Develop Bugs

Moderation in the Dream forums...

What is going on with the moderation in the Dream forums? I have been coming here for quite a few years now, though more reading than posting I grant. I have never seen such lock happy moderation before though.
In the past on the other subforums locking a thread was fairly rare and moderation more in tune with keeping it civil than anything. Moderators kept the peace but left topics and threads to being mostly self-governing. Occasionally a thread would get moved to off topic or the rebellious user warned but nothing like this. About a dozen threads in the last week, six in the last two days alone.
It seems any thread that the moderators feel is a repeat or not needed is locked. There is no warning or explanation by the moderators, just a lock. Instead of educating the user, search first with a link to what the user should have looked for as an example, the discussion is left in limbo. This is making the forum more of a moderated police state than a area for open conversation on topics. This detracts from the ability to have open discussions and the enjoyment of trying to help others.
So I am asking the moderators to please show restraint and give the posters more leeway. There is no need to lock every thread that is a repeat or could have been solved by a search. The threads will go off the front page in due time, locking them simply is not constructive more often than not. If you absolutely must lock it then at least put a post at the end with a reason.

I am not active in the Dream forum, but I will add my thoughts here.
Certain sections of XDA's forums are subject to stricter moderation then others due to the sheer volume of active members in them. For example, the Raphael has seen a US release on all three nationwide carriers, whereas the prior models only saw release on one carrier. This led to more people buying the Raphael, and a large influx of members in the related forums. Due to that influx, we moderators needed to step up our monitoring of those forums in order to keeping them as clean and concise as possible.
This same example applies to the Dream due to it being the first Android phone released.
While I agree with you that a moderator should always leave a quick note as the final post in a closed thread, I also support closing down redundant threads in order to help keep all relevant information in an existing thread; not spread across 5 or 6 different ones.

So I am asking the moderators to please show restraint and give the posters more leeway. There is no need to lock every thread that is a repeat or could have been solved by a search. The threads will go off the front page in due time, locking them simply is not constructive more often than not. If you absolutely must lock it then at least put a post at the end with a reason.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
NotATreoFan said:
While I agree with you that a moderator should always leave a quick note as the final post in a closed thread, I also support closing down redundant threads in order to help keep all relevant information in an existing thread; not spread across 5 or 6 different ones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just thought I would add my two cents in here ( like anyone cares ) because I too have been irritated once or twice by over zealous moderation. Once by a moderator from the Dream forum who came over to the Kaiser forum to delete a whole conversation, because he " thought " we were getting too heated in our debate over M$ supposed actions . There was no flamebaiting, He just thought.
And several times by threads ( not mine ) that were closed without warning or stated reason. I know this is a huge site with a lot of heavy traffic and the Mods are " overworked and under paid " . I also realize that Mods are from around the world, and Moderation style is subject to differing personalities, social and interpersonal customs from different countries. But common courtesy is universal. While many people don't deserve it, please take the time to include a note on why, the thread requires moderation. If you don't have the time , then maybe you should pass the job on to someone who can take the time.
Also in my 1 1/2 years on this site, ( six mo lurking and 1 yr member ) I have PM'd three mods, asking them to please explain their actions in moderating a thread I was posting in, and in all three cases, received nothing, not even an acknowledgement.
This is not a criticism, just my two cents, should someone read this. I have my favorite mods, (natf is one ) Dave and Josh are excellent in the Kaiser forums, mostly because they adhere to the basic tenet, " Moderation in Moderation. "

mikechannon said:
I realise you are being modest there, and the truth is we do care what members think and voicing concern in a calm fashion is appreciated and this kind of feedback is what moderates the Moderators. This is what makes us a community and avoids an "us and them" situation developing.
I don't have anything of value to add to NotATreoFan's comments which match my own feelings on the matter and IMHO reflect the kind of balance we need between being tolerant, courteous and yet maintaining a degree of organisation.
Mike
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for taking that in the context that it was meant, I know that Admin and Mods do care what membership thinks.

denco7 said:
Thanks for taking that in the context that it was meant, I know that Admin and Mods do care what membership thinks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
AND they are simply men and women They could make mistakes, they act differently in the same situation. Suggestions and opinions are always welcome!

i reckon there should be a new button next to the report post button that serves as an appeal button if someone thinks that a tread has been closed for no reason the the button should allow for appeal. a box is filled n explaining the thread and why there was no reason to delete it this is then pmd to the closer of the thread then negotaiations will start

Please do not take my original post too harshly. I do appreciate the mods here on XDA-developers and think that they do a great job. But at the same time when the mods get a little over zealous this seemed the best way to bring up my protest. (I could not PM the moderator in question because I do not know who was closing the threads.)
So thanks again for making this a great place to come back to over the years and keep up the good work.

JanetPanic said:
What is going on with the moderation in the Dream forums? I have been coming here for quite a few years now, though more reading than posting I grant. I have never seen such lock happy moderation before though.
In the past on the other subforums locking a thread was fairly rare and moderation more in tune with keeping it civil than anything. Moderators kept the peace but left topics and threads to being mostly self-governing. Occasionally a thread would get moved to off topic or the rebellious user warned but nothing like this. About a dozen threads in the last week, six in the last two days alone.
It seems any thread that the moderators feel is a repeat or not needed is locked. There is no warning or explanation by the moderators, just a lock. Instead of educating the user, search first with a link to what the user should have looked for as an example, the discussion is left in limbo. This is making the forum more of a moderated police state than a area for open conversation on topics. This detracts from the ability to have open discussions and the enjoyment of trying to help others.
So I am asking the moderators to please show restraint and give the posters more leeway. There is no need to lock every thread that is a repeat or could have been solved by a search. The threads will go off the front page in due time, locking them simply is not constructive more often than not. If you absolutely must lock it then at least put a post at the end with a reason.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you ask me there aren't enough locked threads in the dream section. There are over 80 different threads for the new haykuro build there, 80!!! Probably more because i stopped counting at page 20. I also might add that the main haykuro thread has over 6000 posts and counting. The dream section is out of control and needs serious moderator intervention. One moderator simply cannot do all this himself. I know the dream mod, or at least the only active mod there that i can see and he is excellent at not only helping people but moderating in general. Let a thread be self governed? That's a very scary though!!! I am a moderator at another site and i can say it is not a moderators job to be a friend, be respectful or give you an explaination as to why he or she did what they did. Yes i do give an explaination and most mods on here do as well but they are here to maintain the rules of the forum and the upkeep of the forum in general. If threads were locked its more than likely because you or others got off topic, double posted or started a new thread when another about the exact same thing already existed. Case in point, there is a section for members to post questions to mods about anything already and you opened a new thread on the subject.

