Develop Bugs

Do you guys even know why you want ics?

Besides it being new what are you really gaining. Tons of apps don't work on it. Besides folders and multitasking I don't even know what I'm really gaining. And if I have to lose one feature my phone has now ill pass. Phone works too good right now and ics theme will hold me over for a long time.
I understand everybody wants what is new but think about everything your really gaining. To me its like IOS 4.3 to 5. I upgraded my Ipad 2 lost jailbreak for what I see as a minor upgrade.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk

You can stay on gingerbread then, it wont bother me really

I think you need to read up on what actually ICS changes besides icons and themes....

raqball said:
I think you need to read up on what actually ICS changes besides icons and themes....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From the leaks, we are not getting the new ui because of twiz
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk

kingsway8605 said:
From the leaks, we are not getting the new ui because of twiz
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Once it starts hitting custom roms, I'm sure we will be getting all sorts of interesting things.

Fataldesain said:
Besides it being new what are you really gaining. Tons of apps don't work on it. Besides folders and multitasking I don't even know what I'm really gaining. And if I have to lose one feature my phone has now ill pass. Phone works too good right now and ics theme will hold me over for a long time.
I understand everybody wants what is new but think about everything your really gaining. To me its like IOS 4.3 to 5. I upgraded my Ipad 2 lost jailbreak for what I see as a minor upgrade.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You sound like a old man in his old ways lol jk. I can't speak for everyone else but I bought my phone because it was at the time of purchase ahead of every curve (with the exception of nfc) so now that something is out that can make the phone better why the would I not want it. I'm patient in waiting but would love to have it yesterday
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium

How about true dual core support? or gpu acceleration through the whole phone?
List goes on.

Gingerbread has "true dual core support"

I'm not greedy. Because it's the New thing is the best answer I got. Newer is better right? J/k
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium

...bad joke.

Fataldesain said:
Besides it being new what are you really gaining. Tons of apps don't work on it. Besides folders and multitasking I don't even know what I'm really gaining. And if I have to lose one feature my phone has now ill pass. Phone works too good right now and ics theme will hold me over for a long time.
I understand everybody wants what is new but think about everything your really gaining. To me its like IOS 4.3 to 5. I upgraded my Ipad 2 lost jailbreak for what I see as a minor upgrade.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks to the informative Android blogs and tons of videos, most people know why they want ICS besides having a new look. As for your Ipad and losing jailbreak, you probably should have read in advance to see what features iOS 5 had before taking the plunge. I remember reading multiple times that people with jailbreak should hold up on iOS 5 until an untethered jailbreak is done. But hey, this is about Android

What I'm really waiting for is a nice AOSP ICS with everything working. I am less enthusiastic about TW ICS.

One of the videos showed better app controlled , limit or block apps from background data
Sent from my SPH-D710 using XDA App

Hmm... OP you should consider the fact that ICS source was only recently released and I think the Nexus Prime launched just today. Of course not all apps are going to work you have to give app developers time to update the apps to be compatible. It's not all going to happen overnight that's why these things take time for the transition. Although I'm a little disappointed that TW covers up some features, I am looking forward to:
*Scrollable widgets
*The swipe gesture to remove notifications
*New notification bar Info slots (i.e. when you get a text you see the contact pic)
*Face Unlock (even though it can be bypassed it's cool nonetheless)
*Camera Speed
*New widget placement UI
*New Cool Blue Look
*The drag and drop feature to make folders
*How the app market stays in the app drawer on the top right
*The minimalist layout of all the Google Apps
*A few other things I'm sure everybody knows by now...
Not to say that you have poor judgment, I do advise reading up a little more on the updates before you jump in and discredit them for changing anything. I think Google is actually just trying to make Android more accessible to more than just Devs, if anything at least give them credit for that.
If you want an entire list of things that are new and how they work, read this review (Personally I think it's the best review that covers everything) it's 7 Pages!
LINK

Guys all I'm saying is it seems like alot of people want ics just because and are foaming at the mouth for it. Isn't alot of your apps not working kinda a big deal. People should just calm down enjoy gingerbread for a few more months.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk

Improved multitasking is enough for me....a better looking OS.....speed.....better hardware acceleration...more efficient......data monitoring.......ability to block certain apps from accessing data and last but not least.............camera app (that thing needed updating)
ICS is what Android needs to be to fully compete with IOS the only real threat(since Isheep see differently). I am not too anxious to see TW and Sense on ICS
I remember when iphone first came out my buddies back in college were saying look at what I can do.....I pulled out my cingular blue razr v3 and said check this out....made a call lol
Just gotta wait till the apps are updated thats all

