Develop Bugs

Samsung "Flash Counter" Discovered in SGSII's

Check this out guys. The following is a post from a member named coomb on the darkyrom.com forums. Check this out...its almost scary
"Hello everyone!
As I was surfing the web to look for a jig for the first SGS, I've discovered the SGS II has an internal counter which goes up by 1 everytime you flash something that's custom
What does this counter do exactly?
It's very simple: it counts the number of times you flash a custom ROM or kernel on your SGS II, so the guys over at Samsung know of it when you return the phone to them for any kind of problem you may have (this is done so they can say whether you've voided your warranty or not). Even using Odin to get back to stock won't help you and will let the counter go up by one
The good news is that the counter can be reset by using one of those jigs we all know very well
Ha, Samsung! You thought you could fool us that easy?
No, unfortunately Samsung has very clear in mind what it's doing.
It seems there is a second counter, which counts the number of times the custom flash counter has been reset, and the bad news is that its position/folder has not been discovered yet.
So, it seems all the future SGS II owners and flash addicts over here (and not only here) will have a hard time returning their SGS II to Samsung after having flashed something... I hope someone over at XDA will get everything sorted out (Chainfire is already working on it).
Speaking about XDA, here's the source of this article: XDA-SGS II flash counter.
That's it for now, bye! "
Link to the original thread, remove spaces http://www. darkyrom. com/community/index.php?threads/attention-the-sgs-ii-has-a-custom-rom-kernel-flash-counter.3827/

a couple of points:
1.) I deal with Sprint, not Samsung. Sprint's front-lines CS people aren't typically known for their technical prowess (my apologies to those in present company)
2.) This sounds doubtful. The way this is phrased makes it seem as if it's a file in the current file system we have all the tools required to wipe that clean. If that's true they should expect that someone here *will* figure it out.
3.) All this is going to do is encourage those of us with insurance/TEP et al to render the phone completely inoperable within the scope of our insurance (or return period). Poof, problem solved.
So even if this is in fact true, and it could very well be, I don't see the immediate threat to us and I don't see how Sprint would use this ability to prevent us from using our insurance or return ability given that it would be trivial to render the phone and any file system or electronic counter completely inaccessible by any practical means. Coming up with a process to read the "counter" would involve more time and inconvenience for both the customer and the carrier than either would find acceptable to bear. Though there is that suspicious hole right about the volume rockers that may be a nearly fool-proof direct port to a "counter" it would be impossible to make that a 100% reliable mechanism either.
EDIT: after thinking about this some more I am of the belief that while in our unique circumstance (in the US) it wouldn't be too big a hurdle to pass, should we need to, that it is definitely possible if inconvenient/implausible in practice. (In most of the world you just buy the phone and then hook it up to a carrier, in the US you pick your carrier and get your phone from them....so while everyone else would have to deal with Samsung for warranty claims we do not.)
However I was also wondering what it was counting. Writes to /system and/or any directories/partitions that are typically R/O without root?
There are plenty of times in your phones life where that may be flashed for legitimate purposes. Upgrading the OS comes to mind (cue "Samsung never updates" jokes), as would any carrier provided "flash to stock" (which at my area stores is their last, and usually only, attempt to repair a device for just about any reason). There are likely other scenarios that escape me at the moment.
Any reason legitimate is enough to place a reasonable doubt on any claims of tampering that would cause any court of law to demand far more compelling evidence than merely "the counter went up" in order to find you guilty/uncovered by warranty. "What if the counter is unreasonably high?" You say...well what if you tried desperately to flash and reflash and reflash your broken phone attempting to repair it to get your data back? That's a pretty likely scenario.
EDIT²: ...and if "legitimate writes" don't tick the counter up a notch then there is a mechanism to avoid flash detection and it will be found.

daneurysm said:
3.) All this is going to do is encourage those of us with insurance/TEP et al to render the phone completely inoperable within the scope of our insurance. Poof, problem solved.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That.
Let's see them prove I've flashed custom roms after I pass the phone under a powerful electromagnet a few times.