Ha I couldn't agree MORE with Ryanmo. There should be tighter and more rigid controls there. In fact I don't think it's (currently) possible for there to be moderation there at the moment...too many new bodies added to the fray. And we all know most of them are not reading the Sticky posted at top saying "Must read before you post". I don't have any problem with xda mods enacting 1-3 day temp bans on some of the frequent offenders.

knight4linux said:
Ha I couldn't agree MORE with Ryanmo. There should be tighter and more rigid controls there. In fact I don't think it's (currently) possible for there to be moderation there at the moment...too many new bodies added to the fray. And we all know most of them are not reading the Sticky posted at top saying "Must read before you post". I don't have any problem with xda mods enacting 1-3 day temp bans on some of the frequent offenders.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Haha yeah the sticky at the top about the rules says a little over 23,000 views. The hacking thread has been viewed over 300,000 times, go figure. I probably report 15 posts a day to try and help but your right its outta control.

Hello Friends,
Well i have seen these site and i am quite surprise here that though more reading than posting I grant. I have never seen such lock happy moderation before though.As i am not a active member but ya i will add my though if any and will discuss So I am asking the moderators to please show restraint and give the posters more leeway. There is no need to lock every thread that is a repeat or could have been solved by a search. The threads will go off the front page in due time, locking them simply is not constructive more often than not. If you absolutely must lock it then at least put a post at the end with a reason. Thanx

can someone please unlock this thread
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=429808&page=22

It is not that rules and regulations are not in place in this site. They are posted all over the place. In fact, if you look at my sig, I have them there as a hyperlink (many other members do the same). Why do threads and posts get locked, moved, or otherwise deleted left and right? It is because lots of users (particularly new ones but seasoned users also) do not read these rules. They do not know that they should search before posting or opening new threads; they do not know that there are sections to ask questions that are not relevant to the section they posted at; they do not know that profanity shouldn't be used around here due to a large young crowd; they do not know that flaming (particularly for no apparent reason) is strictly prohibited....
Moderators have little time to be messing around with people who simply do not understand that there are rules that must be followed (or read for that matter). Hence, they close the threads with no previous notice and at times, leave no excuse behind. They don't do it out of the content of their hearts, and they are definitely not watching over every single thread at all times. If you see a thread being closed, it is normally due to someone complaining about it, and more often than not, mods will analyze the trend of the thread and if necessary either warn users to stop, or just flat out close it (normally they warn unless the thread itself is breaking the rules... think of posting warez for instance).
I have yet to see abuse of power by a mod in this forum. And I am pretty sure that if there happens to be a mod that does abuse his/her God-given powers.... let's just say that they will be judged by a higher power
My 2 cents!

Although some moderators try and go out of their way to leave a message as to why they lock a thread, that is not their job. Our job is to make sure people are following the rules.
Here is a little scenario, i log on at night and jump over to the D&H section.... there i find 10 new threads asking questions.
A) I can delete the threads
B) I can close the threads by simply going through and checking every thread and then closing.
C) i can individually open each thread and leave a message for each person
D) i can wait for another moderator to do it
E) move the thread for them
Well i cant delete them or people will think their thread never got posted and just post it AGAIN. If you move peoples threads for them they think they can post anywhere and it will just be moved where it needs to go. I dont have time to open every thread and leave a message for every person everytime, and if i leave it for another moderator, it might not get done.
Really i am only left with checking all of the threads and closing them. if you have a question you can READ the rules, as it is your resonsibilty as a member, and find the answer. (Or of course you can pm a mod)
You guys have to remember that there are over 1,537,526 members on this site and around 66 mods and admin. We do our best to help you guys but we dont always have the time to write a personal letter for everyone of your and put it in you lunch box.

I agree (not that it matters). Mods have absolutely NO responsibility to post why they closed a thread...Why? Because they already are posted...in the rules up top. Its you, the new users that have the resposibility. That responsibility to read the rules before you post (RTFM). It even says at the bottom (of the rules) what will happen if they are not followed.
And by allowing multiple threads of the SAME simple questions (Especially in a phones development section) this completely ruins development and progress, not to mention this is a free and public forum. That means its hosted on servers, and these duplicate threads/posts start to add up.
Trust me. Frequent the forums for more than a few months and it'll start to wear on you too, almost as much as it does to the mods.

UPDATE:
As of late, there seems to be a lot of issues with the dream section, many many topics on bricked phones, new OS releases, old releases, random topics, and other posts. The title of the forum is Dream android 'development', and its actually hard now to find 'development' scattered in many of the different types of topics in there.
SUGGESTION/RECOMMENDATION:
Make a sub-forum of the development forum (or of the whole dream forum like the current 5 main sub-forums), named something like troubleshooting, or repair, or something like that. That way, anyone with a broken phone can post in there maybe. It might be a bad suggestion simply because the 'helpers' may not check there...but I cant think of a better way to keep the 5 different topics a day saying "I have a different brick problem" organized so actual development [important] topics can stay up top, where they should be.
Anyone with a better idea, express it so something can be done, its quite a mess right now.
[Oh and maybe a description under the android dev. forum something in capital letters saying: be careful, and read everything before taking action!!!, because I think some people end up with bricks because of anticipation and possibly dont read. Just as a [duh] advisory, ya know?]
/rant
Thanks [btw not bashing the mods, its just a bit hectic it seems right now, many things going on there]

theslam08 said:
UPDATE:
As of late, there seems to be a lot of issues with the dream section, many many topics on bricked phones, new OS releases, old releases, random topics, and other posts. The title of the forum is Dream android 'development', and its actually hard now to find 'development' scattered in many of the different types of topics in there.
SUGGESTION/RECOMMENDATION:
Make a sub-forum of the development forum (or of the whole dream forum like the current 5 main sub-forums), named something like troubleshooting, or repair, or something like that. That way, anyone with a broken phone can post in there maybe. It might be a bad suggestion simply because the 'helpers' may not check there...but I cant think of a better way to keep the 5 different topics a day saying "I have a different brick problem" organized so actual development [important] topics can stay up top, where they should be.
Anyone with a better idea, express it so something can be done, its quite a mess right now.
[Oh and maybe a description under the android dev. forum something in capital letters saying: be careful, and read everything before taking action!!!, because I think some people end up with bricks because of anticipation and possibly dont read. Just as a [duh] advisory, ya know?]
/rant
Thanks [btw not bashing the mods, its just a bit hectic it seems right now, many things going on there]
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That has been added as a suggestion and I will push for it again in the mod section.
BTW I am a Dream mod and I am usually the one that closes threads or deletes them. I don't always leave a message because it is more time consuming. I can have an unclean section with everyone getting a response and therefore getting their locked post bumped. Or I can have a cleaner (it will never be clean) section with angry users who didn't search in the first place.
I chose the later by the way.

