I was just reading this article:
http://s4gru.com/index.php?/blog/1/...he-midrange-samsung-galaxy-victory-oet-review
And think it's a complete waste of money and resources developing mid and lower range handsets. If I was the CEO of HTC, Moto, or Samsung, I would focus on only 1 (flagship) device in each size category.
It just makes sense on so many levels, economically and marketing wise especially.
For example, the current hottest phone for Samsung is the Galaxy S III, which commands the premium price of being the latest and greatest at $200. They can sell the SGSII for $100 and offer the SGS for free (all on contract of course).
Imagine all the engineers and financial resources they can allocate to flagship devices if they followed this model.
Samsung, Motorola, HTC, please dump all your existing mid and lower range lines of handsets.
Do yourselves and Android lovers a great service!
And lastly, please use the same name for each device for all the carriers. None of this one unique name for each carrier for the same device bullcrap!
It would make sense only if they didn't make a profit on these phones that they push out but obviously they do so they will continue pushing out as many as possible. Luckily it seems Samsung is the only company left doing this.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
Apple actually has a patent on that business model.
Some people can't afford to pay flagship model prices.
More handsets with different ranges will appeal to more customers.
There is also those who don't need everything a top of the line phone has.
No way I am going to pay for the top of the line phone for my 12 year old son.
He doesn't need all the features, plus the fact that since he's a kid there is a greater chance of the phone meeting some kind of accident.
lowandbehold said:
Apple actually has a patent on that business model.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apple has a low end, mid range, and high end iPhone in the market (4 - free, 4S - $100, 5 - $200+). Even they couldn't ignore the low end of the market anymore.
This post demonstrates no business knowledge whatsoever. Like previously mentioned not everyone wants a flagship or even a smart phone. You need to cater to a wide range of users.
It's not about focusing all your resources on flagship models for a smaller group. They make a large profit on lower and mid range phones too.
Sdobron said:
This post demonstrates no business knowledge whatsoever. Like previously mentioned not everyone wants a flagship or even a smart phone. You need to cater to a wide range of users.
It's not about focusing all your resources on flagship models for a smaller group. They make a large profit on lower and mid range phones too.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
agreed, some buy the top end phones and figure there is no need for lower. It is kind of like when you hear "buy a BMW because there is no point to buying a lower quality car" Well what if they put even MORE R&D into it and now the phone was leagues better but cost $900 with a contract renewal? Its about making profit and producing what the market wants. one person once made a ton of money on a pet rock.
Sdobron said:
This post demonstrates no business knowledge whatsoever. Like previously mentioned not everyone wants a flagship or even a smart phone. You need to cater to a wide range of users.
It's not about focusing all your resources on flagship models for a smaller group. They make a large profit on lower and mid range phones too.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, the point is this.
HTC, Moto, and Samsung can all take huge advantage of economies of scale when they only make flagship model phones. How many components can Samsung share between the Galaxy S I, II, III and soon to be out IV?
Apple is making PLENTY of profit ONLY selling to people who want smart phones.
Sm0k3d 0uT said:
Some people can't afford to pay flagship model prices.
More handsets with different ranges will appeal to more customers.
There is also those who don't need everything a top of the line phone has.
No way I am going to pay for the top of the line phone for my 12 year old son.
He doesn't need all the features, plus the fact that since he's a kid there is a greater chance of the phone meeting some kind of accident.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The idea behind this is that everyone gets a flagship phone. You might not have the latest generation of the flagship phone, but it's still a flagship phone from its time.
The Galaxy S I was a flag ship phone and Samsung can now offer it for $0 with contract.
The Galaxy S II was a flag ship phone and Samsung can now offer it for $99 with contract.
The Galaxy S III is the CURRENT flag ship phone and Samsung offers it for $199 with contract.
----------------------
When the Galaxy S IV comes out, just phase out the Galaxy S I and offer this:
The Galaxy S II was a flag ship phone and Samsung can now offer it for $0 with contract.
The Galaxy S III was a flag ship phone and Samsung can now offer it for $99 with contract.
The Galaxy S IV is the CURRENT flag ship phone and Samsung offers it for $199 with contract.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? I think it's the best business model out there! You can save more costs due to sharing some components across generations and everyone gets a flagship device. That alone does a lot for the perception of your brand. Apple doesn't make a crappy mid or low range phone, so their brand is never associated with cheapness. But, you can get an iphone 4 for cheap now, it's $0 with contract. It's also 3 generations behind...but that also means the parts inside it are cheaper to buy, because they too, are 3 generations behind.
lowandbehold said:
Apple actually has a patent on that business model.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't be surprised if they tried to patent this business model!
Yup this I think, is what needs to happen. Way to may phones coming out every year. It would also help with updates. Cheap phones is what gives android a bad name. After someone buys a cheap crap phone then tries an iphone they always end up switching.
Well, your logic in saying they would save money by mass producing more of just one or fewer models is only partly true. Surely there's some benefit, but as large portions of the guts of these budget phones are just last year's processors and chips...what you're saying is already partly happening. I agree it is quite annoying and confusing to bother rereleasing slightly modified versions of previous models as budget phones, but I'm not sure that they truly would save much in terms of production from simplifying their lineups. There may be a certain logic to the rebranding as many average people don't realize they're buying old tech if it's just released, and look, cheaper!
The real benefits of condensing the amount of models is probably just to gain more notoriety for making one good phone, which I guess really is copying the Apple model. Only one laptop, one phone, yadda...which is kinda boring to me. Thus my preference would be to keep some variety out there, but if they are going to release more devices, add more actual variety, not just useless rebranded old models.
EDIT: Additional complaint...I really hate it when people worry about the extra 100 dollars up front for a phone that costs such a ginormous amount of money on contract
johnchad14 said:
Well, your logic in saying they would save money by mass producing more of just one or fewer models is only partly true. Surely there's some benefit, but as large portions of the guts of these budget phones are just last year's processors and chips...what you're saying is already partly happening. I agree it is quite annoying and confusing to bother rereleasing slightly modified versions of previous models as budget phones, but I'm not sure that they truly would save much in terms of production from simplifying their lineups. There may be a certain logic to the rebranding as many average people don't realize they're buying old tech if it's just released, and look, cheaper!
The real benefits of condensing the amount of models is probably just to gain more notoriety for making one good phone, which I guess really is copying the Apple model. Only one laptop, one phone, yadda...which is kinda boring to me. Thus my preference would be to keep some variety out there, but if they are going to release more devices, add more actual variety, not just useless rebranded old models.
EDIT: Additional complaint...I really hate it when people worry about the extra 100 dollars up front for a phone that costs such a ginormous amount of money on contract
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Click to collapse
If you read my OP, I said they should release one flagship phone for each size segment. But for smaller players, like LG, just make one phone. Bigger players, like HTC, Samsung, Motorola....they can make a 4" phone, 5" phone and 4" phone with keyboard.
They all aren't going to make the exact same size 4" or 5" phones. Just look at all the models in the 4.x" range. You still will have the diversity of Android.
Turb0wned said:
Yup this I think, is what needs to happen. Way to may phones coming out every year. It would also help with updates. Cheap phones is what gives android a bad name. After someone buys a cheap crap phone then tries an iphone they always end up switching.
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Click to collapse
You are 100% correct!!!
We should post on Moto, HTC and Samsung's Facebook pages and let them know what we want!
Apple will not have a chance in hell if each company only focused on one kickass, flagship device. Imagine the HUGE benefit to consumer as well!!!
The only problem I see is when your making only one phone or just a few phones and Apple gets them banned your SOL on all sales until its sorted.
In theory, this is a good idea. However, android technology evolves way too fast for this to work. It's possible to get a GS2 for free on contract and a GS3 for like $50 if you look hard enough. If you're really good, you can get really any phone (besides an iPhone) free on contract
People want different things though, i for one think 4.8 inches it's too large, and personally, if they fit some nice specs in a keyboard phone with unlockable bootloader AND removable battery, I'd be all over it. I like the options, and I'm sure many others enjoy having a choice as well.
