Hi All
Not sure if this is potentially a general problem or specific to my build of WM6..
I'm running Dutty's v2 of WM6 - all seems stable on the whole....
Except that if the battery power is at, or below 50% remaining.. when the phone shuts itself into standby & is left for an hour.... No matter what i press.. power button, tapping the screen etc... the phone refuses to wake up....! - (When the battery IS fuller... it DOES spring to life when you tap the power button on the side.)
The green signal light DOES remain flashing all the time though...
Even calling the phone doesn't kick it up the ass.... I just hear the ringing in the earpiece of my land line.. & the tytn remains silent!!
The only way to sort it out is to remove the battery & reboot - pretty crap!?
So is this a BUG? - & if so, something specific to Dutty's build on WM6, OR is this something more generic that other people with different OS's like 'Black' 2.5 or 3.01 are ALSO experiencing???
Your kind answers welcome.
Cheers,
Al
WOW, do a search. This is almost as bad as asking if WM6 is available for Hermes.
Thanks for your POINTLESS ANSWER!
I did a search, & all that is found is page after page of dross, with people saying "it might be this, it might be that... is it the radio version..? is it your storage card, is it too many apps in the background!? BLA BLA BLA
To save time... for all you no-patience types....
WM6 Dutty v2
My radio version: 1.40
storage card 2GB Sandisc... 250MB left, with Tom Tom 6 & European maps... only activated when manually run.
Any background programs like weatherpanel? - NONE
DO you know the Answer or not - YES or NO!?
Don't waste my life with cocky responces. - If there is a definitive SOLUTION, state it, instead of your pompous snobbery!
"Your kind answers welcome." - What's the point of even being polite to you people?
hypersonic said:
Thanks for your POINTLESS ANSWER!
I did a search, & all that is found is page after page of dross, with people saying "it might be this, it might be that... is it the radio version..? is it your storage card, is it too many apps in the background!? BLA BLA BLA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well if you found another thread......
hypersonic said:
Don't waste my life with cocky responces. - If there is a definitive SOLUTION, state it, instead of your pompous snobbery!
"Your kind answers welcome." - What's the point of even being polite to you people?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't waste my time with a new thread to read.....MAYBE post your question in the ORIGINAL thread
wpbear - Reading the thread that i found does not offer up a definative solution.....
Is there one that you know of? - if so then just say it please.
I'm not some teenage snot noob, I'm a 37 year old professional, running a company... I have better & more important things to do with my life than trawl through pages & pages of threads.
Either answer my question with an answer that SOLVES it - or remain silent.
Thankyou
There are other threads on this matter, but no solution has been found yet.
All the WM6 roms I've tried have had this problem.
For me it happens 2/3 times a day if I set IMAP mail to check periodically.
I had this problem with every WM6 rom too. I solved it by disabling the auto download/sync with my IMAP email accounts. I set it to 'manual' to check for email, which is a pain, but my 8525 wakes up every time now. I used to have this problem several times per day regardless if I was going through different singal networks (as people said it was that problem)...also people said it was my memory card, it was not as it happened regardless if that was installed or not.
Once I stopped autodownloading and syncing of my IMAP email, all was fine. i hope this works for you.
This seems like a fairly major bug!
Activesync works fine. Shame you can't sync two exchange accounts over the air! It would be interesting to set up an IMAP server and look at the logs to see where it is getting stuck.
I found also that the mSD card made no difference.
Hmmm
Interesting, i DO have my Pop3 account to auto send/recieve every 10 mins.. I've just disabled it... & shall see what it does...
So this is looking like a WM6 generic bug.... I wonder if Black's 3.01 which is based upon a slightly newer core build from M$ has addressed this.... But i'll wait a while from updating my rom... as it seems pretty stable in all other areas.
Al
P.S . Thanks for the polite & informative replies!!!
It has the same problem and so does the latest LVSW.
It's a bit of a bummer actually! Not sure what to do about it!
Very common problem - no answer
This is the same problem that MANY of us have. I've read its possibly due to the Sandisk microcards (a Kingston is supposably more reliable,) but most people are reporting its due to email checking while the device is in Standby. It has NOT been corrected with the Latest ROMs or OS's. Good luck - if you find an answer let us all know!
hypersonic said:
wpbear - Reading the thread that i found does not offer up a definative solution.....
Is there one that you know of? - if so then just say it please.
I'm not some teenage snot noob, I'm a 37 year old professional, running a company... I have better & more important things to do with my life than trawl through pages & pages of threads.
Either answer my question with an answer that SOLVES it - or remain silent.
Thankyou
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Damn, where did I put that silver platter....
I think that mSD cards can cause the problem, but I've had it happen many times without a card in the slot.
My gut feeling is that something goes wrong while checking the IMAP mail. Remember that the machine is woken by a notification and is in a state where it is on, but the screen and sound are off. I have noted that activesync is much quicker at checking than IMAP. Perhaps it takes too long sometimes and thus becomes stuck.
By any chance are you locking the phone with 'Device Lock'?
My phone (on any version of WM) would lock up at least once per day.
I found that if I stopped locking the phone using device lock and just switched the phone into standby with the power button, it hasn't locked up since.
mitchg said:
This is the same problem that MANY of us have. I've read its possibly due to the Sandisk microcards (a Kingston is supposably more reliable,) but most people are reporting its due to email checking while the device is in Standby. It has NOT been corrected with the Latest ROMs or OS's. Good luck - if you find an answer let us all know!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On my phone I have 100% connected this issue to leaving the WIFI on and letting the phone time out into standbye. While I do have the Taiwan 2GB Sandisc mSD card - the problem happens regardless of if the card is in the phone or not. The problem only ever occurs on my phone if I have the WIFI on and let it timeout. If the WIFI is disabled, it NEVER has this issue and if I manually put the phone into standbye (tapping off button) it almost never has this issue. With WIFI left on, I can expect my phone to freeze on average once or twice a day!
Now there may be many issues that cause this with differnt phones but this is what happens on my phone.
chymmylt said:
On my phone I have 100% connected this issue to leaving the WIFI on and letting the phone time out into standbye. While I do have the Taiwan 2GB Sandisc mSD card - the problem happens regardless of if the card is in the phone or not. The problem only ever occurs on my phone if I have the WIFI on and let it timeout. If the WIFI is disabled, it NEVER has this issue and if I manually put the phone into standbye (tapping off button) it almost never has this issue. With WIFI left on, I can expect my phone to freeze on average once or twice a day!
