Related
Now that o2 are producing lots of new non-htc XDA phones, are you going to open up new forum areas to talk about these phones, or is this going to remain an htc only site?
The reason I ask is that a lot of info applies whatever the device manufacturer and the more devices the site coversthe more people that will contribute.
Great point. I support this fully
The XDA stealth is certainly an XDA, yet it is not on XDA developers... Also there has not been much contribution to the atom probably because it was made by quanta
Guys the way I see it this is a HTC forum, there are a lot of phones around but if we stay on one brand then we can provide top info, tools for that brand. You Might allready have seen that there are a few things that cross devices (The BA's country code flashhing error can be over ridden by the Magicans flashing tool)
If we cover all phones then we water down our strong points.
As for the atom, it was a mistake and by the time it was noticed we allready had threads going on.
(Needless to say it might change in the future)
Hi Everybody,
We noticed that there is some confusion when it comes to posting sensitive material on xda-developers.com and mostly about what can and can't be posted.
We would like to clarify our point of view through this post.
Since the start of xda-developers this has always been a site that once in while has some sensitive material online, through the years this site has grown so big it's no longer possible to check every file on our servers or every post on the board, we also feel it wouldn't benefit the community if we did.
However with increased popularity comes an increased amount of legal complaints when sensitive material is found on our servers. Which is the reason why we have been more careful lately. Recently some sensitive material has shown up on the servers and we received legal complaints from companies who have the copyrights for this material, although we all feel this is very interesting and valuable material we cannot risk the future of xda-developers by ignoring the legal requests we receive, therefore this material has been taken offline.
We understand that maintaining the balance between legal and illegal is sometimes confusing and/or difficult but that is unfortunately how it works.
When it comes to posting sensitive material there are a couple suggestions we can make:
- if possible do not post the files on the xda-developers servers.
- use your common sense (if you feel something might not be legal it probably isn't).
- always keep in mind when posting software of any kind, that we will take it offline if there is a legal complaint from the copyright owner.
Warez is in no way accepted and will be removed upon discovery.
I hope this post will serve as a clear and valuable guideline.
Greetz,
Flar
Site admin.
P.s. When you have any questions you can always contact me or one of the moderators.
anyone can contact me also if they have any questions about any files you want to post.. i apparently have no life and spend way to much time on the boards, so you should get a timely response!
I totally agree
It is very important to keep safe a site with so many knowledge and so many resources online. xda-dev and all of its users have done a lot for the community, and I think that if it wasn't for this site, windows mobile devices wouldn't have been so successful.
I agree also. I think you guys do a great job and as members of this family we need to do our part
actually whenever a person types words such as "crack" or "keygen", they should be automatically eliminated or turn into something like "i am a loser".
we've been getting way too much of thieves here recently
I'm still curious about the Dutty Kaiser WM6.1 Rom Link that got removed.
Was that just a link to A rapidshare/megaupload?
Or was that on XDA servers.
Have there been anymore legal complaints about wm6.1 Roms from Kaiser 5.2.19.199 Build now heavily available on many other devices?
need your opinion
hi,
i'm doing this 'directory' for dummies for prophet users.
i made it just because want to make it as easier as it can be to be understand by the beginners.
--> prophet directory for dummies
if you or any other moderators found it is not relevant, do inform PM me.
hoping that this thread can be sticky.
regards..
It's a very tenuous and risky fine line this whole Forum draws when you really look at it.
Every cooked ROM can be looked at as a hack! using proprietory software as its basis.
Every HardSPL can be looked at as a crack! unlocking a device that is specifically locked by a manufacturer.
A keygen is developed as a standalone piece of SW that generates a code that the user decides how he alone will use.
It's all very nice to say HTC "allow" this to happen for developement while not looking anyone directly in the eyes.
Realistically, this site should only contain SW actually and completely written line-by-line by the individual...
We are all guilty in one way or another as everyone here is an accomplice after the fact!
only HTC... ??
An observation ...
This site should be open to other device that HTC.
I had 4 devices HTC, and whenever quality has declined. I believe that the next device will no longer be an HTC.
The manufacturer is rude with its customers (problem of video drivers on Kaiser and Cruise, etc.). HTC does not respond to e-mails. I was a fan of this brand. My next machine will probably be the Samsung SGH-i900 Omnia, which I hope the quality higher than the lasts touchphones HTC ...
