Related
http://www.androidcentral.com/google-not-open-sourcing-honeycomb-says-bloomberg
I actually choked up when I saw this....
starplaya93 said:
http://www.androidcentral.com/google-not-open-sourcing-honeycomb-says-bloomberg
I actually choked up when I saw this....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While I understand the reasons why they won't release Honeycomb code, Open means OPEN. My feelings are conflicted on this one.
They're delaying the release of the code and this has been taken way out of context.
Sent from my spaceship!
I may be exagerating my dissapointment, but this is just so taboo for google.... In all reality a closed source android is a second class ios... And when wp7 gains more momentum android wouldnt even be a consideration for me if they continued to not release source codes....
Then again, this probably is being taken out of context... Only time will tell I suppose
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
If they named it TabOS 1.0 instead of Android 3.0 people wouldnt have this bizarre obsession with putting it on their phones. I for one don't want a tablet OS on my phone, it a phone OS on my tablet. Apple does it but it's dumb IMHO.
Frankly I wish tablets would go away anyways.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
what??? 2nd class os????
and if it is "closed".. going to wp7 will be different? how so???
this just does not make any sense
This as well as the engadget article bring up the point of google not wanting the reverse of what happened with froyo and manufacturers putting it on devices it's not meant for. Google cites they want to give the best experience to the customers; which means the 99% of users who don't come to xda. Unfortunately the lack of source code also effects us who want to put hc on our phones, optimized or not -especially since the devs here would optimize it. But a flood of smaller oem phones/small tablets that aren't designed for hc would just be crap.
Dan330 said:
what??? 2nd class os????
and if it is "closed".. going to wp7 will be different? how so???
this just does not make any sense
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
WP7 & iOS = integrated experiences. They are optimized for specific hardware releases and have controlled updates. Which is why a lot of people are drawn to the Nexus phones.
wp7 and ios are closed...
he is leaving because it is closed (if it is closed) .. to another closed os.. which has yet to prove itself as a contender to de-throne android.
android is the top os.. and he thinks it is 2nd class.
but whatever.. see ya...
WP7 is the most boring and silly looking mobile OS on the market right now imo. And I agree with whoever said they should rename honeycomb, because its really not necessary on phones. Gingerbread is fine.
Award Tour said:
WP7 & iOS = integrated experiences. They are optimized for specific hardware releases and have controlled updates. Which is why a lot of people are drawn to the Nexus phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not to mention they each have there niche. WP7 with its integration with xbox live PLUS they have openly admitted that they are trying to workout a mutual relationship with "hackers" aka "us"....
There really isn't a need to explain what advantages ios has. I'm android all the way but i'm not arrogant enough to believe that ios isn't one hell of an os and that the iphone isn't a great piece of hardware....
matt2053 said:
If they named it TabOS 1.0 instead of Android 3.0 people wouldnt have this bizarre obsession with putting it on their phones. I for one don't want a tablet OS on my phone, it a phone OS on my tablet. Apple does it but it's dumb IMHO.
Frankly I wish tablets would go away anyways.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
my concern isn't that we won't be able to put honeycomb on our phones, didn't realize I even implied that... I'm just worried about this reoccurring in the future and possibly affecting future phone updates... I don't want a tablet os on my phone neither, but I also don't want a closed source phone (if I did i'd go to the iphone in a heart beat.)
starplaya93 said:
my concern isn't that we won't be able to put honeycomb on our phones, didn't realize I even implied that... I'm just worried about this reoccurring in the future and possibly affecting future phone updates... I don't want a tablet os on my phone neither, but I also don't want a closed source phone (if I did i'd go to the iphone in a heart beat.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You didn't imply it. It's in the article. Google cited it as one of the reasons for the delay.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
Dan330 said:
wp7 and ios are closed...
he is leaving because it is closed (if it is closed) .. to another closed os.. which has yet to prove itself as a contender to de-throne android.
android is the top os.. and he thinks it is 2nd class.
but whatever.. see ya...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol. Where is the justification for anything you're saying? Did you actually read my post or just skim through the title?
The part about not being able to port Honeycomb to phones doesn't really bother me as it's not designed for phones and may not run properly.
However, the real slight in this is Honeycomb tablet owners. If I owned a Xoom, a supposed open Google experience device, I would be enraged at not being able to utilize custom roms by other developers.
This essentially makes the fact that Motorola and Google opted to not include a bootloader in the Xoom worthless.
Similarly, with any Honeycomb tablets, including the upcoming LG and Samsung varieties, you'll essentially be running closed-off systems with no chance of custom roms.
I wasn't planning on buying a Honeycomb tablet anytime soon, but this pretty much seals the deal.
DirtyShroomz said:
They're delaying the release of the code and this has been taken way out of context.
Sent from my spaceship!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1000000000
Sent from my Evo powered by moar gees.