I have to agree with OP,to a certain extent. A lot of the new features are incremental, and I think you can duplicate most of them with already available apps/mods. Not to say I'm not going to flash ICS as soon as a good rom comes out, but I am pretty satisfied with how my phone runs now. ICS is the first step to integrate the Android phone /tablet os, like ios ,and will be much better as it evolves.
Sent from my Samsung Epic Touch using tapatalk

Only if your hiding something?
Sure, you may be able to replicate some of those features with other apps, but thats the point... it brings these features to stock android.

newalker91 said:
*Scrollable widgets - Already offered in custom launchers
*The swipe gesture to remove notifications - Just extra glamour
*New notification bar Info slots (i.e. when you get a text you see the contact pic) - More extra glamour
*Face Unlock (even though it can be bypassed it's cool nonetheless) - There are apps that already offer this
*Camera Speed - Is a hardware feature of Galaxy Nexus, not ICS
*New widget placement UI - Very similar to TouchWiz
*New Cool Blue Look - Already have themes for this
*The drag and drop feature to make folders - Already offered in custom launchers
*How the app market stays in the app drawer on the top right - Already offered in custom launchers
*The minimalist layout of all the Google Apps - Will be available based on app, not Android version
*A few other things I'm sure everybody knows by now...
Many of the things that you've listed can already be achieved or are part of the Galaxy Nexus and not ICS. Just kind of goes to reinforce the idea that most people really don't know why they want ICS. I personally find ICS to be a bit too intrusive into my privacy, especially seeing as in the recently used app overlay it shows you the last picture you took. Definitely not appealing to people in relationships.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Although I do see your point, the OP asks why I want ICS. I'm entitled to my opinion right? and I noticed the majority of the things you quoted and responded to have to do with modding the system in some way. How about having it all in one package and not having to download a bunch of apps to imitate what should come stock in the OS.
And what's wrong with a little "extra glamour" ?

I just want stock Gingerbread with better battery life and no CarrierIQ. I don't know how much faster people need these little computers to be but the E4GT is fast enough.

[REQUEST] Multiwindows???

it will be possible a porting of samsung multiwindows for the nexus 4?

Possibly, though I'm pretty sure that MultiWindow requires hooks in Touchwiz, so you would need a Touchwiz based ROM on 4.2 for it to work.

I'd love this on the N4 aswell. But it might need as said before a touchwiz rom or maybe CM11?

a rom with touchwiz wil be ok for me

There probably won't be a fully functioning Touchwiz ROM for our phone.. There are plenty of "floating" apps that offer similar functionality.
Sent from my Full Android on Grouper using Tapatalk 2

Doesn't paranoid android have this feature? And I remember a rom for the hp touch pad had this thing called cornerstone which allowed for multiple apps to be displayed at once
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app

neer2005 said:
Doesn't paranoid android have this feature? And I remember a rom for the hp touch pad had this thing called cornerstone which allowed for multiple apps to be displayed at once
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Google basically asked cornerstone to stop development of that app I think. I read that somewhere. Not sure where though.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk²

See post below.

kcls said:
Google basically asked cornerstone to stop development of that app I think. I read that somewhere. Not sure where though.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk²
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Here is some helpful info
https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!forum/cornerstone-dev

