Hi,
My name is Dragos and I'm the founder and senior designer of Viiwok, a startup which builds VR adapters and controllers.
More specifically we're currently in the final testing rounds of the first mobile HMD in the world. It's basically a hybrid tablet adapter with integrated, discrete headtracking sensors (as in not using the tablet's gyro/accelerometer sensors).
What it does is letting you slide in any 7" tablet and wirelessly displaying stereographic 3D video feed from the computer. It's basically a mobile Oculus Rift and a future proof product as well, since we're not constrained of resolution and hardware issues - because you can always use the latest and most powerful tablet at your disposal. The headtracking has basically zero latency and the FOV is about 120 degrees, using specially designed aspheric lenses with a 2" diameter for each eye. Besides native 3D support in certain titles (Crytek titles made with Cryengine, DOOM 3 BFG, etc.), we can also use TriDef for realtime side-by-side 3D rendering of currently unsupported games.
While gaming is our main scope, the HMD could be also used for virtual tourism and landscaping, in medicine (disabled or severely handicapped persons) or CAD design. Our next project to be launched is an omnidirectional treadmill which detects your body movements in real time (walking, jumping, crouching), much like a Kinnect, but without the back-facing and latency constraints.
Right now we're using Gamepad THD and Kainy for the video feed, but also Limelight for native Shield streaming ( http://forum.xda-developers.com/show...505510&page=15 ) while also developing our own video streaming solution in house.
REMOVED
Here are a couple of pictures with the 3D printed prototype. Of course, the final design will be much more streamlined and ergonomic.
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What is this?
Inviato dal mio GT-N7100 utilizzando Tapatalk
marco9797 said:
What is this?
Inviato dal mio GT-N7100 utilizzando Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's a head mounted, 3D display. You can stream games to it from the PC and see them in 3D. For virtual reality applications and games.
Attreyu said:
It's a head mounted, 3D display. You can stream games to it from the PC and see them in 3D. For virtual reality applications and games.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do i need a great powered PC for this? Can i find It on Amazon?
Inviato dal mio GT-N7100 utilizzando Tapatalk
marco9797 said:
Do i need a great powered PC for this? Can i find It on Amazon?
Inviato dal mio GT-N7100 utilizzando Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You need a good wifi connection (802.11n) and a medium-to-high computer. An Nvidia Kepler GPU is fine.
Basically, if you can play your games now, you don't need a new computer for the Deva HMD.
The HMD only receives the video-feed from the computer. You need a 7" tablet with 802.11n Wifi and a nice GPU (Tegra 3, Qualcomm 600/800, etc.).
No offense friend but I wouldnt want to put that scary thing on my head.
haha :laugh: fair enough. Would you put an Oculus Rift to your head ?
Attreyu said:
You need a good wifi connection (802.11n) and a medium-to-high computer. An Nvidia Kepler GPU is fine.
Basically, if you can play your games now, you don't need a new computer for the Deva HMD.
The HMD only receives the video-feed from the computer. You need a 7" tablet with 802.11n Wifi and a nice GPU (Tegra 3, Qualcomm 600/800, etc.).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i haven't enough money for an nvidia kepler in my notebook there is a gt 520m ;so can i try also with a tablet or smartphone?
i have a note 2 but it has mali 400 mp and i don't know if is enough great powered for this...
i and my family are going to buy an ipad air for christmas... Can i try with that?Is there any app? For the power i think that the ipad has the best gpu for the mobile,i believe also now is faster than xbox 360 and play 3.
Attreyu said:
haha :laugh: fair enough. Would you put an Oculus Rift to your head ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hell no ))) I wouldnt want to put anything on my head even Google Glass which is overrated for that price tag I think. I mean if it would look like regular Sun Glasses without some thingy that looks like Universal Soldier ))) Maybe I would put it on. And as for is it Enough to have Decent Tablet? Well depends if you want to play Chilidish Android games, which have bad graphics compared to PS3 or XBOX or PC, due to the Lack of DX and OpenGL then you are all set ) but I think its better to wait till TEGRA5 Devices DX11 support full OpenGL and 6 times faster than PS3 GPU... But you have to wait till Summer 2014 and for some games that will be made for that Architecture ( So I wouldnt rush to any new Tablet right now, unless of course your budget is big enough to afford buying a newest tablet every 6 month )
I can certainly say this won't be "the first" HMD using a mobile device. I know VRase has demoed units at various conventions/conferences and has some (supposed) VR industry connections. It had a successful kickstarter, but now we are waiting on the actual commercial units. They are promising they will look better than their 3D printed prototypes (which weren't that bad).
Still, more competition in this market is good. The problem is getting content to render in SbS format (Side by Side). Especially for pre-existing mobile games, less difficult for streamed desktop stuff (easy to tell GPU how to do special render cases through injection or driver manipulation).
Funding links removed
ryocoon said:
I can certainly say this won't be "the first" HMD using a mobile device. I know VRase has demoed units at various conventions/conferences and has some (supposed) VR industry connections. It had a successful kickstarter, but now we are waiting on the actual commercial units. They are promising they will look better than their 3D printed prototypes (which weren't that bad).
Still, more competition in this market is good. The problem is getting content to render in SbS format (Side by Side). Especially for pre-existing mobile games, less difficult for streamed desktop stuff (easy to tell GPU how to do special render cases through injection or driver manipulation).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't call Vrase a HMD, they're in a totally different ballpark. Vrase is just an adapter for smartphones. They aren't intended for VR and gaming, the smartphones have screens too small for the needed FOV, and they don't have integrated sensors, meaning you must use FreePie or other 3rd party 6DOF solution. You could use Vrase for basic SBS movie watching and AR (to some extent).
I know because they're spanish, like us. They're our colleagues but they aren't aiming in the same direction. They're more orrientated towards the casual user (movies, leisure), we're going for the gaming part.
Which leads me to your second preocupations, SBS mobile gaming. AFAIK there aren't many mobile shooters worth their salt at the moment, because the cappabilities are not here. Mobile GPUs are weak still, and untill this summer when Logan makes its appearance, we're going to stick to PC streaming.
Things will change, and will change fast in this VR/mobile gaming sector, and our belief is that our product is prepared to help you fill the gap.
Attreyu said:
I wouldn't call Vrase a HMD, they're in a totally different ballpark. Vrase is just an adapter for smartphones. They aren't intended for VR and gaming, the smartphones have screens too small for the needed FOV, and they don't have integrated sensors, meaning you must use FreePie or other 3rd party 6DOF solution. You could use Vrase for basic SBS movie watching and AR (to some extent).
I know because they're spanish, like us. They're our colleagues but they aren't aiming in the same direction. They're more orrientated towards the casual user (movies, leisure), we're going for the gaming part.
Which leads me to your second preocupations, SBS mobile gaming. AFAIK there aren't many mobile shooters worth their salt at the moment, because the cappabilities are not here. Mobile GPUs are weak still, and untill this summer when Logan makes its appearance, we're going to stick to PC streaming.
Things will change, and will change fast in this VR/mobile gaming sector, and our belief is that our product is prepared to help you fill the gap.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay... wait. You say that this is an HMD, but VRase isn't due to the fact you need to use a phone screen. When clearly the difference for yours appears to be (at first glance) that you use a 7" tablet. I get that you have some integrated high-precision sensors, which obviously you wouldn't have if you were using VRase. Even using a simple solution like VRase you can do similar things with that. Yes, you can watch SBS formatted movies. You could also use software to request a GPU to render 3D in SBS and then connect using Splashtop, Kainy, LimeLight, etc. You would be correct in that it wouldn't have head-tracking though (at least not without extra 3rd party sensors or using some software to forward the laggy/innaccurate sensors from the phone/tablet gyros or accelerometers). Still, both end up being Head Mounted Displays, whether they have frills or not.
