Develop Bugs

HTC working on porting sense to WP7

Since I'm a new user I can't post a link but if you go to Forbes' website and click on the velocity blog you'll see an article near the bottom about HTC porting over sense for WP7.
I know that they can't put their own UI on top but they are looking into using the live tiles to be able to accomplish the same goal.

I'm thinking most likely in the form of additional live tiles and colors.
Edit: Here's some of the article so you don't have to go searching around the web.
Microsoft's February announcement that it would exert more control over the phones that use its upcoming mobile software, Windows Phone 7, would seem to be a challenge for HTC. After all, the Taiwan-based smartphone maker has made a name out of layering inventive software on top of other companies' mobile platforms.
But HTC says its custom software, which it calls "Sense", will live on, even on Windows phones. Drew Bamford, who heads HTC's user experience design team, tells Forbes the manufacturer is applying Sense to its first Windows Phone 7 devices, which are expected to launch in October.
"Microsoft has taken firmer control of the core experience [in Windows Phone 7], but we can still innovate," says Bamford. The future version of Sense, he adds, won't look the way it does on current Windows Mobile (6.5) phones, where it basically replaces all the core applications and is fully integrated into the phone.
Nevertheless, HTC is optimistic about the Windows Phone 7 launch, according to Bamford. "We won't be able to replace as much of the core Windows Phone experience, but we will augment it," he says..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

My thoughts too. OEMs are limited to six pre-installed applications. So we'll most likely see something like the mock up done in another thread here. We might see 2 single tile apps and 2 double tile apps that you could go into and change settings to make it look and feel like you want.
It's definately something I had anticipated that they might try to do but it's always nice to get some comfirmation on the subject.

I may have to think twice about possibly getting an htc phone in october. I dont want added doo-dads and bloated doo-hickies. If they do try to port their own sense experience, I hope they can be uninstalled or at least deactivated completely!

daniel-t said:
I may have to think twice about possibly getting an htc phone in october. I dont want added doo-dads and bloated doo-hickies. If they do try to port their own sense experience, I hope they can be uninstalled or at least deactivated completely!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Anything and everything installed by the OEM/carrier can be uninstalled.

RustyGrom said:
Anything and everything installed by the OEM/carrier can be uninstalled.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OEMs are limited to 6 apps of limited size. The apps that the OEMs create for the phones are also limited to the same restrictions independent developers are. This includes performance. They aren't allowed to bog down the OS with bloatware.

Bengal34 said:
OEMs are limited to 6 apps of limited size. The apps that the OEMs create for the phones are also limited to the same restrictions independent developers are. This includes performance. They aren't allowed to bog down the OS with bloatware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just for the sake of full disclosure, they do get access to some other APIs and integration opportunities that the rest of us don't.

RustyGrom said:
Just for the sake of full disclosure, they do get access to some other APIs and integration opportunities that the rest of us don't.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That, I do not know. My guess is that they will considering that they are assigned Microsoft employees to help them make applications. But I don't think we'll know for sure until after they launch.

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I'm eager to see what HTC has up there sleeves.

All they can add are additional apps, so I wouldn't be worried about fragmentation at all. The main OS will not have Sense UI.

It is on Windows Phone Thoughts posted today! There is a link to Engadgets brief story as well...

I hope this will be good!
I can't wait to see how this will fully pan out. I'm with t-mobile and I hope microsoft brings it hard when they launch this wm7 phone. that goes also for htc with there sense.

Still, with HTCs recent epic fail on Android, I would advice against buying their phones.
If you need another reason, then be it to support the community, as HTC recently attempted to take down a custom ROM distributor.

Windcape said:
HTCs recent epic fail on Android
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What are you referring to?

Windcape said:
Still, with HTCs recent epic fail on Android, I would advice against buying their phones.
If you need another reason, then be it to support the community, as HTC recently attempted to take down a custom ROM distributor.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HTC makes the best Android phones. They may have sense on some of them but not all of them. Them working some sense apps/hubs into a wp7 device won't have any negative impact on performance.

Windcape must have made a typo.
Actually Android is big HTC success.

krjcook said:
It may look something like this
I'm eager to see what HTC has up there sleeves.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i hate the squre look, that is the only thing pushing me away from getting a wp7 wen it comes out. i hope htc intergrates a whole ui into 1 square where it feels like replacing the square ui (kinda like spb mobile shell in its earlyer stages where you would have to click on the softkey to go in to the ui & pressing end key would take u back to the regular today screen) not that its the best idea but it could be a start

HTC cant code software to save their lives, just look around for all the issues Sense has on various WM devices, putting that on WP7 is just asking for the device to be a crappy bugfest for which people will blame MS and probably kill any positive buzz the OS may get. Just keep Sense in ANY form far, far away from WP7.

WiPhone makes no Sense
Still can't integrate! Sounds like Sense will have to be worked around with extra steps. Also, since WP7 has no file access, you won't even be able to customize Sense anyways.
As much as MS is copying the iPhone with WP7, they should just call it the WiPhone and get it over with. No integration or real multitasking for 3rd party apps (which are usually superior or made for your niche), what's that crap?!
When I'm done with my HD2 I'll be moving on to Android or webOS.

gaijin1% said:
Still can't integrate! Sounds like Sense will have to be worked around with extra steps. Also, since WP7 has no file access, you won't even be able to customize Sense anyways.
As much as MS is copying the iPhone with WP7, they should just call it the WiPhone and get it over with. No integration or real multitasking for 3rd party apps (which are usually superior or made for your niche), what's that crap?!
When I'm done with my HD2 I'll be moving on to Android or webOS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pretty much what I was thinking. I'm a big fan of HTC, but more for their HW than for the SW. Sense is "ok" at best. Think about this, if it was so great, would mods like those made by Cookie Monster be so popular? Communities like this thrive off of the customization options and the freedom. Microsoft locking it down to me feels like i'm just buying into to the masses.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not all about the whole "special snowflake" thing. I just know what I like; my money goes where I like it, not to the lesser of two evils.
I honestly see WinMo 6.5 sticking around for some time to come because of this.