Basically what it looks like was Cyanogenmod was going to include Onskreen Cornerstone in their CM10 builds but Google are trying to stop it in a somewhat threatening maner.
See this post for more information
CM10 said:
Steve Kondik
Join group to reply
More message actions
Feb 15
We (the CM team) have been experimenting with Cornerstone on our
tablet builds. There are a few things to iron out, but for the most
part it's working pretty well. What is causing me some concern, is a
response to a re-share on Google+ by Dianne Hackborn, an engineer at
Google working on the Android platform. She raises some pretty valid
concerns (probably threatening to ban us from the Market if we include
it was a bit far over the line, though). I was wondering if someone
from Onskreen would care to comment?
https://plus.google.com/u/0/100275307499530023476/posts/ViCME1bb8F6
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Google said:
Dianne Hackborn
15 Feb 2012
+56
Okay, let me please please beg you not to do this. I can guarantee you this introduces all kinds of application compatibility issues. We work really hard to give our developers a consistent environment where their apps will operate correctly across all the devices Market runs on, not being impacted by negative reviews from bad devices that they should not have to deal specially with.
If you start making your own distributions of Android behaving in such fundamentally different ways, I suspect we are going to need to start doing things to prevent you from impacting our app ecosystem. I'm not sure what, but I could imagine things such as restricting how users can interact with Market apps on these devices (not allowing reviews or such).
We have let a lot of things in this area slide -- for example to be allowed to include Market on your device you are supposed to fully pass CTS. However, if you start really diverging from the core Android platform (I would argue this takes you well into the realm of a fork rather than a customization) then some deep issues are going to come up about how we handle these custom builds.
We have been putting a lot of thought and work for a number of years into how to let Android applications run on increasingly diverse and dynamic screens. Doing this correctly, without impacting our app developers in a negative way, is a really challenging problem. I also think it is something that needs to be done at the mainline platform level, not as a customization, because doing it right is going to require new well defined interfaces with applications for them to interact with it, possibly starting with just a facility they need to use to opt in to it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cornerstone dev said:
onhsnm
Feb 15
Steve,
Thanks for reaching out. We have heard variations on this theme for
some time, so it appears that it is time for us to respond.
We very much appreciate the amount of work that the Android team has
done to address the complexity of supporting applications on the
variety of screen sizes that "real" Android runs on. The Onskreen team
has spent an immense amount of time to continue that effort while
creating the Cornerstone experience.
As far as responding to Diane's comments directly, it’s a bit
difficult because there are no specific concerns mentioned. Her
contention appears to be that changes were made to the Android
Framework at all, not with anything specific with Cornerstone. We'd be
happy to have a conversation with them about anything specifically
they feel negatively impacts apps. We have more work to do on the
product so there are definitely items on our todo list to continue to
improve, but the first release clearly stays within the realm of an
Android optimization (most definitely not a fork) and outside of bugs,
does not break Android apps.
One of our goals was to support Android applications unchanged without
introducing Cornerstone specific APIs or modifications that
applications must conform to. As Diane said, there are some great
things we could have done by introducing multi-tasking specific
interfaces and manifest declarations, but we did not so Cornerstone
did not fragment from Android as it exists today. After all that is
what the app developers have targeted for their apps. Throughout the
code, you will find a number of architectural decisions to ensure apps
run without fragmentation (Ex: setting correct Configurations, not
running multiple instances, etc...); as well as feature decisions to
ensure the same (Ex: ability to turn Cornerstone off, removing the
ability to swap so that apps weren't forced to deal with changing
screen size, etc...)
Threats to rescind Market access are a bit much, we prefer to stick to
specifics and open a dialogue. We are happy to discuss specific
concerns and we expect that once the Google team has had a chance to
dig into the code, we will hear some. We also expect that dialogue to
make Cornerstone better for everyone, one of the reasons we open
sourced the code to start with.
hansmeet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Have you noticed...

Everyone wants to unlock their bootloader so they can run a custom ROM, the supposed purpose being to improve performance and gain new features. But then, once they get the new ROM on there, they keep posting about all the problems they are having, and how this, that or the other doesn't work as well as stock. After goofing with every, and I mean EVERY ROM available for the Razr M, IMHO there's absolutely no reason to use a custom ROM if you are expecting "like stock" performance. It's fun, it's addicting, it can get crazy sometimes, but don't expect it to ever be "Final". More than likely, it will be abandoned the moment a new phone or Android version comes along, and you'll be left with all those unsolved FCs and "almost works" features left hanging. Sad, really.
And then there's the whole "let's take the stock ROM from some other phone entirely and try to make it work on our phone" thing. I totally don't get that. If you like the Necco Choco-Android-o-rama's OS so well, why not just buy that phone instead? I'm just sayin'...
Rooting? That's totally different. I don't know what they do in other countries for bloatware, but Verizon certainly loads up some stinker software here in the US. Tell me, unless you're really into that sort of thing, why would the average shmoe care about Zappos? I certainly don't! And, if I wanted an app for NFL football, I'm perfectly capable of picking one from Google Play, yeah? Same with all the Amazon shtuff. Yeah I get it, advertising helps cover manufacturing costs, and all that jazz. Sure they do it to every new PC from Brand Name X too, but at least you can uninstall it. So rooting is sort of revenge for hogging my limited storage space and then limiting my ability to do anything about it.
And since I'm on this rant anyway, please... PLEASE!!! No more of this "Let's see if we can make our Android look like an iPhone" crap. Or worse, "Windows 8 Phone" crap! - Ewww! That's like taking a Jaguar and trying to make it look like a Ford Pinto... you might manage it, but who the heck would want it?
This rant has been a Public Service Announcement. The thoughts and views expressed herein are not to be considered... period. :silly:

You said it!
I linked to this from my restore where I have a commentary section.

