Develop Bugs

[Q] 100% to 95% battery

Hey guys. Within a minute or so after my phones removed from the charger it drops to 95%.is this normal?im using the 1.8a LG charger that comes with the phone F240L.i read somewhere that they are using the LG charger 1.2a out of the box.does this phone have two different out of the box charger..thanks..

Completly normal. The method that seems to be employed for the battery percentage is read the voltage itself and make a guess
This high voltage drops down quite quickly both as a "load" is applied to the battery,. Plus there is not a lot of change in capacity from the very high voltages to the more normal voltages, in any li-ion battery. So while the voltage can be used to guestimate a range of charge levels, between like 4.0 and 4.3 there isnt much changed in the battery itself.
Further from what i have seen so far (not totally sure) they are charging to 4.35v which is a rescent slight change in the chemistry of the li-ion to allow for higher charge levels without it gassing or reducing the life (Havent tested that theory long enough yet either).
Also All li-ion alogrythms for charging do a CC CV charge, where the final charge is just "holding" the voltage at the high, till the batterys charge state floats up to that level. This can (not facted out yet) mean that leaving it on the charge past the time it claims it is fully charged , it will put tiny bits more into it. This happens more with my big fat zerolemon battery because it seems to have more resistance to the other connected cell items than would be desired.
Anyways all is well, just dont believe anything a computer tells you , and it will be fine The other methods have thier own deficiencies.
Other STUFF:
Li-Ion batteries really do not prefer to be left at their high charge voltages, as they degrade faster there. so when you read the above, or try "bump" charging methods (thats just restarting the charge) It is not good for it. The battery will be happier, using it like it was designed, taking it off the charge when it states it is full. all of this being more info than anyone needs to know, or freaking care about.
As a li-ion battery becomes old and weak, it will exhibit even more of these charateristics that have people wondering. It will drop off the highs quicker still, have less total capacity, and increse a tiny bit in resistance , which will cause it to drop even more under load. At some point the battery would be so bad at that, you would want to replace it.
Heat, the li-ion cells dont like these extreeme heats. they prefer to work more at normal room temps and cold but not extreeme cold. So take that in also as a factor in keeping your battery more happy, again if you want to waste half your life pampering the thing

runwithme21 said:
Hey guys. Within a minute or so after my phones removed from the charger it drops to 95%.is this normal?im using the 1.8a LG charger that comes with the phone F240L.i read somewhere that they are using the LG charger 1.2a out of the box.does this phone have two different out of the box charger..thanks..
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Click to collapse
It's the calibration. Happens to me too sometime. Drops rather fast to 95%, then goes stable around 89%. Just leave it on charge for an extra 45 minutes or so, then let the battery die down to at-least 10% before charging again. Not exact science, it's just what I do.

[Q] Battery Overcharging Concern

Hi,
I recently bought the 2GB RAM variant of the ASUS ZenFone 2 (ZE551ML). I noticed that if the phone was kept on charge for an extended period of time, after the battery had reached 100%, it would take an exorbitant amount of time to go from 100% to 99% and would discharge normally after. During this period the battery section under settings would not report any usage statistics either.
However, if I disconnect it before it hits 100, I noticed that the rate of discharge is how it should be.
If I leave it connected to the charger after it hits 100, CPU-Z reports a battery voltage of 4278mV and once I disconnect it starts discharging from 4227mV. I read somewhere that 4.2V is the max safe limit for a Li-Po battery.
I'm concerned if any of this is an indication of the battery getting overcharged. Any inputs would be appreciated.
Thanks.

The last 1% is the phone trickle charging so it does not overcharge. Some phones stop charging when the battery hits 100%, like the Nexus 4. Other phones keep trickle charging and pull energy from the charger over the battery like Nexus 5 or the Asus Zenfone2.

I agree with the previous poster, the phone trickle charges at the end.
As for leaving your phone on the charger overnight etc, I wouldn't worry, I do it all the time. The phone battery wouldn't overcharge if left on the charger for a longer period of time, it would just stop charging and the phone would draw power from the adapter.

saurav1990 said:
Hi,
I recently bought the 2GB RAM variant of the ASUS ZenFone 2 (ZE551ML). I noticed that if the phone was kept on charge for an extended period of time, after the battery had reached 100%, it would take an exorbitant amount of time to go from 100% to 99% and would discharge normally after. During this period the battery section under settings would not report any usage statistics either.
However, if I disconnect it before it hits 100, I noticed that the rate of discharge is how it should be.
If I leave it connected to the charger after it hits 100, CPU-Z reports a battery voltage of 4278mV and once I disconnect it starts discharging from 4227mV. I read somewhere that 4.2V is the max safe limit for a Li-Po battery.
I'm concerned if any of this is an indication of the battery getting overcharged. Any inputs would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Depends on the battery. Some are rated for 4.35. My Zenfone 2 charging to a solid 4.3+. The voltage will always read lower when removing the charger. After removing the charger, use your phone for about 5 minutes. This is your solid voltage. I wouldn't worry about 4.25. This is no problem.

