Related
Now that o2 are producing lots of new non-htc XDA phones, are you going to open up new forum areas to talk about these phones, or is this going to remain an htc only site?
The reason I ask is that a lot of info applies whatever the device manufacturer and the more devices the site coversthe more people that will contribute.
Great point. I support this fully
The XDA stealth is certainly an XDA, yet it is not on XDA developers... Also there has not been much contribution to the atom probably because it was made by quanta
Guys the way I see it this is a HTC forum, there are a lot of phones around but if we stay on one brand then we can provide top info, tools for that brand. You Might allready have seen that there are a few things that cross devices (The BA's country code flashhing error can be over ridden by the Magicans flashing tool)
If we cover all phones then we water down our strong points.
As for the atom, it was a mistake and by the time it was noticed we allready had threads going on.
(Needless to say it might change in the future)
Hello,
I am posting a simple project request with a small budget in hopes that a Freelance Developer would be willing to take it on.
This project would be a good opportunity for some quick income.
My project is to build a custom ROM for my unlocked Windows Mobile 6.1 HTC Touch HD T8282 (Blackstone), for personal use.
The ROM will incorporate different aspects of the following WM HTC phones:
- HTC Touch Diamond P3700 (Rogers – Canada)
- HTC Touch Pro (Raphael) T7272
- HTC Touch HD (Blackstone) T8282 & T8285 (Telstra)
- HTC Touch Diamond 2 (Topaz) T5353
- HTC Touch Pro 2 (Rhodium) T7373
- HTC Touch HD 2 (Leo) T8585
I have done research on the XDA Developers website, and have the specifications I would like the ROM to include. Also, I have saved relevant “threads” which link to files and examples which I will upload to the project once accepted. I have also downloaded some of the key files (WM 6.1 cabs) and HD updates that I will upload as well once accepted. The majority of the files are already existing (somewhere) on the XDA Developer webiste.
I have not included updates of other HTC models (but can be found on the (HTC Worldwide site - support)
I have not included extracted oem cab files from the various HTC model stock roms.
I have not used the many other “developer” sites – the amount of information is over-whelming.
There is a YouTube link by XDA user starbase64 (German) - But I cannot post it - yet (I am a new user, 1st post) for a general idea of what I would like to accomplish:
As I do not have a programming background, I am not able to create the ROM myself, and that is why I must outsource my project. There may be additional components that are required, that I am not aware of, which I will defer to the more knowledgeable freelancer.
Currently, the shipped HTC Touch HD ROM does not support North American (Canada – Rogers) 3G speed (EDGE is max), whereas the Australian Telstra version (T8285) does support the same frequencies as North America. As all other specifications on both HD versions (’82 & ’85) are identical, I assume that the radio can be successfully switched, though I have not found a thread on the XDA Developer site showing so. This may not even be possible (therefore I defer to the more knowledgeable freelancer).
Also, as the HTC Touch HD T8282 is a Windows Mobile 6.1 phone, I would like to upgrade to WM 6.5.3 (or 6.5.5) while retaining the basic WM 6.1 GUI (not WM 6.5.x GUI), as I prefer the HTC TFlo3D shell GUI (again I defer to the more knowledgeable freelancer).
Finally, the “new” HTC Touch HD will require a compatible “HardSPL” (for flashing), which would the Freelancer’s responsibility to include in the project submission upon completion.
Communication for clarification/issues/concerns/modifications/etc... can be started once a willing freelancer has been accepted.
Freelancer.com/ca posting - Cannot post - yet.
Anyone interested please PM me.. Thanks.
This has to be a joke on so many levels. Though for your sake, here's a healthy bump for that lucky developer out there who is destine for this job.
lude219 said:
This has to be a joke on so many levels. Though for your sake, here's a healthy bump for that lucky developer out there who is destine for this job.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why would this be a joke?
I would like a custom rom, and I can't do it myself.
Look up the post on Freelancer.com/ca...
I'm willing to "donate" (pay) $100 for the project towards the dev, or the website (if they prefer).
I just want a custom rom.
Here is a more my posting on the Freelancer.com / .ca website, if interested...
http://www.freelancer.ca/projects/Android-Symbian/Developer-needed-Custom-ROM-for.html
I am not a WinMo user, so cannot comment on whether the rest of your demands are available in other ROMs (though I suspect they are), but your phone does not 3G in North America as the radio hardware is different.
There are custom ROMs out there that will likely have everything else you require, and if you are willing to pay $100 for a custom ROM for an old phone, you might as well just look at buying a newer phone that does suit your requirements, then use a readily available custom ROM for that.
Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
Hi Mr.Lambomanx,
Thank you for replying to my thread.
The reason why I would like a custom rom, is because I really like the HTC TFlo 3D, (and Sense)and have seen how it could be modified.
I am not really a heavy app user, however, I have seen apps being cooked into roms, which (please correct me if I am wrong), seem to increase performance as it's part of the rom.
I'm really not a fan of the newer Android phones, as some of them are a little "too flashy", and don't have WMLive, or WMOffice included which I rely on.
Over the last few months I have seen some of the amazing custom roms possible, however I have not found one I want personally.
That's why I'm asking an XDA developer with no success..
Regarding the Radio for 3G on the Blackstone T8282. According to the specs (found on the HTC site), nothing differs from the T8285 Telstra apart from the frequency capability. Since the "radio" is software, why would it not be just as inter-changeable as any other piece of software?
Your feedback is greatly appreciated, as is any one else's.
Of course, TouchFlo 3D already comes with the device, but anything else that is new (like from Sense) would have to be ported over.
A built-in app is merely just one that comes with it; there is no performance difference.
When you say too flashy, what do you mean?
The radio isn't just a piece of software, it is essentially the firmware that the radio equipment runs. However, we refer to the firmware as the "radio" because there are differences and optimisations for different networks, for example.
The problem is that the phone is so old, and you'd probably not end up with a great experience running all of this new software on it. The age also means that there won't be much support for it.
You really would have a better experience buying a new phone, I'm afraid; you can find better alternatives for software that you use, and any mobile platform out there now is far superior to WM; WM is very much an old OS that has been taken too far.
Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
Hi again Mr.L,
What I mean by "too flashy" is that I find the newer HTC Android phones have the clock, plus the weather (in the clock), plus the weather animation on the homepage. Also, the clock is now the circular analog, when it was the "flip clock" that's become HTC's "signature". Plus the whole "pinkish" look isn't my thing.
I really like this (YouTube link below) rom created by XDA user starbase64, however when contacted, he informed me that he is focusing his efforts on 'droid dev.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jjCNIZcM5s
Mr.64 has manged to combine TFlo3D with Sense on an HD.
That's the kind of "look" I like.
The things XDA users (and sights like it) create is just AWESOME.
I searched this kitchen thread from him, but there are no images for me to see if it's the video rom (plus then link goes from XDA to rapidshare - in German)
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=460822
Regarding performance: I have read threads where the post-er has created a new rom that has newer, and sometimes more "things" than the original oem, and their cooked rom is producing better ram usage, is faster and better battery performance. I figured that this is related to the app being built into the rom, rather than added / installed after.
Regarding radio: The radio is firmware..? How is it possible that people can upgrade their radio with newer oem radios? (some being from a different build of the same phone)
That is why I wonder if the T8282's radio can be substituted with the T8285 Telstra. If the phone is able to upgrade the radio, shouldn't it be able to support any version of the radio found in different builds (of the same phone)?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/wiki/index.php?title=Blackstone/Radio_Flashing
**Though I noted that radio is dependent of the rom build.
Regarding new phone: Unfortunately, I disappointed that "Balmer" made WP7 generic and HTC can't add any (well, "Sense")
I was contemplating the iPhone (mainly for the apps, and fluidity), but the "home screen" sucks.
I still want something to look at.
More than likely I will BEND OVER and get a BB (Torch 2 9850/Storm 3), mainly cause everyone keeps asking for my "pin", but I've never been all impressed with BB in general.
RIM's problem isn't really them being behind Apple. It's more of them revealing (things in the works) too far in advance causing delays.
Apple just goes: BAM! Surprise! iPadX LTE!
You have to remember that with Android, there is a huge amount of customisability. The clock can be changed for a million other ones, etc. As for the pinkishness, that's just a background
The performance improvements will be down to the optimisations the dev makes, not anything else.
The radio is that you upgrade is firmware, which can be changed for improved performance. Radio firmware is also separate from the ROM, so you can change that to whatever you like. However, the hardware is still limited to whatever it is designed to support, it is different hardware.
To be honest, if you like Sense so much, an Android phone sounds perfect for you. Sense on Android is very similar to how it was on the WM devices, like the HD2. Do take a look!
Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
Hi Mr.L,
Thanks for your feedback, it's much appreciated.
While I do understand 'Droid's customability (real word?), I'm really not to big on 'Droid. I really don't like the "version segmentation" problems they face (though, I've "heard" Google is becoming more strict with Honeycomb). Maybe in the future I would get an Android device, if one catches my eye.
You being in the UK is sweet for receiving the newest phones, and more selection.