Dan330 said:
what??? 2nd class os????
and if it is "closed".. going to wp7 will be different? how so???
this just does not make any sense
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The implication is that, if the open aspect is taken out of android, and all we have left to compare the three (wp7, ios, and android), for some, android would no longer make the cut. And, in some ways, I tend to agree: most of what I love about my phone depends on having root access and source code.
matt2053 said:
You didn't imply it. It's in the article. Google cited it as one of the reasons for the delay.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes, i'm aware of that...
I just think everybody is missing the point of Androidcentral and Engadget posting this article, as well as the purpose of this thread...
Here is my concern in bold for you guys who don't understand...
WHAT DOES THIS FORESHADOW FOR GOOGLE AND ANDROID AS AN OS? WE NEVER IN OUR WILDEST DREAMS THOUGHT THEY WOULD LOCK THE SOURCE CODE FOR ANYTHING WITH ANDROID OS. WHAT ELSE ARE THEY CAPABLE/WILLING TO DO?
That is my concern folks.... If you're viewing this thread or any android development forum then more than likely its because android is an open source project.
I'm sure this will still go over the trolls heads, but so be it.
3.0 is not closed!!! Google just doesn't want outside developers playing with their source code that they haven't had time to optimize for smart phones.
Basically Google is baking ice cream 2.4 and wants us to get that first. Why would they release 3.0 which is "supposedly " just for tablets when they have put time and money into 2.4 specifically for smartphones. They have phones planned to run on stock off of that. If Google releases 3.0 why would people want to buy "downgraded " software on a flagship phone. Its all just business.
AOSP
Android open source project
Will never ever be closed this is how android became what it is now and how it will dominate the future.
Powered by Steve Jobs' Tears and Jealousy
aray92 said:
3.0 is not closed!!! Google just doesn't want outside developers playing with their source code that they haven't had time to optimize for smart phones.
Basically Google is baking ice cream 2.4 and wants us to get that first. Why would they release 3.0 which is "supposedly " just for tablets when they have put time and money into 2.4 specifically for smartphones. They have phones planned to run on stock off of that. If Google releases 3.0 why would people want to buy "downgraded " software on a flagship phone. Its all just business.
AOSP
Android open source project
Will never ever be closed this is how android became what it is now and how it will dominate the future.
Powered by Steve Jobs' Tears and Jealousy
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hope what you are saying is correct... at least for our sake
Who dares?
I own a Samsung Galaxy SII T-989 and, because I come from the "Windows" side rather than Linux or Apple, I would like to be able to completely wipe out the Gingerbred ROM that came with the phone and install a "cooked" ROM based on Windows Mobile 7 or, at least Windows Mobile 6.5.
I am hoping that, all those great developers connected to this site and spending so much time on cooking roms and rooting android phones, maybe one day they would look into this project that will become, I am sure, the greatest challenge, the pinnacle of all great things ever accomplished and recorded on this amazing forum.
Would be cool to dual boot like the HD2 days. But TBH Sui, we barely have any devs for anroid let alone start a whole new can of worms with WP7. Like the idea though.... +1
Wp7 doesn't support multiple cores.
$1 gets you a reply
Kailkti said:
Wp7 doesn't support multiple cores.
$1 gets you a reply
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Except for, you know, the already released dual-core WP7 phones.
Good Point Kallkti, but soon it will. I was at a mircosoft event and we will see an update in a few months to support it. In theory couldnt we just use one core like ....idk the original froyo/GB code, and keep the second core sleeping. I never wrote kernel code im only asking
lol we dont even have a working CM7 or Miui...yet you want this?! i dont think it'll ever happen
GS2 doesn't meet hardware requirements for 6 hardware buttons and who knows what else, but seems to me if someone wants a WM7 phone, you get one.
Another thought - get an HTC HD2 - ROMs available for WM 6.5, 7 and just about every flavor of android available. A little slow (1 GHz) but satisfies all other requests.
I think it'd be awesome, been thinking about this myself. Probably damn difficult if not impossible to do at this point.
My girlfriend has a Samsung focus and it's pretty sweet. I find myself getting jealous over her phone at times especially with the zune pass lol.
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda premium
Why
Sui Generis said:
Who dares?
I own a Samsung Galaxy SII T-989 and, because I come from the "Windows" side rather than Linux or Apple, I would like to be able to completely wipe out the Gingerbred ROM that came with the phone and install a "cooked" ROM based on Windows Mobile 7 or, at least Windows Mobile 6.5.
I am hoping that, all those great developers connected to this site and spending so much time on cooking roms and rooting android phones, maybe one day they would look into this project that will become, I am sure, the greatest challenge, the pinnacle of all great things ever accomplished and recorded on this amazing forum.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why would you ruin a perfectly good phone and turn it into an unstable brick?
The question is not who dares. But why? Lol
Sent from my SGH-T989 using XDA App
They have not released any dual core wp7 phones.
Windows Phone 7 will never work unless Microsoft makes it open source. The Hd2 was lucky only because the Hd7 has the same exact internals and even that phone doesn't run Windows flawlessly.
Its like trying to put iOS or RIM's software on the GSII. It will never work and if you are lucky to get it to boot it will be extremely buggy!!!!