daneurysm said:
a couple of points:
1.) I deal with Sprint, not Samsung. Sprint's front-lines CS people aren't typically known for their technical prowess (my apologies to those in present company)
2.) This sounds doubtful. The way this is phrased makes it seem as if it's a file in the current file system we have all the tools required to wipe that clean.
3.) All this is going to do is encourage those of us with insurance/TEP et al to render the phone completely inoperable within the scope of our insurance (or return period). Poof, problem solved.
So even if this is in fact true, and it could very well be, I don't see the immediate threat to us and I don't see how Sprint would use this ability to prevent us from using our insurance or return ability given that it would be trivial to render the phone and any file system or electronic counter completely inaccessible by any practical means. Coming up with a process to do so would involve more time and inconvenience for both the customer and the carrier than either would find acceptable to bear. Though there is that suspicious hole right about the volume rockers that may be a nearly fool-proof direct port to this "counter" it would be impossible to make that a 100% reliable mechanism either.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In response.
1. As far as phone returns, you never deal with the the phone maker anyway, you ALWAYS deal with the returns per the carrier. My thoughts on this is that Sprint has been supplied with the tools and info from samsung to verify if the phone has been flashed or not, seeing as how it would be pointless for samsung to include such a feature when they wont be doing the warranty checks.
2. This doesnt sound beyond the scope of samsung in my opinion. And as far as how it was "phrased" this was from a regular user with no real dev experience or technical experience. So if what he said sound a bit odd or simpleton in terms of terminology or his guess as to where this counter would be, thats why. Just because he made a guess that its in the filesystem somewhere doesnt mean much. Also where do we all get these magical tools that you say we have to delete this data that no one knows the location of yet?
3.If you render the phone completely useless in a way that there could be no data pulled from the phone (aka smashing it) then you wouldnt be able to redeem your warranty anyway. bricking the phone wouldnt matter as sprint/samsung have the tools to easily access and repair any bricks that you or I could perform, and then read the information that they need.
Also the fact that the user ChainFire is working on this confirms its vailidity to me, as he is a major dev in the Galaxy S I & II Scenes.

HaiKaiDo said:
3.If you render the phone completely useless in a way that there could be no data pulled from the phone (aka smashing it) then you wouldnt be able to redeem your warranty anyway. bricking the phone wouldnt matter as sprint/samsung have the tools to easily access and repair any bricks that you or I could perform, and then read the information that they need.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
TEP covers all that.
I guarantee after I put the phone internals into the microwave for a few seconds there is no tool in the world that's going to be able to repair the brick.

eagercrow said:
TEP covers all that.
I guarantee after I put the phone internals into the microwave for a few seconds there is no tool in the world that's going to be able to repair the brick.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well for the 90% of people out there that dont pay 30 dollars a month for the protection plan, and just want a warranty exchange for something that actually wasnt their fault and at one time or another had a custom rom on their phone, they will be out of luck. So this is a problem for people like myself. Ive never bricked a phone, but i did have my captivate radio antennae die and was getting no signal whatsoever and was able to get att regular warranty to replace it. Had i been in that situation NOW, with this counter in place, i would be screwed. for something that wasnt caused by myself.
---------- Post added at 10:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:42 PM ----------
Torethyr said:
That.
Let's see them prove I've flashed custom roms after I pass the phone under a powerful electromagnet a few times.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If I remember correctly flash based storage isnt effected by magnetic fields. Also if that did work, good for you....but where do the rest of us get an expensive highpowered electromagnet lol.

I think this is very low of Samsung ... but i doubt anything will change ... sprint employees know less about this stuff than we do on here .. and haven't people already mess their phones up and got them replaced easily ? ..
Sprint can't accuse you and deny you a replacement if you play stupid and never admit to rooting/ modding ..

