Develop Bugs

Is the google pixel better than the s7 in terms of rooting/roming?

Is the pixel better in terms of not fighting the manufacturer to root the phone and rom it? Does it allow the built in call recording (like editing the xml file on a rooted galaxy?)

It's a Google phone, there is no fight rooting or roming or moding it. It's wide open. Hit the unlock slider, fastboot flash unlock. Done.
Verizon version is a bit different. So far no problem as long as you unlock it before it updates. That may change, but so far so good.

That's what I was hoping to hear.

ElementalWindX said:
Is the pixel better in terms of not fighting the manufacturer to root the phone and rom it? Does it allow the built in call recording (like editing the xml file on a rooted galaxy?)
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It is the carrier that locks phones. Like Verizon. Both Samsung and Google leave their phones open by default.
Of course, you may lose some functionality on rooting. Like security features and pay systems.

Yea I don't care about pay systems, or the built in security. None of the card readers at the stores around here even do NFC devices. I always have my cards on me too. My biggest concern is being able to record phone calls automatically. I seriously hate how Verizon locks them down. Right now I have an S6 G920V on version QA3 I'm trying to figure out how to root and have no idea how to at this moment.

ElementalWindX said:
Yea I don't care about pay systems, or the built in security. None of the card readers at the stores around here even do NFC devices. I always have my cards on me too. My biggest concern is being able to record phone calls automatically. I seriously hate how Verizon locks them down. Right now I have an S6 G920V on version QA3 I'm trying to figure out how to root and have no idea how to at this moment.
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Samsung Pay works with old magnetic card readers where you swipe your card, because they bought the company which developed a special magnetic sensing/beaming chip called MST.
http://www.samsung.com/us/support/answer/ANS00043865/
So it basically works everywhere except where you need to insert the card inside the machine like gas stations or ATMs. And it gives you points to redeem goodies from Samsung, like gift cards or their hardware.
I was really enjoying Samsung Pay when I had S6 Edge and Note 7. I didn't have to carry a wallet - just a case with a driver's license and a hundred dollar bill. I really miss it.
Now, Verizon is awful in Midwest, where I live. It's the most overpriced carrier with zero benefits to back up their high prices. I switched from Note 7 on US Cellular prepaid, where I was paying $37 per month, to Pixel XL on Project FI, where I'm now paying $25 per month. Aside from a few simple quirks, I think FI is perfect for a low data user such as myself. Stay away from Verizon.
As far as rooting Verizon devices... I think you may be SOL. It varies depending on the device/software version, but usually they are locked pretty tight.

The Pixel is a much better choice simply based on the development efforts and the quicker updates from Google, which helps developers get their custom firmwares out much faster with the newest features.

xocomaox said:
The Pixel is a much better choice simply based on the development efforts and the quicker updates from Google, which helps developers get their custom firmwares out much faster with the newest features.
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'
7.1.1 Broke Bluetooth functionality. It seems like every single update in the beginning of an update cycle only introduces more bugs. It is a common theme and trend in modern technology. Another trend in technology, most bugs get fixed after about a year. But this phone become obsolete after 6 months.
We, the consumers, cannot win - technology companies release buggy products because they can, and they love quick and flashy profits, Quality Assurance seems to be taking a back seat to corporate profits. Because we, the consumers, seem to buy anything to please us in these times.

nabbed said:
'
7.1.1 Broke Bluetooth functionality. It seems like every single update in the beginning of an update cycle only introduces more bugs. It is a common theme and trend in modern technology. Another trend in technology, most bugs get fixed after about a year. But this phone become obsolete after 6 months.
We, the consumers, cannot win - technology companies release buggy products because they can, and they love quick and flashy profits, Quality Assurance seems to be taking a back seat to corporate profits. Because we, the consumers, seem to buy anything to please us in these times.
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Bluetooth is working fine on my phone. In fact, I'm not experiencing any problems on my phone. I am on the latest build of DU 11.1 based on NOF26V.
And I'm not sure how you are coming to the conclusion that this model will be obsolete in 6 months. It has OS updates guaranteed all the way through Android P...
Regardless of all that, I still think it is vastly better to develop for a phone that is getting constant updates from the manufacturer (Google) rather than one that is typically behind (Samsung).

ElementalWindX said:
Is the pixel better in terms of not fighting the manufacturer to root the phone and rom it? Does it allow the built in call recording (like editing the xml file on a rooted galaxy?)
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Click to collapse
Infinitely better. I loved my S7 while I had it, but the root method was so terrible and caused lag, heat, and poor battery life regardless of any "fix" for it. It's a shame because I loved the phone and would NOT have switched if it weren't for those issues listed. Needless to say, I NEED root on my phone and I wasn't willing to give up any of those things to get it. The root method for this phone is far better and gives me the freedom I want with MY phone. The constant on time updates, and general smoothness of the phone help as well
With that being said, I would not be against giving Samsung another try. I love their phones, but I don't care for their locked bootloaders. If the S8 comes with a developer edition or root is easily achieved I'd have no issues going back. I'd also have no issue staying with future Pixel phones. :good:

JAYNO20 said:
Infinitely better. I loved my S7 while I had it, but the root method was so terrible and caused lag, heat, and poor battery life regardless of any "fix" for it. It's a shame because I loved the phone and would NOT have switched if it weren't for those issues listed. Needless to say, I NEED root on my phone and I wasn't willing to give up any of those things to get it. The root method for this phone is far better and gives me the freedom I want with MY phone. The constant on time updates, and general smoothness of the phone help as well
With that being said, I would not be against giving Samsung another try. I love their phones, but I don't care for their locked bootloaders. If the S8 comes with a developer edition or root is easily achieved I'd have no issues going back. I'd also have no issue staying with future Pixel phones. :good:
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This post makes no sense. How can "root method" cause the following quote - "root method was so terrible and caused lag, heat, and poor battery life regardless of any "fix" for it."
Is the user literally regarded as genius?

nabbed said:
This post makes no sense. How can "root method" cause the following quote - "root method was so terrible and caused lag, heat, and poor battery life regardless of any "fix" for it."
Is the user literally regarded as genius?
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Uh, are you serious? Go look at the s7 forums and then talk, until then let the men talk.

JAYNO20 said:
Uh, are you serious? Go look at the s7 forums and then talk, until then let the men talk.
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Are you literally blessed?

nabbed said:
Are you literally blessed?
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Are you literally a troll?

JAYNO20 said:
Are you literally a troll?
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Click to collapse
I really give up now. People can be what they choose to be!
Freedom!

Moderator Information,
Thread cleaned, flaming users is not acceptable.

JAYNO20 said:
Infinitely better. I loved my S7 while I had it, but the root method was so terrible and caused lag, heat, and poor battery life regardless of any "fix" for it. It's a shame because I loved the phone and would NOT have switched if it weren't for those issues listed. Needless to say, I NEED root on my phone and I wasn't willing to give up any of those things to get it. The root method for this phone is far better and gives me the freedom I want with MY phone. The constant on time updates, and general smoothness of the phone help as well
With that being said, I would not be against giving Samsung another try. I love their phones, but I don't care for their locked bootloaders. If the S8 comes with a developer edition or root is easily achieved I'd have no issues going back. I'd also have no issue staying with future Pixel phones. :good:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
nabbed said:
This post makes no sense. How can "root method" cause the following quote - "root method was so terrible and caused lag, heat, and poor battery life regardless of any "fix" for it."
Is the user literally regarded as genius?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just so you guys understand why the root method for the S7 caused those issues...
In order to root the S7, you needed to flash a developer kernel. This is allowed even with the locked bootloader of the S7 since it is signed and accepted by the bootloader.
As we all know, a kernel can cause a lot of issues with the phone, and that is exactly what happened with the S7. That kernel was not tweaked properly and especially not for real-world usage. But it did allow us to root the phone, so it was a sacrifice (in my opinion).

xocomaox said:
Just so you guys understand why the root method for the S7 caused those issues...
In order to root the S7, you needed to flash a developer kernel. This is allowed even with the locked bootloader of the S7 since it is signed and accepted by the bootloader.
As we all know, a kernel can cause a lot of issues with the phone, and that is exactly what happened with the S7. That kernel was not tweaked properly and especially not for real-world usage. But it did allow us to root the phone, so it was a sacrifice (in my opinion).
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I understood that just fine. It was all the issues caused by root that made me jump ship to the Pixel. As for the other guy (who obviously didn't understand the problems that root caused) I can't say for sure what his issue was. Just trying to help the OP with his decision through my experience with both devices.

I agree with what most people here are saying, I used to have a Galaxy S7 Edge, I loved everything about it, except for the locked bootloader. As previously mentioned it could be rooted, but there just weren't many roms out there and there was also a slight lag and poor battery life that occured after flashing the engineer boot. I just missed being able to customize it as much as I could all my old HTC devices. I switched the the Pixel XL 3 weeks ago rooted it day 1 and haven't missed the S7 Edge once

bbacon said:
I agree with what most people here are saying, I used to have a Galaxy S7 Edge, I loved everything about it, except for the locked bootloader. As previously mentioned it could be rooted, but there just weren't many roms out there and there was also a slight lag and poor battery life that occured after flashing the engineer boot. I just missed being able to customize it as much as I could all my old HTC devices. I switched the the Pixel XL 3 weeks ago rooted it day 1 and haven't missed the S7 Edge once
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I came from an S7 Edge as well. It was an excellent phone if you didn't require root access. But I like to customize. I had it for 7 months the went to the Pixel XL.

First time Note buyer. What should I know or look for?

As the title says, this will be the first time I've purchased a Note phone. The last Samsung phone I've had was an S7. I've used Google, HTC, LG and even Blackberry, as well as iPhones. I've waited a while to upgrade and while I know there are the new iPhones and Pixels coming out soon they just don't interest me. Pretty boring, actually.
That brings me to this phone - the Note 10+. I've seen the reviews and I've seen everyone saying stuff like "it's just an S10 with a pen", it doesn't have this or that, they kinda mailed it in etc etc. While it would normally turn me off to this phone there is something drawing me to it. I love the boxy look. I'm genuinely curious about using the S-Pen. The camera is one of the most important things for me , and yet, while not Pixel grade, I'm sure I'll be happy with it. Hell, I've been using a U11 and an iPhone 7 for the last year or so and I'm sure this will be an upgrade from those and I can just use the Google port as well.
Having said all that I figured this would be the best place to ask people what I can look forward to when I pick this up later today. Any tips or tricks I should know? Anything extra I can do with phone that maybe the general public or site or YouTuber might not know or mention. Any and all information will be very much appreciated and I look forward to see if and any developments happen here for the Note phone. Thanks! ?

