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As posted at L337Ware
I'm not some kind of communist hippie but I have to admit it's nice to get a high quality free application that isn't marred by Ads every once in a while. I've noticed a trend of sorts lately that alot of applications I originally downloaded aren't offered for free anymore or now have Ads plastered about them. In a matter of fact I probably need to consider how I'm going to update some of the reviews already on this site.
This leads me to wonder why? Is this a sign of things to come? We are already being charged a premium for XBox Live games in comparison to the titles on other platforms even in the light of some missing features. I've kind of attributed that to supply and demand though and know the prices will drop as things become more competitive. Perhaps the initial offerings were a simple test of the waters? I've considered this as developers are still trying to get their footing on this new platform. Regardless it still kind of feels like a bit of a bait and switch to the end user.
That being said I understand the need to cash in because I know some of these applications took a considerable amount of time and effort on the developers part. Honestly I wish as much consideration was placed on developing new business models as producting new products in the mobile market. Creative uses of Geotagging, cameras, and perhaps even social networking could be used as opposed to damaging the user's experience.
Since I kind of dropped the gauntlet there I will cough up a few examples.
Geotagging - The user has to go to say a store in order to unlock an application. This would also work with a setup where a purchase has to be made if a code was offered on the receipt.
Cameras - Scan a bar code for this product using your phone to unlock application. This could even change from month to month as the app relocks.
Social Networking - Like this page on Facebook and keep it liked to keep app full featured or follow this entity on twitter to unlock app.
I'm not saying all of these ideas would be easy or even effective but the current models could definitely use some work. At the end of the day I don't really blame the developers as they are doing what they need to in order to justify their hard work. I believe the burden really falls on the creator of the platform to step up and separate themselves from the pack. In this case I hope Microsoft moves a bit faster than their competition.
L337Ware said:
I hope Microsoft moves a bit faster than their competition.
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I lol'd.....
Seriously though, I noticed on the app store the other day that there's a Lego game where you can unlock in game items by going to a shop and scanning the bar codes on actual Lego products so what your suggesting is probably already happening on a small scale, if not its right around the corner.
MS will probably catch up in 3-4 years ....... just kidding.
Sent From My Fingers To Your Face.....
Given the three alternatives you proposed, I'd take ads in the app over all of them. All of those would be far more annoying requirements than a minimal ad that I most likely won't respond to anyway. In those cases, I have to go out of my way to locate a product and allow someone else to be aware of my activity.
All things considered, I think I'd rather keep things as they are. Many of the ad-based apps I have now only display the ads on title, setup, and other ancillary screens, not during the main functions of the app. That seems like a reasonable approach.
I can see where you are coming from. Thing is I tend to get very annoyed when I accidentally click an ad while trying to use an application. Seriously I'm not really a professional in the field of digital marketing but if I can come up with alternatives that easily there definately has to be a better way.
L337Ware said:
I can see where you are coming from. Thing is I tend to get very annoyed when I accidentally click an ad while trying to use an application. Seriously I'm not really a professional in the field of digital marketing but if I can come up with alternatives that easily there definately has to be a better way.
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I've never accidentally clicked an ad in an app. Either you need to start using higher quality apps or finetune your motor skills
Sure, your alternatives are interesting, but how exactly would developers get paid using them? Take the FB/Twitter like/follow scenario for example - sure, you gain a bunch of followers but there's no money changing hands.
Scanning a barcode could work for branded apps, i.e. the app is commissioned by the manufacturers of the product in question. But apps like these are generally free anyway - unless we are talking e.g. Lego Games where this approach would be great (although, including a code INSIDE a box of Legos would be better in terms of revenue).
I really like the GeoTagging idea though, but again I'm not entirely sure how you, as a developer, would leverage this. You could do what Cocktail Flow has done and sell your app for $$$ but include an in-app code-redemption (or in this case, Location-based) system of sorts where the full app unlocks. It sort of limits your reach though as you will either have to contact retailers (or theme parks, coffee shops, etc etc) all across the globe to strike deals with them about kickbacks.
Generally speaking, using GeoLocation or Barcodes is pretty smart, but not for the average developer. Too much overhead in terms of administrating the scheme. For branded apps I definitely think we'll see more taking advantage of this to unlock "special" features or offers though.
