I never used Linux never knew anyone who has. What can you run on Linux game wise? Can you play any Windows games on Linux? What is the newest version of Linux? How do you buy computer parts to make a Linux computer? All I ever seen is Windows logo on parts. Whats the advantages compared to Windows? How does one get it one a computer does if come on a disk or flash someplace?
Thank you
Rbohannon89 said:
I never used Linux never knew anyone who has. What can you run on Linux game wise? Can you play any Windows games on Linux? What is the newest version of Linux? How do you buy computer parts to make a Linux computer? All I ever seen is Windows logo on parts. Whats the advantages compared to Windows? How does one get it one a computer does if come on a disk or flash someplace? Thank you
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I haven't used Linux directly in quite a long time but, the following threads may be helpful in understanding it a bit better. Don't be afraid to ask for some member guidance within one of them too.
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1459153
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2723240
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=3300596
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=3530696
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2885245
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1076138
There's others out there but, this will give you a good start...
Good Luck!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I DO NOT provide support via PM unless asked/requested by myself. PLEASE keep it in the threads where everyone can share.
I looked at them but that didn't answer any my question.
There is Steam on Linux. And lot of games are available on Linux. You can't play all windows games on Linux .
http://store.steampowered.com/linux
Windows is like an LTS OS if compared to Linux.
So Ubuntu 16.04 is a safe.
Some OS are updated on daily basis like Arch , Debian.
Some every 6 months like Linux Mint & Ubuntu ,
Linux runs on everything. So basically , as long as you have a computing device.
As far as custom Linux PC is concerned, checkout System76.
https://system76.com/
There are nice builds and they come with good support.
karandpr said:
There is Steam on Linux. And lot of games are available on Linux. You can't play all windows games on Linux .
http://store.steampowered.com/linux
Windows is like an LTS OS if compared to Linux.
So Ubuntu 16.04 is a safe.
Some OS are updated on daily basis like Arch , Debian.
Some every 6 months like Linux Mint & Ubuntu ,
Linux runs on everything. So basically , as long as you have a computing device.
As far as custom Linux PC is concerned, checkout System76.
https://system76.com/
There are nice builds and they come with good support.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What is the advantages and disadvantages in having linux? Also what do most people use it for everyday personal use?
Rbohannon89 said:
What is the advantages and disadvantages in having linux? Also what do most people use it for everyday personal use?
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Click to collapse
Linux just works. Windows has lot of software. Mac is really optimized.
People use Linux to devlop software mostly. Cos it's has great support for development and most servers run on linux.
Windows is still for people who want variety of software and games.
karandpr said:
Linux just works. Windows has lot of software. Mac is really optimized.
People use Linux to devlop software mostly. Cos it's has great support for development and most servers run on linux.
Windows is still for people who want variety of software and games.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So can I can play Windows games somehow? I'm only asking cause I'm thinking of buying a older laptop to experiment with and always curious about Linux. Wanted to play with Linux and learn it. Thanks for the response.
Rbohannon89 said:
So can I can play Windows games somehow? I'm only asking cause I'm thinking of buying a older laptop to experiment with and always curious about Linux. Wanted to play with Linux and learn it. Thanks for the response.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are lot of steam games for linux . Older games can be played using Wine or Crossover...
Don't expect to play newer games due to graphics card limitations. (DirectX and Video graphics drivers cause issues.)
Rbohannon89 said:
So can I can play Windows games somehow? I'm only asking cause I'm thinking of buying a older laptop to experiment with and always curious about Linux. Wanted to play with Linux and learn it. Thanks for the response.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
An older laptop would be a good way to start. Since it's an older laptop I don't imagine there will be an expectation to play new games on it, Windows or otherwise. Still, remains a great way to dip in and and look at Linux's potential.
Also, the make and model of the laptop can determine how well it is suited for Linux (you have mentioned the Windows stickers earlier - especially recently manufacturers have been making it difficult to allow the switch to Linux), can do a web search with 'linux' in the search, or a distribution. e.g. ...
Code:
linux support lenovo t420
debian support lenovo t420
Lenovo, HP, and Dell are big names that appear to play nice (and System76 makes PC's for Linux). Others, can be like rolling the dice.
And when I hint at a difficult time, it's usually the wi-fi, sometimes the trackpad, maybe sound, rarely something very important like video.
Not saying this to discourage, only to suggest research when it comes to any equipment, old or new. Hopefully the toughest thing would be deciding which distribution to choose - I'm enough of an old fogey to stick to versioned, long-term releases like Debian and avoid the bleeding edge "rolling releases" provide.
Hope this helps.