Chinaphonearena said:
Depends on the battery. Some are rated for 4.35. My Zenfone 2 charging to a solid 4.3+. The voltage will always read lower when removing the charger. After removing the charger, use your phone for about 5 minutes. This is your solid voltage. I wouldn't worry about 4.25. This is no problem.
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Mine goes beyond 4.3, I'm seeing as high as 4.33...Can you confirm the voltage that's listed as safe for the battery?

Is there a way to turn off the fast charging in the OS?

I plan to use this phone for many years, so I'm worried that the fast charging might do damage to the battery in the long term or shorten its lifespan, so I'd rather charge it "slower". Is there a way to turn off the fast charging in the OS? Or is my worry unsubstantiated?

513263337 said:
I plan to use this phone for many years, so I'm worried that the fast charging might do damage to the battery in the long term or shorten its lifespan, so I'd rather charge it "slower". Is there a way to turn off the fast charging in the OS? Or is my worry unsubstantiated?
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You made my night... Slower charger kills battery not fast charging.. fast charge save battery to be honest. And you dont have to be worry since the batteries now are LI-lon . Go get info in google about the batteries . All i can say you got infos wrong.
Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using XDA-Developers mobile app

Agree with previous post. But if it makes you feel better, just don't use a dash charger...
Very simple.

lummujaj said:
You made my night... Slower charger kills battery not fast charging.. fast charge save battery to be honest. And you dont have to be worry since the batteries now are LI-lon . Go get info in google about the batteries . All i can say you got infos wrong.
Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using XDA-Developers mobile app
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OK. I didn't know.
I was speaking from my past experience with Samsung Galaxy Note 4. I bought couple of original Samsung batteries and rotate them throughout daily usage. I noticed a significant difference in battery life comparing the ones that I used fast charge on vs the ones I didn't. After that I stick to NOT using fast charge.
Of course, that's nothing scientific. And Samsung uses a different fast charge mechanism (higher voltage) than OnePlus (higher current), so there could be difference there too.

Because Dash Charge seems to be re-labeled Vooc charging from OPPO, I can tell you, that the last two years with charging minimum one times every day, there is no bad effect on the battery (still the first one).
Sent from my Find7 using XDA-Developers mobile app

513263337 said:
OK. I didn't know.
I was speaking from my past experience with Samsung Galaxy Note 4. I bought couple of original Samsung batteries and rotate them throughout daily usage. I noticed a significant difference in battery life comparing the ones that I used fast charge on vs the ones I didn't. After that I stick to NOT using fast charge.
Of course, that's nothing scientific. And Samsung uses a different fast charge mechanism (higher voltage) than OnePlus (higher current), so there could be difference there too.
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Samsung devices are notorious for killing batteries and its more likely hardware than it is the battery itself, u will be fine

I have a similar question: does it make any problem if I leave the phone in (dash) charge for the whole night? I mean, if I sleep for 7hrs I'll have 1h of fast charging and 6hrs of nothing-but-charger-heating. Will this habit hurt the phone's battery or the charger itself?

513263337 said:
I plan to use this phone for many years, so I'm worried that the fast charging might do damage to the battery in the long term or shorten its lifespan, so I'd rather charge it "slower". Is there a way to turn off the fast charging in the OS? Or is my worry unsubstantiated?
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Click to collapse
I use Samsung 1.5 Amp charger and keep my battery between 40% to 80%
I think these are best for long term usage.

repsol89 said:
I have a similar question: does it make any problem if I leave the phone in (dash) charge for the whole night? I mean, if I sleep for 7hrs I'll have 1h of fast charging and 6hrs of nothing-but-charger-heating. Will this habit hurt the phone's battery or the charger itself?
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I used a samsung S3 before and overnight charging killed my battery! Bless samsung for making battery removable on S3!
If i were you, I wouldn't leave my precious OP3 on an all-night charge.

iam_adarsh said:
I used a samsung S3 before and overnight charging killed my battery! Bless samsung for making battery removable on S3!
If i were you, I wouldn't leave my precious OP3 on an all-night charge.
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Well, it was my first thought, but everyone in this topic is telling me that OP works different than Samsung!