mrlugo88 said:
That brings me to this phone - the Note 10+. I've seen the reviews and I've seen everyone saying stuff like "it's just an S10 with a pen"
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What's silly is when people downplay a product's selling point simply because it doesn't appeal to them. I don't tell people interested in e bikes that "it's just a bike with a motor". That type of close minded perspective serves no purpose, and fails to sate the curiosity of (potential) buyers. This is aimed at those that write professionally, not you.
As I always tell people, the S Pen has its audiences. Whether they choose to acknowledge them is their prerogative. Anyway, the S Pen's accuracy and precision are in line with other pens like the Active 2, Bamboo, Asus, and Surface. I've used 2 of these (including S Pens since N4).
While rare, sometimes I need a digital signature for e docs. The S Pen allows me to write like I would on paper or a ntrig/wacom based panel. Now, anyone that has ever attended a conference knows that you can't make a ton of noise, since you should be courteous to whoever has the floor. In this case it makes sense to use your phone to take notes/questions and annotate pics taken of slides as you record audio. Another situation, and likely the most obvious, is drawing. You can make things that achieve parity with the pens I mentioned earlier. Ofc skill level is another story...
Last but not least, the S Pen has other features like remote pics for vloggers and various air commands for things. If you consider what I've written, it makes sense that journalists overlook the S pen. People that rely on Notes were never going to find contentment with an S10, and yet they've managed to fuse the different audiences.

What to watch for? Probably an erection lasting more than 4 hours.
It's a pretty phenomenal phone line. You'll probably be on Note phones for a while...

Beware of the advertised battery capacity. It more than likely won't be the 4300mAh Sam is claiming. Mine is 4170 which is the minimum capacity tested.

Don't expect any timely updates. OS updates will come 7-8 months after Google release of it's anything like previous notes.
Sent from my Pixel 3 XL

Eudeferrer said:
Don't expect any timely updates. OS updates will come 7-8 months after Google release of it's anything like previous notes.
Sent from my Pixel 3 XL
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Not too worried about OS updates. It's not like it use to be when there were major changes in each version.

PsiPhiDan said:
What to watch for? Probably an erection lasting more than 4 hours.
It's a pretty phenomenal phone line. You'll probably be on Note phones for a while...
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I look forward to it....trying out this line of phones, not the long lasting erection I may get lol
jt1954 said:
Beware of the advertised battery capacity. It more than likely won't be the 4300mAh Sam is claiming. Mine is 4170 which is the minimum capacity tested.
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Noted. I will see what it's about. But that will still be the biggest battery I will have had in a phone so interested to see how well it goes considering the big screen and amount playing I like to do with my phone's.

mrlugo88 said:
I look forward to it....trying out this line of phones, not the long lasting erection I may get lol
Noted. I will see what it's about. But that will still be the biggest battery I will have had in a phone so interested to see how well it goes considering the big screen and amount playing I like to do with my phone's.
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My Note9 was AMAZING for battery and the battery is smaller. The screen is bigger on the 10+, but I suspect the increase in battery will offset it. Plus the improvements with the CPU... I'm thinking battery life will be spectacular. As in... I only charge at night. Which is all I care about, personally. ?

General Even MKBHD Says He’s Done With the Pixel 6 Pro

I've been a huge fan of the Pixel since the original XL. Dealing with this phone from day one has been a struggle. The voice dictation is terrible. The worst I've ever had on a pixel. Also the phone is my daily driver and sometimes I can't even work with this phone. Really holding out for an update to fix the phone so that I can love it, but I think I'm more patient than most. I feel like replying with a real world experience to every made by Google tweet, but I'm not out to jeopardize their business and I understand new tech takes a little while to achieve its full potential. But there needs to be some heads rolling at Google. There's been issues with every Google Pixel launch and this I think is the worst from my experience. I'm glad some others aren't experiencing what I'm going through. Lucky dogs
MKBHD Slams Google Pixel 6 Pro's "Bad Experience"
YouTuber MKBHD tweets that he's done with the Pixel 6 Pro and will no longer recommend it to his viewers. That's not great for Google.
www.droid-life.com

Mine hasn't been buggy but it's good his statement made headlines. Maybe Google will get off their azz and fix these problems.

MArtyChubbs said:
I've been a huge fan of the Pixel since the original XL. Dealing with this phone from day one has been a struggle. The voice dictation is terrible. The worst I've ever had on a pixel. Also the phone is my daily driver and sometimes I can't even work with this phone. Really holding out for an update to fix the phone so that I can love it, but I think I'm more patient than most. I feel like replying with a real world experience to every made by Google tweet, but I'm not out to jeopardize their business and I understand new tech takes a little while to achieve its full potential. But there needs to be some heads rolling at Google. There's been issues with every Google Pixel launch and this I think is the worst from my experience. I'm glad some others aren't experiencing what I'm going through. Lucky dogs
MKBHD Slams Google Pixel 6 Pro's "Bad Experience"
YouTuber MKBHD tweets that he's done with the Pixel 6 Pro and will no longer recommend it to his viewers. That's not great for Google.
www.droid-life.com
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I'm one of those lucky dogs, I guess
Side note: I don't pay much mind to reviewers such as MKBHD...I like to judge things for myself