Giving 5 Nokia Lumia 800 to homebrew devs who need them!

Hi folks,
I'm giving away 5 WP7 Nokia Lumia 800 carrier unlocked devices to homebrew devs who need them.
My goal is to give this hardware out to devs who will use it for either:
Port existing homebrew apps/features/hacks to Nokia Lumia 800.
Create new Nokia Lumia specific homebrew apps/features/hacks.
Anything else that you can convince me makes sense.
"I want one of these free phones, what's next?"
Respond to this forum post with the following information:
What will you use the Nokia Lumia 800 for? The more specific the better. (see the aforementioned list of goals)
Up to 3 links (+ explanation) showing that you have the previous experience required to meet your development goal.
Anything else you think will help you get one of the Lumia 800 phones.
More details and fine print
I'm the one giving away phones, not any previous or future employer of mine.
I'll choose who gets the phones and I'll do so at my own discretion. I'm under no obligation to anyone about anything. It's mine, my own, my precious.
Twitter proof this is a Justin Angel Genuine Offer™ @ https://twitter.com/#!/JustinAngel/status/146662884024385537
Picture of the fabled phones @ http://twitpic.com/7r1731 (The 6th phone in this picture is now my personal phone and it's awesome)
Recipients of this give-away will be announced on this forum, and via private message asking for contact details.
The giveaway ends when submissions have tapered off. At minimum that'll be on 23/12/2011.
If giving you a 700$ phone isn't OK under your local laws (e.g. government employees) please don't submit your name.
This giveaway is available world-wide. However if you live outside the USA, I'll need to figure out how to ship the phones to you, so it'll take a little longer.
My definition of homebrew is "stuff that can't be shipped on the WP7 Marketlpace within the limitations of the current mango application framework".
If you can't comment on this forum due to the 10+ minimum posts, you can email your details to me directly at [email protected].
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Nice!
Challange Accepted!

JustinAngel said:
I'm the one giving away phones, not any previous or future employer of mine.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So this is your way of saying that your current employer, Nokia, is paying for this? Afterall, it is kind of suspicious that you visit their HQ and suddenly possess all those Lumia's ;-)
Cool thing, though!

1. Research of undocumented OS capabilities - I know it's quite general, but that's what I do a lot anyway. Examples include:
attempts to access more phone capabilities through AT commands
try to access the app:// URI scheme from third-party apps and the browser
telnet into the phone
research OS vulnerabilities
access external hardware (read: microcontrollers) from the phone, directly or through a client-server link
2.
How to access blacklisted apps in the Windows Phone emulator ROM (with the locked BIN image) - how to access locked applications in the emulator even though those are not listed in any menus.
How to trick Windows Phone OS into believing your app is the YouTube app - how to hook to the OS and handle YouTube requests with your own app.
Sending text messages from a Dell Venue Pro. Directly from the app and without SmsComposerTask. - self-expalantory. Using AT commands to send SMS messages from a Dell Venue Pro without an explicit prompt. Using native capabilities (interop).
Reading the registry on a Dell Venue Pro. No Dell COM DLL, no ID_CAP_INTEROPSERVICES
3. More work I wrote about available here and here.

Er, why'd you post this in the Windows 8 section instead of the WP7 one?

Arktronic said:
Er, why'd you post this in the Windows 8 section instead of the WP7 one?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Snap, good point. Computers are hard. If a mod can move this to WP7 Dev & Hacking that'll be awesome.

I should probably enter this giveaway. I haven't had a Nokia device in quite a while (see my sig).
1. I'll use it to test my various hacks, especially to compare my current 1st gen's performance to the Nokia.
2a. Don't want to link publicly yet, but I DM'd you about it yesterday. Performance with that project will be a very important factor.
2b. Hacks such as RingRing7 (which I've been meaning to update for Mango), a project like that is still useful for creating your own ringtones instead of just DLing others' stuff
2c. Just as as reference for stuff I've done, ArkSwitch was a pretty damn popular WM6x task manager
3. As a leader/cofounder of my local ALT.NET group, I'm always be showing off my cool gadgets - publicity
Thanks!

JustinAngel said:
Snap, good point. Computers are hard. If a mod can move this to WP7 Dev & Hacking that'll be awesome.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I reported the thread for moving, should be done as soon as a mod sees it.

1. I've been at this stuff for a while. Here's my first thread on XDA... an app I wrote for WinMo 5 over 5yrs ago. Wow... can't believe it's been that long. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=263051
2. I've got experience with interop on WP7 (although I haven't been able to bust into the Mango stuff yet) http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=914055
3. I like to share what I've learned. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1147933
4. I've been working on WP7 since before WP7 was even out and sharing my findings http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=7190440#post7190440
Ok so that's four links but you said anything else that would help us get one . I could go on but hopefully that's enough.
I'm currently working on getting com interop unlock working on the HTC Mango devices. Would love to get it working on everything. From there, who knows what's possible? Depends on what Nokia put in their drivers. An actual flashlight app will likely be first on the list since it's easy and really handy.
Oh and one of those should go to heathcliff. Pretty sure he could get some good use out of one.