Oh (looking back to the first post), advantages (which are in the eye of the beholder since they can potentially hold a disadvantage):
Free (as in freedom). I like to be able to vote with my dollar, even though Linux users are rarely obligated to pay for software. This is a philosophical reason, and one can go deep down that rabbit hole, what I like is, nothing is hidden from the public eye since the software is often accompanied by source code, on request. Which makes it difficult for say, a search assistant to send unknown data back to the mother ship.
Variety of experience. If you don't like an application, a windows manager, heck even the init process, you can replace it with something else or even write your own.
Support for older hardware. Often the method to revive a five to ten (sometimes quite older - I occasionally run an up-to-date Linux-powered laptop from 2002 with very satisfactory results) year old device for a new life.
Thank you so much for the replies. What kind of hardware and era should I look for to make a smart decision to what kind of laptop to get? From someone who has never ever used linux or even seen it only used windows how hard is the learning curb? Can I load it on the the pc and just go for it or will I be massively confused?
Rbohannon89 said:
Thank you so much for the replies. What kind of hardware and era should I look for to make a smart decision to what kind of laptop to get? From someone who has never ever used linux or even seen it only used windows how hard is the learning curb? Can I load it on the the pc and just go for it or will I be massively confused?
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Click to collapse
I would go for a once-mid-to-high-end laptop of about six years old (newer run but still holding the Windows 7 stickers), from a vendor I noted before. It does not guarantee complete compatibility so you would still want to cross reference the model number.
I am not a fan of "chiclet" keyboards (I have enough difficulty typing on laptop keyboards) and have fond memories of the IBM ThinkPads (I used to own the popular 600X) that I maintain one of the final bastions before Lenovo took design tips from Apple (by the way, I hear MacBooks can have reasonable compatibility as well, though there would be an extra premium there).
For a laptop longevity perspective (the second thing to look for), a "flagship" laptop from a vendor (especially from Apple or Lenovo) means better access to (and thus generally less expensive) spare parts. To identify this on the Lenovo side, it would mean part of the "T" or "X" lineup (both are business grade; the X models just have a smaller footprint). For what it's worth, business-grade HP laptops are the "ProBook" series.
From what I understand, the learning curve is not that difficult. There have been people who knew nothing about computers that learned Linux quite easily. The challenge for a Windows user trying Linux becomes "un-learning" specific workflow to make way for new ways of doing things. Apologies I can only be general - me trying to share my experience with the learning curve is difficult since that transition was about two decades ago and Microsoft drastically changed the typical user's workflow three times between the early 1990's of my first computer and the year 2000 (MS-DOS -> Windows 3.1 -> Windows 95 -> NT5) that makes the transition from Windows 7 to 8 to 10 look like a food fight. The first year I was quite reliant on a guru (I was in the expectation to accelerate my knowledge for an upcoming project) until I was directed to not use that as a crutch. A bit sad to say, that moment I was told to "RTFM" for a simple problem was when I really started to learn.
But I would definitely not dive into the deep end (as they say) by wiping your main computer for Linux. For starters, even with decent backups (which you should be doing anyway), your data can be inaccessible (installing Linux on a fully set up PC means losing all your personal files there, and if your backup tool to other media is done by a Windows program, Linux may not support restoring that data).
It is also a quick way to become frustrated when hitting even a small roadblock. I would not use "confused" as asked above for this phenomenon. When you combine the impact of the problem with the time in which you would need it resolved by, it can create a sort of desperation on a forum when the answer could have been glaring back without realizing it. Depending on how well documented the issue's solution is (and when a problem that prevents the achievement of a deadline occours on short notice, blind spots tend to happen to even the best of us), would-be readers get frustrated as well and may criticize the lack of research. An exaggerated XDA example of this is when someone flashes a ROM on their daily driver, without any backups first, without wiping anything, and then frantic that their only phone has app force closures every five seconds - and the plane for their two week trip leaves in six hours. In short, a dedicated device to play on means you set the pace on how you want to learn.
A dedicated laptop would be the better way to go. For a no-cost (no additional hardware to buy) demo of Linux, can try a live CD (will also determine how your hardware can interact with Linux) or maintain a persistent instance through an install in Oracle VirtualBox or VMWare (which Linux will work even if your hardware does not play with Linux). Much further away from recommended territory we have the "cold turkey" method (gripes noted in previous two paragraphs), and finally - for a reason - dual-boot (which has to opportunity to hose one or both operating systems at any given moment - including your data - for as something as simple as a Windows Update).
This turned out to be longer than expected, but I hope this helps.