neoobs said:
That has been added as a suggestion and I will push for it again in the mod section.
BTW I am a Dream mod and I am usually the one that closes threads or deletes them. I don't always leave a message because it is more time consuming. I can have an unclean section with everyone getting a response and therefore getting their locked post bumped. Or I can have a cleaner (it will never be clean) section with angry users who didn't search in the first place.
I chose the later by the way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mhm, and you do what you can, I notice somethings being done by you, which is good that something is being done. I used to mod/administrate big places so I know what its like, its a pain when people cant search, or arent sure of where to post so they post anywhere (sometimes in the effort of 'just getting an answer').
This causes the clutter, especially when there are multiple 'different but very similar' type topics being created, and its tricky to know which to close and which not to close. Thats why I think maybe a separate forum 'might' be the best solution, because as of right now, bricks are happening pretty quickly and thats not good (no one to blame, just the anticipation again).
I appreciate the backing, hope 'something' can be done, its just really crowded right now (making the 'new' browsers get lost [causing the multiple similar topic issue], and your job harder).

One problem is the sticky's need to be updated by the people who started them. Many are older and with 5 different roms available to flash now they simply don't meet the demand for all these different roms. The rom developers need to do a better job of explaining how to flash their roms. The newest one tried to get a little too cute and force a new apps2sd method on users and the result was a lot of looped (not bricked) g1's. The sub forum could consist of how to's and guide's. I'm not sure a sub forum is the best way to go though, There are already 5 and most phones on here don't even have 4. Xda simply need more help with this section, neoobs has been cleaning house and i thank you but you can't do it all lol. I am a moderator on another site, not here but will do what i can to report posts as much as possible to help the mods.

Ryanmo5 said:
One problem is the sticky's need to be updated by the people who started them. Many are older and with 5 different roms available to flash now they simply don't meet the demand for all these different roms. The rom developers need to do a better job of explaining how to flash their roms. The newest one tried to get a little too cute and force a new apps2sd method on users and the result was a lot of looped (not bricked) g1's. The sub forum could consist of how to's and guide's. I'm not sure a sub forum is the best way to go though, There are already 5 and most phones on here don't even have 4. Xda simply need more help with this section, neoobs has been cleaning house and i thank you but you can't do it all lol. I am a moderator on another site, not here but will do what i can to report posts as much as possible to help the mods.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed 100%, it seems there are alot of stickies there, maybe redundant on some, but are necessary on others. There should be a way to make it distinguishable between information/guides, developments, and problems. They do need to be updated as well.
I agree, a forum might not be the best way because there might be 'lost' posts which would not work either (like the new magic thread that showed up, though I dont dissagree with that simply because the OP is correct, android is android, and the magic needs some help, maybe because we stole quite a bit from it too? lol. but still posting to 'get help' anywhere).
Is there a modification for vb that makes stickies different color than the regular topics? I never administrated vb only ipb and smf so I dont know. But that would be a big help there, then the new comers can instantly see which are informal.
Im trying to report, to help you so you dont need to spend as much time 'looking' as doing the task. Its not 'too' bad right now, when I first posted though omg it was disaster. Once the new rom comes out though....thennn its gonna be biig trouble again.
Update: I was looking at something...the first forum, named Dream. That I was actually looking at for the first time, it seems pretty useless really. A lot of the topics in there could definitely go into the development thread...OR that forum could get changed to something else and cleaned up. There arent many 'general' topics for the phone I dont think, whats general for the phone? What is the g1? Maybe but useless indeed. So maybe instead of MAKING a new forum, just change that one and clean it up. Make it a troubleshooting forum, or a tutorial section, or just updates, or something I dont know. But maybe just better use of it I think.

Flaming/Insults/Bullying!

Ok, i know people should use the search button before posting a question, or submitting an incorrect fact BUT SERIOUSLY every other reply is just another person insulting someone else!
I know it's hard to keep your cool sometimes with people asking/stating the same things over and over, but is there rely the need to be an a*s about it. All thats going to do is provoke a reaction (Because everyone is invincible on the internet) and that will just lead to more useless posting, which if i'm right thats what you were trying to prevent in the first place!
This is not an attack on any person, nor is it meant to cause offense, but honestly forums are about friendship where everyone can come and gain advice/guidance or just have a nice chat to learn(Everyone has to start somewhere) and a lot of people on here are not helping them. Would you like to have someone talk to you like that when you were just starting out and didn't have a clue what you were doing?. . . NO you would want an easy answer so you could learn from it, in the same amount of time it takes to flame someone for not knowing it you could have told the the bloody answer!
I know I'll properly get a lot of people flaming me for this but just needed to get this out my system because i think its out of order.
Like me mum used to say "If you ain't got anything nice to say, pi*s off!"
Billy_M

Billy. said:
I know I'll properly get a lot of people flaming me for this but just needed to get this out my system because i think its out of order.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why would you get flamed when all you said is an honest truth?
The forum is full of morons and self appointed forum nazis, hell I could name a few in a split second who do this all the time...
This behaviour is probably induced by the lack of moderator presence. This Desire subforum has couple of thousand posts daily, and I see only two moderators listed.
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

Like it or not, this is a forum - and a HUGE one at that, as erklat has said, thousands of posts each day. This make stringent enforcement hard.
And every forum that I have ever been to seemed to have (sadly, but is it avoidable?) a social structure, whether clearly displayed or not - and probably, that's the way its going to be (for a long time to come).

oursoul said:
Too many ******* can't take bit if banter.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
big difference between taking the piss out of someone and abusing them tho....

it comes down to laziness on users. People want information given to them on a plate and not have to find it themselves. The issue is that rule number 1 of the forum rules is to search
If you can't follow a simple rule then you deserve to get flamed
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App

So maybe I'm just reading the handfull of threads that are being actively policed by the moderators...
Or maybe I have a really thick skin..
Or maybe the very few people whom I do see getting flamed actually deserve what they're getting (i.e. those who expressly list in their post that they can't be arsed to search and those who have the gall to post in developer threads with "your rom sucks, I'll never use it unless you add ...")..
Whatever the cause, I simply don't agree with your observation. People here are being genuinely helpful and the mods are doing a great job cleaning up bad posts and flames (as evidenced by those "thread cleaned" posts every now and then).

