Related
I’ve been baffled by what I’ve been hearing and reading about the bootloader is being locked and the late delivery of Android updates for Defy and other handsets from Motorola. I would like to request Motorola to make official statements about the very same concerns almost all their customers have.
In my opinion, Motorola is not being sincere about the mess they are into. Motorola has a long history for being far slower in delivering updates compared to other manufacturers. In my case, after owning my Defy for nearly six months I still don’t have the Android version (Froyo 2.2) I wanted on day one. My handset is now too old and too slow compared to what I can buy in today’s market with latest version of Android on most of them.
I often see people acting as Motorola’s spokesperson by saying the cause of the delay is due to the test mobile network provider has to perform. I would like to see a written statement from Motorola saying just that please. For a company is very easy to hire a small PR Firm to spread rumours on the internet and people often fall in that trap and spread the rumour all for free behalf the company.
Motorola must be aware of its customer frustrations with the late updates. Supposedly, this is the fault of Mobile Network Providers, why then Motorola doesn’t release latest Android with their handsets to avoid comments like mine? This is a clear indication to me Mobile Network Providers cannot be blamed and this must have to do with a policy Motorola has. Why other manufacturers are not affected by the very test process? Didn’t Samsung release a fix update globally for SGII only after weeks?
This is what I understood from manufactures’ spokesperson (users claiming to know everything). Bootloader is locked because of Mobile Network Providers’ demand. I bought my mobile sim-free from a retail, why the bootloader is still locked then? This is another lie from manufacturers, not just Motorola. Has anyone seen an official statement from any manufactures explaining who the decision was made by? I’d predict no one can provide such evidence.
The bootloader fiasco is all about reducing repair cost whilst the handset is under warranty. That means it is possible for a manufacturer to calculate the cost of a handset with locked bootloader and without. Is the saving made by locking the bootloader passed on to the customer?
Motorola is the most arrogant company I have ever dealt with and they should be disgraced with the level of service they have provided for their customers. I have reached to the point that the hardware quality no longer matters to me when I feel being ripped off by Motorola. I have already boycotted Nokia for selling spying equipment (tracking & listening) to countries such as Iran and now I refuse to spend my hard earned money on Motorola’s products for their poor services.
Companies have the right to earn money, but not at the cost of ripping people off or even worst at the cost of endangering people lives.
You are totally wrong.
And if you don't like your defy dont buy motorola again or install cm7
Ov3rd0se said:
You are totally wrong.
And if you don't like your defy dont buy motorola again or install cm7
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Who are you? Are you playing God in here? Who asked your opinion about my alternative solutions?
Why your first ever post submission (1 post, 25 May 2011) has to do with telling me off? You did not provide any valuable arguments as to why I was wrong.
I think there is a post for a petition in unlocking the boot loader. As for updates. 2.2 has already been released last march. even if motorola is like that, ur defy is still a great phone comparable to the latest phones because you have the support of great developers and forumers here.
Sent from my MB525 using XDA App
salingpusa said:
I think there is a post for a petition in unlocking the boot loader. As for updates. 2.2 has already been released last march. even if motorola is like that, ur defy is still a great phone comparable to the latest phones because you have the support of great developers and forumers here.
Sent from my MB525 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for your comments.
UK yet to receive (25 May 2011) Froyo. Motorola claims to release Froyo to select countries in Europe. Another lie from them. The only European country has recieved Froyo is France. Motorola all the sudden turned their attention to East-Asia and started releasing updates in the respective countries and forgot all other European countries. I'm referring to Retail version not sim-locked version of Defy.
Just my two cents but although developers love unlocked bootloaders, truth is the majority of end users (customers) don't need or care about flashing their phone and especially flashing a bootloader to load custom kernals. I believe you're right in the biggest factor for Motorola or any manufacturer locking the bootloader is to keep costs down with regards to repairs under warranty - and can you blame a company for that?
I think it would be nice to see real numbers and costs associated as to how many phones are returned to M (or any other manufacturer) under warranty in where it's believed the user bricked the phone...I know if I owned a business I wouldn't want to dish out free phones every time someone bricked their phone because they wanted to hack it on their own accord.
So - even though a locked bootloader essentially eliminates the ability to flash a custom kernal, there are still tons of amazing custom roms that can be developed and flash away all day without fear of bricking the phone. Kinda best of both worlds, a good compromise...isn't that what life is about
Also - even though a custom kernal can't be flashed...you can still have a port like CM7/MIUI etc so you can keep up with the newest OS even when the carrier/manufacturer is slow to upgrade...although not a true port without the kernal but nevertheless you still are running the newest OS.
If they sold a retail version with an unlocked bootloader, carriers will lose sales. The bootloader issue was known for a long time, if you didn't like the fact that the bootloader is locked, you shouldn't have bought a Motorola android phone.
Suck it up. It's your fault, want to do something useful? send a complaint to Motorola and sign the petition.
confusedfella said:
If they sold a retail version with an unlocked bootloader, carriers will lose sales. The bootloader issue was known for a long time, if you didn't like the fact that the bootloader is locked, you shouldn't have bought a Motorola android phone.
Suck it up. It's your fault, want to do something useful? send a complaint to Motorola and sign the petition.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please point to my comment where I'm complaining about "my phone" being locked and I've been desperate for custom roms? The point of mentioning about the bootloader was to highlight the lies and the unfounded truth some people spread around. I would never use a custom ROM not even with an unlocked bootloader.