HaiKaiDo said:
In response.
1. As far as phone returns, you never deal with the the phone maker anyway, you ALWAYS deal with the returns per the carrier. My thoughts on this is that Sprint has been supplied with the tools and info from samsung to verify if the phone has been flashed or not, seeing as how it would be pointless for samsung to include such a feature when they wont be doing the warranty checks.
2. This doesnt sound beyond the scope of samsung in my opinion. And as far as how it was "phrased" this was from a regular user with no real dev experience or technical experience. So if what he said sound a bit odd or simpleton in terms of terminology or his guess as to where this counter would be, thats why. Just because he made a guess that its in the filesystem somewhere doesnt mean much. Also where do we all get these magical tools that you say we have to delete this data that no one knows the location of yet?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If it's in the file system I would use "rm". If it is being stored in a non-standard way as to escape a deep directory/partition inspection I would have to say that it's outside of the file system. A pedantic gripe of mine, to be fair.
3.If you render the phone completely useless in a way that there could be no data pulled from the phone (aka smashing it) then you wouldnt be able to redeem your warranty anyway. bricking the phone wouldnt matter as sprint/samsung have the tools to easily access and repair any bricks that you or I could perform, and then read the information that they need.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't even have to present the damn phone to get a new one , it must be lost or stolen....or flashed to boost, lol. Not that I ever have or would, but, that's pretty feasible.
Also the fact that the user ChainFire is working on this confirms its vailidity to me, as he is a major dev in the Galaxy S I & II Scenes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't doubt the veracity of the claim. Nor do I doubt the word of chainfire. What I am not certain of is what exactly they found and what it is counting and how that counter can be used as incontrovertible proof of a warranty damning activity.
I updated my post above which partially addresses this.

I checked into this before I returned my 1 day old bricked epic touch 4 g, and Sprint replaced it no questions asked.

akkord64 said:
I checked into this before I returned my 1 day old bricked epic touch 4 g, and Sprint replaced it no questions asked.
BTW - After you use the JIG it resets the counter..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But what about the counter-counter?

akkord64 said:
I checked into this before I returned my 1 day old bricked epic touch 4 g, and Sprint replaced it no questions asked.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol yeah it resets the FIRST counter...but thats not the problem. Theres appearently some mechanism in place the count how many times youve reset that first counter lol. Im sure itll be killed in a few days if not weeks by people here on XDA, but i sure do find these kind of things interesting.

HaiKaiDo said:
Well for the 90% of people out there that dont pay 30 dollars a month for the protection plan, and just want a warranty exchange for something that actually wasnt their fault and at one time or another had a custom rom on their phone, they will be out of luck. So this is a problem for people like myself. Ive never bricked a phone, but i did have my captivate radio antennae die and was getting no signal whatsoever and was able to get att regular warranty to replace it. Had i been in that situation NOW, with this counter in place, i would be screwed. for something that wasnt caused by myself.
---------- Post added at 10:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:42 PM ----------
If I remember correctly flash based storage isnt effected by magnetic fields. Also if that did work, good for you....but where do the rest of us get an expensive highpowered electromagnet lol.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bro, you are high if you think this has any bearing on Sprint users being able return an Epic Touch 4G. Moreover, Steve Kondick...hired by Samsung. Team CM, given GS2's to hack by Samsung.
Also, if this is an issue with the Galaxy SII international variant, why don't you POST IT IN THAT FORUM?
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium

All you have to do is flash something in odin with the OG Epic Pit and check re-partition. Start it, run it for a minute or 2 and pull the cord. Completely inoperable.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium

Hope you people that want to make the phone inoperable and stuff under stand you are the reason the insurance deductible keeps going up......
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium

abowlby said:
Bro, you are high if you think this has any bearing on Sprint users being able return an Epic Touch 4G. Moreover, Steve Kondick...hired by Samsung. Team CM, given GS2's to hack by Samsung.
Also, if this is an issue with the Galaxy SII international variant, why don't you POST IT IN THAT FORUM?
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh god you called me bro -_-. second off, im not high, i just found this interesting.
Also Steve being hired by samsung doesnt make him president of the "i get to do whatever the **** i want" club lol. He still has to adhere to NDA and the like.
and finally, its in our phones too. our phones are SGS II's lol. Sprint just gave ours a "fancy" name.
---------- Post added at 10:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:54 PM ----------
SAShady said:
All you have to do is flash something in odin with the OG Epic Pit and check re-partition. Start it, run it for a minute or 2 and pull the cord. Completely inoperable.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Inoperable to you sure. To the people with the equiptment MADE to run diagnostics and access low level bootloaders, not a problem. Half flashing a bootloader isnt the end all to a warranty claim. Also i dont know why you all are taking this almost personally as if i was saying this is something that will never be patched or worked out here on xda. And continue to come up with scenarios where you are above the counter lol.

As long as mine doesn't count how many times it sees me masturbate I'm happy...

Something else im curious about.....it says that Odin wont help reset the second counter. To my mind that makes me think that theres something hardware based thats keeping track. Lol exbawkz eFUZE

paniro187 said:
Hope you people that want to make the phone inoperable and stuff under stand you are the reason the insurance deductible keeps going up......
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While I agree and would never do that to my phone, I would just find somewhere else to return it that would accept it. That always works.
But the main point here is that it is the natural "next thing to do" when you go about punishing people for treating their own hardware as, well, their own hardware and installing whatever software they would like on a device that they own...
...Why don't they expend this type of effort on making the phones unbrickable? That would surely save them far more money than "catching the bad guys" and denying people warranty service for things issues that have nothing to do with the software you chose to install on a device you own.
If my PC were to **** itself and something broke because I was running linux/macos/beos/MSDOS/Windows/Xenix/AmigaOS/etc do you know what that means? That the computer was a piece of crap and the computer (or component responsible) should be replaced if it was under warranty... do you suggest that a piece of hardware failing is the softwares fault?
Most (non oem) motherboards come with overclocking tools built into the BIOS these days with safeguards to keep you from blowing your isht up.
This has less to do with hardware failures than it has to do with the freedom to run whatever you want on a computer you purchased....with a dual-core 1.2ghz chip and 1 gig of ram you can be damn sure this is a computer.

alnova1 said:
As long as mine doesn't count how many times it sees me masturbate I'm happy...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Best post of the day +1 lol
xDDDD

HaiKaiDo said:
Well for the 90% of people out there that dont pay 30 dollars a month for the protection plan, and just want a warranty exchange for something that actually wasnt their fault and at one time or another had a custom rom on their phone, they will be out of luck. So this is a problem for people like myself. Ive never bricked a phone, but i did have my captivate radio antennae die and was getting no signal whatsoever and was able to get att regular warranty to replace it. Had i been in that situation NOW, with this counter in place, i would be screwed. for something that wasnt caused by myself.
---------- Post added at 10:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:42 PM ----------
If I remember correctly flash based storage isnt effected by magnetic fields. Also if that did work, good for you....but where do the rest of us get an expensive highpowered electromagnet lol.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wasn't sure you were crazy, until you said TEP was thirty bucks. It's 8. Honestly not having it on your plan is crazy at this point, unless you have a good backup device you aren't planning on selling.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

[Tutorial] How to purposefully "brick" your Nexus

Scroll down to get to the Tutorial ---- This method WILL cause your phone to go through bootloops or not boot!
If you like the tutorial or think it may be helpful in some weird way, thank me!
So I had a problem with my nexus yesterday and couldnt unroot, relock, or go back to stock.
Since i had no way of getting my charger to connect or even come up on the computer, i needed to make my phone look as stock as possible to try and replace it
I basically had to make my phone look like it was "Bricked"
I still had a good battery charge and everything but the charging port was working. I simply rebooted into CWM and interrupted a fresh rom install.
"I don't know what happened. My charger hasnt been charging and i woke up to a dead phone this morning. I just replaced my extended battery with the stock one, and now all i get is this google logo. Please verizon rep, Help me!"
What i got out of this?
A free replacement of my phone and a free charger.
MOD EDIT

Good job commiting fraud
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

flyerwire said:
Good job commiting fraud
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

And then sharing it on xda.