Sent from my LG-P999 using xda premium
I just don't understand why you would want that OS on such an amazing piece of hardware. WM7 in my opinion is just too limited in the things you can do, hence the reason why people including myself rid of 6.5 from their HD2's.
kenvan19 said:
Except for, you know, the already released dual-core WP7 phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What windowsphone7 phones have you seen with dual cores? Even the top of the line phones are single core be ause the OS doesn't support it yet.
Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk
wp7 runs extremely smooth and looks very nice. i don't know why this phone has no cool stuff, we have a bunch of competent developers, even cyanogen is working on this phone. i'm hoping that in the next 3 months development will explode for this phone.
like stated before if we can't even get a stable version of cm7 or miui we are deff not getting this here....... lol
If it's looks you want there might be a launcher theme out there you could try
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda premium
Sui Generis said:
Who dares?
I own a Samsung Galaxy SII T-989 and, because I come from the "Windows" side rather than Linux or Apple, I would like to be able to completely wipe out the Gingerbred ROM that came with the phone and install a "cooked" ROM based on Windows Mobile 7 or, at least Windows Mobile 6.5.
I am hoping that, all those great developers connected to this site and spending so much time on cooking roms and rooting android phones, maybe one day they would look into this project that will become, I am sure, the greatest challenge, the pinnacle of all great things ever accomplished and recorded on this amazing forum.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i still have my hd2. its cool as hell but i never used wm6-7. why because it sucks-hard. why would you want that? Oh if you like wm and like your phone, download a wm7 launcher. i think thats going to be the most development youll see.
Charlie Brown said:
The question is not who dares. But why? Lol
Sent from my SGH-T989 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Windows Phone 7.5 is a better OS than Android. Does it have as much developer support? No. But speaking strictly of the OS itself, it's much more efficient, handles battery life much better, is smoother out of the box. It just needs more love from software developers.
That said, what the OP is suggesting is never going to happen. Least of all on the Hercules/T989
OriginalMemnock said:
Windows Phone 7.5 is a better OS than Android. Does it have as much developer support? No. But speaking strictly of the OS itself, it's much more efficient, handles battery life much better, is smoother out of the box. It just needs more love from software developers.
That said, what the OP is suggesting is never going to happen. Least of all on the Hercules/T989
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ya saying Windows phone anything is better than android is just straight up garbage sorry. If that was the case it wouldn't have 1% marketshare while the richest company in the world is marketing and pushing it.
Sent from my HTC_Amaze_4G using xda premium
Okay, so I saw a bunch of the tech news sites running with the story about 5.0 coming out in Q2 (Google I/O?). Anybody have any GOOD info on this? I can't imagine it will be anywhere near as big an update as 4.0 was, but I am curious as to what it will have, who will get it first (GNex makes the most sense), and how far behind that release 6.0 and the next Nexus device are.
The next version will be 4.1
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA App
Hemlocke said:
Okay, so I saw a bunch of the tech news sites running with the story about 5.0 coming out in Q2 (Google I/O?). Anybody have any GOOD info on this? I can't imagine it will be anywhere near as big an update as 4.0 was, but I am curious as to what it will have, who will get it first (GNex makes the most sense), and how far behind that release 6.0 and the next Nexus device are.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We won't be seeing 5.0 for at least until Q4.
We may not get it until Q4 but it is extreamley probable that is will be announced in Q2 due to that's when google i|o is
cordell507 said:
We may not get it until Q4 but it is extreamley probable that is will be announced in Q2 due to that's when google i|o is
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Doubt it. THey haven't even polished ICS. They would just stir up **** talking about 5.
if anything, Android 5 would probably be more of a minor update like it was from froyo to gingerbread than gingerbread to ICS. more behind the scene changes
This just further proves to the tech blog community that 'android fragmentation' will always exist.
kfirms said:
This just further proves to the tech blog community that 'android fragmentation' will always exist.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If thats the price of having a 'latest and greatest' style community I'm fine with that. I think went you have fast paced development and your always looking at the next big thing theres always gonna be a lack of consistency.
Troll... troll and more troll...
Enviado desde mi Galaxy Nexus usando Tapatalk
If it duel boot chromium then it will be a PC build
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Why has the word RUMOR been left out of this entire thread!?
Okay continue the speculation..
Have to love Rumors, I think 4.1 is more logical than 5.0 and I would think we would see it on the gnex fairly quick. But again this is all speculation and rumors at this point.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk
I don't really see versioning == fragmentation. Having developed with and seen the android SDK grow, it looks like natural evolution to me.
Most people don't really get it. From 2.3 to 4.0 isn't like they rewrote "android", the changes are not that drastic. Its still essentially the same basic API and framework, with additions and deprecations as needed. In fact the increase of a "major" version number (2->4) was completely a farce, and entirely marketing spin.
So, 5.0 will be much of the same, and 4.0 is so good now, I can't say I'm all that worried about when its coming out. My main concerns are with manufactures optimization of the drivers that interface with the ICS HAL. Get that ironed out first, and let ICS be ICS.