So it's been about 20 I don't know it's been about since 1997 that I played the Linux or Kali nethunter I was wondering if these are possible put on my smg900v or piece of crap that's the original smart phone from Samsung I don't remember the name but it still on Android Jelly Bean I believe was interested if I could take my two older phones and wipe the OS completely and make them nothing but Linux because I used to have a lot of fun with that we used to stay up and drink beers and play on it you know and then it went away in 2008 and I haven't had a cell phone in years because my work gave me one any advice would be appreciated but my youngest son would probably really be interested in it are you having dyslexia try to get him in anything also I found back in the day where they used to convert that phone to be 2G but I can't find anything but the source code and I don't know how to completely enter source code into an Android phone I had a computer I can do it on the computer but not a phone
averydiablo said:
So it's been about 20 I don't know it's been about since 1997 that I played the Linux or Kali nethunter I was wondering if these are possible put on my smg900v or piece of crap that's the original smart phone from Samsung I don't remember the name but it still on Android Jelly Bean I believe was interested if I could take my two older phones and wipe the OS completely and make them nothing but Linux because I used to have a lot of fun with that we used to stay up and drink beers and play on it you know and then it went away in 2008 and I haven't had a cell phone in years because my work gave me one any advice would be appreciated but my youngest son would probably really be interested in it are you having dyslexia try to get him in anything also I found back in the day where they used to convert that phone to be 2G but I can't find anything but the source code and I don't know how to completely enter source code into an Android phone I had a computer I can do it on the computer but not a phone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The closest thing you can do is run linux with chroot.
Here is a good post to get you started.
https://www.xda-developers.com/guid...a-gnulinux-environment-on-any-android-device/
Related
I know xda developers is mostly a windows mobile and android sit but I would like a n900 section on xda developers it would really boost the hacking scene because we all know this is the best place for smartphone hacking and the n900 is the best device to hack it would almost be like love. What do you guys think.
Welcome to forums
This has been discussed many times and answer remains no. (as far as I know)
I love the idea!
I am thinking in moving on to this weird and wonderful device/os.
Even though it seems to have only a few applications available directly I've read that the Linux on it is based on Debian and if you know your way around linux you can download almost any Debian app. and what I often see here is people wanting to get their hands on some phone with linux in it or some version of linux for their phones. In a way this one offers all this but, yes, it is a Nokia device, so what?
I will still keep one of my HTC/Wimo devices but will scrap the rest!
I want always on full internet and other geeky stuff.
So there Orb! Put it in your pipe and smoke it!
Hey all,
I am a happy owner of a n900 and it is the first time I am so excited with a mobile device since my first symbian phone. What amazes me with the device is its 'open' character, meaning that you buy the hardware, with maemo ofcourse, but the device is meant to be exploited. you can dual (triple) boot running android, meego and maemo, you can port many applications (Qt 4.6.2 Gui required), you can compile yourself stuff, run a debian VM with easy-debian.
Since most of applications are linux ported, there is loads of stuff you can do. Am example I enjoy is you can run an x11vnc server on your n900 and remote access it from anywhere with a vnc client. Other fancy stuff such to connect the n900 to your tv, run an Amiga emulator, bind your ps3 controller over BT, and start playing.
It's (very easy) overclockable, GPU runs great, VoIP services as a charm (Skype Video is now added), and most important in a really good multitasking environement. And ofcourse the moment you want to call your phone will response very very fast.
While it does all of the above, it does give you an iPhone feeling in terms of ease of use and device polishing.
On the downside, until today the software was limited except if you were a linux pro as very well mentioned above. The new 1.2 upgrade with Qt support broadens the range and posibiliteis quite a lot. For me, only support for Flash 10 is also a big issue for now, and i really hope it gets addressed soon.
It is bulky (related to iPhone likes) - nothing new here.
Bottom end, I tend to agree it doesn't fit to this forum. this forum was always about smartphones. This is one a tiny marvelous computer that can make GSM calls too. I think its a bit advanced for this site ;-)
rGrds
George
phones with resistive and cheap plastic like feeling screens always put me down.....
go to MAEMO.Org its all for n900 and whatever u want to do with it..
ruslanriad said:
go to MAEMO.Org its all for n900 and whatever u want to do with it..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
there you go then if you have a n900 and want to tweak it!
better talent here than maemo.org. still have my htc hd and the n900, just can't part with my htc yet.
Please make it, its a way to promote a lot of staff and give one opportunity for this system, *if nokia* gives the same "status" as Google with Android probably it will be the best system for mobile ever. A simple example, Maemo as conceited to support Open GL 2.0, Android not. Maemo was made for gives a new way to do the things, Android is only a WinMO more social and user-friendly. Now with MeeGo, the system haves a new chance, but XDA could help because Nokia still sucks with support.
So, please make it, i will appreciate it as well.
WoW!
I am now running nearly ALL my dearest Palm OS apps of yore (from my Treo650) in a VM inside N900.
Gotta looove open platforms!
If interested, follow here.
how comes there`s a new Kin forums and nothing for the N900 thats just BS
i suppose the n900 is linux and we've tweaked with linux here at xda before so.... if you contact the administrator he might say yes!
Both Communities have amazing minds, and i'm sure that there could be some overlap of usefulness stuff if there was an included section.
