A recent teardown by ifixit reveals Evo running Broadcom BCM4329 radio chipset. According to broadcom's official promo page, BCM4329 contains "FM radio receiver and transmitter" capability.
HTC Evo - 1Ghz, 4.3" LCD, WiMax, WiFi a/b/g/n, FM Rx+Tx... I think I'm starting to melt just thinking how much I will enjoy this lil device once I get it on June 4th
frifox said:
A recent teardown by ifixit reveals Evo running Broadcom BCM4329 radio chipset. According to broadcom's official promo page, BCM4329 contains "FM radio receiver and transmitter" capability.
HTC Evo - 1Ghz, 4.3" LCD, WiMax, WiFi a/b/g/n, FM Rx+Tx... I think I'm starting to melt just thinking how much I will enjoy this lil device once I get it on June 4th
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i bet you 50 bucks that there will not be any transmitting feature installed.. and i bet you that it will take several months before it will get hacked
There is no transmitting feature. You can only listen to the radio with headphones on.
-------------------------------------
Sent via the XDA Tapatalk App
Well, that much I do know... already been down that road with touch pro's "hardware accelerated graphics". HTC is well known not to utilize chip's full potential, let it be due to licensing or whatever reason there is.
After quick search on google, it seems that N1/Desire/iPodTouch3G/iPad all contain BCM4329, and seeing all the good devs coming over to Evo territory I'm having my fingers crossed that someone unlocks/writes a driver+app for that FM transmitter before this christmas
EDIT: ... given that the FM transmitter part of the chip is actually wired to the board
I've been dealing with various radios on linux with x86/x64 hardware for past 5 years, so I'll give Evo a stab and see what I can do with it
And just what will you be transmitting if you could?
i use a bluetooth speakerphone in my car to transmit to my car stereo... it'd be nice to take the speakerphone out of the picture. stream pandora/last.fm to the clock radio i have at work.
as posted above, I'd love to stream music to external speakers such as car's audio which doesnt have no aux/blutooth capability.
Has there been any progress on the FM transmitter part? where can I get more info? or is it just a dead topic without much glory
Would be great to be able to stream audio to the car!! I may be buying wrong cars, but none of them come with stock radios that have aux inputs or such. FM transmitting was availble on TAPE DECKS at one time to 'stream' audio to the car.
How can we have forgotten this ability for our newest devices??
BCM4329 is an 802.11 chipset... and originally a B/G only one if I remember right. FM just means frequency modulated. Would be a 2.4ghz FM transmitter chip. Cant think of any microwave transmitters that are AM really anyhow. So, nowhere even close to the right frequency range. Most likely the wifi chip.
Namopereht
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
Htc evo 4g has fm transmiter from bc reports.
i posted this over here.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=7073406#post7073406
I think we should somehow merge these two threads as they both are trying to achieve the same thing.
so some are going off on the depend and saying the fm means freq mod .
NOPES
Broadcom clearly states its a "FM radio receiver and transmitter."
SO YES IT DOES HAVE THE CAPABILITY TO TRANSMIT AUDIO OVER FM
where i got this from .
http://www.broadcom.com/products/Bluetooth/Bluetooth-RF-Silicon-and-Software-Solutions/BCM4329
as we know software wise the evo has no fm Transmiter software installed and like we know Wifi N was in it and turned off till now.
so sometime soon we hope someone will come out with an APK to use the fm transmiter. (to stream our media to fm radios for car or house use.).
actully if you look at there app guide they have a unit without the FM TX.