Now there may be many issues that cause this with differnt phones but this is what happens on my phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't have the problem anymore, but when I did have it using different ROMs it was always when it timed out with WIFI on. Having read all the threads on the subject I to think there are several things which are causing it for different users.
mattlehrer said:
By any chance are you locking the phone with 'Device Lock'?
My phone (on any version of WM) would lock up at least once per day.
I found that if I stopped locking the phone using device lock and just switched the phone into standby with the power button, it hasn't locked up since.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I saw the same problem on my old Prophet. The solution for that phone and it's AKU2.0 ROM was to set backlight and standby timeouts to the same value.
I've had this with:
WiFi off;
Email off;
Device lock off;
Power at 90%+.
And all of the above at the same time, hehe.
With computers, it can be something that appears completely unrelated, that causes the problem.
As an example, I once built a new machine (I've been a custom system builder for more years than I care to remember), that kept coming up with hard drive errors, massive hard drive failures, loss of partitions, you name it. Even with known good hard drives.
I changed the IDE controller. I changed the motherboard. I changed the memory. I changed the CD drive. I changed the powersupply. With all known good components.
Same errors.
I gave up, and went to bed to sleep on it (usually a very good idea when a problem is wearing you down).
In the morning, I realised that the only thing that I hadn't changed at least once, was the graphics card.
Yep, it was the graphics card that was persistently producing hard drive errors, hehe.
My guess is there's some sort of driver incompatibility (some companies have a very bad track record regarding their competence at supplying decent, compatible drivers), or clash with a couple of otherwise unrelated apps. Something like that.
My gut feeling hollers ATi driver (I think I have had more headaches caused by ATi drivers the last approx 20 years, than everything else put together).
Could well be wrong, but might give someone an area to start looking.
"Don't waste my time with a new thread to read.....MAYBE post your question in the ORIGINAL thread"
Thread title was clear enough.
Exercise discretion upon what you click.
It isn't compulsory.
You wasted far more of your own time by answering.
abubasim said:
I saw the same problem on my old Prophet. The solution for that phone and it's AKU2.0 ROM was to set backlight and standby timeouts to the same value.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My Hermes has the same problem and only when the screen/buttons are locked. I will try to set the timeouts as you suggested and see what happens. It was not a problem in Black 2.0.
Hi
Regarding Wifi... I usuall have it off, unless i'm using it.... so it can't be that.
I disabled my mail account auto connection last night... & left the phone....
Now it WAS plugged into the charger, but upon clicking on the phone power button this morning, it DID come out of Standby!!!
However... as i noticed already, when the battery is full or over 50% it did seem to want to come out of standby.... only when the battery starts to run low, did it refuse to wake up...
I'll let the power run down today.. & let standby activate..... now that the email auto connect is disabled, if it DOES still fail when the battery is getting low... then we know it is something to do with the power...
If it DOES come on, with low power, then it will point towards the email problem...
"set backlight and standby timeouts to the same value." = Well this is an interesting little quirk..... I'll give it a try too. - Cheers
I'll let you know.
Al
Related
When ever the phone is in standby for a few minutes or so, it refuses to power back on when I press the power button. The only way to bring the phone back is a soft reset. While it is frozen in standby mode it does not receive phones calls, emails or texts. Im running lvsw 03-26. I noticed it didn’t happen with lvsw 3-20…but it was happening with both versions of xda live. I did a few hard resets to see if that will get rid of it…but nothing. I tried searching high and low on the site and even read wiki for answers but no one seems to know what is going on. I saw a few people post up the same issue but still no help….so I decided to open a new thread. Can anyone help?
It happens. Do you have a Storage Card in? If so, take it out for a while and see what happens. What 3rd party apps are you using too. I know Wisbar Advance causes this issue. Can you list what you're running and maybe I can see if you're having the same problem I was.
I've had the same problem with most WM6 roms. Having upgraded to BlackEd2.0 the problem seems to have gone though...
are you running a today plugin off storage card perhaps?
none of the roms i've tried had power on problems
Sometimes you can have that problem with having a cluttered SD Card or having a program that is accessing online in the background.
I have a 512 storage card. I’m not running much 3rd party apps…I have Mundu IM, Microsoft live search, Google maps, WM black commander, macromedia flash player active x…and that’s it. I Had mundu, live search and Google maps installed to my storage card. After reading rabanJR’s post, I uninstalled them from the card and installed them to the phone. I then went back to the card and deleted all program folders and files….I also did a general clean up of the card. Lets see what happens now.
Also to swampy…im not running much of anything on my today screen….just the messages, calendar and the com manager plug in that came with the rom. That’s all. Lets hope for the best.
Bad news, it froze up twice again today. I’m all out of ideas….any more suggestions?
funny thing, that just happened to me today. greed led was flashing, but i couldn't get out of standby mode without soft resetting. maybe some kinda software issue? Its the first time it's happened to me since going to wm6. i did notice it before however.
rzanology said:
Bad news, it froze up twice again today. I’m all out of ideas….any more suggestions?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
maybe try a hard reset?
What Radio Rom?
Have you flashed a new radio lately? If not, what radio ROM version do you have? I had an issue with my TyTN that was definitely a radio issue. Flashed to 1.38.0.11 and haven't had a single issue with freezing since.
Just an idea, of course.
rzanology said:
Bad news, it froze up twice again today. I’m all out of ideas….any more suggestions?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes sir...i tried many hard resets. A radio upgrade is one of the things i tried...i saw a few people trying it. i went to 1.34 though. im going to flash to 1.38 riiight now! im desperate right now. i'll let you know how it goes.