I'll say the same thing I said in another thread...
The Pixel 6 is a new platform on new hardware. There are going to be teething issues. Expecting perfection isn't realistic. Google has been using Snapdragon SoC's since the Nexus 4, and this is their first foray using their own hardware. When Apple introduced the A7 in the iPhone 5S, they had the same problem - a lot of stability and feature issues.
Remember that OEMs have to make compromises in order to get everything they want into a reasonable package. Bigger battery means less space for the electronics, and heat becomes a bigger problem. Bigger display and more powerful processor means more battery drain. With handheld devices, weight and size are significant issues as well.
If you want stability, there are other OEMs to choose from that are sticking to established hardware - such as Samsung, using both Qualcomm and their own Exynos systems. The Pixel series has been pretty solid up to this point, so while the 6 and 6 Pro have certainly had a lot of issues, the next generation will be improved, as will the next after that, and so on.
When you buy a Pixel, it's for vanilla Android with the Google experience. Don't expect much more than that.

why do people care what he thinks
i not had that many issues and I am on the December firmware.
battery life is main issue for me but as its a new SOC and needs time to tune it along with new A12 I expected this

Nekromantik said:
why do people care what he thinks
i not had that many issues and I am on the December firmware.
battery life is main issue for me but as its a new SOC and needs time to tune it along with new A12 I expected this
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Probably the same reason stupid challenges trend on social media?

jayr04 said:
Mine hasn't been buggy but it's good his statement made headlines. Maybe Google will get off their azz and fix these problems.
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man, i really wish my experience was like yours. i bought into Google's P6 hype for sure... i purchased the phone for dual-sim connectivity so i could use one device for my personal and biz numbers. i started with an AT&T version, returned it due to connectivity issues, and purchased an unlocked version that "seemed" to work a little better. however, inconsistent connectivity (no cellular signal, dropped calls, dropped wifi) forced me to put the phone away for now, and switch to a dual-sim S21 Ultra. i'm willing to give Google a chance to address the connectivity issues, but my confidence in their ability to do so is pretty low right now.

bouchigo said:
I'm one of those lucky dogs, I guess
Side note: I don't pay much mind to reviewers such as MKBHD...I like to judge things for myself
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Who? Twitter? I never go there, same as FB, Instagram etc.
Purveyors of disinformation and censorship, at the best.
Really this is Google's doing and not singularly the P6 Pro itself; Android 12 is a huge part of the problem. Android 11 was no gem either.
Following Apple's lead like a lost puppy was one of their biggest mistakes. Google Android degrades their market edge by doing so and ultimately fails their customers.
A large part of Google's problem is that they are also control freaks. They want to push their cloud services at all costs even if it conflicts with the customer's best interests. They learned that from MS.
Who needs another bloody iPhone knock off?

Nekromantik said:
why do people care what he thinks
i not had that many issues and I am on the December firmware.
battery life is main issue for me but as its a new SOC and needs time to tune it along with new A12 I expected this
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't even know who that is, nor do I really care. However, and this is a big but, if he has a following of thousands of users who buy phones for multiple family members and go on social media platforms then it becomes a problem. Not here because it seems no one is on social media round these parts, but this is the extreme minority. So call it where it belongs, the phone is buggy.. big time. I'm not talking about battery life either, I'm talking about not being able to make a phone call or receive a text. That is major. If I want stability I go with one of the big guns, Apple or Google. Pure iPhone experience and pure Android experience. There is nothing pure about this Pixel 6 series. OEMs compromising and releasing a device that is obviously flawed is not a great model for success. I don't want a Samsung or an iPhone. I want a Pixel. There is absolutely no reason I should put up with a test device when they touted this as the phone of the year. Next generation doesn't interest me right about now. I want a phone with security updates that are current and a device that always can receive a phone call and text. It is not the Pixel 6 no matter how many excuses you can come up with.
If this was a test device at least tell me that. If they are working out problems fitting stuff in then let me know. I easily could have kept my pristine P5 but I was led to believe this was a finished product and, I repeat, the phone of the year. the iPhone killer the every other phone killer. Well the P6 just got killed by their own hands and if you can't admit it then nothing I can say will change your mind.

I got a P6 Pro at launch and I haven't had any major issues or bugs. I'm on Dec update and I think I experienced the network drop thing only twice. I restarted my phone and everything was back to normal.
No other issues though..

d.cortez said:
man, i really wish my experience was like yours. i bought into Google's P6 hype for sure... i purchased the phone for dual-sim connectivity so i could use one device for my personal and biz numbers. i started with an AT&T version, returned it due to connectivity issues, and purchased an unlocked version that "seemed" to work a little better. however, inconsistent connectivity (no cellular signal, dropped calls, dropped wifi) forced me to put the phone away for now, and switch to a dual-sim S21 Ultra. i'm willing to give Google a chance to address the connectivity issues, but my confidence in their ability to do so is pretty low right now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i was on s21 ultra and switch to pixel6 pro if iam kinda sad? yes definetly and iam not big fan of samsung but compare to p6 pro samsung was way better

I bought the unlocked version, and I've had no problems to speak of. My former daily driver was an iPhone 12 Pro Max. Been switching my VZ SIM back and forth to see which one I'll stick with.

blackhawk said:
Who? Twitter? I never go there, same as FB, Instagram etc.
Purveyors of disinformation and censorship, at the best.
Really this is Google's doing and not singularly the P6 Pro itself; Android 12 is a huge part of the problem. Android 11 was no gem either.
Following Apple's lead like a lost puppy was one of their biggest mistakes. Google Android degrades their market edge by doing so and ultimately fails their customers.
A large part of Google's problem is that they are also control freaks. They want to push their cloud services at all costs even if it conflicts with the customer's best interests. They learned that from MS.
Who needs another bloody iPhone knock off?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

My concern is that Google may not find a solution for the P6P reception problems and will have a Nexus 6P issue on its hands. Lawsuits caused many Nexus 6P to be replaced with Pixels so in theory it could happen again but 10 months is a long way from now.