It would be really pleasant-XDA Developers focuses on the characteristics of this Samsung Omnia ... and that we produce some new ROM test for this new phone.
But this site is perhaps subsidized by HTC?
Excuse me for my bad English (I only speak french)
well if i may interject myself,
the site should be open to all devices carried that are or will be carried by XDA. Thats the name, and thats how it ought to be. Anachronistic, but elegantly interesting
jeannot61 said:
An observation ...
This site should be open to other device that HTC.
I had 4 devices HTC, and whenever quality has declined. I believe that the next device will no longer be an HTC.
The manufacturer is rude with its customers (problem of video drivers on Kaiser and Cruise, etc.). HTC does not respond to e-mails. I was a fan of this brand. My next machine will probably be the Samsung SGH-i900 Omnia, which I hope the quality higher than the lasts touchphones HTC ...
It would be really pleasant-XDA Developers focuses on the characteristics of this Samsung Omnia ... and that we produce some new ROM test for this new phone.
But this site is perhaps subsidized by HTC?
Excuse me for my bad English (I only speak french)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If HTC Phones where perfect, well there would prolly be less of XDA
But at least Samsung understands what the word Samera Means.
And there is some Unlocking and Cooking going on for a few Non HTC hardware Based phones out there. (Unless i'm wrong and they are HTC hardware base anyway)
But sort of back to the subject.... How about some people selling ROM's made by anyone but themselves on Amazon and whatnot?
That is beyond unsensitive.
If people are doing this. They prolly do this because they can make money of of it.
arent all roms illegal? i mean the phone statment "sorry t be so blatent forgot the actual statment name" but dealing with cellphones the statment, protects people allowing them to return the phones to there original state but not to modify the programing? just wondering probably isnt, hope it was relevant
This thread has aually raised a few questions in my mind.
what is the legality of cooking roms. Obviously cooking an ubuntu mobile rom or an android rom is perfectly legal since that software is under GPL. But my tilt has windows mobile 6 on it with no current upgrade path to winmo 6.1, other than custom cooked roms.
Since at&t has not licsensed winmo6.1 for the tilt yet (or at least hasnt offered it to the public yet) are we basically pirating software it seams likes its the same thing as having a copy of winXP and upgrading with your friends vista disk and a crack.
As far as using SPL cell phone co's have to unlock your phone on request so i dont think theres any issue with that.
I am really looking forward to the new nvidia phones coming out, im hoping they have a big user base like HTC. I must say love my kaiser but its a bit slugish an unfunctional compared to the dell axim i30 i have from 03.
Yes i can imagine as the site has grown it can be harder to keep on top of everything flying around the servers.
Plus with files like you say companies can warn you it it breaches copyright.
I will add again here i am thankful to the mods and members on xda, a very top world website.
Noonski said:
If HTC Phones where perfect, well there would prolly be less of XDA .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am sorry just thought i would point out the spelling mistake, I'll let you edit it.
I have quite good spelling and see some horrible spelling on some websites, not your little spelling mistake but some really bad stuff. I sometimes do the odd mistake more so when i am very tired.
I'm with boorishid on this one
If someone could make this a tab bit clearer to me I would be very appreciative.
Just don't understand where the line is drawn??
In all of the international conventions/treaties as well as demestic laws from various countries regarding the protection of copy rights and intellectual property rights, EXCEPTIONS are always outlined. And always For Educational & Research Puppose is one of the top exceptions.
As far as I understand, Xda-Devs site is mainly a platform for developers to exchange research information. But seems we are lack of DISCLAIMERS to make it clear on nessecary cases.
Certainly 'common sence' is important for every poster to decide what to do.
What I have found out during my stay here is, well basically everything is allowed except cracks / warez.
Anyway M$ knows about this site and has not complained, that means ....
Can chefs add warez / cracks in their ROMs ???
Some how I feel they can!
Check this:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=531181
Although I don't know whether SPB Mobile shell / coreplayer come as standard package with Hermes or not
Addicted2xda said:
Can chefs add warez / cracks in their ROMs ???
Some how I feel they can!