At the very least it would generate new interest for the site as a whole.
I also think that an N900 section would compliment the already excellent forums of XDA. As you are probably aware there is a lot of development currently underway of porting Froyo to this device.
We are all like minded and are trying to get the most out of our mobile devices. The nokia N900 is linux based as with the andriod system.
Thanks
I stupidly started a thread on this subject without searching earlier, apologies for that, should know better.
I see that there's a few of us wanting to see the N900 represented here.
I'd be happy to do some articles on the power mangement system and other bits I've learned since getting my N900, if only there was an appropriate place to put them.
Please don't say the obvious "put them on <insert-name-of-maemo-forum>". I trust this community to dissect and disseminate information in a constructive way. Other forums just don't give me the same confidence.
I think it'd be a smart move to add it for a few reasons:
1. It is a great way to combine the minds from here to another powerful device
2. With major companies now backing the Meego OS for there vehicle systems, this would be a great way to get the foot in the door as this OS gains some ground in the coming year or so.
3. The community here is exceptionally constructive...it's not about what can't be done, it's about discovering what can. What better tool to use than an fairly open sourced/linux based device.
4. My biased reason: Now that it's my only device, I miss xda :-(
I'm sure there are also some seasoned programmers familiar with the OS differences that would be able to bring up some more in depth reasons on why programming for this device wouldn't be a huge stepping stone from Android/Win Mo.
I would believe that breaking down all of the positives on the programming side of things might be a way for the admin's to make a thoughtful/final decision on whether or not it's worth XDA's resources to add the phone.
i had a n900 and i loved and even overclocked it, my youtube video was on engadget and got 50000 hits
anyways great device and hardware but letdown by nokia, i then bought the desire as i got bored of n900. so happy i got rid of it it had a major price drop in the second hand market.
I would really like to see one as well since I just got the N900. I really like the community here and doesn't want to leave this forum because I bought a n900.
hi together i also own a N900 since Nokia decided to choose Meego and Maemo5 is dying i play around with Nitdroid for the N900 its an Android Port for the N900 and works very well the only Problem is that the Phone radio dont works. The Nitdroid Port for the N900 is done by 3 People so far maybe some good Devs from here could help to get the Phone or GPS working for this, that would be amazing.
I guess nobody cares about the N900 anymore .. since Nokia goes to Meego i just hope about the Nitdroid Port.
Hey everyone,
I'd like to pitch in and start developing on WP7, thanks to my new LG Optimus 7. I have a working knowledge of C# and have earlier developed on WP6.5...
Unfortunately though.. the only computers I have on my disposal are Macs... Anyone have any luck developing for WP7 on them? All the tools I found don't seem to have open-source/Mac alternatives.
Please don't suggest a VM.. its too slow... Boot Camp is a pain (have other issues with Apple on that one!)
Thanks for your help..
CUGWMUI
Get a cheap Dell, put it on your LAN and remote desktop into it.
Or make your first goal a port of Microsoft's dev tools for Mac.
Ok, I hate macs with every fiber of my being and wouldnt use one if my choices were using a Mac or watching my legs go through a wood chipper but cant you just emulate the silverlight tools.... or I also heard macs can dual boot windows so you could use a good OS.
z33dev33l said:
Ok, I hate macs with every fiber of my being and wouldnt use one if my choices were using a Mac or watching my legs go through a wood chipper but cant you just emulate the silverlight tools.... or I also heard macs can dual boot windows so you could use a good OS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
windows a good OS, haha good one.
indiekiduk said:
windows a good OS, haha good one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, Linux is good, windows is functional, mac is.... diarrhea being orchestrated by a nazi
z33dev33l said:
Well, Linux is good, windows is functional, mac is.... diarrhea being orchestrated by a nazi
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ok I'll bite...
linux is unusable, however some people enjoy spending their days on forums looking up any number of random things from trying to make your cpu fan speed scale to getting your wifi card to work. That's for home use, as a server in a data centre in a pre-configured setup it's ideal.
Windows hasn't changed fundamentally since NT, even on 7 you still can't move a file while in use, sometimes you can't delete a file because it mistakenly *thinks* its in use, PCs are noisy and innefficient when running that OS. Stuff is just harder and more awkard to do, e.g. checking your IP address is over 7 clicks, if you make it that far and don't get confused by all the weird pictures of routers and globes. Even on 7 you need to resort to running cmd to do simple tasks that are a couple of clicks at most on every other OS.
With macs it comes down to the fact you can work quicker on it, there are less problems, the frameworks and dev tools are well designed, used by Apple themselves, so you can write apps faster, and make more money, and less frustrations along the way, leading to an overall less stressful more successful life. But I'm not going to argue with you, some people enjoy pain and just live unlucky lives, making bad decisions. All very strange to me...
indiekiduk said:
ok I'll bite...
linux is unusable, however some people enjoy spending their days on forums looking up any number of random things from trying to make your cpu fan speed scale to getting your wifi card to work. That's for home use, as a server in a data centre in a pre-configured setup it's ideal.