I truly do wish for you to prove me wrong. If information is available for public consumption, what differentiates your product from others existing in the market? Is it basically just similar to Occulus Rift, but with a wirelessly connected screen powered by a 7 inch tablet (and thereby... upgradeable)? Do you plan to push for public availability prior to commercial release of the Rift?
I get you and agree that mobile gaming horsepower really isn't quite there yet, and the content _REALLY_ isn't there. There are maybe six or so competent shooters out there that were originally programmed for mobile (IE: not counting Quake recodes). As an aside, I do wonder if there a way to runtime modify OpenGL ES calls to force SBS rendering in such apps. I know ChainFire managed to have a Root-required piece of software that allowed for platform specific (Tegra-only, Adreno-only, etc) optimized games to run pretty well on other chipsets. However, that is neither here nor there.
ryocoon said:
Okay... wait. You say that this is an HMD, but VRase isn't due to the fact you need to use a phone screen. When clearly the difference for yours appears to be (at first glance) that you use a 7" tablet. I get that you have some integrated high-precision sensors, which obviously you wouldn't have if you were using VRase. Even using a simple solution like VRase you can do similar things with that. Yes, you can watch SBS formatted movies. You could also use software to request a GPU to render 3D in SBS and then connect using Splashtop, Kainy, LimeLight, etc. You would be correct in that it wouldn't have head-tracking though (at least not without extra 3rd party sensors or using some software to forward the laggy/innaccurate sensors from the phone/tablet gyros or accelerometers). Still, both end up being Head Mounted Displays, whether they have frills or not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey, I'm not trying to enter an argumente here with you man If you consider the two similar enough, fair play. They are, in more ways than one. The differences are subtle enough for the average user - size, scope, sensors, etc. As I said before, Vrase is for the casual user, our product would be more towards gaiming.
ryocoon said:
I truly do wish for you to prove me wrong. If information is available for public consumption, what differentiates your product from others existing in the market? Is it basically just similar to Occulus Rift, but with a wirelessly connected screen powered by a 7 inch tablet (and thereby... upgradeable)? Do you plan to push for public availability prior to commercial release of the Rift?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have to take into consideration that the "market" for these products is very much in its infancy. You have the Oculus Rift and then you have the others (Vrase, Durovis Dive, InfiniteEye, Viiwok Deva) which are adapters by all means. Our goal is to achieve full mobility, without that tangled mess. So there are about 4-5 products, out of which only the Rift is out (even though there isn't a commercial version yet) and the Vrase just finished its Kickstarter a couple of months ago. So there isn't much of a competetion between ourselfes. We're all just trying to push VR out in the open.
Yes, we are going to start a crowdfunding campaign this weekend, with delivery starting in April.
ryocoon said:
I get you and agree that mobile gaming horsepower really isn't quite there yet, and the content _REALLY_ isn't there. There are maybe six or so competent shooters out there that were originally programmed for mobile (IE: not counting Quake recodes). As an aside, I do wonder if there a way to runtime modify OpenGL ES calls to force SBS rendering in such apps. I know ChainFire managed to have a Root-required piece of software that allowed for platform specific (Tegra-only, Adreno-only, etc) optimized games to run pretty well on other chipsets. However, that is neither here nor there.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I totally agree. Mobile SBS gaming isn't here now, and one can only hope for things to change this year. Maybe products like ours will help push things in that direction. Android exclusive content is made of movies and a number of tech-demos here and there (most from Durovis, using Unity engine). So we're focusing to PC titles for the moment, going the streaming way.
If you want to discuss your project, that is fine. But links to funding projects are not allowed.
Thank you for your cooperation
Friendly Neighborhood Senior Moderator
And as this section is for the Nvidia shield it does not belong here.
Best fit will probably be Accessories
Thread moved
Related
My History with devices, my favourite of all time being the Dell X50V, I have been through HTC diamonds, Touch HD 1 and 2 and the oldest being the casio 500 and the fujitsu loox 600.
At present I am in the land of Iphone...
I am tempted by the HTC Desire as I see it seems similar to the old Windows mobile enviroment, but looks more stable and has a similar app store to the Iphone, with the ability to customise, here are my questions:
1) Are there any good Bird guides on Android ?
2) Are there any OSUK mapping applications on Android ?
3) Can you play 3D games on the Desire like you can the Iphone ?
4) Is the screen easily readable outside on the Desire ?
5) Do you have to constantly tweak the system to make the Desire stable ?
6) Are there any Runners applications on Android ?
THUDUK said:
1) Are there any good Bird guides on Android ?
2) Are there any OSUK mapping applications on Android ?
3) Can you play 3D games on the Desire like you can the Iphone ?
4) Is the screen easily readable outside on the Desire ?
5) Do you have to constantly tweak the system to make the Desire stable ?
6) Are there any Runners applications on Android ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure, sorry
Yes, check out "OS Map"
Yes
Mostly, but in strong direct sunlight it's almost useless.
No, not at all.
Yes, don't know if they're any good however
I am in the process of moving from HTC Desire back to iPhone.
I love the Desire but I have friends and my girlfriend who are all now on iPhone.
I have loads of paids apps as well which I feel like I have wasted money on so I want to move back.
I am just looking for someone who would like to swap from iPhone and go to Android.
It seems OSmaps for Android will not cache or allow you to use your own Memory Map/OSUK map tiles, you have to be connected to the Internet to use, this is absolutely usless when out for a walk.
3D gaming has its problems especially Gamelofts Real soccer you can't press both run and shoot at the same time, also it seems there is a complete lack of decent 3D games apart from the few Gameloft ones, and there is no news of them developing further for Android now that they are concentrating on Ipad and Iphone OS4.
Also have read lots of reviews stating the screen on the desire is next to useless outside.
There are about three or four good bird guides on the Iphone, two good ones on Windows mobile and none for Android
Seems running applications are covered well on Android about the same amount as Iphone ones...
So conclusion, I thought I would get more help on this forum, thanks to the one reply who did, unless someone can prove my above comments wrong and supply info I shall be sticking to Iphone.
gvSIG Mini apparently allows you to create a local cache of maps.
Regards,
Dave
There is a Bird guide detailing the top 50 most common British Garden birds, called BirdsUK, there are more detailed apps for American birds.
My favourate 3d games are Lets Golf, Carrom 3d and Raging Thunder, but its true that multi touch gaming doesn't work well on the Desire as the screen is not full multi touch capable. The above 3 games are more than enough to occupy me and have very good graphics. But if multitouch gaming is really important you might want to look at a device like the Galaxy S, or even dare I say it the IPhone 4 if you really want the top of the line 3D games.
There are several apps that allow cached map tile use, though not an expert on them and not sure how easy it would be to use Ordnance Survey maps with them.
Foxmeister mentioned gvSig, and just found this article http://www.eurodroid.com/2010/05/get-ordnance-survey-maps-on-android-with-gvsig-mini-map-viewer/
Liam
Thanks Liam very helpful, looks like I will be sticking with the Iphone for now.
gvSIG only seems to support OS vector based tiles, not the more useful maps that show public footpaths etc, doh. Will email that about that if they have a contact address.
Update: They say they will add support for the Raster based OS Map is the next week or two.
Hi,
gvSIG Mini currently supports Ordnance Survey rendered tiles. Next version will support OS OpenSpace tiles API
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If you like Dell id say go with the dell streak. If you don't mind the size. Id love it.
alrocar said:
Hi,
gvSIG Mini currently supports Ordnance Survey rendered tiles. Next version will support OS OpenSpace tiles API
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is the level of detail I am after
400 sqkm OS Landranger 1:50,000
100 sqkm OS Explorer 1:25,000 )shown below
I use RunGPS (which I had on WM), which tracks online too for running, works very very well on Droid. It's actually an app thats NOT available on iPhone they do exist! But there are other running/tracking GPS programs out there. It doesn't look the best, but it works, and works VERY VERY well! (Just looking for a blue tooth heart rate monitor too for it!)