JustinAngel said:
Hi folks,
I'm giving away 5 WP7 Nokia Lumia 800 carrier unlocked devices to homebrew devs who need them.
My goal is to give this hardware out to devs who will use it for either:
Port existing homebrew apps/features/hacks to Nokia Lumia 800.
Create new Nokia Lumia specific homebrew apps/features/hacks.
Anything else that you can convince me makes sense.
"I want one of these free phones, what's next?"
Respond to this forum post with the following information:
What will you use the Nokia Lumia 800 for? (see the aforementioned list of goals)
Up to 3 links (+ explanation) showing that you have the previous experience required to meet your development goal.
Anything else you think will help you get one of the Lumia 800 phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow, nice initiative! Here's my two cents.
1) I would use the Nokia Lumia 800 for further development with WindowsPhoneHacker, not only including development of our current homebrew applications, but serious research on native code, interop, and exploits (we've got some processes in queue, trust me)
2) Some of my work (I'm sure most of you are well aware of what I've been up to): http://windowsphonehacker.com/articles/themes_for_windows_phone_first_release-12-12-11
http://windowsphonehacker.com/articles/folders_for_windows_phone_mango_first_release-10-27-11
http://windowsphonehacker.com/articles/exclusive_instant_resuming_on_windows_phone_7_hack-03-19-11 (old gold)
and most everything else on the WPH site.
We're currently in the process of doing something I can't really talk about, but it involves interop, and freedom, and the suffix "break", and in order to expand this research to all OEMs and users, we would need to add Nokia to that portfolio
3) I believe in freedom. I understand Microsoft's security and limitations, and it makes sense for the end user. But I believe all WP users should have a choice on what they want for their device, whether it be a homebrew application, or a method of unlocking the phone to it's full potential. That's the goal in mind, and I ensure you I'll have some seriously neat stuff to share in the near future, and with a Nokia device, we'll have one more OEM we can get it ported to.
Edit: Thought I'd throw this in there: I'm a student, and thus my ability to purchase new phones is fairly limited. Everything I do is volunteer and free, for the good of the community.
Edit 2:
Here's the project I mentioned but wasn't ready to disclose yet. I'm working on Nokia specifically, because it seems like the easiest to crack open if I can get around the whitelist. My major goal, if I get a device, would be to get this working, along with interop, and then see about registry/file system access. It's a start
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=20616855#post20616855

My Entry for the Contest to win a Lumia 800
What I will use the Nokia Lumia 800 for:
I am a current Windows Phone Developer. I would use the Lumia 800 to further my knowledge of Windows Phone Developement. I was inspired by your Metro Pandora to try and see what hacks/homebrew possibilities are out there. I am currently working on one, and would love the opportunity to realease it on the homebrew front just for the Lumia 800, Beauty on Beauty!!! I feel that any app, tile, image that touches the Lumia should match the beauty of the lumia's style and personality.
Links to prove my worthyness:
Link to my Windows Phone Apps: Windows Phone Market
Link to My Website: http://www.b-techlabs.com/
Extra That I think will help:
I think the Lumia 800 is the most beautiful phone ever created!!! (Wish Verizon would get it!) I always stive to make my apps not only functional, and as bug free as possible at launch, but beautiful And just a stab at convincing you that I need one, I need one!!!!!! Since the first videos of them I have dreamt of them, I have tweeted of them, I have drove my wife nuts about them (she can verify), my favorite online statement for it is:
if( (verizon + lumia800 + 4GLTE) == "soon") {string me = "Driving my wife completely nuts for one";}
Windows Phone is AWESOME!!!!!! add in a Dash of Nokia with a few cups of Style and you get the NOKIA LUMIA 800!!!!!!
----------------------------------------------------------------
Good Luck to all!! These Phones are beautiful!

If possible can we nominate a few people
I think fiinix, jaxtbot, heathcliff, cotulla come to the top of my head re: developers who may need the lumias for the community as a whole.
Do the chevron guys have it too?
edit

I would use it to port my GPS logger and navigation software from Windows Mobile to Windows Phone. My software was never successful on Windows Mobile mostly because of no easy way of selling it. Windows Phone and the marketplace has opened up new possibilities which would be nice to try.
1. http://download.heime.org/GPSlogger_Smartphone_setup.CAB The Windows Mobile application
2. http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1036&message=34138345 A post in the dpreview forum. My application is most suited for photo tagging and is made to be fast and easy to use without the need to mess around in a lot of menus only for starting the logger.
3. http://no.linkedin.com/pub/stig-vidar-hovland/42/598/751 My linkedin profile.
My application for Windows Mobile was using very little power and was able to run for hours on the phones battery. I haven't found any application on the Windows Phone Marketplace which has a strong focus on low power and long running times and be easy to use. A Lumia 800 would make it possible to try to make a long running gps logger for Windows Phone.