Windows hasn't changed fundamentally since NT, even on 7 you still can't move a file while in use, sometimes you can't delete a file because it mistakenly *thinks* its in use, PCs are noisy and innefficient when running that OS. Stuff is just harder and more awkard to do, e.g. checking your IP address is over 7 clicks, if you make it that far and don't get confused by all the weird pictures of routers and globes. Even on 7 you need to resort to running cmd to do simple tasks that are a couple of clicks at most on every other OS.
With macs it comes down to the fact you can work quicker on it, there are less problems, the frameworks and dev tools are well designed, used by Apple themselves, so you can write apps faster, and make more money, and less frustrations along the way, leading to an overall less stressful more successful life. But I'm not going to argue with you, some people enjoy pain and just live unlucky lives, making bad decisions. All very strange to me...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, we enjoy making bad decisions. We love knowing that if our webcam breaks we have to send the whole computer in or buy a new one. We also love the fact that our market share is ridiculously low because we offer no form of freedom. I have multiple phones with more gaming capability as well as functionality as a mac. Their are less problems because who wants to create "problems" for a 6 percent market share when they can clear 90 percent with their "buy our antivirus to fix our virus" crap. All mac has going for it is the fact that they "just work." Well, I built a PC more than 2 times more powerful than any Mac I've seen and it works fine for a much lower cost. If I were incompetent and planned on opening emails that congratulated me for winning 100,000 dollars and all I had to do was download the sign-up form then yeah, I'd use a mac. For now I like gaming, the cloud, applications that are worth anything being designed for my computer, freedom, being able to repair it myself, and not having to bend over for that nazi Steve Jobs.
If your webcam breaks you take it to a store which fixes it for free in a couple of days for 3 years, and if it isn't fixed to your satisfaction you get a brand new laptop, the latest model even if yours is years old, and its all taken care of by a hot girl. Yeh most people would totally rather spend their time instead under the desk with a screwdriver or surfing newegg comparing specs and benchmarks of harddrives that copy an extra 0.5MB/s faster. I totally understand your point there...
yes because people go to the apple store for the hot chicks, yeah, thats the case. Then they go without a computer for 3-5 days all to get a webcam repaired. Then they go back home and enjoy adding effects to photos.... seeing as how thats about the most amusing thing a Mac can do without emulating windows files.
Looks like no-one has the answer.
You need Visual Studio at the moment (AFAIK) and that only runs on Windows OS's.
Sorry.
Thread Closed as it's derailed off-topic.
Dave
It's a beta! It's buggy, it's slow (at least on a Surface RT).
If you use your tablet daily, stay away from this thing. Wait for the full release.
SilverHedgehog said:
It's a beta! It's buggy, it's slow (at least on a Surface RT).
If you use your tablet daily, stay away from this thing. Wait for the full release.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
expecting bumps. so far it's good and I am not experiencing any hiccups yet. I very much like the changes.
cheers
Well, I found it rather buggy - though considering how I use it, I'm rather surprised how well it works in 8.0. Still, a warning might be a good idea - I'm sick of people attacking companies when beta software is behaving like beta software.
It's also so limited in terms of the number of devices and regions it will actually install in, I rather get the impression it was a real rush job to try and show that improvements are at least coming at some point.
SilverHedgehog said:
It's a beta! It's buggy, it's slow (at least on a Surface RT).
If you use your tablet daily, stay away from this thing. Wait for the full release.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don`t stand by you .I think the RT 8.1 is perfect。The experience on my surface RT is nice
seven7xiaoyang said:
I don`t stand by you .I think the RT 8.1 is perfect。The experience on my surface RT is nice
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I second that.. My Surface is faster and smoother now. Especially with IE11. I have no more lags or getting the Browser to freeze. I love it!
I have the 8.1 Preview on my Surface RT and it seems fine. I wouldn't caution anybody against it based on what I've seen so far.
Tk
ToddKlindt said:
I have the 8.1 Preview on my Surface RT and it seems fine. I wouldn't caution anybody against it based on what I've seen so far.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Jailbreak. 'Nuff said.
Using Spotify crashes the browser - worked perfectly in 8.0.
A reminder to all who find bugs: PLEASE report them to MS! This is our last chance to ask Microsoft to fix things while the software is in development. Once it ships and gets handed off to a maintenance team, changes will be much slower to arrive.
Note: while the continued restriction on running our own desktop apps is not strictly a bug, this is also a good time to complain to MS about that; it's a very easy policy for them to change, if they decide it would be worth it!
So far my experience with windows rt. 8.1 is very nice. I like the outlook 2013, the keyboard and the response time of the tablet.