There's not a big selection in North America, Canada even less than the US.
Regarding the radio firmware: How do you, (or anyone) know that the T8282, is different hardware than the T8285?
I cannot find a spec sheet showing any difference.
Regarding the rom request: Another reason why I made the request is since my device (HD) is considered "legacy", I thought it would be easier to cook, since many chefs already made dishes.
Even if i cannot get the 3G radio, I could still have something like what Mr.64 created.
I thought that there would be at least one Chef willing to "microwave" a dish for me.
searzy8 said:
Hi Mr.L,
Thanks for your feedback, it's much appreciated.
While I do understand 'Droid's customability (real word?), I'm really not to big on 'Droid. I really don't like the "version segmentation" problems they face (though, I've "heard" Google is becoming more strict with Honeycomb). Maybe in the future I would get an Android device, if one catches my eye.
You being in the UK is sweet for receiving the newest phones, and more selection.
There's not a big selection in North America, Canada even less than the US.
Regarding the radio firmware: How do you, (or anyone) know that the T8282, is different hardware than the T8285?
I cannot find a spec sheet showing any difference.
Regarding the rom request: Another reason why I made the request is since my device (HD) is considered "legacy", I thought it would be easier to cook, since many chefs already made dishes.
Even if i cannot get the 3G radio, I could still have something like what Mr.64 created.
I thought that there would be at least one Chef willing to "microwave" a dish for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The problem that people claim is there with Android is fragmentation of the specification of phones on the market; to the end user, there is no effect. In my opinion, it is a load of rubbish.
We do get everything first here!
The difference is that the T8285 supports North American 3G frequencies, while the T8282 supports the rest if the world's frequencies.
The problem is that the Touch HD is very much legacy; very few support it now as a result.
Unfortunately, I can't really help you much when it comes to ROMs; I have no knowledge of WM devices. All you can do is look at the Touch HD section of XDA (is there one?) and see what you can find.
But really, don't dismiss newer platforms just like that. You really need to try Sense on a newer device; it is a full experience on Android, not just a skin on top of the OS. You'd adjust easily, and it is very well done
Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
My suggestion is to just update you phone... Would save you alot of time and money.
Sent from my I897 using XDA Premium App
xThe Enforcer said:
My suggestion is to just update you phone... Would save you alot of time and money.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, most likely I will be purchasing a new phone in the near future...
HOWEVER, regardless of new or old wouldn't any "customization" not oem require an XDA Dev (or like)?
That's why I figured why not "pimp out" my HD, and that will keep me satistified until I find something a really like.
***Question:
Can Anyone tell me how much work is involved in "cooking"?
Like man hours using an existing kitchen...
I assume seasoned Chefs like Mr.Duttythoy makes his own kitchen from scratch?
How long would it have taken him to produce one of his well respected roms?
(I have a post in the mod request forum referring to my lack of programming knowledge, and how programming knowledge is a definite requirement for cooking)
SO No, I am NOT able to cook for myself.
searzy8 said:
Yes, most likely I will be purchasing a new phone in the near future...
HOWEVER, regardless of new or old wouldn't any "customization" not oem require an XDA Dev (or like)?
That's why I figured why not "pimp out" my HD, and that will keep me satistified until I find something a really like.
***Question:
Can Anyone tell me how much work is involved in "cooking"?
Like man hours using an existing kitchen...
I assume seasoned Chefs like Mr.Duttythoy makes his own kitchen from scratch?
How long would it have taken him to produce one of his well respected roms?
(I have a post in the mod request forum referring to my lack of programming knowledge, and how programming knowledge is a definite requirement for cooking)
SO No, I am NOT able to cook for myself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That would be fine, but as we've established, it is now a legacy device. You certainly won't find another dev willing to work on the phone for you.
The amount of hours that goes into these ROMs is...well, it really depends on what is wanted in the ROM. We're talking hundreds of hours over a period of time. A single ROM, from scratch, if anything needs to ported, again, tens of hours.
Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
ARGH!!!
This is frustrating!
I've checked out the new Android phones coming out this month (Rogers - Canada): HTC Evo 3D, and LG Optimus 3D.
While the 3D is VERY appealing,... (the phone) NOT my style..
Microsoft threw some nails in the WM coffin in the last few weeks, with the discontinuing of the Marketplace, and My Phone. (The Live Mesh beta was sweet, but ended)
I REALLY wanted MY rom...
Can anyone reading at least give me a quote on how much ($)they'd be willing to make it for??