Somebody other has problem with photo quality and strange artifacts? Here look in bright part ....pls dont be a stupid and dont say its becouse saturation or something photo is normal standard photo with no setup right from camera

I'm on Dec build in UK (not sure if that makes a difference but O2 network), I have had small teething issues but nothing like some of the major bugs that have been mentioned. Are we using different variants or something?

Guyinlaca said:
My concern is that Google may not find a solution for the P6P reception problems and will have a Nexus 6P issue on its hands. Lawsuits caused many Nexus 6P to be replaced with Pixels so in theory it could happen again but 10 months is a long way from now.
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Please no!

bobby janow said:
I don't even know who that is, nor do I really care. However, and this is a big but, if he has a following of thousands of users who buy phones for multiple family members and go on social media platforms then it becomes a problem. Not here because it seems no one is on social media round these parts, but this is the extreme minority. So call it where it belongs, the phone is buggy.. big time. I'm not talking about battery life either, I'm talking about not being able to make a phone call or receive a text. That is major. If I want stability I go with one of the big guns, Apple or Google. Pure iPhone experience and pure Android experience. There is nothing pure about this Pixel 6 series. OEMs compromising and releasing a device that is obviously flawed is not a great model for success. I don't want a Samsung or an iPhone. I want a Pixel. There is absolutely no reason I should put up with a test device when they touted this as the phone of the year. Next generation doesn't interest me right about now. I want a phone with security updates that are current and a device that always can receive a phone call and text. It is not the Pixel 6 no matter how many excuses you can come up with.
If this was a test device at least tell me that. If they are working out problems fitting stuff in then let me know. I easily could have kept my pristine P5 but I was led to believe this was a finished product and, I repeat, the phone of the year. the iPhone killer the every other phone killer. Well the P6 just got killed by their own hands and if you can't admit it then nothing I can say will change your mind.
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He's got 15.2 million subscribers on YouTube. But I agree with you. You would think Google put a little more resources behind it, especially with their big marketing push.
I have a typo and almost every single sentence when doing voice dictation. Maybe I have a stroke happening and my speech is the issue but I'm heavily dependent on it and have been relying on it for years without a problem.
It's just one of the many bugs I'm dealing with, but by no means the end of the world... I ran the A12 betas on my 4XL and it was a rather good experience. Basically all the new features I use specific to the 6pro are broken. I'm hoping that January will be our lucky month

The only issue I have is a bluetooth audio streaming. I need to reconnect it one or two times to make it work.

yeah my second Pixel 6 pro went back to google yesterday, I have had issues with both 6 pro`s I have had, so I`m back to my 9 pro for now. guess wait and see what happens with the S22 ultra or the 10 pro.

Question "Google has no excuses left for limiting the Pixel 6 to just three Android updates"

After Samsung announced yesterday that the entire S21 (last year!) and S22 lineup will receive 4 (!) major OS updates, this article popped up on 9to5.
(just for recapitulation and to bring you up to speed in case you are not aware: The "new" Pixel 6 will only receive 3 major OS updates)
What do you guys think?
Personally, I have the same expectation. All these years we had these "Qualcomm only gives 3 years support" - excuses, why Google wasn't - supposedly - able to offer more than 3 years of OS updates with the Pixel phones. That is, as we now know - since Samsung does support a Qualcomm chip for more than 3 years - just a petty excuse.
And now? Now that Google has its own chipset?
Still not more. Now the reason is clear: Greed. Google doesn't want to spend more money than absolutely necessary. That is a shame. The Pixel community deserves better.
If Google wants to take this adventure serious, 5 years of OS updates should be the minimum.
Comment: Google has no excuses left for limiting the Pixel 6 to just three Android updates
The moment Samsung officially expanded its update policy to deliver four major Android updates, Google's Pixel 6 policy stopped being enough.
9to5google.com

Morgrain said:
After Samsung announced yesterday that the entire S21 (last year!) and S22 lineup will receive 4 (!) major OS updates, this article popped up on 9to5.
What do you guys think?
Personally, I have the same expectation. All these years we had these "Qualcomm only gives 3 years support" - excuses, why Google wasn't - supposedly - able to offer more than 3 years of OS updates with the Pixel phones. That is, as we now know - since Samsung does support a Qualcomm chip for more than 3 years - just a petty excuse.
And now? Now that Google has its own chipset?
Still not more. Now the reason is clear: Greed. Google doesn't want to spend more money than absolutely necessary. That is a shame. The Pixel community deserves better.
If Google wants to take this adventure serious, 5 years of OS updates should be the minimum.
Comment: Google has no excuses left for limiting the Pixel 6 to just three Android updates
The moment Samsung officially expanded its update policy to deliver four major Android updates, Google's Pixel 6 policy stopped being enough.
9to5google.com
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Click to collapse
I'm pretty sure Google is offering 5 years of upgrades on the Pixel 6 phones.
At least security patches anyway.

