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Hello
I just phone up O2 UK Customer Service and I ask them for the Network Unlock COde and the Operator that take my call say is illegal to unlock your o2 mobile and you isnt allow to do that anyway
Oh my god.... LOL cant believe she say that.... she so stupid
weasley said:
Hello
I just phone up O2 UK Customer Service and I ask them for the Network Unlock COde and the Operator that take my call say is illegal to unlock your o2 mobile and you isnt allow to do that anyway
Oh my god.... LOL cant believe she say that.... she so stupid
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If you bought the phone on a contract then she is absolutely correct.
When you buy the phone on a twelve month contract, then that contract forms a part of the sale. In other words, you havn't finished paying for the phone until the twelve months is up. Given that the phone is still, in part, owned by O2, they can put restrictions on your useage in their terms and conditions including preventing you using the phone on someone else's network. To change the state of the phone whilst it is still under contract it breaking that contract.
I'm afraid, if you want to use the phone somewhere else, you have to pay for the phone yourself! If you want someone else to help you pay for the phone (by getting it massively discounted on a contract) then you have to accept the restrictions that come with that - or wait for someone to create an unlocking utility
i bought it Sim-Free From THE LINK for £550 But is still locked to O2
so in other word the Phone isnt sim-free after all
weasley said:
i bought it Sim-Free From THE LINK for £550 But is still locked to O2
so in other word the Phone isnt sim-free after all
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In that case, I think you need to speak to the link, not O2.
It's not correct to say it's illegal.
Secondly, O2 don't own the phone. It's yours.
Thirdly, get on their case. Mither them, write to them and write a complaint to ofcom.
Bassey said:
weasley said:
i bought it Sim-Free From THE LINK for £550 But is still locked to O2
so in other word the Phone isnt sim-free after all
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In that case, I think you need to speak to the link, not O2.
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Been to THE LINK First then call o2
In the Link they say Is a O2 Device and you should contact O2 for the unlock code since the stock is came from O2 Directly
It is definitely not illegal to unlock a phone in Europe. In the US, it might fall under the DMCA, and be considered illegal.
Like Bassey said, the contract you signed might forbid you from unlocking the phone, but this would be a case for civil court. No operator would find it sensible to pursue individuals who unlock their phone unless this becomes a major problem.
LeSkip said:
It is definitely not illegal to unlock a phone in Europe. In the US, it might fall under the DMCA, and be considered illegal.
Like Bassey said, the contract you signed might forbid you from unlocking the phone, but this would be a case for civil court. No operator would find it sensible to pursue individuals who unlock their phone unless this becomes a major problem.
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The XDA IIs is not from Contract..... is supose to be Sim-free.... on my invoice is say Unconnect Sim-free O2 XDA IIs
so I should entitle to get the phone to be unlock since i am not commit to a contracy
As has been said already - if you have bought it supposedly sim-free from the link, then your gripe is with them as they are breaking trades descriptions laws by selling a sim-free unit when it is network locked.
In my understanding, no phone company would ever block you from getting a phone unlocked through their own channels as it is still revenue for them if they charge you. You are still tied to the contract anyway, therefore they know they will make money out of you either way.
The only way you may have trouble from the network is if you unlock independently, as they can then claim you have tampered with the handset and are therefore out of warranty should you have a fault with the unit.
The Link are definately out of order here. The problem is that you've bought it sim free, so you don't have a Service Provider. And the link are basically telling you to ring your Service Provider. ITS THEM!!.
To get a quick soluiton email your IMEI and proof of purchase to [email protected] and they will sort it out. They did for me.
JD
Ludicrous, really...
It seems that every time you speak to someone at O2 customer services you get different answers; it's verging on the ridiculous.
My situation is that I will be travelling to Montana in the US on business next month, but the city which I'm going to is not covered by any of O2's roaming network partners - information that I double-checked before contacting O2.
Armed with this knowledge, I set about emailing O2 support. I explained the situation, and the responses were as follows (edited for brevity)
Me: I'd like to SIM unlock my XDA IIs as I'm going abroad to an area that O2 do not have sufficient roaming partner network coverage.
O2: SIM Unlocking costs £15, but we don't unlock handests until after your 12 month contract is up.
Me: Hang on a minute, I'm locked into the contract for 12 months anyway, and on my O2 Max tarriff, you'll get at least £900 out of me for the duration. If I were to cancel my contract, I'd still have to pay O2 the remainder of my line rental and, if I didn't, you could but a global bar on the handset's IMEI... so where's the risk to O2?
O2 Yes, we confirm you've had your handset for less than 12 months; if you wish to cancel, you'll need to pay us for the remaining line rental. If you wish to use your handset abroad, you need to have international roaming activated. To do this, you will need to lodge a £100 deposit against your account, which is refundable after three months.
