeze, you act like it's some sort of crazy idea. It's already running Silverlight 3+. Silverlight 4 was just finished recently. They don't have time to include it before launch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok thats all I wanted to hear, sorry if I came across as prudent I just don't want to get my hopes up then be disappointed later on
Windcape said:
You know the Android implementation of copy&paste is terrible broken right? But feel free to get a Android, I'm sure the "no paid apps in Europe" makes it a GREAT alternative.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Android is Google's first foray into the OS business. Microsoft has been around for decades. Windows 3.1 had c&p, Microsoft 1.0 had it (remember this? http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4915875929930836239#docid=-2992183880068262304) heck, even my old Commodore 64 running GEOS had it. So yes! I am a bit surprised to see such a basic feature missing in the latest Microsoft OS.
btw WP7 marketplace will only be for 17 countries and no sideloading alternative. If you could sideload, a developer can sell you the app from his website or on an alternative such as slideme
http://windowsteamblog.com/windows_.../07/13/windows-phone-7-getting-connected.aspx
17 countries at launch, and no-sideloading is really good for developers who want to write applications for a living. It ensures a good and uniform distribution center for applications.
And as I said with this topic, copy&paste is already made. It's just not supported yet, because the Silverlight 4 implementation was first finished in April.
Windcape said:
17 countries at launch, and no-sideloading is really good for developers who want to write applications for a living. It ensures a good and uniform distribution center for applications.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Gameloft can actually sell their Android games to people living in your country since they can sell from their website. They won't have to worry about app approval restrictions, paying a share of their profits to anyone, or the race to the bottom where everything ends up selling for under $1.
ari-free said:
Gameloft can actually sell their Android games to people living in your country since they can sell from their website. They won't have to worry about app approval restrictions, paying a share of their profits to anyone, or the race to the bottom where everything ends up selling for under $1.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And have to do their own marketing, setup a payment site and distribution channel, and deal with piracy!
And they can't sell apps directly on the phone, but have to guide users to a often long and complicated website url, and a site that's probably not even optimized for mobile phones.
You don't see the big issues here? Distribution and marketing is much much bigger issues than anything else.
Its not the same,
for instance if you send me an email with a coupon code in it, and now I want to paste that on the website of the specified vendor, I cant do it. Outlook doesn't support copy, and IE doesn't support paste.
Oh no!! i am compelled to either remember an 8 digit alpha numeric code (or write it down, sounds pretty primitive to me). What if it was an mailing address on a website that you wanted to email a friend - that's even worse.
I see no reason to stop complaining yet.
Windcape said:
17 countries at launch, and no-sideloading is really good for developers who want to write applications for a living. It ensures a good and uniform distribution center for applications.
And as I said with this topic, copy&paste is already made. It's just not supported yet, because the Silverlight 4 implementation was first finished in April.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have a complaint about this too. The phone 'phones home' to check if the application is valid. As a developer this is awesome, but as a phone user, I am worried about my data package.
For instance if I install a world clock app, as a result every time i check launch the app to check the time in Denmark, I use bandwidth.
In the states this might not be a problem, but in other countries, data can be expensive.
I hope the implementation of phoning home is elegant, and not burdonsome
Any one think the android market lay out and set up is **** every time I go on to it its always the same old ****e Top Free Top Paid its all ****e the apps never change, I think they should have a shake up so you can do a search on top rated, higest price, lowest price, most comments, newest apps,oldest apps,multi-player etc just change the way you can search altogether.
Does any one else agree or is it just me?
Give us a vote and comment
+1 for it being crap I installed Appbrain which is better but far from what you describe
Yes its crap. With all the money Google have got, you'd think it would be better.
keep the comments and votes comin in
I agree, I expect much better market.
Yes, it's not that advanced.
Totally agree with you guys.
Most of the stuff on there is crap and there are lots of apps that do the same bloody thing.
aye its not brilliant but its far better than the microsoft market or whatever it was called on my htc touch hd
bradmax57 said:
aye its not brilliant but its far better than the microsoft market or whatever it was called on my htc touch hd
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Click to collapse
I agree but MS didn't have anywhere near as many apps that were any good.
The only things that were good on MS's market place were facebook/twitter/SPB shell.
the rest of it was garbage.
although I guess this will eventually change with WP7 and get better when they buy some people to develop apps for it...
+1
I'm all for an open market. But there REALLY needs to be a way to Filter/Dispose of the minefield of Porn Apps and XXX Photo Galleries finding their way on.