bouchigo said:
I'm pretty sure Google is offering 5 years of upgrades on the Pixel 6 phones.
At least security patches anyway.
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Yes, they promised 5 years of security patches, but we are talking about OS upgrades only. Thus getting Android 13, 14 and 15 is guaranteed, but we would like a version or two more.

skoda9635 said:
Yes, they promised 5 years of security patches, but we are talking about OS upgrades only. Thus getting Android 13, 14 and 15 is guaranteed, but we would like a version or two more.
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I should have read the article, but it's too long... Just skimmed through it just now.
I could see how it would be beneficial to those keeping their phones that long, but I keep my phone's max. 2 years.

bouchigo said:
I should have read the article, but it's too long... Just skimmed through it just now.
I could see how it would be beneficial to those keeping their phones that long, but I keep my phone's max. 2 years.
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It's also beneficial for YOU when you want to sell your phone, since it will still be a top up to date device, that's also a reason why used IPhones have high prices - even old models still get OS updates.
There is no reason whatsoever NOT to want long OS updates as a user, since that is beneficial in every way.

Morgrain said:
It's also beneficial for YOU when you want to sell your phone, since it will still be a top up to date device, that's also the reason why used IPhones have high prices - even old models still get OS updates.
There is no reason whatsoever NOT to want long OS updates as a user, since that is beneficial in every way.
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This will likely be a hand-me-down phone. The 5 years of security patches should be good enough in my use case.

bouchigo said:
This will likely be a hand-me-down phone. The 5 years of security patches should be good enough in my use case.
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Which means that the person that will get your phone for free will still have a top up to date device for years to come. The phones value will still remain high and ensures that the person that you will hand your phone down to will have more fun AND will be able to fetch a higher price later on, since that "downhanded" phone will at some point probably be sold by that next person. Having a phone with 5 years (or more) of OS updates is beneficial in every way, to every person along the line that should ever use a phone.
How can you not see the glory of several years of OS updates? It doesn't cost you anything, but it makes a product so much better. Security updates alone mean very little. Running years behind new features and capabilities is detrimental to a user experience. Especially since major OS updates offer massive updates in Kernels and drivers and often offer completely new tech (just think about codecs like LDAC which were introduced with an OS update), something that security updates do not deliver.

I'm sure Big G will cave to the pressure on the 7 and offer 5 years of OS updates. Or they could change their mind and offer it on the 6's. But just because Samsung is offering OS updates for 5 years, it doesn't necessarily mean it's a good idea. How will the user experience be after 2-3 years? I have my old Nexus 6 laying around and Nexus 6p and I can tell you it's not really the greatest experience on their latest versions. Apps take quite some time to load, there's plenty of jank, and it's no longer a fluid experience. Granted, hardware has gotten a lot stronger, but eventually the newer OS versions will bog down the dated hardware and the user experience will decline. I would think those users would rather go for a budget line and upgrade every 2 years for a reasoanble experience and expense. Budget phones have gotten a lot better and it's insane what some of them offer you for $300-$400+~.

zetsumeikuro said:
I'm sure Big G will cave to the pressure on the 7 and offer 5 years of OS updates. Or they could change their mind and offer it on the 6's. But just because Samsung is offering OS updates for 5 years, it doesn't necessarily mean it's a good idea. How will the user experience be after 2-3 years? I have my old Nexus 6 laying around and Nexus 6p and I can tell you it's not really the greatest experience on their latest versions. Apps take quite some time to load, there's plenty of jank, and it's no longer a fluid experience. Granted, hardware has gotten a lot stronger, but eventually the newer OS versions will bog down the dated hardware and the user experience will decline. I would think those users would rather go for a budget line and upgrade every 2 years for a reasoanble experience and expense. Budget phones have gotten a lot better and it's insane what some of them offer you for $300-$400+~.
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It depends on the hardware power. My Pixel 2 XL with a Snapdragon 835 (4 1/2 years old) is still running smooth and without problem. Nowadays processors have become very strong. And in the rare case that a device should slow down a bit, in 90% of the cases that can be solved with a factory reset.
Just think about that example - my Pixel 2 XL is still running strong. The only things that made me update? Battery and OS updates.
Of course, Google wants that. That is why they don't want more OS updates. Having an EoL phone means users will probably update. What Google doesn't see is that this destroys the used market, just look at IPhones. Their value remains ridiculously high after several years, since people don't need to care about the hardware - they will all have the same, modern software experience. And Pixels?
Oh dear. A Pixel 3 can maybe fetch 80 bucks. A Pixel 2? Less. They have basically lost their entire worth.

zetsumeikuro said:
I'm sure Big G will cave to the pressure on the 7 and offer 5 years of OS updates. Or they could change their mind and offer it on the 6's. But just because Samsung is offering OS updates for 5 years, it doesn't necessarily mean it's a good idea. How will the user experience be after 2-3 years? I have my old Nexus 6 laying around and Nexus 6p and I can tell you it's not really the greatest experience on their latest versions. Apps take quite some time to load, there's plenty of jank, and it's no longer a fluid experience. Granted, hardware has gotten a lot stronger, but eventually the newer OS versions will bog down the dated hardware and the user experience will decline. I would think those users would rather go for a budget line and upgrade every 2 years for a reasoanble experience and expense. Budget phones have gotten a lot better and it's insane what some of them offer you for $300-$400+~.
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I hope Google gonna fold and give the 6 users also 5 or at least 4 OS updates. I think in the next years this might change or they'll just do it without announcing. Who knows what Project Mainline will bring us.