I had the same problem until I upgraded to black 2.0. I had the radio 1.38.0.11 from the time I upgraded to wm6 and my 8525 was freezing until upgrading to black 2.0 solved my problem.
well i have good news. i upgraded to LVSW(2007/04/08) last night...and so far so good. didnt freeze once today. hope the issue is gone for good. thanks all for the help.
same exact issue here running LVSW 03-26 (goes unresponsive while in standby, green blinking LED, soft reset to recover). 2gb card installed...i'll try removing it to see if freezes go away.
rzanology: if LVSW 04/08 fixes the issue, please post back and let us know!
installed (all to device, not card)
salling clicker
resco explorer/registry/ftp/today
kyphur hold comm button toggle
wmxl apps 8525 keyboard fix
shogun cing
will do...one more note...i updated to 1.38.11 i think it was. what funny is right after i updated the radio the phone froze on the first standby. while i was coming back to post i saw the new rom update for lvsw.
This has a been a long reported problem on WM6 ROMs. 'wont wake from sleep' is the common phrase. Radio and bacground app using net I think was the problem, but no real solution if I remember correctly. On LVSW 3 26 I have gone weeks without this though. In the beginning LVSW 3 26 still did the freeze but after a week it stopped and works pretty good now. Sounds like MS is behind it since it makes no sense at all. LOL.
rzanology said:
When ever the phone is in standby for a few minutes or so, it refuses to power back on when I press the power button. The only way to bring the phone back is a soft reset. While it is frozen in standby mode it does not receive phones calls, emails or texts. Im running lvsw 03-26. I noticed it didn’t happen with lvsw 3-20…but it was happening with both versions of xda live. I did a few hard resets to see if that will get rid of it…but nothing. I tried searching high and low on the site and even read wiki for answers but no one seems to know what is going on. I saw a few people post up the same issue but still no help….so I decided to open a new thread. Can anyone help?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow, I thought I was crazy becasue nobody mentioned this issue before. I had this problem from day 1.
However, i recently noticed that the 1.38 Radio was eating up my battery life and downgraded to 1.34. This combined with installing Black2.0 seems to have taken care of this problem. I just came back from a weekend away from my phone (which i know is a crime since it is so much fun to use) and it woke up right away.
What Radio do you have?
How long are your phones in standby when it happens?
well....bad news again. even after the new rom update it is still freezing. do you guys think this is hardware? I never froze on wm5...i can't see it being a hardware issue. im almost tempted to call cingular and have them send another one, but i dont know how to go back to wm5. for me, the phone will be in standby for 30 minutes or so....then wont turn back on. any more suggestions?
try disabling everything completely.
1 events and notifications
2 beam auto receive
3 bluetooth
4 wifi
5 put device into flight mode
6 all startup items (including those in rom) move to a temp for now
7 disable activesync
8 disable push email
9 disable all today items
1. disable error reporting customer experience
11 remove anything that reads the sd card
12 remove sd card entirely
13 remove sim card
literally disable everything that runs automatically or otherwise.
power down ur phone by pressing power button for 3 secs. shutdown. leave it for 20secs.
power it back up. then test it now.
if u have a problem now then it could be scary bear notifications fix only. u could have a notification queu problem that is causing ur device to contradicory items simultaneously.
this could be caused activesync so no matter which rom u use it comes back via activesync of calendar or tasks.
if at this stage its fixed then bring things back systematically with the most important first like the sim card. turn off flight mode
c how u go. sometimes pda just gets confused and doesnt wake up from a sleep to well (bit like me in the morning... sometimes bed and sleep is just way to good compared to work/life)...
good luck.
Hi all,
As many of you have heard (or experienced), many Hermes units seem to exhibit less than stable behavior with the production WM5 ROM, or even some of the cool ones here.
Browsing the other forum, we are all to familiar with:
1 - Camera taking black pictures
2 - SD Card not recognized
3 - System hangs
4 - Unit gets very hot and drains battery
5 - Using the alarms is out of the question due to reliability
etc.
After two months of testing, I have two choices:
A - Go back to my Wizard 8125.
B - Move on up to WM6, and see if these issues will be resolved.
My question for those of you have taken the WM6 leap is:
"If you have experienced annoying system hangs, battery drains, and so forth, with WM5, have these issues been resolved when you upgraded to WM6?"
I want so badly to stick with the Hermes, and I'd love to learn all about the various WM6's ROMs... But not if this unit will be as unstable as before.
Any quick thoughts would be appreciated.
I'm ready to hit this forum and the wiki, and learn all there is to know about WM6... but NOT if this unit is still going act up.
I eagerly await your quick replies!
To be honest, I think WM6 is more stable overall compared to WM5 on my 8525.
I also have an 8125, and I have WM6 on that as well. The differences in functionality and the nice new interface are well worth it. The key (in my opinion) is to pick a ROM without all the extra 'garbage' added in, and be careful about the 3rd party apps you add. The core OS is very solid.
Generally speaking WM6 is faster with less hangs.
My only gripe with it is that after you have about 300 sms messages, typing gets slow .... like really delayed ... to solve this i turned the Autospeller thingy off, and it seems to be working flawlessly now!
Compatability is great, it actually just WORKS! .... *cough* most of the time *cough* ... no seriously it rarely hangs, and only the really old applications don't seem to run.
Alarms, christ don't get me started ... i personally just add a calender entry, with the alarm function turned on, it always works and reminds me 15 mins earlier than the desired time
My unit only gets hot while in my pocket a lot or while charging ... i have radio rom 1.41 and the battery life is good, but not as good, i advise 1.40 (for my device it worked best)
SD card not being recognised? never had that problem with WM6
Camera taking black pictures? ... well moving it out into the light generally helps, but out of 300 pictures so far none have been black!
i've also noticed that boot times are slightly quicker
and using IE is MUCH faster and smoother
WM6 is more visually pleasing and is smoother with less hangs. I'm using Sleuth's VARIANT of LVSW ... and its good, i'm an anti-black guy, Black just doesnt do it for me, too unreliable (IMHO!) but well done to JJ for it all, i'm not knocking him, just my personal experience
dropped calls or missed calls are a thing of the past with WM6, i suffered SO MANY during WM5 ... also the lack of OEM images is good, byebye orange customisations horay!! (backup your extended rom 1st, it might be useful later on)
i completely agree with the above statement.
WM6 is great. Haven't had any problems with it. but choose your ROM carefully. I use LVSW, and tried Black Dymond. Both were great, i personally had better luck with LVSW. Radio 1.41 seems to be working well for me, I haven't tried 1.40, so i can't speak to the battery life. make the WM6 jump. you won't be sorry.