As an interesting side-note, there are fairly huge discrepancies between countries in terms or trial-to-paid conversions and the like. The US seems to be very low on the list in buying apps at all whereas Australia is on top when comparing the same app, with an equal price. As a "desktop" ISV I've never come across this before (the US has always given very high trial-to-paid conversions for me) so there is something about the mobile sector that makes people vary about purchasing apps. Even comparing a $20 desktop app with a $1 mobile app the desktop app has higher sales. My take is that the app "bubble" is about to burst.
how dare the devs make money???
Research has shown that ad supported apps do better than paid apps. I would gladly pay for any app over an ad supported, but apparently I'm in the minority on that one.
Just ask the indie developer Elbert Perez, over 100k made on ad revenue...
ad free - the wonderful application that blocks ad related sites systen-wide. love it !
emigrating said:
I've never accidentally clicked an ad in an app. Either you need to start using higher quality apps or finetune your motor skills
Sure, your alternatives are interesting, but how exactly would developers get paid using them? Take the FB/Twitter like/follow scenario for example - sure, you gain a bunch of followers but there's no money changing hands.
Scanning a barcode could work for branded apps, i.e. the app is commissioned by the manufacturers of the product in question. But apps like these are generally free anyway - unless we are talking e.g. Lego Games where this approach would be great (although, including a code INSIDE a box of Legos would be better in terms of revenue).
I really like the GeoTagging idea though, but again I'm not entirely sure how you, as a developer, would leverage this. You could do what Cocktail Flow has done and sell your app for $$$ but include an in-app code-redemption (or in this case, Location-based) system of sorts where the full app unlocks. It sort of limits your reach though as you will either have to contact retailers (or theme parks, coffee shops, etc etc) all across the globe to strike deals with them about kickbacks.
Generally speaking, using GeoLocation or Barcodes is pretty smart, but not for the average developer. Too much overhead in terms of administrating the scheme. For branded apps I definitely think we'll see more taking advantage of this to unlock "special" features or offers though.
As an interesting side-note, there are fairly huge discrepancies between countries in terms or trial-to-paid conversions and the like. The US seems to be very low on the list in buying apps at all whereas Australia is on top when comparing the same app, with an equal price. As a "desktop" ISV I've never come across this before (the US has always given very high trial-to-paid conversions for me) so there is something about the mobile sector that makes people vary about purchasing apps. Even comparing a $20 desktop app with a $1 mobile app the desktop app has higher sales. My take is that the app "bubble" is about to burst.
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Way to be disingenuous...
Desktop apps are easier and better to use, and are usually worth the extra cash. Higher rez graphics, better graphics in general (even with Integrated cards) and generally of higher quality with better support IME.
But it's not hard to misclick an ad when apps seem to have them on the bottom on one screen and at the top of others, and some apps randomly change ad positioning.
It's part of the reason why I uninstalled AlphaJack. There aren't enough people on the platform to not have a ton of "dead" games in your list, and the Ads move from top to bottom on different screens. Also, Ads on the top of the screen in Metro are just terrible, and prone to misclicks because the gesture area is up there (to see your Wi-Fi status and Reception level)... Ads on the bottom are prone to misclicks because the menu and app control buttons are down there. Ads generally look pretty bad and do not fit within the GUI, either...
All those ideas are pretty terrible and with gas prices these days it costs more to go to the store to unlock an app than to just buy it. For me and where I'm located, I could probably buy 10 apps with the gas I wasted just to unlock one app...
How about they just give longer trial periods so that we don't have to buy basically every app on impulse. Very short time limited trials (i.e. Android's 15 minutes), and feature limited trials (many WP7 apps) do not give me incentive to buy anything.
Most functionality we need on a smartphone is trivial to obtain via stock apps, anyways, besides games.
Your options 1 and 2.. Have the user buy something else, or get close to a for-purchase product, to make the app free. Your option 3.. follow them on a social network, never give them any money.
Why not just skip a burger/beer/brownie and give the dev a couple of dollars for the app? I don't understand people.. they'll pay $10-$15 to sit in a movie theater for 2 hours but won't spend $2.99 to use an app everday forevermore. YOu said you respect their time and effort, do you really? Don't forget that they have to pay to be in the Marketplace.
Look, I'm a regular user too... I'm hesitant to spend on something when I don't know if it's good or if free alternatives will do it. That's why MS put trials in. Unfortunately MS wasn't smart enough to have a 3rd category between "paid" and "free" called "trial", so people just browse free apps and devs have to do ads to make money.