Check this:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=531181
Although I don't know whether SPB Mobile shell / coreplayer come as standard package with Hermes or not
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No,
I've Removed the links and sent a PM.
Dave
After a deep thinking and consideration I thought I need to benchmark the market -or in this case the Forum. I have been having Jasjar (Universal) for quite sometime now and was not so sure whether I keep it or not.
Every span of couple of months new device is launched with this feature or that benefit. Many that have proved functionality and other proved to be a total disgrace to the ppc industry
And since I am a member in this forum for almost over a year now, I wanted to ask all -at least who will visit this thread- how many of those are using Universal and those who are using other devices ranked in this Forum? If any would -thankfully- be coming up with serious statistics of the wide use of Universal vs. other devices and brands this would definitely indicate the global domination of such device and the versatility not to mention that with the latest ROMs this device became more and more dearer to me as much it is to others -I reckon so!
I am sure this would help all those programmers to focus more on developing roms and apps compatible with Universal than others. I would ask anyone who reads this post to contribute in voting and comments would surely be appreciated.
Cyber-mate said:
After a deep thinking and consideration I thought I need to benchmark the market -or in this case the Forum. I have been having Jasjar (Universal) for quite sometime now and was not so sure whether I keep it or not.
Every span of couple of months new device is launched with this feature or that benefit. Many that have proved functionality and other proved to be a total disgrace to the ppc industry
And since I am a member in this forum for almost over a year now, I wanted to ask all -at least who will visit this thread- how many of those are using Universal and those who are using other devices ranked in this Forum? If any would -thankfully- be coming up with serious statistics of the wide use of Universal vs. other devices and brands this would definitely indicate the global domination of such device and the versatility not to mention that with the latest ROMs this device became more and more dearer to me as much it is to others -I reckon so!
I am sure this would help all those programmers to focus more on developing roms and apps compatible with Universal than others. I would ask anyone who reads this post to contribute in voting and comments would surely be appreciated.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why not start a poll?
Universal
Hi Cyber-mate
To let you know; I do love my Universal and I'm using it 24 hours a day!
So I think I'm the first who answers your question
'Yeah... Lets start a poll'.
Cheers, Leo
Hi Cyber-mate
Have to say, I have persevered with the Universal, and that since the genius rom builders on here have cooked up some of their magic I am at last a happy Uni owner. I bought mine in Sep/Oct of 2005 and I can honestly say now I find mine usefull. I'm not a heavy user, but it is my main squeez (so to speak).
Regards
Mavrik
The reason there are so many devices, is because the market can support them as different people like different things.
There is no such thing as the best device, or the perfect device, it's what you think suits your needs the closest.
Currently, the Universal is the highest specification device, but soon the Athena will be out, but this is much larger, and not designed as a mobile pda phone, and also the Omni, which is the replacement for the Universal.
Really though, if you like your Universal, then great, if you don't, then listening to other people's views on what is good or bad will only confuse you.
We like the Universal, but there are many more that hate it.
I love my unversal too, and I think I keep it until I can get an Apple iPhone.
Or maybe I never change it to another device, because it has all thing in one, except GPS. But I can live without it, still we have BT GPS on the market.
Confused!!!...
Not sure what you want!!!...
Benchmark PDA? Yes I like my Universal!!!...
Benchmark Forum? Yes this is a good forum!!!... Of course, somethings are not allowed here but can be found somewhere!!!...
Benchmark self cooked ROM? This is definitely the best before WM6 starts to be banned!!!... If this banned forever, well one good thing less!!!...
HyperMalac said:
I love my unversal too, and I think I keep it until I can get an Apple iPhone.
Or maybe I never change it to another device, because it has all thing in one, except GPS. But I can live without it, still we have BT GPS on the market.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why iPhone?
CWKJ said:
Confused!!!...
Not sure what you want!!!...
Benchmark PDA? Yes I like my Universal!!!...
Benchmark Forum? Yes this is a good forum!!!... Of course, somethings are not allowed here but can be found somewhere!!!...
Benchmark self cooked ROM? This is definitely the best before WM6 starts to be banned!!!... If this banned forever, well one good thing less!!!...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You see CWKJ, there are 100s of opinions from 100s of poeple. However, being a person among a large comunity that consider Universal as a gr8 device that has got the all-in-one! I mean, just check any of those posts with a ROM related topic, you'd see more than 100k entries and with no doubt this indicate that it is widely used and YET proven to be a
top-of-the-list device.