WM6 works for me
I had some of the problems you described with WM5 that came with my JASJAM. I have since upgraded to WM6 using the Elf version of LSVW. It works very well for me so far. The only thing to watch out for is that after installing the WM6, it somehow changed the device id and my WebCamera Plus app would not activate anymore. I have to call the Ateksoft to issue me another activation code.
bchau said:
I had some of the problems you described with WM5 that came with my JASJAM. I have since upgraded to WM6 using the Elf version of LSVW. It works very well for me so far. The only thing to watch out for is that after installing the WM6, it somehow changed the device id and my WebCamera Plus app would not activate anymore. I have to call the Ateksoft to issue me another activation code.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There's always going to be these small problems with an upgrade, but i think it's still agreed that WM5 < WM6
Hey hey!
These first five posts are VERY encouraging!
I am starting to get excited about it now...!
I'll wait to see who else can offer their opinions.
Thanks guys for the great news!
Michael_514 said:
Hey hey!
These first five posts are VERY encouraging!
I am starting to get excited about it now...!
I'll wait to see who else can offer their opinions.
Thanks guys for the great news!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No one elses opinion matters.
My only regret with WM6 is not taking the plunge sooner. See my signature for my configuration.
I am using black dymond 3.5 for past two weeks now and so far it's just rock solid and fast. No hang ups. Quick response to buttons / commands. No drop calls. Smooth operations. Nice visual interface. No complaints what so ever.
My prior cingular rom was stable but too slow and clumsy.
Anybody who is confident in performing upgrade should do it especially as now the risk of bricking the device is very low with Hard SPL 2.10 Olipro.
My 2 cents
Michael_514 said:
Hi all,
A - Go back to my Wizard 8125.
Well, I must say that my experience has been awsome with many of the roms on my 8525 especially JJ's stuff, yes I am a devoted black follower . My experience with the wizard or 8125 was horrible, never modified it at all so i don't know how it does otherwise but I thought it was a piece of ****e.
In conclusion my advice is go wm6 and you will have a new addiction. It is faster, more memory and of course the many other perks like when you get to show your friends that your already runnin wm6 and their stuck with 5
Just follow the steps hard spl, radio then rom and you should be just fine.
I almost forgot, the only times I have experience problems/ instabilities was when I installed things to storage card rather than main memory.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have SoftBank X01HT... I've just upgraded my ppc to Black diamond 3.5 and it works perfect... But I still had the same problem with capturing image in the dark place and it comes up with black picture.. the flash doesn't help at all.. it seems like it's not functional... I hope someone could help me with this... Any Advice? Please feel free to tell me.. I'm waiting.. thanks in advance....
Okay, guys!
I am sold!
I will do my readings; check out the various ROMs, and away I go!
And of course, Hard SPL is a must!
And I agree with the post a few posts back... I am all for a less bloated ROM.
I use my PPC for very specific tasks (Adobe Reader, Outlook, GPS, phone,voice command)... and the less junk/crap/freeware/shareware/malware/utils/bloatware/games I have installed, the better.
I will do some investigating, and I shall take the plunge!!!
Thanks!!!
Michael_514 said:
Hi all,
As many of you have heard (or experienced), many Hermes units seem to exhibit less than stable behavior with the production WM5 ROM, or even some of the cool ones here.
Browsing the other forum, we are all to familiar with:
1 - Camera taking black pictures
2 - SD Card not recognized
3 - System hangs
4 - Unit gets very hot and drains battery
5 - Using the alarms is out of the question due to reliability
etc.
After two months of testing, I have two choices:
A - Go back to my Wizard 8125.
B - Move on up to WM6, and see if these issues will be resolved.
My question for those of you have taken the WM6 leap is:
"If you have experienced annoying system hangs, battery drains, and so forth, with WM5, have these issues been resolved when you upgraded to WM6?"
I want so badly to stick with the Hermes, and I'd love to learn all about the various WM6's ROMs... But not if this unit will be as unstable as before.
Any quick thoughts would be appreciated.
I'm ready to hit this forum and the wiki, and learn all there is to know about WM6... but NOT if this unit is still going act up.
I eagerly await your quick replies!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, I have similar problems. I am trying to find out what's going on and the symptoms are like you say: battery drains too fast. Let's say it the battery gets hot, there's something wrong. If you measure the current usage with ACBPowerMeter you will see a high load, like 300-400ma, even with all stuff off, radio off, wifi off, incoming beams off, bt off etc, nada. Now, if you pull out the battery, leave the device the some hours, then start again, power it up, activate GSM and everything, you should be luck and see a current of maybe as low as 30-60ma, even with full brightness on the display. And one time it was okay the whole day, but then all of a sudden, maybe after I hooked up with Activesync or got an SMS, it's gone bananas again.. sigh.. There's gotta be something strange that's completely wrong. I've tried many radios no difference, I've tried bandswitch to limit to GSM only as I live in a area with maybe not super quality 3G signal, did not sort out the problem yet. I had WM6 from LVSW 19-05-2007 with all kinds of radios, then moved on to Pro Black, same problem, but will no try black dymond as someone else mentioned problem was gone with that ROM.
Please all, anyone else with these problems? Any good ideas what this can be? If the device is off for a long time, and I mean off as in battery pulld out, what difference does that make to having the battery off a short while, let's say some minutes? Is there some memory-stuff here? My device is just a week old, never wanted to use a native language WM5 that was in it, hoping this problem will be fixed..
thanks
Update:
I happened to purchase a faulty device!!! There was indeed a HW error on my brand new device so I got it swapped with another one that works. Not all problems are SW-bugs..
I use WM6 on both my 8525's without significant probs; battery drain seems less with radio v.1.38 than 1.40 or greater although use Band Switch to keep phone on GSM when not cruising the net; initial boot up is faster; I've not had overheating probs, no micro SD card issues . Wish I'd gone to WM6 much sooner, but I think having the Cingular 8525 makes a big difference as well.
My battery gets hot and discharges too quick even with radio off. I've tried all radios, am at 1.34 now, will try the 1.43 later tonight if I am able to fully charge battery quick enough... The thing is, if I remove battery for some hours and start over, it's okay, 40ma, radio on etc. Then, at some random point in time, the phone can just lay on the table untouched, it starts consuming battery as crazy, 300-400ma, measured by ACB Power Meter. It's dricing me nuts... I've tried to kill processes, to watch what's going on... I don't have a clue yet, except from there's something "running wild"..