I totally agree. Don't flash ROMs if your going to complain. Its one thing to report to the devs and quite another to ***** about it. And good on ya for the entire rant.
Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 4

I really hope the motox stock can be ported.
It would be a big event if he & others did it.
I thank them on each post.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2412427

I originally rooted and unlocked my bootloader on this phone because of the screen shake issue that a Motorola introduced in an update if that didn't happen I may not of rooted the phone its stock ROM has such a good layout its no wonder so many complain. I however knew what I was getting into. Rule of thumb to new flashers backups are your friend and don't piss off the developers.

I like stock... de-bloat it and its good to go... just wish I could find something to mod the navi bar... remove the recent apps button replace it with the menu button and change color of it...
Sent from my XT907 using xda app-developers app

well, the main reason why folks are not as excited about the new ROMs, is b/c there are not any ground-breaking features on the 4.2.2 or 4.3 operating systems. When I got my first android, I had Froyo. Folks were dying to get to Gingerbread in order to vastly increase performance/battery life.
the deal with Jelly Bean, is that the upgrade from stock 4.1.2 to 4.2.2 or 4.3 is minimal at best - and the changes are mostly aesthetics (although, I read that 4.3 has better bluetooth connectivity). but mostly, 4.2.2/4.3 are primarily geared towards tablets.
the race is on now to see what KitKat can bring to current phone users.
in terms of improvements, just as radorix said, these custom ROMs eliminated the shakes that I was getting on 4.1.2. so for me, while that was not a huge deal, it's enough for me to go custom.
personally, I like the tiles layout of 4.2.2 as well as the AOKP customization, so I'll stick with that for now given that my battery life/performance is stock-like.

*claps* You said it. The Razr M has actually been the first Android phone I owned where I've kept the stock ROM. I think it does fine with 4.1.2 atm, and if I really wanted a change I'd probably just theme it.

The only thing that matters to me is stability and speed. I like a fast phone and I like to o/c, push the phone. I like to test things and try to understand its problems rather than build myself because I don't have the time. If I can find the right medium between speed and stability it becomes my dd, naturally. But stock was built for a reason and every now and then I go back to 4.1.2 because I miss some of the features. Like the far left quick settings menu and Circle Clock. Why have to find a work around to add all these features and fixes to a reimagined custom OS that causes more problems when its already working? We wouldn't have anything to work with if we didn't have the source to start at!

Couldn't agree more. I've had 9 different android devices in the past 4 years. Only ones I haven't rooted are my Sony tablet s (original, don't even get me started with their abandonment of this thing, hey let's leave bugs, make a seemingly unlockable boot loader, not share any code, abandon it after realizing all the bugs exist, then support everything we make after it) and my original nexus 7. I too came back to a stock debloated deodexed ROM for the RAZR M.
Sent from my Sony Tablet S using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

JPHoller said:
Couldn't agree more. I've had 9 different android devices in the past 4 years. Only ones I haven't rooted are my Sony tablet s (original, don't even get me started with their abandonment of this thing, hey let's leave bugs, make a seemingly unlockable boot loader, not share any code, abandon it after realizing all the bugs exist, then support everything we make after it) and my original nexus 7. I too came back to a stock debloated deodexed ROM for the RAZR M.
Sent from my Sony Tablet S using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol. Not the only Sammy device they've dropped. Heard of the Galaxy Player 4.2?
Oh and ezknives, you do realize the menu button is completely redundant right? Considering it pops up if needed and isn't even supported/required for Holo apps
Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 4

sloosecannon said:
Lol. Not the only Sammy device they've dropped. Heard of the Galaxy Player 4.2?
Oh and ezknives, you do realize the menu button is completely redundant right? Considering it pops up if needed and isn't even supported/required for Holo apps
Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not for me... with-in various apps it does not... when on different ROMs and I removed the multitasking feature and replaced it with a menu key I was able to utilize features that was other wise inaccessible... like deleting messages in Facebook app for instance... that cannot be done without a menu button or opening your browser and requesting the desktop site... I just need my menu key its never there when I need it...and I don't know what halo apps are nor use it I don't believe...
Sent from my XT907 using xda app-developers app

ezknives said:
Not for me... with-in various apps it does not... when on different ROMs and I removed the multitasking feature and replaced it with a menu key I was able to utilize features that was other wise inaccessible... like deleting messages in Facebook app for instance... that cannot be done without a menu button or opening your browser and requesting the desktop site... I just need my menu key its never there when I need it...and I don't know what halo apps are nor use it I don't believe...
Sent from my XT907 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Holo means apps designed for android 4.0+.
It's the ICS+ ui style. There should be a way to access the menu without a dedicated button - either built-in or by telling the system it's a legacy app that needs the settings button to appear
Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 4