WOW...gunja99, I used to use this on my Windows mobile devices, in fact this was one reason I put off going over to the iphone, I clocked up so many running miles with this application, really didn't know they did a version for Android. I currently use Runkeeper on the Iphone its OK, in fact pretty good really but not a patch on RUN.gps.
hmm now you have me thinking...
So if the OSUK maps can get sorted, the bird guides really need to be better than the BirdsUK posted earlier, you can get this for the Iphone it only has about 50 out of the near on 500 species of UK bird.
3D gaming seems to be heading the kind of right direction, never going to be as good as the iphone I don't think, but could live with some decent games.
it pains me to say it - but the biggest problem with android are the apps
sure there are some very good apps out there but the general quality of apps on android at the moment are far far behind the iphone, I fired up my ipod touch again just a few days ago after it sitting on a shelf for months and these were my thoughts.... (oh pants = awful)
the touch's screen vs the desire's screen is pants
iphone os vs android is pants
the touch's interface vs android (stock or sense) is pants
BUT android's apps are 10 x pants compared to iphone apps (in general fellas)
in fact, I am considering an iphone4. I have no loyalty to any platform, whichever I "like" the best, I go with. Android is badly lacking in apps now and I'm not seeing how it's gonna catch up. Although I really hope it does.
Maybe some quality devs instead of the plethora of "I spend the morning learning some java and managed to cobble together a lame "app" with absolutely no graphical design whatsoever, if I put it on the market and charge 0.99 I'll be rich come the summer holidays" - and the painful amount of "me too" apps
So you may want to think carefully before ditching your iphone just yet!
Yes jmpmjmpm
This is why I was trying to find out what actual applications that I put high on my use list existed on Android.
The general quality and very low pricing of the Iphone apps is totally amazing.
OK I miss the UI, the screen may be better even though I love the iphones screen especially good outside. I miss the customisation, and OK the android may be superior on paper, but its those pesky applications, you just can't beat the Iphones applications.
THUDUK said:
you just can't beat the Iphones applications.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and there lies the dilemma...
it's a choice I'm fighting with at the moment after "seeing" the iPhone 4, I'm not sold yet, but I may be soon. That said, my Desire works and is very stable. Froyo brings a lot to the party and the unofficial roms are almost ready for primetime and you just can't underestimate the usefulness of true multitasking.
The Desire is a very well made bit of kit. The screen is a little "dim" in sunshine but I find it ok and usable, I don't think it's any worse than the screen on my touch (I think the screen on the touch is the same as iPhone?)
it's a very close call mate....... good luck!
All I can say is to try an android phone extensively before buying, I was not expecting the apps to be anywhere near as good as I was used to on my iPod touch, yet I was still disappointed at the state of third party apps. Same thing with games.
Obviously android has some big advantages, it just depends on what you rank most highly in importance.
Good news for HTC Playstation is coming to HTC phones now we get to play ps1 classic the proper way no links sorry just seen it on E3
shankly1985 said:
Good news for HTC Playstation is coming to HTC phones now we get to play ps1 classic the proper way no links sorry just seen it on E3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what about ps2 games?
hello00 said:
what about ps2 games?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good point am not sure, were getting what that sony phone has can that play ps2 games? (forgot the name of the phone)
shankly1985 said:
Good point am not sure, were getting what that sony phone has can that play ps2 games? (forgot the name of the phone)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
we wish but it isn't possible for now..there could be games with similar graphics as the ps2 games but thats as far as we can go..
hello00 said:
we wish but it isn't possible for now..there could be games with similar graphics as the ps2 games but thats as far as we can go..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not so sure about that, the Vita's hardware should be perfectly capable of emulating the PS2, especially when it's the original PS2 engineers writing the emulator! Hell, remember Bleem was capable of emulating the original PS1 on the dreamcast! The Vita is leagues beyond the dreamcasts capabilities.
As to the PlayStation Suite/Mobile SDK itself, if anyone is interested, I have created a series of tutorials that cover most parts of creating a basic game. If you know a bit of C#, check them out, it really is a nice programming environment.
ps2 emulation is difficult..bc the ps2s hardware is very unique and the synchronization of the cpu..the two vector units..the graphics synthesizer and the dma controller is hard to emulate.. bc they all depend on each other..
this is all pointless unless they give us a controller accessory IMO
I'm really at a loss why apple or goog hasn't released an official joypad grip, bluetooth + maybe chuck a battery in there, then official joypad APIs to hook into. At one stroke eviscerate the handheld market.
Yes there are 3rd party ones but they all only work with a handful of games. If Goog or apple did it officially then adoption would be much wider.
My Sony Tablet S for example pairs beautifully with a ps3 controller but I have a hard time finding anything that actually supports it (aside from, er, emulators ROFL 12 bucks for a PS1 game, FU sony lol)
Good news everybody!
scei.co.jp/corporate/release/120605e_e.html
Excuse me for not being able to post a proper link due to newbie restrictions.
HTC One X, S, V is Playstation Certified.
The license program to expand PS Mobile, dedicated for portable hardware manufacturers. SCE will not only license logos but also provide necessary development support. As of June 5, 2012, the line-up of PlayStation™Certified devices include the HTC One series of smartphones, HTC One™ X, HTC One™ S, and HTC One™ V. Content developed with official version of PlayStation®Mobile SDK will be available on those devices later this year, also Xperia™ arc, Xperia™ acro, Xperia™ PLAY, Xperia™ acro HD, Xperia™ S, Xperia™ ion, Xperia™ acro S from Sony Mobile Communications AB, and "Sony Tablet" S and "Sony Tablet" P from Sony Corporation. Model name may vary by region. Sales model may vary by area.. Software Development Kit is a set of development tools and software libraries. Developers are able to obtain this SDK by signing a license agreement with SCE.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNwiCZKK0cI
Serapth said:
I'm not so sure about that, the Vita's hardware should be perfectly capable of emulating the PS2, especially when it's the original PS2 engineers writing the emulator! Hell, remember Bleem was capable of emulating the original PS1 on the dreamcast! The Vita is leagues beyond the dreamcasts capabilities.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To this day I regret selling it
Regarding the certification....I guess it's good news.
I can already play PS1 games...PS Vita games would be intresting! Since the Vita uses Tegra 3 it should be possible. I couldn't care less about PS2 games if the Vita games would work
I would say definitely no ps vita games...since ps vita using stronger gpu which is powervr 543 and the processor inside vita is not tegra,it is ti omap
Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2
magic_moe_ said:
I can already play PS1 games...PS Vita games would be intresting! Since the Vita uses Tegra 3 it should be possible. I couldn't care less about PS2 games if the Vita games would work
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
vita is not using the t3
it has a uniquly built Quad A9/Quad PowerVR 543 GPU, the same GPU on the iPad3 but at a fraction of the pixel count
ie the vita is a monster that will not be matched anytime soon but i have to say the X does get close, especially considering it runs at a higher resolution
hamdir said:
vita is not using the t3
it has a uniquly built Quad A9/Quad PowerVR 543 GPU, the same GPU on the iPad3 but at a fraction of the pixel count
ie the vita is a monster that will not be matched anytime soon but i have to say the X does get close, especially considering it runs at a higher resolution
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The ARM Cortex-A9 MPCore is a 32-bit multicore processor providing up to 4 cache-coherent Cortex-A9 cores, each implementing the ARM v7 instruction set architecture.