(Then I can better judge if it is worthwhile (cost))
**I'm not having much luck on the Freelancer site I mentioned either...
Right now, as it stands, IF I get a new mobile soon it would be the (BIG SIGH) Blackberry Torch 9860 (Monza) - the full touch BB.
But I'm not a BB fan!
(I'm not even much of a 'Droid') fan... **not trying to offend 'Droid lovers
I'm not a chef for the Blackstone (Touch HD), so I won't be able to help you make the ROM, but I can offer a couple of pointers.
1. As was mentioned, the 3G radio hardware is different in your device to what the US frequencies are. Yes, you can update the radio firmware, but this is only tweaking what the hardware can do and how it performs, i.e. battery performance, signal strength and so forth. 3G is frequency specific and must be taken into consideration before making a device purchase because the hardware cannot be changed without swapping out the main board. If you want to do that, then it would still be cheaper to get the other device.
2. You should ask about this in the device-specific forum that you want the ROM created for. Not many devs are going to regularly check this area. You would do well to either PM them or simply post this thread in the Blackstone forum.
searzy8 said:
ARGH!!!
This is frustrating!
I've checked out the new Android phones coming out this month (Rogers - Canada): HTC Evo 3D, and LG Optimus 3D.
While the 3D is VERY appealing,... (the phone) NOT my style..
Microsoft threw some nails in the WM coffin in the last few weeks, with the discontinuing of the Marketplace, and My Phone. (The Live Mesh beta was sweet, but ended)
I REALLY wanted MY rom...
Can anyone reading at least give me a quote on how much ($)they'd be willing to make it for??
(Then I can better judge if it is worthwhile (cost))
**I'm not having much luck on the Freelancer site I mentioned either...
Right now, as it stands, IF I get a new mobile soon it would be the (BIG SIGH) Blackberry Torch 9860 (Monza) - the full touch BB.
But I'm not a BB fan!
(I'm not even much of a 'Droid') fan... **not trying to offend 'Droid lovers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well what I would of done is went to the development thread find the latest rom releases and contact that developer for this project. I was bored so I went and did half of it for you . The latest I found was the Eneregy Rom series released July 4 which is close enough. NRGZ28 makes the Energy rom series, I would get ahold of him and let him know about your project and that you are willing to pay, maybe you might get lucky
cajunflavoredbob said:
You should ask about this in the device-specific forum that you want the ROM created for. Not many devs are going to regularly check this area. You would do well to either PM them or simply post this thread in the Blackstone forum.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi again Cajun Bob,
I WOULD have posted in the HTC Touch HD forum - but, I'm pretty sure it's against the forum rules... I asked a Mod, they "said" I shouldn't (not can't), so I didn't risk it - I know how you guys are with the forum/post ish
I have TRIED to contact devs via PM, but other than the mods, or really helpful types, the reply is nil.
I'm not sure how to request a thread move...
Viper89 said:
Well what I would of done is went to the development thread find the latest rom releases and contact that developer for this project. I was bored so I went and did half of it for you . The latest I found was the Eneregy Rom series released July 4 which is close enough. NRGZ28 makes the Energy rom series, I would get ahold of him and let him know about your project and that you are willing to pay, maybe you might get lucky
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
THANKS Mr.Viper!
I will definitely look into that!
No custom roms... No unlocks... Nothing..... Why??
Because it is a secure device like the dell venue pro. The other HTC devices (gen 1) had a long standing HTC bootloader exploit.
Actually, I don't think it's really any more secure. It's just because, frankly, the world runs on GSM. The US and a very few other countries use CDMA, but the international hacking community has relatively little interest in CDMA devices - they couldn't use one even if they could buy one.
The DFT guys claim to have a working bootloader unlock for the CDMA devices (Arrive and Verizon Trophy) and, given that, I'm sure custom ROMs will come eventually. It will take time, though; I think DFT didn't even have the devices until a few months ago.
As for homebrew, most of the original HTC homebrew (TouchXplorer, Advanced Explorer, etc.) worked fine on the Arrive. Additionally, there's lots of device-agnostic homebrew that works on anything (assuming it has been dev-unlocked).
The problem is the interop-lock. I (and a few others) are researching universal interop-unlocks, but so far we haven't made one work. Aside from LG, no devices have a registry editor already available, so we have to take over another program and make it edit the registry for us. The only apps that have successfully been used for this so far are network configuration apps, because they have a lot of configuration data and we can often modify it. The Arrive is permanently locked to a single network, so there's no point in it having a network configuration app.
On my list of reasons why I prefer GSM over CDMA, "can use hackable network configuration tools" would normally be pretty far down the list. Since the release of Mango and the interop-lock, though, it's become much more important on WP7. I don't really have anything against Sprint as a company - they just use a poor choice of wireless technology. CDMA is to GSM as Imperial is to Metric; the US keeps on using it and everybody else thinks we're crazy for it.