And keyboard phones don't sell like they use to so they're no longer flagship phones, even the Droid series is dissolving.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Only if they happened to have designed the perfect budget phone 2 years ago, no changes necessary (or, in the case of apple, if your consumers don't care and would just buy anyway). Reading your example, this new phone was designed precisely because they were able to add newer, better components while still keeping it a budget phone.
Now, your strategy might make sense for some (say, if your company can't afford to spend the money, HTC style) but I doubt you'd convince someone like samsung, whose business model is based on one-upping their opponents in all areas, to do so. As Ashton suggested, Android (unlike the iPhone) is driven too hard by competition, so that the vendors are forced to evolve even their budget lines.
thebobp said:
Only if they happened to have designed the perfect budget phone 2 years ago, no changes necessary (or, in the case of apple, if your consumers don't care and would just buy anyway). Reading your example, this new phone was designed precisely because they were able to add newer, better components while still keeping it a budget phone.
Now, your strategy might make sense for some (say, if your company can't afford to spend the money, HTC style) but I doubt you'd convince someone like samsung, whose business model is based on one-upping their opponents in all areas, to do so. As Ashton suggested, Android (unlike the iPhone) is driven too hard by competition, so that the vendors are forced to evolve even their budget lines.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So, none of the antagonizing arguments make sense.
If Android vendors are under more competition, then it makes MORE sense to adopt this business model.
It's no wonder Jelly Bean web penetration is only at 1.2% a full two months after its release. Look at the staggering amount of handsets that have to be upgraded. Even the SGS3, a flagship phone, isn't getting JB until October. But, the Nexus S has it already...because Google only makes one model. Say Samsung cut down to only producing the GS and Note series phones and just used the previous gen models to sell as "budget" phones. It would be so much easier to do software upgrades for their customers (which is what everyone wants...check their FB page, number one question is...when is my phone going to get the next update?).
Also, the whole argument about diversity has already addressed. HTC, Moto and Samsung all aren't going to make the same size phones. That's not to mention the smaller players like Sony, LG, etc. They'll all stake a claim somewhere in the 4"-5" range. HTC and Samsung will also stake claims in the 5"+ territory.
AshtonTS said:
In theory, this is a good idea. However, android technology evolves way too fast for this to work. It's possible to get a GS2 for free on contract and a GS3 for like $50 if you look hard enough. If you're really good, you can get really any phone (besides an iPhone) free on contract
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That sounds counter intuitive. If Android tech evolves really fast, then that's actually all the more reason to adopt this model. The budget phone segment will get a new "update" every 9mos or whatever the cycle is at now that new flagship versions are being released. Samsung and others can allocate more engineers to work on just two models and get software updates out faster.
Related
SamFirmware is claiming that Samsung is in the process of distancing itself from Windows Phone 7 and increasing its emphasis on Android and especially its own home-grown Bada OS.
Further support for the rumour can be found in both a leaked roadmap which shows only a poorly specified follow-up for the Samsung Omnia 7 in Europe, the Samsung Omnia W, with a small screen and low resolution camera, and a recent FCC disclose of a mildly updated Samsung Omnia 7 with a front-facing camera running Mango, both not demonstrating much effort or emphasis on the OS by Samsung.
http://wmpoweruser.com/samsung-rumoured-to-be-stepping-away-from-windows-phone-7/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wonder if there is any truth in this..
BadaBing.
we all will die 21 December 2012, u forgot?
so they want to cancel it before, so inside hell they got some small bonus for that.
It's the final countdown...
Cotulla said:
we all will die 21 December 2012, u forgot?
so they want to cancel it before, so inside hell they got some small bonus for that.
It's the final countdown...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And YES.....We all die on Dec 2012 !!!!!! lol....
Siiiiick. Who's next
Sounds to me that someone from SamFirmware got butt hurt because of this thread yesterday and decided to post about the demise of WPx.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1251414&page=8
.. In short.. Samfirmware was trying to up the downloads of their firmwares before they would release the RTM mango for Omnia7. Turned into a flame war.
If Samsung has not made a clear roadmap for WPx, it does not mean that they are killing it. This is pure speculation on SamFirmwares part.
Samsung is a very opportunistic company, so anyone who's trying to guess what they will decide in the end of 2012 is dreaming.
That Samsung has no commitment for WP7 now is sort of obvious by their lineup (or lack thereof).
This would make no sense since WP is destined to be the number 2 operating system in a few years according to multiple analysts. I can see Moto not jumping now that they are owned by google but not Samsung. Samsung , HTC ,and Nokia are going to be the 3 major players in the market. But who knows what the legal teams talk about. Maybe Microsoft pissed Samsung off asking a piece of their android sales like with HTC ( $15 per android device )
Sent from my T8788 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Cotulla said:
we all will die 21 December 2012, u forgot?
so they want to cancel it before, so inside hell they got some small bonus for that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's why the space station exists, to give the big-wigs a place to watch humanity be destroyed...for entertainment.
Well if they doit will not be suprising. Samsung has their own platform and ecosystem which seems to be taking off decently in the grand scheme of things. Plus, they simply don't have the freedom they need to innovate on WP7.
All Microsoft needs now is Nokia. The other's have not shown a legitimate commitment to WPhone. All the WP phone specs and design are lackluster compared to other brands. I think it's to MS advantage to focus on one hardware manufacturer that can create hardware that is totally synergistic with the Mango OS...the same way Apple does with their devices. In the Android market, there is a forgetable phone released every week it seems like. MS needs to focus on one or two very memorable phones to gain mindshare. A high-end phone (more expensive than iPhone or top-end Android), and a mid-range phone.
N8ter said:
Plus, they simply don't have the freedom they need to innovate on WP7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't worry about Samsung's frustration in this area.
i don't actually mind them backing out... their WP7 and coming known offerings aren't very worthy of consumer money, imho. though, i must admit, them backing out could harm the rest of us with increased pricing. : /
also, i do like the idea (proposed?) at the end of that article. Microsoft should pick up RIM, Blackberry enhancements would do great things for WP7, i imagine.
just my two cents...
sh4d0w86.
samsung's loss if true. bada is going nowhere outside of korea and low-end smart phones (think palm). they now compete head-to-head with htc, but with their vertical hardware component production (e.g., amoled) they have an advantage as long as that remains a leading technology. and have attracted the attention of competitors like apple... but for their hardware+android creations... not a dead-end bada 'ecosystem'.
cheers
tbh who cares? one word Nokia
I have an Omnia 7 now. Whilst the hardware is great, I doubt i'd get another Samsung phone with all the software issues there have been.
I don't expect to have to be putting resistors into my USB port to get into download mode for instance and Samsungs lack of any really decent apps in the market speak volumes.
My contract is up around March time. The thing that sold me on the Omnia was the AMOLED screen and since Nokia seem to be using them it's a bit of a no brainer for me.
The only thing I'd miss would be AMOLEDs, but if Nokia keeps using them (but Clear Black is just a filter, it isn't necessarily AMOLED...), I'm fine. No way I'm going back to LCD.
Freypal said:
I have an Omnia 7 now. Whilst the hardware is great, I doubt i'd get another Samsung phone with all the software issues there have been.
I don't expect to have to be putting resistors into my USB port to get into download mode for instance and Samsungs lack of any really decent apps in the market speak volumes.
My contract is up around March time. The thing that sold me on the Omnia was the AMOLED screen and since Nokia seem to be using them it's a bit of a no brainer for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Super AMOLED+ is so superior to AMOLED, it's kind of insulting and ignorant to compare the AMOLED panels on the DVP or a Nokia phone to the Samsung panels.
Seriously, Samsung's displays are in a league above practically everyone else in all areas except pixel density these days. And I expect to see some qHD mobile displays coming from them soon.