I'm all for freedom of choice, but don't need it on every other app
KYI
An overhaul would be nice for sure, it seems weird with such focus on Apps in order to ensure success of the Android platform that there seems to be little focus on the market.
The interface needs a change, some customization options, an most importantly they really need to hurry with the paid market for all countries! We in Denmark and probably a bunch of other countries are still waiting for paid apps.
I know there is brilliant alternatives to the market place, but seeing how many Android activations we see daily, they really need to focus some energy on the market, but I suspect it will have a major overhaul with the come of Gingerbread.
I don't believe Android cannot compete to its full extent with Apple until its marketplace delivers the same quality while differentiating its product by supporting the openness of the market.
Bump
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App
I think that they need to charge everyone in their local currency as otherwise people get charged oversees fees by the banks for converting it.
Lukehluke said:
I think that they need to charge everyone in their local currency as otherwise people get charged oversees fees by the banks for converting it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah thats another thing currency if you are in the uk you should be charged in pounds and it should show pounds instead of dodgey Y letters and dollars and all other currency that isn't normal and people dont understand
I just thought I'd start this thread to ask other developers about their opinion on the matter.
I spent many hours across several weeks reverse engineering the Samsung Galaxy S flashing protocol and then programming, testing and distributing Heimdall as open-source software.
Based on bandwidth consumption Heimdall has been downloaded anywhere between 2000 and 8000 times (depending on whether the source or binaries were downloaded). I have received no more than eight donations, a very sincere thank-you goes out to those eight people! Let's assume that 25% of the total number of downloads were repeat downloaders, so we have somewhere between 1500 and 6000 unique users. So only 0.134-0.534% of users actually donate. Those sorts of donation rates are barely able to cover the cost of bandwidth, if at all.
I know there are a lot of people out there who consider themselves avid supporters of open-source and open-source software. I wouldn't necessarily call myself one of those people, however I do believe there is definitely a time and a place for open-source software, Heimdall being a perfect example.
I also know a lot of people who distribute ROMs, apps, tools, mods etc. are hobbyists who do what they do in their spare time, and the community should be very thankful of that. As for myself, I work as a independent software/games developer, not particularly the most monetarily rewarding profession around.
As much as we do enjoy releasing free software for the community, it is difficult for developers such as myself to justify the work involved when there is little to no return, after all the bills need to be paid somehow.
My question is this, is it possible for developers releasing open-source software directly to the community, not large corporations, to make a living off their work? Furthermore, how do we encourage community members to give back to developers who have donated their time to the community?
Can't you use Google Code instead for hosting? or SourceForge? all provide free bandwidth IIRC.
Don't expect any donations as a rule, if you are expecting profit then either use ads on your website or charge.
I would have thought the primary reason for developing OSS on your phone is to improve the product you originally bought.
Cheers,
MiG
If you want free hosting, I can hook you up at http://www.sgscompilebox.dreamhosters.com/ that I'm paying for anyway for z4mod. Unlimited bandwidth/space. Offer goes out to anybody who wants to host anything for the SGS.
EDIT: Oh, and to answer your question: No, I don't believe it's possible to make a living off making 3rd party open source tools that only a fraction(technical users) of a device's users will use. If you want to make a living off open source, the best bet is through a company such as Canonical, or by creating applications focused at casual users with as much potential marketshare as possible. Or do what most people do: get a regular 'closed' job, and do open source stuff as a hobby.
MiG- said:
Can't you use Google Code instead for hosting? or SourceForge? all provide free bandwidth IIRC.
Don't expect any donations as a rule, if you are expecting profit then either use ads on your website or charge.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think you fully understand what I'm trying to discuss. The bandwidth costs are fairly negligible, especially if I'm approximately able to cover the costs with just eight donations. A developers time however is substantially more expensive, and in some ways the effort and intention is priceless
I'm not expecting profit as such, nor do I particularly wish this discussion to center around myself (I'm just using my statistics as an example). I'm just curious to know whether people think it is possible to be a "sustainable" open-source developer who contributes software directly to a community? As opposed to large open-source products targeted towards large corporations who pay technical support contracts.
I'm also not a big fan off stuffing ads down the throat of my user-base. Also, in this particular context I seriously doubt that sort of approach would work, especially if third-party free hosting (sourceforge, github etc.) is used.