Only real direction for growth is for Android to start having the ability to become a desktop computer + tablet in one, basically like W8 is trying to do.
ICS basically bridged phone + tablet, so only remaining path is to add desktop to it, to be able to replace most office computers (that aren't needing high powered gear)
---------- Post added at 06:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:36 PM ----------
Deofol said:
I don't really see versioning == fragmentation. Having developed with and seen the android SDK grow, it looks like natural evolution to me.
Most people don't really get it. From 2.3 to 4.0 isn't like they rewrote "android", the changes are not that drastic. Its still essentially the same basic API and framework, with additions and deprecations as needed. In fact the increase of a "major" version number (2->4) was completely a farce, and entirely marketing spin.
So, 5.0 will be much of the same, and 4.0 is so good now, I can't say I'm all that worried about when its coming out. My main concerns are with manufactures optimization of the drivers that interface with the ICS HAL. Get that ironed out first, and let ICS be ICS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Anti-android people just like to throw out the word fragmentation, don't feed trolls.
kfirms said:
This just further proves to the tech blog community that 'android fragmentation' will always exist.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey you, get back under your bridge until we say you can come out.
Damnit I accidentally hit thanks.
I don't know why people keep shooting this down as a rumor?
It's almost certain that we will see a major announcement in Q2, since google has been updating android 2 times a year almost since its release. The only uncertainty is whether they'll upgrade the name and how much they'll upgrade the version number.
So yes we will see an announcement at Google I/O and it'll be likely to hit our gn's first, just as we will see another one in Q3/4 along with another device release.
mortenmhp said:
I don't know why people keep shooting this down as a rumor?
It's almost certain that we will see a major announcement in Q2, since google has been updating android 2 times a year almost since its release. The only uncertainty is whether they'll upgrade the name and how much they'll upgrade the version number.
So yes we will see an announcement at Google I/O and it'll be likely to hit our gn's first, just as we will see another one in Q3/4 along with another device release.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You must have missed the announcement where Google said they will only give one update a year from here on out. With all the clamoring on how ICS is a "huge" update you will NOT see 5.0 in Q2 AND something in Q4.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
I think we'll see a 4.1 update fairly soon, but JellyBean probably not until next year during the annual release and it will probably be just back end code like stated. We'll probably start seeing information on it around the end of Q2 but I don't see anything dramatic coming to light.
ICS was the BIG change over everyone was waiting for that brings tons of features to the table. I can't see them doing anything dramatic for a while. I think the CORE Android is where they want it to be now where Tablets and Phones are merged into one single version.
someone swing by google and see if the statue is up or not
mortenmhp said:
I don't know why people keep shooting this down as a rumor?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because everywhere this is found on the internet it is tagged with a big ass RUMOR in the title!! And the original source is known for pulling **** out of their ass.
Multi touch bug ftl and slow multitasking.
Was really hoping Google would solve these problems earler
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA App
hurricurry said:
Multi touch bug ftl and slow multitasking.
Was really hoping Google would solve these problems earler
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Multi touch bug is a complete killer. Really can't wait for 4.0.4 AOSP hopefully soon
The news is that not everyone is on 4.0.2 yet. If you can't wait then grab a custom rom, otherwise a whole lot of patience may be necessary.
virtualcertainty said:
The news is that not everyone is on 4.0.2 yet. If you can't wait then grab a custom rom, otherwise a whole lot of patience may be necessary.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Totally true.
Google is not really considering Galaxy Nexus a Nexus device it seems. Some other systems have gotten newer version of Android already.
At least my Galaxy Nexus runs bloatware-free official Android, even if the build is totally outdated by now. The only real benefit of having a Galaxy Nexus it seems.
Well, I actually don't think it is all that bad. The oldest ISC version out there is still only around 3 months old and better than 99% of Android's entire installation base.
The fact that a few manufacturers jumped on AOSP so soon is great and I'm happy for those users. I don't see the need to be 'first' and it doesn't sour my experience any. Google obviously thought the GN would re-fork with 4.0.3 by now but sometimes bugs get in the way of developer's best intentions.
virtualcertainty said:
Well, I actually don't think it is all that bad. The oldest ISC version out there is still only around 3 months old and better than 99% of Android's entire installation base.
The fact that a few manufacturers jumped on AOSP so soon is great and I'm happy for those users. I don't see the need to be 'first' and it doesn't sour my experience any. Google obviously thought the GN would re-fork with 4.0.3 by now but sometimes bugs get in the way of developer's best intentions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well yeah, but the things that annoy me are the bugs that are present in 4.0.2 and have been fixed in 4.0.4. And not only that, but also the API features of 4.0.3+ that was supposed to be the 'base' version of Android 4.0.
I don't mind how long major releases would take, but this is a small incremental update. I am just surprised that it takes so long to serve it to 'Google phone'.
kristovaher said:
Totally true.
Google is not really considering Galaxy Nexus a Nexus device it seems. Some other systems have gotten newer version of Android already.