BCM4325 Low-Power 802.11a/b/g with Bluetooth® 2.1 + EDR and FM
BCM4329 Low-Power 802.11n with Bluetooth® 2.1 + EDR and FM (Tx and Rx)
from pdf
FM Control: HCI and BSC (I2C-compliant) ports
FM Audio: Stereo analog input and output, bidirectional
FM receiver and transmitter (76 MHz to 108 MHz FM bands);
Standards supported:
- European Radio Data Systems (RDS)
- North American Radio Broadcast Data System (RBDS)
• Programmable FM transmit output power
TECH SPECS FROM PDF
FM
Host Interface: High-speed UART, I2C for control
Standard: RDS (Europe) RBDS (North America)
Operating Frequency: 76 – 108 MHz
Search Frequency Step: 50 KHz
Transmit Output Power: 117 dbuV
Receive Sensitivity: –107 dBm
look on the right you will see fm
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pdf can be found here
http://pdf.eccn.com/pdfs/Datasheets/Broadcom/BCM4329.pdf
While the chip may be capable of FM transmitting, it might need a certain hardware configuration to achieve this. That kind of info should be in the datasheet. We can then look at the circuit board to see it if it has the necessary components to move forward. Of course, I'm saying this because I don't know how easy it is to change the chip config and code the necessary drivers. If the software side is easy, they could just do it and see if it works. I'm not sure that it is though. Are there any other android phones with an FM transmitter? I'd imagine the Nexus One has the same chip. If they haven't gotten it working by now, it probably isn't possible.
an FM Transmitter would be epic.
tlordon said:
so some are going off on the depend and saying the fm means freq mod .
NOPES
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes F.M. stands for Frequency Modulated..
Still, as long as its connected and the software is right, im sure it could work
Sent from my Evo 4G via the XDA app
anybody has the datasheet or pinout diagram for BCM4329? i'll take my Evo apart and see if the pins are soldered to PCB...
anybody has the datasheet or pinout diagram for BCM4329? i'll take my Evo apart and see if the pins are soldered to PCB...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Careful now
I hope this happens, but I feel like HTC would have already capitalized on this if it was built-in..
I mean not many phones come with built-in FM transmitting. Sound relay with no BT required!
Good luck all, sorry I can't offer anything here..
topdnbass said:
Careful now
I hope this happens, but I feel like HTC would have already capitalized on this if it was built-in..
I mean not many phones come with built-in FM transmitting. Sound relay with no BT required!
Good luck all, sorry I can't offer anything here..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HTC utilizing hardware? No wai....
topdnbass said:
Careful now
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have a replacement coming in within few days and can use this opportunity to do some hw diggin =P
Minjin said:
While the chip may be capable of FM transmitting, it might need a certain hardware configuration to achieve this. That kind of info should be in the datasheet. We can then look at the circuit board to see it if it has the necessary components to move forward. Of course, I'm saying this because I don't know how easy it is to change the chip config and code the necessary drivers. If the software side is easy, they could just do it and see if it works. I'm not sure that it is though. Are there any other android phones with an FM transmitter? I'd imagine the Nexus One has the same chip. If they haven't gotten it working by now, it probably isn't possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you look at my post above. you will see the chip is bidirectional for the FM. nothing else needed. hardware wise.
we do need the app to run the fm (like you said its not found in other fones yet)
only reason it may not be possible is cause BC hasnt released the app source code yet.
Mast3rpyr0 said:
Yes F.M. stands for Frequency Modulated..
Still, as long as its connected and the software is right, im sure it could work
Sent from my Evo 4G via the XDA app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ya but wifi uses Spread spectrum not fm.
frifox said:
anybody has the datasheet or pinout diagram for BCM4329? i'll take my Evo apart and see if the pins are soldered to PCB...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
again read my post has all hardware info we need.
like i say 2sec ago we need the source code to use it. or someone that knows how to make one. LOL
topdnbass said:
Careful now
I hope this happens, but I feel like HTC would have already capitalized on this if it was built-in..
I mean not many phones come with built-in FM transmitting. Sound relay with no BT required!
Good luck all, sorry I can't offer anything here..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you may think that but if you knew how htc and many other companies downgrade products by software to profit you wouldnt say that.
the TP and TP2 both had FM radios (both mine worked after many hours)
Neither had fm listed from htc or sprint.
just example my samsung ln46a640 just needed change in sys menu to turn into a 650 with DLNA.
many products are software limited (its cheaper more profitable to limit via software controlles vs hardware. that way they can be making the next gen product and get 2 out of it.
so many products i could spit out that are soft limited and can be opend up(short version)
jerryparid said:
HTC utilizing hardware? No wai....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ya i know like we expect them to do that.
so again lets recap
the chip has standard fm radio both RX and TX biderectionlay. meaning if it works in fm receive mode we can make it work in fm transmit mode. No hardware changes.