The Tegra 3 is part of this Family, so it basicly uses the same core structure...same with iPad 3, which is called the A5X...not talking GPU here, I'm talking CPU...
source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_Cortex-A9_MPCore
booya
vita=monster? LOL
please...
magic_moe_ said:
The ARM Cortex-A9 MPCore is a 32-bit multicore processor providing up to 4 cache-coherent Cortex-A9 cores, each implementing the ARM v7 instruction set architecture.
The Tegra 3 is part of this Family, so it basicly uses the same core structure...same with iPad 3, which is called the A5X...not talking GPU here, I'm talking CPU...
source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_Cortex-A9_MPCore
booya
vita=monster? LOL
please...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you are not talking GPU? which is half the story when it comes to gaming? the topic in discussion? equally the memory controller and cache is a big part of the story which is different between all the device we are speaking of
and so
The "QUAD" GPU on the Vita, enhanced MP4+, contains 4 SIMDs per core so it's 16 SIMDs and it'ss feeding a 960 × 544 qHD panel
on the iPad3 its same GPU feeding a massive 2048×1536 HD panel
on Tegra3 the Geforce GPU is a single core 12 SIMDs chip and it's feeding a 1280x720p HD panel
That's enough to give you an idea which machine has much more GPU headroom
Finally a gaming console like the Vita doesn't carry the burden of a multi-tasking OS and instead most games are running at a lower level
lets not forget the MP4+ in the vita's GPU
It is included in the PlayStation Vita portable gaming device with the MP4+ Model of the PowerVR SGX543, the only intended difference, aside from the + indicating features customized for Sony
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
more info here
and here
hamdir said:
you are not talking GPU? which is half the story when it comes to gaming? the topic in discussion? equally the memory controller and cache is a big part of the story which is different between all the device we are speaking of
and so
The "QUAD" GPU on the Vita, contains 4 SIMDs per core so it's 16 SIMDs and it'ss feeding a 960 × 544 qHD panel
on the iPad3 its same GPU feeding a massive 2048×1536 HD panel
on Tegra3 the Geforce GPU is a single core 12 SIMDs chip and it's feeding a 1280x720p HD panel
That's enough to give you an idea which machine has much more GPU headroom
Finally a gaming console like the Vita doesn't carry the burden of a multi-tasking OS and instead most games are running at a lower level
lets not forget the MP4+ in the vita's GPU
more info here
and here
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First thing you got right. I'm not talking GPU
cant wait!
PlayStation Vita eschews Sony's previous policy of custom hardware and uses off-the-shelf mobile technology combined into a single processor: quad core ARM Cortex A9s (only three of which are available to games developers) are paired with a slightly enhanced version of the same PowerVR SGX543 4MP found in the new iPad.
Vita possesses several advantages over the iOS and Android platforms, however. Firstly, it services a much lower resolution: 960x544 vs the iPad 2's 1024x768 and its successor's 2048x1536. Secondly, 128MB of dedicated video RAM is attached, presumably with faster access and more bandwidth than the A5 and A5X chips in the iOS machines. Finally, and perhaps most crucially, Vita developers have complete access to the hardware at a much lower level thanks to an implementation of the same libgcm interface found in PlayStation 3, along with tools created by a team with years of experience in working exclusively on games development.
In essence, Vita offers us a glimpse into a world of mobile games development where creators have access to much more raw power concentrated into a smaller area of pixels, and the results are fascinating. Take Uncharted: Golden Abyss for example. It features state-of-the-art lighting technology - a variation of the deferred shading technique used in the PlayStation 3 Drake games, while motion capture is effectively on a par with current generation consoles. There are clearly some cutbacks in terms of polygon count and texture quality, and the lack of performance sapping transparency effects is telling, but on a mobile screen there's still very much the sensation that this is a full-fat console experience.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
id software's John Carmack has previously speculated that the direct interface with the hardware gives Vita a generational edge over other mobile devices using the same technology, but perhaps didn't consider that iPad's resolution would be increasing so dramatically. The contest here isn't just Vita native 960x544 vs. Retina 2048x1536 - several of Sony's titles actually run at 720x405, the technologically superb Uncharted: Golden Abyss amongst them. On a 5-inch screen, gamers are less likely to notice sub-native resolutions compared to the same trick being pulled on a 9.7-inch display.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Enter PowerVR "Rogue", the next generation of mobile GPU from British firm IMG. Insiders in the smartphone business tell me that it's the point at which graphics processing power in Xbox 360 is finally exceeded. Combined in SoCs with the new ARM Cortex-A15 and potentially we have a viable platform not just for more visually rich titles, but a new target for direct ports of existing 360/PS3 games. There are still issues in terms of bandwidth, memory speed etc, but I would expect mobile devices to have a great chance of at least matching Vita graphical performance within the next 12 months.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/digitalfoundry-the-quest-for-console-quality-mobile-graphics
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Heres the current Playstation Mobile Family. the Pictures of HTC phones running content at the bottom from E3.
Zero gravity is not A PS1 or PS2 game its a PS-M game but is running on the HTC and vita...
not bad as PS-M SDK is still in beta..
shankly1985 said:
Heres the current Playstation Mobile Family. the Pictures of HTC phones running content at the bottom from E3.
Zero gravity is not A PS1 or PS2 game its a PS-M game but is running on the HTC and vita...
not bad as PS-M SDK is still in beta..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what do you mean PS-M? got a link for zero gravity?
A couple of days ago, nVidia presented their new portable gaming device alongside one particular feature. The ability to stream PC games via cloud and from a nVidia powered PC with GFE (equipped with at least kepler Ge Force GTX 650) to any device able to have their Grid client.
This is nothing more than the evolution of what Splashtop brought (with nVidia sponsorship) on CES 2012 (confirmed by nVidia Italy itself on Facebook).
Now during the conference it was stated that the client would have reached every android device (not only Tegra ones nor Project shield) and in the next days some hands-on with different "non-shield" devices were recorded.
Finally also the one recorded on Nexus 7 landed (cortesy of Droid-Life)
here it is:
I honestly think that if there will be the option to customize controls other than the only gamepad, the Nexus 7 could be even a better device that the shield itself for this kind of gaming (even if it lacks the Tegra 4 SoC). Furthermore it will surely be a great boost for android gaming in general (thanks to the direct support of nVidia and their money / partners- compared to the influence of Splashtop Inc.). The staff of the Tegra page on FB confirmed me that Grid (that I intend in its incarnation of both LAN (via GFE) / internet streaming (via third party partners)) will have a different timetable than Project Shield, so I think we'll have the opportunity to enjoy this feature sooner than the release of Shield (maybe at the same time with the announcement of the Nexus 7 successor @ Google I/O or even sooner with an open bea :laugh
SimoxTav said:
A couple of days ago, nVidia presented their new portable gaming device alongside one particular feature. The ability to stream PC games via cloud and from a nVidia powered PC with GFE (equipped with at least kepler Ge Force GTX 650) to any device able to have their Grid client.
This is nothing more than the evolution of what Splashtop brought (with nVidia sponsorship) on CES 2012 (confirmed by nVidia Italy itself on Facebook).
Now during the conference it was stated that the client would have reached every android device (not only Tegra ones nor Project shield) and in the next days some hands-on with different "non-shield" devices were recorded.