Depends on the section. It's ruined the Dev section because of leniency so there's a major clamp-down now in process, which I obviously applaud.
I have not till date seen anyone of thousands ask a valid question/concern and be policed, ridiculed or flamed. The help here is extremely benevolent and common. However, hundreds make invalid, undeserving posts justifying scorn but get away with it with smiles in response. That's the other, bigger side of what you mention.
I hate the playground child forum behavior immensely too. Trust me, so do the mods I've come across. I've seen quite a few past the limits on this. The users who reply and continuously flame are usually just as bad, except the one offs and the ones justified. They're meant to simply report the one breaking the rules and mods will deal with them as justified.
In my limited experience, 99% of those opposing/objecting to following the set rules don't have a clue about them but have big mouths and like to talk any nonsense to justify what they did. They are clueless about the rules on xda-dev and what this place is all about long before they were ever aware of it. The 'mantra' here. They come on here expecting the place to follow their own personal beliefs and rules, just causing havoc. That's why mods say, if you be so, better find somewhere else. And if a user repeats the obvious oft-repeated, that insults and offends everyone. It's a spit in their face, and of the mods, and it is bound to anger many with justification. Those who abide by the rules have placed much time and effort in doing so. Don't expect them to just laugh around while another just comes storming in trampling on them with great disregard. The same goes in every sphere of life.
The internet shows time and time again how modern society en-masse fails grossly in the honesty, decency, humility, intelligence and mentality departments. Greed, ego and stupidity rule, that's why places like xda-dev need to have firm rules enforced to maintain some quality. This place was always known for quality, and having spoken to mods, I know they work hard - for free - to maintain it as so. Be human, have some regard for them and others here before posting.
------------------------------
- Sent via HTC Desire -

What I would ask, is that people who see something that offends you, report it.
We can't read every post in every forum, but I can tell you that each and every report is seen and acted upon. We rely on members helping us to root out the bad apples.
This is what I've posted in the Oxygen thread. I think it sums up my feelings on this subject.
The frustration shown here by both AdamG, and _thalamus, must surely give people an indication of how annoying it is to see a thread be totally ruined by people who are too lazy to try and help themselves.
It's sad that you need reminded that the people who develop roms and post them here, do so for no personal gain, and do so to try and help us all get the best possible user experience from our devices.
The sad fact of life in today's society is that people want to be spoon-fed, they are too lazy to carry out a simple piece of research, and they demand that they get what they want, when they want. Then once they get it, they demand more. This is not what XDA-Developers is all about. If you need to ask what this forum is for, then you surely are in the wrong place.
Please take a moment and ask yourself, do you find your device now runs faster, smoother, is faster updated etc? If the answer is yes, then that is down to the dedication of the developers here. If you drive them away with your laziness, rudeness, demands etc, then you only have yourself to blame.
Please show the developers some respect. If you feel they owe you something, then do us all a favour and move on to somewhere else.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Lol, bad apples

erklat said:
This behaviour is probably induced by the lack of moderator presence.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No. This behaviour is usually induced by a severe lack of self esteem on the part of the bully.

In my opinion, if a question is deemed flammable, just report it instead of answering.
This can achieve two goals. People will start to understand that it will be faster to search instead of demand. And for those "Are we there yet"s, each unjustified bumps/reposts would count as multiples infractions. Thus, a faster banning.

I must agree will that
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App

ignore?
As with all twats to cross in your way and hurl abuse.....IGNORE them,we are adults.most of us anyway..why is there a thread for this lol.

DoomFragger said:
In my opinion, if a question is deemed flammable, just report it instead of answering.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's very true. Flaming somebody for an idiotic post instead of reporting it makes about as much sense as posting only "Cool, thanks" instead of using the "Thanks" button. Waste of space.

I have noticed recentlyl that that the people who know stuff have reduced their posts. This is counter productive. But I can understand why. And I've seen some bad advice given by others.
Don't know what the solution is tho....
Bye
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

mikep99 said:
I have noticed recentlyl that that the people who know stuff have reduced their posts.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe they get tired of answering the same questions over and over.
At least, instead of flaming, they just ignore it.

foresterr said:
Flaming somebody for an idiotic post instead of reporting it makes about as much sense as posting only "Cool, thanks" instead of using the "Thanks" button. Waste of space.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You got totally wrong perception about flaming. If someone posts a question about recommended radio for the tenth time, and you go with flaming and rudeness, it points out one and only thing - you are even worse than him/her, he is not in the violation of the forum rules, you are. In that situation you either respond to help, or you don't respond at all. A binary choice. You are either a smoker or a non smoker. You can't be a moron in that story and smoke an electronic cigar. Well, this is similar.
Sometimes I reply to silly posts, sometimes I don't. I don't make a drama out of it. The problem of this and other forums are illiterate halfwits who are unable to keep a decent intellectual and communicational level in their posts.
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

erklat said:
The problem of this and other forums are illiterate halfwits who are unable to keep a decent intellectual and communicational level in their posts.
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
just because someones primary language might not be English doesn't make them an illiterate halfwit. I think many of the communication issues in this and other forums can be chalked up to a language barrier.

I got flamed a bit in the post i made about ROMs. Pissed me off a bit, but i just ignored it.

As someone new to this forum, but some experience in other specialized forums for many years I was at first surprised and then a bit angered about the massive amount of totally useless posts.
I bought my first smartphone last year and after some weeks I found in xda the richest fountain of information. The first time it is not easy to learn, especially if you have to wade through pages and pages of silly, pointless and sometimes downright dumb posts. Extremely annoying are the repeated questions about a problem, which is explained thouroughly in the first 3 or 4 posts of a thread, as this is a proof for the total disregard of the OP, who is often the developer.
I think, this "I wanna be spoon-fed and pampered"-behaviour is actually encouraged in our society - the sad point is, in the late nineties these kind of people couldn´t post in forums - it was simply too complicated for them to use a computer
Today every simpleton with the ability to push a button can post in forums like this - with the observable consequences. Phewww /end rant
What to do about it - I don´t know. In other forums I have seen, the quality gets better through massive and sometimes hard moderation - but these forums were much smaller than xda.
So I can understand the anger, but it is as pointless as the silly questions: it only wastes space and makes threads harder to read.
Reporting pointless posts to moderation with a warning to the poster and maybe a strict "3-strikes and you´re out"-rule would bring some success, but also an massive amount of discussion about censorship, freedom of expression etc.
What to say: I´ll read and maybe sometimes post a question and hope, that this massive fountain of information will not become a mere trickle.
English is not my mother-tongue, therefore my use of grammar might be sometimes a little funny.