netizenmt said:
Everyone wants to unlock their bootloader so they can run a custom ROM, the supposed purpose being to improve performance and gain new features. But then, once they get the new ROM on there, they keep posting about all the problems they are having, and how this, that or the other doesn't work as well as stock. After goofing with every, and I mean EVERY ROM available for the Razr M, IMHO there's absolutely no reason to use a custom ROM if you are expecting "like stock" performance. It's fun, it's addicting, it can get crazy sometimes, but don't expect it to ever be "Final". More than likely, it will be abandoned the moment a new phone or Android version comes along, and you'll be left with all those unsolved FCs and "almost works" features left hanging. Sad, really.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Meh. I disagree. I've been running CM since it went official and I haven't had any complaints. I experience much-better-than-stock performance and battery life, plus it is way more customizable. I love it!

allc0re said:
Meh. I disagree. I've been running CM since it went official and I haven't had any complaints. I experience much-better-than-stock performance and battery life, plus it is way more customizable. I love it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just tried it again. Froze on reboot, wouldn't let me into recovery, same BS as all the 4.3 versions. And I wrote the book, well thread, on how to install it, so yeah I wiped etc.
Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 4

i'm enjoying better than stock performance on the stable 4.2.2 branch, and i built a custom kernel for CM10.1 for better performance. I tried the 'stock' life and its boring lol. The custom ROM features and better performance are what makes it worth it in my view. 4.3 will be even better as work is continually being done on it, and it hasn't been out that long. Also, I think we need to give appreciation to the devs for giving us options as far as what we can run on this phone compared to being stuck with only one choice.

CM is getting good. Recently the "display freezing" issue got fixed, also more fixes for cardock audio and wifi. It simply takes a while to get it all done properly (with that what's left is SIM I/O and HDR (works with Moto X camera application)).
@netizenmt: Booting to recovery is not affected by the ROM you have installed, so you screwed up the installation at some point.

Skrilax_CZ said:
CM is getting good. Recently the "display freezing" issue got fixed, also more fixes for cardock audio and wifi. It simply takes a while to get it all done properly (with that what's left is SIM I/O and HDR (works with Moto X camera application)).
@netizenmt: Booting to recovery is not affected by the ROM you have installed, so you screwed up the installation at some point.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Would you offer a build for a Bluetooth phone user that has the SD swap working?
One that might quiet this thread?

netizenmt said:
I just tried it again. Froze on reboot, wouldn't let me into recovery, same BS as all the 4.3 versions. And I wrote the book, well thread, on how to install it, so yeah I wiped etc.
Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are a few tricks to getting 4.3 installed and running but it will never happen if u just quite and go back to stock before u get it up and running correctly. I had a terrible time getting 4.3 to boot, keyboard forcing close, stability etc but I figured all that out and wouldn't think of going back to stock. The amount and way if partions the internal drive alone will keep me from ever going back to stock.
Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 2

stanlalee said:
There are a few tricks to getting 4.3 installed and running but it will never happen if u just quite and go back to stock before u get it up and running correctly. I had a terrible time getting 4.3 to boot, keyboard forcing close, stability etc but I figured all that out and wouldn't think of going back to stock. The amount and way if partions the internal drive alone will keep me from ever going back to stock.
Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You actually just made my whole point.
While it's cool you had time, patience, skill and effort to resolve your issues with 4.3, that's not the point of this thread. So do I. The point is, if you think you're going to slap one of these ROMs on and everything is going to work like stock, forget it. If that's what someone expects, they should stick to stock.
Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 4

Any dev working on bringing back Adobe Flash compatibility to Kitkat?

Looking and searching for days on this topic. Could not find word on anybody working on it.
It is pretty heavy handed for Google to issue an update that reduces to functionality to their device. I use Adobe flash may be 5% of the time on my phone, but still, if I don't use it at all, I will just use an iPhone. No point in letting Google make money from my searches.

It's not Google job to keep Adobe Flash Player updated.

k3lcior said:
It's not Google job to keep Adobe Flash Player updated.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Adobe flash player doesn't have to be updated. Out dated versions work fine on Android 4.3. But compatibility is completely gone on Kitkat.

Yes, because Adobe is no longer updating it.