On that note, HTC announced today they are reviewing their bootloader policy. You can read more about it here. I guess this news alone proves my earlier point that people are spreading unfounded facts blaming Mobile Network Providers over the bootloader.
Companies has their own rights to manufacture devices under their own policies in term of locking here and there and this normally applied to telco service provider agreements too between them. So pointing Motorola alone is not a good idea as they have their rights all along. Comparing companies like Motorola and another company like HTC is another scenario where different company have different policies they followed or what they wanted they own product be in the market..
If one doesn't like a company policies for being late in upgrading or poor in responding customer feedback. Then there's always another company to choose with. Do survey and then make the purchase when all the details fit you.
And not forgetting that average people doesn't bother with this upgrading software or the hype about bootloader inside out. Most of them just use it the way it is by default when they got it from the shop. Only selective peoples like us here care about these being the first or the last or having the latest software here and there and this is why we have this XDA to support peoples like us. Some of us already running Froyo way back in November last year(if I'm not mistaken) while Motorola might just starting their own Froyo development project on Defy that time.
After all, I do see Motorola did a good job in reviving their phone manufacturing and come back compete with others big companies. So if you buy Motorola phone, you should come here and start flash it and customised it to your own preference as there are a lot of peoples love Motorola and do it freely...
You vote with your wallet, so buying a phone from a company known to deliver few and far between updates with a locked boot loader shows that you don't mind a locked bootloader and are satisfied with the initial state of the phone needing no updates.
And as I've mentioned in my earlier post, if Motorola launches an unlocked bootloader RETAIL version of a phone, the grand majority of power users will buy the retail version and consequently decrease the carriers' sales.
As you mentioned you are not happy with Motorola because of the late update and the locked bootloader. Those 2 issues were known.
IMO the carriers have an upper hand over here, because of the price reduction they can offer. Not everyone can shell out 500-700$ for a high end phone every 6 months. I understand what you mean, its disappointing and not a totally honest move from Motorola. Next time I'll buy a samsung or a SE since they promised more open phones.
who is this sh1t?
When I bought the Defy, I knew about the slow update policy of Motorola, I knew about the locked bootloader. I knew that if I would buy an HTC phone I would have updates sooner, I would have custom roms with custom kernels. I also knew that would cost me about 100 euros more, give me lower sound quality, a more vulnerable phone. So I had to make a choice, en chose the Defy. You could have known the same, regardless of what companies say. Just read about different phones on forums like this.
Hardly any company will be 100% honest about their money-making policies. Just use your common sense and you'll know that almost every buisness has only one core buisness: to make money. Some companies will give you more service, other companies give less service to be able to lower the prices of their products. It's up to you to make a choice what you value more. I chose for a lower price and some restrictions in customizing and a tougher phone. You maybe should have chosen to pay a bit more to have more freedom.
confusedfella said:
You vote with your wallet, so buying a phone from a company known to deliver few and far between updates with a locked boot loader shows that you don't mind a locked bootloader and are satisfied with the initial state of the phone needing no updates.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I bought Defy base on the promise of Froyo but didn't expect six months of wait. Why it takes a global company about six months to release an update? It is not like they are doing all the Android development, is it?.
I don't understand why you are blindly defending Motorola. Without our money Motoroal would be nothing. I will survive without a Mobile phone but does Motorola survive without our money?
confusedfella said:
IMO the carriers have an upper hand over here, because of the price reduction they can offer. Not everyone can shell out 500-700$ for a high end phone every 6 months. I understand what you mean, its disappointing and not a totally honest move from Motorola. Next time I'll buy a samsung or a SE since they promised more open phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
At least in the UK, with 24 months contract you are not saving anything on the handset itself. Some plans actually work out even more expensive. Please name a business that passes on the savings to the customers? They are greedy and you are happy to defend them all for free.
Fotogravin said:
When I bought the Defy, I knew about the slow update policy of Motorola, I knew about the locked bootloader. I knew that if I would buy an HTC phone I would have updates sooner, I would have custom roms with custom kernels. I also knew that would cost me about 100 euros more, give me lower sound quality, a more vulnerable phone. So I had to make a choice, en chose the Defy. You could have known the same, regardless of what companies say. Just read about different phones on forums like this.
Hardly any company will be 100% honest about their money-making policies. Just use your common sense and you'll know that almost every buisness has only one core buisness: to make money. Some companies will give you more service, other companies give less service to be able to lower the prices of their products. It's up to you to make a choice what you value more. I chose for a lower price and some restrictions in customizing and a tougher phone. You maybe should have chosen to pay a bit more to have more freedom.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Those people bought Motorola CLIQ were promised updates but Motorola didn't deliver. I guess that is ok by you because Motorola didn't force them to buy anything from them in the first place. And the millions of dollars Motorola spends advertising is just to show off their products to other companies not to encourage us consumers to depart from our money.
My friend, there is no relation between you are being happy with your purchase from Motorola and the rest of us has to shut up about not being happy.
I'm not going to mention the Defy's earpiece fiasco.
csharpheaven said:
i’ve been baffled by what i’ve been hearing and reading about the bootloader is being locked and the late delivery of android updates for defy and other handsets from motorola. I would like to request motorola to make official statements about the very same concerns almost all their customers have.