Update:
I happened to purchase a faulty device!!! There was indeed a HW error on my brand new device so I got it swapped with another one that works. Not all problems are SW-bugs..
Hi all!
Okay, I am taking the plunge!
I think I'll stick with Radio 1.40, which I have instealled. Hard SPL is also installed...
...so, the only decision is to figure out which ROM!
I have rounded the choice down to two, based on what I've read.
I'm either gonna go with LSVW or Elf's version of LSVW.
Both are downloaded and sitting on my hard drive, ready to roll.
I just hope I can still use PocketMirror; iGuidance; and spb Pocket Plus.
We shall see!!!!
Any final suggestions are welcome!!!
Thanks!
What have you got to lose?
Just follow MrVanx's guide and enjoy it.
Unwired,
You actually bring up an EXCELLENT question!
"What have I got to lose?"
The simple answer: Time!
As much as I enjoy my hobby that involves tweaking PC's, PocketPCs, laptops, gadgets, and so forth...
...I am an attorney and I do run a business.
This means my time is very important and quite valuable to me.
For every hour I spend tweaking; resintalling apps; customizing e-mail settings; testing the phone; resyncing my business contacts with PocketMirror; researching the proper registry hacks....
...that is an hour I lose making MONEY!
So... As much as I would lllllllove to play with and test single new ROM and its variant, and as much I enjoy spending my day enjoying playing with the latest and greatest operating systems...
It kills me when I can't service clients, and when I can't run my business, because I am busy YET AGAIN(!) resintalling my PocketPC.
That's why I love getting opinions before I move ahead...!
So there ya go... I have no time to lose!
GilesTheAlmighty said:
Generally speaking WM6 is faster with less hangs.
My only gripe with it is that after you have about 300 sms messages, typing gets slow .... like really delayed ... to solve this i turned the Autospeller thingy off, and it seems to be working flawlessly now!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now i have arround 700 sms in the Inbox and about 500 in sent items, and typing works good for me, with autospell on... i keep copy of all SMS i send/receive since i get my first pda, my loved Wizard...
GilesTheAlmighty said:
Alarms, christ don't get me started ... i personally just add a calender entry, with the alarm function turned on, it always works and reminds me 15 mins earlier than the desired time
SD card not being recognised? never had that problem with WM6
Camera taking black pictures? ... well moving it out into the light generally helps, but out of 300 pictures so far none have been black!
i've also noticed that boot times are slightly quicker
and using IE is MUCH faster and smoother
WM6 is more visually pleasing and is smoother with less hangs. I'm using Sleuth's VARIANT of LVSW ... and its good, i'm an anti-black guy, Black just doesnt do it for me, too unreliable (IMHO!) but well done to JJ for it all, i'm not knocking him, just my personal experience
dropped calls or missed calls are a thing of the past with WM6, i suffered SO MANY during WM5 ... also the lack of OEM images is good, byebye orange customisations horay!! (backup your extended rom 1st, it might be useful later on)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really the difference is not only the ROM you use, but what you do with the ROM...this causes ppl talking about one ROM so quick and other ROM so slow, if you take a search, someone (don't remember) make a speed test after HR every ROM, and the results shows the ROMs aren't so different.
Of course if you havn't time for this, this isn't your forum
Regards.
I noticed this after I set up direct push email. Wondering if anyone else is having the same issue.
BTW I'm using the Premier Plus Rom and Mail 2 Web free push service
mine is, dont know why but just started recently after re flashing to artemies love rom 4.1.
Sometimes it shuts down when it wants to, freezes when it wants to and received sms notification dont work even after you have set it in the phone settings.
I reckon didnt flash properly so i am going to do it again. I hate flashing.
illusion786 said:
mine is, dont know why but just started recently after re flashing to artemies love rom 4.1.
Sometimes it shuts down when it wants to, freezes when it wants to and received sms notification dont work even after you have set it in the phone settings.
I reckon didnt flash properly so i am going to do it again. I hate flashing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanx for replying but I think I've narrowed it down to a storage card issue. i noticed that it woud freeze for abouta full minute when I had a particular program open that I run from the storage card. I moved it to the Device memory and today it still froze, but I could at least turn the device on and off.
Now that I think about it, I noticed this freezing after i reflashed to the Premium Plus ROM with SDHC support. I upgraded from a 2GB Card to a 4GB Card. So it could be the SDHC drivers or just the card itself. I'm going to switch back to the 2GB card for a few days to see if it happens again.
That's as far as I'll gotten. These observations were made after a hard reset.
And I know what you mean about reflashing. You hare to reinstall everything. But it's good to do at least once a year.
illusion786 said:
mine is, dont know why but just started recently after re flashing to artemies love rom 4.1.
Sometimes it shuts down when it wants to, freezes when it wants to and received sms notification dont work even after you have set it in the phone settings.
I reckon didnt flash properly so i am going to do it again. I hate flashing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have very similar issues on mine.
I had the Oops v1.0 on it, then thought it had been a while since I last flashed, and perhaps that was the reason it froze often no logical reason to think this ! I KNOW).
So I flashed it with another ROM, and it does exactly the same. I have searched on this forum and seen some HTC do this as well.
UPDATE:
I have now narrowed it down to this:
I discovered that if I restart my Atremis and use it as normal or leave it on a stable table or side bed, it works OK, but if I slip it into my pocket for a minute it freezes....or if I place it in the same space/place/pocket/bag with my BB Pearl it just freezes....AMAZING !
I will be very stunned...yes stunned if their any solution to this...
Feel free to stun me !
I dont have any input on the issues you guys are having but I think i solved my own problem. I moved two programs from the storage card to the main memory and it hasnt come back. Actually, I think it was just the 2nd program.
I'm using an older ROM though: O2 Premium Plus by Meschle (now retired). I've stuck with this ROM because it's been the most stable for me.
UPDATE
I have very similar issues on mine.
I had the Oops v1.0 on it, then thought it had been a while since I last flashed, and perhaps that was the reason it froze often no logical reason to think this ! I KNOW).