MiG- said:
I would have thought the primary reason for developing OSS on your phone is to improve the product you originally bought.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not necessarily. In my particular case I've simply released a tool to further enable the community to do something that other users (myself included) could already do, in some capacity or another.
For most developers releasing open-source software isn't so much about improving something they own. It's more about providing something for a community to use and benefit from without constraints. It's not unreasonable to ask the community to support you in return. After all there is nothing that forces developers to ever release the software they develop, unless you've used GPL code which is another matter entirely.
MiG-, based on your answer I'm assuming you're saying, no you do not think it's possible, which is definitely a perfectly valid answer to questions I've asked. Although I would definitely love to hear what more community members, particularly developers, have to say about the topic.
RyanZA said:
If you want free hosting, I can hook you up at http://www.sgscompilebox.dreamhosters.com/ that I'm paying for anyway for z4mod. Unlimited bandwidth/space. Offer goes out to anybody who wants to host anything for the SGS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bit of topic.. you can host roms?
DocRambone said:
Bit of topic.. you can host roms?
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Until someone stops me, sure.
RyanZA said:
EDIT: Oh, and to answer your question: No, I don't believe it's possible to make a living off making 3rd party open source tools that only a fraction(technical users) of a device's users will use. If you want to make a living off open source, the best bet is through a company such as Canonical, or by creating applications focused at casual users with as much potential marketshare as possible. Or do what most people do: get a regular 'closed' job, and do open source stuff as a hobby.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with pretty much everything except the part about targeting casual users in order to make money. In my experience technically inclined users, who have an appreciation for a piece of software, are substantially more likely to donate that casual users who lack the knowledge of the work involved. Of course selling software is something that can be more easily achieved when targeting a casual user base, especially if they know nothing of piracy. However it is generally not possible to sell "open-source" software directly.
Benjamin Dobell said:
I agree with pretty much everything except the part about targeting casual users in order to make money. In my experience technically inclined users, who have an appreciation for a piece of software, are substantially more likely to donate that casual users who lack the knowledge of the work involved. Of course selling software is something that can be more easily achieved when targeting a casual user base, especially if they know nothing of piracy. However it is generally not possible to sell "open-source" software directly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Of course it is. Why do you think all of these app stores and market place etc is all catching on? You're never going to get rich off it, but putting up a popular open source application with an advert (and the option to turn it off even) should be able to bring in a pretty good revenue! Social networking seems to do the best for these types of apps.
Also, you'd probably want to diversify if relying on ad money - one banner ad in 25 open source apps, with 100K users each could easily reach a lot of money. And it should be possible to crank out a simple, well made open source app that serves a definite purpose in under 3 months. So with some time investment, in a couple years you'd be able to live off it. No different from closed sourced apps when you you use advertising.
Most important thing though is to make something that
1) the average user understands what it does
2) does the job as simply as possible
3) actually helps the user
4) has as wide a potential market as possible
You could look at firefox as the ultimate in this type of thing.
This is all a lot of work though, I'm sure, and if you're after money, a regular desk job is almost guaranteed to work out better.
RyanZA said:
Of course it is. Why do you think all of these app stores and market place etc is all catching on? You're never going to get rich off it, but putting up a popular open source application with an advert (and the option to turn it off even) should be able to bring in a pretty good revenue! Social networking seems to do the best for these types of apps.
Also, you'd probably want to diversify if relying on ad money - one banner ad in 25 open source apps, with 100K users each could easily reach a lot of money. And it should be possible to crank out a simple, well made open source app that serves a definite purpose in under 3 months. So with some time investment, in a couple years you'd be able to live off it. No different from closed sourced apps when you you use advertising.
Most important thing though is to make something that
1) the average user understands what it does
2) does the job as simply as possible
3) actually helps the user
4) has as wide a potential market as possible
You could look at firefox as the ultimate in this type of thing.
This is all a lot of work though, I'm sure, and if you're after money, a regular desk job is almost guaranteed to work out better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed, I mostly meant that it's difficult to "sell" open-source software. If your software is truly open-source then users are likely to download it, compile it and then redistribute it for free, which is sort of reasonable given that it's meant to be open source.
However advertising in a free application is slightly different than selling an application and it does have a lot more potential to succeed. However depending on what you mean by "putting up a popular open source application" I might have moral issues with that. Unless the popular application is your own or you've substantially modified (added a UI etc) to an existing piece of open-source software. Although a lot less likely to happen if your app is free, if it is open-source there is still the chance someone else will distribute it for free, unless of course the non-code assets aren't open.