In my opinion, motorola is not being sincere about the mess they are into. Motorola has a long history for being far slower in delivering updates compared to other manufacturers. In my case, after owning my defy for nearly six months i still don’t have the android version (froyo 2.2) i wanted on day one. My handset is now too old and too slow compared to what i can buy in today’s market with latest version of android on most of them.
I often see people acting as motorola’s spokesperson by saying the cause of the delay is due to the test mobile network provider has to perform. I would like to see a written statement from motorola saying just that please. For a company is very easy to hire a small pr firm to spread rumours on the internet and people often fall in that trap and spread the rumour all for free behalf the company.
Motorola must be aware of its customer frustrations with the late updates. Supposedly, this is the fault of mobile network providers, why then motorola doesn’t release latest android with their handsets to avoid comments like mine? This is a clear indication to me mobile network providers cannot be blamed and this must have to do with a policy motorola has. Why other manufacturers are not affected by the very test process? Didn’t samsung release a fix update globally for sgii only after weeks?
This is what i understood from manufactures’ spokesperson (users claiming to know everything). Bootloader is locked because of mobile network providers’ demand. I bought my mobile sim-free from a retail, why the bootloader is still locked then? This is another lie from manufacturers, not just motorola. Has anyone seen an official statement from any manufactures explaining who the decision was made by? I’d predict no one can provide such evidence.
The bootloader fiasco is all about reducing repair cost whilst the handset is under warranty. That means it is possible for a manufacturer to calculate the cost of a handset with locked bootloader and without. Is the saving made by locking the bootloader passed on to the customer?
Motorola is the most arrogant company i have ever dealt with and they should be disgraced with the level of service they have provided for their customers. I have reached to the point that the hardware quality no longer matters to me when i feel being ripped off by motorola. I have already boycotted nokia for selling spying equipment (tracking & listening) to countries such as iran and now i refuse to spend my hard earned money on motorola’s products for their poor services.
Companies have the right to earn money, but not at the cost of ripping people off or even worst at the cost of endangering people lives.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
listen fast judger , i don't care about the update that what is about to be released , the point is that you can work smoother than iphone.
Second thing is you will never get the full control of any other company such as samsung and htc.
Each one has it's on bad staff ,so if you feel damn bad just try others and live the disappointing.
CSharpHeaven said:
I’ve been baffled by what I’ve been hearing and reading about the bootloader is being locked and the late delivery of Android updates for Defy and other handsets from Motorola. I would like to request Motorola to make official statements about the very same concerns almost all their customers have.
In my opinion, Motorola is not being sincere about the mess they are into. Motorola has a long history for being far slower in delivering updates compared to other manufacturers. In my case, after owning my Defy for nearly six months I still don’t have the Android version (Froyo 2.2) I wanted on day one. My handset is now too old and too slow compared to what I can buy in today’s market with latest version of Android on most of them.
I often see people acting as Motorola’s spokesperson by saying the cause of the delay is due to the test mobile network provider has to perform. I would like to see a written statement from Motorola saying just that please. For a company is very easy to hire a small PR Firm to spread rumours on the internet and people often fall in that trap and spread the rumour all for free behalf the company.
Motorola must be aware of its customer frustrations with the late updates. Supposedly, this is the fault of Mobile Network Providers, why then Motorola doesn’t release latest Android with their handsets to avoid comments like mine? This is a clear indication to me Mobile Network Providers cannot be blamed and this must have to do with a policy Motorola has. Why other manufacturers are not affected by the very test process? Didn’t Samsung release a fix update globally for SGII only after weeks?
This is what I understood from manufactures’ spokesperson (users claiming to know everything). Bootloader is locked because of Mobile Network Providers’ demand. I bought my mobile sim-free from a retail, why the bootloader is still locked then? This is another lie from manufacturers, not just Motorola. Has anyone seen an official statement from any manufactures explaining who the decision was made by? I’d predict no one can provide such evidence.
The bootloader fiasco is all about reducing repair cost whilst the handset is under warranty. That means it is possible for a manufacturer to calculate the cost of a handset with locked bootloader and without. Is the saving made by locking the bootloader passed on to the customer?
Motorola is the most arrogant company I have ever dealt with and they should be disgraced with the level of service they have provided for their customers. I have reached to the point that the hardware quality no longer matters to me when I feel being ripped off by Motorola. I have already boycotted Nokia for selling spying equipment (tracking & listening) to countries such as Iran and now I refuse to spend my hard earned money on Motorola’s products for their poor services.
Companies have the right to earn money, but not at the cost of ripping people off or even worst at the cost of endangering people lives.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think ur very disappointed with Companies like Motorola for Locked Boot loader and no Updates and ur Phone lags.....So why don't you buy Nokia 3210..No bootloader problem and no Update problem and it never Lags...
I believe they will soon. If another don't why they need to.
Samsung : Unlock
LG : Unlock
SE : Able to Unlock
HTC : Reviewing
CSharpHeaven said:
I’ve been baffled by what I’ve been hearing and reading about the bootloader is being locked and the late delivery of Android updates for Defy and other handsets from Motorola. I would like to request Motorola to make official statements about the very same concerns almost all their customers have.