This is what Dolphin says on the developer's website (https://dolphinbrowser.desk.com/cus...id-4-4-how-do-i-enable-flash-player-?b_id=317) --
The Adobe Flash Player is no longer compatible with Android 4.4 Kitkat devices. Some critical APIs have been removed from Android 4.4 Kitkat that all browser cannot activate the flash player. We are working on to provide better video playing experience.

sparksd said:
This is what Dolphin says on the developer's website (https://dolphinbrowser.desk.com/cus...id-4-4-how-do-i-enable-flash-player-?b_id=317) --
The Adobe Flash Player is no longer compatible with Android 4.4 Kitkat devices. Some critical APIs have been removed from Android 4.4 Kitkat that all browser cannot activate the flash player. We are working on to provide better video playing experience.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Right, but is anyone working on this at the rom level?

which APIs and why are they removed?

Galaid said:
which APIs and why are they removed?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Website rendering is no longer done by AOSP(which renders flash). Now it's done by chromium (which doesn't render flash)

Lolento said:
Adobe flash player doesn't have to be updated. Out dated versions work fine on Android 4.3. But compatibility is completely gone on Kitkat.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As someone else already said, it's not Google's job to keep Adobe's app updated.
You're basically relying on old technology that should have been gone for a long time already. If you think about it that way, ask yourself, why doesn't Windows rely on MS-DOS anymore (it was there in older versions, so why isn't it there now)?
And I don't see how switching to iPhone would help in any way, you can't sideload apps or have Flash at all actually. Do you really want to go from a 7" screen to a 4" one? And wouldn't you use Google on iOS too?

Bogdacutu said:
As someone else already said, it's not Google's job to keep Adobe's app updated.
You're basically relying on old technology that should have been gone for a long time already. If you think about it that way, ask yourself, why doesn't Windows rely on MS-DOS anymore (it was there in older versions, so why isn't it there now)?
And I don't see how switching to iPhone would help in any way, you can't sideload apps or have Flash at all actually. Do you really want to go from a 7" screen to a 4" one? And wouldn't you use Google on iOS too?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your argument is exactly why I will not longer consider Android as my next whatever device. Even when MS no longer base windows on DOS, the underlying DOS commamds are still supported.
Google is pretty heavy handed in trying force users to move away from flash. There are better tech available, I agree, but there asre still tons of websites using flash exclusively. These websites are completely essentially to the people who use it.
I also want to ask, aside from flash, objectively, what makes Android better iOS. Nothing, imo.
I believe App vs App, the quality of Apps on iOS is better than Android, even the Google one. I dont really sideload anything aside from flash, which i use to access sports websites.

Lolento said:
Your argument is exactly why I will not longer consider Android as my next whatever device. Even when MS no longer base windows on DOS, the underlying DOS commamds are still supported.
Google is pretty heavy handed in trying force users to move away from flash. There are better tech available, I agree, but there asre still tons of websites using flash exclusively. These websites are completely essentially to the people who use it.
I also want to ask, aside from flash, objectively, what makes Android better iOS. Nothing, imo.
I believe App vs App, the quality of Apps on iOS is better than Android, even the Google one. I dont really sideload anything aside from flash, which i use to access sports websites.
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Android gives you customization where as iPhone pretty much tells you how your layout is going to be. A lot more freedom on Android, that is the biggest difference for me. You're definitely on the wrong forums to start an iOS vs Android debate though.

Lolento said:
Even when MS no longer base windows on DOS, the underlying DOS commamds are still supported.
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Last time I checked the 16-bit subsystem was no longer there in 64-bit Windows.
Lolento said:
Google is pretty heavy handed in trying force users to move away from flash.
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I don't understand why you keep blaming Google and not Apple, who ceased development on Flash for mobile devices 2 YEARS AGO

Lolento said:
Your argument is exactly why I will not longer consider Android as my next whatever device. Even when MS no longer base windows on DOS, the underlying DOS commamds are still supported.
Google is pretty heavy handed in trying force users to move away from flash. There are better tech available, I agree, but there asre still tons of websites using flash exclusively. These websites are completely essentially to the people who use it.
I also want to ask, aside from flash, objectively, what makes Android better iOS. Nothing, imo.
I believe App vs App, the quality of Apps on iOS is better than Android, even the Google one. I dont really sideload anything aside from flash, which i use to access sports websites.
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So your willing to go pick up a new over priced device which gives you next to no freedom on it for customization, for a old, out dated, inefficient system of flash? Even though that device also has no flash support ? Glad we settled that.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app