GoodDayToDie said:
A reminder to all who find bugs: PLEASE report them to MS! This is our last chance to ask Microsoft to fix things while the software is in development. Once it ships and gets handed off to a maintenance team, changes will be much slower to arrive.
Note: while the continued restriction on running our own desktop apps is not strictly a bug, this is also a good time to complain to MS about that; it's a very easy policy for them to change, if they decide it would be worth it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You need to read up on win32 vs. RT as well as some basic application architecture, then you will see why your complaint isn't valid.
Just because it has a pretty desktop and a run box doesn't mean apps magically work... Code for winform apps has to be compiled for arm vs x86/x64 to function and that just isn't going to happen. Explorer is there for a shim/stopgap.. By win9, will likely be gone for good.
This is like winnt on alpha and 2008 on titanium all over again... Except its now in the hands of consumers that don't understand what's going on under the covers.
MS should have never put a traditional desktop/explorer in RT and just finished the port of apps to modernui because its confusing to the average user.
Just think if apple had a shortcut in iOS to give you a macosx desktop that didn't run Mac apps..
Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
@libbycm: Despite being here even longer than I have, you appear to have no idea who you're talking to *or* what you're talking about.
I maintain the Ported Apps thread for RT, and have ported a few of them myself (and should get back into it with something more realistic than Chrome, which I still hope to get working Some Day Soon Now). I am quite *personally* familiar with the requirements of porting, the difficulties of working around missing functionality (almost all of which, it should be noted, is missing by design and not neccessity), and the realities of what an ARM processor can and cannot do.
First of all, .NET apps (including WinForms ones and even once that use COM or P/Invoke to system libraries) work just fine, no recompile needed. That's a pretty small portion of the overall Windows software ecosystem, of course, but it's a growing one and also it's one that would be seen as worth targeting by more developers if they saw an actual benefit to architecture-independent toolchains on Windows.
Second, and related to the first, .NET is far from the only architecture-independent language. Java (though IKVM, though .NET) kind of works on RT already; it wouldn't take much to make a serious platform worthy of an official port. Same for Python, and we already have Perl. Yeah, that's still miniscule next to the bulk of legacy x86 code, but it would nonetheless make RT a far more popular platform (for example, many of the Windows bittorrent clients are either Java or Python code, and some very popular games are written in those languages).
Third, even with the crippled tools that we have cobbled together to do our porting, and despite the fact that it's all done on our own time, we've managed a fair number of native ports already. There'd be far more if it weren't for the fact that we can't port closed-source programs (and many open-source ones don't happily compile under MSVC, which is the only RT-targeting compiler we have right now). Already, a growing number of programs are natively available on x64 - after all, it's just a drop-down selection and another click on "Build" in Visual Studio. Well, the same is true of RT. It wouldn't get legacy software, but there's no reason that *new* software released in the last half year - even proprietary commercial stuff - couldn't support RT. After all, it's more customer base for almost no additional work (supporting x64 is sometimes actually more work than supported ARM; at least ARM uses the same-width pointers as x86).
Fourth, legacy code is - by its very nature - older code and generally suitable for running on less-powerful systems. You mentioned Apple... but you failed to mention that when Apple went from 68k CPUs to PowerPC CPUs, and then from PPC to x86, they used mostly-transparent emulation layers to bridge those gaps. Yeah, the code ran slower, but it ran well enough for most purposes. Yeah, ARM is *less* powerful than x86, not more powerful (although you could argue that the same is true for some use cases when going from a G5 to a first-gen Core Duo), but we've also gotten better at this emulation thing. When Apple did it before, they hired the best folks in the business, and pushed the entire field of CPU emulation forward with their need to make it work. When Microsoft declined to do that, one guy on XDA took it upon himself, in his free time, with only a partial toolchain and no access to Windows internals, hacking on open-source pieces, and built a transparent emulation layer for RT. Microsoft's Windows application compatibility team almost certainly loses more man-hours in one day's bathroom breaks than @mamaich has been able to spend on that project to date, and yet some of those very same people who pushed the whole industry forward at Apple, doing things like inventing what is today called dynamic recompilation, now work at Microsoft. They have the expertise to make it work if they'd wanted to.
Fifth, Windows on Itanium failed (mostly; it's still being used, just not developed) because Itaniums were targeted specifically at the enterprise market but weren't very good even there; there's plenty of software for that instruction set in the aforementioned market. Alpha (never mind Windows on Alpha, which I actually know people who used and worked on) failed because DEC wanted outrageous sums of money for it, seeking high-end margins instead of embracing the commodity market. Had they done otherwise, they might even still exist as a company today. NT on MIPS and PPC was similarly niche, targeting brand new (and poorly-merketed) segments that didn't have great penetration in the ecosystem (NT for PPC was a server/workstation OS, not a MacOS alternative). Unlike all those achitectures, though, ARM is well established in the consumer market for commodity computers, and its market share there is growing. If Microsoft is serious about succeeding with RT (and I think they are), they should look at the success story in that market... and it's not Apple anymore. Despite Apple's huge first-mover advantage with the consumer market, Android is rolling over them. Yet Microsoft seems determined to repeat many of Apple's mistakes, despite having precious few of its advantages. They need to make themselves a better Android, not a me-too Apple clone.