This actually belongs in the Q/A section, but if you look at most other devices (droid custom, windows mobile, etc) the GSM customizations are much more numerous than their CDMA counterparts.
Pretty much GoodDayToDie nailed it as to why the CDMA counterparts don't see a lot of action. Most of the major teams live in countries where GSM is the norm.
Thread Closed
This is not Development. It is a device specific question, i will from now on not move these, they will be closed.
Please refer to the read before posting sticky
Before you start to think I am about to scream "GPL, GPL, GPL," stop for a second, take a deep breath, and sympathize with the thousands of power users and developers who have been left in the dark and/or ignored in regard to their device being partially unlocked with a seeming false advertisement. This is an opinionated piece in the regard of actually getting what we asked for and were promised to receive.
Not long ago, users and developers alike relied heavily on hackers and logic to achieve S-OFF to get the full experience of their desire for a great(er) experience on their Android phone. Some people buy an overlay device like HTC with Sense, Motorola with Blur, and so on, knowing what entails when they get it, but they anticipate running a stock experience or a heavily optimized build from one of the developers in this community. Recently we took a moment to talk with ToastCFH and Dees_Troy from TeamWin, who are responsible for HTC Dumlock. HTC Dumlock makes the unlocked device further accessible for a few more phones.
Last week we purchased some T-Mobile One S units for our developers and one of them was chosen to go for a test drive and to try out HTC Dev Bootloader Unlock. This is where we got to know each other and a bit more about HTC's online utility, which nonetheless has disappointed thousands more than just a bit. I am going to let everyone know now: do not plan on just stopping at rooting this and calling it a day, I tried to remove bloat with Root Explorer and came to a brick wall of denial. I found out you also cannot flash custom kernels in recovery mode.
"What is affected in retrospect when I unlock?" Let me answer that: It actually cripples your phone. It's probably less risky to take a chance and go for an S-OFF method that could potentially brick your device. As per numerous reports, and some insight from ToastCFH and Dees_Troy, there is a plethora of issues with this process and many gripes and speculation just coming from myself.
A cobb without a Kernel: Flashing a kernel is similar to trying out walking on coals. You have to do the following (coming from ToastCFH at XDA):
fastboot boot recovery alternaterecovery.img
Here's some thought: If you flash a crap/test kernel that doesn't boot, not only can you not pull the battery you have to relentlessly use your power button to get yourself out of the mess to get the phone to shut off (HTC One series). The reason you can do it through "booting" recovery as opposed of using the one you flashed: The boot method is actually using the boot/temp partition, which in the end, is not really the boot partition.
HTC, why are you doing this? Aren't you supposed to be trying to deter users from chasing exploits and trying to gain S-OFF? It sure doesn't seem like it. From this perspective, it seems you will be are pissing off and running away potential customers instead. The image you see above is the warning you receive in HBOOT after unlocking the device via HTC Dev. Note that it doesnt say "unlocked" but a very menacing "Tampered," a word that carries a different set of connotations altogether.
All your system are belong to HTC: ROM Manager uses a script to replace your recovery while in Android. The slight issue is, it requires root. Root is the center of the development universe when it comes to ROMs, kernels, mods and the likes of the bunch. HANDS DOWN, most of the alterations you make to your phone while booted in Android utilize root and the system partition. This is not only a P.I.T.A., it can be a deal-breaker. I will get to that point in a bit. First, let's take a look: How do I tinker with something if the manufacturer tells me I can but in reality I can't? Conundrums. It's amazing: You cannot remove the bloat from your phone, you cannot replace the recovery and you sure cannot replace the boot image while booted in Android/Sense.
Radio killed the kernel dev star: Yes, radio. Those cool P*IMG.zip files you flash in HBOOT, that's out the window... Unless you get an RUU (ROM Update Utility) and go back to the stock firmware. With older HTC devices with S-OFF, you could slap a P*IMG.Zip (essentially a firmware/radio update in HTC's update.zip format) on the SD card and boot into HBOOT. It would check and flash it for you. That whole proces is gone; this entire process of being able to do this on the mobile side is now gone. You will now need a computer to flash the file.
To need or not to need... That is the question: Toast brings up another excellent point: If these measures have to be in place (maybe due to carrier request) why not provide the proper documentation to support the device? We're pretty sure when someone unlocks this device they understand they are giving up any firmware support from HTC.