I am sure many more would agree with me and to tell you the truth, Apple IPhone is a pansy one.
We are talking FUNCTIONALITY here and not looks and colors! A device that can connect wirelessly, bluetooth, camera, keyboard and many others proves to be a true Pocket PC.
And hey, one more thing, when we talk about a Pocket PC, we aint talking mobile phone, I mean apple to apple
Hi,
about the Universal, I have to say it's a wonderful device which can be very useful and helpful. Thanks to its VGA display you can browse Internet really well not like those other devices with smaller resolutions.
The "laptop alike" makes it again very useful to write anything, even long texts.
I think about it more like a little laptop replacement (...ok the OS is not really a good OS replacement but I guess this would change with Linux...). It's another way of PPC, since I got my Hermes (about two weeks ago) I see how it's different, I use the Hermes with just one finger (almost everything) while I don't use the keyboard too much....on the other hand with my Uni I almost did everything with the keyboard.
So now with these two devices I have to say I use the Hermes as an "stable" PPC and the universal to try every new ROM is created, I'm trying to learn how to cook them, etc so now I think I'm enjoying the Uni even more!
Hey Everyone,
As mentioned in my earlier post (please read if you have not yet already), we are considering adding non-HTC forums to the site, and are curious to hear which ones should be first. We're considering devices such as the Motorola Droid/CLIQ, plus the Samsung Omnia II and/or Acer neoTouch. What are your thoughts? We're listening!
P.S. The below excerpt is taken from my first post, and should help answer some questions.
svetius; said:
Finally-- and hopefully this doesn't cause a mass uproar-- we are considering the idea of selectively adding non-HTC device forums (focused on Windows Mobile and Android devices). Every day we get requests from users for this, and there's really no good reason why we cannot oblige them. Already the discussion is happening in the general forums. That said, we will only add new forums if: 1. We are confident added traffic won't cause site speed to suffer; 2. We can recruit quality moderators; and 3. The content and discussion is of high quality. The only way to know these things for sure is to try it out. So, within the next 14 days we are going to add two or three non-HTC forums. The delay is to ensure the site continues to operate at a reasonable speed and so we can figure out where to put the new forums (the forum homepage is already absurdly long and cluttered). We are open to suggestions as to deserving devices for our first non-HTC forums, so give us your ideas in this thread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
MOD EDIT - The following devices are due to be added Thursday morning (CET time):
Acer neoTouch F1 S200
Acer Liquid A1 S100
Samsung Omnia II
Toshiba TG01
There may be a slight delay in adding these so no more request for the above devices
HP iPAQ HX4700
HP iPAQ HX4700, even though it is a HTC made device, would love to have a forum for it, willing to moderate as i have plenty of spare time
Much Thanks
Badwolve1
PS, YES!!! Second Post on both threads
Long overdue!
At last !
This is a very nice forum, resourceful , frequented by the "developers" yet user/noob friendly.
People like me were / are dismayed when requests-questions for non HTC devices are placed in the hacking forum where you just cannot keep track of the threads.
More and more WM/android based devices are launched now and we should have a separate forum for them.
Maybe we can first demand a few requests for a particular device before starting a dedicated forum so that it would not fizzle out in the long run and the whole site becomes cluttered unneccessarily.
From my experience, the most requested one is: Omnia
I think the droid should make the first entry, its really popular. But thats just my opinion.
hell,whose idea was this...??
you are breaking our firs tenant which says "made by a firm called HTC"
we stood for the idea for a long time and prevented such forums to be crated and now comes some "user experience admin" who works for the "unhappy samsung motorola crowd" selling some controversial ideas
come on people,don't be ridiculous...
GREAT,just great....you could also say hello to iPhone and crappy nokias....which we fought for a long time.......great job traitor
Yes, OMNIA II and why not iPhone?
An i780 forum won't be bad too. This is the best site for i780 even if it's not (yet) officialy supported. There are several roms for it on xda and there's also an android porting for this device.