Finally also the one recorded on Nexus 7 landed (cortesy of Droid-Life)
here it is:
I honestly think that if there will be the option to customize controls other than the only gamepad, the Nexus 7 could be even a better device that the shield itself for this kind of gaming (even if it lacks the Tegra 4 SoC). Furthermore it will surely be a great boost for android gaming in general (thanks to the direct support of nVidia and their money / partners- compared to the influence of Splashtop Inc.). The staff of the Tegra page on FB confirmed me that Grid (that I intend in its incarnation of both LAN (via GFE) / internet streaming (via third party partners)) will have a different timetable than Project Shield, so I think we'll have the opportunity to enjoy this feature sooner than the release of Shield (maybe at the same time with the announcement of the Nexus 7 successor @ Google I/O or even sooner with an open bea :laugh
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I used splashtop thd and I was able to play any game even just cause 2 just from streaming from my gaming computer. It worked perfectly fine on my N7 I don't see any reason why I would buy a device like this when I already own a device that can do the same thing.
Sent from my LG-C729 using xda app-developers app
Splashtop?
What's that?
And is OnLive working with N7?
AFAinHD said:
I used splashtop thd and I was able to play any game even just cause 2 just from streaming from my gaming computer. It worked perfectly fine on my N7 I don't see any reason why I would buy a device like this when I already own a device that can do the same thing.
Sent from my LG-C729 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Indeed, with the move from nVidia to make the technology available to all android devices, the only benefit compared to Splashtop THD is that the application will be directly supported from nVidia (that is not a startup nor currently involved with iOS).
It wasn't a topic about nVidia Shield but about nVidia Grid (that are 2 different projects with their own roadmap, simple shown together during the conference)
However Splashtop is lacking in the support of their app (several critical bugs are more than 1y old) (p.e. I had to tweak an XML profile via text editor to fix the mouse flickering issue in their app) and they have also to develop the iOS "traditional" version that it's surely more profitable for them than the THD one (in fact talking to their support center their confirmed that are short on resources to fix those bugs in short times).
Furthermore nVidia Grid will be probably free on LAN side (so potentially better than Splashtop), but it will be also available via 3G and 4G/LTE (but the service will be provided by third party owned Grid Server Farm). A feature that Splashtop simply doesn't have
Fatal1ty_18_RUS said:
Splashtop?
What's that?
And is OnLive working with N7?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I will semplify:
Splashtop = Remote desktop gaming via LAN streaming YOUR OWN hardware (Google Play)
Onlive (as you know) is the same thing of splashtop on the "internet" and is offered as a service with THEIR hardware (is currently in bankrupt due the expensive architecture, a technical problem solved by nVidia Grid with virtualization).
nVidia Grid will be BOTH (for the LAN side supported directly via nVidia through their Geforce Experience Program and for the "Internet" side provided by third party like Playcast)
For OnLive for N7 the device isn't officially supported, but IMHO it should work
The question is - will Grid work on N7/N10/current top tablets?
Or is it going to be Tegra 4-exclusive?
To me...YES!
Fatal1ty_18_RUS said:
The question is - will Grid work on N7/N10/current top tablets?
Or is it going to be Tegra 4-exclusive?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Grid (for its "internet/cloud" side) for sure, was declared during the conference ((link, look from 0:24:00) and was also shown there (even if in a limited environment having the rack next to the devices and not "on the internet"). To see other devices running it there is the video in the opening post and several other hands on showing it running on N7, HTC X and LG Smart TVs.
Grid (-or whatever it's called- for its "LAN" side, basically the evolution of Splashtop THD streamer) is currently promoted only on the Shield Project page but considering that is the same H.264 compressed stream that travel from a server to a client but in a local environment, if it can works on internet, why shouldn't work on local? If what Mr Huang said ("as long as you have a mobile processor able to manage h.264 you can run grid) is true, directly from nVidia or from someone that extract the APK, we'll easily have the client.
On the server side everything is needed is a GeForce GPU (at least GTX650) and the GeForce Experience Program, so no particular gimmicks.
Seeing Splashtop THD running smoothly on N7 is enough to state that the hardware is powerful enough to handle it (as long as we're speaking on internal screen (so 720p) and i'd say up to 1080p (even if Splashtop doesn't support on its THD version). Probably 4K screens and concurrent miracast streaming to both the devices will be an exclusive for the power of T4 (and with a very good wireless repeater i'd say), but without a video output option on the N7 is not our scenario at all
I don't see much point of using 4K HDTV's with a tablet to run a gaming streaming program. It's much easier to just play on a console or connect your gaming PC to a HDTV and use it as a monitor to utilize the power potential and play graphics-heavy things like Crysis in the resolution it was meant to be played
Fatal1ty_18_RUS said:
I don't see much point of using 4K HDTV's with a tablet to run a gaming streaming program. It's much easier to just play on a console or connect your gaming PC to a HDTV and use it as a monitor to utilize the power potential and play graphics-heavy things like Crysis in the resolution it was meant to be played
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I completely agree. Furthermore, talking about raw numbers, accordingly to this a streaming of an H.264 720p video (in high quality)@ 30fps, takes about 6Mbit/s that is currently a bandwidth available even on a good G router (and on several mobile providers). Considering the target of 60 fps we will need a surely at least a N router to avoid hiccups during the stream. However, rising the resolution to 4k the bandwidth needed for 60fps is about 70mbit/s that is simply insane to reach completely wireless if not sitting next to the PC and the router (as always seen in all the presentations) or having a real powerful dual band router...So to me the streaming makes sense only on portable devices up to 1080p. Above there are surely other solutions
SimoxTav said:
I completely agree. Furthermore, talking about raw numbers, accordingly to this a streaming of an H.264 720p video (in high quality)@ 30fps, takes about 6Mbit/s that is currently a bandwidth available even on a good G router (and on several mobile providers). Considering the target of 60 fps we will need a surely at least a N router to avoid hiccups during the stream. However, rising the resolution to 4k the bandwidth needed for 60fps is about 70mbit/s that is simply insane to reach completely wireless if not sitting next to the PC and the router (as always seen in all the presentations) or having a real powerful dual band router...So to me the streaming makes sense only on portable devices up to 1080p. Above there are surely other solutions
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So, as I understand, to use Grid you must not only have a more or less fast Wi-Fi connection (or mobile network if it allows it), but also have a device powerful enough to decode the picture being streamed from the server/your PC, right?
I've seen a couple of vids with the above-mentioned Splashtop GamePad THD - and it runs with noticeably less framerate than it does on the PC that the app was demonstated with
It's kinda strange though, because unlike Grid and Splashtop - the OnLive required to have only a fast enough internet connection which bandwith would allow to process the stream from the server, and the technology didn't require you to have a powerful hardware, meaning that you could even run things like Battlefiled 3 with maximum quality on a 5 year old PC
So why did NVidia decie to go the other way around?
Fatal1ty_18_RUS said:
So, as I understand, to use Grid you must not only have a more or less fast Wi-Fi connection (or mobile network if it allows it), but also have a device powerful enough to decode the picture being streamed from the server/your PC, right?
I've seen a couple of vids with the above-mentioned Splashtop GamePad THD - and it runs with noticeably less framerate than it does on the PC that the app was demonstated with
It's kinda strange though, because unlike Grid and Splashtop - the OnLive required to have only a fast enough internet connection which bandwith would allow to process the stream from the server, and the technology didn't require you to have a powerful hardware, meaning that you could even run things like Battlefiled 3 with maximum quality on a 5 year old PC
So why did NVidia decie to go the other way around?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
More or less every device today is able to manage (encode/decode) a H.264 stream so basically the "requirements" for the client device are not so strict (I'd say similar to OnLive indeed. Consider that having a compressed stream means less bandwidth used, on the other hand a decent CPU is needed to handle the task). The main difference is about that the THD version is specifically optimized to use one core of Tegra 3 just for the decoding process. Talking about the framerate of splashtop, I'll measure it somehow (I need the GF reflex but i'll try with a phone ), however I never noticed so much difference between the 2 devices (assuming that I have an intel core-i5 + GTX 670 and a DGND3700).