This still isn't a big deal. The app's free. The devs support their users for free. Maybe we should be telling Google etc to find a revolutionary new complicated business model and stop sticking ads in our web pages
MSdoes have trial apps.
Sent from my SGH-i917 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Add suported model is also the easiest to gain money, no paperwork with ms. A few clicks and your good to go, plus you can serve a much larger crowd since a lot of people can only use free apps on wp7.
Even a big part of europe does not have the possibility to buy apps yet and you dont want to exclude your own countries people ( in my case), your friends and family.
The Windows Phone 7 Marketplace already has enough issues such as Navigating. But surely I cannot be the only person who gets absolutely infuriated when I see these STUPID POINTLESS Real Estate Apps by the Hundreds!! And they just keep on coming..it never ends... This makes browsing through the Marketplace such a Pain... Look developer of those Stupid Apps... Enough is enough... Please stop contaminating our Marketplace... We already have a Joke for a App Store... Filling it with your dumb Apps just make matters worse.
/END RANT
Sent by Projekt hTC
I agree. It is annoying.
But the truth is, most people think "apps" make the phone because most people are stupid, so Microsoft is happy to see all those "apps" come to give them more apps faster in the marketplace.
But, if there are so damn many real estate apps, give them a ****ing category so I can ignore them! They all could have been combined in one really useful app and saved Microsoft reviewers time. I wondered why my apps have seemed to take a lot longer lately to get reviewed, because there are 100 maybe even 1000s of real estate apps they have to certify, each one, fairly thoroughly......!
I just sent an e-mail through support in the AppHub:
I would just like to make a request for a new category in the Marketplace: 'Real Estate'. These apps are contaminating the Marketplace for the rest of us at the moment, making it harder for new apps to be discovered. We don't want the Marketplace to be filled with this junk like the AppStore is, or even worse for the Marketplace to end up like the Android market.
Regards,
Calum
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Not much, but if enough registered developers complain, maybe someone will listen. Even better would be to have these apps removed from the 'New' section. If they had there own category then apps like the WP7Applist app could filter them out.
I was about to post a similar thread regarding those annoying real estate apps. What is so wrong with creating 1 app that covers all cities instead of separate app for each individual city.
I live in UK and dont want to know about real estate across the US.
Please dont let it turn into the Android market.
Too late, it's already filled with spam.
Please, an admin move this to general (check sticky)
I guess that's the downside of Microsoft now allowing us to publish 100 free apps a year instead of 5...
But to echo the sentiments of everyone here - why not make those apps one bloody app with region settings?!
Name and shame: SmarterAgent.
Casey
Here in Canada we have one app that uses your GPS to find stuff nearby. That is really dumb to have an app for each city.
Kind of like that navigation app that has one app for each country is has maps for.
you can contact the developer and let them know your feelings...
http://www.smarteragent.com/
Smarter Agent
Waterfront Technology Center
200 Federal Street, Suite 300
Camden, New Jersey 08103
856-614-5423
1-800-727-1787
[email protected]
If there is an upside to this, at least it makes the app count that is reported in the news look good . After all, detractors keep comparing the size of the WP7 Marketplace with the size of the Android Market and the iOS App Store. The fact that the proportion of "spam" apps for those platforms is at least as high as it is for WP7 never gets mentioned. All we hear is FIVE HUNDRED THOUSAND IPHONE APPS!!!
Well, now there are OVER TWENTY THOUSAND WP7 APPS!!!
And seriously, the quality of the good WP7 apps is growing every day. Has anyone checked out the new WP7applist app? It is by far the best marketplace browser I have ever seen.
RoboDad said:
And seriously, the quality of the good WP7 apps is growing every day. Has anyone checked out the new WP7applist app? It is by far the best marketplace browser I have ever seen.
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I did. And I'm using it multiple times a day ever since I installed it. It's a bit slow though and I don't like the way it provides screenshots. But this aside, it's amazing.
I dont quite know what u r talking about..never seen 1 myself, but then again, i dont visit a market place as often...but i agree, there should be a section for 'Real estate' and file them all under that...
OK, I just ran into a simmilar situation. Search the market place for "GPS Timer". The results look interesting and diverse. However, several of them, with different titles, are all the exact same app.
Chrono GPS FREE
GPS Sports Watch FREE
GPS Sports Watch
Jogging Partner
These are all the exact same app. How anoying is that!
Got the same situation here...I think WP7 team is sleeping and a developer called smarter agent is so hardworking spamming the marketplace with his awesome real estate app.