Then why not give us documentation or utilities to flash fimware.zips from recovery like HTC does? When HTC was the proud Nexus device there was full support and documentation available on how to flash firmware on their devices. This made anyone choosing an HTC device blessed with knowing that their device was not only open and unlocked, but when flashing firmware that it was being flashed correctly to Google and HTC's standards. This code has now been moved out of recovery since right before the move to edify scripting and moved to vendor/htc/ (not arguing this choice as thats where it belongs from a maintaining point of view). But the problem is that vendor/htc is proprietary now. Which means Documentation and support for flashing firmware correctly is not available and left to developers of recoveries for the community to figure out. One would think if HTC was standing behind us that they would step up and give us a PROPER/OPEN/REAL unlock, or if they cant for the lame excuse of security concerns, then give us the documentation and utilities to flash the boot and firmware partitions properly. I mean really... what is there to lose there?
- ToastCFH
An excellent point, and most of you will probably agree with his bomb of logic. At the end of the day, he is right; the unlock method is crap and we find it more of a hinderance and crippling intent rather than a compliance to the developer community who has made them the number one development device for so long. Recently Samsung has taken the torch and led its dedicated developers with fulfilled promises and standards.
HTC, why would you do this? That is far too easy. Clarification, reason, justification, etc., it isn't needed. It's about doing the right thing. HTC has kept the proverbial sprinklers on and now the unlock tool is watered down. My advice for the power user/modder/dev is that this tool is essentially useless. We have been the number one spot for developer support by giving free devices to developers and UI designers to make the device even more fun and unique. We will continue to support, drive, and advocate open development on a supposedly open platform and follow those who make it what it is today. With that being said, it makes us skeptical in giving devices to people that HTC seems to have set a navigation route to Failure Avenue, and know that the developer on hand won't feel shorted. HTC, let us own our devices. Some love the hardware, some love the software, but in the end we love Android.
Lastly, GPL. It is is not made to stretch the maximum time available and take your time. It is probably a good suggestion to set up an HTC gitweb or something of the nature to ensure that when the device is available, the developers that you "support" so much can have free reign at improving your device and moving forward at their own pace. That making the final connection to the developer house, letting the user and developer free you from providing software support. Release the source, fully alert and vigilant. We know it takes time to clean code, but the One X (international) community could really use some tasty kernel source code right about now.
One last note: HTC may not be able to further assist with the firmware/software/OS once unlocked, but you can still support your hardware by giving some documentation on how to proceed with an unlocked device. Giving someone a flashlight with no batteries in a dark house isn't an ideal method of answering our call.
Sincerely,
Your Customer.
If you read this, please take a moment and support your developers and modders that enhance your phone life everyday, by tweeting, sharing or posting on Facebook the following quote:
" @HTC we want our phones back! http://tinyw.in/LNSn "
Thanks to everyone who has read and contributed to this piece.
****
My contribution.
I made it about 60% through and I still don't see s-off released. ;p
acer73 said:
Before you start to think I am about to scream "GPL, GPL, GPL," stop for a second, take a deep breath, and sympathize with the thousands of power users and developers who have been left in the dark and/or ignored in regard to their device being partially unlocked with a seeming false advertisement. This is an opinionated piece in the regard of actually getting what we asked for and were promised to receive.
Not long ago, users and developers alike relied heavily on hackers and logic to achieve S-OFF to get the full experience of their desire for a great(er) experience on their Android phone. Some people buy an overlay device like HTC with Sense, Motorola with Blur, and so on, knowing what entails when they get it, but they anticipate running a stock experience or a heavily optimized build from one of the developers in this community. Recently we took a moment to talk with ToastCFH and Dees_Troy from TeamWin, who are responsible for HTC Dumlock. HTC Dumlock makes the unlocked device further accessible for a few more phones.
Last week we purchased some T-Mobile One S units for our developers and one of them was chosen to go for a test drive and to try out HTC Dev Bootloader Unlock. This is where we got to know each other and a bit more about HTC's online utility, which nonetheless has disappointed thousands more than just a bit. I am going to let everyone know now: do not plan on just stopping at rooting this and calling it a day, I tried to remove bloat with Root Explorer and came to a brick wall of denial. I found out you also cannot flash custom kernels in recovery mode.
"What is affected in retrospect when I unlock?" Let me answer that: It actually cripples your phone. It's probably less risky to take a chance and go for an S-OFF method that could potentially brick your device. As per numerous reports, and some insight from ToastCFH and Dees_Troy, there is a plethora of issues with this process and many gripes and speculation just coming from myself.