Something Needs to Change

All,
I've decided that rather than start attacking some of the forum users whose conduct I don't agree with, I'd write an opinion and a suggestion.
Let me start by saying, that I love XDA. Before I became a member, I spent countless hours reading through threads on these forums. Admittedly, prior to discovering the Nexus One I was an iPhone user, and apple fanboy. I can honestly say that XDA helped cure me of that.
I am not a developer. I use these forums as a method of learning how to enhance my phone; to build a working knowledge of Android; with a hope to one day I will be able to repay the Devs who helped me with original work of my own. Lately, as many people have already stated, I've noticed that the quality of discussion in many forum threads has gone down significantly. The mods do an excellent job of keeping threads on topic, and cleaning useless posts, however, I think its getting to be too much for them. This is my attempt to provide advice to new users, and to suggest a possible course of action to help correct the conduct that is a cancer on this great site.
I've seen threads where Dev's are threatened if they don't release ROMs, where people demand ETAs. Team Hacksung, who worked tirelessly to release CM7 for the SGS2 actually had to threaten to leave XDA to bring order to their development thread. I've also seen threads degrade into rascism and discrimination, threats of violence and bigotry. None of this is acceptable, and will serve no other goal than forcing developers to leave XDA.
People need to understand a few things:
[*] Dev's work is done on their own free-time
[*] Dev's work is done for no compensation other than the gratitude of their peers and the occasional donation.
[*] Dev's are under no obligation to release ANYTHING to the members of XDA - If they don't feel their work is ready, or they aren't ready to share it, you have no right to demand it released.
[*] Access to Dev work is a privilege that can easily be revoked; NOT A RIGHT.
In addition to the excellent and trying job that the moderators already undertake, I suggest the following apply to anyone not recognized as a developer:
[*] There is a 3 strike rule with regards to posting in each development section. Any posts deemed to be off-topic, not-relevant, hateful, malicious, rascist, etc should be deemed a strike. I would not include obvious jokes, sincere mistakes, attempts to be helpful, etc as a strike. My goal is not to discourage participation, but to discourage comments designed to be harmful.
[*]Strike 1 is a warning, Strike 2 is a one week ban from posting within the development forums, strike 3 is a permanent ban from posting within the development forums.
Moderators would be responsible for determining what is a strike based on a pre-determined criteria.
My 2c, take it or leave it..
C0mbe

"In a perfect world..."

github said:
"In a perfect world..."
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is an internet forum, not the world... you can be as punitive as you like...
Sent from my SCH-I510 using XDA Premium App

I think your suggestions are too lenient. In the six years I've been here, the mods have only gotten more and more lax in the rules with the influx of Android users. It used to be that if you said something retarded or offensive, it was an automatic ban. Now, it seems as though it takes an act of congress to get an abusive user removed. Don't worry, though. Their are some changes coming soon that will help out tremendously.

Rule with an Iron Fist!!!
I agree and it's quite simple. Have respect and decency toward others and remember this is a "family oriented" site/community and that needs to be respected. I have stated my advice elsewhere in the forums that XDA needs to start ruling with an "IRON FIST" and keep this site enjoyabe and respectable as it should be. I stand behind that and always will. It is the best way to run the forums otherwise it will turn into a battleground of idiots envoking arguments, name calling, etc. I personally take offense to people who attack others in the forums and elsewhere on XDA. I have probably gotten a little out of line in the past a couple of times but that was due to others' attacks and flaming.
If you feel you should be allowed freedom of speech and explicit visual interpretation/expressionon on XDA, then this isn't the community for you. XDA holds the right to moderate it's site and forums as they see fit. In this case XDA chooses to run a family friendly site instead of a free-for-all slugfest site and I'm in favor of that. This is not directed to anyone in particular, nor do I pass judgement on anybody it's just my thoughts. Leave the hate/foul mouth comments in your world not here @XDA.
I think XDA is the best "go-to" site for all smartphone development needs and resources and that is how everybody should want to keep it. I bet most of you will agree. Do your part by helping and respecting others AT ALL TIMES. Please don't post hate comments, intentional troll provoking/explicit behavior/expressions, hateful/attitude remarks here at XDA.
Thanks for reading.

C0mbe said:
This is an internet forum, not the world... you can be as punitive as you like...
Sent from my SCH-I510 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't want to elaborate, but meh I'm bored. You are not the first to post about this, and won't be the last. It will get buried, and life will go on. I mean, there was already a thread about this in this very forum... and it's one of the top 5 right now.
It's a world wide forum. People will post stuff you don't like. PM a moderator and tell them about it and move on. Or use the ignore list. There are new users both new to phones AND the internet/computers. They will make mistakes and ask questions (ETAs and such). At the end of the day, it's the internet. Does it really bother you so much that someone "demanded" an ETA? Made a disrespectful comment?
An old saying works wonders here. If I had $1 for every "XDA is dying" post, I'd be very wealthy.
P.S. I also heard that the sky is falling.
cajunflavoredbob said:
I think your suggestions are too lenient. In the six years I've been here, the mods have only gotten more and more lax in the rules with the influx of Android users. It used to be that if you said something retarded or offensive, it was an automatic ban. Now, it seems as though it takes an act of congress to get an abusive user removed. Don't worry, though. Their are some changes coming soon that will help out tremendously.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, bans! bans! more bans! RAWR BANHAMMER. That's the way to encourage growth. Everyone knows that a police state is what is needed.

github said:
I didn't want to elaborate, but meh I'm bored. You are not the first to post about this, and won't be the last. It will get buried, and life will go on. I mean, there was already a thread about this in this very forum... and it's one of the top 5 right now.
It's a world wide forum. People will post stuff you don't like. PM a moderator and tell them about it and move on. Or use the ignore list. There are new users both new to phones AND the internet/computers. They will make mistakes and ask questions (ETAs and such). At the end of the day, it's the internet. Does it really bother you so much that someone "demanded" an ETA? Made a disrespectful comment?
An old saying works wonders here. If I had $1 for every "XDA is dying" post, I'd be very wealthy.
P.S. I also heard that the sky is falling.
Yes, bans! bans! more bans! RAWR BANHAMMER. That's the way to encourage growth. Everyone knows that a police state is what is needed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This has nothing to do with site growth. It never has. If you break the rules, you get punished. It's that simple. You can try ignoring useless or inflaming comments all you want, but all that does is allow the behavior to continue. Obviously, catering to the behavior and becoming more lenient didn't work. The result is that the mods are now beginning to crack down harder again. This is the direction the site is now going. This site is about developers, not troubleshooting.
Users should learn manners and respect or go somewhere else. That's the main point. It isn't our job here to teach people the manners their parents could not. That's why the site isn't named XDA-Babysittingservice.com.