Me FFS! I never said I wanted to cancel, and my tariff already includes ITS (as published) and now you say I have to pay £100 to roam? Did you miss the part where I mentioned that you have NO PARTNER COVERAGE in the area which I'm travelling to?? Please escalate this issue to a supervisor.
O2 Hello. You have had your contract for less than twelve months. If you wish to SIM unlock your handset, you will have to cancel your contract, pay for any outstanding call charges and the line due for the remaining portion of your contract, plus a £15 unlock fee.
... at this point, I could kill... so I telephone O2 customer services instead.
I get told:
1. The O2 shop can do it for you
2. The O2 shop tells me they'll call customer services on my behalf
3. The O2 shop calls me and says "They say it'll cost over £900"
4. I call O2 customer services - again - and ask for a supervisor, and get told to contact O2 network services on a different number
5. O2 network services say they DO have partner coverage in Montana, and that this info is on their website... I'm not near a PC when I take this call, so I cant check.
I get to my desk, get to the O2 website and check for Billings, Montana, USA under international coverage. Guess what? No Coverage
6. I call O2 customer services again, thinking to myself that perhaps a lesser person would have resorted to mass-murder by now. I explain the situation in detail again, get told "can't unlock under 12 months yada yada" and then ask to speak to a manager. Two minutes of being on hold and then I'm told - "Right, we're organising your unlock code for you"
A half dozen emails and about 1 hour of 0870 calls to get there.
Compare and contrast this with my call to Orange to SIM unlock my SPV C500 yesterday:
Me Hello, SIM unlock yada yada
Orange Fine; we've requested the code and will call you for your £20 payment once we have it, which will be around 5 business days time.
I've had my C500 since August 26th... yes, five whole months
So, in summation
O2 = first to market with the goods, but crap support
Orange = late getting the handsets, but very little hassle
i totally agree with u
when i got my vodafone SE v800 with contract
i called the customer service the same day say i want a network unlock code .... they say fine there will be a charge of £25.... i say that fine no problem .... after they give me the code straight away no question asked
From taking contract out to un-sim lock mt phone take no longer than 15min
I usually dnt like voadfone bcoz there low coverage in my area but that time is the first time i prasie them
O2 also told me if was illegal to unlock my XDA II. Eventually (after speaking to several O2 representatives) they agreed to do it for £25 charge and said it could take up to 28 days to be applied.
At that point I downloaded the unlock utility and within 2 mins had a nice unlocked XDAII.
Seems to me the least hassle to get the phone unlocked !
cheers
Russ.
Re: Ludicrous, really...
TheMadScot said:
A half dozen emails and about 1 hour of 0870 calls to get there.
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Hi.
Thought you may be interested in the following service:
http://www.registeredcall.com/?cat=2&subcat=1&compID=2
You call this 0871 number and record phone conversations. You can then download the audio file or send a link to the file if needed.
Use it when you are phoning customer services etc so you have a copy of what people have told you - very usefull.
I have no connection with the service - I just think its a handy tool to use.
Regards,
Ian Watson
russ said:
O2 also told me if was illegal to unlock my XDA II. Eventually (after speaking to several O2 representatives) they agreed to do it for £25 charge and said it could take up to 28 days to be applied.
At that point I downloaded the unlock utility and within 2 mins had a nice unlocked XDAII.
Seems to me the least hassle to get the phone unlocked !
cheers
Russ.
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Y'know, if someone out there had developed a utility to unlock the XDA IIs, I'd have done the same thing
Unfortunately time wasn't on my side here... it's less expensive for me to pick up a Verizon or Sprint pre-pay SIM for my XDA IIs than to go to the trouble of either
a) Purchasing a pre-pay mobile in Montana, or
b) Renting a handset for use whilst I'm there
I'd rather pay the £15 to O2, get a pre-pay SIM when I touch down, and alter my O2 voicemail to say "I'm out of the country; call me on +1 xxx etc. if you need me" for the duration of my stay. That way I'll retain all my important data on my IIs, be able to dial within the States when necessary without spending silly money, and call back to the UK to retreive my voicemail without it costing a packet.
The one feature of my IIs that'll get worked overtime is the built in WiFi; there's plenty of hotspots around so I might even take a look at Skype for those occasions I need to call
SIM FREE does not mean unlocked to all networks, it means the phone is sold without a sim, I know we assume that sim free means unlocked but that is not the case, if it was the case it would be advertised as open to all networks, crafty maybe but there is no onus on the the link to do any more for you.
I'm pretty sure in this case you could probably push them for selling it with misleading information.
I do appreciate what you're saying though and again, we dont have all the facts of how the salesman actually described the product to the buyer.
that's strange, i just got my xda IIi and then phone to the O2 customer service, they said that i have to pay 15 pounds, then they will send the unlock code to me within 14 days.
weasley said:
LeSkip said:
It is definitely not illegal to unlock a phone in Europe. In the US, it might fall under the DMCA, and be considered illegal.