Sixth, while Microsoft has made no secret of their desire to move to WinRT, I don't really forsee them having much more success with that than with their prior effort to move people to .NET; lots of small developers will go, but the big programs that are the movers and shakers of the Windows world will stick with the vastly more powerful, flexible, and (frankly) useful Win32 API. Porting an app to RT is a hell of a lot harder than porting x86 native code to ARM, though...
Cross posting this from another thread I made. For those of you, who now have Root, I am wondering if any of you would be interested in installing a Linux Distribution alongside your Android OS...well Fire OS. I have tested this on 4 devices so far, one being the Amazon HD 8.9. Since the HD 10 just got root, I am interested to see how a Linux OS would work on Fire OS, if at all. This would be a fully operational installation of a Linux distribution that runs alongside of Android.
If you're concerned about bricking your tablet, don't worry, this is very, very low risk, and pretty much impossible to brick your device. It will either work, or it won't. It's that simple. Note you need at least 4GB free space of internal storage, or if you have an sdcard slot, you can partition part of it to install a Linux distribution (that will be part two of my guide). I believe this will be a success on these tablets because I've tested it on three vastly different Samsung devices, with success on all of them. Samsung customizes (butchers) the framework in much of the same fashion as Amazon. If it works on the Kindle 8.9, it should work equally as good, maybe even better on the HD 10.
Please see my long, but detailed XDA guide.
Got it working but, its not proper. App Image runner ontop of the OG OS.
darksoul21 said:
Got it working but, its not proper. App Image runner ontop of the OG OS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure what you mean?
DragonFire1024 said:
I'm not sure what you mean?
Click to expand...
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Its like running a VM. Is there a way to get a full install instead?
darksoul21 said:
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Its like running a VM. Is there a way to get a full install instead?
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This is a 'full install.' you need the VNC if you want a graphical interface. You can also use a ssh client, but I haven't been able to figure that out yet.
If you want to replace android with Linux, it just isn't possible anymore. For now, this is about as good as you are going to get. I'm almost done with the second Guide. Perhaps that's more what you mean.
DragonFire1024 said:
This is a 'full install.' you need the VNC if you want a graphical interface. You can also use a ssh client, but I haven't been able to figure that out yet.
If you want to replace android with Linux, it just isn't possible anymore. For now, this is about as good as you are going to get. I'm almost done with the second Guide. Perhaps that's more what you mean.
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Its a Virtual Machine running on top of android. So your stuck with the available resources from the primary OS (android).
Its better than nothing since this device is basically dead on this Forum.
darksoul21 said:
Its a Virtual Machine running on top of android. So your stuck with the available resources from the primary OS (android).
Its better than nothing since this device is basically dead on this Forum.
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Click to collapse
Not true. You can download apps and what not. You can do just about the same things as you could in a desktop with Linux. You have git, gcc, etc. But at the moment l, unless you have a Nexus, this is the best there is. The virtual aspect is unavoidable.
DragonFire1024 said:
Not true. You can download apps and what not. You can do just about the same things as you could in a desktop with Linux. You have git, gcc, etc. But at the moment l, unless you have a Nexus, this is the best there is. The virtual aspect is unavoidable.
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You can do all that in a virtual machine. What he's saying is, since it's a vm, you only get access to system resources not in use by the host operating system. No complaints. Again, it's better than nothing if that kind of thing is what you're looking for.
sturner83 said:
You can do all that in a virtual machine. What he's saying is, since it's a vm, you only get access to system resources not in use by the host operating system. No complaints. Again, it's better than nothing if that kind of thing is what you're looking for.
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Right. But you can interact with those resources. This has always been the only mass way to install Linux. There used to be a way, but I couldn't replicate it. Keep an eye on Ubuntu though.
I'm interested but will it run native or chroot?
Franzferdinan51 said:
I'm interested but will it run native or chroot?
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Supposed to be both, but have only been able to get chroot going.
Sent from my Amazon Jem using XDA Labs
I think native might require BL unlock but I'm not even close to an expert I will say that it whould be cool to port a ChromeOS varient chromium or cloudready even
Franzferdinan51 said:
I think native might require BL unlock but I'm not even close to an expert I will say that it whould be cool to port a ChromeOS varient chromium or cloudready even
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Click to collapse
I think, though I'll have to look, I had a Gentoo Android installation. I never tried it and not sure if I still have it. Supposedly it just needs installing into /data. I'll look for it and a link and post my findings a little later.