Joppykid said:
Android gives you customization where as iPhone pretty much tells you how your layout is going to be. A lot more freedom on Android, that is the biggest difference for me. You're definitely on the wrong forums to start an iOS vs Android debate though.
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This is not even an iOS or Android debate, I can pick up a Windows device, who knows.
Google removing flash support is the last straw for me. And I am surprised that no else see it as getting escalatingly worse.
Here are a few things that Google did this year.
1. Gmail exchange active sync support removed
2. Youtube comment ties to Google+
3. Google dropping voice support for third party apps
4. And now removal of the killer app, adobe flash, that brought me over from iOS in the first place
Also, i have been using android for the past three years. The level of customization on Android is more of a toy box than anything else. With the removal of adobe flash support, the core functionality is identical and i would even give Windows Phone an edge over both iOS and Android.
Lastly, btw, this thread is about whether any dev is working to bring adobe flash back to 4.4. I didnt start this debate.

Lolento said:
This is not even an iOS or Android debate, I can pick up a Windows device, who knows.
Google removing flash support is the last straw for me. And I am surprised that no else see it as getting escalatingly worse.
Here are a few things that Google did this year.
1. Gmail exchange active sync support removed
2. Youtube comment ties to Google+
3. Google dropping voice support for third party apps
4. And now removal of the killer app, adobe flash, that brought me over from iOS in the first place
Also, i have been using android for the past three years. The level of customization on Android is more of a toy box than anything else. With the removal of adobe flash support, the core functionality is identical and i would even give Windows Phone an edge over both iOS and Android.
Lastly, btw, this thread is about whether any dev is working to bring adobe flash back to 4.4. I didnt start this debate.
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Couldn't agree more... If only iOS have a 5" phone, I'd have jump ship.
The customization advantage is getting lesser by the day...

Lolento said:
This is not even an iOS or Android debate, I can pick up a Windows device, who knows.
Google removing flash support is the last straw for me. And I am surprised that no else see it as getting escalatingly worse.
Here are a few things that Google did this year.
1. Gmail exchange active sync support removed
2. Youtube comment ties to Google+
3. Google dropping voice support for third party apps
4. And now removal of the killer app, adobe flash, that brought me over from iOS in the first place
Also, i have been using android for the past three years. The level of customization on Android is more of a toy box than anything else. With the removal of adobe flash support, the core functionality is identical and i would even give Windows Phone an edge over both iOS and Android.
Lastly, btw, this thread is about whether any dev is working to bring adobe flash back to 4.4. I didnt start this debate.
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How is comparing pros and cons of two competing operating systems not a debate?
You asked "what makes android better than iOS, nothing IMO" I told you what I liked about Android over iOS. And you only mentioned iOS and Android in all of your posts, nothing about windows.
I understand that flash is a big deal for a lot of people. I am unaware of any devs working on it. Sounds like it may be tough with Google removing the framework needed for flash. I doubt many devs want to put time in to developing something that is starting to get phased out. Good luck in your quest to find flash.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

Joppykid said:
I understand that flash is a big deal for a lot of people. I am unaware of any devs working on it. Sounds like it may be tough with Google removing the framework needed for flash. I doubt many devs want to put time in to developing something that is starting to get phased out. Good luck in your quest to find flash.
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Not just starting to get phased out. As far as Google is concerned, you aren't supposed to keep using an app that hasn't been updated for 2 years (and if the only app using the framework was pretty much abandoned a long time ago why would they have to keep supporting it?)

Lolento said:
Even when MS no longer base windows on DOS, the underlying DOS commamds are still supported.
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How does that compare? Want me to list the hundreds of programs that no longer work in modern Windows incarnations? How about most Creative sound cards? Is that MS' fault? I wouldn't say that, but you probably would.
Google is pretty heavy handed in trying force users to move away from flash. There are better tech available, I agree, but there asre still tons of websites using flash exclusively. These websites are completely essentially to the people who use it.
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So Adobe is moving away from Flash for mobile and you are saying it's Google's fault for not making sure every outdated app works on their newest OS version?
I also want to ask, aside from flash, objectively, what makes Android better iOS. Nothing, imo.
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"objectively" - "imo". 'Nuff said.
I believe App vs App, the quality of Apps on iOS is better than Android, even the Google one.
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And that's your right, but don't spin it as anything other than your own biased opinion. Also, I'm pretty sure those sports websites never worked on iOS devices, ever.

I think its a good move by Google, the faster website developers will realize flash is outdated the better for everyone, less users using flash content because its incompatible will force them to switch to html5, sooner or later.
Homever Adobe should stop supporting desktop version too, it would fasten up the process alot.