We just need the software that will take the music or whtver and feed it into the fm side and speak its lingo to transmit
Erm, might it be a problem that it doesn't appear that the phone itself has any sort of FM antenna built in? I mean, the FM Radio app wont even turn on the radio unless you have headphones plugged in... which would be kind of a problem if you are trying to use the transmitter as an audio sink. Speaking of which, Eclair doesn't seem to have any way to select a default audio sink, it just uses whatever is available that has the highest priority ie: headphones -> bluetooth -> internal speakers. I think I read somewhere that Froyo improves on this functionality, but I'm not sure. I guess you could always just use an app to enable the transmitter, set it to highest priority (if that's even possible,) and then start playing whatever you wanted to be transmitted.
Well, I started trying to figure out what the max clock speed is for
mmc1 (external SDHC) and why the audio is such crap in SGH-T999.
I thought I would share the differences with US and the i9300 I found.
Starting with the Service Manuals for i535 and i9300 and the
teardowns of the T999 and i9300....
We can figure out enough making some assumptions and also
lacking high quality zooms of all the US board...
First a system overview:
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In the i9300, the FM radio is sent directly from a Silicon Labs
CMOS FM radio receiver chip to an audio line in on the Wolfson
WM1811 audio codec and speaker driver chip. The schematics
don't provide the part numbers, but through the teardowns people
already know about the Wolfson chip. The SiLabs part hasn't been
mentioned anywhere I have seen. The schematics, pin out, and
part number match the unidentified part in the teardowns as the
SiLabs part:
We can see this extra SiLabs radio chip with is on the thin side of the
board and this chip is missing from the US versions:
All Galaxy S3 boards appear to use the same Murata SoC module
that incorporates the Broadcom BCM4334. From the service manuals,
we see the exact same Murata part and schematics: (top one is i9300)
This might be where the confusion is for people trying to use the i9300
firmware to enable FM radio. Yes, the BCM4334 has FM capabilities and
could have been used for maybe FM radio, but it isn't used in any of the boards.
This is the same WLAN/bluetooth hardware, but an unpopulated pin and a deadend.
There isn't even an external pin you could add a wire to.
Now the audio differences:
What is also of interest is that (sadly) the US Galaxy S3 use the
Qualcomm WCD9310 Audio Codec which drives the headphones.
There aren't any datasheets for what this is capable of. In (at least)
the i535 the speaker is driven with a Texas Instruments TPA2039D1
Audio Power Amplifier. And I suspect it is the same for all the US versions.
Whereas, the i9300 uses the Wolfson WM1811 which both drives the
headset and a speaker driver with many other features.
Code:
TPA2039D1 Class-D, 12-dB fixed-gain audio power amplifier
3.24 W (4 Ω, 5 V, 10% THDN)
2.57 W (4 Ω, 5 V, 1% THDN)
1.80 W (8 Ω, 5 V, 10% THDN)
1.46 W (8 Ω, 5 V, 1% THDN)
Code:
Wolfson WM1811
2W stereo (2 x 2W) class D speaker driver
Capless Class W headphone drivers
(5.3mW total power for DAC playback to headphones)
ReTune™ Mobile 5-band, 4-channel parametric EQ
In both cases we don't really know much about the headphone
driver except that you would rather have the Wolfson chip.
I did find this interesting blog post with some
hints about tailoring the WCD9310. Now if only someone had a Qualcomm datasheet.
Good stuff. Thanks.
On a side note. I know everyone agrees about the superiority of the Wolfson implementation, but I don't find the audio in the T999 to be bad at all. Of course, I haven't directly compared the two, and I am certainly no audiophile. Is there a way to do simple tests (besides how loud it is) to find out how good/bad one's audio is?
I know no one cares, and this should be in a R&D development forum, but anyways, here are the tabla registers.
This would allow hardware control of muting, gains, calibration bias currents...
include /linux/mfd/wcd9310/registers.h and the whole commit
http://goo.gl/HZJgw
In related news, I found the debugfs controls for the battery charging, so I guess this adventure comes full circle.