Maybe a brand forum will be great too. For example a samsung or acer or anythig else forum with some subforums like rom developemente, q&a and general discussions.
ajhvdb said:
Yes, OMNIA II and why not iPhone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Omnia 2 is winmo, this forum is for WINMO + ANDROID ONLY!!! iPhone can go somewhere else for the people who like it
I still want one for my HTC MADE IPAQ, its in the WIKI under HTC Roadster
but hey this is..or at least was htc forum and not winmo and android forum...so...if we are expanding towards samsung,motorola and some others,why don't we go for apple too
think about it
i mean i'm not supporting any of that but....higher force wants to try it out,so if we are opening our gates for non htcs....apple is also nonhtc...so what's the difference
Toshiba TG01
Acer S200
Omnia 1 and 2
If Xda is considering to open new foruns, lets open for new top mobiles that are/were best sellers
Thanks for the feedback thus far, it's helpful. We're indeed going to stick with just Windows Mobile and Android.
But on the other side allowing non htc mobile will mean let in any mobile. So admins, how will you then manage all this?What about server load and all the technical things it will bring along?And also will there be enough staff to monitor the behaviour of each and everyone? This is no simple question. Right now I see xda dev as a small group providing quality support and devs, what will it be then? Many bloggers refer to xda dev website, it is a turning point on the htc platform. Wont allowing other brands in kill this image?
yash08 said:
But on the other side allowing non htc mobile will mean let in any mobile. So admins, how will you then manage all this?What about server load and all the technical things it will bring along?And also will there be enough staff to monitor the behaviour of each and everyone? This is no simple question. Right now I see xda dev as a small group providing quality support and devs, what will it be then? Many bloggers refer to xda dev website, it is a turning point on the htc platform. Wont allowing other brands in kill this image?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i talked to svetius via pm and this was almost the same thing i said to him
and for the
svetius said:
Thanks for the feedback thus far, it's helpful. We're indeed going to stick with just Windows Mobile and Android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what about "brew" platform which comes with new htc smart
maybe the "xda-developers.com" should be changed to "apple-haters.com" because as i see everything except apple is welcome
just to make it clear....i'm absolutely not voting for apple (although i love macs),i'm just giving you something to think about...pointing finger towards the paradox so everybody could see it
yash08 said:
But on the other side allowing non htc mobile will mean let in any mobile. So admins, how will you then manage all this?What about server load and all the technical things it will bring along?And also will there be enough staff to monitor the behaviour of each and everyone? This is no simple question. Right now I see xda dev as a small group providing quality support and devs, what will it be then? Many bloggers refer to xda dev website, it is a turning point on the htc platform. Wont allowing other brands in kill this image?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As mentioned in my first post earlier today...
We will only add new forums if: 1. We are confident added traffic won't cause site speed to suffer; 2. We can recruit quality moderators; and 3. The content and discussion is of high quality. The only way to know these things for sure is to try it out. So, within the next 14 days we are going to add two or three non-HTC forums. The delay is to ensure the site continues to operate at a reasonable speed and so we can figure out where to put the new forums (the forum homepage is already absurdly long and cluttered). We are open to suggestions as to deserving devices for our first non-HTC forums, so give us your ideas in this thread.
I hope this helps.
I say expand to the iPhone field....wouldn't hurt to add it to the forums....we can say we hate it and that it suxs...whatever. XDA harbors people that want to push their phone's limits. I've been a follower of XDA for a while now, even when I had my iPhone, because the amount of talent in these forums are awesome. I say open the flood gates and bring in iPhone OS to the table. Droid and the new Dell Android would be great as well. My 2 cents
I kind of want to see a forum for the HTC Smart, running that Brew OS and a forum for the Android SE Xperia X10 and WM X2.
farukb said:
but hey this is..or at least was htc forum and not winmo and android forum
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Official or not, this site has ALWAYS been a winmo forum. Given that HTC's devices mostly ran winmo, that's pretty much unavoidable - unless you think that all discussion/development of software that runs on non-HTC winmo devices should be banned, anyway. And the same goes for Android, now that it comprises ~half of HTC's product lineup - unless you think that half of HTC's current phones should be banned from an 'HTC forum'.
YES to new forums
I've been following XDA-Devs for quite some time now (over a year and a half, to be exact) ever since I gleefully bought my AT&T Tilt, and then was frustrated with it within a week. Prior to that, I have owned & happily modded several PPC's. I lurked on these forums for over a year before joining and asking anything. Almost every question I had was answered by patiently searching. So Junior Member, yes. Noob...not quite.