So I flashed it with another ROM, and it does exactly the same. I have searched on this forum and seen some HTC do this as well.
UPDATE:
I have now narrowed it down to this:
I discovered that if I restart my Atremis and use it as normal or leave it on a stable table or side bed, it works OK, but if I slip it into my pocket for a minute it freezes....or if I place it in the same space/place/pocket/bag with my BB Pearl it just freezes....AMAZING !
I will be very stunned...yes stunned if their any solution to this...
Feel free to stun me !
Possible solution
Hello,
first of all when you experience any kind of freezing, run a full scandisk in Pocket Mechanic, then Check Notification queue in the same app.
Also check Start - settings - system - Key lock , make sure that you select "Lock all buttons except power" (first option). Restart your Artemis and try if the problem happens again.
Well it's been a week and I haven't had the freeze come back after I moved a couple programs from my storage card to my device. Both were programs with an application (small) and a huge database on the storage card (Oxford Spanish Dictionary & iSilo data base). I noticed that I always got the freeze when one or both of these applications was running.
So, of course, the data base info is still on the storage card but the applications are saved under Windows/Programs. No more freezes. And when I mentioned freeze, I ment that the phone would be extremely slow to respond to inputs. I would wait about 30 to 60 seconds for it to respond. If I pushed the power button 3 or 4 times, like a minute later I would get the screen flashing on and off so it's registering the commands. I wasn't sure if this was the same type of freezing that others were experiencing.
I'm thinking it has something to do with the card or the drivers for the SDHC. I never had this problem without the SDHC support and my 2GB card. Just FYI
nik3r said:
Hello,
first of all when you experience any kind of freezing, run a full scandisk in Pocket Mechanic, then Check Notification queue in the same app.
Also check Start - settings - system - Key lock , make sure that you select "Lock all buttons except power" (first option). Restart your Artemis and try if the problem happens again.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As funny as it may sound.
I did the above and noticed a few days after, that the freezing is now reduced....still happens from time to time, though not as frequently as it used to...
What is the logic?
I assumed it was due to my frequent ROMing of my Atremis....guess patience has now paid off, but seriously and technically, I would want to be able to explain what is happening !
I had the Standby of Death SOD this is when the phone fails to come out of standby with a power button press. This issue only affects some people on some networks. I'm not sure if its a network problem or a software problem but as only a minority of people have it, I suspect its mainly a network problem there is a software solution.
The solution is to change the phone settings band option from auto 3G/2G to either 3G Only (WCDMA + UTMS 2100 in Europe) or 2G Only (GSM + AUTO) depending on your requirements.
Also read this thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=540943&highlight=standby&page=2where the resolution was to get a new SIM.
Obviously this only solves the problem when the crash is because of the sim and/or settings which impact the sim. To rule out a software cause its best to start with a hard reset.
I'm at my wits end, and I'm desperate for a fix.
I have a Touch Pro 2 with Verizon, and it originally had WM 6.1 preloaded, which was ok, although there were quite a few issues that made the phone very unpleasant.
After a few months, a Verizon tech suggested that I upgrade to WM 6.5, which I did. Although it did seem to clear up the issues, I soon found out that 6.5 brought a whole host of new ones that weren't just a nuisance, they were devastating.
Chief among all the problems is this issue I'm having with SMS's. tmail.exe now locks up the phone all the time. Initially, I thought that the problem was the 2000+ texts on my phone, but even after removing over 1800 of them the problem persists.
In desperation, I spent hours upon hours reading the forums here and in many other places to try and figure this problem out. Of course, both Verizon and HTC were useless. I finally changed my ROM to mightyrom, and even after tweaking the **** out of my phone, the problem persists.
Basically, what it does is this. If the backlight turns off, it won't turn on again over 75% of the time, at least not immediately. Sometimes it takes a good 2-5 minutes to turn back on, and even then the sms program is lagging the hell out of my phone.
If the backlight is on and a new text is received, it could take upwards of 45 seconds for the phone to regain functionality enough for me to look at the damn thing.
I've removed the text tab from the Touch Flo menu, and now I use the standard sms program. I try to kill the damn sms program every chance I get, and I installed process manager specifically for this task, and nothing, and I mean NOTHING that I've tried has fixed the problem.
I am at my wits end, and I seriously do not know what else to do. If this goddamn problem was fixed, the phone would be incredible and perfect and make me very happy. The rest of it's quirks are very manageable and a tiny insignificant nuisance compared to this nightmare issue.
I beg you, please give me a little of your time and please please please help me.
You have my most humble thanks.
Do a hard reset and do not tweak the f*** out of your phone. Do you still have the issue when running "plain vanilla?"
Sounds like your gettings SOD's (sleep of death) a common fix for that is to task 29 between flashes.
And HTC Messenger is terrible! I recommend finding a ROM without HTC messenger(energy for example)
Allways remember to task 29 between flashes. and you will need to enter bootloader(vol down + power while rebooting) after doing this to sync with your pc or use the sd card install method.
GOOD LUCK my friend!
schmenge said:
Do a hard reset and do not tweak the f*** out of your phone. Do you still have the issue when running "plain vanilla?"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, and that's the problem. Both a clean install of WM 6.5 and mighty rom had the same SMS issue. The only reason I've done any tweaking is to resolve this issue. I would be absolutely thrilled if a hard reset would fix the problem, and I would stop adding things immediately were that the case.
Instead, the issue arises immediately and then I spend hours trying to fix it.
It's very sad.
mrbox23 said:
Sounds like your gettings SOD's (sleep of death) a common fix for that is to task 29 between flashes.
And HTC Messenger is terrible! I recommend finding a ROM without HTC messenger(energy for example)
Allways remember to task 29 between flashes. and you will need to enter bootloader(vol down + power while rebooting) after doing this to sync with your pc or use the sd card install method.
GOOD LUCK my friend!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow. While I appreciate your reply, I have to admit that what you just said made me feel stupid. I think I'm going to have to reread this post a few hundred times coupled with a couple dozen google searches to understand it.