I definitely do believe that at the moment it would be extremely difficult if not impossible to live off the type of open-source software I initially described. It's a bit saddening though to realise how massively one falls short, hopefully this will change in the future.
About those donations. If I would use it, I would probably donate.
I worked my a** of for the community, providing ROMs and kitchens for 3 years for the HTC S710 and S740 and I got about 4 or 5 donations over that period of time. Sometimes it get's very frustrating, but hang in there, it's worth it after all (there would be no WM 6.5 on the Vox or the Rose without me (dare I say that ), but I wanted it anyway, so I made it and just released it for others as well)!
PS: SAP r3 is open source and it sells veeeeeery good
I think the community can recognize such invaluable work & devote a part of their donations to them, if they are using his software & really think its worth.
I think however small percentage it could be, it would make the developer feel wanted & make him continue devoting his valuable time.
I just read an article either today or yesterday regarding a conference of software developers for android community, & when one developer went to the podium & said he is earning a steady $1-$2 per day, people actually laughed. He retorted, THIS IS SUPPOSED TO BE GOOD. Android hasn't penetrated the markets YET like iPhone. So awareness & earnings are still low.
BTW, a nice GUI would change everything.
Just my 2 cents worth.
PS : In continuation to RyanZA's talk, I would like to mention that if you think you have something worth using, MAKE A LOT of noise about it. THAT's how people notice, use & donate. No one can understand a software's worth until you tell them. Like some WWii prime minister said, if you want the world to understand what you are telling, tell it like you are telling a donkey.
Ben, I think you need to differentiate between recognition, fame & money. Ideas are many have you tried http://www.ideaken.com/ ?
Benjamin Dobell said:
Agreed, I mostly meant that it's difficult to "sell" open-source software. If your software is truly open-source then users are likely to download it, compile it and then redistribute it for free, which is sort of reasonable given that it's meant to be open source.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most companies "built on open-source" provide binaries, and real support for those binaries, and earn a living from that. In an enterprise environment giving support can earn a lot of money (mainly because a lot of companies have policies to only use software/hardware that has decent support). On my last job we had to use a really crappy software, just because the (really) good alternative didn't had a support center in our country.
For the casual users: the marketplaces + ads are a good place to start. If you manage to create something that casual users will use, then it might pay of. Those users don't actaully care about the software being FOSS or not. Actually there aren't many people who care how free an application really is (except for most people working in IT or similar)
If bandwidth is an issue then host it over megaupload and such, problem solved.
ragin said:
BTW, a nice GUI would change everything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And give users the ability to think they are actually a power user. Most people here at xda can't write even simple scripts, but they do want to try out new and experimental stuff. (on the other hand there are a lot of users who want things that just work, for them give a simple gui saying: "DO DA STUFF")
EarlZ said:
If bandwidth is an issue then host it over megaupload and such, problem solved.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hate when people upload source code to megaupload. There's github, code.google.com and sf.net. sf.net is although quite old now, the other too are still great when it comes to hosting FOSS stuff.
Github is even nicer since they've added a big "Download" button for the end users.
Is there really a filter in there? The 90% of the apps in market are really a bunch of junk, yesterday I saw a 400 bucks app that someone did for fun... (not much fun if someone double click the buy button).
I mean is microsoft really fitering the apps for wp7 or they just want to increase the ammount of apps asap?
When are the good apps (like in windows mobile 6) coming?
When we will able to have some serious apps for buy? I speak about GPS navs, configuration tools for connections, tethering apps, voip and all the great stuff that we had on windows mobile etc...
No, you are not dreaming.
They are adding 5 new 'Calculate the Tips' software every week.
Really nice, isn't it?
No it's not just you ... there is alot of rubbish out there but to be fair ... I wouldn't say 90%. There are a few decent bit.
I was expecting this and imagine it will only get better as MS have given this OS some motherly love as opposed to WM
Infuriated-Germ said:
it will only get better as MS have given this OS some motherly love as opposed to WM
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nice. So we can expect some good 'Fart' applications in the near future ?
no offense, but how many apps in the apple market or android market are actually any good??? Not very many.
1. HTC has a connections config app, if you didn't buy an htc phone then shame on you.
2. There is a voip app in the marketplace, someone else was talking about it.
3. You do know the OS is less than a month old right???
OK, I have used the Palm market place, the Itunes app store, the android market and the windows market and I have found that in all cases 90% of the apps are rubbish or variations on a theme (tip calculators for the numerically challenged etc.). I am waiting for only 1 app which has been promised - Kindle!!!