I would also recommend Heathcliff74 to the list of possible candidates. So far the list seems very much complete

Hi Justin,
Really cool of you to do this. I appreciate all efforts to boost homebrew-development! And I won't hide that I totally want one of those NOKIA's
Even though I don't own a NOKIA Lumia, I already started hacking it (link 1 and link 2). The first thing that is required for most (not all) other hacks to work is Interop Unlock. I would love to continue that work with a hands-on NOKIA device. I also created WP7 Root Tools and I'm working hard to support other brands too. It would be great to add NOKIA to the supported devices. All my apps and hacks have always been free of charge.
I've always been impressed by the new security mechanisms that Microsoft has implemented for WP7. Their policy engine is a great challenge for me. Although I understand their angle on security for most users, I'm interested in unlocking the devices to their full potential for tweakers like us on XDA. I've done quite some research already (link 1, link2 and link 3). But my best is yet to come
Thanks!
Heathcliff74

I agree, Heathcliff74 & cotulla/DFT should be at the top of the list if you want Interop Unlock/HSPL/Custom ROMs plus Heathcliff's Root Tool. Oh, & xboxmod would be another suggestion as well as fiinix.

I totally agree with drkfngthdragnlrd.

1. mwang/Cotulla/DFT - for their XSPL, XAPinstall, etc.
2. Heathcliff74 - for their Interop-unlocking, WP Root Tools, etc.
3. zyxer_raffy - for having nothing and really want to have Nokia Lumia 800 - LOL!
4.
5.

drkfngthdragnlrd said:
I agree, Heathcliff74 & cotulla/DFT should be at the top of the list if you want Interop Unlock/HSPL/Custom ROMs plus Heathcliff's Root Tool. Oh, & xboxmod would be another suggestion as well as fiinix.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This -^
Heathcliff74, cotulla, xboxmod, fiinix, and Jaxbot have my vote as they have by far done the most for wp7 homebrew.

1. Heathcliff74
2. Cotulla
3. fiinix
4. xboxmod
5. ....
I would left open the 5th slot because in my opinion there are some members I would give a lumia....
Sent from my OMNIA7 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App

Xda os

Hi, everyone I am a new member of xda developers but i look out the forum for months. My opinion is that you are '' Gods ''. You can make everything work in the way you want. And I have a big question ; why you don't start a project for making an os. (ok, I know it is not easy but you can do it)
What s your opinion?

ilias1998 said:
Hi, everyone I am a new member of xda developers but i look out the forum for months. My opinion is that you are '' Gods ''. You can make everything work in the way you want. And I have a big question ; why you don't start a project for making an os. (ok, I know it is not easy but you can do it)
What s your opinion?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just my ideas:
For developing, maintaining and contributing an operation system, you need the skills (no problem for xda) and very good connections to the hardware manufacturers.
Not only via mails, chats, phone, etc. for communication and knowledge transfer, but also in economic/financial and legal affairs.
And the last part could be a problem for xda, as a free and open community - it implicates a kind of company/enterprise structure.
Maybe that would force xda to change into something different ... and that's not what I want.
So, IMO let other companies do the OS job, and xda can stay like it is ... and that's fine.
P.S.: For a smartphone or tablet, the firmware is based on a special OS, but it is the software "touched" by the user. So creating custom ROMs/kernels/apps/themes/etc. is already a great job, which is done in many many thread through-out xda for nearly all devices.

Ok......
It_ler said:
Just my ideas:
For developing, maintaining and contributing an operation system, you need the skills (no problem for xda) and very good connections to the hardware manufacturers.
Not only via mails, chats, phone, etc. for communication and knowledge transfer, but also in economic/financial and legal affairs.
And the last part could be a problem for xda, as a free and open community - it implicates a kind of company/enterprise structure.
Maybe that would force xda to change into something different ... and that's not what I want.
So, IMO let other companies do the OS job, and xda can stay like it is ... and that's fine.
P.S.: For a smartphone or tablet, the firmware is based on a special OS, but it is the software "touched" by the user. So creating custom ROMs/kernels/apps/themes/etc. is already a great job, which is done in many many thread through-out xda for nearly all devices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with you in some points but first all I believe that if xda developers make their own os they won't have the restrictions( of thinks like
Devices warranties, licenses problems and other things like that.) they have. Also financial and legal affairs management is a problem that can be solved by xda staff(forum owner)

I posted in a thread kinda like this some time ago.
The thread was about XDA making their own phone/tablet and the talk of creating an OS cropped up in there.
It's the kind of idea that has it's good and bad points.
The main good point being that if there was a problem somewhere along the line, the staff would be easily able to get it sorted because of the amazing skill they have.
But the 2 main bad points (that I can think of) are:
•The OS scene would be really hard for a new competitor to break in to. Windows = HUGE. Android = HUGE. Apple = HUGE. They haven't got that status overnight.
It's took years and years to first get everything set up, then promote the company and then get the credibility and fanbase. It's not easy at all.
•If XDA were to make their own OS, I personally think it would ruin them.
I say this because XDA is renowned for the development and hacking of all these different devices over all these OSes. If they launched their own, it would take the spotlight off development for other OSes and if users didn't want to make the switch over, they're then left with no development, meaning that XDA then loses a ton of members.
I'm a product of the system I was born to destroy!

I agree with KC. I think the app is enough. Nice suggestion tho'

ilias1998 said:
Hi, everyone I am a new member of xda developers but i look out the forum for months. My opinion is that you are '' Gods ''. You can make everything work in the way you want. And I have a big question ; why you don't start a project for making an os. (ok, I know it is not easy but you can do it)
What s your opinion?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The thread was about XDA making their own phone/tablet and the talk of creating an OS cropped up in there.

?
chuqi said:
The thread was about XDA making their own phone/tablet and the talk of creating an OS cropped up in there.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
??

ilias1998 said:
??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They're probably just trying to be sly about getting to 10 posts. I'll be keeping an eye on them anyway
I'm a product of the system I was born to destroy!