Like Bassey said, the contract you signed might forbid you from unlocking the phone, but this would be a case for civil court. No operator would find it sensible to pursue individuals who unlock their phone unless this becomes a major problem.
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The XDA IIs is not from Contract..... is supose to be Sim-free.... on my invoice is say Unconnect Sim-free O2 XDA IIs
so I should entitle to get the phone to be unlock since i am not commit to a contracy
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This is OUTRAGEOUS!!!! "SIM free" generally means unlocked... so you're supposed to be able to use any wireless carrier... Even though the word "SIM free" word-for-word means "no SIM" and not necessarily means unlocked, the "SIM free" word has been widely used to indicate that a device is also unlocked.
It's clear that "The Link" is playing word games with its customers. This vendor is NOT TO BE TRUSTED AGAIN...
From what has been said (and not having seen your contract with the Link or the full surrounding circumstances) it sounds like:
1 Either the link is in breach of its contract/its obligations to you as a consumer under Sale of Goods Act (SOGA); or
2 You have an actionable remedy for misrepresentation against the Link shop involved (you would need to verify that there is no small print at the point of sale or alongside the demonstration phone defining exactly what sim free means/that you weren't informed of what this meant by the sales assistant).
Absent any definition of Sim free I think it is reasonable to intrepret this as available for use with any network.
Contract/Sale of Goods Act
There are certain terms implied into all consumer contracts by SOGA. The most important being that the phone is of satisfactory quality and fit for the purpose and as described. Important here is to check through the point of sale posters and leaflets etc (see above). Also when you were speaking to the sales representative did you make know to him or her that you would be making use of this phone with another sim. If you did then this puts you in a real position of strength as you will have expressly made a particular purpose known to the vendor. If not you still probably have a reasonable case that either the phone is not of satisfactory quality (given the manner in which it was described) or that there is an actionable misrepresentation.
Misrepresentation
There are 3 types of misrepresentation (innocent, negligent and fraudulent) with technically differing effects upon your contract. But leaving the legal technicalities aside, at the very least there is a good argument that there has been an innocent or negligent misrepresentation by the Link here aside from a breach of SOGA. Either way you are entitled to demand that the Link resolve this situation to your satisfaction or threaten to take them to the small claims court.
Conclusion
Where you get to, is do you want the phone? If yes, write to them and demand that they resolve this with 02 forthwith. State your legal rights to them as outlined above (remember to think about your particular circumstances). Alternatively if you don't get anywhere say that you will and pay the necessary unlocking charge to O2 and will seek a refund of this charge and your costs from the Link (keeping the Link notified in writing and retaining all paperwork and receipts). You can then take action against the Link (if necessary) to recover it.
If you don't wish to keep the phone, then return it to them and demand a refund immediately. Do not delay.
Finally, there are various helpful guides to your rights as a consumer on the government sites - see dti.gov.uk and look for sale of goods act. Remember that everything depends on the facts of a particular case.
Good luck
P.S Finally, having given some pro bono advice, I would appreciate some help in return from anyone who would be willing to spend 30 minutes on the telephone with me going through the upgrading process. Having read through Wiki I am getting lost with all the Dos commands root files etc. If anyone can, please PM me.
Thanks J
I posted the thread about Bell and Virgin taking pre-orders the other day and I'm the one that is supposed to receive the phone for $235. But Bell called me 36 hours after the deal had been made to try and tell me they couldn't do it.
I've spoken with a few reps and 2 supervisors and now I'm waiting for a manager call back.
A little background:
I called early, was offered a data discount of $415. The rep checked and double checked just to be sure and the order was put through.
Then later on in the day, the option to get the phone off contract had disappeared along with the option to get it on a 1 or 2 year term. So I entered into a chat with a live online rep, and he also double checked and reassured me I was eligible for the discount and able to get the phone. All systems go.
Now yesterday, after work they called me. Telling me they couldn't authorize it. So now, like I said, I'm waiting for a call from a manager.
My main argument is that they entered into a verbal contract with me. I understand their employees made a mistake, but that isn't my fault. I was just there to capitalize. Help me!
Verbal contracts are as binding as written, only harder to prove, if you have a logg over your online chat, copy it and keep it!
Sent from my X10i using xda premium
Tjotte said:
Verbal contracts are as binding as written, only harder to prove, if you have a logg over your online chat, copy it and keep it!
Sent from my X10i using xda premium
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I decided not to save the online chat I really really should of. But I have another one stating my ability to get the phone on no contract on the day of release.
Did you not receive confirmation of the pre-order? Surely they have to honour it, after checking three times and saying it was OK?
Neville.Holland said:
Did you not receive confirmation of the pre-order? Surely they have to honour it, after checking three times and saying it was OK?