That's what makes Apple's app store so laughable. They occasionally announce that there's a bazillion or so apps in their store but 98% of them are rubbish. I suspect the WP7 market will most likely mirror that and it probably should. The alternative is to become Apple and turn things down because "there's too many of those" or "there's no good reason for this" or the worst, no reason at all. Where Apple's store really fails is their rating system. If Microsoft can identify and correct that weakness they'll definitely have an upper hand.
Its the same in every market. No matter where you go there will be junk.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using Tapatalk
Johny1969 said:
Is there really a filter in there? The 90% of the apps in market are really a bunch of junk, yesterday I saw a 400 bucks app that someone did for fun... (not much fun if someone double click the buy button).
I mean is microsoft really fitering the apps for wp7 or they just want to increase the ammount of apps asap?
When are the good apps (like in windows mobile 6) coming?
When we will able to have some serious apps for buy? I speak about GPS navs, configuration tools for connections, tethering apps, voip and all the great stuff that we had on windows mobile etc...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How do you expect to see configuration tweaking apps for the OS that has been locked down like a Ft. Knox?
BTW, happy anniversary.
arturobandini said:
No, you are not dreaming.
They are adding 5 new 'Calculate the Tips' software every week.
Really nice, isn't it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly what is the deal with that? That is crazy. Cant even get a decent checkbook app
arturobandini said:
No, you are not dreaming.
They are adding 5 new 'Calculate the Tips' software every week.
Really nice, isn't it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Another example are currency converters. The funny thing is that I still have to find one that works correctly with German localization...
I just need a good IM app and the Kindle app and im set. Hopefully the IM app supports multiple logins on all platforms.
Isn't it the developers spewing out these applications that are to blame? If someone is so foolish as to pay a $99 fee only to produce a fart application at the end of it, why is it MS's fault? If they rejected the devs work then people would moan that MS is censoring people, big brother, etc. Just let market forces play their part, crap will sink and quality applications will rise by word of mouth and reviews by users.
efjay said:
Isn't it the developers spewing out these applications that are to blame? If someone is so foolish as to pay a $99 fee only to produce a fart application at the end of it, why is it MS's fault? If they rejected the devs work then people would moan that MS is censoring people, big brother, etc. Just let market forces play their part, crap will sink and quality applications will rise by word of mouth and reviews by users.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They produce the fart app for you in order to get back that 99 dollars as soon as possible.
Do you think real developers do not want to create good apps? They just need to be interested in what the users want and what they can accomplished with the SDK provided by the manufacturer to satisfy the users' wants.
I suggest for you guys to create a thread, and possibly stick it, on what you want on your device, and get a feedback from developers how easy or difficult it is going to be to implement it,
Johny1969 said:
Is there really a filter in there? The 90% of the apps in market are really a bunch of junk, yesterday I saw a 400 bucks app that someone did for fun... (not much fun if someone double click the buy button).
I mean is microsoft really fitering the apps for wp7 or they just want to increase the ammount of apps asap?
When are the good apps (like in windows mobile 6) coming?
When we will able to have some serious apps for buy? I speak about GPS navs, configuration tools for connections, tethering apps, voip and all the great stuff that we had on windows mobile etc...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So are you saying the Android market isn't full of junk? When I perused the Android market, I say 90% filler, including sex app after sex app. And I saw personal quote apps a plenty.
MartyLK said:
So are you saying the Android market isn't full of junk? When I perused the Android market, I say 90% filler, including sex app after sex app. And I saw personal quote apps a plenty.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Stop bringing Android, no need to stir it this way, the thread is about WP7 market.
it goes like this...eventually as the good developers port their apps over to WP7, and the so-so developers get better as they become accustomed to the platform,...the apps on the market will get better. And those apps that are "rubbish" will eventually fade away.
And yes, if you think the WP7 market place is rubbish, there's no doubt that all that rubbish is on every other phone's market place as well...just more of it
lol, I registered to answer this question.
Alot of people are correct in this thread.. Developers are just try to quickly recoup their $99 investment. There is some low lying fruit that can quickly make a buck in a marketplace that has relatively no competition. Flashlights / farts / quotes / bartenders / etc are very easy to make and are a good introduction to new wp7 developers.