iam_adarsh said:
I used a samsung S3 before and overnight charging killed my battery! Bless samsung for making battery removable on S3!
If i were you, I wouldn't leave my precious OP3 on an all-night charge.
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that's the problem of the charger or the phone itself. thecharger is designed not to charge when the battery is full. What I want to say is you experienced an accident and sorry for you.
The most serious threat to the battery is high temperature. OnePlus 3 reduce the charging heat by its dash charge. The dash charge pushes low voltage directly to the phone, which mitigates the heating problem by pushing high electric current and making the voltage transition process in dash charger. Most of other phones still use high voltage because they fail to create high current. recalling the physics in high school, the power is current multiplied by voltage and energy equals to power multiplied by time. than you would understand the powerful feature of dash charge

dlhxr said:
that's the problem of the charger or the phone itself. thecharger is designed not to charge when the battery is full. What I want to say is you experienced an accident and sorry for you.
The most serious threat to the battery is high temperature. OnePlus 3 reduce the charging heat by its dash charge. The dash charge pushes low voltage directly to the phone, which mitigates the heating problem by pushing high electric current and making the voltage transition process in dash charger. Most of other phones still use high voltage because they fail to create high current. recalling the physics in high school, the power is current multiplied by voltage and energy equals to power multiplied by time. than you would understand the powerful feature of dash charge
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The power is current multiplied by voltage so what's the difference between high current mutiplied by low voltage versus low current multiplied by high voltage ?
2V x A = V x 2A

lapocompris said:
The power is current multiplied by voltage so what's the difference between high current mutiplied by low voltage versus low current multiplied by high voltage ?
2V x A = V x 2A
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qc3.0 uses low current and high voltage. Dash uses high current and low voltage. As a result, they have similar power and both charge quickly. However, the heating problem is more serious for qc 3.0. The difference of the battery voltage and charger voltage is the leading factor that determines the transition efficiency. The bigger the difference is, the more heat charging process generates.
So~ you could look up for qc3.0. for mi 5, it has three adaptive mode: 5V2.5A、9V2A、12V1.5A. for dash, we have 5V4A

repsol89 said:
I have a similar question: does it make any problem if I leave the phone in (dash) charge for the whole night? I mean, if I sleep for 7hrs I'll have 1h of fast charging and 6hrs of nothing-but-charger-heating. Will this habit hurt the phone's battery or the charger itself?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is no problem with leaving your phone on the charger. I do this with every phone since years.
If people experience something bad with it, their phone or battery are broken. The current tech just keeps the battery at full capacity once it's full. Never had any problem.

So many "opinions" but mostly incorrect. The answer to the OPs question is that you don't have to worry about quick charge destroying your battery. It will not have significant impact on your battery capacity. I would have been more worried about breaking the usb type-c port(see point 2 below). All things considered, after 2-3 years you will probably buy a new phone anyway and also you can always buy a replacement battery cheap. But you can simply use a normal charger which delivers <3A with 5V so you don't have to worry about anything.
1- Slow charge does not damage lithium-ion chemistry batteries. You can read about lithium-ion charging here. But neither fast charge will damage lithium-ion as long as the battery temperature is not extremely high. Also temperature at different charge stages effect the capacity decrease (source) But you will be fine as long as the battery temperature is less than 45C. The charging IC should stop the charging process if it exceeds it anyway.
2- Qualcomm's quick charge is much better than voop/dash charge from an engineering standpoint. This is why also USB organization's power delivery (PD) standard uses similar scheme. The problem is the cable and the connector. The maximum allowed current at 5V is 3A with usb type-c connector (source). If you provide more current, you need to use a thicker cable(dash/vooc cables). But you can't change the connector, and it may damage your connector in the long run to use 3+A currents to charge. Because there is a contact resistance (R) and the power lost in the connector is square of current (I) times R. Meaning R*I^2, it will wear off the connector faster. This is why some companies with some engineering skills opt in to use higher voltages instead of higher currents.
3- You can't push more current to lithium-ion battery than it accepts. The maximum current is voltage delta (between charging voltage and battery voltage) divided by internal resistance. This is why you can charge empty battery much faster. If you use an app like Ampere from play store, you can see the voltage of your battery before and after you plug in your charger. If you plug in a normal charger, you will see that it goes up a little bit. If you plug a quick charger it goes up to ~4.35V
4- Yes, there is conversion inefficiencies for quick charge inside the phone, and it will warm up the "phone" and battery only indirectly. The conversion IC are normally >90% efficient (source). This does not mean that your battery will be destroyed. It is perfectly fine to charge lithium-batteries with up to 45C temperatures (source).
4- If overnight charging killed your battery, your battery was faulty (or you had 3rd party battery?). The battery should be capable of holding 4.35v charge. You would need to store battery at 4.35V full charge for over 3 months to loose 20% capacity (http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_store_batteries). Having full charge few hours overnight won't destroy it unless your battery or device is faulty.
With all this information, I would rather opt in for USB-PD/Qualcomm Quick Charge solutions than VOOC/DASH solutions. I think eventually only USB-PD will remain and everybody will use it as a standard only.