At least my Galaxy Nexus runs bloatware-free official Android, even if the build is totally outdated by now. The only real benefit of having a Galaxy Nexus it seems.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Newer versions such as what? The latest aosp is 4.0.3 and not 4.0.4. It's quite obvious that 4.0.4 is not ready.
The Galaxy nexus is a Google supported device and is a nexus.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Well, if you look from it from the other side. Google might actually spare us from the still-bugged 4.0.3 version wich is AOSP. Also, JBQ already confirmed that the 4.0.4 version contained a "nasty bug" and wasn't ready for release.
If you look at it that way, new devices with 4.0.3 is still bugged in a way. And Google wants to keep those versions away from their current Nexus.
Just my way of being patient
Oddly enough, some of the tablets shown at MWC (on 4.0.3) had multi touch issues. This brings in a whole new strand of questions...
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
In regards to the latest os .... can anyone tell me what phone has ics update already???? And I've said phone ohh and it has to be released now announced
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
hurricurry said:
Multi touch bug ftl and slow multitasking.
Was really hoping Google would solve these problems earler
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was really hoping people would stop *****ing about OTAs.
Sorry, but you all sound like a bunch of whiney kids. You'll never be satisfied because the OTAs will never be quick enough to satisfy people. Google is not going to give you nightly builds of ICS. So just calm down and wait for it to be finished and pushed out.
martonikaj said:
I was really hoping people would stop *****ing about OTAs.
Sorry, but you all sound like a bunch of whiney kids. You'll never be satisfied because the OTAs will never be quick enough to satisfy people. Google is not going to give you nightly builds of ICS. So just calm down and wait for it to be finished and pushed out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You just love calling everyone whiney kids don't you?
People are pissed because we have a Nexus that for the first time, is NOT leading the way in terms of OS version. We are pissed because of the overwhelming silence from Google.
It would take them 15 minutes to post a blog on where things are at.
Scottatron said:
You just love calling everyone whiney kids don't you?
People are pissed because we have a Nexus that for the first time, is NOT leading the way in terms of OS version.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes I do. And people deserve to be given some perspective.
What do you mean? ~1% of Android devices have ICS. How is that not leading the way in terms of OS version when we're the only phone with it? Nothing has a higher OS (and don't say "omg the NS has 4.0.3!"). The Galaxy Nexus launched Android 4.
Why are you crying about not having 4.0.3/4.0.4 over 4.0.2. If its not ready, its not ready. That's why we don't have it officially yet. For all you know Google is holding off till 4.0.5, 4.0.6, or 4.1... no one knows.
Like your phone for what it is. You're like a dog chasing his tail when you get something great and always look for the next best thing. You'll spend your entire time with the device wanting more, and you'll never enjoy what you have.
Like I said in the other thread: OTA's will never come fast enough for people. If Google started pushing one every month (regardless of how what it did or didn't include/fix), it still wouldn't be fast enough because people would prefer it was 3 weeks instead, then 2 weeks, then 1 week, then nightlies. And guess what? Google isn't going to do nightly OTAs of ICS (not even close!). If you want nightlies, go build a ROM from CM source and change things for yourself. Or better yet, build straight from AOSP source and fix the bugs yourself. Make a thread for it and let people ***** at you for not fixing them faster.
maybe this is why apple is having better success in the mobile world then google and all the others.
while all i have is an old ipod touch from apple, and have GN and ACER tablet, the fact is that google ANNOUNCED 4.0.3 as THE LASTEST STABLE release, however, even on the official supported hardware i still have 4.0.2
this is why i personally compare android to the old windows mobile system.
on the old windows mobile system, if you wanted to upgrade to the latest, you had to hack the device and upgrade yourself, and even then not all devices could be upgraded to all OSs. when i talk to people about android, i still find mayself telling them that even on the official hardware you need to hack the device to get the official upgrade.
if google and all the open source will learn a little from old mistake they will build a better test environments and stop calling any buggy version an official release, or make sure that all devices be able to get the latest version when it is announced (ipod/iphone 3rd gen can still be updated to ios5 even if it can barely work with it) .
the simple fact is, the android is repeating all of the mistakes that even microsoft with WP7 have learned, and am not showing even the slightest inclinations to make a change to this inadequate system of multiversioning....
PCHelper said:
maybe this is why apple is having better success in the mobile world then google and all the others.
while all i have is an old ipod touch from apple, and have GN and ACER tablet, the fact is that google ANNOUNCED 4.0.3 as THE LASTEST STABLE release, however, even on the official supported hardware i still have 4.0.2
this is why i personally compare android to the old windows mobile system.
on the old windows mobile system, if you wanted to upgrade to the latest, you had to hack the device and upgrade yourself, and even then not all devices could be upgraded to all OSs. when i talk to people about android, i still find mayself telling them that even on the official hardware you need to hack the device to get the official upgrade.
if google and all the open source will learn a little from old mistake they will build a better test environments and stop calling any buggy version an official release, or make sure that all devices be able to get the latest version when it is announced (ipod/iphone 3rd gen can still be updated to ios5 even if it can barely work with it) .
the simple fact is, the android is repeating all of the mistakes that even microsoft with WP7 have learned, and am not showing even the slightest inclinations to make a change to this inadequate system of multiversioning....