Again, I was not inviting a debate in my OP. But if it needs to continue, it can.
Firstly, on Windows platform, in every modern iteration, there is a compatibility mode that maintains (to a certain extent) backwards compatibility. This is how MS does business, they dont go out of nowhere to drop support for a key piece of software. My windows 7 setup is backward compatible to software back to Windows 95.
Google, on the other hand, drops third party support for anything that they have a market share strangle hold on. Mark my word on this. It started with exchange sync support for gmail, then google voice, it will not stop there.
I think everyone hopes that web devs will realize flash player is dead. This is wishful thinking. Just like I wish voice call and sms should be dead.
Fact is, there are still millions of websites that are still dependent on flash player. They are still essential to people who uses these websites. I really dont care if Google supports or not, my OP asked if anyone else is working on it.
I switched from iPhone to Android years ago because Steve Job's Apple is a bully in their vision of technology. I see google as going down the same path.
Google doesn't really make anything that blow people's mind. They make things that are cheap and are good enough. I can easily and happily switch. In fact, I already made up my mind to test out the Dell Venue 8 Pro with Win 8.1 since the holiday deals look pretty good.
Lastly, I think someone misunderstood the diff between 'objective' vs 'subjective'.

What is going to happen to trebuchet?

Simple question, really.
Trebuchet was CyanogenMod's default launcher. Is that going to be updated and maintained or will Lineage just use Google Now Launcher or similar?

The only reason I can think of for LineageOS not continuing to maintain and update Trebuchet would be if Cyanogen Inc had close sourced it. I do not know if that is the case, but it seems unlikely.
Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

Trebuchet, at least on my device (HTC A9) is a steaming pile of ?that would be better off if It died. It's literally had the same problems since CM 12. As far as I can tell it's been abandoned anyway. It's a lot like Internet explorer in that sense. It's there to work good enough to allow you to install an actual launcher.
Sent from my HTC One A9 using Tapatalk

scott8281 said:
Trebuchet, at least on my device (HTC A9) is a steaming pile of 💩that would be better of if It died. It's literally had the same problems since CM 12. As far as I can tell it's been abandoned anyway. It's a lot like Internet explorer in that sense. It's there to work good enough to allow you to install an actual launcher.
Sent from my HTC One A9 using Tapatalk
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LOL, yeah I use Nova myself.
Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

SteveYoungs said:
LOL, yeah I use Nova myself.
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Same. I use nova for the customisation. I was just curious as to what would become of trebuchet.

Doofitator said:
Same. I use nova for the customisation. I was just curious as to what would become of trebuchet.
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I haven't heard a clear answer yet but I suspect things like trebuchet, snap or anything else that was CM related might pose a legal danger. I've read quite a bit on it but it's terribly complicated. There's cyanogen OS , cyanogen mod and Android AOSP.
From what I've read cyanogen OS is the only thing cyanogen Inc really owns but I know when the transition first happened several devs pulled apps that had been intergraded with CM. I'm not sure whether they did that because it meant they'd have to surrender there ability to keep the app open source because of cyanogen os or they weren't happy with the deal or what. Perhaps someone else can shed more light on it.
I'm curious to know how many of the tweaks (such as is system settings) and apps (such as trebuchet) are actually licensed under cyanogen Inc. I guess we will soon find out.
Seeing how they shut the server's down early I'm guessing it was a nasty break up and in those deals we might see a level of legal pettiness that might not usually be seen in a more civil breakup. The guy Kondik hired appears to a be a huge douchenozzle.
Sent from my HTC One A9 using Tapatalk

scott8281 said:
I haven't heard a clear answer yet but I suspect things like trebuchet, snap or anything else that was CM related might pose a legal danger. I've read quite a bit on it but it's terribly complicated. There's cyanogen OS , cyanogen mod and Android AOSP.
From what I've read cyanogen OS is the only thing cyanogen Inc really owns but I know when the transition first happened several devs pulled apps that had been intergraded with CM. I'm not sure whether they did that because it meant they'd have to surrender there ability to keep the app open source because of cyanogen os or they weren't happy with the deal or what. Perhaps someone else can shed more light on it.
I'm curious to know how many of the tweaks (such as is system settings) and apps (such as trebuchet) are actually licensed under cyanogen Inc. I guess we will soon find out.
Seeing how they shut the server's down early I'm guessing it was a nasty break up and in those deals we might see a level of legal pettiness that might not usually be seen in a more civil breakup. The guy Kondik hired appears to a be a huge douchenozzle.
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So huge of one he bailed on his own ship & crew, so the new guy could tread water lol.

I love Trébuchet !