Question regarding Fast Charging feature

Does fast charging as opposed to normal charging (FC turned off in device care) as our standard means of charging our devices affect battery lifespan in the long run?

All things being equal, I don't think that it does

raul6 said:
All things being equal, I don't think that it does
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Well, thanks. But it's the noticeable heat generated from fast charging that gives me some concerns whereas in normal charging, the heat isn't that much.

Well, no such differences with chargers I use but if there was I would be probably use normal charging

No. Charging doesn't harm your phone
Sent from my SM-N975F using Tapatalk

Its a known fact that high temperatures are bad for lithium ion batteries, fast charging generates more heat than std charging, if there are no adverse effects by fast charging, then it would not be an option, it would be the standard

winol said:
Its a known fact that high temperatures are bad for lithium ion batteries, fast charging generates more heat than std charging, if there are no adverse effects by fast charging, then it would not be an option, it would be the standard
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Fast charging is fine as long as you control the heat; brief 10-30% partial charges generate a modest temp increase. LIs are designed for fast charging.
If your ambient room temp is high simply wrap a damp rag around the phone while charging to cool it.
Monitor bat temp and keep it belong 95 F.
-Avoid full or near full charging-
60-70% is a good range; > 62% is ideal for longevity.
Avoid discharging below about 20%; low voltage isn't as efficiently converted and there's a knee in LI's power curve near that mark; battery % drops more rapidly from 20-6%.
Deep cycle recharges stress the LI much more than short 10 or 20% bursts.
LI's love frequent, short charge cycles in the 40-60% range.
Keep battery >100 F when using, charging or storing!
Avoid using the phone whilst charging; it screws up the charge cycle curve and greatly slows charging!
Same-same if battery temp exceeds 100 F!
25 w brick yields about 2%@ minute charge.

Question Battery temperature while charging

Hi. I have the Indian version of the device, which is Mi 11x 6|128GB variant. I noticed while charging, Accubattery shows battery temps of 45 46 degrees Celsius (113 Fahrenheit). I find that not normal for a new phone. I'm coming from a Poco F1 which had a SD845, so here are my doubts:
1. Does all flagship class SoCs heat up that much during charging? But my Poco F1 didn't.
2. Is there something wrong in my unit or is it faulty cooling implementation on the entire Redmi K40 lineup?
3. Can I expect this issue to become a little less in the future after some updates to alter SoC clock speed or something?
Thanks for reading.

Thats normal if you use the included 33W charger, the battery naturally heats up while charging, the fatest you charge the battery the more heat it produces. is always recommended to not heavily use the phone while in charge. just for the sake of doubt you can try use a 5W charger and see if it heats up while charging slowly, (it should be hot just a little).

What's the ambient temperature?
Is it fast charging? Which typically produces a,fair amount of waste heat.
If it's start temperature is 99F it will climb into the triple digits.
You want the battery to be above at least 72°F at charge start to prevent the possibility of Li plating.
While it may be normal for this phone, you are beating the battery. It's been reported that high temperatures during fast charging can promote Li plating.
Cool it once it reaches 99F, with a fan and/or a damp microfiber cloth.
On my Samsung it will stop charging if it goes above about 102F. Samsung tends to be conservative with their charging parameters.
Not a bad thing as it lengthens battery lifespan and reduces the chances of a thermal runaway event.