Flawn said:
I hope Google gonna fold and give the 6 users also 5 or at least 4 OS updates. I think in the next years this might change or they'll just do it without announcing. Who knows what Project Mainline will bring us.
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I doubt it a bit.
Google has gotten stingy in the most recent years.
They took away Google Photos unlimited storage.
They took away Pixels unlimited upload.
They now force people to swallow several ads before EVERY Youtube video, an obvious attempt to push Youtube Premium subscriptions (Vanced for life).
They took away several GCam features and locked it behind Google One.
Google One itself is a good example, since Google is pushing their "pay us if you want something" hard.
Once, Google offered most its services for free and kept itself floating through ads revenue.
Now? They want BOTH monthly subscriptions AND ads revenue. They went greedy. Maybe they will cave in under the pressure... but that would require GREAT pressure. That would require that even the self-centered ones that do not see the immediate benefit to themselves ("I only use my phone for 2 years, why should I care") begin to voice such a claim.

Morgrain said:
It depends on the hardware power. My Pixel 2 XL with a Snapdragon 835 (4 1/2 years old) is still running smooth and without problem. Nowadays processors have become very strong. And in the rare case that a device should slow down a bit, in 90% of the cases that can be solved with a factory reset.
Just think about that example - my Pixel 2 XL is still running strong. The only things that made me update? Battery and OS updates.
Of course, Google wants that. That is why they don't want more OS updates. Having an EoL phone means users will probably update. What Google doesn't see is that this destroys the used market, just look at IPhones. Their value remains ridiculously high after several years, since people don't need to care about the hardware - they will all have the same, modern software experience. And Pixels?
Oh dear. A Pixel 3 can maybe fetch 80 bucks. A Pixel 2? Less. They have basically lost their entire worth.
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That's good to know that the older hardware is now holding it's own compared to the devices that I listed. I haven't kept any of my older pixels as I passed them on or traded them in. I'm all for devices having a longer shelf life to keep them out of landfills and reduce electronic waste. That definitely is one of the factors why iPhones retain more value. But the Pixels will need more than the 5 year OS update guarantee to retain value like iPhones do.
Flawn said:
I hope Google gonna fold and give the 6 users also 5 or at least 4 OS updates. I think in the next years this might change or they'll just do it without announcing. Who knows what Project Mainline will bring us.
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Indeed, would be great for those that plan on keeping the devices for longer than two years.

zetsumeikuro said:
That definitely is one of the factors why iPhones retain more value. But the Pixels will need more than the 5 year OS update guarantee to retain value like iPhones do.
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I appreciate iphone but I don't think longevity of updates is why they keep their value, at least not a big part of it. I think the building of the brand into something synonymous with luxury is what got it it's staying power when it comes to retaining cost.
Better customer support is also a huge factor.
But android as an ecosystem needs more than multiple years of updates to get to that point.
If anything the hugest element is the fact that there isn't a physical building I can go to with people trained to know my device in and out. Apple has that, the apple store itself is an experience. While we scrounge on message boards and get first lvl call center techs telling me to reboot my phone while they diddle on their iphone.
There is a store out there my grandma can just walk into and hand her phone off to someone that actually knows about that device.

I don't get why people still demand something more. You knew what you were buying before you bought it. Why to demand something more now?

I mean why
Mikulec said:
I don't get why people still demand something more. You knew what you were buying before you bought it. Why to demand something more now?
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I mean why not. You want customers, you provide incentives for people to choose your product over another. It's not like it's hurting anyone to expect a company to stay competitive.
I see nothing wrong with consumers leveraging purchase power. And it's not like retroactively increasing the support lifetime is unheard of.

Who gives a squat about OS updates when they can't even get 12 right?
You almost need a minor in Entomology to keep track of the bugs. Their engineers might learn something if they followed critical path analysis of the possible effects undetected software errors may have and accept those with little impact and not let errors pass that could brick a phone. Similar to the best practices aviation engineers follow to certify aircraft software per DO-178C.

Offering as long term software support as possible is of course a good thing but think about the battery. As currently there are no phones from top class with easily changeable battery do you think that after 3 years or more this phone will be usable if you charge it every day (which most users do)? My previous experience shows that i never kept phone for more than 3 years and on average i buy new one after just 2 years.
There is also one more thing to consider and it is when you will receive the promised updates. Google always releases the new android early (around october) and for all devices simultaneously. Other manufacturers usually update their current flagship relatively fast before the end of year but the other models can get it even as late as spring or summer of next year.
Of course if google could provide 5 years of major android upgrades this would be great but the current policy of 3 major upgrades plus 2 more years of security updates is something with which i was aware when i bought the phone and is good enough for me personally.