What I really came here to say though, is that there is a BIG onus on US to review and rate these apps. We should rate and review every single app we use. Even if you give it a low rating it will push apps that noone even bought lower on the list. I've seen a few free apps with 0 reviews.. this should not happen.
I have an app in development that should be above mediocre, but it takes time and I only got my device for testing 2 days ago. So be patient, we're churning them out.
itchison said:
lol, I registered to answer this question.
Alot of people are correct in this thread.. Developers are just try to quickly recoup their $99 investment. There is some low lying fruit that can quickly make a buck in a marketplace that has relatively no competition. Flashlights / farts / quotes / bartenders / etc are very easy to make and are a good introduction to new wp7 developers.
What I really came here to say though, is that there is a BIG onus on US to review and rate these apps. We should rate and review every single app we use. Even if you give it a low rating it will push apps that noone even bought lower on the list. I've seen a few free apps with 0 reviews.. this should not happen.
I have an app in development that should be above mediocre, but it takes time and I only got my device for testing 2 days ago. So be patient, we're churning them out.
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Thank you for this bit of reminder. Even when I was in Android, I made good use of the rating system...in WinMo on the HD2 also...and I most of the time forgot to rate them myself.
All these app stores, Apple, Android and Microsoft's, suffer the same problem that there's a glut of garbage in them. I can't speak for Android's as I haven't used it in ages but the problem with Apple's is their lousy rating and review system and poor (if any) filtering. I suspect the Apple and Android stores will probably always look like the software version of a garage sale but my hope is that Microsoft identifies and comes up with a good solution to the problem. Being able to sort based on units sold over a period of time, for example, would cause the real trash to immediately sink to the bottom and out of sight regardless of rating. A great fart board is still a fart board, for example, and how many of any individual app is going to be sold? Out of sight, out of mind.
I am a user of W10M and I was very impressed with the development potential that exists in this forum and also intrigued to think there has not arisen some great big hit app for Windows Phone from some kind of collaborative development from here.
Anyone here have no interest making an app to meet a demand like a really good youtube app or something else?
Windows Phone lack of good apps and if there someplace in the world that can change this reality is here, probably. There is so much to do and here are met very skilled people... I don't know... seems like everything is laying arround here, like tools, knowledge, experience, time, computing resources, even the good will, and etc... Let's face it, today Windows users depends, almost tottaly, on the development of people like you guys, just like the Linux community do... it's the only way, I think...
raphaelsolis said:
I am a user of W10M and I was very impressed with the development potential that exists in this forum and also intrigued to think there has not arisen some great big hit app for Windows Phone from some kind of collaborative development from here.
Anyone here have no interest making an app to meet a demand like a really good youtube app or something else?
Windows Phone lack of good apps and if there someplace in the world that can change this reality is here, probably. There is so much to do and here are met very skilled people... I don't know... seems like everything is laying arround here, like tools, knowledge, experience, time, computing resources, even the good will, and etc... Let's face it, today Windows users depends, almost tottaly, on the development of people like you guys, just like the Linux community do... it's the only way, I think...
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Really, the main apps missing don't come from independent developers, but from banks, stores, public transportation/airports/airlines, schools, etc.
Until market share picks up, or we make enough fuss, they won't see it as worth the time and effort to deploy apps for windows phone.
here in Croatia, for example, we have bunch of banking apps (almost all banks here have windows apps) because we were annoying
for my bank PBZ, we gathered and every week sent requirements for banks apps six months. Today we have:
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/apps/mpbz/9nblggh093bh
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/apps/pbzmtoken/9nblggh0f4rr
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/apps/mpbzcom/9nblgggzkjmg
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/apps/american-express-myaccount/9nblggh52jmn
https://www.microsoft.com/hr-hr/store/p/pbz-wave-2-pay-sticker/9wzdncrdjzv4
so, dont be lazy. find people who want some apps also, and every week send request for apps to banks, developers... and maybe you got apps...
P:S
here is apps from other banks here:
https://www.microsoft.com/hr-hr/store/p/addiko-mobile-hrvatska/9nblggh0k1m0
https://www.microsoft.com/hr-hr/store/apps/m-zaba/9nblggh0fv21
https://www.microsoft.com/hr-hr/store/apps/m-zabaps/9wzdncrdt4n0
https://www.microsoft.com/hr-hr/store/p/poba-m-token/9nblggh0jxxl
https://www.microsoft.com/hr-hr/store/p/rba-na-dlanu/9wzdncrdl8v0
user107 said:
Really, the main apps missing don't come from independent developers, but from banks, stores, public transportation/airports/airlines, schools, etc.