I have observed that this problem is non-stop for 1or2 months,Until now,everytime i go into the new app category...they are at least 50real estate apps by smarter agent.Until now,i think there are at least 1000+ real estate,quotes and spam book apps....
Now I'm started to think back when M$ said, they will promise quality apps rather than quantity.And now I know how they filter the apps and they enjoy sleeping.
Good job WP7 team,
http://windowsteamblog.com/windows_...-marketplace-manages-bulk-app-publishing.aspx
WP7 has one of the most fat growing app marketplaces!
Yea, way to go!!!
That's important, but not the fact that 95% of apps are retarded and useless
It's nice that some people here are not working at Microsoft. The "who cares, it's more apps to the marketplace" attitude is just ridiculous. At least Microsoft heard the complaints and are doing something about it.
we are limiting the number of apps any one developer can have certified in a single day to 20.
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Step in the right direction, I think 5 would be more appropriate though. I can't honestly see many developers having more than 5 apps to certify in one day!
Casey_boy said:
Step in the right direction, I think 5 would be more appropriate though. I can't honestly see many developers having more than 5 apps to certify in one day!
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5 a day still means 1500 a year from a single spammer. I think quantitative checks are useless and they should go with qualitative .
But it's clear they have opened the market to spam on purpose and fooled devs into believing their quality mantra.
HIccups and delays annoyed me, but this is huge and inexcusable
andycted said:
5 a day still means 1500 a year from a single spammer. I think quantitative checks are useless and they should go with qualitative .
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True, though the same blog post does say that MS have contacted the developer to push them onto the right track (i.e. build one app which is locale aware). They have also removed the apps from the Marketplace.
I'm going to give MS the benefit of the doubt, by saying I don't think they expected it (somewhat naively). Remember, we were only permitted five free apps a year before we had to pay for submitting them (now we get 100).
Casey
I think M$ should warn and freeze the spammer account for a certain period such as 2weeks or 1month. this is the more efficient way to do things.Furthermore,M$ should work harder to filter the quality of apps...
One of the things which has sometimes mildly annoyed me is the apparent under-usage of categories in the marketplace. For some sections of the Marketplace (i.e. entertainment) there are no categories in it.
Well since the recent update to the Marketplace, I'd just like to show you the importance of these categories. I have an app called eyePredictor in the Marketplace (it's a free baby eye colour predictor which I never thought would be particularly popular) which averaged ~5 downloads a day. However, since the recent update and my including the app into a category the download rate soared to ~100 a day.
That's a 20x increase.
I know it could also be due to the opening of new regions, however, my other apps haven't seen such an increase.
So, for all developers, make sure you utilise the categories available to your app. As for us as consumers, I think they're quite a handy feature which should be used more.
Do you agree? Or do you not use them?
I would love to hear your thoughts and if anyone else has had a similar experience?
Casey
That's very interesting. I may just write a post on our site about this! I've always been curious about just how often people those Marketplace categories are used and apparently this is a pretty good sign that they do.
Sent from my SGH-i917 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Cool. Feel free
I'd be interested to see if any other devs noticed this behaviour too. I wonder if it's because it's a relatively unpopulated category thus giving more exposure to the app, guess we can't tell.
There are rumours this will be turned into an ad campaign, time will tell.
The "really" ad was true to life and not a rigged survey like this one is, but hey, we're talking marketing soooooooo... it should get interesting.
ohgood said:
The "really" ad was true to life and not a rigged survey like this one is, but hey, we're talking marketing soooooooo... it should get interesting.
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I don't get your point at all. How are the "really" ads more true to life than this? This is not a survey, these are real life scenarios, have you even watched the video?
ohgood said:
The "really" ad was true to life and not a rigged survey like this one is, but hey, we're talking marketing soooooooo... it should get interesting.
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I don't think it's rigged dude...
Nope. MS should just watch iphone ads and copy them
For example: an iphone ad will be something like "with the iphone you can do, x, y, z" with video on how to do them all in the ad.
With WP7 ads sometimes even I have no idea what they are trying to do, or even then how to do it (the guy shopping with his kids typing in a document in skydrive). Keep it simple and to the point.
pillsburydoughman said:
Nope. MS should just watch iphone ads and copy them
For example: an iphone ad will be something like "with the iphone you can do, x, y, z" with video on how to do them all in the ad.