It the world wide web there are bound to be idiots out there. If they start banning these people there be just me and the mods left!!
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA Premium App

github said:
At the end of the day, it's the internet. Does it really bother you so much that someone "demanded" an ETA? Made a disrespectful comment?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, each and every demand for an ETA or disrespectful comment does not bother me that much, and of course I understand that its the internet. Its very easy to behave like an idiot when you are hiding behind pixels. Its really the totality of the circumstances that I am referring to. The object of XDA is for individuals to share development information with the common goal of improving Android phones. If the purpose of the site is lost in all the ETAs and disrespectful comments, then what is the point? Certainly, the point is not to lose developers...
github said:
P.S. I also heard that the sky is falling.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Call me whatever you like, your admission that there are multiple complaints like mine on each sub-forum is proof that there is a problem with member conduct on the site. And I did say that my OP was my own opinion, and my 2c.
github said:
Yes, bans! bans! more bans! RAWR BANHAMMER. That's the way to encourage growth. Everyone knows that a police state is what is needed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Who says you need a police state? I'm merely talking about adding rules to encourage and enforce order on the forums. And no one wants growth for the sake of growth. A small site that is efficient and has a high number of contributing members will always be better than a large site where the sheer volume of junk posts dilute the contributing members.
Plus, at the end of the day, all anyone really has on the internet is a voice. Thus, the ban remains the most effective method of controlling poor conduct.

It appears you guys have not read the site admins latest announcement...I advice u do

TheRomMistress said:
It appears you guys have not read the site admins latest announcement...I advice u do
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's fine and all. But does it address the time it takes to actually report problem posts (instead of just complain about them)? Having to PM forum mods that either gave up on your forum, or don't even visit that forum isn't exactly encouraging.
Or will the forums stop becoming void of moderators (like over in EVO 4G land, where I can't remember the last time we had moderator participation besides the banhammer here and there, or moved threads that I report). Will we start seeing more moderator participation?
Of course, my last posts here were worded to spark conversation (and that they did). I am happy to see this latest development, but still feel that it falls short of what is needed. Hopefully there is more in the works.

github said:
That's fine and all. But does it address the time it takes to actually report problem posts (instead of just complain about them)? Having to PM forum mods that either gave up on your forum, or don't even visit that forum isn't exactly encouraging.
Or will the forums stop becoming void of moderators (like over in EVO 4G land, where I can't remember the last time we had moderator participation besides the banhammer here and there, or moved threads that I report). Will we start seeing more moderator participation?
Of course, my last posts here were worded to spark conversation (and that they did). I am happy to see this latest development, but still feel that it falls short of what is needed. Hopefully there is more in the works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The report system is being reworked. The site improvements will take some time to roll out fully. Things are going back to the earlier days here. Everyone needs to learn how to act right or reap what they sow.

github said:
That's fine and all. But does it address the time it takes to actually report problem posts (instead of just complain about them)? Having to PM forum mods that either gave up on your forum, or don't even visit that forum isn't exactly encouraging.
Or will the forums stop becoming void of moderators (like over in EVO 4G land, where I can't remember the last time we had moderator participation besides the banhammer here and there, or moved threads that I report). Will we start seeing more moderator participation?
Of course, my last posts here were worded to spark conversation (and that they did). I am happy to see this latest development, but still feel that it falls short of what is needed. Hopefully there is more in the works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
cajunflavoredbob said:
The report system is being reworked. The site improvements will take some time to roll out fully. Things are going back to the earlier days here. Everyone needs to learn how to act right or reap what they sow.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What he said

Thanks. I actually moved this into it's own post/question, as it is kind of offtopic from what OP was discussing.

Is it easier to move a thread or to simply close it?

In a few places that I mod, I know that it is actually easier to move a thread and leave a place holder if I think that a thread is in the wrong forum than it does to type an explanation and then lock a thread.
But I am not moving it simply because it is easier. It is the better thing to do. But then again, I don't get the satisfaction of locking the thread then beating my chest when I get home to my woman proclaiming..."Me HE man. Close thread today. Me want sex NOW"!!!!
I posted a thread, http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1904115 and it was locked. What is so hard about moving it and leaving a place holder referring to the new location if you think it is in the wrong forum? It clearly applies to the general forum as it applies to all phones with the recent lawsuits that have been flying around. Not only just apple lawsuits, but many others involving cell phone manufacturers including Apple and six other mfgs getting sued by another company.
Sure there may be another forum that it may fit into. But that can be said about many posts here. Just move it if it is questionable.
Hell, I have even had a post where the mods didn't even know where it went. One mod moved it to another forum, and the FSM in that forum said it was in the wrong forum and locked it. LOL A mod moved it to where he thought it went and then another mod thought it was in the wrong place!!
All I am asking is move the darn thing instead of locking it if it is questionable. It is not like I posted the thread in Near Field Communications Forum or the Job Board. Sheez... Use a little common sense. If it is clearly in the WRONG place, then by all means close it. But if it is a subjective call, use a little common sense.

Takes 5 seconds to do either one.