You should move this nice thread to Hardware hacking instead...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=1425
So we have the chip that can be used for FM radio, but the antenna isn't there? Am I understanding this right?
aNYthing24 said:
So we have the chip that can be used for FM radio, but the antenna isn't there? Am I understanding this right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, but it's more complicated than that.
None of the Galaxy S/S2/S3/Note class devices use the Broadcom chip for FM. The International versions that have FM use a Silicon Labs chip.
Many cheaper Samsung devices use Broadcom for FM.
There are over 200 posts on the subject of FM on the US GS3 here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1732685 The last 20-50 posts or so might give a more complete idea of the findings made.
joederp said:
...hints about tailoring the WCD9310. Now if only someone had a Qualcomm datasheet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Qualcomm datasheets are almost impossible to find/get.
I'm pretty familiar with most of the info you posted, but thanks for the pics and the added details.
Are you sure the GT-i9300 uses an SI-4705 and what's the source of that info ? There's no clue in the stock ROM of course, the si470x driver is generic and the 470x chips are very similar.
I don't recall exactly the differences with the 4705, but if there's a register difference, I can check on my 9300.
mikereidis said:
Are you sure the GT-i9300 uses an SI-4705 and what's the source of that info ? There's no clue in the stock ROM of course, the si470x driver is generic and the 470x chips are very similar.
I don't recall exactly the differences with the 4705, but if there's a register difference, I can check on my 9300.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm about 99% sure the i9300 uses the SiLabs 4705.
I am the only source for that and I figured it out based on looking through the i9300 Service Manual.
They include some schematics that point to a radio chip labeled U203, well I googled the pin names
on the schematic, because everyone reuses they symbols provided with the models/abstracts. So the
schematic labeled U203 pointed to SiLabs names on some of their chips, I googled the FM receivers a
little and found one with the same footprint. The only one that fit was the 4704/05 series which are for
mobile.
Now I went back to the service manual and if you search for U203, you will find a parts list that designates
the part as a SI4705-D50-GM. What was confusing is the parts list table is shifted by one row on the right
column. This can be confirmed throughout the document.
So it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that is what the chip is.
It is a Silicon Labs 4705-D50.
So, I hope that helps the i9300 rom efforts.
aNYthing24 said:
So we have the chip that can be used for FM radio, but the antenna isn't there? Am I understanding this right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would say that they would need the resistors, and inductors inside the SoC module, and an antenna. And then some was to get the data out of the broadcom chip, and then can it handle FM while using bluetooth and WLAN? So I'm guessing based on the cost and module specs, they abandoned it. For the flagship i9300 international design they just threw in another chip. The respin US version they want to save money and the Wolfson and SiLabs volume and cost makes more sense to use the Qcom part and abandon an extra audio input. Also US cell companies go out of their way to disable FM radio even when it is "free". They would rather you pay for data or some crazy nonsense.
...
joederp said:
I would but some asshole mod just threw my post (Not even a new thread, a legit reply to a thread on 8960)
into the general Q&A thread and removed it from hardware.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1888652
That was a post, not a thread that needed a title.
His own forum rules state:
"relating to the hardware of devices and in many circumstances dealing with families of devices. "
Which my COMMENT was, but the power mad mods have to delete my comment. So they obviously don't care about hardware or my research, so **** that mod.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Chill...mods try to keep things orderly. If you feel you're treated unfairly, pm the mods and plead your case...it's never a good idea to publicly criticise staff (made up of volunteers) dedicated to our shared interests.
On topic, the FM stations are miserable here, full of annoying racket and ads...I'd never even consider listening to FM even if the SIII had an operable implementation.
mikereidis said:
Are you sure the GT-i9300 uses an SI-4705 and what's the source of that info ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just googled some more proof for you that it is Si7405. Check the datasheet and compare the part numbering:
YWW is 2012 Week 7 from the photo.
joederp said:
I would say that they would need the resistors, and inductors inside the SoC module, and an antenna. And then some was to get the data out of the broadcom chip, and then can it handle FM while using bluetooth and WLAN? So I'm guessing based on the cost and module specs, they abandoned it. For the flagship i9300 international design they just threw in another chip. The respin US version they want to save money and the Wolfson and SiLabs volume and cost makes more sense to use the Qcom part and abandon an extra audio input. Also US cell companies go out of their way to disable FM radio even when it is "free". They would rather you pay for data or some crazy nonsense.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sure you're right about 4705. 9300 schematic shows DOUT which is the digital out the 4701 doesn't have. I didn't even look at the parts list; previous service manuals didn't use the real part numbers so I figured it was useless again.