With WP7 ads sometimes even I have no idea what they are trying to do, or even then how to do it (the guy shopping with his kids typing in a document in skydrive). Keep it simple and to the point.
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I totally agree with copying what Apple does, it's just great and Google has started doing it too (for non-Android services) but the above video is still miles better than all the generic stuff Microsoft has been doing so far.
cool video. It wasn't rigged but the contestants were obviously not prepared.
First test the guy could have stopped the app and it would have found the song.
The others didn't make use of their widgets, instead they went looking for the app.
Nice try though.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk
Well you're right, but the whole point of the contest is to show how on WP7 you don't have to look for a way to do things faster (like stopping soundhound).
vetvito said:
cool video. It wasn't rigged but the contestants were obviously not prepared.
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Agreed.
First test the guy could have stopped the app and it would have found the song.
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Couldn't the WP7 guy as well? Wouldn't a fair test be both to run its course?
The others didn't make use of their widgets, instead they went looking for the app.
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Agreed. Again, not prepared. I was shocked the iPhone beat the WP7 with its straight to camera ability. But then I remembered iOS5.
Nice try though.
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I love this campaign. It has more meaning than the "really" one which is entertaining but does not really show anything. The one great thing about the iPhone/iPad ads are they fully demonstrate the products' capabilities. The Macs take that entertaining approach.
Has my thumbs up.
nicksti said:
I was shocked the iPhone beat the WP7 with its straight to camera ability. But then I remembered iOS5.
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To Me the WP won if it was based on who said uploading first now as far as the completed task there are many other variables like which image was larger thus taking longer to post to twitter.
rruffman said:
To Me the WP won if it was based on who said uploading first now as far as the completed task there are many other variables like which image was larger thus taking longer to post to twitter.
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Either way, this campaign drives the message home:
"Get in, get out, get on with your life."
Peew971 said:
I don't get your point at all. How are the "really" ads more true to life than this? This is not a survey, these are real life scenarios, have you even watched the video?
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The "really" ads showed people staring at their phones, walking into doors, refusing sex, etc which is true to life.
The survey is neither scientific nor prepared users other than the surveyor offering a $100 bet. He decides the task, instead of an impartial third party. Give an impartial third party the opportunity to decide random tasks, it will be very different and less dramatic.
^ this is why I said its marketing, soooooo you know.
LOL, everybody on here that's mad and complaining got smoked by a Windows Phone.
sinister1 said:
LOL, everybody on here that's mad and complaining got smoked by a Windows Phone.
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now that's funnay, sigline updated !
nicksti said:
Agreed.I was shocked the iPhone beat the WP7 with its straight to camera ability. But then I remembered iOS5.
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We'll see:
http://wmpoweruser.com/microsoft-applies-for-patent-on-locked-mode-camera-access-in-smartphones
I seem to remember some iFan reporting on iOS 5 and how one of the reasons it was so much better than Windows Phone was because you could access the camera from the lock screen. He was oblivious that WP7 had done this first, and a year earlier, and would have had serious egg on his face if anyone had ever bothered correcting him.
drokkon said:
We'll see:
http://wmpoweruser.com/microsoft-applies-for-patent-on-locked-mode-camera-access-in-smartphones
I seem to remember some iFan reporting on iOS 5 and how one of the reasons it was so much better than Windows Phone was because you could access the camera from the lock screen. He was oblivious that WP7 had done this first, and a year earlier, and would have had serious egg on his face if anyone had ever bothered correcting him.
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There was a nokia something or other years ago that did this. Not that it matters who was first, its an awesome feature reguardless !
The ads were interesting and did prove some points, but too social network-centered. Come on, you don't choose a phone just because it allows you to quickly post stuff to Twitter. I don't facebook and post to Twitter twice a month, so this is hardly useful. And cameras on most Windows phones suck, especially first-generation models.
No mentions of
- integrated Office
- contact grouping (Android 4 does something like this, but WP7 is better)
- best-of-class email (reading large emails is much better in WP7 than Android)
Now if they did some other real-world scenarios:
- Use turn-by-turn navigation without distracting (Android navigation is a lot better)
- Load an Ajax-heavy page over a crappy network connection (Opera Mini obviously wins)
- Use a non-facebook online messenger, such as Google Talk or ICQ, or a non-integrated social network
- Uploading a bunch of documents for later reference with a USB cable instead of using Skydrive or email
- Identifying a random object (sorry, Bing Vision is pathetic compared to Google Goggles)
- Making a Skype call
- Switching between third-party apps without them losing state
that would make the competition a lot more interesting!