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I would hope so. But no, I didn't receive an email or anything because the phone was set to go on my bill. But as I stated, there are several notes on my account confirming that I was to get the phone for the discounted price.
This doesn't really surprise me. I've heard people say a lot of bad things about Rogers, but I'm starting to reconsider switching to Bell for the Nexus. As I mentioned in your other thread on Monday, they actually refused to sign me up as a new Bell customer... and now you're having these problems... maybe I should just wait for Rogers to get the Nexus in January...
I just called a Bell store yesterday and asked if I could reserve a handset. They said that wasn't a problem and they just require my name and number. I told them clearly i was going to buy if off of contract and he said that is fine. I proceeded to ask him how many devices I can buy and he said they do not have a per client cap on device sales.
Needless to say I will be at the bell store at 10am on the 8th and buying a few Galaxy Nexuseseses =)
Goat_For_Sale said:
Needless to say I will be at the bell store at 10am on the 8th and buying a few Galaxy Nexuseseses =)
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and selling it to people in the US for a since profit
Goat_For_Sale said:
I just called a Bell store yesterday and asked if I could reserve a handset. They said that wasn't a problem and they just require my name and number. I told them clearly i was going to buy if off of contract and he said that is fine. I proceeded to ask him how many devices I can buy and he said they do not have a per client cap on device sales.
Needless to say I will be at the bell store at 10am on the 8th and buying a few Galaxy Nexuseseses =)
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Thats all lovely, I just really want them to honor the price they offered. Fingers are crossed.
Tjotte said:
Verbal contracts are as binding as written, only harder to prove, if you have a logg over your online chat, copy it and keep it!
Sent from my X10i using xda premium
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That is a massive misconception. Verbal contracts are *NOT* binding in the same way that written contracts are. Don't believe everything you hear on television.
Secondly, verbal contracts, irrelevant of their legality, can be broken very easily, when it comes to commerce. If the party providing the service (Bell, in this case) decides they don't want to provide the service for the price agreed upon, they can cancel the entire contract. What this means is you would have the right to cancel the transaction (assuming the price has actually changed from the time you agreed upon it) and walk away without penalty.
Now, do you have no assurance at all, in writing, that you were purchasing the phone for that price? Don't you have a pay stub, credit card transaction, or anything? They can't "force" you to buy the phone for the full price if you agreed upon a lower price. Legally, they *do* have to give you the option of cancelling the transaction (once again, if the final price was different from the agreed-upon price).
Now, on to the "verbal contract" misconception. There are 3 parts of a contract, both verbal and written (let's see if I remember their names). Offer, Acceptance, and Consideration.
Offer: Someone offers something. In this case, Bell offers you service for a certain price.
Acceptance: The offer is accepted. In this case, you accepted the offer by agreeing to purchase the item.
Consideration: Something must be exchanged. In this case, it was most likely a charge placed on your credit card. Usually it's a downpayment of some kind, or sometimes just a promise/contract that it'll be paid.
Sounds like only 2 of those have been met...which makes this *not* a verbal contract. Even if the third had been, when the contract terms change (the price), the accepting party has the right to opt out.
hotleadsingerguy said:
That is a massive misconception. Verbal contracts are *NOT* binding in the same way that written contracts are. Don't believe everything you hear on television.
Secondly, verbal contracts, irrelevant of their legality, can be broken very easily, when it comes to commerce. If the party providing the service (Bell, in this case) decides they don't want to provide the service for the price agreed upon, they can cancel the entire contract. What this means is you would have the right to cancel the transaction (assuming the price has actually changed from the time you agreed upon it) and walk away without penalty.
Now, do you have no assurance at all, in writing, that you were purchasing the phone for that price? Don't you have a pay stub, credit card transaction, or anything? They can't "force" you to buy the phone for the full price if you agreed upon a lower price. Legally, they *do* have to give you the option of cancelling the transaction (once again, if the final price was different from the agreed-upon price).
Now, on to the "verbal contract" misconception. There are 3 parts of a contract, both verbal and written (let's see if I remember their names). Offer, Acceptance, and Consideration.
Offer: Someone offers something. In this case, Bell offers you service for a certain price.
Acceptance: The offer is accepted. In this case, you accepted the offer by agreeing to purchase the item.
Consideration: Something must be exchanged. In this case, it was most likely a charge placed on your credit card. Usually it's a downpayment of some kind, or sometimes just a promise/contract that it'll be paid.
Sounds like only 2 of those have been met...which makes this *not* a verbal contract. Even if the third had been, when the contract terms change (the price), the accepting party has the right to opt out.
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Unfortunately, you're most likely correct. I just have to bank on the good will of the manager I'm going to talk to. I will report back once I've spoken with them.
HideYoKids said:
Unfortunately, you're most likely correct. I just have to bank on the good will of the manager I'm going to talk to. I will report back once I've spoken with them.