It's a shame Samsung didn't use the Digital out IMO. But this leads into the fact that they have a "settled design" for FM on the higher end Galaxy S/S2/S3/Note devices. The "settled design" uses a Silicon Labs si470x chip with analog output. I don't know if SL chips have better audio than Broadcom currently, but I suspect they did when the Galaxy S was designed at least (along with a high quality Wolfsson audio chip.)
Samsungs "settled design" for FM on lower end products always uses Broadcom combo chips, that also support BT and WiFi. FM piggy-backs on the BT core and is handled by the Broadcom proprietary BT/FM stack on stock ROMs.
joederp said:
And the Si4705 uses a 32.7MHz crystal, but it can also take
a reference clock from 31.130 to 40.000
...
Can you read RDS through the SDIO?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
32,768 Hz (2^15)
Hardware wise, yes all si470x registers, including RDS registers, are accessed via SDIO.
The V4L driver accesses the si470x registers.
Samsungs proprietary Silicon Labs/high end specific FM API accesses the V4L driver.
My Spirit FM app, like the Samsung app, can access the Samsung API. But Spirit can also speak directly to the V4L driver, which is preferred.
So there are multiple software layers between an app and the hardware pins such as SDIO.
I'd be interested to access some unique features of the si4705, such as operation down to 64 MHz. but I don't think the V4L driver allows it, as it's generic to si470x.
Just for your benefit, they saved cost by skipping the crystal for the radio chip, it is using the reference clock from the BT chip which is 37.4 and might impact which freq you can tune.
joederp said:
Just for your benefit, they saved cost by skipping the crystal for the radio chip, it is using the reference clock from the BT chip which is 37.4 and might impact which freq you can tune.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are no FM tuning problems on GT-i9300: 76-90 or 87.5-108.
I didn't mean problems but more like in the datasheet if you don't use crystal and have ref clock then there are certain multiplier issues. I was pointing out they are sharing they wlan
Sent from my SGH-T999 using xda app-developers app
it'd be nice to be able to change the headphone amplifier volume (as voodoo does). Does this information you guys found help in that area? It'd be nice to lower the analogue volume to reduce hiss and artifacts.
Yes and no. You can directly modify the tabla register for the qcom codec, but I don't have and darasheet to know what 00 is versus c4 or whatever in the register. I have to write it up still
Sent from my SGH-T999 using xda app-developers app
joederp said:
Yes and no. You can directly modify the tabla register for the qcom codec, but I don't have and darasheet to know what 00 is versus c4 or whatever in the register. I have to write it up still
Sent from my SGH-T999 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Any news on that?
Does anyone know if Z Fold 4 has an FM Tuner? like being able to run NextRadio app. I have a Z fold 2 but I know FM tuner chip is not enabled on Fold 2. BTW, I am not interested in getting FM stations using streaming apps like Tune in. I know the FM Tuner chip is on Samsung phones but I am not sure if it is enabled on Z Fold 4 or not.
Don't think it's been on a modern Samsung tier 1 device for years, sorry. Also no wired headphones for aerial
Yeah, haven't seen or heard of it on this Samsung...
Cheers
[email protected] said:
Does anyone know if Z Fold 4 has an FM Tuner? like being able to run NextRadio app. I have a Z fold 2 but I know FM tuner chip is not enabled on Fold 2. BTW, I am not interested in getting FM stations using streaming apps like Tune in. I know the FM Tuner chip is on Samsung phones but I am not sure if it is enabled on Z Fold 4 or not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FM radio tuner in smartphones has been relagated to a relic of the past! I've used iHeartRadio app (free version) for years to stream my favorite radio stations. Great app and many others in the Play Store.