I am working on a simple preemptive multitasking OS (since i won the STM32 here), though it isn't aimed at competing with android but i had a different thing in my mind, bootstrapping it from OEM's bootloader. I am trying to stay as far as i can from the hardware so there are a lot of quirks which prevent it from being a full fledged OS, like all process share a single address space, infact if the device support file choose to, it will execute entirely in physical address space. From my experience so far, it should work on anything newer than ARMv6 (and with some hacks on ARMv5). I have it booting on HD2 but it's still not near completion, I use a round robin scheduler with priority scaled quantum to have best of both simplicity and prioritized tasks (Run longer instead of running often) while planning to replace it with priority queues in future.
Best part, I don't have a name yet

intresting...........
Rick_1995 said:
I am working on a simple preemptive multitasking OS (since i won the STM32 here), though it isn't aimed at competing with android but i had a different thing in my mind, bootstrapping it from OEM's bootloader. I am trying to stay as far as i can from the hardware so there are a lot of quirks which prevent it from being a full fledged OS, like all process share a single address space, infact if the device support file choose to, it will execute entirely in physical address space. From my experience so far, it should work on anything newer than ARMv6 (and with some hacks on ARMv5). I have it booting on HD2 but it's still not near completion, I use a round robin scheduler with priority scaled quantum to have best of both simplicity and prioritized tasks (Run longer instead of running often) while planning to replace it with priority queues in future.
Best part, I don't have a name yet
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ok,very intrensting.Is it going to be open source?Any screenshot or any feature?
if yes i would like to know if you don't have a problem

Rick_1995 said:
I am working on a simple preemptive multitasking OS (since i won the STM32 here), though it isn't aimed at competing with android but i had a different thing in my mind, bootstrapping it from OEM's bootloader. I am trying to stay as far as i can from the hardware so there are a lot of quirks which prevent it from being a full fledged OS, like all process share a single address space, infact if the device support file choose to, it will execute entirely in physical address space. From my experience so far, it should work on anything newer than ARMv6 (and with some hacks on ARMv5). I have it booting on HD2 but it's still not near completion, I use a round robin scheduler with priority scaled quantum to have best of both simplicity and prioritized tasks (Run longer instead of running often) while planning to replace it with priority queues in future.
Best part, I don't have a name yet
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My suggestion for the OS name: RickOS !
Ok, it's not very fancy, but I like straight and brief names.

hmmmmmmm..........
It_ler said:
My suggestion for the OS name: RickOS !
Ok, it's not very fancy, but I like straight and brief names.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1

ilias1998 said:
ok,very intrensting.Is it going to be open source?Any screenshot or any feature?
if yes i would like to know if you don't have a problem
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not aimed at users as i just said, though it does have a framebuffer i wrote some time ago for another software i worked for Below are the screenshots of the framebuffer driver in that software and it's development branch (black screens). The kernel itself is non-intrusive and most of the device behavior is governed by the device files. As of now i have quite a lot working on HD2, I could easily port linux drivers with a few modifications. It will run any code written in C or C++.
And, yes It will be open but not unless i have something stable working (1st release).
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I completely agree with KC. I like XDA the way it is now.
sent from my captivate glide running ICS (NardROM 0.4 Rooted)

MediaTek driver sourcecode (want custom ROMs? read this!)

Even though it was said that the Fairphone will be completely open, the sourcecode of the MediaTek chip (MT6589M) is still not available (update: that was true for the time of writing. Luckily as of now, sourcecode is available and a custom ROM is in the making, see Developtment and Original Development Subforums). The link to the linux sourcecode except for the MediaTek part is here:
joemier said:
Here's our next step in providing developer resources. Happy to present to XDA: Fairphone OS Linux kernel source code package. Please let us know issues, problems, questions!
We've put together this package with all our downloads of Fairphone OS and stock Android 4.2.2.
We're eager to see what you all can do with it. Thanks for your patience as we got it up. Enjoy!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great to see that. However, we need MediaTek sourcecode for custom ROMs if we don't want to reverse engineer (which is a lot of hard work and may even be considered a gray area on legality, I think)
Thanks to @dbrgn for bringing this up:
dbrgn said:
@joemier any plans to release the mediatek sources? Without them, not much will happen here...
If I'm not mistaken the mediatek kernel modules were written explicitly for Linux/Android. In which case, according to Linus Torvalds, they would have to be licensed under the GPL license:
That doesn't mean that I would accept just any kind of binary-only module: there are cases where something would be so obviously Linux-specific that it simply wouldn't make sense without the Linux kernel. In those cases, it would also obviously be a derived work, and as such the above excuses don't really apply any more, and it falls under the GPL license.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
(source linuxmafia.com/faq/Kernel/proprietary-kernel-modules.html)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So
Petition for MediaTek to release the sourcecode
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/aosp-support-for-mediatek-devices/
Does anyone know if it's possible to persuade MediaTek to release the code, because they use Linux (GPL)?
Why don't they release the code? Can it be exploited or do they think there is a risk this can be used against them by other companies? Or do they just not care to do a little work?
Sony has managed to release the sourcecode of the MediaTek inside the Xperia C
http://developer.sonymobile.com/dow...es/open-source-archive-for-build-16-0-a-0-36/
So we and Fairphone can do it too!
(Mistake by me, it's just the kernel. Thanks chrmhoffmann for pointing it out)

Yes, we definitely need the full sources. One of the reasons why I bought the Fairphone was its alleged openness. If we can't get the Mediatek sources, the promise of a "completely open phone" is nothing but empty words.