In my opinion, Motorola is not being sincere about the mess they are into. Motorola has a long history for being far slower in delivering updates compared to other manufacturers. In my case, after owning my Defy for nearly six months I still don’t have the Android version (Froyo 2.2) I wanted on day one. My handset is now too old and too slow compared to what I can buy in today’s market with latest version of Android on most of them.
I often see people acting as Motorola’s spokesperson by saying the cause of the delay is due to the test mobile network provider has to perform. I would like to see a written statement from Motorola saying just that please. For a company is very easy to hire a small PR Firm to spread rumours on the internet and people often fall in that trap and spread the rumour all for free behalf the company.
Motorola must be aware of its customer frustrations with the late updates. Supposedly, this is the fault of Mobile Network Providers, why then Motorola doesn’t release latest Android with their handsets to avoid comments like mine? This is a clear indication to me Mobile Network Providers cannot be blamed and this must have to do with a policy Motorola has. Why other manufacturers are not affected by the very test process? Didn’t Samsung release a fix update globally for SGII only after weeks?
This is what I understood from manufactures’ spokesperson (users claiming to know everything). Bootloader is locked because of Mobile Network Providers’ demand. I bought my mobile sim-free from a retail, why the bootloader is still locked then? This is another lie from manufacturers, not just Motorola. Has anyone seen an official statement from any manufactures explaining who the decision was made by? I’d predict no one can provide such evidence.
The bootloader fiasco is all about reducing repair cost whilst the handset is under warranty. That means it is possible for a manufacturer to calculate the cost of a handset with locked bootloader and without. Is the saving made by locking the bootloader passed on to the customer?
Motorola is the most arrogant company I have ever dealt with and they should be disgraced with the level of service they have provided for their customers. I have reached to the point that the hardware quality no longer matters to me when I feel being ripped off by Motorola. I have already boycotted Nokia for selling spying equipment (tracking & listening) to countries such as Iran and now I refuse to spend my hard earned money on Motorola’s products for their poor services.
Companies have the right to earn money, but not at the cost of ripping people off or even worst at the cost of endangering people lives.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dude.. What the hell are you talking about?? When the froyo update gets released in UK and when you flash it you will not notice any difference between the stock eclair and the froyo.. Dont simply go by the versions of android that gets released.. Check what the version of Android offers you.
Coming to your bootloader issue, What if its locked or unlocked? why the hell a layman care if he has a locked or an unlocked BL? All he wants is a fancy phone which he can use for his purpose, If the BL is not locked developers might even port windows 7 to defy but thats not what a layman wants or cares.
And coming to your policy for making money.. All companies try to make money and you talk as though samsung and nokia shell out there money for charity..
Your defy is the best mid range Android device you can get in the market, I visited tons of forums before I decided to buy it. If you are not happy with the service call the service desk or mail them.. Dont waste your time showing your agitation on Moto here.
Motorola is going to use every last days in Q2 to make sure Froyo is not released for Defy to increase the sale of their newer handsets with Froyo. I'm not happy about this dirty tactic from a company that already got my money. I suspect they will use the same dirty tactics with Atrix that I used to keep my eyes on for. I'm not going to let them trick me twice.
Exercising my rights to speak is so wonderful. Thank you XDA team for the opportunity.
CSharpHeaven said:
I bought Defy base on the promise of Froyo but didn't expect six months of wait. Why it takes a global company about six months to release an update? It is not like they are doing all the Android development, is it?.
I don't understand why you are blindly defending Motorola. Without our money Motoroal would be nothing. I will survive without a Mobile phone but does Motorola survive without our money?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know why it takes them so long, but you knew they tend to stretch update schedules, so why the hell did you buy a motorola phone? You said it right there "without our money motorola would go bankrupt" so thats why you don't buy motorola phones if you think they are doing it wrong, they'll have to adapt(better customer support,unlocked bootloader..etc) to overcome a potential crisis. They promised Froyo and you will get it, but when I don't know. You're blaming a company for your bad choices no one is making you buy their phones.
Im pretty satisfied with my purchase, It has an awesome screen size, is pretty fast and small. And for a small price. If you can't wait anymore for froyo, flash an official rom or go buy another phone. I learned it the hard way.
I am using the HTC trophy on Verizon. I went in to my local store and was asking about a charging cord (39.95 please), and i kid you not, the sales rep tried to get me to upgrade to an android phone. Im happy with my WP7, and have had android and didnt like it. So after telling the guy that i didnt need a new phone, i left. Now what upsets me is verizons lack of commitment to this OS. people want it, i want it, yet they only give you one phone (HTC trophy) with very low specs. My brother in law works for go wireless and his boss refuses to stock any WP& devices. And go wireless is essentially verizon. Thats is the companies stance on the OS. "no, no one wants that. Here, take one of these 45 android phones. They are way better. why? because they are android". Im so ****ing sick of all this verizon android basket. I dont want to switch to ATT to get a good device, but its making it look more and more probable with each passing day that verizon shafts the WP7 people. I know the kins didnt do so well, but thats verizons fault for requiring a data plan on a dumb phone. Point of my rant is this: i want something other than this trophy on verizon, yet they are making it so difficult to stay with them due to their constant hard on for android and their brief love affair with IOS. Another reason not to switch is i was grandfathered in to the unlimited data plan. Why must you make it so hard for me verizon!? I hate you, yet love your cell reception and unlimited data. Get more CDMA WP7 phones. How hard would it be to get that fujitsu number over here? not that hard i would assume. I would pay cash for that in a heart beat. Much like how i paid 400 some odd bucks the day the trophy came out for verizon.