To be completely honest, however, I didn't even noticed a difference between the THD version and the "Splashtop 2 version on the nexus 7 (Splashtop 2 is free so is worth a try and compatible with a wide range of devices).
May I ask you to link the video you watched to see if the different framerate could be relevant to some particular environment?
SimoxTav said:
May I ask you to link the video you watched to see if the different framerate could be relevant to some particular environment?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I watched this video, the official one from Splashtop YouTube channel:
You can easily notice that even streaming a movie lacks the framerate compared to the original shown on the PC
Fatal1ty_18_RUS said:
I watched this video, the official one from Splashtop YouTube channel:
...cut...
You can easily notice that even streaming a movie lacks the framerate compared to the original shown on the PC
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah I'd say the difference is crystal clear. Probably for Grid/Project Shield they improved their codec to grant a smoother output (nVidia Italy said something related to it on Facebook (Link)
Quanto mostrato è una evoluzione di questa tecnologia, ancora a livello prototipale, quindi purtroppo non siamo in grado di risponderti con precisione, non essendo neppure noi a conoscenza dei dettagli
Translated:
As shown is an evolution of this technology (Note: Splashtop), still at prototype level, so unfortunately we are unable to answer precisely, since neither are we aware of the details
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I recorded on the fly a video for BF3, both server and client are connected via wifi (this isn't the optimal scenario but due the distance I can't move the desktop around the house). Talking about numbers there are no excuses and even on side by side comparison the difference is noticeable; however taken each one singly, the experience is IMHO enjoyable). Tomorrow I'll try with Splashtop 2 the same test (that one comes from a different developing branch, more recent than THD so maybe there will be improvements)
Video
FYI:
I used the render.drawfps call on BF3 (embedded in the engine) and FPS Meter on Android so was easy to see their framerates side by side. On PC the game is configured on Ultra with Vsync so no more than 60fps.
Does the in-game graphics setting have an influence on the framerate of the streamed picture?
Fatal1ty_18_RUS said:
Does the in-game graphics setting have an influence on the framerate of the streamed picture?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For this i quote what Eurogamer stated during the faceoff between OnLive and Gaikai (that should be based on Grid servers) (Source)
Improved visual quality server-side also has ramifications for video compression. Hard edges with no anti-aliasing will be harder to encode than a richer, smoother picture derived from the game running on higher graphics settings - after all, these video compressors were designed with real life footage in mind, not raw game visuals.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So better compression means lower bandwidth, however the framerate of both the stream and the server play a big role.
Basically, fewer unique frames (60FPS) means less work for the compressor to deal with when encoding the video stream. From another perspective, dropping down to 30FPS also provides double the amount of bandwidth for image quality and thus delivers overall clarity closer to the experience of gaming on local hardware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
IMO 30FPS is mostly enough, though for fast paced racing and fighting games 60FPS is a must. Especially for fightings.
I believe that if we use a game with less graphics-heavy vicuals - then the stream should be pretty smooth, right?
Like, let's say, games like Diablo II, StarCraft, WarCraft III and Trackmania/Trackmania: Sunrise should work pretty nice
Fatal1ty_18_RUS said:
IMO 30FPS is mostly enough, though for fast paced racing and fighting games 60FPS is a must. Especially for fightings.
I believe that if we use a game with less graphics-heavy vicuals - then the stream should be pretty smooth, right?
Like, let's say, games like Diablo II, StarCraft, WarCraft III and Trackmania/Trackmania: Sunrise should work pretty nice
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, but more than graphics visuals details, their fast pace gameplay is the worst for this kind of technology.
However it seems that with grid the performance are clearly better
Did they specify if this was going to be a monthly subscription type deal or a pay for the games and what not like onlive?
ÜBER™ said:
Did they specify if this was going to be a monthly subscription type deal or a pay for the games and what not like onlive?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think that NVidia can afford to run a service like this (imagine how much resources they need to provide this streaming, especially in a perfect state)
Look at what happened to OnLive
So probably it's gonna be, like, 10-15$ a month or so, not too much (like if you'd rent a game from a shop like GameStop or such) and multiplied by the number of NVidia-powered devices (including phones, tablets and computers/notebooks/etc) - it's gonna bring some $$$ for the company
ÜBER™ said:
Did they specify if this was going to be a monthly subscription type deal or a pay for the games and what not like onlive?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Their GRID architecture for cloud will be sold to third parties (Playcast, Ubitus, etc) and nVidia will not provide its own service directly. However talking on the LAN side of the application, it should be promoted and supported directly by nVidia (even if for now is shown as a "Shield only" feature) but I expect to see it at least on "all" Tegra devices (due the fact that if the service can work on the cloud, make it working on LAN is surely easier.
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Thread for those who are interested in Archos 97 Titanium HD.
Got my device about two weeks ago and I'm really impressed with this Archos tablet. It's probably the first on the market to offer iPad like Retina screen and first Archos tablet that's is pretty pleasant to use, because Android 4.1 at lats runs pretty decent, fast and smooth.
Hi i have the same tablet, i look at the video and there are running a game like gta, in my google play, they aren't this app because it is uncompatible with it, there is a way to play it?....i saw windows rt in the video, what can i do this? Thank you
Yes, Google likes to disable some apps by country or tablet model.. though you can always download apps on PC and install them from SD card anyway..
Do you know if can i root this tablet?
Just thought I'd add a little feedback here as our family has just bought a new Archos tablet and this 97 Titanium HD was on our shortlist but we discovered at the last moment that it didn't have a mini HDMI socket like the rest of the Titanium range. It also seems some people are not too impressed with the 97 Titanium HD specs to cope with the higher retina display resolution. Therefore just thought I'd mention if you want the higher resolution and the mini HDMI you'd be better off spending a little extra to get the 97 Platinum HD which has quad core CPU and 8 core graphics, opposed to dual core CPU and 4 core graphics on the Titanium.
The Platinum range is currently only on pre-order so we went for the 101 Titanium as it has the mini HDMI and means we can also use it with a non smart flat screen TV to add BBC iPlayer etc.
Going well so far but a few apps we wanted aren't available for 4.1, such as, ITV Player, thetrainline, UK Bus Times Live, Rightmove.
Hopefully Android 4.2 will be available soon.
lucalampe said:
Do you know if can i root this tablet?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Haven't found any guides on rooting and custom ROMs yet.
Though there are info for 97 Carbon, maybe it suits for Titanium too. Haven't tried.
No the carbon way doesnot work try the 80xs way
sent from my UNLOCKED gt-s5360 using the XDA app
The ARCHOS 97 Titanium HD looks the same as my VIEWPIA TB-310 and has the same specs.
Mine plays 1080p movies from a 1TB NTFS USB HD connected via the OTG cable to the host USB connector.
It is also ideal for reading PDF documents with the RADAee PDF reader.
Minor drawbacks are the 12V/2A power supply and the lack of an HDMI output; it also allows only one USB storage device.
I bought the 8GB version for 225 Euro in the Netherlands (this includes a 3 Euro copy tax).
Googling for "9.7 Retina IPS, Dual Core 1,6GHz, 1GB RAM" yields at least three different labels and several sellers offer the same machine without mentioning a brand.
Does someone knows the originator of this tablet?
Archos 97 titanium retails for 255 euros in Lithuania and you get 2 year warranty. Guess Android updates from Archos too.
Some games on Archos 97 Titanium HD.
R: ARCHOS 97 Titanium HD - 9.7 Retina IPS, Dual Core 1,6GHz, 1GB RAM, Mali 400 Quad G
Originalas said:
Thread for those who are interested in Archos 97 Titanium HD.