Click to expand...
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I'll tend to agree with most of what you said.... Apple has this down to a T with releasing OS versions. Everyone with the previous 2 versions of the hardware is completely guaranteed to get the update the day that it comes out. Models 3 years ago may or may not get a full update, but they'll at least get a partial update (with some features pulled). You know what you're getting and you know when you're getting it. You'll never be in limbo. When Apple announces a new iOS version, they explicitly say which models will get it. The consistency is good.
WP7 is a bit better analogy of what Android has to strive for IMO. Android covers tons of carriers, devices, etc. but still needs to be able to handle pushing OTAs to everyone in a timely matter. This is a huge logistical hurdle for MS (or Google) to try jump. MS is handling it by putting very strict guidelines on what hardware can be used and what you can/can't do to the software (which is pretty much nothing). This makes the OTA process a 1000 times easier for MS to implement. What it leads to is basically knowing that the OTA update will work on all of these different devices because they're about 90% identical in hardware, and 99% identical in software. The only hurdle for them is pretty much getting carriers to accept the terms of pushing the OTA.
While Google could implement a system like this, it'd be at least a year out. Because in order for this MS-style system to work, Android would have to have specific hardware and software guidelines. The problem being that Android is open source and free, and manufacturers can really do whatever they want. They only have to follow some very relaxed "guidelines" to get GAPPS. Even if Google wanted to push OTAs to all of these phones in their current state they couldn't. Google doesn't hold the code from Samsung, HTC, LG, Huawei, and others because they're each doing it in house. There is no unifying OTA that can be pushed. Ultimately Google has no say in what happens after they certify it for GAPPS support. At that point, its between the manufacturers and carriers what is going to happen.
Google needs to start hitting manufacturers where they can, with GAPPS. Its the only closed-source part of Android and its a really really important one. They need to start forcing UI guidelines and skinning policies that let OTAs flow smoother. On the carrier side, they need to start pushing carriers to allow manufacturers to push them when its ready. Google can only do so much to carriers though. At that point they can threaten, but again its not up to Google what happens with those devices once the licenses go out. Its not a Google sale to the carrier, its a manufacturer sale. Until every phone Google sells is a Nexus, they won't be able to tell carriers what to do. Although the market share is huge for Android, it doesn't have the same unified push to bully carriers like Apple has.
....but I've got a couple other points as well on your post. You're making it sound like the Galaxy Nexus is running 4.0.2, and the rest of devices are running/being sold with 4.0.3 (the "stable" build). This is not the case. Whether its running the most "stable" build or not, the GNex is the most up to date of all Android phones out there right now. And we'll be getting stock 4.0.3 before anyone, and all of those phones being sold from this point w/ 4.0.3 will have skins attached as well.
martonikaj said:
the GNex is the most up to date of all Android phones out there right now. And we'll be getting stock 4.0.3 before anyone
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Why doesn't the Nexus S factor into your argument?
Evangelion01 said:
Why doesn't the Nexus S factor into your argument?
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First off, the Nexus S update has yet to be pushed to everyone. Its still halted because of bugs (and the NS4G doesn't have it officially, either). Second, simply because it's 4.0.3 doesn't mean that it's "better" than 4.0.2 on the Galaxy Nexus. For all intents and purposes, it's the same update... look at the NS4G and NS on Gingerbread. One was on 2.3.5, the other on 2.3.7... doesn't mean one was better than the other, but simply the NS4G needed specific build # because its a different device.
If you're splitting hairs of 4.0.3 vs. 4.0.2 to try and win this argument, it's not going to work.
now here is where we can start the argument... 4.0.3 is better then 4.0.2 if only due to the codex hardware fix.
But that is not the question. The issue is it was officially released as latest stable, however only after official release somehow all of a sudden the official Google phones are full of bugs and it is not good for them. If it is not developed and tested on the official hardware, then why put the official stamp on everything? Where is Google QA? Why buy Google official devices if we cannot even get the minimum we expect from the name? Pay attention, I am not talking about vendor devices, only on official stamped device/software....
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Scottatron said:
You just love calling everyone whiney kids don't you?
People are pissed because we have a Nexus that for the first time, is NOT leading the way in terms of OS version. We are pissed because of the overwhelming silence from Google.
It would take them 15 minutes to post a blog on where things are at.
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+1
Couldn't have put it better myself. Google really needs to pull its **** together and give us some of that 4.0.4 goodness!
Thank god for unlockable bootloaders and XDA devs, huh. Oh, wait......
From my point of view (and mine only) I knew the nexus would have an unlockable boot loader, I knew there would be a root exploit before I even brought the device and I knew the devs here would provide better then Google themselves, that's why I personally, brought the phone. Fortunately you didn't choose HTC. The delays are longer and the devices more secure. What I'm trying to say is, make the most the the nexus and this community and get a custom ROM or makesure you choose devices in the future for the right reasons. Let's face it, very few of us brought it for the specs....