Morgrain said:
Which means that the person that will get your phone for free will still have a top up to date device for years to come. The phones value will still remain high and ensures that the person that you will hand your phone down to will have more fun AND will be able to fetch a higher price later on, since that "downhanded" phone will at some point probably be sold by that next person. Having a phone with 5 years (or more) of OS updates is beneficial in every way, to every person along the line that should ever use a phone.
How can you not see the glory of several years of OS updates? It doesn't cost you anything, but it makes a product so much better. Security updates alone mean very little. Running years behind new features and capabilities is detrimental to a user experience. Especially since major OS updates offer massive updates in Kernels and drivers and often offer completely new tech (just think about codecs like LDAC which were introduced with an OS update), something that security updates do not deliver.
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I'm only replying to the very first portion of your post, since that is all that really concerns me.
I'm sure the person getting the phone (who will be 7 years old at that point) won't mind. She will just use it to play games and watch YouTube. By the time she is done with it (it will be a 4-5 year old phone) the battery will be trash, and time for a new phone.
Just like I accepted that I see how it could be beneficial to some to have updates/OS upgrades for longer, you should accept that others don't require that, nor should they have to just because you believe it's "necessary".
If later I want updates for a longer period of time, maybe I will switch to Samsung...ah, no I won't And if the value of the phone is less when I go to sell it, or trade it in, then so be it.

I never got people arguing against folks requesting more support or more options.
Especially when the main point of contention is "well I don't need it". A mass produced consumer product fortunely needs to address the needs of a wide range of users. Not just one person that doesn't care because the added support won't benefit them.
It's not hard to not personally need something yet appreciate why someone else might benefit. I've literally never used phone insurance. Doesn't mean I don't understand why someone might want or need it.

As I've made known my opinion in the past, anytime there's a discussion about what Google doesn't do with their Pixels that they conceivably could, I always suspect Samsung strong-arming Google behind the scenes. "You want to use our chips? You want us to make your CPU? You want to buy the screen from us? Here's the list of things we require (besides money), and here is the list of components we're willing to sell you."
Complete speculation on my part, but I don't think it's an unreasonable suspicion. It would certainly answer a lot of questions of "why".

General End bloatware

I think most people on this forum can agree that the biggest shortfall of Samsung's devices is the bloatware. Be it the Samsung app, the google apps or even the netflix app, everyone has something they wish wasn't there which is why ADB is so popular.
It would be great if Samsung was to allow a custom app load on startup.
That is precisely what I am suggesting for the Samsung UI beta. I'd like to get some feedback, or at least some "hearts" from the XDA community to show interest on their dedicated suggestion forum.
UI Suggestion
Good afternoon, It is undisputed that Samsung makes great phones with great hardware and physical integrity. That being said, the most prominent complaint against them is the abundance of bloatware. It is so prominent that many will skip the purchase, and others will use a debloating program...
us.community.samsung.com
Thank you,

What's bloatware to some is a useful app to others. A builtin package disabler be nice though.
Much of the Samsung bloatware sits there and uses little or no resources unless used. About 30 out of 80 apps I disable are Samsung. Some are toggled on/off as needed.
Samsung's auto updates are far more troublesome and need to be locked down
Firmware upgrades can and do kill Samsung's especially later ones.
So with some wherewithal it's not a big deal using 3rd party work arounds, settings and a firewall. Otherwise there's always iPhone...
That said the last 3 flagship releases for the Note/S series have been lacking with dropped balls a plenty. Right now Samsung has no new flagships I'll buy even when they become marked down.

blackhawk said:
Right now Samsung has no new flagships I'll buy even when they become marked down.
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There is no good flagship option atm.
The P6? lol
The S22? Bleh
Upcoming P7? A possible repeat of the P6.
Upcoming S23? May be worth the wait?
Apple? As much as it pains me to say it, I do find them more and more appealing when comparing.

Stickmanx89 said:
There is no good flagship option atm.
The P6? lol
The S22? Bleh
Upcoming P7? A possible repeat of the P6.
Upcoming S23? May be worth the wait?
Apple? As much as it pains me to say it, I do find them more and more appealing when comparing.
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Apple? No.
No expandable storage kills Apple without even getting into their firmware/software/DRM issues. However don't expect much out of Samsung with their next new release.
With both Samsung and Google Android I'm banking on it taking them at least 1-3 years to get their sorry acts together. To that end I will continue to use my N10+'s running on Pie and Q. With a projected lifespan of 2-3+ years... means I don't care.
Let the other rats run the maze, I'm chillin

blackhawk said:
Apple? No.
No expandable storage kills Apple
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No sd card sucks on all 3 main manufacturers. It is such a strange thing to have removed.
I was also hoping to ride my old p2 for a while longer until better options come out, but i jumped in a river with it instead
I'll need to select something for the next 3+ years when my backup phone fails (well on its way)
Anyway, i dare to dream on the bloatware front and hope for built-in solutions

Stickmanx89 said:
No sd card sucks on all 3 main manufacturers. It is such a strange thing to have removed.
I was also hoping to ride my old p2 for a while longer until better options come out, but i jumped in a river with it instead
I'll need to select something for the next 3+ years when my backup phone fails (well on its way)
Anyway, i dare to dream on the bloatware front and hope for built-in solutions
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Google been pushing to kill expandable for years. They got the MS cloud control power fantasy going on.
Well I can still recommend a N10+ which is what I would buy today. Bought my last one 10 months ago. New ones are still available and their loaded with Android 10.

yes, bloatware from Google and Samsung