Got my device about two weeks ago and I'm really impressed with this Archos tablet. It's probably the first on the market to offer iPad like Retina screen and first Archos tablet that's is pretty pleasant to use, because Android 4.1 at lats runs pretty decent, fast and smooth.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Fast band smooth... you gotta be kidding, try HD mode and you better male yourself a coffee while waiting for e-mail to open...
Inviato dal mio ARCHOS 97 TITANIUMHD con Tapatalk 2
Yes, try it more often if whole point is just to complain.
I've tried both normal and HD modes, haven't even noticed a difference in picture quality, so normal mode is a lot faster, smoother and saves battery. Haven't used HD since then at all.
Let's remember that Archos 97 Titanium is even cheaper than previous G8, G9 models, but offers incomparable screen quality, speed has dramatically improved as battery life too.
Even then compared to Samsung Galaxy Tab 10.1, Archos 97 has way better screen, runs a lot faster and retails for less.
And if speed is the most important thing, buy iPad, Windows device, but never Android. There is no Android device yet that runs smoothly and probably won't be anytime soon. So Archos is smooth only compared by Android standards, that you don't have to make a coffee every single time then clicking next link or turning magazine page (because you had with 101 G9 or Tab 10.1)... So Android Jelly has made a dramatic improvement in speed, but still even a budget WP phone will run smoother then any premium Android device, because is just the way Android is..
Another gameplay video
R: ARCHOS 97 Titanium HD - 9.7 Retina IPS, Dual Core 1,6GHz, 1GB RAM, Mali 400 Quad G
Originalas said:
And if speed is the most important thing, buy iPad, Windows device, but never Android. There is no Android device yet that runs smoothly and probably won't be anytime soon. So Archos is smooth only compared by Android standards, that you don't have to make a coffee every single time then clicking next link or turning magazine page (because you had with 101 G9 or Tab 10.1)... So Android Jelly has made a dramatic improvement in speed, but still even a budget WP phone will run smoother then any premium Android device, because is just the way Android is..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think I have to agree with you. I am surprised a cheap WP tablet to be perfectly smooth when even nexus 10 have some lags... I like android but this thing is SIMPLY WRONG design. There are no possible excuses. I am so pissed off about this I am seriously thinking to switch to other systems.
Inviato dal mio GT-I9100 con Tapatalk 2
I've got second super cheap chinese tablet for ~$121, same chipset 1.6Ghz and Android 4.1, the only difference is 8 screen with 1024x768 resolution. It seems like games and OS runs a bit smoother than on Archos 97, though this is not something unexpected, because lower resolution puts less load on CPU and GPU.
Think maybe the link is wrong? It seems to be the A86 not A85. How's the wifi away from router?
Clarkeymc said:
Think maybe the link is wrong? It seems to be the A86 not A85. How's the wifi away from router?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Title and description doesn't match real item. Though link is correct and real name with specs are like shown on the box.
The price went up to $144.99 last week too. Guess because it's clear now that $120 was a crazy good deal for device like this.
some thoughts
I think when you do some gaming, the battery drains really fast, within a few hours totally flat. Watching youtube is 4 hours max.
Somebody knows how to root it ? I hate the ads, and want to put a hosts file to block'em, and put other tweaks for JB (build.prop and init.d scripts)
Br.
Michel
Just to let you guys know, and warn you not to get the Archos 97 Titanium HD, it's that bad, i don't know what to do with it. i will try to sell it as a second hand and loose money on it. i bought it 5 days ago....
the problems with this device:
1. WIFI is very very slow and reception almost doesn't exists ! you will not be able to get a signal farther than 3m from the router.
2. HD ? Retina ? are you kidding me the device is on Normal mode (half of retina res.) and works sort of OK but still not as fast as expected from a dual core 1.6GHZ CPU with quad core GPU !- SHAME on you Archos.
Putting the device in HD mode, Forget about it, your device will flicker like hell and the lags becomes epic !
IMHO, the worst is the Archos knows about this and doesn't issue a recall or a solution to their customers. this is definitely the last time i will buy Archos for me they are a bunch of thieves because they know about their defective product and they keep selling it.
I feel like it's my obligation to post this message in all the relevant forums, to warn other suckers from falling in Archos trap.
Let me know what you think about this device, i'm going to the store tomorrow and will try to give it back.
"IPAD killer" really ?
predatorftp said:
Just to let you guys know, and warn you not to get the Archos 97 Titanium HD, it's that bad, i don't know what to do with it. i will try to sell it as a second hand and loose money on it. i bought it 5 days ago....
the problems with this device:
1. WIFI is very very slow and reception almost doesn't exists ! you will not be able to get a signal farther than 3m from the router.
2. HD ? Retina ? are you kidding me the device is on Normal mode (half of retina res.) and works sort of OK but still not as fast as expected from a dual core 1.6GHZ CPU with quad core GPU !- SHAME on you Archos.
Putting the device in HD mode, Forget about it, your device will flicker like hell and the lags becomes epic !
IMHO, the worst is the Archos knows about this and doesn't issue a recall or a solution to their customers. this is definitely the last time i will buy Archos for me they are a bunch of thieves because they know about their defective product and they keep selling it.
I feel like it's my obligation to post this message in all the relevant forums, to warn other suckers from falling in Archos trap.
Let me know what you think about this device, i'm going to the store tomorrow and will try to give it back.
"IPAD killer" really ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They are making an retina less version called 97b
sent from my UNLOCKED gt-s5360 using the XDA app
[REVIEW] Much/Snail W3D (Smartphone/Gaming Console)
Nota: Hay una versión en español de este artículo en este enlace
Note: Due the extension, this article is a summary from the original located here.
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Usage of this review
Author give permission to use this review, part of this or by a link reference, to anybody wants to use it, with only one condition that you must keep the author of this article, and the original source, that is on my blog.
For any update for the content of this article, i suggest to visit the link avobe.
Acknowledgments
To Shop-Oye store for send me an unit of their product Snail W3D to test it and write this review.
Agreement
I am not responsible for any problems caused by the implementation of procedures or guidelines indicadated in this article. Any modifications you make in the device (such as a flash ROM, change bios, software installation, configuration, poorly assembled, etc) will be at your own risk.
Presentation of the received product[/i]
As usual withhin this manufacturer, their products come in a very well presented package, and for their star product will no be less.
The box come with an external cover with a photo of the device and their logo (in 3D representation, of course)
On the back, we found general info of the device.
The sides of the cover show to us the W3D logo too.
When get the box out of the cover, we found the real box where the device come. This box come with the logo again on their surface (raised and silvered print).
Once opened, we found directly the device (with an extra screen protector)
Under the device there is a User guide with the shape of the device itself. I really like this detail, because last time manufacturers (in general speaking) are avoiding these kind of elements of their products.
Finally, under the device there is a section divided on 3 parts, where come the rest of the accesories of the device.
The care of the presentation of the product give a very good first impression, and take away from any concept of "Chinese product" that people may have about this kind of product.
Package ContentsUnboxing y full description of the package contents
When the package is opened, we found the following elements thats, i understand, are part of any standard shippment for this product.
User guide (in chinese)
Snail W3D device
MicroUSB Cable for data and charge
Wall Charger
Extra Screen protector (the device come with one installed from factory)
Note: I get stranged becaause there is no Headphones included as part of accesories.
Product informationSpecs of the device
According with the manufacturer, or searching info on web pages, we can found many sources of information about the device and sometimes these information may be not consistent (may be different from one web page to other), and this may cause some confusion for anybody that wants to get info about this product.