Or if they offered contestants to propose the challenge instead of the predefined scenarios.
ohgood said:
The "really" ads showed people staring at their phones, walking into doors, refusing sex, etc which is true to life.
The survey is neither scientific nor prepared users other than the surveyor offering a $100 bet. He decides the task, instead of an impartial third party. Give an impartial third party the opportunity to decide random tasks, it will be very different and less dramatic.
^ this is why I said its marketing, soooooo you know.
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Click to collapse
I don't think I have walked into doors or been refused sex - so don't seem like that's a real life situation for me!
Anyways, if you did read about the 'survey' which was a challenge as a matter of fact - you would have known. The 'survey' wasn't meant to be scientific or wasn't meant to compared the 'cores' of phones. We know the hardware boasting of android is much above par. Dual cores, nearly 2ghz sorta processor etc etc.
What the challenge was to show that, yeah whatever funky hardware you carry in your pocket, let's just do something we do daily and we will see who can do it faster. Yes the incentive was $100. But it is completely wrong to say that 'he chose' the tasks. The tasks were mutually agreed by both and generally the task that the challenger thought he does daily with his phone and is happy doing it was performed as a challenge. For example if someone was so much into tweeting all the time on his dual core high end Android phone, he was challenged to do so against Windows Phone and get smoked!
Ideally if I was challenging WindowsPhone I wouldn't want a random dude to tell me what I should try. Instead asking the user to do what he does daily is scientifically even more challenging. You are not only challenging the cognitive brain but also challenging the routine co-ordination the user has already mastered on his phone. Thus the users who tweet regularly would ideally have the 'widget' somewhere pinned down. If they din't it's sad. But then it shows how the users are used to going into the 'app drawer' even for things they do daily or very frequently. Whereas a WindowsPhone user can pin it in a similar way as any other OS user too. But the fact that is very clear is - Only a few Pinned Live tiles covered ALL or Majority of tasks that any other OS user performed routinely. Thus, you don't need to clutter you screen with widgets, but live tiles (few) will let you do a plenty!
---------- Post added at 03:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:05 PM ----------
zlogic42 said:
The ads were interesting and did prove some points, but too social network-centered. Come on, you don't choose a phone just because it allows you to quickly post stuff to Twitter. I don't facebook and post to Twitter twice a month, so this is hardly useful. And cameras on most Windows phones suck, especially first-generation models.
No mentions of
- integrated Office
- contact grouping (Android 4 does something like this, but WP7 is better)
- best-of-class email (reading large emails is much better in WP7 than Android)
Now if they did some other real-world scenarios:
- Use turn-by-turn navigation without distracting (Android navigation is a lot better)
- Load an Ajax-heavy page over a crappy network connection (Opera Mini obviously wins)
- Use a non-facebook online messenger, such as Google Talk or ICQ, or a non-integrated social network
- Uploading a bunch of documents for later reference with a USB cable instead of using Skydrive or email
- Identifying a random object (sorry, Bing Vision is pathetic compared to Google Goggles)
- Making a Skype call
- Switching between third-party apps without them losing state
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Click to collapse
Turn-by-turn navigation on WP7 is much less distracting than Googles one. You only hear the annoying woman when you tap and need it. Else it smoothly shows the directions to you. But probably that was no possible anyway unless they go on driving from CES to McD and then to CES!
Do you load Ajax-heavey pages daily? I think loading documents will be done easily and quickly via email. The task for fixed, not the method. So if aim was upload documents - WP7 would have done much faster and safer way using the hotspot connectivity they had. Certain third-party apps like skype, googles and many google services would have surely made WP7 stumble but obviously they could come back with - Ok let's get your XBOX achievements on your android phone? Or let's play assassin's creed or any WP7 only app/games on your phone? - that doesn't look like would have worked!
drupad2drupad said:
Do you load Ajax-heavey pages daily?
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I do, every day. Reading news on the bus/train, while most websites include tons of widgets (Facebook like, Tweet this, +1 etc), ads and inefficiently formatted HTML makes surfing the web with a real browser (instead of Opera Mini) unusable, especially in non-3G areas. I don't need AJAX features, but they do use a lot of traffic and not all websites provide a decent mobile-friendly version. Even forums without tons of AJAX still load much faster in Opera Mini. Online stores, cinema sites, forums - all load slowly, sometimes even on a 3G connection.