/end rant
Amen, I feel the same way, if nothing is at least announced for Verizon by the end of 2011 I'll probably be going to AT&T because their phone line-up is better. It's a pity because I do like Verizon's service.
I'm not even asking for a new phone this year, I just want an announcement of a new phone. They're releasing so many Android phones per year, and they can't announce a new wp7 phone after half a year or so, it's kind of BS.
I emailed one of the higher ups at VW regarding this. I got an email and a call back from his assistant regarding my frustrations. Supposedly there will be new WP devices coming, but they wouldn't give a time frame.
Rumor on the net through a couple Nokia sites say that Verizon will be getting a high end Nokia WP, while AT&Crap and T-Mobile will be getting mid tier devices. I'm personally over HTC's battery life issues so I'm optimistic something better will be coming so I can finally make the switch from Android.
Do yourself a favour, if you see what you like on another carrier (at&t, Titan, Focus S, Focus Flash), check out the coverage and prices as best you can and if everything looks ok switch! Why sit around on a carrier that doesnt give you what you want, whether it be CS, coverage or the device you desire? Buy a prepaid phone, use it to confirm you will have coverage and if its a go make sure to tell vzw just why you are switching. Spread the word about your experience, and maybe in 10 years time they will pull their heads out of google's butt!!
That's probably because Verizon is Google's favorite carrier and gets more from Google than other carrieres do, just like Motorola will now be favored over other OEMs.
the deathstars cell service is awful where I live. Calls are always dropped, and the data plan is horrendous. If it weren't for those two things, I would have switched long ago. The only thing really keeping me with big red is the aforementioned unlimited data.
Sent from my mwp6985 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
wakka420 said:
I am using the HTC trophy on Verizon. I went in to my local store and was asking about a charging cord (39.95 please), and i kid you not, the sales rep tried to get me to upgrade to an android phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Regardless of what platform he personally prefers, in the end, he wants to make money, and he wants you to upgrade right then and there, and there isn't another WP7 device for him to offer you... what else is he supposed to do? lol
As a sales rep myself, I would attempt to figure out what you want, and get you the device that suits you the best. I'm no Android fan, but if I find out that you like Android, there is little reason for me to try and get you to buy into a completely different platform, no matter how awesome it is. Since you have the only WP7 device on Verizon, there isn't much else he could have done except tell you to buy into a different platform.
But the general idea of your topic, I understand, and its most certainly saddening to see how the market treats underdogs (not only Verizon). Though, I think you'll find that once the dollar signs start shifting toward WP7, the tune of most sales reps will also shift. They go where the money goes.
But when the rep tells me WP7 sucks like its fact and not opinion, that's when I tune out. And its sad because I feel that his behavior reflects on veizons opinion of WP7 in general besides, how are you gonna make tons of cash on a phone OS when you only have one model that supports it? Of course your gonna make a boatload of money if you have 19 phones that all have android on them
Sent from my mwp6985 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
I agree in general that VZW has little to no interest or support for WP7 and hopefully this changes with time as I too have little choice for good reception and am grandfathered on the unlimited data.
Google, Motorola, and Verzon are The Three Stooges. I'm suprised so many people here seem to have missed that...
prjkthack said:
Regardless of what platform he personally prefers, in the end, he wants to make money, and he wants you to upgrade right then and there, and there isn't another WP7 device for him to offer you... what else is he supposed to do? lol
As a sales rep myself, I would attempt to figure out what you want, and get you the device that suits you the best. I'm no Android fan, but if I find out that you like Android, there is little reason for me to try and get you to buy into a completely different platform, no matter how awesome it is. Since you have the only WP7 device on Verizon, there isn't much else he could have done except tell you to buy into a different platform.
But the general idea of your topic, I understand, and its most certainly saddening to see how the market treats underdogs (not only Verizon). Though, I think you'll find that once the dollar signs start shifting toward WP7, the tune of most sales reps will also shift. They go where the money goes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Blame yourself for the setup....going to the oem for charging solutions is a setup for fail.
Expecting a salesperson to backup an all but discontinued device (because you like it) is a second setup to fail.
Continuing to support that company month to month is the third setup for fail.
Vote with your money, and enjoy the device you want instead = win ?
Seems like the fowl taste WM and the Kin left in VWs mouth hasn't left pitty.
Sent from my SGH-i917 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
...then Verizon should've been smart and got the HD2 instead of the Kin !
Ok ohgood, let me clarify a few things:
1. I was looking at charging cables. Its not like I ran in, brow sweaty demanding a cable and willing to pay any price.
2.funny how a device that's Been out since early summer is considered "discontinued". Only reason it is could be because VZW deemed it so. Way to give it a chance.
3.maybe you should read why I'm sticking with VZW (great cell service and grandfathered into unlimited data). I'm sure I mentioned it above. Let me check...yep. I did.