That being said, I am very heavily leaning towards replacing my battle-scarred Tilt with a Samsung Omnia II instead of a TP2 variant. Lots of pros, very few cons, at least for the things I use my device for the most. One of the BIGGEST cons, however, would be that I would lose the guidance, support, knowledge and hard-earned wisdom of the people that post here by straying from HTC.
And so I hesitate.
I've likely read posts into the multiple thousands here, and despite the device or app, or even OS under discussion, one theme runs through it all:
We love messing with our phones.
Better, stronger, faster, smarter, louder, brighter, more fun ..... ad infinitum.
So, for the sake of that common goal, I say add new forums. Break them down by manufacturer. Even iPhones. All those people that bought one, only to discover the limitations of their expensive "cool" new phone? Let's help those poor saps too, ok?
YES to new forums!!
I know I'm going to get my head bitten off for saying this, but in some ways I'm actually not that big a fan of HTC's phones. They're often ridiculously slow to incorporate new tech (such as faster CPUs). They have a very long track-record of failing to include adequate drivers on their phones, so that even when the hardware is respectable, the software cannot take advantage of it. They fail to include important software elements (compare, for example, the video playing applications on HTC phones with what you get on high-end Toshiba or Samsung devices). And they also have a very tiresome philosophy of treating their own products like feature-phones; if you grumble about the fact that some piece of third party software doesn't work properly on an HTC phone, they don't care - not even when the reason it doesn't work is because HTC has failed to include some important drivers; as far as HTC is concerned, any non-HTC software installed on your phone is not their problem, and they'd be happier if you didn't install 3rd party software on it at all. And (compared to Nokia, Samsung, or Sony Ericsson) the cameras are terrible!
And yet, I used to own a Touch Pro2, and I now own an HD2. Why? Because there are three very important things that HTC phones do have going for them.
1) They sometimes have exceptional hardware - not in terms of the internals (like the CPU and GPU), but in terms of the device form factor. The Touch Pro2 has the nicest hardware keyboard I've ever seen on a phone, for example; the HD2 has the nicest screen I've seen on a phone.
2) They do some interesting things with user-interface customisations. The most obvious example of this is Sense UI; but this also includes things like adding pinch-to-zoom support on the HD2.
3) The single biggest advantage HTC phones have, of course, is this forum. There are some very, very smart people here, and the work they produce can transform an HTC phone from mediocre into remarkable.
But... what's going to happen in the WP7S world? Innovative form factors will be a lot harder to achieve, partly because the platform is so locked down, but also because the minimum requirements are set so high. Large-scale customisations of the GUI will also be banned, so HTC WP7S phones can't have Sense UI on them any more. And as for this forum... well, how many keen WM6.x developers around here are likely to become WP7S developers? It seems like most of them are either planning to jump ship to Android, or get out of the free tweaks and utilities game and start selling apps for money through the WP7S marketplace. It's not at all clear that it will even be possible to flash custom ROMs onto a WP7S phone; hell, we may not even be able to edit the registry, for all we know; certainly there will no more .cab installs. So how much of a contribution will this forum be able to make to WP7S devices?
So, while things like the lack of drivers will hopefully no longer be an issue on WP7S phones from HTC (HTC will have no choice but to include them, and MS will write them, so there won't be so much of a problem with Qualcomm being difficult), it is hard to see what features those WP7S HTC devices will have which makes them stand out from the crowd in any meaningful way.
What do you think?
Shasarak said:
I know I'm going to get my head bitten off for saying this, but in some ways I'm actually not that big a fan of HTC's phones. They're often ridiculously slow to incorporate new tech (such as faster CPUs). They have a very long track-record of failing to include adequate drivers on their phones, so that even when the hardware is respectable, the software cannot take advantage of it. They fail to include important software elements (compare, for example, the video playing applications on HTC phones with what you get on high-end Toshiba or Samsung devices). And they also have a very tiresome philosophy of treating their own products like feature-phones; if you grumble about the fact that some piece of third party software doesn't work properly on an HTC phone, they don't care - not even when the reason it doesn't work is because HTC has failed to include some important drivers; as far as HTC is concerned, any non-HTC software installed on your phone is not their problem, and they'd be happier if you didn't install 3rd party software on it at all. And (compared to Nokia, Samsung, or Sony Ericsson) the cameras are terrible!