Samsung phones tend to have a number of advantages in hardware:
1. They tend to use NAND Flash instead of SD Cards internally like Dell and HTC (offers better performance)
2. Their Camers are always at least "Good"
3. Their Cell Radios tend to be wildly superior to anything that isn't Motorola
4. Their sound tends to be wildly superior to anything that isn't an iPhone or dedicated media device (Zune or iPod)
5. Their displays are superior to anything else on the market outside of pixel deisity vs some qHD/LG (iPhone) displays
6. Their higih end smartphones always have at least a decent battery size, and aren't weighty
The thing they always miff up, though, is the software. Microsoft was supposed to negate that weakness of thiers, but I guess Samsung always has to find a way to fail ya know
I don't expect a phone OEM to provide flawless software, though. I just want a good phone. Let Microsoft worry about the software. Dunno how they miffed up WP7, but I guess they were trying hard. I think some of the issues were a the wrong ROM being loaded on the phones (focus?) or something...
Samsung is the only OEM outside of Dell that actually put some thought into their flagship WP7 devices (Focus and DVP), so they do deserve a bit of credit.
samsung has the sales numbers in hand (their own information), which most likely m$ wants kept quiet. As a globally present company, they don't care what os is run, so long as the phones sell. They have no alligience to a software platform, only to sales. Nothing would surprise me at this point with the very slow uptake of wpx.
Then again, this thread speculates about things that might happen in 2012-13, which means nothing. The holiday season of 2011 is where the golds at.
aquanaut88 said:
samsung's loss if true. bada is going nowhere outside of korea and low-end smart phones (think palm). they now compete head-to-head with htc, but with their vertical hardware component production (e.g., amoled) they have an advantage as long as that remains a leading technology. and have attracted the attention of competitors like apple... but for their hardware+android creations... not a dead-end bada 'ecosystem'.
cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bada is going nowhere? Millions upon millions sold and its going nowhere?
If Bada is dead end and going nowhere, why is it outselling WP7?
A loss but how big?
Look, I have had the Focus since last December and love it. Sure, it has had some frustrating and random issues but I am a very old guy and grew up with the earliest computers so am accustomed to dealing with these. I bought the Focus mainly for the screen, my eyes aren't what they used to be. I have had all HTC phones prior to the Focus and tweaked, flashed and updated until I grew weary of it, but liked the hardware. I will just go to Nokia or HTC but will not move away from WP7. There will be phones with screens equal to Super AMOLED or better, I have little doubt of that. The support (or lack of it) from Samsung for the phone and software has been terrible so goodbye to a poor company from that standpoint.
why are the WP7 so expensive while having less spec? I really want to get a WP7 but the price is the biggest constrain.
There are inexpensive models, too. What ones, specifically are you comparing? Also WP7 doesn't need dual cores to run really well. Other spec issues may still be limitations of the OS.
Sent from my Lumia 800 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
WP7 devices are generally more expensive. For proof look at the HTC Sensation XL; identical in every way to the HTC Titan, but has more RAM, includes expensive Beats headphones and sells unlocked for roughly £100 less than the Titan. Why a 25% price reduction for better hardware running Android?
It could be license fees, maybe less Titans were manufactured, maybe just the Android phone market is more competitive and they think they can get away with higher WP7 pricing?
anseio said:
Also WP7 doesn't need dual cores to run really well.
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Click to collapse
Why do people keep repeating this? It's like an echo on WP7 forums; so so annoying!
Obviously a mobile OS doesn't need dual-cores to be smooth (iOS is proof of that) but it is hugely limiting when it comes to 3D games and CPU intensive apps. For example, Titan II just announced and still no 1080p video recording, let alone cool things like onboard video editing. So technically the OS doesn't need it, but it does if it doesn't want to get left in the dust by the big two competitors.
WTF do you expect people to say! You give no specs to compare or complain about. Of course, you're going to hear the same thing over and over again.
Be specific the first time around.
anseio said:
WTF do you expect people to say! You give no specs to compare or complain about. Of course, you're going to hear the same thing over and over again.
Be specific the first time around.
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Click to collapse
The original post is about WP7 pricing. What has "WP7 doesn't need dual cores to run really well" got to do with the posters question?
It was an odd response, hence I had to take issue and question it.
I just don't understand, why WP7 from the same manufacturer is more expensive than their Android counterpart. Are manufacturers forced to pay Microsoft license fee for Windows Mobile?
At 1% of the smartphone market, MS should really try to make their phones cheaper.
Windows mobile phones were also very expensive even after android came out.
Sent from my HTC EVO 3D using Tapatalk
because there's no market of WP7. and the few phones sold, are very expensive, because the variable cost of production.
It sounds absurd, but WP7=old hardware=bigger price, Android=new hardware=more rotation=male price.
if you want to buy today a cathodic tube TV, it will be more expensive tan a 3D led TV.
the same reason.
hey but remember: WP7 doesn't need dual core, it runs smooth with one core!
that's the only important thing about mobile phones nowerdays. that's why WP7 is the best phone of the world! I'm just kidding obviously...
Aphasaic2002 said:
WP7 devices are generally more expensive. For proof look at the HTC Sensation XL; identical in every way to the HTC Titan, but has more RAM, includes expensive Beats headphones and sells unlocked for roughly £100 less than the Titan. Why a 25% price reduction for better hardware running Android?
It could be license fees, maybe less Titans were manufactured, maybe just the Android phone market is more competitive and they think they can get away with higher WP7 pricing?
Why do people keep repeating this? It's like an echo on WP7 forums; so so annoying!
Obviously a mobile OS doesn't need dual-cores to be smooth (iOS is proof of that) but it is hugely limiting when it comes to 3D games and CPU intensive apps. For example, Titan II just announced and still no 1080p video recording, let alone cool things like onboard video editing. So technically the OS doesn't need it, but it does if it doesn't want to get left in the dust by the big two competitors.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This right here. Best post ever, especially in these forums.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk
It must be a "right place, right time" thing, because I got my Focus for free, my wife got hers for free, I got my Titan for free, and four other extended family members got their "Focii" for either free or, at most, $50.
The focus is an old phone right now. Not sure where you got a Titan for free from. Maybe from a holiday promotion? Tmobile gave away hd7 a month after releas on promotion so that doesn't really say much tbh.
Under normal circumstances the phones are more expensive than better hardware running iOS or android. Even bb7 phones launches with better hw than wp7 had when it launched and cost less in many cases.
Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk
N8ter said:
The focus is an old phone right now. Not sure where you got a Titan for free from. Maybe from a holiday promotion? Tmobile gave away hd7 a month after releas on promotion so that doesn't really say much tbh.
Under normal circumstances the phones are more expensive than better hardware running iOS or android. Even bb7 phones launches with better hw than wp7 had when it launched and cost less in many cases.
Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry, 4 of us got our Focus phones for free between January and April of 2011, to be more specific, and I think 2 got them for $50. Yes, I know it's an old phone, but it was new (~2-6 months old) when all 6 were purchased.
I specifically waited until "Black Saturday" to buy my Titan for $0.01, because I knew the discount was coming. Keeping up with the WP7 blogs, it just seems like WP7s are usually on some kind of special or another...so unless you're talking about off-contract prices, I really don't see WP7 as being any more expensive than Android.
That said, obviously Android's larger market, greater competition, and zero licensing cost would result in lower prices.
Cheapest I see on Google shopping for the Titan is $519, $569, $575...
Cheapest I see on Google shopping for the HTC Sensation XL is $525, $582, $587, $599...
Maybe things are different in the UK, but that is not the case in US. The problem is the price of the Titan is all over the place so maybe depend on where you buy it is a $20 difference or a $100 difference.