So it's hard to vote with ones wallet when my other choice is a cell carrier that drops calls or gets no service in my area all together. Heaven forbid I would like to get a phone that isn't based on specs from a year ago. So, my point still stands. Google might as well buy VZW so they can just outright say "all android, all the time"
Sent from my mwp6985 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Oh and to add a point, I wasn't seeking an upgrade. I was just browsing,curious about data cables or whathaveyou, and when making small talk, he saw the phone and started off on "the facts" about why WP7 is awful. So he wasn't trying to find my needs. And I get they follow the money, but as I previously stated, of course your gonna make more money on an OS that has a carrier branded tv and radio spot, not to mention the wall sized posters of android phones in store. Yet every vzw store I've been to had the trophy for 2 weeks in a corner of the store where no one would see it. /end rebuttal
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wakka420 said:
Oh and to add a point, I wasn't seeking an upgrade. I was just browsing,curious about data cables or whathaveyou, and when making small talk, he saw the phone and started off on "the facts" about why WP7 is awful. So he wasn't trying to find my needs. And I get they follow the money, but as I previously stated, of course your gonna make more money on an OS that has a carrier branded tv and radio spot, not to mention the wall sized posters of android phones in store. Yet every vzw store I've been to had the trophy for 2 weeks in a corner of the store where no one would see it. /end rebuttal
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Yes, I read that about lack of quality cellular service, its familiar to me. He's just using sales tactics that usually work for him, or possibly pointing out reasons other customers have cited for moving to iphone4. Prolly gets him a contract renewal or sale 9/10.
Thing is, no matter how uninterested you are in their hardware choices, you're supporting them month to month.
prjkthack said:
Regardless of what platform he personally prefers, in the end, he wants to make money, and he wants you to upgrade right then and there, and there isn't another WP7 device for him to offer you... what else is he supposed to do? lol
As a sales rep myself, I would attempt to figure out what you want, and get you the device that suits you the best. I'm no Android fan, but if I find out that you like Android, there is little reason for me to try and get you to buy into a completely different platform, no matter how awesome it is. Since you have the only WP7 device on Verizon, there isn't much else he could have done except tell you to buy into a different platform.
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You're a good sales rep. Honestly. My last experience with a rep at a VW store went more or less as follows. I walk into the store just to look around because I had time to kill. The rep walks up and asks me what phone I have. I tell him a Focus and that I am on AT&T and am not interested in buying anything, I was just browsing. He proceeds to tell me that my phone's OS isn't any good, and that AT&T sucks (I can't really argue very much with that, though) -- I should switch to VW and get a Droid because they are the best phones available on the market. I asked him if he had ever used a WP7 -- he hadn't, of course. That conversation ended right there and I asked him to show me a Moto Xoom, which is another story.
I already have a Note 3 but would love to try a Gear VR. Finally found an okay price for a Note 4 on craigslist today and was excited to give it a go. I'm on tmobile but my verizon Note 3 functions just fine so I thought I'd "upgrade."
So far ... I kind of hate it.
The fact that this phone can't be rooted (because of Verizon?) wouldn't be quite so depressing if it weren't for the hideous pastel colors staring me in the face every time I pull down the tool bar or open a menu ... Yes I've installed a custom launcher but it doesn't change the 80's era color scheme ... This is 2015. I can't choose the background color on my own damn phone? Really?
I had my Note 3 setup the way I wanted it to look with a rom that gave me a lot of options, and going from having control over aesthetics to having basically no control over them is a shock. Like moving from a house you own and can paint any color you want to an awful pastel apartment that you can't paint because the landlord won't let you.
The lockscreen. I liked the option on my Note 3 to pick the effect when unlocking my phone. The rippling water effect was my favorite. Now I have ... no such option? The choice to change it seems to be grayed out?
The heat. Running low graphic Cardboard apps and the back of this phone seems to be getting awfully warm awfully fast. Haven't tried anything really intensive yet but I'm already worried about heat.
Speed. Not notably faster (no pun intended) than my customized Note 3. Apps that were slow on the 3 ... are still slow on this phone. Menus seem to open at about the same speed or possibly even slower.
Pixel density. I thought having a higher resolution screen would mean less visible picture structure ... Not really seeing it. I can look at my two phones side by side and unless I zoom in, there is not that much visible difference in image quality, except ...
The one good thing:
The camera. Took a couple of photos and am really impressed by the amount of detail that shows up. Definitely a big leap over the camera in my Note 3 ...
But ... I'm thinking maybe I should sell this to someone else on craigslist and go back to my Note 3.
Anyone else have a similar reaction? Am I missing something here?
Honestly only you can answer that question. In regards to root, only DE have it as far as I know for any carrier. If you HAVE to have root, then it might have been a mistake.
ssb13 said:
Honestly only you can answer that question. In regards to root, only DE have it as far as I know for any carrier. If you HAVE to have root, then it might have been a mistake.
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Actually the Note 4 on Sprint and T-Mobile are both rootable. Verizon and AT&T are the a**holes here. Actually @Haints you just made the same mistake most other people did. You didn't do the research before you spent your money. Because I've been practically living in this forum for 4 years I've seen the day when Verizon would lock a phone down to where nobody would be able to root it coming. I bought a Note 4 Developer Edition.
What a terrible corporate policy. WHY do they do that? Well, I've learned my lesson. I will never buy a Verizon phone again. ( Scratch that. Sounds like you never really "own" a Verizon phone to begin with, since they lock it down to keep the OS the way they want it. I will never ... rent a Verizon phone again?)