Just a few clicks to move. But you have to type words to close and provide an explanation. Besides it was a rhetorical thread title I posted. Everybody knows the answer. I was making a point for mods to use some common sense.
Sent from my Kindle Fire running CM10 Jelly Bean

It's up to the individual mod what they'd like to do with it.
A lot of the time, a mod will close the thread rather than move it because people should read the rules and stickies before posting and therefore know that it's in the wrong section.
Whereas, sometimes it will be moved rather than locked because either it's easier for them, or they just don't want to lock it, for whatever reason.
In regards to the mod moving it to OT and it then getting locked whilst in OT, it's not very often that happens anyway.
If a mod of a certain forum sees a thread which shouldn't be there, they probably haven't got enough time to be thinking whether or not it would get locked in OT. So the best thing to do is just to move it there and leave it down to the off-topic mods to do what they wish with it.
''Evil corrupts the mind of the weak but fails to feed off the mind of the strong''

KidCarter93 said:
It's up to the individual mod what they'd like to do with it.
A lot of the time, a mod will close the thread rather than move it because people should read the rules and stickies before posting and therefore know that it's in the wrong section.
Whereas, sometimes it will be moved rather than locked because either it's easier for them, or they just don't want to lock it, for whatever reason.
In regards to the mod moving it to OT and it then getting locked whilst in OT, it's not very often that happens anyway.
If a mod of a certain forum sees a thread which shouldn't be there, they probably haven't got enough time to be thinking whether or not it would get locked in OT. So the best thing to do is just to move it there and leave it down to the off-topic mods to do what they wish with it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Point taken Kid. I can see locking the thread if I went into the Kindle Fire forum and was talking about the headphone output on my RAZR MAXX. Lock the thread for me being a dumbass and posting in the wrong section.
But it was a thread about patents and prior art, which has had SPECIFICALLY had a huge impact on the people/developers here at this site as of late.
"Anything that involves all of the phones and doesn't fit in any of the other fora." hmmmm. It could "fit" into a couple of "fora". If it is questionable then move it. Use some common sense. That is all I ask.
At least I can say one thing for the mod that locked it. He left an explanation. That is an vast improvement from the way things have been in the past.
As for the really old topic that I referred to getting moved then locked..... It wasn't moved to OT. One mod thought it belonged in another forum because I used a question mark somewhere in the post. The mod that is "Guardian of the Question Mark" moved it to Q&A because there was an interrogative in the post. Then a mod in Q&A thought it was in the wrong forum and locked it IIRC. LOL

85gallon said:
Point taken Kid. I can see locking the thread if I went into the Kindle Fire forum and was talking about the headphone output on my RAZR MAXX. Lock the thread for me being a dumbass and posting in the wrong section.
But it was a thread about patents and prior art, which has had SPECIFICALLY had a huge impact on the people/developers here at this site as of late.
"Anything that involves all of the phones and doesn't fit in any of the other fora." hmmmm. It could "fit" into a couple of "fora". If it is questionable then move it. Use some common sense. That is all I ask.
At least I can say one thing for the mod that locked it. He left an explanation. That is an vast improvement from the way things have been in the past.
As for the really old topic that I referred to getting moved then locked..... It wasn't moved to OT. One mod thought it belonged in another forum because I used a question mark somewhere in the post. The mod that is "Guardian of the Question Mark" moved it to Q&A because there was an interrogative in the post. Then a mod in Q&A thought it was in the wrong forum and locked it IIRC. LOL
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But there's already threads that exist which are about the patent war between Apple & Samsung and even if a thread gets created which speaks of patents regarding other companies aswell, it's still similar in its content, so naturally it could be placed in an existing thread.
But your threads been reopened now anyway, I believe.
And if your think a mod could deal with a particular thread differently, then the best option would be to PM them and speak to them about it.
''Evil corrupts the mind of the weak but fails to feed off the mind of the strong''

KidCarter93 said:
But there's already threads that exist which are about the patent war between Apple & Samsung and even if a thread gets created which speaks of patents regarding other companies aswell, it's still similar in its content, so naturally it could be placed in an existing thread.
But your threads been reopened now anyway, I believe.
And if your think a mod could deal with a particular thread differently, then the best option would be to PM them and speak to them about it.
''Evil corrupts the mind of the weak but fails to feed off the mind of the strong''
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand your point about PM'ing a mod. To a point.
I don't fault the mod. I fault the system here.
If I feel something is going on too much here that I disagree with by several mods, I like to make a post in here so users can read it and also put in their feedback. That is why I did so. It is not attributable to a single mod, but the way things are done a lot as a policy. (Hence the argument that my post could really apply to a few forums) In that case err in the case of caution. I did the same a while back when I thought it was wrong to simply close threads without any explanation. (and that was rampant for a while) It is right to close if it is posted obviously in the wrong forum, and the rules were not read. But explain why it was closed so other readers can head the warning to make sure they post in the correct forum. I am not saying I corrected that policy, but I would like to thing I was instrumental.
If I report the thread, I am not sure how many mods read it before it is acted upon. If the problem involves a policy, it may just be the mod on duty that sees the report and takes action either way. No other mods see the complaint to take it into consideration and think, "maybe he has a point".
If I PM the mod directly, I will only do that if I think that particular mod was wrong in his actions. Like it was an action the HE took that other mods have not taken in similar situations. That way, I KNOW that only that mod I disagree with reads it and I can air my disagreement with them personally.
I have only found that necessary a few times and I accept the answer. I don't always agree with the answer. But if I don't, I may escalate to report post in hopes that other mods may see it and voice their opinions in the mod forums. (One case comes to mind on removing a picture in the OT images thread. God it was a funny pic. It may have been offensive to a select few, but funnier than hell. The thread was taking a turn towards memes on the Grand Theft Auto game. I posted a pic of an advertisement for GTA Somolia. It had a Somli with a gun in a wheel barrow with another Somali pushing the wheel barrow through battle ridden streets. LOL)
The mod chose to remove it and I accepted his answer. (Didn't like it.) GRIN. But I accepted it.
But in this case, the closing of a thread that "might" fit better in another forum happens a lot here by several mods. Like it is a systemic policy. If it is clearly in the wrong forum, close it and explain why so others will learn. But it was a thread that could fit in more than one forum. Just move it with an explanation if that is the case.
And after I made this post, I did report the thread to see if other mods might review when no other mods commented. The luck of the draw was that bigjoe was on duty and got the report. He took into consideration my thoughts and re-opened it. I truly wouldn't have minded if he moved it to OT. And he provided an explanation in the thread why he did what he did when he closed it. My disagreement was just simply closing it because he thought it "might" better fit somewhere else.
Kudos to bigjoe. 1. He did provide an explanation when he closed it. and 2. he listened to me and considered my argument. A few months ago that would have never happened here. There was a short period here when threads were simply closed with no explanation. Thankfully that period seems to be over.
Again kudos to bigjoe and to XDA for relaxing the policy of simply slamming down the hammer and not allowing discussion.
And posting it in another patent thread would have been useless and would be buried. They are usually specific flame wars posted by fanboys from both sides. That is why I chose start a new thread in the General Forum. That is where I fell it would reach the biggest target audience.
Again to kudos to bigjoe for having an open mind. the topic of the new site is going to make a big difference (hopefully) and nip the frivolous IP phone patents in the bud for the betterment of the cell phone/tablet community which is where many of the BIG patents wars have been as of late. And those affect US specifically even though the site will help in other areas as well.