Amazon.com has the Sensation for $581.49 but the Titan for $675
Ebay - HTC Titan (locked) from $450. (unlocked) from $550.00
Ebay - HTC Sensation XL (unlocked) from $530
I will let you know this, wholesale the Sensation XL is consistently below $500 while the Titan is all over the place. Be reasonable guys, that is the supply chain to blame.
Joe Belfiore discussed the pricing issue yesterday in an interview with the Verge.
http://www.theverge.com/2012/1/11/2699923/joe-belfiore-windows-phone-interview
If you don't want to watch the entire video, the relevant part is at 7mins 43secs.
It's a good interview, so worth watching the whole video. Don't expect any new information though
who cares what they cost compared to android. if you want one buy one if not then stick with your android
FinancialWar said:
why are the WP7 so expensive while having less spec? I really want to get a WP7 but the price is the biggest constrain.
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Click to collapse
They really are not. I mean head over to your friendly neighbourhood ebay and check it out. If your talking about expensive you will really have to explain. Seeing as the prices range between all WP7 devices.
N8ter said:
Under normal circumstances the phones are more expensive than better hardware running iOS or android. Even bb7 phones launches with better hw than wp7 had when it launched and cost less in many cases.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Proof?
The Titan and Sensation XL are just about identical and when comparing apples to apples can be obtained on ebay for just about the same price. And infact, I can buy a locked Titan and pay for an unlock code and come out cheaper.
Why spread misinformation? A simple price check shows that is absolute nonsense.
Because Windows Phone 7 is like a honey badger. It does whatever the hell it wants and it's still an awesome mobile OS.
I love that WP7 is not playing the whole hardware game and is just focusing purely on the user experience and this really shows. It sucks that I have to revert my HD2 back to Android mainly because of unsolvable random resets running WP7.
Sensation vs Titan current ebay prices
Supporting evidence on post above by nicksti
HTC Titan Buy It Now for $449.88, 509.99, and $545
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fro...1313&_nkw=HTC+Titan&_sacat=See-All-Categories
HTC Sensation XL Buy It Now $529.99, $552.99, $554.99 ...
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw...C+Titan&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3286.c0.m270.l1313
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Hardware
Titan is 1.4 GHz where the Sensation is 1.5 GHz - pretty close.
Both are 8 mega pixel cameras
Titan does 720P / Sensation does 720P (the listings did not show 1080P)
Both have 16GB.
I am now thinking the title of the thread needs to be changed.
Someone else can do the searching and posting for other device comparison information.
As is, it does not look to be more expensive for the same hardware.
I'm starting to see a shift in the pricing, for example on the TMOUS site one will find that the SGS2 and the HTC Amaze cost more on contract than the radar and Lumia 710.
I am very interested in this phone and the $20 Amazon price tag makes it even more exciting but Apollo is (reportedly) just around the corner.
My question is should I wait and get Apollo or go ahead and grab this? I can't think of a good enough reason to wait ATM but I must admit that is mostly due to the fact that I can't think of any must have features Apollo would have that Mango doesn't or that the 900's Hardware wouldn't be able to handle other than screen resolution and I am certainly not waiting 6 months or better for that.
What say you?
You know what..buy it...if you could afford it...you only live once...I bought mine off-contact. $481 w/tax.
No point waiting since we don't even know for sure when Apollo will be release...But if you want to play the waiting game...why not wait for windows phone 9 or windows phone 10....because new technology will always be out...the longer you wait...the less time you truly get to enjoy it before the next best thing hits market...
I got my Lumia 900 and enjoying it a lot...that means that when Apollo release I'll have like 6 or 7 months of joy with this phone....Of course only do this if you can afford the phone...
For a new and the top of the line Nokia phone for $481 w/tax is cheap. I bought their old Nokia 8800 for more than that...fruit for thought...
johnnybrav0 said:
You know what..buy it...if you could afford it...you only live once...I bought mine off-contact. $481 w/tax.
No point waiting since we don't even know for sure when Apollo will be release...But if you want to play the waiting game...why not wait for windows phone 9 or windows phone 10....because new technology will always be out...the longer you wait...the less time you truly get to enjoy it before the next best thing hits market...
I got my Lumia 900 and enjoying it a lot...that means that when Apollo release I'll have like 6 or 7 months of joy with this phone....Of course only do this if you can afford the phone...
For a new and the top of the line Nokia phone for $481 w/tax is cheap. I bought their old Nokia 8800 for more than that...fruit for thought...
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Click to collapse
I appreciate your opinion. Doing some basic estimations if the price holds steady on Amazon for the next month or so I can get it for $20 as compared to a standard high end phone at $200 which is a $180 discount.
Whereas if I were to buy it unsubsidized it runs $450 and a lot of of phones run $550+ unsubsidized. Therefore the $20 does seem to be a better deal.
I don't usually play the waiting game but I was just wondering if anyone knew a groundbreaking reason I should hold off.
jedivulcan said:
I'd wait for Apollo. I think the Lumia 900 is late to the game hardware that's more of a holdover until Microsoft readies Apollo (which hopefully supports larger than 800x480 displays and dual core processors) and Nokia is able to utilize any enhancements Microsoft mandates for newer Apollo devices.
I'm not saying it's a bad product, just not something I'd put down for a two year contract.
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Click to collapse
Why do I need/want a dual core processor? All videos I have seen showthe Lumia performing compareably with a single core. I agree on the resolution but I'm not holding on to my focus for another 6 months(or more) for a better resolution.
I somewhat agree on the hardware specwise but the software is performing in a manner that doesn't show it as much. I just think my excitement for the 900 is higher than my excitement would be for an Apollo device. If not than I probably would be willing to drop my unsubsidized money on it.
bmc24 said:
Why do I need/want a dual core processor? All videos I have seen showthe Lumia performing compareably with a single core. I agree on the resolution but I'm not holding on to my focus for another 6 months(or more) for a better resolution.
I somewhat agree on the hardware specwise but the software is performing in a manner that doesn't show it as much. I just think my excitement for the 900 is higher than my excitement would be for an Apollo device. If not than I probably would be willing to drop my unsubsidized money on it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good point. Its really easy to say, look at all the things I could do. Why not say, look at all the thing I do. The difference between the 2 is huge.
Windows Phone has only 80k apps in the marketplace. The others, hundreds of thousands. With the exception of a few notable ones, why is a weather app found in WP Marketplace not as good as one found in Android Marketplace. I guarentee you I will not scroll through 32k weather apps, to find the perfect one for me. I have my starbucks card, my facebook/twitter, my Cloud Music player, a few games I like, minus Angry Birds space. What else would I use all those apps for?
Dual/Quad core. I've not seen an Android phone, in my hands, have the battery life its expected to. Every Android I've had, plus the Razr, has failed at batterr life, for me. I never tried the MAXX. Is it the cores eating the battery? Or is it something else? Gaurentee you, Microsoft won't release the dual/quad core spec until it solves the battery life issue. Until the phone can be used, normally, for normal purposes, by normal people, non modded, a Dual or Quad core windows phone won't release. Terry Myerson is one of the more realistic GM's at Microsoft. If the phone won't last all day on a charge, then its no good. He doesn't ask if it can be fixed. He says show me it working.
Can you imagine, Angry Birds Space, in Quad Core!!!! Level 1, recharge. Level 2, Recharge.
I'm sure I do not understand the science of the Dual/Quad core. I'm sure there is a logic between all of these 'improvements', and why we need them. Someone on this forum talked about his phone in comparisons to his previous one, as a normal person should(?) think about it....
Checklist:
Does it work better than my last one> Check.
End of Checklist.
I plan on buying the white 900 when it comes out later this month. I'm going to buy it outright even though I'm due for an upgrade and save my upgrade for WP8. I'm betting the full price on a WP8 Nokia device will be higher than what the 900 is going for.
CrownSeven said:
I plan on buying the white 900 when it comes out later this month. I'm going to buy it outright even though I'm due for an upgrade and save my upgrade for WP8. I'm betting the full price on a WP8 Nokia device will be higher than what the 900 is going for.