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lol not to be self-indulgent, but I'm not just *most likely* correct
Unfortunately, all they were willing to give me was $100 bill credit and 2 free months of my voice plan, for a total of $150. Instead of the $415 I was originally offered.
Hey guys, i might be buying a note 2 very soon .. I was just wondering if any of u got it unlocked? If yes then HOW MUCH DID YOU SPEND ..
Cellunlock.net offers it for 25$. Looking for some cheap alternatives !!
Call T-Mobile, and ask to have the phone unlocked. I had to fax them a receipt (a t-mobile one, which made no sense to me), along with my remedy trouble ticket number, and imei. They later sent me the unlock code. Free.
My store said they would do it for free after 30 days.
I paid the $25 because I didn't want to wait and I wanted to try it out on ATT.
i was thinking to buy a tmobile one and use it at my local network .. for that I need the unlock code .. 25$ is not what I am looking to spend ..
Again, it's free if you buy a t-mobile one and call their customer service to get the unlock code.
mdt73 said:
Again, it's free if you buy a t-mobile one and call their customer service to get the unlock code.
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If they give you static, just tell them you plan to go overseas and need it unlocked for that.
I dont think they will give the code to a new contract !!
Tell them you are going out of the country, and if they won't budge contact me and I can get it unlocked for about $15.
Guys, chill out. There is really no need to be so concerned about unlock codes. I work for T-Mobile, and I want to offer some advice. Completely on my personal accord, not as part of my job with T-Mobile of course. Mind you, I will not do anything that violates any NDA or other agreement, contract, association that I have with T-Mobile, but I can offer the policy information, since it is not anything I wouldn't tell any other customer I talked to as part of the job.
Basically, if you buy a phone from T-Mobile you can get it unlocked, so long as you are at least 40 days into your account. Not contract, not tenure, but account. The account you are using the phone on has to have been open at least 40 days. You also have to have used the phone on that a line on that account. Meaning you made at least 1-2 minutes worth of phone calls.
Otherwise, assuming you bought it and do not want to use it on your account, you can send in proof of purchase that you bought it at full cost, or they can see on your account that you bought it. Phone purchases in store, just to address one earlier comment, do not always show the full receipt information (device, etc) and that is why a fax is required. Purchases made through customer care, online, or through telesales, are viewable through the proper phone team.
If you buy a phone at full cost and DO NOT have a T-Mobile account, you can get it unlocked by calling in and providing the imei number and they will submit the request. No faxing or any other hassle. Many agents are not aware of this exception in the policy because it does not come up all that often. So you may get someone on the line who is unaware and will swear up and down that it is not part of policy. I, personally, have had to spend time talking to managers who did not even know this part of policy. However, it is a part of a policy, and therefore is the easiest way to unlock the device.
There are other little minor things in policy, but most of what I have said is for the average buyer. Also, note that 'going overseas' is not any sort of exception to policy. If you do not meet the normal policy requirements, you could be going to the moon for all it matters and it would not be any reason to go outside of policy. The requests are completed by an offline team, and they are strict to policy. I have seen many customers get angry because "the store told me I could just call in and unlock it" or "I am going overseas in two days and that is why I bought the phone in the first place." If you say you are going overseas, then you will just be offered international roaming information for using T-Mobile overseas, or be told about cancelling your contract, paying any applicable ETF, and then getting the unlock request submitted in as part of the cancelled account part of the policy (which has its own set of requirements).
As a disclaimer I will say that while I work for T-Mobile, I am not writing this as part of any association with T-Mobile, and I do not condone any abuse of policy or misrepresentation in order to circumvent or manipulate policy. I also will not do anything outside of policy for anyone. I am unable to submit any unlock requests for anyone or call in for anyone or do anything of the such.
However, I do hope my advice helps.
The only real time to pay to get the device unlocked is if you just bought the phone at a discount, started a brand new T-Mobile account, and are under 40 days since activating your account.
phoenixbennu said:
Guys, chill out.[...]
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just to back phoenix up (thanks for the writeup btw) i've done this twice on Tmo
- 30+ days into my value plan and I requested the code for my s3, had it the next day in my email.
- paid full price for another s3, same thing, didn't have to wait at all, just called and requested the same day.
easy as pie.
Thanx phoenix... N other guys .. I will try to get it done from t mobile only ..
I purchased the phone outright from T-Mobile, did the fax thing the next day, and proceeded to wait about a week for the unlock team to get me my code. Glad I didn't need to have it with Solavei. Of course I found that out after the fact, lol!
mdt73 said:
I purchased the phone outright from T-Mobile, did the fax thing the next day, and proceeded to wait about a week for the unlock team to get me my code. Glad I didn't need to have it with Solavei. Of course I found that out after the fact, lol!