Until market share picks up, or we make enough fuss, they won't see it as worth the time and effort to deploy apps for windows phone.
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Oh, sorry I have no idea about this fact.
In my experience I see the big majority are shytty unofficial apps and unofficial clients for the big apps we don't have a official version yet, this big majority apps comes from individual developers or small software houses, and the official versions are kind of shytty too, because all lacks of important features, this is what actually we have at our disposal: a bone to the dogs, the leftovers, this is what they have to offer to W10M users. My point is: if we want to have something really good, this will have to come from us, because we are the only people who actually cares with this O.S.
dxdy said:
here in Croatia, for example, we have bunch of banking apps (almost all banks here have windows apps) because we were annoying
for my bank PBZ, we gathered and every week sent requirements for banks apps six months. Today we have:
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/apps/mpbz/9nblggh093bh
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/apps/pbzmtoken/9nblggh0f4rr
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/apps/mpbzcom/9nblgggzkjmg
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/apps/american-express-myaccount/9nblggh52jmn
https://www.microsoft.com/hr-hr/store/p/pbz-wave-2-pay-sticker/9wzdncrdjzv4
so, dont be lazy. find people who want some apps also, and every week send request for apps to banks, developers... and maybe you got apps...
P:S
here is apps from other banks here:
https://www.microsoft.com/hr-hr/store/p/addiko-mobile-hrvatska/9nblggh0k1m0
https://www.microsoft.com/hr-hr/store/apps/m-zaba/9nblggh0fv21
https://www.microsoft.com/hr-hr/store/apps/m-zabaps/9wzdncrdt4n0
https://www.microsoft.com/hr-hr/store/p/poba-m-token/9nblggh0jxxl
https://www.microsoft.com/hr-hr/store/p/rba-na-dlanu/9wzdncrdl8v0
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Click to collapse
Dude... I'm not lazy... at all my friend... Maybe you don't get what is my point here, I don't want make a fuss like a children begging for something, I want more, we deserve dignity and respect too... The fuss was made already along the years, and we have not been heard, they just shut up us with a pacifier, some diversion to take our attention... until today we don't have even a good FB app, we have a official app but it don't have live streaming and video calls on FB messeger, we always have less then the others plataforms. Linux is the example for us here, they are by himself and they are going well. We have to send a message with a really good big hit app like Youtube or something else...
raphaelsolis said:
I don't want make a fuss like a children begging for something, I want more, we deserve dignity and respect too... The fuss was made already, along the years and we have not been heard, they just shut up us with a pacifier, some diversion to take our attention...
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Are you familiar with the idiom "The squeaky wheel gets the oil"?
user107 said:
Are you familiar with the idiom "The squeaky wheel gets the oil"?
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No, it's new to me. I'm not familiar with english idioms, but I get it...
Like I said, we squeak for a long time and no one seems to care about... They doesn't oil this squeaky wheel, they just make a palliative repair to temporarily stop our noise. They seems not interested in take action to solve the problem once and for all.
My point is: if we could make this great free app (wich we will not do, I know), it will make their irresponsibility with us something embarrassing to then (Google and Microsoft), worldwide. That would be a big squeak.
I wanted a awesome Windows 10 Mobile experience. That is what we paid for, and that we deserve, like the others plataforms are getting.
Big companies (Facebook, Google) are just rich, stupid and cocky... today they are only interested in profit. They are faceless money-sucking parasites who don't care nothing about the users needs from a minor low-profit plataform. We are just a problem to cover up.
But we in other hand (me, at last), have pride. We are enthusiasts and care about this. and we should take care of this situation, that's what I think...
raphaelsolis said:
My point is: if we could make this great free app (wich we will not do, I know), it will make their irresponsibility with us something embarrassing to then (Google and Microsoft), worldwide.
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It's wishful thinking, but we (independent developers) simply do not have access to necessary APIs to develop third-party apps.
Many things can be taken care of through the browser, but still that is not enough in some instances (like my city's public transport system).
Again, you won't do much just ranting here.
You must harass them (facebook, google, etc) daily if necessary.
raphaelsolis said:
Big companies (Facebook, Google) are just rich, stupid and cocky... today they are only interested in profit. They are faceless money-sucking parasites who don't care nothing about the users needs from a minor low-profit plataform. We are just a problem to cover up.