If you need to search an answer for something that's not integrated in WP7's Bing features, it's going to be so slow over 2G that most people give up and call a friend to google it on a regular computer.
IE on WP7 however is a very good browser UI-wise, I'd call it the best I've seen on a smartphone.
I do agree with your other points, but the ads could've shown much more features - like voice recognition (in cases where both phones support it), making a call, sending a text or email with the restaurant address. No mentioning of the live tiles or lockscreen displaying the number of unread messages, or the next appointment. Something like 80% of the ads displayed taking a picture and/or posting to social networks. Both Android 4 and iOS 5 already made taking a picture easy right from the lockscreen and posting stuff to social networks right on the spot is not a top priority for most people. It's a nice feature, but email/text is much more important in real life.
Damn the hate on this forum even extends to this competition. I don't remotely see how this was rigged, this was all stuff I do on a daily basis: post to twitter, take pictures and upload them to twitter/fb, etc... Not to mention, the image sizes had nothing to do with this, as the taste was completed when the picture was submitted, not when the upload completed. And, both basically took identical pictures of each other.
I was recently pondering this question of "Why are there so many lackluster apps on the marketplace?" while I was looking into improvements for my app.
It really does seem that there are only a hundred or so, really inspiring Metro based apps on the WP7 marketplace, and Im not sure why. Even many of the developers who are active with their apps have truly un-inspiring visual apps, or downright stripped functionality. Im not sure why, granted you see a similar pattern with Android, which from what I can tell is much worse, but WHY? These developers are just one-off releasing apps, they are most commonly very active.
Just thought I would see if anyone had any input on this.
Its like that on all market places. Did you think there was over 500,000 aw inspiring apps?
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2
How many things
I have pondered the high number of apps for quite some time as well, but I approached it from another angle:
Think about it like this: How many different things can you possibly do with a smartphone? Well, quite a lot, obviously, but interestingly as soon as I start to enumerate, I run into problems to continue pretty soon. Maybe I can name 100 different things to "do" with a smartphone.
Now, say I forget a lot of things, and other people do other things than me anyway, and there will be new things that nobody has thought of so far, so let's take this times 10 and proclaim that you can use a smartphone for a full one thousand different things. (I would really love to see this list.)
If you cover each thing with, say, 10 different apps, so people have choice and can take the app the like, and there is healthy competition, we arrive a grand total number of 10'000 apps that make sense - ever. Anything beyond that is simply too much.
If you think 1'000 things to do with your smartphone is way too low I would challenge you to list 1'000 things that you do in your daily life, overall and in general, with your smartphone or otherwise - our lives are quite interesting, but there are limits of what we all do.
Ok, now let's be generous and throw in 50'000 different games which are not subject of things that must make sense, after all you can just invent and invent new variants of games.
That absolute upper limit of 60'000 apps or so is pretty low compared with the contents of the app stores, isn't it?
^ it is low, but you have to add in the different region apps too, different languages, and all of their variations. Thus the huge number of apps.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2
rbrunner7 said:
I have pondered the high number of apps for quite some time as well, but I approached it from another angle:
Think about it like this: How many different things can you possibly do with a smartphone? Well, quite a lot, obviously, but interestingly as soon as I start to enumerate, I run into problems to continue pretty soon. Maybe I can name 100 different things to "do" with a smartphone.
Now, say I forget a lot of things, and other people do other things than me anyway, and there will be new things that nobody has thought of so far, so let's take this times 10 and proclaim that you can use a smartphone for a full one thousand different things. (I would really love to see this list.)
If you cover each thing with, say, 10 different apps, so people have choice and can take the app the like, and there is healthy competition, we arrive a grand total number of 10'000 apps that make sense - ever. Anything beyond that is simply too much.
If you think 1'000 things to do with your smartphone is way too low I would challenge you to list 1'000 things that you do in your daily life, overall and in general, with your smartphone or otherwise - our lives are quite interesting, but there are limits of what we all do.
Ok, now let's be generous and throw in 50'000 different games which are not subject of things that must make sense, after all you can just invent and invent new variants of games.
That absolute upper limit of 60'000 apps or so is pretty low compared with the contents of the app stores, isn't it?
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1:Manage your bank account....how many different banks are out there.
2:Follow your local news....how many tv station, radio station, newspapers.
3:Follow your favorite sports team...how many teams out there.