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All carriers are required to unlock phones at the customers request, it was put into law a year ago or so. Same law that said jailbreaking/rooting is legal and cannot void a warranty. No one knows about it yet because it loses money for telecoms, but they can't refuse to unlock your phone because it is illegal to do so.
You do know there's a write up to unlock this phone for free right ?
Sent from my SGH-T889 using XDA Premium HD app
Hello everyone,
A lot of good work is done here to help people get the most value out of their Android devices. One point that really annoys me though is the phones from the major cell companies are sold at a premium price but are locked to only that carrier. I started a petition on Change,org to address this. The data charges that are added to an account to get a "free" or reduced price phone are a rip off of the consumer. I appreciate all the information on rooting available here, but the efforts required to unlock phones should not be necessary. If I buy a car the dealer doesn't get to tell me what roads I can drive on. I urge you to consider signing the petition if you agree that contract phones are an abuse of the consumer.
http://www.change.org/petitions/us-...tm_medium=email&utm_campaign=petition_created
The Librarian of Congress decided in October 2012 that unlocking of cell phones would be removed from the exceptions to the DMCA.
As of January 26, consumers will no longer be able unlock their phones for use on a different network without carrier permission, even after their contract has expired.
Consumers will be forced to pay exorbitant roaming fees to make calls while traveling abroad. It reduces consumer choice, and decreases the resale value of devices that consumers have paid for in full.
The Librarian noted that carriers are offering more unlocked phones at present, but the great majority of phones sold are still locked.
We ask that the White House ask the Librarian of Congress to rescind this decision, and failing that, champion a bill that makes unlocking permanently legal.
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/make-unlocking-cell-phones-legal/1g9KhZG7
I believe this only applies to new phones.. and you have 90 days from the date of the law to unlock your phone without any penalties.
page 16 of the docket: https://s3.amazonaws.com/public-inspection.federalregister.gov/2012-26308.pdf
so most of us are okay. but it sucks for people buying new phones. Might be okay on used phones, but I haven't gotten to that part yet.
chances are they'll revise the law in 2 years.
Seeing as T-Mobile is doing away with subsidized phones and the other carriers will probably follow suit much the same as international markets then one would no longer have a need to lock into a2 year contract unless of course there are to be plan discounts. That said there should be no reason for a carrier to refuse to unlock a phone that a consumer is now paying full price for, which is pushing $600 to $700 for the newest high end models.
I certainly don't agree that we should be paying upwards of $700 for something that has a realistic life span of 2 years, i would expect a laptop of the same price to last 5+. However i do agree that if you purchased a phone at a lower subsidized price and signed a two year contract then no you should not be able to Sim unlock it. Now if you pay your early term fees and are clear of your contact them there should be no reason for a carrier to deny unlocking said device.
If you are a person that travels abroad and need an unlocked phone them you should take that into consideration at time of purchase or contact the carrier to deal with it then.
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I'm not sure but can this be posted in other threads without getting in trouble so we can make everyone know about this situation?
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blakdrew said:
I'm not sure but can this be posted in other threads without getting in trouble so we can make everyone know about this situation?
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I don't see why not...but whats the point? Everyone should know about this by now, its been mentioned on various websites all over the internet.
Also, no offense to the OP but this petition is pretty useless, I mean, we all know how good petitions (ones pertaining to mobile phones) have worked before. Companies don't pay attention to it, so I doubt Congress will. The whole issue is redundant seeing as whoever wants to unlock their phone, will end up unlocking it, whatever the law may be. Its not like the government will set up random checkpoints to take your phone and make sure its not unlocked. People are just over reacting like they usually do. Its been illegal to download music and movies for a few years now and that doesn't seem to stop the people doing it. The only thing I see the this law harming are the various websites and ebay auctions that make money from unlocking phones. The truth is compared to the old Nokia days, smart phones(some, not all) are pretty easy to unlock.
One of the provisions is if you buy a phone from a 3rd party youre exempt.
My opinion? Its a sad day in this country when you dont have complete ownership of some you purchase.
Today its phones, tomorrow its......?
blackangst said:
My opinion? Its a sad day in this country when you dont have complete ownership of some you purchase.
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I know. Even the cell phone industry (CTIA) basically admitted in its arguments to the Library of Congress that the reason they want this is purely in order to protect their business model (based on subsidies) and has nothing to do with copyright. It's bizarre to claim that it can possibly be a violation of copyright to use a physical device that you fully own the way you want. And it's pathetic that the U.S. is so far behind the rest of the world in terms of having a rational competitive wireless market.
Again the last two posts even though they stated the point they missed it. The carriers offer phones at a subsidised price to get subscribers to sign two year contracts not because they want to give you a good deal but because they want you to use and pay for their services fort that time. Prior to this law anyone could go and purchase a phone at a lower price and a month later decide to jump ship, sim unlock their phone and go to another carrier or worse stay with said carrier and sell the new phone for a profit. I could feasibly add a line to my account for an extra $5 a month which comes to $120 over two years, get a $600 phone for around $200 sim unlock it and sell it on eBay at the $600 price. That's a $280 profit in my pocket.