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Businesses must care about profit first, for the owners and shareholders. That's a whole idea about business; otherwise please refer to the "communism" or other "-isemes"...
raphaelsolis said:
But we in other hand (me, at last), have pride. We are enthusiasts and care about this. and we should take care of this situation, that's what I think...
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Click to collapse
"Pride" will not cover your time/money/other expenses. You should say "thanks" (in the opposite meaning of this word ) to the M$ who just screwed up a good platform.
Nobody wants to spend money to W10M anymore; there are no W10M jobs on the US market (at all!), many big companies are stopped WP/W10M support at all like Amazon etc. Indie devs are not happy too: if you have good idea, you may earn much more by developing to the other platforms (but you should spend same resources).
P.S. BTW, for your OP: I do have a good apps and games in the store (a lot of) and I always provided my development skills to the community (when I have the time of course)
OK. I gave the shot because here seemed to be the birth place of amazing Android mods like the cyanogenmods and some Windows Hacks... I thought app development for this guys was a child's play.
And, just to make clear about the APIs, I insisted in Youtube App because I know the paid app Metro Tube and seemed possible to do.
But you are totally right, it's wishful thinking...
Thanks for attention.
sensboston said:
Businesses must care about profit first, for the owners and shareholders. That's a whole idea about business; otherwise please refer to the "communism" or other "-isemes"...
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Click to collapse
Yes, but not related. Big companies (Google and Facebook) started operations totally focused in offer something cool to users and make money in consequense. Have the users was to whole point. Now they have all the users of the whole world and it changed his attitude and can (stupidly) ignore who are not interesting for them, even if the reason for that is low-profit (but still profit, not a loss), for that I think they are cocky now. That is why I wrote "today" in that sentence. Today is another reality.
sensboston said:
"Pride" will not cover your time/money/other expenses. You should say "thanks" (in the opposite meaning of this word ) to the M$ who just screwed up a good platform.
Nobody wants to spend money to W10M anymore; there are no W10M jobs on the US market (at all!), many big companies are stopped WP/W10M support at all like Amazon etc. Indie devs are not happy too: if you have good idea, you may earn much more by developing to the other platforms (but you should spend same resources).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pride certainly will not cover. That is why I brought Linux like an example to follow. They work for themselves to serve all the community. Who have the knowledge helps and I believe you will did the same if a project like "W10M Free Youtube App" existed. This seemed our reality from now on...
Nice Apps by the way...
Thats why I want to emphasize: if we want start to reverse this scenario we have to start make something big by ourselves. W10M need apps to raise his market share? let's make the apps... by ourselves.
I believe if W10M show signs of growth it can grow exponentially when companies start to notice this.
raphaelsolis said:
Yes, but not related. Big companies (Google and Facebook) started operations totally focused in offer something cool to users and make money in consequense.
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He-he, I wish to live in your world but "I'm too old for this sh&t" (c)
raphaelsolis said:
That is why I brought Linux like an example to follow. They work for themselves to serve all the community.
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Linux is a different kind of story; by the way, if you'll try to get help from a linux gurus or other kind of open source nerds like ffmpeg guys by the similar way (I mean your opening post), don't get too upset, usual "RTFM" will be a most decent word
Also, apps are created not by "we" or "let's make". The correct question should sounds like: "I created an ultimate youtube app, the sources are located at the https://github.com/blah-blah-blah. Anybody wanna get a try or join development?"...
People usually do what they are like to do; looks like everybody are happy with the youtube mobile site via Edge, as I am.
sensboston said:
He-he, I wish to live in your world but "I'm too old for this sh&t" (c)
Linux is a different kind of story; by the way, if you'll try to get help from a linux gurus or other kind of open source nerds like ffmpeg guys by the similar way (I mean your opening post), don't get too upset, usual "RTFM" will be a most decent word
Also, apps are created not by "we" or "let's make". The correct question should sounds like: "I created an ultimate youtube app, the sources are located at the https://github.com/blah-blah-blah. Anybody wanna get a try or join development?"...
People usually do what they are like to do; looks like everybody are happy with the youtube mobile site via Edge, as I am.
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Click to collapse
Ok... apps can be created by others ways too. Thanks for your interest. There are always a million reasons not to do something...
Let's do nothing and watch this ship sink... it's the best thing do to.
Can you or anyone else tell me how to delete this pointless thread?