On this section i will post the info i get from the manufacturer (or is not possible, the web page that i consider more reliable), listing only the relevant points for a tech analysis of the product, and omit these points that don´t get any relevant info about the device (as many time we found on many pages, things such video capabilities, mail capabilities, etc, that really are software based features that we can install on the device, and not a real feature of the device itself)
CPU: MediaTek MTK6592 Octa-Core, 2.0 GHz
GPU: Power VR Series6IMG Rogue G6200 600 MHz
RAM: 2 GB de RAM LPDDR3 @ 933 MHz
Storage: 16GB
Operating System: Amdrpod 4.4.2
Screen Size: 5.5"
Screen resolution: 1920x1080 (FullHD)
Screen feature: 3D Glassfree
Rear Camera: 13 MPx
Front camera: 5 MPx
Stereo loudspeakers
SIM Slots: Dual
External storage: MicroSD
Supports: TD-LTE, LTE FDD, TD-SCDMA, WCDMA, GSM.
Battery: 4000mAh
Wifi: 802.11 ac / aban
Antutu Benchmark System Info
Benchmarks
Normalized tests for comparing with another similar devices.[/i]
For people that don´t know about these programs, i can tell (in short words) that a benchmark is a program or normalized test that runs on a device. These tests give points (usually, averaging many results) the performance of a device, in the way that the final total point may be useful to compare, in a simple and direct way, the general performance between many devices.
There are so many benchmarks on Google Play Store, but in my test usually i use the most populars.
For the running of these benchmarks, the initial conditions of the device are:
CPU Frequency: 2000 MHz
CPU Governor: Interactive
Screen Resolution: 1920x1080 (FullHD)
Firmware: Official overseas update (including Google Playstore)
3DMark - The Gamer's Benchmark
Gaming performance
As usual, the most common way to show the performance of a device is running and playing games, android natives and emulated (roms) using emulators.
In the following lines i will show some games and emulators running on the device, and some comments with relevant info.
Android native games
Android games are specific for touch screens, and may use another device sensors such tilt sensor, and most of them show on screen controls to interact with the game, but only few of them have native joystick/gamepad support.
For now, there are some alternatives that we can use to bring these kind of support (joysticks/gamepads and other devices) on these games, bringing another way of playing using physical controls. Most of these alternatives are based on emulating the events and mechanisms that the device originally support for interact with the games. Most of these events are touch screen based, then this kind of apps will "emulate" these touches, linking physical controls (buttons, sticks) to screen locations.
Soulcraft
Dokuro
Savant
Chaos Legends
Taichi Panda Heroes
Call of Duty Strike Team
Kingdom Warriors
Grand Theft Auto
Age of Whushu
Iesabel
The King of Fighters'97
Gangstar Vegas
EmulationRetrogaming
In the same way that Android games are an important way of testing the performance of a device, emulation is another factor to get in concern, and most important, for systems that are quite hard to be emulated, because with these emulators/roms we can see differences between devices. (most of times, the pure power of a CPU/GPU can run better a game in a device, and get poor performance in another device)
In Android, we get many emulator alternatives (emulated systems) that we can recreate on the device that we are testing. We can use emulators of old computers, videogame consoles, and is possible to run some x86 system (MS DOS, windows 9x but so limited), and we can run most modern systems such Nintendo64, Playstation one (PSX), both of these emulators are consider the top of the current frontier of emulation, but this is not limited to these systems. There are new emulators that most probably will become the new top/frontier, with emulation of PSP that many games currently are playables with near of 100% of speed, or Nintendo DS, that currently is able to run many titles.at full speed (or near to)
This way, we can say that the emulators are important than Android games en terms of entertainment, and for this reason are a big and important part of any testing planning of any device.
Assassin's Creed BloodlinesPPSSPP - PSP Emulator
Tekken Dark ResurrectionPPSSPP - PSP Emulator
Tekken 6PPSSPP - PSP Emulator
TMNTDrastic - Nintendo DS emulator
Mario Kart DSDrastic - Nintendo DS emulator
New Super Mario BrosDrastic - Nintendo DS emulator
Soul CaliburReicast - Dreamcast Emulator
Capcom vs SNK 2Reicast - Dreamcast Emulator
This game have some graphic glitches in all devices and emulator versions of android.
Ms PacmanMupen64+ AE (Nintendo 64 Emulator)
Conker Bad Fur DayMupen64+ AE (Nintendo 64 Emulator)
Mortal Kombat 3 Ultimate EditionMAME4droid
Marvel Superheroes vs Street FighterMAME4droid
Pros, contras y mejoras
As in every product, there are pros and cons points that are good to mention in a clear way. These points will help to us to decide if the device features are enough for what the user are looking for in a device of this kind.
Pros are based on features that highlight, comparing the device with another similars, or these features improve the experience of the user.
In the another hand, the cons are these points that worse the experience, or the feature is not enough for fulfill what we expect from the device.
Finally, the improvements pints are some features or specs that i think must be improved in a supposed new version of the device, and will generate a better experience in my opinion.
Cons
The screen of the device have a refresh rateof 58.78Hz. This may mean a problem if you want to execute a precise emulation of some systems.
There is no physical buttons for Select and Start. Now these buttons are virtuals but, for a gaming user is more reasonable these buttons must keep as physicals
The touch screen did not include L2 and R2 buttons
The gamepad driver, for some reason is not so much compatible with android games, and for this reason is preferred to use the on screen mapper than try to configure direct gampead controls in game.
There is no way to enable 3D feature when we want. The device will determine when this feature may be used, and in some cases such some youtube videos that are 3D enabled (side by side) that may be watched on the device, is not possible to activate the 3D screen.
the L1/R1 & L2/R button positions are not so much ergonomics, and most for people with big hands.
The product price is high from the manufacturer, and for this reason the final prince on stores is high too.
Improvements
I think may be a very good point if the device come with a double back camera, for taking 3D photos (the same way as 3DS do)
Counting that the device can add virtual buttons such Select and Start, may the mapper can include the L3 and R3 buttons, needed for some games (such GTA for completing some missions)
Conclusion
From a gaming point of view, there is a improvement about the previous version of the device, but there are some points was dropped on this evolution such Select and Start buttons.
There is missing other buttons from android system, but now these functionality are included on the gamepad via KeyDIY app, but is not the same in my opinion than the previous device.
The design was improved from previous version, and now we have a device that don´t spin on the table (thanks for this). The back of the device is flat and this help a lot to stabilize the device for a normal usage when is on a table.
The 3D screen is especially remarcable. I get so impressed with this feature. Is very similar to Nintendo's 3DS screen, but with better result and resolution.
Watching a 3D movie is simple, and do not get tired as playing on 3DS.
My conclusion is, if you will use and enjoy watching 3D contents (movies) then this device will be worth, because there are not so much devices similar to this (and there is none similar, if consider gaming controls and 3D screen, all in one)
If you have the W1 and don´t get interested on 3D feature, then may not worth this device for your needs, because basically is a very similar device and don´t feel a big difference running apps and emulators on it, but i figure most of people interested on this device come from a non gaming device, then for all of them may be interesting consider this as your new phone/gaming console.
I must recognize that i did not a fan for this device when announced, because i did not get clear about what to expect from 3D screen, but after testing it i can confirm that is something for considering, even for wathching movies, if what are you looking for of course.
Final words
First of all, apologize my english. I did my best on trying to explain my experience and bring all this info directly in english, but is not my primary language and i'm aware that my level is so basic and rude. Even so, i think most of this article is undestandable because is based on data captured from the device, and this will help to you to get a general idea about this device.
I'm so happy for test this device and their 3D feature. I hope that Snail get success with this device and, with this, get more devices from this manufacturer.
Hope this review help to you to get info about this device, and apologize if there are more aspects that i forgot on mention on this article.
Zalu2!
Deen0X
Thanks Deen0x for posting! Hopefully some Dev's take interest in the device now that they know the specs.