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Click to collapse
I plan on doing something similar. I can get it for 20 on amazon with subsidized pricing so that means it is roughly 180 cheaper than a standard subsidized high end phone.
Comparing that to 450 unsubsidized to 550+ unsubsidized shows you save more money that way. Which also makes more sense because I am by convinced I'll be unequivocally upgrading
to Apollo therefore I don't want to commit my financial plns to it.
Sent from my SGH-i917 using Board Express
Save the money now, get the subsidized price, then decide if new WP8 hardware is worth buying off contract/unlocked. It's pretty simple, pay now or pay later and pay later is always better, especially given lack of info regarding WP8.
$450 is a pretty good price for the phone.
With the ~$400 difference between subsidized and unsubsidized, I guess your question should be "Do I think the difference between subsidized and unsubsidized on the WP8 phone I'll want will be > or < $400?"
I just bought it outright in hopes the difference for the WP8 flagship will be >400
ragingclue said:
$450 is a pretty good price for the phone.
With the ~$400 difference between subsidized and unsubsidized, I guess your question should be "Do I think the difference between subsidized and unsubsidized on the WP8 phone I'll want will be > or < $400?"
I just bought it outright in hopes the difference for the WP8 flagship will be >400
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The one major downside to that plan, and the reason I won't most likely do it, is because I am preemtively locking myself into upgrading into Windows 8. Which I am nowhere near convinced that I will want to.
The focus is the first handset I have held on to long enough to reach the upgrade point. I usued to upgrade once a year or more. Stating that I could reasonably see the 900 being in that category as well and if it turns out it's not I'll pay then for unsubsidized.
Most of my research says that there is a better chance that the difference will be less than 180 which is what I am looking at here ( price of 900(20) vs the price of most high end devices (200)) Whereas most devices run roughly no more than 600 or so compared to 450 or better unsubsidized.
And furthermore the likelihood of a killer feature coming out in the next year or less is highly unlikely as far as I am concerned.
Can anyone think of a rumored feature that would be that earth shattering?
kenikh said:
Save the money now, get the subsidized price, then decide if new WP8 hardware is worth buying off contract/unlocked. It's pretty simple, pay now or pay later and pay later is always better, especially given lack of info regarding WP8.
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Click to collapse
This is the way I'm leaning. Although I will admit I wish the White I was so looking forward to wasn't gloss. Makes it seem cheaper and more prone to scratches and smudges. But no device has ever been perfect so I suppose this is no different.
bmc24 said:
Can anyone think of a rumored feature that would be that earth shattering?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Earth shattering? No. But WP8 will bring a number of things up to speed like higher resolution displays, multi-core procs, etc.
The most important things will likely be in the software running on the phone. Various accounts suggest that the tight integration of services into WP7 will be on steroids in WP8. Think along the lines of Skype integrated into the dialer, perhaps even APIs that support direct integration of third party VOIP solutions, like Tango or Google Voice.
If you assume that MSFT will get it together and roll out APIs for integrating third party services into core OS functions on the scale of the Mango API release, watch out. You can really let your imagination go crazy.
kenikh said:
Earth shattering? No. But WP8 will bring a number of things up to speed like higher resolution displays, multi-core procs, etc.
The most important things will likely be in the software running on the phone. Various accounts suggest that the tight integration of services into WP7 will be on steroids in WP8. Think along the lines of Skype integrated into the dialer, perhaps even APIs that support direct integration of third party VOIP solutions, like Tango or Google Voice.
If you assume that MSFT will get it together and roll out APIs for integrating third party services into core OS functions on the scale of the Mango API release, watch out. You can really let your imagination go crazy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And those sound enticing but not world beaters. I feel like the core argument is similar to the current generation video game consoles; meaning that they have more power than developers know what to do with and as such will take a while to come into their own.
Thank you for your knowledge. The people here are making me feel better and better about my decision.
Either way, there's no wrong decision.
+1 to all kenikh said. Hit the nail on the head, especially the if M$ get their **** together part. That's the key here. They could hit it out of the park, or just end up with an experience that's only a minute step forward as opposed to a monumental one.
WP7 is great despite all it lacks. WP8 should address the areas where WP7 is decidedly hindered.
Sent from my Lumia 900 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
ragingclue said:
Either way, there's no wrong decision.
+1 to all kenikh said. Hit the nail on the head, especially the if M$ get their **** together part. That's the key here. They could hit it out of the park, or just end up with an experience that's only a minute step forward as opposed to a monumental one.
WP7 is great despite all it lacks. WP8 should address the areas where WP7 is decidedly hindered.
Sent from my Lumia 900 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just curious what do you think it lacks? The resolution is the only thing I can think of that matters
All I know is that I went to an att store and played with a 900 today, and I want one bad! I have used android for years now, but wow I love that phone. And the price is great! And there will be 4G in my area next month. Need to dump my sprint contact.
Sent from my MB855 using Tapatalk 2
bmc24 said:
Just curious what do you think it lacks? The resolution is the only thing I can think of that matters
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah resolution of course and an ecosystem (not their fault) with apps that can access core OS API. App integration into the OS has come a long way, but will mature further. More customization options couldn't hurt them either.
It'd be nice to have some real multitasking.
Other than that, it's all I can think of at the moment. Not a whole lot of stuff but just lime everything else, not only does it have to be done, it needs to be done right.
Sent from my Lumia 900 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
I'd edit my last post but the app won't let me scroll to the bottom of it LOL. Lime=like.
And with things like upped resolution will be everything behind it hardware-wise.
One thing I can't get with WP7 is proper integration of outlook when your company is running exchange server 2003, almost a deal breaker for me, but I blame my company as much as I blame M$ for that.
My most important work emails arrive with no preview line or contents. Sucks sometimes.
Sent from my Lumia 900 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
ragingclue said:
Yeah resolution of course and an ecosystem (not their fault) with apps that can access core OS API. App integration into the OS has come a long way, but will mature further. More customization options couldn't hurt them either.
It'd be nice to have some real multitasking.
Other than that, it's all I can think of at the moment. Not a whole lot of stuff but just lime everything else, not only does it have to be done, it needs to be done right.
Sent from my Lumia 900 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I pretty much agree with all of that but not being a Machead, none of those middling features are enough to make me foam at the mouth and wait in line to get a Win8 phone. Want but don't need and not want more than my 600 dollars
bmc24 said:
I pretty much agree with all of that but not being a Machead, none of those middling features are enough to make me foam at the mouth and wait in line to get a Win8 phone. Want but don't need and not want more than my 600 dollars
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
TBH, the upped resolution (assuming it doesn't sacrifice the smoothness) and proper compatibility with my Exchange server would be enough for me to justify it.
I'm not a Machead either.
But the quality and functionality of apps should improve with WP8.... Curious how well integrated it'll get with Win8.
I can't say right now whether I'll be in line for the first flagship WP8 device. Who knows, there might be another offering at that time that I'd prefer. I'm not affixed to any certain OS family, so my opinion is subject to change as they change and the offerings evolve. I can say, though, I'm glad WP finally got a flagship quality device. I'm addicted to AMOLED but have been F'd in the A enough by Samsung that I wasn't about to buy another one of those.... Then the Lumia 900 came along. Perfect.
What do you think?
I have read it will cost in the US 650$, how much will it be in the European in €?
What do you say about a waterproof Pixel and will it have a hard button home key?
FaserF said:
What do you think?
I have read it will cost in the US 650$, how much will it be in the European in â?¬?
What do you say about a waterproof Pixel and will it have a hard button home key?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not waterproof
www.androidpolice.com/2016/09/21/googles-pixel-phones-will-be-ip53-rated-meaning-no-dunking-your-pixel-or-hosing-it-down
Can't see there being a home button either.
Google doesn't do physical or capacitive buttons on the front.