And yet, I used to own a Touch Pro2, and I now own an HD2. Why? Because there are three very important things that HTC phones do have going for them.
1) They sometimes have exceptional hardware - not in terms of the internals (like the CPU and GPU), but in terms of the device form factor. The Touch Pro2 has the nicest hardware keyboard I've ever seen on a phone, for example; the HD2 has the nicest screen I've seen on a phone.
2) They do some interesting things with user-interface customisations. The most obvious example of this is Sense UI; but this also includes things like adding pinch-to-zoom support on the HD2.
3) The single biggest advantage HTC phones have, of course, is this forum. There are some very, very smart people here, and the work they produce can transform an HTC phone from mediocre into remarkable.
But... what's going to happen in the WP7S world? Innovative form factors will be a lot harder to achieve, partly because the platform is so locked down, but also because the minimum requirements are set so high. Large-scale customisations of the GUI will also be banned, so HTC WP7S phones can't have Sense UI on them any more. And as for this forum... well, how many keen WM6.x developers around here are likely to become WP7S developers? It seems like most of them are either planning to jump ship to Android, or get out of the free tweaks and utilities game and start selling apps for money through the WP7S marketplace. It's not at all clear that it will even be possible to flash custom ROMs onto a WP7S phone; hell, we may not even be able to edit the registry, for all we know; certainly there will no more .cab installs. So how much of a contribution will this forum be able to make to WP7S devices?
So, while things like the lack of drivers will hopefully no longer be an issue on WP7S phones from HTC (HTC will have no choice but to include them, and MS will write them, so there won't be so much of a problem with Qualcomm being difficult), it is hard to see what features those WP7S HTC devices will have which makes them stand out from the crowd in any meaningful way.
What do you think?
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i think htc will depend on sales only on android devices as it is still customizable (which htc is special at and that differes it from other devices ) but when going to wp7 no thing will specialize htc phones so no big sales like before
the only thing they can do is use the most highest specs in the phone to stand out but samsung seems to pull out high spec'ed phones before most of companies.
i was thinking how screwed spb is as they have a lot of software that they can use on wm (shell, keyboard etc) and i know they are making the shell on android but why would someone with android and to spend $30 on a widget based shell when they already have one.
IIRC, SPB was listed as one of the 'key partners' for WP7S, so they must have something cooking!
HTC is a HARDWARE company. When did TouchFlo first come out? With the release of the Touch Diamond right? Not all that long ago (late 2007). I always saw TouchFlo as a "necessary evil" and that HTC was just polishing a turd. They got really good at it and the more recent Sense products are pretty darn good but it's still an adulteration of their core business. They'll continue to exist as a HARDWARE company and they will still do some value-add software development likely through a Sense application that integrates weather, twitter, Footprints, etc.
It'll be interesting to see what SPB comes out with for WP7. Maybe they can still make some kinda shell it just can't be set up to over take the start menu and has to be launched each time you start the device. Of course they would probably need some priveledged API's to do anything worth doing.
Also, I don't just love HTC because of Manilla. I've had HTC devices before manilla ever came out. I just love the design of there hardware. That's what really drives me. Any device can have UI's put on it but you can't just change the design by installing a cab.
Great question here. I agree that despite excellent form factors, nice materials and very decent build quality, HTC failed in many areas of making great devices, and the problem was primarily with software. Even Manila, which I enjoy greatly, is an example of how not to build interfaces - 3000 lua files, no customization, no APIs to hook other services or programs, it is all mediocre stuff on the inside. Drivers have caused many frustrations over the years, they constantly failed to document any APIs they used, and always refused to take into account complaints and requests, repeating their "this is not an entertainment/gaming/whatever device" mantras.
With a software company taking charge of software, I think HTC devices will get much better. So I'm rather optimistic with regard to my possible future use of HTC products.
However, they do lose ability to differentiate themselves from other OEMs with WP7, and their ambitions to become a large cell phone manufacturer in the same league with Nokia & Co. now look a bit too optimistic. So yeah, they may go through some difficult times in search of self-identification.