Sent from my Amazon KFSUWI using XDA Labs
Double down on IDK
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Franzferdinan51 said:
I think native might require BL unlock but I'm not even close to an expert I will say that it whould be cool to port a ChromeOS varient chromium or cloudready even
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Click to collapse
Not close to expert on Android on ARM myself, although I used to dumpster dive for 386 PCs when I discovered linux and 486s we're just coming out, and I was "stuck" with a 68k Mac. Bought the first bootable Linux CD back in the 90s (Debian), got Linux running on a DEC Alpha soon after, so I've been around the block. I don't see any reason at all to get linux on a Fire except as an academic challenge. ChromiumOS (and ChromeOS) are crippled Linux. Period. CloudReady is just Chrome tweaked for old x86 PCs. Linux itself would just give you some extra developer tools, maybe. Perhaps a pro might secretly do penetration testing with a Kindle that way, but it would be like trying to fish with firecrackers. Might as well get a RPi. Is there a particular app you want to run? I can see trying to break from Amazon's walled garden with an alt Android, but anything else and you might as well write your own OS. That's about the level of challenge you're talking about. Dragonfire1024- am I right? I don't mean to be harsh, just realistic. Personally, I'd rather spend time on development boards like the Pi, than reverse engineer a Fire to that extent.
cuvtixo said:
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Not close to expert on Android on ARM myself, although I used to dumpster dive for 386 PCs when I discovered linux and 486s we're just coming out, and I was "stuck" with a 68k Mac. Bought the first bootable Linux CD back in the 90s (Debian), got Linux running on a DEC Alpha soon after, so I've been around the block. I don't see any reason at all to get linux on a Fire except as an academic challenge. ChromiumOS (and ChromeOS) are crippled Linux. Period. CloudReady is just Chrome tweaked for old x86 PCs. Linux itself would just give you some extra developer tools, maybe. Perhaps a pro might secretly do penetration testing with a Kindle that way, but it would be like trying to fish with firecrackers. Might as well get a RPi. Is there a particular app you want to run? I can see trying to break from Amazon's walled garden with an alt Android, but anything else and you might as well write your own OS. That's about the level of challenge you're talking about. Dragonfire1024- am I right? I don't mean to be harsh, just realistic. Personally, I'd rather spend time on development boards like the Pi, than reverse engineer a Fire to that extent.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To each their own I guess. My goal is to at some point get nethunter to work in a better capacity than this guide. There's a lot more you can do with parts of Linux. For example, attempt to root other devices, build parts of or whole ROMs, etc.
Sent from my Amazon KFSUWI using XDA Labs
Has there been any progress on this? I'm looking to use this as digital signage where there isn't space in a wall box for a RPi or similar SBC.
sorry for posting this question here but it I've tried to find a better place and failed...what's the best option(s) for this thing if it hasn't been rooted already? I'm ready to just sell it and move on if I can't do something other than what Amazon intended.
Ubuntu touch on fire hd 8
I would love to put Ubuntu touch on my 8" fire has this been done and can I use ubports to do it and what works??
Hi all,
I am new, as a registered user, to this forum, but I have been tinkering with my recently acquired Lumia and its content for a little while now and I really wanted to make a point on this device. I read and re read most of the pertinent entries here but with no luck in tracing a path to make a better use of it.
I bought it as It was the cheapest portable machine I could find with Internet explorer in order to do some debugging on a website I am developing that I wanted to work, even if in a basic form, also with legacy browsers such us older IE.
Now that I concluded the thing I got it for, I am feeling too bad not finding a use for it. It still comes plenty of battery, at only 66 cycles, and the design is still nice and sleek, even modern at some extent. Even the display is ok for today standards and it feels like a nice little machine. Unfortunately it came with W 8.1 RT, and by my understanding there is no way to jailbreak, unlock the bootloader or even allow third party non signed applications due to the fact that it is a Lumia and not a contemporary 2013 Surface RT, that seems to be much more popular in this forum.
I understood, also, that there is no as reliable as Surface RT or Surface 2 way to unlock the boot loader on this device due to the better work done by the SOC developers back when it was released, but here and there I found traces of possible work arounds by people that confirmed they managed to do something with it nut without giving much details.
I wanted to understand if there was a way to have a non explorer based ported browser (I took a look at the great work done by frylockk19, but first I need to jailbreak the device and I found guides inly for surface, not for Lumias) or to Install Windows 10 Arm from some years ago (here) but with no luck with Lumia drivers.
Does anyone have a clue?
Any help would be really appreciated to revive that little machine!
Thanks for your time in reading my post!
I'm also still in the hopes of trying to change Windows RT 8.1 to something better, preferably linux.