A home button isn't entirely impossible. Case leaks include one on the front, oddly, and the actual photo leaks I've seen have the same area blurred. It wouldn't make sense, but there is evidence to support it. As for waterproofing, it would make sense for them to, but if we haven't seen any info on it yet, it's probably not going to happen
I imagine maybe there is a fingerprint sensor or something along those lines in the front below the screen embedded in the glass
KnownDominance said:
I imagine maybe there is a fingerprint sensor or something along those lines in the front below the screen embedded in the glass
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The fingerprint sensor is actually on the back of the phone. Since the speakers are bottom firing, maybe they will take up more space than standard speakers?
Man, I REALLY hope they put a MicroSD.
YellowGTO said:
Man, I REALLY hope they put a MicroSD.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's funny because this year it looks like expandable storage is the least thing everybody seem to worry about.
Regarding the price: If the US price is really $650 then I'd expect a similar € price here in Europe. They'd have a hard time convincing us to pay a higher price than most flagship smartphones (e.g. Galaxy S7) without offering some of the features they offer (waterproof, expandable storage)
FaserF said:
What do you think?
I have read it will cost in the US 650$, how much will it be in the European in €?
What do you say about a waterproof Pixel and will it have a hard button home key?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Probably the same amount (649) but in Euro`s. If all the rumors are correct this will be a expensive device, the XL will cost even more off course maybe even up to 700-750 euro`s, its not waterproof, non expandable storage and rooting Nougat will be harder and harder as Google is gradualy locking down android to obtain root.
I will not pay this amount for a Google phone considering i bought the blue Honor 8 for 399 euro`s wich overall is a great device with a killer camera and fingerprint scanner.
The rumor is that the smaller Pixel will start at $650. No one seems to know what the extra storage will cost, but since Google is trying to replicate Apple's pricing, I would expect an Apple-like matrix. That would put the fatter sailfish at $750. The Pixel XL would then come in at $770 and $870. That also puts them roughly in parity with the Samsung Galaxy S7, but with a larger screen. Of course, the difference is that you can add a comparatively cheap (read, less than $100) SD card to a S7. It is less than the $900 asking price for a Note 7, but it also lacks the stylus and has a smaller display.
I'm hoping this is off, but at this point it's looking pretty likely.
ts-apps said:
It's funny because this year it looks like expandable storage is the least thing everybody seem to worry about.
Regarding the price: If the US price is really $650 then I'd expect a similar € price here in Europe. They'd have a hard time convincing us to pay a higher price than most flagship smartphones (e.g. Galaxy S7) without offering some of the features they offer (waterproof, expandable storage)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now that Samsung gave me 4 256gb SD cards Ill be stuck with MicroSD card phones for a bit
If this thing is over 600 bucks nobody better buy it. Once we do the line will be drawn and they will never turn back.
ramblinman said:
If this thing is over 600 bucks nobody better buy it. Once we do the line will be drawn and they will never turn back.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Considering that the Nexus 6 was $699, I'd say that that line has already been surpassed.
doitright said:
Considering that the Nexus 6 was $699, I'd say that that line has already been surpassed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Nexus 6 didn't exactly fly off the shelves either. Part of that may be the lack of demand for such an enormous device, but I suspect a big part of that was the price tag and Google's typical mucking up of marketing campaigns.
The only Android OEM to maintain those kinds of flagship prices successfully has been Samsung. Everyone else has either had to back off (LG) or suffered poor sales performance (hTC).
Now, in their defense, Google always intended the Nexus devices to be "developer phones", so they probably didn't care too much that the 6 wasn't exactly the hottest ticket going.
jshamlet said:
The Nexus 6 didn't exactly fly off the shelves either. Part of that may be the lack of demand for such an enormous device, but I suspect a big part of that was the price tag and Google's typical mucking up of marketing campaigns.
The only Android OEM to maintain those kinds of flagship prices successfully has been Samsung. Everyone else has either had to back off (LG) or suffered poor sales performance (hTC).
Now, in their defense, Google always intended the Nexus devices to be "developer phones", so they probably didn't care too much that the 6 wasn't exactly the hottest ticket going.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What do you base that on?
The reality is quite the contrary, Nexus 6 sales *exceeded* expectations quite dramatically. They were persistently short on meeting demands until well into 2015 -- first sell date was in November 2014. That doesn't happen when you are having a hard time selling them.
doitright said:
What do you base that on?
The reality is quite the contrary, Nexus 6 sales *exceeded* expectations quite dramatically. They were persistently short on meeting demands until well into 2015 -- first sell date was in November 2014. That doesn't happen when you are having a hard time selling them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Google themselves admitted that the Nexus 6 (and the 9) didn't meet their sales expectations, to the point where they impacted revenue statements in 2015. They sold reasonably well, but they weren't barn burners. Now, part of that is the fact that they couldn't keep sufficient stock, which I chalk up to Google's "typical mucking up" of consumer launches, and part of that was the fact that the 6 wasn't sold through carriers.
I suspect the latter is probably the bigger factor. It's a lot easier to charge $800+ for a flagship when the customer can finance it through their phone bill than it is to extend that as a separate loan. As such, it's possible the Pixel phones may be able to pull off the higher pricing now that the carriers are on board with selling them.
jshamlet said:
Google themselves admitted that the Nexus 6 (and the 9) didn't meet their sales expectations, to the point where they impacted revenue statements in 2015. They sold reasonably well, but they weren't barn burners. Now, part of that is the fact that they couldn't keep sufficient stock, which I chalk up to Google's "typical mucking up" of consumer launches, and part of that was the fact that the 6 wasn't sold through carriers.
I suspect the latter is probably the bigger factor. It's a lot easier to charge $800+ for a flagship when the customer can finance it through their phone bill than it is to extend that as a separate loan. As such, it's possible the Pixel phones may be able to pull off the higher pricing now that the carriers are on board with selling them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When did "google themselves" say that? Especially since everybody and his brother and his uncle and his cousin and his ..... has a nexus 9.....
doitright said:
When did "google themselves" say that? Especially since everybody and his brother and his uncle and his cousin and his ..... has a nexus 9.....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Look, I'm not anti-Google, and I actually liked the Nexus line, so I have no particular axe to grind. However, you will find that in 2015, Google CFO Patrick Pichette stated as much in the Q1 guidance to investors. Additionally, Motorola has independently discussed the fact that the Nexus 6 didn't perform as well in the market as they would have liked, so it's not like this is some new piece of information. Now, anecdotally, I have only seen a handful of Nexus 6 devices roaming wild, and I work in a very tech-oriented town. Instead, I see what you might expect - mostly iPhones, Galaxy S6/7s and Notes, with a smattering of older Nexus devices - particularly the 5. I saw a guy with a 6P the other day in the parking lot, but I only remember that because it's the first one I've seen so far.
I have yet to see a single Nexus 9 in my town. When I do see a tablet in the wild here, it is almost invariably an iPad or iPad pro, though I have seen a few Galaxy tabs and Nexus 7's.
Now, no one is calling these devices failures, or bad. However, they didn't sell to Google or Motorola's expectations for a variety of reasons, and it is likely why the Nexus 6 was the last actual 6" Nexus device made.
jshamlet said:
Look, I'm not anti-Google, and I actually liked the Nexus line, so I have no particular axe to grind. However, you will find that in 2015, Google CFO Patrick Pichette stated as much in the Q1 guidance to investors. Additionally, Motorola has independently discussed the fact that the Nexus 6 didn't perform as well in the market as they would have liked, so it's not like this is some new piece of information. Now, anecdotally, I have only seen a handful of Nexus 6 devices roaming wild, and I work in a very tech-oriented town. Instead, I see what you might expect - mostly iPhones, Galaxy S6/7s and Notes, with a smattering of older Nexus devices - particularly the 5. I saw a guy with a 6P the other day in the parking lot, but I only remember that because it's the first one I've seen so far.