I just think HTC will continue making phones with WM6.5 and Android. There is no reason why would HTC use WP7 on their phones.
ZaxXx said:
I just think HTC will continue making phones with WM6.5 and Android. There is no reason why would HTC use WP7 on their phones.
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Other than the fact that Microsoft has announced that HTC is one of its major partners on the WP7S project, you mean?
First of all, microsoft dont care about their costumers, we can see that cos theiy did sayd silly excuses about how their new OS wont implement cos some lack of buttons, after that cos lack of some small sume of memory ( ROM ), and they expect from us, to trow into the garbage machines what we did pay 600 eu and to get new i guess with win7 and waste another 600 eu. That is the way how they are working. MONEY , and screw the rest
I'm surprised no one thinks MS won't give a damn if all the WM OEM's give them the finger, they will just contract the manufacture of the hardware out to one of the said OEM's to produce "microsofts" design and specs.......microsoft will make more money, the OEM's like HTC...less, this is imo what the whole point of what they're doing is.....they want total control and a cut of every pie, OS, software, downloadable content, and hardware.....there's not enough money in only producing OS software, and I suspect a point of annoyance at money others make off their platform.
They will FLOURISH :
-geeks like us ( small proportion of marketplace ) will not buy their stuff
-normal people ( huge proportion of marketplace ) will buy their "user-friendly" WP7 stuff
HUGE PROFIT !
ZaxXx said:
I just think HTC will continue making phones with WM6.5 and Android. There is no reason why would HTC use WP7 on their phones.
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just a thought and suspicion HTC will not continue developing devices with wm6.5 for long.
The last official rom updates for Diamond 2 and touch pro2 have sence 2.5. Why? because HTC sees no reason to continue development of sense? so lets just give it all for everyone. Now software vice there is no real differance between a Diamond 2 and HD2 only a compass, footprints and business card reader.
so software vice its like iPhone 3G and 3GS
so it looks like we are on the beta max phone right now
You get aids when you sleep with too many girlfriends and their mom too!
chiks19018 said:
You get aids when you sleep with too many girlfriends and their mom too!
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Sometimes, innocent babies get AIDS from their drug addicted parents. We can't seem to comprehend the weird actions of the parents in producing An Intelligence Deficiency System (AIDS) --- a mobile phone OS that lacks so many basic essential features; we might speculate the parents were in psychedelic high, sharing dirty needles, and spread AIDS to each other. The babies (innocent young developers) will mostly likely get AIDS. Some of them who have just learn how to talk have gone so far as to say AIDS is good for the world. The world with AIDS will make a better ecosystem -- it will be skinnier for sure. Many innocent victims (consumers) will likely be infected by the AIDS. It is a potential outbreak, but the kind doctors (xda-developers) can do nothing to help, they are being denied the essential tools to perform their duties. So the whole healing process will have to be left to shamans or witches with divine powers (certain developers with access to native herbal medicines called c++); and we all have to live in the dark age ... wait a minute, I am seeing all these from a distant droid land; phew! I am saved by an open source robot , as the welfare of our droid land seems to be progressing toward the positive territory, I really feel sorry for those who are still in the doom land; with supreme leaders getting more and more paranoids. I hope some one sane enough will stop the supreme leaders if they ever command all their followers to commit mass suicide; such as by destroying the only platform they are all still standing on... an old but useful platform we all love; where everything is colorful and free, the one where the doctors are provided tools to cure any weakness or illness.
The end result:
Only the very strong will survive!
chiks19018 said:
You get aids when you sleep with too many girlfriends and their mom too!
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I think I speak for nearly everyone when I say: what in God's name are you talking about?
Shasarak said:
I think I speak for nearly everyone when I say: what in God's name are you talking about?
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I am talking about HTC, sleeping with MS and then Google.
Now it got aids in form of Apple lawsuit and probably neglect from MS for the new WP7.
You're all acting as if HTC didn't know this was coming. Just because Microsoft kept every single detail about WP7 secret from the public doesn't mean they kept it secret from their hardware partners. HTC has known what was coming for months, if not years.
chiks19018 said:
You get aids when you sleep with too many girlfriends and their mom too!
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Not if you use a condom.