4:Manage you reservations....for every hotel, rental car, airline.
5:Stream video....from every network, internet service, cable/satellite provider, your own network at home.
Now, how many tens of thousands of apps would it take just to cover those 5 functions that you can do with your smartphone?
Millions of apps
66stang351 said:
Now, how many tens of thousands of apps would it take just to cover those 5 functions that you can do with your smartphone?
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Yeah, I know, let me guestimate that there are maybe 10'000 large cities on this planet. Then you have 10'000 "Map of City x" apps, plus another 10'000 "Public Transport Time Table for City x", and again 10'000 "Coming Events in City x", and on and on.
Of course this brings up all kinds of questions, e.g. whether it really makes sense to turn all these things into an app where a website would perfectly do, but anyway, I concede you have a point.
I developped the habit to check all the new apps that appear in the Marketplace daily, and of course I see many apps of this type appear, but in my estimate at least half of the apps are just "garbage".
And what really makes me sad: Usually many days pass until I find a new app that really surprises me, an app with a real idea if you know what I mean, where somebody found something new - a rare gem of creativity. All that time spent building apps, what must amount to man centuries even, and then this meager result - it's a shame.
It's a growing thing. When Android and iOS were first released, there weren't many lackluster applications for awhile. Currently, developers are just trying to get everything on Windows Phone 7 that is already on Android and iOS...to include tools, games, instant messaging platforms, etc. Once they've caught up, then the developers will start using creativity.
It's not really a problem, just give it time
PoorCollegeGuy said:
It's a growing thing. When Android and iOS were first released, there weren't many lackluster applications for awhile. Currently, developers are just trying to get everything on Windows Phone 7 that is already on Android and iOS...to include tools, games, instant messaging platforms, etc. Once they've caught up, then the developers will start using creativity.
It's not really a problem, just give it time
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Don't you think its due to lack of API restricted by MS that not want to allow developer to work on!!
Just me maybe but i hardly even look at the market anymore.
Sent from my LG-P920 using xda premium
Well I rather lackluster apps than the other side of things shown here. Kind of explains why if you do not have one of the really popular Android phones why you may see more force closes than someone holding a SGS2.
taruian said:
Don't you think its due to lack of API restricted by MS that not want to allow developer to work on!!
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I totally agree with the API restrictions. It has kept me from making an app i really want to but on the other hand I as a developer feel that having eye candy in your app is a must. My specific type of apps for WP7 make the Android and iPhone users jealous as they dont have eye candy apps in that genre in their marketplaces. Also a lot of devs try to push many apps out for the money. Like if you include ads in your apps. The more apps the revenue you can earn as its a numbers game. So i think they rush on the design part.
vetvito said:
Its like that on all market places. Did you think there was over 500,000 aw inspiring apps?
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^This. Is there any objective evidence the amount of dross in the MSFT app store is any more than any other OS' app store?
People like to see their name in lights. It's as simple as that. Someone barely cobbles together an app with their meager programing skills and uploads it just to see their name in the app store.
sitizenx said:
^This. Is there any objective evidence the amount of dross in the MSFT app store is any more than any other OS' app store?
People like to see their name in lights. It's as simple as that. Someone barely cobbles together an app with their meager programing skills and uploads it just to see their name in the app store.
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Apple apply quality control on submitted apps. They will reject any apps that are buggy, crash or which don't serve a useful purpose. They are notoriously strict, causing quite a few famous publishing issues.
Mean while, Microsoft also have a submission possess, but not sure what it actually does? I remember reading on here about as developer that submitted 6 WP7 apps, that all just displayed a block on screen (each app was a different colour) and they all got published. A paid appstore should be no place for test apps; It's almost like MS don't care, and just want to boost their numbers..
Android market has no QA; anyone can submit anything. Most wild-west like app-store, but stuff doesn't get pulled off the store randomly like the above two.
^ you're joking about Apples QC right? That has got to be joke of the day.
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whodisname said:
Just me maybe but i hardly even look at the market anymore.
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pretty the same here. For quite some time now I have found all the apps I need and I only look for new ones (or alternatives f.e. different twitter apps etc.) very rarely, maybe when "super new, awesome app blabla" is featured on some news website.
The majority of apps I use work fine and aren't "lackluster". Just 3 or 4 I wish they would make improvements/alternative app.
Of course there are many not so good apps in the marketplace but thats a problem of every device, not even only phones. just look how much crappy software or games are available for pc.