A cobb without a Kernel: Flashing a kernel is similar to trying out walking on coals. You have to do the following (coming from ToastCFH at XDA):
fastboot boot recovery alternaterecovery.img
Here's some thought: If you flash a crap/test kernel that doesn't boot, not only can you not pull the battery you have to relentlessly use your power button to get yourself out of the mess to get the phone to shut off (HTC One series). The reason you can do it through "booting" recovery as opposed of using the one you flashed: The boot method is actually using the boot/temp partition, which in the end, is not really the boot partition.
HTC, why are you doing this? Aren't you supposed to be trying to deter users from chasing exploits and trying to gain S-OFF? It sure doesn't seem like it. From this perspective, it seems you will be are pissing off and running away potential customers instead. The image you see above is the warning you receive in HBOOT after unlocking the device via HTC Dev. Note that it doesnt say "unlocked" but a very menacing "Tampered," a word that carries a different set of connotations altogether.
All your system are belong to HTC: ROM Manager uses a script to replace your recovery while in Android. The slight issue is, it requires root. Root is the center of the development universe when it comes to ROMs, kernels, mods and the likes of the bunch. HANDS DOWN, most of the alterations you make to your phone while booted in Android utilize root and the system partition. This is not only a P.I.T.A., it can be a deal-breaker. I will get to that point in a bit. First, let's take a look: How do I tinker with something if the manufacturer tells me I can but in reality I can't? Conundrums. It's amazing: You cannot remove the bloat from your phone, you cannot replace the recovery and you sure cannot replace the boot image while booted in Android/Sense.
Radio killed the kernel dev star: Yes, radio. Those cool P*IMG.zip files you flash in HBOOT, that's out the window... Unless you get an RUU (ROM Update Utility) and go back to the stock firmware. With older HTC devices with S-OFF, you could slap a P*IMG.Zip (essentially a firmware/radio update in HTC's update.zip format) on the SD card and boot into HBOOT. It would check and flash it for you. That whole proces is gone; this entire process of being able to do this on the mobile side is now gone. You will now need a computer to flash the file.
To need or not to need... That is the question: Toast brings up another excellent point: If these measures have to be in place (maybe due to carrier request) why not provide the proper documentation to support the device? We're pretty sure when someone unlocks this device they understand they are giving up any firmware support from HTC.
Then why not give us documentation or utilities to flash fimware.zips from recovery like HTC does? When HTC was the proud Nexus device there was full support and documentation available on how to flash firmware on their devices. This made anyone choosing an HTC device blessed with knowing that their device was not only open and unlocked, but when flashing firmware that it was being flashed correctly to Google and HTC's standards. This code has now been moved out of recovery since right before the move to edify scripting and moved to vendor/htc/ (not arguing this choice as thats where it belongs from a maintaining point of view). But the problem is that vendor/htc is proprietary now. Which means Documentation and support for flashing firmware correctly is not available and left to developers of recoveries for the community to figure out. One would think if HTC was standing behind us that they would step up and give us a PROPER/OPEN/REAL unlock, or if they cant for the lame excuse of security concerns, then give us the documentation and utilities to flash the boot and firmware partitions properly. I mean really... what is there to lose there?
- ToastCFH
An excellent point, and most of you will probably agree with his bomb of logic. At the end of the day, he is right; the unlock method is crap and we find it more of a hinderance and crippling intent rather than a compliance to the developer community who has made them the number one development device for so long. Recently Samsung has taken the torch and led its dedicated developers with fulfilled promises and standards.
HTC, why would you do this? That is far too easy. Clarification, reason, justification, etc., it isn't needed. It's about doing the right thing. HTC has kept the proverbial sprinklers on and now the unlock tool is watered down. My advice for the power user/modder/dev is that this tool is essentially useless. We have been the number one spot for developer support by giving free devices to developers and UI designers to make the device even more fun and unique. We will continue to support, drive, and advocate open development on a supposedly open platform and follow those who make it what it is today. With that being said, it makes us skeptical in giving devices to people that HTC seems to have set a navigation route to Failure Avenue, and know that the developer on hand won't feel shorted. HTC, let us own our devices. Some love the hardware, some love the software, but in the end we love Android.
Lastly, GPL. It is is not made to stretch the maximum time available and take your time. It is probably a good suggestion to set up an HTC gitweb or something of the nature to ensure that when the device is available, the developers that you "support" so much can have free reign at improving your device and moving forward at their own pace. That making the final connection to the developer house, letting the user and developer free you from providing software support. Release the source, fully alert and vigilant. We know it takes time to clean code, but the One X (international) community could really use some tasty kernel source code right about now.