That Sony code is just the kernel. It's clearly stated on that page you link to.
Chris
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda app-developers app

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More threads about this:
Operation RMD - To Support & Reward our MTK SoC Developers: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2164959
OmniROM For MTK Devices: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2483238
MTK 6577 Sources [Complete]: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2560714
MediaTek Contact URL: http://www.mediatek.com/_en/08_info/03_contactUS.php

You guys have to remember any device out of China is not going to be held to the GPL.
Bat cave One

dbrgn said:
Yes, we definitely need the full sources. One of the reasons why I bought the Fairphone was its alleged openness. If we can't get the Mediatek sources, the promise of a "completely open phone" is nothing but empty words.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Promising openness and choosing an MTK chip are completely conflicting right now.
MTK is one of the least open source friendly chipset providers out there.
1) Their kernel is often full of binary blob modules. Sadly, in many cases, blob modules ARE legal. See the infamous Samsung FSR driver on the GalaxyS family.
2) Their kernel source code is a disorganized mess
3) If you have a friendly OEM that will leak MTK's complete Android build tree to you:
a) They will only build as-is with an oddball and VASTLY outdated Ubuntu configuration
b) They're an even more disorganized mess than the kernel sources and will cause severe brain damage if you try to read/understand them without taking breaks to work with a less screwed up source tree
c) Even their OEMs only get statically linked binaries for many components. For example their hwcomposer "source" is just a wrapper around a blob
d) They have yet to support an Android release newer than 4.2 - partly because it looks like they initially wrote stuff for Android 1.x and have never updated their sources properly to fit in with newer versions of Android. (They have been hacking Android sources to be compatible with their junk instead of the other way around). For example, they still don't use device trees.
Even with an OEM that is cooperating significantly with developers (like Oppo), working with MTK devices is slow and extremely agonizing.

Kernel Source ??
Good day everyone,
I was looking around for useful information and I stumbled over this -> https://github.com/varunchitre15/MT6589_kernel_source
Maybe I'm wrong but isn't that what everyone is looking for?
If not... well I'm sorry about pointing out the wrong stuff
Cheers,

ancdix said:
Good day everyone,
I was looking around for useful information and I stumbled over this -> https://github.com/varunchitre15/MT6589_kernel_source
Maybe I'm wrong but isn't that what everyone is looking for?
If not... well I'm sorry about pointing out the wrong stuff
Cheers,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
no
Seriously, did you even bother to read the earlier posts in this thread?

Thank you very much for your kind response.
Anyone wants a Fairphone? Gonna sell mine.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And it's gone Nexus 5 here I come.

There are new sources posted on the Fairphone website. See the thread with technical details.
Hope it is complete now, as the first compilation attempt failed...

FlamingoKid said:
There are new sources posted on the Fairphone website. See the thread with technical details.
Hope it is complete now, as the first compilation attempt failed...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Kernel source is better than many MTK OEMs, but it'll still at best get you custom kernels. AOSP-derivative builds (CM, Omni, etc.) are right now far away.
(In case you haven't figured out - some of the Omni developers have a "complete" MT6589 source tree. I use "complete" in quotes because while it will build 4.2 on a properly configured machine, it is a mix and match of tons of blobs and all sorts of horrible hacks that result in it being a nightmare to integrate into any 4.3/4.4 AOSP-based project. Yes, even with an OEM giving us everything they have access to we're barely able to get 4.4 to boot on MT6589.)
https://gerrit.omnirom.org/#/q/status:open+branch:android-4.4+topic:mt6589,n,z for an example of the terribad hacks required to get it even to boot

Entropy512 said:
...
(In case you haven't figured out - some of the Omni developers have a "complete" MT6589 source tree. I use "complete" in quotes because while it will build 4.2 on a properly configured machine, it is a mix and match of tons of blobs and all sorts of horrible hacks that result in it being a nightmare to integrate into any 4.3/4.4 AOSP-based project. Yes, even with an OEM giving us everything they have access to we're barely able to get 4.4 to boot on MT6589.)
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah, so this is more a Mediatek issue (provided with full 'sources' it still is a lot of work)? I'm an enterprise developer (JEE) so kerneldeveloping is new to me. Will check the links in your signature though :good:

Sigh. I think that also the new kernel sources don't work. I can't get it to boot. http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=4bv6fyWw
The ringbuffer and/or ram console are quite small, so I don't really get much output. Looks like some problem with the dsi/display.
ARRGGHHH...
Chris

I just don't understand the ChiCom's thinking here .... You have a small army of intelligent motivated developers willing and able to extend your code AND your hardware for free ..... and you just sh-- all over them? There is nothing going on inside a Mediatek processor that's unique, groundbreaking or proprietary that's worth protecting. I say that as someone who has been in the field of Industrial and Commercial Process Controls since 1997
It's like they don't really want to make money and I'm afraid they've picked up a bad habit that's plagued the US business community for decades
Penny wise and Dollar foolish .... Save a couple of pennies now and throw way several dollars in the future (For instance it is ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS cheaper to mitigate Pollution at the source than it is to clean up the environmental and health degradation it causes, I've yet to find a single exception to this Rule and the ChiComs are going to learn it real quick the hard way in the very near future)
Can't they see why the Nexus 7 was such a hit? Can't they see how Google took a device that's Margin was so low it was obviously never meant to make real money but since it was so Open it was embraced by the WORLDWIDE community and became a money making best seller. Cripes the biggest downside to a Nexus 7 is that there are so many ROMs and Kernels out there it's hard to choose and takes a week or more of research to cull your way through them
My only conclusion that they are Thieves at heart and thus think everyone else is out to steal from them like the steal from others .... Another bad habit they picked up from US "Corporate-think" .... Or maybe they do such shoddy coding that they are embarrassed to have anyone see it ... nothing pisses off a so-called Professional more than a bunch of 'amateurs' laughing at them and showing them up ....
Plus like any Corporation it's not the better educated engineers and scientists that call the shots but the poorly educated MBA's who don't know a resistor from a capacitor and couldn't even fix a broken flashlight or change their own oil ....