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA App
Let's get this out of the way first, nobody here is stupid, we know the L Release is never going to come to the Galaxy Nexus officially. So let's talk about the community. I just have one basic question for our talented devs, what are the odds that a port of L will be able to come to the Gnex and if so, what kind of time frame are we looking at here?
Does the Cyanogenmod team do developers previews like this one? We might see it from them.
I'm sorry, but this post is exactly what I expected to see today.
so lets get it out of the way.
SURE
we COULD see some 5.0 aosp love(via custom development)
MAYBE.
time frame?
when.source drops, give it a few months at most I'd say
source isn't even CLOSE to ready yet though.
SOOO
let's ALSO look at the past.
which nexus devices, after Google officially dropped support, are STILL ABLE AND ARE running LATEST android version?
ALL of them right?
stability and such isn't a factor for this question, it's IF IT CAN/DOES run newest aosp in SOME FORM.
so I'd say YES gnex WILL see 5.0 in SOME usable form. but asking for ANY "time frame"at THIS POINT since SOURCE ISN'T AVAILABLE YET is kinda pointless.
maybe though, just maybe, there are ALREADY some people at work on getting those "preview" things ported. no matter WHAT, patience and not asking for timeframe/eta is key here
I don't normally do +1 style posts, but I am also greatly interested in knowing this as well.
I imagine it is largely going to depend on how much of the underlying kernel and driver interaction changes. I remember on my prior phone, a Droid X which has been and is still locked down, it was generally impossible to get past ICS because of the major underlying changes in JB and not being able to get those on the DX. Granted the Nexus doesn't have this limitation but drivers aren't likely to be further updated and if the kernel goes too far forward it is unlikely to see compatible driver versions for GNex hardware.
EDIT: I should probably say modules instead of drivers. I'm primarily a Windows person PC-side.
Put it this way my 4 year old HTC Desire can run Kitkat then i would be amazed if we didn't end up with some pretty good builds of "L".
ashclepdia said:
I'm sorry, but this post is exactly what I expected to see today.
so lets get it out of the way.
SURE
we COULD see some 5.0 aosp love(via custom development)
MAYBE.
time frame?
when.source drops, give it a few months at most I'd say
source isn't even CLOSE to ready yet though.
SOOO
let's ALSO look at the past.
which nexus devices, after Google officially dropped support, are STILL ABLE AND ARE running LATEST android version?
ALL of them right?
stability and such isn't a factor for this question, it's IF IT CAN/DOES run newest aosp in SOME FORM.
so I'd say YES gnex WILL see 5.0 in SOME usable form. but asking for ANY "time frame"at THIS POINT since SOURCE ISN'T AVAILABLE YET is kinda pointless.
maybe though, just maybe, there are ALREADY some people at work on getting those "preview" things ported. no matter WHAT, patience and not asking for timeframe/eta is key here
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Thanks for replying! I figured since I looked pretty thoroughly and didn't see a thread for it and thought that having at least one place for Gnex owners to talk about the L release for us wouldn't be a bad thing. I in no way meant to be one of those people who constantly bugs the devs about ETA's, I just meant what were could be expecting in the general sense. Thanks for the reassurance about us getting it, I've just been burned before about support with previous devices when they got past official support. But those weren't Nexii so I didn't know what to expect.
Brettbesa said:
Thanks for replying! I figured since I looked pretty thoroughly and didn't see a thread for it and thought that having at least one place for Gnex owners to talk about the L release for us wouldn't be a bad thing. I in no way meant to be one of those people who constantly bugs the devs about ETA's, I just meant what were could be expecting in the general sense. Thanks for the reassurance about us getting it, I've just been burned before about support with previous devices when they got past official support. But those weren't Nexii so I didn't know what to expect.
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yea sorry about my tone in that reply mostly too
I'm usually not the one to fly off ranting towards other users actions, at least not on xda(i do #AshRants elsewhere lol)
your question was a valid one, and I know where you coming from when it comes to nom nexus devices and their lack of support, I had a droid x2 that was ORIGINALLY SCHEDULED BY MOTOROLA to have ICS update. which for some reason they just didn't follow through on. Their REASON they said was that "android 4.0+ would not improve functionality of this device"...aka "we don't feel like fixing all the bugs we gave you already with shotty gingerbread releases, and we aren't going to allow you to unlock the device or give you usable kernel source so screw off",...back when moto didn't gaf about the dev communities. they have made huge strides towards mending that relationship. just couldn't believe they had the gall to say 4.0 wouldn't improve the first dual core android device running a tegra2 chipset. bah. ramblings now again from ash.
but yea reason I kinda went off in that reply was mostly cuz I hoped all the other people who were already drooling at the chance to post the exact same things would slow down and think instead first it wasnt intended as a personal attack towards you or to start any flamewar on the subject. and judging by your reply you didn't take offense to it anyways, so :thumbsup: :good: we all on the same page anyways.
personally, I haven't seen much of the IO stuff about L, I saw mostly design changes, and would like to know more details about it's new features so I'll be digging around YouTube today for recaps and such.
but I'm almost certain that if we don't get some kinda official rom like CM, OMNI, SHINY, PA, etc... building L based.roms for us, then some of our awesomely talented devs will at LEAST get us able to look like we have it, along with SOME if not z MOST functionality of L.
ashclepdia said:
I'm sorry, but this post is exactly what I expected to see today.