I did figure out how to change the lock option, and I do like the phone, apart from the choices I'm locked out of ... but having freely owned a phone before, I can't forget what that feels like. So f*ck Verizon.
And yes, Stuey, I did err by not doing my research here. The Verizon Note popped up on craigslist at a good price and I jumped at it. My mistake.
Thanks to you both for responding!
Haints said:
What a terrible corporate policy. WHY do they do that? Well, I've learned my lesson. I will never buy a Verizon phone again. ( Scratch that. Sounds like you never really "own" a Verizon phone to begin with, since they lock it down to keep the OS the way they want it. I will never ... rent a Verizon phone again?)
I did figure out how to change the lock option, and I do like the phone, apart from the choices I'm locked out of ... but having freely owned a phone before, I can't forget what that feels like. So f*ck Verizon.
And yes, Stuey, I did err by not doing my research here. The Verizon Note popped up on craigslist at a good price and I jumped at it. My mistake.
Thanks to you both for responding!
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You're not the only one. It's heartbreaking to see this happen to so many people. The Verizon Note 4 forums are depressing. Pretty much all of us plan to leave Verizon someday. The only reason I'm still with them is T-Mo and Sprint suck so bad around here. I'm just hoping for them to improve some.
The reason they do it is because locking them makes them more secure. All of the big corporate and government accounts like them that way. Hackers are becoming more of a problem. Verizon makes a lot of extra money because they are more secure than the others. We'll probably all lose our rootable phones soon.
stueycaster said:
You're not the only one. It's heartbreaking to see this happen to so many people. The Verizon Note 4 forums are depressing. Pretty much all of us plan to leave Verizon someday. The only reason I'm still with them is T-Mo and Sprint suck so bad around here. I'm just hoping for them to improve some.
The reason they do it is because locking them makes them more secure. All of the big corporate and government accounts like them that way. Hackers are becoming more of a problem. Verizon makes a lot of extra money because they are more secure than the others. We'll probably all lose our rootable phones soon.
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I've already given up.
I've been stuck with the Verizon Samsung Galaxy Note 4 ever since it launched last year...I bought it right as it came out, expecting that it would get root at some point like previous phones.
Every single day I've visited these forums, patiently waiting for a permanent root. I have so much pent-up frustration over waiting that I recently splurged on a 128 GB Frost Huawei Nexus 6P and permanently canceled my Verizon contract. I gave up.
I've been a loyal Verizon customer since 2007 with previous phones rooted and I just couldn't stand it anymore. I'm sick of being treated like a child not being able to do what I want with a phone that I purchased with MY money.
I hope they realize that they're going to be losing loyal customers like me at a rapid pace over digging their heels on this ridiculous policy.
I preordered the retail version at upgrade price ($300) and sold it a month later for $590 after giving up on waiting for root. Then paid an extra $110 for the developer edition. So I paid for a developer edition for $410 instead of $700. I wish I thought about this once I got the phone to sell it for more but overall I still came out on top. The DE Note 4 is the best phone out right now on Verizon. Nothing compares, yet. And I still have unlimited data but I hear they are changing the price to $50 a month for people who are grandfathered in D:
rarenight said:
I've already given up.
I've been stuck with the Verizon Samsung Galaxy Note 4 ever since it launched last year...I bought it right as it came out, expecting that it would get root at some point like previous phones.
Every single day I've visited these forums, patiently waiting for a permanent root. I have so much pent-up frustration over waiting that I recently splurged on a 128 GB Frost Huawei Nexus 6P and permanently canceled my Verizon contract. I gave up.
I've been a loyal Verizon customer since 2007 with previous phones rooted and I just couldn't stand it anymore. I'm sick of being treated like a child not being able to do what I want with a phone that I purchased with MY money.
I hope they realize that they're going to be losing loyal customers like me at a rapid pace over digging their heels on this ridiculous policy.
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I'm sure there will be more like you.
Sent from my SM-N910V DE w/MoRom
Thanks for the correction. I wasn't totally sure.
Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk
rarenight said:
I've already given up.
I've been stuck with the Verizon Samsung Galaxy Note 4 ever since it launched last year...I bought it right as it came out, expecting that it would get root at some point like previous phones.
Every single day I've visited these forums, patiently waiting for a permanent root. I have so much pent-up frustration over waiting that I recently splurged on a 128 GB Frost Huawei Nexus 6P and permanently canceled my Verizon contract. I gave up.
I've been a loyal Verizon customer since 2007 with previous phones rooted and I just couldn't stand it anymore. I'm sick of being treated like a child not being able to do what I want with a phone that I purchased with MY money.
I hope they realize that they're going to be losing loyal customers like me at a rapid pace over digging their heels on this ridiculous policy.
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Click to collapse
Unfortunately, VZW doesn't care. People who root their devices make up a small percentage of their customers. VZW is more concerned about promoting safety and security.