longjohn119 said:
I just don't understand the ChiCom's thinking here .... You have a small army of intelligent motivated developers willing and able to extend your code AND your hardware for free ..... and you just sh-- all over them? There is nothing going on inside a Mediatek processor that's unique, groundbreaking or proprietary that's worth protecting. I say that as someone who has been in the field of Industrial and Commercial Process Controls since 1997
It's like they don't really want to make money and I'm afraid they've picked up a bad habit that's plagued the US business community for decades
Penny wise and Dollar foolish .... Save a couple of pennies now and throw way several dollars in the future (For instance it is ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS cheaper to mitigate Pollution at the source than it is to clean up the environmental and health degradation it causes, I've yet to find a single exception to this Rule and the ChiComs are going to learn it real quick the hard way in the very near future)
Can't they see why the Nexus 7 was such a hit? Can't they see how Google took a device that's Margin was so low it was obviously never meant to make real money but since it was so Open it was embraced by the WORLDWIDE community and became a money making best seller. Cripes the biggest downside to a Nexus 7 is that there are so many ROMs and Kernels out there it's hard to choose and takes a week or more of research to cull your way through them
My only conclusion that they are Thieves at heart and thus think everyone else is out to steal from them like the steal from others .... Another bad habit they picked up from US "Corporate-think" .... Or maybe they do such shoddy coding that they are embarrassed to have anyone see it ... nothing pisses off a so-called Professional more than a bunch of 'amateurs' laughing at them and showing them up ....
Plus like any Corporation it's not the better educated engineers and scientists that call the shots but the poorly educated MBA's who don't know a resistor from a capacitor and couldn't even fix a broken flashlight or change their own oil ....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yup. This is why Oppo has done so well in the West compared to other Chinese manufacturers despite almost no international marketing efforts outside of social media - Instead of crapping on community developers, they embraced them and we became their evangelists.

A little bit desappointed
My first fairphone is about to arrive and I've been looking for sofware news for weeks. Disappointedly, I've found FairphoneOS is not being Open Source and customizable... Is it true my research conclusion?
Thanks in advance
Lupin

Ubuntu Phone and Fairphone
If have read this article on omgubuntu.co.uk http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2014/02/bq-aquaris-ubuntu-phone-specs and if i read this correctly, the Ubuntu Phone by manufacturer bq will use a MT6589 (without M). This is essentially the same chipset as the fairphone but with a higher clocked gpu. This should ease porting ubuntu for phones to Fairphone i guess. It will be interessting how (and if) Canonical publishes Ubuntufor that phone. It might actually include sources to help porting Ubuntu to Fairphone.
What do you think?

Well, and what do you think about Neo900: http://neo900.org/#features
Yes, I consider this could be considered spam; sorry for that.

Hi all,
anybody seen/tried this: gizmochina.com/2014/03/10/finally-android-4-4-kitkat-is-available-for-mediatek-mt6589-chipset
Could that be good news?

supersn0b said:
Hi all,
anybody seen/tried this: gizmochina.com/2014/03/10/finally-android-4-4-kitkat-is-available-for-mediatek-mt6589-chipset
Could that be good news?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What's new?
Search right here on xda.
There are currently two cyanogenmod builds (CM 10.2 - jb 4.3) and (CM11 - KK 4.4) for the wiko stairway MT6589.
Check the miscellaneous android development forums
Regards

What is the oldest WORKING smartphones you still own? Share your YT demonstration.

Nowadays we all have relatively new devices. Lets see what still lives among us.
At the start of this thread, September 2015, what is the oldest WORKING device you still own.
Requirement:
~Your device age must be a minimum of 4 years +
~Take a video (use that new device:good, showing the device working.
*In the video, include the software version installed*
~Please offer some history on your device.
~Please post only one device per post
We are not here to simply discuss what you have owned, we're here to see these old guys that are still alive:good:
Please keep this thread clean and friendly.

JIC

Love the idea of this thread, especially with the video and I hope others take part in it
Anyways, my oldest *working* device is the EVO 3D.
The device came out in early 2011 so is about 4 years exactly and to me is a special device. Is the device that I started compiling Android from source and is what started #DirtyUnicorns for me.
At the time I was winzipping/porting ROMs on the EVO 4G and had felt that I've done everything I could possibly do on it and was looking for a newer device. A friend and now fellow dev @NYCHitman1 offered to donate his EVO 3D since he was moving on to the GNEX (I think) and I took him on that and loved it!
Started compiling unofficial AOKP builds and digging into source to see how things actually work. Started cherry picking features as users requested on my thread and sooner or later, it got to the point that it was no longer AOKP. Well, at least the AOKP that you compiled from stock. It had a ton of features on top of what AOKP offered and so I renamed it and it took off after that.
People started contributing to my little project and compiling for their devices and fast forward to today and is grown to it's own thing! I love it and is all because of this little device, the EVO 3D
Currently it has KitKat 4.4.4 and it runs fairly well. Only thing that's broke is the 3D camera but that's every AOSP rom for the EVO 3D since lack of source and blobs.