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I also think you guys should be patient. Your life won't be (that limited if there won't be a port of the coming up Android L to our Galaxy Nexus. Just relax.
As some have already pointed out, we're unlikely to see Android 5 "officially" ported to our GNex, for pretty much the same reason that we don't have an official 4.4 release for our phone. From ArsTechnica:
"Our talk with Burke shed some light on some more obscure topics too, including the lack of an Android 4.4 update for the Galaxy Nexus. Google's official line was that the company only supports hardware for 18 months after release, which it still mentions in its official Nexus update support document. As was speculated at the time, though, the decision was tied to Texas Instruments' exit from the consumer SoC market (TI's OMAP chip powered the Galaxy Nexus as well as other prominent Android-based hardware like the first Kindle Fires).
"It was a really extraordinary event," he said. "You had a silicon company exit the market, there was nobody left in the building to talk to."
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TI stopped development for the GNex SoC at Android 4.1. Google and others worked hard to support it for 4.2 and 4.3, but the official TI software was broken by 4.4. The reason that we even have 4.4 custom ROMs is because some kind-hearted person, perhaps a TI insider, released beta or engineering sample software for the SoC. But as we've found, it's not the most stable
have a great weekend,
john
You could all complain about TI stopping development and blaming them. The Google Glass uses a not to different TI SOC compared to the GNex has a 3.4 kernel and runs 4.4.2
Now please understand that Google simply ditched us for reasons other than TI stopped developing SOC bla bla bla.
akash3656 said:
You could all complain about TI stopping development and blaming them. The Google Glass uses a not to different TI SOC compared to the GNex has a 3.4 kernel and runs 4.4.2
Now please understand that Google simply ditched us for reasons other than TI stopped developing SOC bla bla bla.
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Plus if they didn't drop support after two years android would have alot more bugs in general.
DR3W5K1 said:
Plus if they didn't drop support after two years android would have alot more bugs in general.
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I don't get your logic. And its not like 4.3 is flawless. HD video playback on this device (GNex) lags.
+ if Google themselves show a bad example to OEMs on how long to update devices, expect OEMs to not update devices older than a year. And this makes the whole "android doesn't get timely updates" into a new issue where "android doesn't get updates after a year+ at best".
GNex will never die!
(3.5 yrs going strong bby, and thanks to vanir+dirtyv f2fs running better than ever)
latenightchameleon said:
GNex will never die!
(3.5 yrs going strong bby, and thanks to vanir+dirtyv f2fs running better than ever)
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Indeed. There will likely be somebody out there building from the latest source for this device as long as it's possible to do so, and possibly even if it isn't.
akash3656 said:
Now please understand that Google simply ditched us for reasons other than TI stopped developing SOC
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Out of curiosity, what would those reasons be?
jsage said:
Out of curiosity, what would those reasons be?
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That's up for you to imagine....
Money, profit, greed? You pick which one. Or make your own reasons.
akash3656 said:
That's up for you to imagine....
Money, profit, greed? You pick which one. Or make your own reasons.
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Well, I guess when simple facts aren't sufficient then fantasy must be more believable.
wow
some of these replies were brutal, sheesh
gray bishop said:
some of these replies were brutal, sheesh
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Honest perhaps. It's pretty simple really. The new OS (4.4) has a new kernel. The new kernel requires new drivers. Neither TI (OMAP SoC) nor ImgTec (PowerVR GPU) will supply those drivers.
Yes, an engineer at TI "released" a blob last fall. But it was not release-quality, it was beta-quality. Not everything is a conspiracy; we've just reached the end of the official support road.
On the other hand if one is inclined to run on the bleeding edge and stability is not their primary concern, there are any number of KitKat custom ROMs in which one can indulge.
have a great evening,
john
jsage said:
Honest perhaps. It's pretty simple really. The new OS (4.4) has a new kernel. The new kernel requires new drivers. Neither TI (OMAP SoC) nor ImgTec (PowerVR GPU) will supply those drivers.
Yes, an engineer at TI "released" a blob last fall. But it was not release-quality, it was beta-quality. Not everything is a conspiracy; we've just reached the end of the official support road.
On the other hand if one is inclined to run on the bleeding edge and stability is not their primary concern, there are any number of KitKat custom ROMs in which one can indulge.
have a great evening,
john
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Ah crap I didn't mean to thank you. Anyway, yea sure remember all those OEMs you blame and all have given everything you've said to a certain product. GOOGLE GLASS. And go and check what SOC Google Glass uses.
Now have fun.