I have yet to see a single Nexus 9 in my town. When I do see a tablet in the wild here, it is almost invariably an iPad or iPad pro, though I have seen a few Galaxy tabs and Nexus 7's.
Now, no one is calling these devices failures, or bad. However, they didn't sell to Google or Motorola's expectations for a variety of reasons, and it is likely why the Nexus 6 was the last actual 6" Nexus device made.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So you're taking BUSINESS EXCUSES as fact? That's silly.
Anyone hear anything about a notification light?
I really miss this from my Nexus 5 and enabling it on my Nexus 6 was a pain. The 5X and 6P have it. I would rather have a notification light than the ambient display.
I will consistently miss the "pulsing" ambient display notification, or when I pick up the phone to put it in my pocket etc, the motion will turn on the screen and I'll accidentally activate some app on the phone or change a setting accidentally.
I'd rather not have the screen on unless I turn it on.
-J
Before I get started I have ordered my Note 10 5G in Aura Glow, and I'm happy with the design changes.
Ok so we all know or perhaps knew the Note line as being the one Samsung would test or perhaps throw in all the goodies into.....as it is known as the "Power House Device" or "Power Users". This seems to have stopped though and it's now really The S line Refresh. Or slightly updated.
It's at this point I scratch my head and ponder why Samsung bother with Two Flagships and why not or note have 1.....they are after all reminesant of a fruit based company.
Their used to be a difference between the 2 devices more than just an S-Pen but perhaps and true the market was different then than it is now, however casing point that yes people are holding onto devices for longer, so yes Samsung needed to do more to entice people to part with the cash (I'm a tech addict I will buy whatever I feel I like) so yes I do like the Note 10+, but I will also on the other hand say that Samsung did not do enough.
I like to see companies push innovation and yes some innovation takes time. For me personally I would have been happy with just a few things on this Note....the Snapdragon 855+ ok ok it's just marginally overclocked and the 90hz Display....., Could this not have been easily done? I think so but Samsung are a big brand much like Apple....they can get away with it. Also Samsung makes money in the Semi Conductor industry so it's not like they have to go all chips in with their devices.
But I'm yes just a little disappointed in that Samsung are quite content to see the competition not overtake or be leaps and bounds better. However to see others just pushing the envelope as Samsung used to do.
Yes great things seem to be in the works for next year, much looking forward to it, I just think that the Note 10+ could have dropped all these ****ty Harry potter bull, the camera doodle rubbish and focus on what made the Note the Power Users Dream.
So onto why I ordered and like it, mainly from a design perspective, I like the camera layout much better, like the more squared off look, Display is very nice, Cameras are nice, I have never had many complaints. And for me it's ok for another run of the sensors.
The Things like Dex I was getting more drawn in and thinks it's gradually improving so much so that I think more will be inclined to use it now. Gamelink is another decent feature, UFS 3.0 we all knew Samsung would be too dog here...with the read/write Speeds.
I still have it as a fantastic device, and I'm sure I'll enjoy it, but guess it's people like me or if your like me, that perhaps slows down or encourages these companies Samsung/Apple to simply cash in. Less of them having to really try because Samsung are capable of better, Apple are to, yes the iPhone will be much of the same to (small updates) I just didn't want to see two very different companies look quite so much the same.
I'm sure many will pick apart my arguments & some will agree....I'm not looking for nodding dogs.
Just expressing myself in a relatively balanced way (maybe contradictory by buying, but I do like the Note 10+, just expected more).
Well let's get the fun started....
I have zero issues with their being two notes.
The Note 9 having two versions was a sign of the times and I think the idea that the higher tier sold well solidified the move to have two versions this year.
That said, I don't even pay the non plus any attention, it's not an upgrade for me coming from a 9. Frankly the Note 10 should be the Note 10e.
I get the idea though, the smaller note with the cheaper price tag (and likely to see larger price drops) will be used to lure in people that would've either moved away from the note because of the larger size and folks that think the Note is too much of a phone so stick with smaller form factors. You also have the small hand people but even then 6.3 isn't tiny. Add a case and both are that much bigger.
If this brings more people to the Note then I have no issue with having a lower tiered phone, we can equate this to apple all day and that's a low hanging fruit argument kind of like Samsung going after apple for the headphone jack.
We keep knocking them and saying they are copying apple every time we aren't happy with a decision but they aren't the first to seal in the battery, they aren't the first to remove the headphone jack. At the same time though, being explicitly different from Apple doesn't exactly mean sales will shoot up (the bottom line) so I think there is more nuance than pointing fingers and complaining they are becoming the thing they hate.
So we have choice and are still not happy?
People moaned about the Note being too big so they gave the choice of two.
Others moaned about the Note being too small so they gave us the choice of two.
I fail to grasp arguments why there should not be the choice of two variations?
It must be the most impossible profession in the world working in mobile devices R&D.
We want bigger, no smaller. We want thinner no bigger battery!
We want all screen with zero bezels, oh look it has a tiny camera spot in the middle!
In reality this new Note 10+ is a beast of a mobile! Mine is coming with 512GB and 12GB RAM on a mobile phone?! Superb screen. multiple cameras and the S-pen, ad infinitum.
I regret the day I sold my Note 9, and yes all the same moans where here about the note 9 too, and purchased the iphone XS max. The note series are incredible devices, if you doubt me try an iPhone for six months! That will give you cause for reflection and pause!
I wasn't complaining about the choices in the two variants, however more in Samsung sticking to a set-plan.
This plan is to sell us on marginal gains, slimmer bezels have been a huge marketing thing and we buy into it because it looks nice.
What I mean is Samsung used to innovate and the note line was the bleeding edge, however the S & N line are very much similar, I would have liked to have seen more differentiation
I'm far from saying it's not a device worth purchasing (I have like I said ordered my Note 10+ 5G).
It's still a well balanced device to which I will enjoy, but we as consumers need to be vocal, rather than saying yeah this will do.....
Duncan1982 said:
It's still a well balanced device to which I will enjoy, but we as consumers need to be vocal, rather than saying yeah this will do.....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't want to be that guy but you should speak with your wallet.
If you see them going down a path that isn't beneficial to the consumer, stop purchasing their devices. We can complain all we want in our niche communities but if the sales are good what incentive is there to change.
I mean this goes from they can do better to, hol up guys, I still purchased it.
Having issues with them but still buying from them is about the same as saying "yeah this will do".
As far as the note line not being the bleeding edge, we have to consider what makes the most money for some Samsung. As long as we keep the context that the S series makes more money, it only makes sense that the lines would blur and more innovation would come to the S series. It's about keeping shareholders happy and not about maintaining the legacy of the Note.
It's a phone, when a year drops that isn't all that impressive or a really impressive phone does come out. That is where my money will go. I have as much loyalty to Sammy as they have to me.
pcriz said:
I don't want to be that guy but you should speak with your wallet.
If you see them going down a path that isn't beneficial to the consumer, stop purchasing their devices. We can complain all we want in our niche communities but if the sales are good what incentive is there to change.
I mean this goes from they can do better to, hol up guys, I still purchased it.
Having issues with them but still buying from them is about the same as saying "yeah this will do".
As far as the note line not being the bleeding edge, we have to consider what makes the most money for some Samsung. As long as we keep the context that the S series makes more money, it only makes sense that the lines would blur and more innovation would come to the S series. It's about keeping shareholders happy and not about maintaining the legacy of the Note.
It's a phone, when a year drops that isn't all that impressive or a really impressive phone does come out. That is where my money will go. I have as much loyalty to Sammy as they have to me.
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Oh I agree by still purchasing I'm just as much to blame.......
Duncan1982 said:
Oh I agree by still purchasing I'm just as much to blame.......
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We're in an abusive relationship with Samsung.
pcriz said:
We're in an abusive relationship with Samsung.