Well if you get stuck pm me or post here ill help u out theres also .cabs to remove htc messenger....... i have them if you want
mrbox23 said:
Well if you get stuck pm me or post here ill help u out theres also .cabs to remove htc messenger....... i have them if you want
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That would be awesome. So they basically allow me to only have the normal WM tmail program on my device? If so, I def want them. Maybe that will solve the problem.
id flash the ROM again. like energy or one without htc messenger in it. the zenyee cab is not perfect best to have a ROM that has never seen htc messenger
So here's a typical day with WP7.
Wake up, unplug phone from PC. I had left it to sync overnight, because for some reason Zune wasn't syncing a particular photos subfolder (1), so I removed the whole lot and resynced over 6,000 photos while I slept. Found the phone was only half-charged (2). Plugged it into the mains while I got ready for work.
Saw there was an update for Board Express Pro, downloaded it but it failed, as I'm using the trial (3).
As I left for work, I went to hit PLAY on my music, expecting to carry on listening to the music I had last night, but in the dropdown music controls, it displayed just a blank. So I had to reselect the album (4).
On the train, sat at the station waiting to leave, I went to access Game Chest: Logic Games to make my next chess move in the ongoing game against my wife. The phone spent ages starting up the game, then informed me, despite having a 3G connection, that it couldn't connect to the game (5). Tried two or three more times (6). No dice. Decided to try Alphajax, but on starting that up, it complained it couldn't obtain push notifications (7). It asked me to restart my phone, which I did (8). The restart got stuck at the "Windows Phone" splash screen for about two minutes - it normally takes a couple of seconds, so that was a worry (9). Eventually I got my home screen, so I went back into Alphajax and got the same message again (10). So no push updates any more for that game. Went back to my home screen and noticed that I'm also not getting tile updates for either Flixster (11) or Flickr (12). Decided to play a bit of Sudoku (Game Chest: Logic Games). I always use a bluetooth headset, and partway through the game something happened and the sounds stopped coming through (13). I had to go into SETTINGS and disconnect my headset, then reconnect to get it working again (14).
I went into Marketplace to look for an app to keep my ten-pin bowling scores in. I found a couple, but they both keep the scores on the phone with no way to sync to my PC or to the cloud, hence they're useless because if my phone breaks, gets stolen or hard resets itself, I stand to lose the entire bowling score history that I'd have inputted to the app (15). So I knocked up a spreadsheet and emailed it to my phone (no easy way to get it onto the phone (16)). When I opened the sheet on the phone, I found just about all the formatting had vanished and several of the centered headings were invisible (17). So I made up my mind to keep my scores in a notebook while bowling and enter them into a spreadsheet on my PC when I get home. So much for smartphones (18).
Now I'm at work, writing this, and have experienced 18 annoyances with my phone in the space of just four hours.
I am seriously starting to get sick of it.
I think I'm on the cusp of going to try out Android! Save me!
The fact is.. we are early adopters. Yes.
And we all know that we would have a problematic phone in our hands when we bought WP7. Then why did I buy this?
Because I was faithful that Microsoft was not going to blow it up. I thought MS was going to update, fix bugs, and try their best, since they have the nicest phone right now.
It's not the bugs that annoy me. It is the fact that the January update turns out to be an April update (yeah, we are 22 March and nothing until now).
And it doens't fix a quarter the problems that we can found in the list of bugs thread.
I share your pain and frustration.
Yesterday I caught myself looking at Nexus S. I'm worried ;/
Still.. since I've balls, I'll stand and wait some more for MS do something useful in this life (oh, yeah, they do sometimes.. Xbox, Win7..)
Don't abandon us!
I don't believe the phone charges while it is in the process of syncing over USB, only when it is in standby, it has been discussed a few times. If you just synced, obviously it accessed your music, so how can you expect it to have not prevented you from accessing it, it does that as a precautionary measure. The trial issue has been discussed a variety of times as well, It's been fixed in NoDo. The games and push notifications could be device specific, as you're the 3rd person I've seen mention this. I use my SkyDrive to move files, or email, I don't see how that isn't "easy." As far as the formatting, good luck finding perfect formatting on Android...
You see, there's no one thing with WP7 that in itself is enough to make me abandon it. It's just the daily grind of all those annoyances that continually grate on me. I'm always sat next to someone playing with their iPhone or Android or Blackberry and some of the time as I'm whizzing through WP7s tiles or playing with some jazzy app I can see them glance over at my phone....and then I'll almost inevitably come to an app that won't open and I'll have to reboot my phone to get it working and I can imagine them chuckling to themselves as I eat humble pie.
It. is. annoying. The potential is there but there are so many let-downs.
There is absolutely no need for this thread to turn into a flamewar.........
If you can offer a potential solution or any relevant information to the points raised by the OP then please dont be shy in putting them forward...
Anything else, dont bother.
That is all.
conantroutman said:
There is absolutely no need for this thread to turn into a flamewar.........
If you can offer a potential solution or any relevant information to the points raised by the OP then please dont be shy in putting them forward...
Anything else, dont bother.
That is all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really don't see why my post had to be edited when it wasn't a 'flame' - maybe his response attacking my thank count was, but mine was asking a question of utilizing available resources. Those that have been posted a variety of times.
FiyaFleye said:
Really don't see why my post had to be edited when it wasn't a 'flame' - maybe his response attacking my thank count was, but mine was asking a question of utilizing available resources. Those that have been posted a variety of times.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dude I was just teasing ya! Anyway I think you've missed the point of the thread. I'm not looking for individual fixes / excuses / workarounds etc etc to each of the individual points. My point is, that was a TYPICAL day spent with WP7, and that all these little things contribute to an overall feeling of malaise with the OS. I've tried to put across that I am a stalwart of WP7 - I have had many many WM5 / 6 / 6.1 / 6.5 phones over the years and went straight to WP7 and yes there is much to like, which is why I'm still clinging to it.
I really just want to guage the mood among other WP7 users - are they experiencing similar malaise to me or not? Is it just me?
FiyaFleye said:
Really don't see why my post had to be edited when it wasn't a 'flame' - maybe his response attacking my thank count was, but mine was asking a question of utilizing available resources. Those that have been posted a variety of times.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That statement wasnt specifically directed at you. You'll notice that posts from multiple users have been deleted in an attempt to bring this thread back on topic.
Let me make this very clear to all concerened.
I expect the next post to be directly related to the isues raised by the OP.
Not discussing the drama this thread has already caused in its short lifespan.