Generally speaking we will endeavour to move all threads to the correct location, unless of course a similar thread already exists there. We also try to leave and explanation upon closing a thread.
Obviously this doesn't happen every time but feel free to PM a mod if you would like an explanation. We don't bite.... That costs extra.
What are you doing outside of OT anyway?
Sent From My Fingers To Your Face.....

conantroutman said:
What are you doing outside of OT anyway?
Sent From My Fingers To Your Face.....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Somebody left the door open and I escaped!! LOL I guess I need to get back to the basement.

Application of Rules Liberally

In the time that I've been here, and had several phones while here, I've noticed that moderators can sometimes use the same rules very differently. With some of my older phones (and so in those forums) I noticed that if someone 'tried to act like a moderator' they could be lobbied with an infraction pretty easily. With my current phone (and in that thread) that's not an issue - people frequently make directions based on the rules. Why is that? How can a rule be invented or ignored like that? That's two completely different reactions to the same situation.
Another issue that I've noticed is the level of tolerance in different forums for attacks on other people. In some forums, people would be shooting each other with attacking comments and dripping sarcasm all day, in the next, one slap and it's an infraction.
Some moderators I've found very easy to talk to and their approach is simple and clear. Others, can't seem to communicate without fury. You cannont reason with an angry person and I'm surprised that that can come from a moderator. Like many others I'm sure, I use many forums and this is the only one where I've seen moderators be allowed act this way.
I find that confusing and I'm also convinced that 'convenience' rules are created sometimes, and other times rules are flouted. Like a lot of people, I just want to come to talk about my phone, mod it etc. but the above makes it an unhappy trip on here sometimes. If it becomes a place where these issues are occuring, it feels to me like an 'anything goes' territory.
One other thing, is that I'm convinced that a thanks meter (which we know is also used as an 'I like you or your comment' meter is currency. Do we each have to notch up 1,000 posts and 300 thanks to become equal?
Anyone noticed similar? Any other frustrations?

SharpnShiny said:
Anyone noticed similar? Any other frustrations?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Having received an infraction and a ban in the past, the irony being that I received the second for discussing by P.M that the first was given incorrectly by a moderator who didn't seem to know what an "affiliate" link was, so I do have a few frustrations with how some things are dealt with around here :silly:, but no matter how good your intentions are, how good an idea is or how in the long run something might improve the site, nothings going to change around here, and expect this thread to be locked as criticism even if constructive of how things are done around here doesn't usually go down well with TPTB. :angel:

SharpnShiny said:
In the time that I've been here, and had several phones while here, I've noticed that moderators can sometimes use the same rules very differently. With some of my older phones (and so in those forums) I noticed that if someone 'tried to act like a moderator' they could be lobbied with an infraction pretty easily.
<SNIP>
Anyone noticed similar? Any other frustrations?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There's a big difference between trying to act like a moderator and aiding the moderators in what they do by referring people to the relevant links etc.
If someone is pushing their weight around, being all high and mighty and trying to enforce the rules as if they're more important - that is trying to act like a moderator.
However, directing people to the right place or making someone aware of the rules, without acting like the Big I Am - this is aiding the moderators and helping xda out.
Another thing that needs to be taken into account is that mods are only human and different mods will find some things acceptable whereas some others won't.
So if there are posts that you think should be actioned, simply report it and it will get the relevant mods attention. If you don't agree with a mods decision then you can politely PM them and ask why they made the decision they did and if you're still not happy with it, get in touch with a senior mod about it.
Where did the idea about posts and thanks come from? I don't agree with that at all, to be honest with you.
XperienceD said:
Having received an infraction and a ban in the past, the irony being that I received the second for discussing by P.M that the first was given incorrectly by a moderator who didn't seem to know what an "affiliate" link was, so I do have a few frustrations with how some things are dealt with around here :silly:, but no matter how good your intentions are, how good an idea is or how in the long run something might improve the site, nothings going to change around here, and expect this thread to be locked as criticism even if constructive of how things are done around here doesn't usually go down well with TPTB. :angel:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you think that we're not allowed to discuss the way the site is, then I can assure you that's not the case at all.
The fact is, there's a time and a place for everything.
If you're not happy with how the site is run, or how a moderator/admin acts around the site then creating a thread to bring these issues to the forefront isn't the way to do it.
If you contact the relevant mods etc via PM and want to discuss something relevant I'm sure they'll be more than happy to speak to you about it and sort out any problems you may have.

Nothing is perfect. The moderators can't be. But the comittee chooses them as they do appear close to 'perfect'. If at all you think any unfair decision has been taken upon you or any other member, you can always contact the moderator liasion admins or any one of the admins.
Sent from my GT-S5360 using xda premium

If you have concerns about a specific moderator or forum then I'd be happy to hear them. As would any member of the moderator committee. Feel free to drop us a pm if you wish.
Sent From My Fingers To Your Face.....

I've posted a couple of threads on GENERAL news topics which were curiously moved to the section belonging to my current phone. I can't believe it. It's so biased it's unbelieveable. I calmly messaged the mod who moved it and got no response. I really have no respect for a system that has no respect for it's users. That will be the last news piece that I post, I'll add and contribute to mods and that's it.
Not all of us are 16 year olds still learning, some of us are adults that have education and experience and can tell the difference between the sections. The bias and lack of communication is poor reflection of the site.

conantroutman said:
If you have concerns about a specific moderator or forum then I'd be happy to hear them. As would any member of the moderator committee. Feel free to drop us a pm if you wish.
Sent From My Fingers To Your Face.....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you very much, I didn't see this until today. I'm afraid that on a few issues I have tried this and got no where. I can guarantee I communicate in these messages calmly, reasonable - and open to being wrong. I just can't believe it goes no where.

SharpnShiny said:
Thank you very much, I didn't see this until today. I'm afraid that on a few issues I have tried this and got no where. I can guarantee I communicate in these messages calmly, reasonable - and open to being wrong. I just can't believe it goes no where.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can only apologise for that, I'd hope that any enquiry made would be met with a response. I must say though that it may well be a simple mistake as we can often get quite a lot of messages to respond to and it's easy to one miss one, I'm certainly guilty of that myself (more than once)
As I said though, if you have specific concerns please feel free to get in touch with either myself or any mod committee member and we'll try to make sure the issue is resolved.