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Mwaaaaaaaahahaha yeah one way of putting it......
Name one other smartphone that offers the same level of technical innovation as the Note 10+ offers?
In the past when Samsung was still passing through their plastic phase with plastic backs, plastic stitching and plastic chrome I stopped purchasing Samsung. I went Sony and was very happy with that move. Come the Note 7 and I returned, twice!
I know we can all find something about all smartphones we don't like BUT this note 10+ is a stunning piece of micro engineering. 6 months ago I unwisely purchased an iPhone XSmax PLUS the iWatch 4. the watch is easily the most advanced on the market, the mobile is.....I simply don't have words! The iPhone alone cost 1,450€!!! The note 10+ is 1,230€ and they cannot compare. This Note 10+ is a pocket PC. I cant wait to get my hands on it.
I think one major issue is the line between best features and "bleeding edge" is starting to blur.
In order to really differentiate the Note series from the S Series, Sammy would basically have to gimp the S Series completely. In truth, the people who buy the Note, and the people who buy the S are two separate groups that are separated by more than just a 6-month upgrade cycle.
The S Series people are your base consumer level users who want a flagship Samsung device. They typically don't use it for productivity, but they still want and expect flagship features and quality.
The Note people love the S-Pen and typically use the phone for productivity, i.e. at work, and expect flagship level features and quality.
Yes the two phones are VERY similar, and will continue to be so. What else would you expect? Made by the same company, using same generation hardware, running the same software.
To say we should expect, or worse yet... DESERVE, a more premium device just because it's a Note, and the S Series people should get a gimped device is ridiculous and borders on entitlement.
The Note 10+ is a ultra premium flagship device. Some companies may have 90hz screen refresh, or maybe high MPs on the camera. But those are generally one trick ponies. Samsung gives the best total package money can buy, and for MY money there's no better value out there.
It's not that the S and the Note need to be different or higher or lower quality. They are just packaged differently for two specific user groups. And it's been this way for a while. The S Series is the bigger leap forward, then the Note perfects and marginally updates it. Rinse and repeat. Along with all the annual complaining that they aren't different enough.
pcriz said:
I don't want to be that guy but you should speak with your wallet.
If you see them going down a path that isn't beneficial to the consumer, stop purchasing their devices. We can complain all we want in our niche communities but if the sales are good what incentive is there to change.
I mean this goes from they can do better to, hol up guys, I still purchased it.
Having issues with them but still buying from them is about the same as saying "yeah this will do".
As far as the note line not being the bleeding edge, we have to consider what makes the most money for some Samsung. As long as we keep the context that the S series makes more money, it only makes sense that the lines would blur and more innovation would come to the S series. It's about keeping shareholders happy and not about maintaining the legacy of the Note.
It's a phone, when a year drops that isn't all that impressive or a really impressive phone does come out. That is where my money will go. I have as much loyalty to Sammy as they have to me.
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Click to collapse
I think the issue is nothing is going to be that impressive anymore. We have reached a point where nothing really stands out anymore especially to me. With that being said I am still buying almost every new phone including the note 10 plus so maybe it will impress?
My hunch is that 90Hz refresh may mess with the technology in the digitiser for the pen. As Samsung make the screen for the one plus 7 pro, I can’t see them not including it unless there is a reason like that. The pop up camera in the one plus is a really smart innovation though and is so quick that face authentication feels no slower than an iPhone. This means no interference with cutouts in the screen too. Mind you only apple really has a secure face authentication despite the s10 5g having a front facing depth sensor. Samsung also has very high pixel count camera sensors for mobile use that were ready to go but didn’t use them.
So it feels like the note 10 is a mix of cutting edge and good but not great other aspects. It’s not surprising that it has many people divided!!
Great Phone it is
I kind of disagree with you about the productivity and pen thing. I've been a note buyer since the note 2 and honestly I've barely ever used the spen.
For me it's always been about top of the top when it comes to specs and typically largest display size on the market
The note 10 (not the 10+) is a very bad joke.
Worse display, no sd card and smaller battery than note9. No led notification, no 3.5 jack.
In conclusion worse than note9.
I doubt anyone with common sense would toss that amount of money to buy at this starting price.
The top flagship mobiles from Samsung vary in features and size exactly like a car. Ford Focus. The focus range come in estate, two door sport, four door sedan and coupe etc. Very different cars all built on the same chassis etc but aimed at different segments of the population.
I have never understood why one would buy the Note line and not use the pen? Its what the Note is focused on and built around around !!!
Stop the comparisons and enjoy the choice. Buy what you need.
Like I said I purchased the Note 10+ 5G.....:good: wasn't meant as a complaint as it's a fantastic device with very little to complain about.
It's just that with such a device perhaps some of us just expected a little bit more than what was presented.
However I have been using since Friday & everything is just dandy, very much appreciate the new design, that for me was one reason to buy, but also like mentioned the S-Pen and it's industry leading, nothing comes close to it's functionality and usefulness.
Hope you are all enjoying .....
Hitman3984 said:
I kind of disagree with you about the productivity and pen thing. I've been a note buyer since the note 2 and honestly I've barely ever used the spen.
For me it's always been about top of the top when it comes to specs and typically largest display size on the market
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Which is why is said Note users "typically" use the phone for work and productivity.
The opposite is also true about the S series. They are TYPICALLY used used by just typical consumers, but are sometimes used for work and productivity.
Panasonic toughbook laptops are TYPICALLY used in law enforcement, fire departments, and other industrial settings, but that doesn't mean some there are SOME consumer level users.
I didn't mean to mischaracterise you or your usage, nor did I intend to make you feel left out. But as a matter of practicality, I can not 100% covert ever single user's individual use case scenario, I can merely comment on what I generally see in each segment of the consumer base. There will always be overlap.
So you're not left out...you're special.
---------- Post added at 11:31 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:13 AM ----------
This brings me back to my original point though. Forget productivity, if you just use the Note series for top tier specs, then what exactly do you expect them to do with the S series? There's a 6 month difference between the Note and S series release. We are a point in time when even YEARLY updates are merely incremental. There's no large leaps forward.
So again, we would have to ask Samsung to purposely gimp the S Series and alienate at least half (if not more) of their user base to make us happy so we have the best and toppest of top tier.
I mean they gimped the Note 10 so the Plus would be better and Note fans are mad about that. So what do you expect the S Series fans to say or feel when Sammy does that to them?
Mr. Orange 645 said:
Which is why is said Note users "typically" use the phone for work and productivity.
The opposite is also true about the S series. They are TYPICALLY used used by just typical consumers, but are sometimes used for work and productivity.
Panasonic toughbook laptops are TYPICALLY used in law enforcement, fire departments, and other industrial settings, but that doesn't mean some there are SOME consumer level users.
I didn't mean to mischaracterise you or your usage, nor did I intend to make you feel left out. But as a matter of practicality, I can not 100% covert ever single user's individual use case scenario, I can merely comment on what I generally see in each segment of the consumer base. There will always be overlap.
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I wouldn't even say typically without some kind of numbers.
Given the community I've observed from the note 2 on, maybe it started that way when it was more of a niche phone but after iPhone started making larger phones and it become more mainstream, more consumers started purchasing it. More casual users typical of the larger market
Samsung has enterprise device support for business and they push out last year's model of the basic S device.
Most of the Reddit users I come across don't seem like business users. I mean some are sprinkled here and there, but I wouldn't say the trend is towards professionals..
Im working for a company that builds drones and space shuttles and your options for work phones that the company will pay for and allow on our Network are the S8 and some iphone.
The tough book example doesn't really work because that isn't really a big consumer device at all. You're paying for a rugged platform that is a LOT more than its consumer counterpart minus the military spec'd ruggedness. Samsung wants everyone to have this phone.
This reminds me of the people that would state that Nexus devices were for devs, but it was only people in the forum, Google never advertised that way because it's a great way to scare away sales..