@Mazda
Thanks Alex, that's the ticket:good:

Awesome thread and very unique unfortunately I don't have any old devices anymore. But my oldest and first android was of course G1 from Tmo but the oldest of all was a palm pda. And of course an old...... Motorola with a laptop near it to get activated at the scene. Lol
Sent from my LG-H811 using Tapatalk

TonyStark said:
Nowadays we all have relatively new devices. Lets see what still lives among us.
At the start of this thread, September 2015, what is the oldest WORKING device you still own.
Requirement:
~Your device age must be a minimum of 4 years +
~Take a video (use that new device:good, showing the device working.
*In the video, include the software version installed*
~Please offer some history on your device.
~Please post only one device per post
We are not here to simply discuss what you have owned, we're here to see these old guys that are still alive:good:
Please keep this thread clean and friendly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
/me cracks knuckles....
I give you the device that gave birth to this here site.... HTC Wallaby aka O2 XDA
* I purchased my HTC Wallaby in 2003, which makes it 12 years old (I guess it qualifies );
* While I forgot to shoot the build version of the ROM, it is on PocketPC 2002 (can be seen at the beginning of the video);
This phone is a marvel of the golden age of mobility, well before Apple was what we know today as crApple. I bought it while I was studying Engineering. I had owned a few other WinCE mobile devices before that (my first being a HP Jornada 520), but I wanted to have phone and PDA all in one (I had a Toshiba e740 at the time I bought this). Found a good deal on eBay and have had it ever since. That thing has been through thick and thin yet still has a battery that can hold a charge, even if only for a short while and it works flawlessly. Equipped with 32 MB of shared RAM and ROM, an Intel Xscale processor clocked at 200 MHz, BT and a SD card, this was ahead of its time in every sense of the word. It has a lot of our modern, Samsung "innovations" like the stylus and the new clip-on keyboard. It had no on board Wifi and was only GPRS capable, but to this day, it has lasted longer than any phone I have ever had. The device has seen loads of development in here and is the true bed of Linux on a mobile device (look for XANADUX)... A bad OEM update to PPC2003 was what brought me to this site back in '05... 10 years later, and I am still around (have gone up slightly in the hierarchy ever since )
Suddenly, I have the urge of trying to find the cab for Age of Empires 2 for PPC... This thing ran it flawlessly....
Good enough @TonyStark?
I could do another one with my Blue Angel but I guess you cannot really go too further back than this.

@egzthunder1
Excellent and thank you. It will take a major undertaking to find something much older If you do not see any other user post the Blue Angel, please do not hesitate.

Hmmm.... Droid 2...
I still have my original droid 2 and its honestly the worst system I have ever owned and know 7 other people who equally shared the same hate .... You would seriously die before making a call for help...

smartphone?? its my galaxy 5.. its with my dad right now...

reyscott1968 said:
smartphone?? its my galaxy 5.. its with my dad right now...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please read the OP

TonyStark said:
Please read the OP
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hahaha. i forgot to include. i still use it for calls. my dad just have it for now

I have several "smart" devices from my first Palm TX, all the way up to several newer Samsung devices and everything in between. Took me some time to get to the bottom of my electronics bin but I eventually found a good smart phone.
My first "smart" phone was the Blackberry Pearl 8100. It lasted me for about a year when I upgraded to my Palm Pixi and I went crazy from there. The Pearl was the device that first taught me the joys of customizing a device and in a round about way got me into rooting and ROMing. The first thing I did to it was to find a way to get third party apps on it without the presence of an app store. Once I figured that out I then figured out how to customize the color of the Pearl and my love for playing with mobile devices was born.
Even though I retired it from my personal use almost eight years it has been in use almost constantly until a year ago when I got my sister in law to give it back and got her upgraded to a Moto X. I pulled it out today and plugged it in and after about thirty minutes of charging I was able to play Brick Breaker on it for a whole two minutes before the battery died (thank you battery bulge!).
View attachment 3469522

HTC desire wildfire s used for around 5years now also its working properly without any issue using cm10 in it.Runs smooth,5mp camera without any crack.Almost fallen down 100 times from hand.Also works as a backup phone for me.

I have owned 2 old devices, Galaxy S1 just keeping in box as souvenir
Another still using, galaxy tab 7.7 legend, this device beloved by a lot of people so that still have XDA developers update new rom, special is Daniel_hk developer, he did a lot of rom for this device, his Omni rom 5.1.1 on my device now and continue to follow him for Mashmallow 6.0 which just on the way, I lost my account on forum so have registered this new and try to get ten posts soon to meet him at 6M thread
To @daniel_hk :
I have up your mm rom with TWRP 2.8.7.1, it have a problem till step I sign in Google account then it pop-up a lot warning that Google Apps stopped working then restart, this action work in cycle so setting cannot be finished if during settings skip sign in Google account then can finish settings but while get in play store with account then problem happen same, hope you recheck it tks!

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Wow... looks how far we have gone. New phone now is as powerful as a full feature computers - looking back 10 years ago.

Working? None, lol
But I remember the myth:

HTC Hero running CM 7 nightly.
Its right now in the bin of used phones. I don't really remember using it though it was my daily driver at the time.

I still have a droid 2. It became a much better phone after rooted and bloatware removed.
Sent from my A0001 using XDA Free mobile app