GranoTurc00 said:
Thats normal if you use the included 33W charger, the battery naturally heats up while charging, the fatest you charge the battery the more heat it produces. is always recommended to not heavily use the phone while in charge. just for the sake of doubt you can try use a 5W charger and see if it heats up while charging slowly, (it should be hot just a little).
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I'll try this with my Poco F1 charger and let you know what I find

Ambient here is
blackhawk said:
What's the ambient temperature?
Is it fast charging? Which typically produces a,fair amount of waste heat.
If it's start temperature is 99F it will climb into the triple digits.
You want the battery to be above at least 72°F at charge start to prevent the possibility of Li plating.
While it may be normal for this phone, you are beating the battery. It's been reported that high temperatures during fast charging can promote Li plating.
Cool it once it reaches 99F, with a fan and/or a damp microfiber cloth.
On my Samsung it will stop charging if it goes above about 102F. Samsung tends to be conservative with their charging parameters.
Not a bad thing as it lengthens battery lifespan and reduces the chances of a thermal runaway event.
Click to expand...
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Ambient here is 86 Fahrenheit and above. While charging the phone, I don't even use it. I just put it face down on the screen so that the heat dissipation is faster from the back surface. But still it reaches those temperatures and is making me doubt the QC process of Xiaomi in this case.

TweaknFreak said:
Ambient here is
Ambient here is 86 Fahrenheit and above. While charging the phone, I don't even use it. I just put it face down on the screen so that the heat dissipation is faster from the back surface. But still it reaches those temperatures and is making me doubt the QC process of Xiaomi in this case.
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It may dissipates more heat through the display.
Never use a phone while charging as it skews the charge cycle parameters.
Simply cool as I described or don't use fast charging.
You can also use partial charge cycles like 40-60%. That's also part of the range the battery pulls high current and heats up.
If I see my battery temp climb above 100F I will stop the charge and hit it up a little latter.
For my Samsung the optimum battery temp range for fast charging is 85-100F. Outside of that range fast charging may not always engage or stay engaged. However in that ambient temperature range I need to some form of cooling when fast charging if I want to maintain a temperature under 100F.
Always keep an eye open for case swelling which indicates a battery failure. Replace it immediately if that happens.
It becomes more likely as the battery ages or if exposed to temperature/current extremes. I just replaced a failed battery at the 1.5 year mark on my Note 10+.
Fun, isn't it

I just checked the charging with my Poco F1 charger which is 18W. The portion just below the camera module heats up the most. And the temperature between charging with the 33W charger and 18W poco charger are same. At least that's what Accubattery says. I'm replacing this device for sure, let's see how the replacement device works out.

TweaknFreak said:
I just checked the charging with my Poco F1 charger which is 18W. The portion just below the camera module heats up the most. And the temperature between charging with the 33W charger and 18W poco charger are same. At least that's what Accubattery says. I'm replacing this device for sure, let's see how the replacement device works out.
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If the temperature is the same than it's not fast charging. Fast charging generates much more heat however even while it's enable the charge rates vary due to temperature, charge state and battery condition.
For instance between 80-100% the charge rates will be about the same. This may start as low as at 70% or even lower if the charging parameters aren't optimum.
The easiest way to tell is with an app like Accubattery. Put it on the charge page then use the power button to turn off the screen. Start charging. You have about a second if you turn the screen on to see the screen off charging milliamp figure. The charging log also tells what was happening but not when it happened in the charging cycle.
At maximum rate mine tops out at around 5200 ma using a 25 w brick. It varies between 1700- 5200 until it starts ramping down as the cell nears a full charge.
Nearing 90-100% it may be 800 ma or lower.

blackhawk said:
If the temperature is the same than it's not fast charging. Fast charging generates much more heat however even while it's enable the charge rates vary due to temperature, charge state and battery condition.
For instance between 80-100% the charge rates will be about the same. This may start as low as at 70% or even lower if the charging parameters aren't optimum.
The easiest way to tell is with an app like Accubattery. Put it on the charge page then use the power button to turn off the screen. Start charging. You have about a second if you turn the screen on to see the screen off charging milliamp figure. The charging log also tells what was happening but not when it happened in the charging cycle.
At maximum rate mine tops out at around 5200 ma using a 25 w brick. It varies between 1700- 5200 until it starts ramping down as the cell nears a full charge.
Nearing 90-100% it may be 800 ma or lower.
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Click to collapse
But 45 degrees Celsius is not normal for a new device dont you think? I mean if it was 65W charging I'd say maybe it can get a little toasty but for 33W I'm sceptical.

TweaknFreak said:
But 45 degrees Celsius is not normal for a new device dont you think? I mean if it was 65W charging I'd say maybe it can get a little toasty but for 33W I'm sceptical.
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If that's the battery temp, it's high. The CPU can easily run beyond that though.
If the whole phone feels hot you got issues.

blackhawk said:
If that's the battery temp, it's high. The CPU can easily run beyond that though.
If the whole phone feels hot you got issues.
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It's generally the back portion of the phone specially the part below the camera module. I'm getting the device replaced tomorrow. Let's see what happens