So the carriers shouldn't protect themselves from this type of activity.
Don't get me wrong i think all the carriers rape their customers every chance they get and i don't agree with 95% percent of what they do but trying to petition Congress over this is totally dumb. Maybe petition Congress to get reasonable cell phone pricing. Or how about the fact that i pay the same rate in an area with sketchy service as a person that live in Seattle and had great service.
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yeah, but all carriers have ETF's (Early Termination Fees) that you have to pay if you jump ship before fulfilling your contract. That should take care of the subsidized cost of the phone.
mike-y said:
yeah, but all carriers have ETF's (Early Termination Fees) that you have to pay if you jump ship before fulfilling your contract. That should take care of the subsidized cost of the phone.
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Yes if those fees actually get paid. Or most likely someone who is being shady in the first place will just let those fees go to collection and later written off in bankruptcy or simply forgotten about for years and years.
Take me for example, i got my phone for $99 (2 of them actually) and i am very unhappy with T-Mobile but still have 18 months on my contract well my thought is to unlock the phone, jump ship, and worry about the early term fees at a later date which by the way wouldn't be in my name anyway. So really if i break up with my girlfriend then I'm not responsible and i just made a $400 profit. Now i have two reasons not to do all that 1I'm not a shady person and 2 its now illegal.
My point is that all one needs to do is ask the carrier to unlock the phone and if there are no contact obligations then the carrier has no reason not to. The only ones that should have issue are those trying to be shady.
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explodingboy70 said:
Again the last two posts even though they stated the point they missed it. The carriers offer phones at a subsidised price to get subscribers to sign two year contracts not because they want to give you a good deal but because they want you to use and pay for their services fort that time. Prior to this law anyone could go and purchase a phone at a lower price and a month later decide to jump ship, sim unlock their phone and go to another carrier or worse stay with said carrier and sell the new phone for a profit. I could feasibly add a line to my account for an extra $5 a month which comes to $120 over two years, get a $600 phone for around $200 sim unlock it and sell it on eBay at the $600 price. That's a $280 profit in my pocket.
So the carriers shouldn't protect themselves from this type of activity.
Don't get me wrong i think all the carriers rape their customers every chance they get and i don't agree with 95% percent of what they do but trying to petition Congress over this is totally dumb. Maybe petition Congress to get reasonable cell phone pricing. Or how about the fact that i pay the same rate in an area with sketchy service as a person that live in Seattle and had great service.
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explodingboy70 said:
Yes if those fees actually get paid. Or most likely someone who is being shady in the first place will just let those fees go to collection and later written off in bankruptcy or simply forgotten about for years and years.
Take me for example, i got my phone for $99 (2 of them actually) and i am very unhappy with T-Mobile but still have 18 months on my contract well my thought is to unlock the phone, jump ship, and worry about the early term fees at a later date which by the way wouldn't be in my name anyway. So really if i break up with my girlfriend then I'm not responsible and i just made a $400 profit. Now i have two reasons not to do all that 1I'm not a shady person and 2 its now illegal.
My point is that all one needs to do is ask the carrier to unlock the phone and if there are no contact obligations then the carrier has no reason not to. The only ones that should have issue are those trying to be shady.
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No, sir, I believe YOU are missing the point if you honestly believe this is about carriers trying to recoup their $$$ from subsidized phones. Seriously? NOTHING in the bill states carriers can unlock phones after a contract is fulfilled, or that they have to. Therefore, after said contract is fulfilled, you STILL own a device you dont have control over.
Do you own a house? Do you have a mortgage? If so, you know that just by paying off the mortgage it doesnt give you any more property ownership rights that you didnt have when you signed the mortgage. Once you've signed it, you legally own it, even though you still owe money on it. Until this overreaching law took effect, it was that way for phones (for the most part).
explodingboy70 said:
Again the last two posts even though they stated the point they missed it. The carriers offer phones at a subsidised price to get subscribers to sign two year contracts not because they want to give you a good deal but because they want you to use and pay for their services fort that time. Prior to this law anyone could go and purchase a phone at a lower price and a month later decide to jump ship, sim unlock their phone and go to another carrier or worse stay with said carrier and sell the new phone for a profit. I could feasibly add a line to my account for an extra $5 a month which comes to $120 over two years, get a $600 phone for around $200 sim unlock it and sell it on eBay at the $600 price. That's a $280 profit in my pocket.
So the carriers shouldn't protect themselves from this type of activity.
Don't get me wrong i think all the carriers rape their customers every chance they get and i don't agree with 95% percent of what they do but trying to petition Congress over this is totally dumb. Maybe petition Congress to get reasonable cell phone pricing. Or how about the fact that i pay the same rate in an area with sketchy service as a person that live in Seattle and had great service.