I was an iPhone user up to the release of iPhone 6. Decided to get Samsung Galaxy Note 4 (verizon) because of easy access to change battery. (As each new iPhone model made seems to make it more difficult.) I've had the Note for over a year. I keep telling myself that I'll get used to it. I haven't yet. I hate it! I fight with it every time I want to do a simple task. On top of how confusing it is to use compared to iPhone. Battery drains fast. Screen turns on randomly. And now any app I try to install from google play AND amazon app, it just hangs saying, "installing.........."-google play. And "install pending........"-amazon. It's been like that for 48 hours now. WTH? I have 10 gigs free'd up. I restarted app, restarted phone tried searching Forums. YES, I hate this phone. And if Samsung drops support on this phone, I'm going to drop my support for Samsung products.
Yeah you screwed up just like the rest of us. I came from ATT, who are assholes by the way, and am pretty much gonna dump Verizon when my contract is up. I will buy my own phones from now on, no more carrier branded, locked out , **** phones like this one. The Note 4, when locked down, is actually a turd. its slow, it crashes and pretty much just all around sucks. Root would make this a great phone, but there will never be root until long after this phone is ancient and useless.
They say Android 6 will fix the issues that Android 5 caused. The Note 4 with Android 4.4 ran good. The latest word is Android 6 will come in February.
Sent from my SM-N910V DE w/MoRom
stueycaster said:
They say Android 6 will fix the issues that Android 5 caused. The Note 4 with Android 4.4 ran good. The latest word is Android 6 will come in February.
Sent from my SM-N910V DE w/MoRom
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By that time the Note 4 will be an ancient turd. I liked my Note 2 waaaay better than this piece of garbage.
Just wondering if there's any official word from Google on how long they're going to support this tablet. I figure it should at least get support through the end of this year, which will be its 2 year anniversary, so we can expect software upgrades for the next 6 months or so, but what about beyond that. I've looked around Google's support pages, but haven't seen any mention of the Pixel C.
The reason I ask is because I'm actually considering trying out one of the new iPad Pro models that were just announced, and one of the key factors in that, aside from the impressive hardware, is the fact that Apple seems to support their stuff a lot longer than just about any Android manufacturer, including Google. While this isn't such a big deal on phones, which most people seem accustomed to changing out every 2 years here in America (probably because they're used to the way most carrier contracts are set up), tablets should be expected to last a little longer, in my opinion.
I know tablets aren't nearly as popular as they once were, but I still really enjoy mine. Started out with a Nexus 7 2013, and then moved on to the Pixel C, and was hoping to stay in the Android camp. But it seems like Apple is one of the few manufacturers left still trying to make premium tablets, and backing them up with solid after-purchase support for a good long time. I don't mind paying a bit more for a nicer tablet, but I want to know that I'll still be able to get software and security updates for longer than 2 years. Yes, I know I could always try rooting the Pixel C, but I went down that road with my Nexus 6, and truthfully other than adding an ad blocker, I never got any use out of having a rooted device. And now since I've found other applications that do the same thing without rooting, I don't see myself ever wanting to deal with that again.
So if anyone has any info on what Google has planned for the Pixel C, I'd be interested in hearing it. I've had a great experience with the tablet, and the software issues it suffered on first release have been ironed out though updates. Be a shame if they weren't planning on supporting this device well past the 2 year point.
Two years, like every other product.
http://www.androidpolice.com/2017/04/27/google-adds-pixels-end-life-support-page/
cam30era said:
Two years, like every other product.
http://www.androidpolice.com/2017/04/27/google-adds-pixels-end-life-support-page/
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That page you linked to just shows the Pixel phones, not the Pixel C. I know Google has committed to 2 years on the phone side, but I'm wondering about the tablet. I imagine it is 2 years, but I'd like some official confirmation.
Sign the Petition
https://chn.ge/2OhGn3Z
Done
Lol it's a waste of time...HTC rushed Android 8 just to get it out there and it sucks. They won't update any further sad to say.
It's pointless
We will never see something like this
I agree, it's totally pointless - they'll never do it, but I'll sign it anyway.
I did it too! I hope for the best, but even if we get to 100, isn't it not enough?
They have no reason to upgrade a 2-year-old flagship phone to Pie, no matter how many signatures you get. 2 years is all you get. Why would you invest all the dev resources into upgrading a phone that is no longer manufactured, and will provide absolutely zero return on investment? As a business owner, I sure as hell wouldn't do it.
whiteduck89 said:
They have no reason to upgrade a 2-year-old flagship phone to Pie, no matter how many signatures you get. 2 years is all you get. Why would you invest all the dev resources into upgrading a phone that is no longer manufactured, and will provide absolutely zero return on investment? As a business owner, I sure as hell wouldn't do it.
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We have come to a point that a device which cost around 600 euros (!!!) has a lifespan of 2 years and this is considered OK... Think about that for a moment. It's not anyone's fault, but peoples' who always buy the newest no matter how much it costs.
But damn, even Apple launches a new iPhone every year and they support the devices with updates for 4+ years. So business-wise, there is no excuse why Android manufacturers shouldn't do it as well. The problem is that it costs way more to upgrade an Android device, plus there are many parties who need to upgrade the software for their parts.
@errikosd yeah it sucks but that's the way it goes, unfortunately ... Planned obsolescence is a horrible business practice that even Apple did, by dumbing down the processor speed and battery capacities. Until they were caught that is ...
Signed. But not sure if it will go anywhere. In my books, HTC 10 remains the best phone of its time.
No hope guys.
https://twitter.com/htc/status/1028000627794706432