NO MORE OFF TOPIC CHATTER PLEASE!
typical ?
is this a typical day of your phone usage ? I've seen the bug thread, but there aren't a whole lot of folks posting similar accounts of annoyances... there are threads, but not so many all at once, such a short span of time.
I wonder how long since your last reset, and if you reboot it daily, weekly, or just when it becomes unusable ?
id imagine it this is a typical experience that m$ is working pretty hard on it... with the update getting pushed back regularly.
ohgood said:
is this a typical day of your phone usage ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sadly, yeah
I've seen the bug thread, but there aren't a whole lot of folks posting similar accounts of annoyances... there are threads, but not so many all at once, such a short span of time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It wasn't until I started writing them down that I realized just how many there were.
I wonder how long since your last reset, and if you reboot it daily, weekly, or just when it becomes unusable ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did a hard reset a couple of weeks back to cure the push notification issue, but it has returned. I reboot my phone whenever an app asks me to or an app stops working or anything else goes wrong that a reboot might cure. On average, probably about once or twice per day.
id imagine it this is a typical experience that m$ is working pretty hard on it... with the update getting pushed back regularly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The delays in getting the bug fixes are all part of the overall feeling of "meh" I'm getting about WP7.
Obviously you're still very much in love with WP7, which is fine - I wish I was, too, but despite me evangelizing it to all my mates, deep down I don't feel anything like as good about it as I did in October last year.
Actually, I just remembered another thing that went wrong this morning - when I came out of the (constantly crashing) Comica app, the screen graphics went all ape**** and I had to reboot. Again.
To be honest, with this many issues I would be inclined to think that it's a device specific problem.
Do you have any kind of warranty you could claim on?
Sent from my fingers to your face...
I understand a lot of the little frustrations, especially with the update delays, but one thing that did stand out for me is the comment about stability... having to restart your phone to get basic functionality (app launching) going again. I very seldom (less than once a month) have needed to reboot my Focus to get some service or app going again. Some apps do have stability issues for me, but a reboot of the phone doesn't appear to be needed... I can simply relaunch the app in question after it returns to the start menu (sometimes I've had an issue where the app needs a couple of launches to sort itself out).
Are you using a WP7 device with a replaced microSD card, or a Samsung Focus with an added microSD card? The stability issues sound like something that I'd expect to see with a non-compliant microSD card, or some hardware issue with the device. I'm running a Samsung Focus with an added 16 GB card (Ridata, class 6 for the curious), and 20+ GB of space has been used on the phone since Dec., and my device sounds like it is far more stable than yours at the moment.
conantroutman said:
To be honest, with this many issues I would be inclined to think that it's a device specific problem.
Do you have any kind of warranty you could claim on?
Sent from my fingers to your face...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well yeah there's a warranty but most of the issues are either with apps or are known software issues.
VelJharig said:
I understand a lot of the little frustrations, especially with the update delays, but one thing that did stand out for me is the comment about stability... having to restart your phone to get basic functionality (app launching) going again. I very seldom (less than once a month) have needed to reboot my Focus to get some service or app going again. Some apps do have stability issues for me, but a reboot of the phone doesn't appear to be needed... I can simply relaunch the app in question after it returns to the start menu (sometimes I've had an issue where the app needs a couple of launches to sort itself out).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I usually try restarting the app at least three times before I reboot. Rebooting always fixes it.
Are you using a WP7 device with a replaced microSD card, or a Samsung Focus with an added microSD card? The stability issues sound like something that I'd expect to see with a non-compliant microSD card, or some hardware issue with the device. I'm running a Samsung Focus with an added 16 GB card (Ridata, class 6 for the curious), and 20+ GB of space has been used on the phone since Dec., and my device sounds like it is far more stable than yours at the moment.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No it's an HD7 with the stock O2 ROM and stock 16GB card as supplied. I have done nothing to it.
Jim Coleman said:
No it's an HD7 with the stock O2 ROM and stock 16GB card as supplied. I have done nothing to it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
TBH, I think this is the main problem. HTC isn't exactly known for providing great SD cards with their devices.
I encountered similar issues on my HD7 but haven't seen them on either of the Omnia7's or Optimus7 currently available to me.
emigrating said:
TBH, I think this is the main problem. HTC isn't exactly known for providing great SD cards with their devices.
I encountered similar issues on my HD7 but haven't seen them on either of the Omnia7's or Optimus7 currently available to me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But if it was a problem with the storage card, why would rebooting fix it?
If any data on the card was corrupted, it would still be corrupted after the reboot. If it was a transient read error, then retrying would usually work, but it never does.
Jim Coleman said:
But if it was a problem with the storage card, why would rebooting fix it?
If any data on the card was corrupted, it would still be corrupted after the reboot. If it was a transient read error, then retrying would usually work, but it never does.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know for sure, but I reckon the OS gets bogged down over time. Either due to temporary files or running processes. I didn't investigate much myself as I returned the handset after about a week, but others with certain HTC devices (as well as some DVP owners) have said the problems go away by changing the SD card.
It may also be that it's fixed in NoDo as they have reworked the way memory is accessed. I did however see similar issues in the 7008 build on my Omnia7 - which made me revert to the standard 7004.
Hehe, WP7 is piling it on today. Just tried to download an app.
"Can't get this information at the moment. Check again in a little while."
*Sigh*
Jim Coleman said:
But if it was a problem with the storage card, why would rebooting fix it?
If any data on the card was corrupted, it would still be corrupted after the reboot. If it was a transient read error, then retrying would usually work, but it never does.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think we dell venue pro owners are the experts on sd cards and WP7 The known problem with the DVP crashing when using wifi or returning from standby with a black screen is fixed for a lot of people who swapped their sd cards, though not all. For reasons we cant pinpoint WP7 is spectacularly picky about which cards it works with. I myself have tried 2 new cards and have not managed to solve the crashing problem on my DVP.
Quite possibly you are experiencing the same intolerance to certain sd cards on your HD7 as has affected the DVP and possibly a device swap could fix it. I certainly have not experienced the level of individual application failures you have, and that is with a known crash happy device.
I think I will wait for Nodo and see what happens after. There are some bugfixes in Nodo so you never know. Nodo must surely be coming in the next few days.....right?