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You forgot an important point in your comment. YOU HAVE TO PAY 20-30USD PER MONTH FOR DATA! Therefore, your cost of adding a line is 120$+20x12=360$. So the profit is not as great as you mentioned.
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What's next? Putting restrictions on oxygen?
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Signed and reposted on Hackforums.
http://www.hackforums.net/showthread.php?tid=3226550
Hope you don't mind.
I linked this thread, and quoted the contents of the OP.
Figure it'd be good to get it out to a broader audience.
45,000 more signatures needed.
Go ahead and put my name on it. I'm too lazy to register, and I don't want a bunch of new e-mails trying to get me sign a bunch of other petitions.
And to the debate: Use an Obama phone, Save your money, and BUY a phone outright. The faster they see that this hurts the big TWO (AT&T, Verizon), it will change.
If you're impatient and want a phone NOW, understand the consequences. You are licensing that phone, and may never own it. And you'll also be advertising for whatever company you go with.
Yes, I know I'm advertising for T-Mobile in my signature. That's because I think they are honest, and very beneficial to the XDA community.
explodingboy70 said:
Again the last two posts even though they stated the point they missed it. The carriers offer phones at a subsidized price to get subscribers to sign two year contracts not because they want to give you a good deal but because they want you to use and pay for their services fort that time. Prior to this law anyone could go and purchase a phone at a lower price and a month later decide to jump ship, sim unlock their phone and go to another carrier or worse stay with said carrier and sell the new phone for a profit. I could feasibly add a line to my account for an extra $5 a month which comes to $120 over two years, get a $600 phone for around $200 sim unlock it and sell it on eBay at the $600 price. That's a $280 profit in my pocket.
So the carriers shouldn't protect themselves from this type of activity.
Don't get me wrong i think all the carriers rape their customers every chance they get and i don't agree with 95% percent of what they do but trying to petition Congress over this is totally dumb. Maybe petition Congress to get reasonable cell phone pricing. Or how about the fact that i pay the same rate in an area with sketchy service as a person that live in Seattle and had great service.
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WELL SAID! BRAVO! This I would support as well as many others!
I have been on this side of things for a long time! I used to live in Seattle, had Sprint and Verizon because ATT and T-Mobile are both very sketchy up there, Verizon is top dawg and since Sprint uses Verizon's towers and is cheaper than anyone else, you get the best phones (imo) and best value, not to mention unlimited data.
That being said, I recently moved to Dallas, and Sprint/Verizon down here are really terrible! I mean Seattle, West Seattle I was pulling upwards of 70mb down and 50-60's up, ridiculous speeds, but made it a lot better when you paid your bill because you felt like you were getting something! Down in Dallas I never saw it go past 10-15mb. Not to mention my signal bars never reached full unless I was under a tower.
Tmobile, my current provider (only for another week or so) is just terrible everywhere. Best I have seen them anywhere is 6-10mb, and I'm sorry but they claim to have better call quality than ATT now, which is horse$hit! Dropped calls, taking over a minute just to start dialing, and when you do talk, lets just say its not good.
I just think that payment plans should be based on where you are at in their coverage area. (If you leave state/town for a trip that's on you). That's like car companies making you pay retail price for a used car same as a new one! Would you do it?
I hope you guys know they unlocking your device is legal. What's illegal is buying an unlock code from online sources. You can no longer just go online and pay a small fee (like $10) for the unlock code. You can call your service provider (T-Mobile as an example) and ask them for the code. (They shouldn't have a problem giving it to you.) Another way of legally unlocking your device is by doing a method like the one in this thread:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2024514
Or you could have someone that knows coding and have then do it for you. (As long as it is not through an online coding site you are good.)
Source: T-Mobile employee and target mobile employee.
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I'm full of great idea's, but don't have the time to create them or learn the coding to create them. If you want to make one of my ideas a reality just message me and I will give you my idea as specific as possible.
ideas:
Spoiler
-launcher/lock screen
-line rider type game where you control the character
-2d fighting game like art of fighting for the SNES
-multiplayer fps where you create your own map with a creative mode (minecraft style)
-roller coaster tycoon style game
-many more!
Just message me which idea you want info on and I'll tell you!
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Well said Ariana....
Service provider must ... unlock the device at any time and at no charge.
At least that's what the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission (CRTC) is recommending.
It's warm day in February when I have something good to say about the CRTC but they do finally appear to cracking down on service provider fees, lengthy contracts, and cell phone locking.
I mention this because the title of this thread sounds like the opposite of ongoing discussions in Canada about how North American consumers are paying more than cell phone customers the world over.
More information by search for "Buyer's remorse" and CBC or go to the Canadian governments CRTC website to download a full pdf of current proposal.
(I'd give you the links, but I'm newly registered here