One last note: HTC may not be able to further assist with the firmware/software/OS once unlocked, but you can still support your hardware by giving some documentation on how to proceed with an unlocked device. Giving someone a flashlight with no batteries in a dark house isn't an ideal method of answering our call.
Sincerely,
Your Customer.
If you read this, please take a moment and support your developers and modders that enhance your phone life everyday, by tweeting, sharing or posting on Facebook the following quote:
" @HTC we want our phones back! http://tinyw.in/LNSn "
Thanks to everyone who has read and contributed to this piece.
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My contribution.
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Done
Sent from my HTC Desire HD using Tapatalk
Done
I would share it but its got to many bad grammatical mistakes that makes its a hard read plus doesn't specifically request things like S-OFF. The sentiment surely is right though.
Hi Guys,
I've been coming here for a number of years and have always been frustrated by the naming of the forums, used to get really fed up with remembering that the HTC Tytn II was an XDA Stellar which was a Kaiser etc. etc. I can't even remember what the orbit's other names were now. Anyhow, the forums now are getting split up mainly by American Operators which is fine if you live in the US, but the roots of this forum are European so it puzzles me why this is the case (I know there are many many US participants here, but it's getting really confusing again)
I've seen so many threads on here that have been posted in the wrong forum for the wrong device because perhaps they were on "Three UK" or "o2" Germany and thought that mapped to X operator in the US. I've even read a thread just the other day where people can't figure out if their phone, which was a Canadian phone, would work with the roms from Y phone in the US.
This gets me onto the title of this thread. Seriously, how many forums do we need for the Galaxy S III, there are four "General" threads, four "Q&A" threads etc. etc. Surely 90%+ of the posts in these forums are common to all the devices.
Would it not be better to classify threads by device ID and then have a mapping somewhere for all operators in the world to the device ID. I'm sure the majority of people who use this forum will know the device ID of the device they are interested in off by heart anyhow.
BTW, I did search for an explanation about why the forum is formatting in an American way, but didn't find one, so if there is an explanation about why and perhaps even a past (But recent) discussion on this, then please point me to it. If this hasn't been discussed for a while, would this be a good time to review it again?
Cheers,
Mark.
I heard that sometimes the hardware is different, such as the lte for our american devices. The T-Mobile s3 is branded t-999, not whatever the international version is branded.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using xda app-developers app
markfid said:
Hi Guys,
I've been coming here for a number of years and have always been frustrated by the naming of the forums, used to get really fed up with remembering that the HTC Tytn II was an XDA Stellar which was a Kaiser etc. etc. I can't even remember what the orbit's other names were now. Anyhow, the forums now are getting split up mainly by American Operators which is fine if you live in the US, but the roots of this forum are European so it puzzles me why this is the case (I know there are many many US participants here, but it's getting really confusing again)
I've seen so many threads on here that have been posted in the wrong forum for the wrong device because perhaps they were on "Three UK" or "o2" Germany and thought that mapped to X operator in the US. I've even read a thread just the other day where people can't figure out if their phone, which was a Canadian phone, would work with the roms from Y phone in the US.
This gets me onto the title of this thread. Seriously, how many forums do we need for the Galaxy S III, there are four "General" threads, four "Q&A" threads etc. etc. Surely 90%+ of the posts in these forums are common to all the devices.
Would it not be better to classify threads by device ID and then have a mapping somewhere for all operators in the world to the device ID. I'm sure the majority of people who use this forum will know the device ID of the device they are interested in off by heart anyhow.
BTW, I did search for an explanation about why the forum is formatting in an American way, but didn't find one, so if there is an explanation about why and perhaps even a past (But recent) discussion on this, then please point me to it. If this hasn't been discussed for a while, would this be a good time to review it again?
Cheers,
Mark.
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Its because in america devices can be completely different depending on the carrier, they all like to have there on tweaked versions, which result in hardware changes which mean ROMS will not work on each without changes, so they are split up to stop people flashing stuff for other versions of the device and bricking it.
Normally there is a international version which will pretty much cover the rest of the world.
This is more about the organization of various device sections than the devices themselves, so I'm moving this to About XDA.
zacthespack said:
Its because in america devices can be completely different depending on the carrier, they all like to have there on tweaked versions, which result in hardware changes which mean ROMS will not work on each without changes, so they are split up to stop people flashing stuff for other versions of the device and bricking it.
Normally there is a international version which will pretty much cover the rest of the world.
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Click to collapse
This is exactly why. It is annoying but the only way to keep things separate. ROMs and kernels will not work on both devices, therefore we created separate forums for each. Its a pain... but blame the carriers for each wanting to be "Special."