I wouldn't say that it was a fraud. His phone was broken and I don't think it had anything to do with root. Anyways this will not brick your phone, you could just aswell wipe everything and then reboot without flashing a rom.

Cause we, over here at XDA, have NEVER committed any type of crime! This is CRIMINAL!!!! LOL

io53 said:
I wouldn't say that it was a fraud. His phone was broken and I don't think it had anything to do with root. Anyways this will not brick your phone, you could just aswell wipe everything and then reboot without flashing a rom.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
THIS^^^^^^
shojus said:
Cause we, over here at XDA, have NEVER committed any type of crime! This is CRIMINAL!!!! LOL
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
AND THIS^^^^^
Fraud? Chargers are always a problem... and he was nice enough to get me a replacement.
As far as the phone, If i had a way of restoring it back to stock settings, i Totally would have done that for them. It really wasnt a problem with rooting, but a piece of hardware.
In fact, if it wasnt for the broken charger port, i would have no reason for needing to take it back... but Isn't that always our excuse? It is for me
But thanks for all your feedbacks! Dont you love XDA?

And people wonder why cell phones are so expensive.
Sent from my Nexus in Texas.

You evil, evil person

I don't think that's fraud. He had a phone that is defective and should be covered under warranty except he rooted it and vzw considers that voiding the warranty which is bull. We should be able to do whatever we want to our phones software short of bricking them. If we can't restore that's on us. But when something physically breaks and it is not the result of rooting or romming, then they should honor the warranty.

io53 said:
I wouldn't say that it was a fraud. His phone was broken and I don't think it had anything to do with root. Anyways this will not brick your phone, you could just aswell wipe everything and then reboot without flashing a rom.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's still fraud lol being ignorant of it doesn't mean it's not.
When you root and rom your phone you accept that you've now broken your warranty. This means if anything goes wrong, it's now all on you. He tricked Verizon into thinking his phone was untouched...making it fraudulent.
Can we call for a ban, plz?
---------- Post added at 04:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:08 PM ----------
Synopsis: Just because you *THINK* something should be a different way doesn't mean it's acceptable to lie to people to make it seem true. Just because you believe rooting and installing a rom shouldn't break the warranty doesn't make it acceptable to lie to them.
The cliche "Two wrongs don't make a right" is acceptable here.

still not an excuse considering the bootloader can be relocked and software can be flashed back to 100% stock

I stand on OP side in this.. yes, you invalidate your warrenty when modding your phone, but this was a serious hardware issue and had nothing to do with rom-ing and therefor hardware warrenty should still be valid but verizon would probably not have replaced it if they found traces of software tempering.. don't get me wrong, i'm not FOR frauds in any kind. But this was a faulty device even before modding it.
Sent from my X10i using xda premium

So we don't advocate posting ways to "brick" your phone to get it replaced. Technically this would be fraud, whether or not the device had some major hardware flaw is irrelevant, still fraud. Thread closed anymore posts on ways to intentionally "brick" your device may lead to an infraction. Thanks for your cooperation.
Sent from my HTC Evo 3D using xda premium

[Q] hard brick, now what?

ok this has already been said to be hard bricked. i tried the JTAG and it didnt work because of a damaged EMMC chip. but how does a EMMC chip get damaged??? could it of been from shipping it to texas (place where it got JTAGged)? what about sprint could i lie and get a refurbished one???
btw it was bricked by a flash, so how could it damage the EMMC chip????
thanks
i flashed cm9 with the el26 CWM repacked ( the one in the directions) and i still bricked...

How do you know EMMC chip damaged? Just curious...

jamcar said:
ok this has already been said to be hard bricked. i tried the JTAG and it didnt work because of a damaged EMMC chip. but how does a EMMC chip get damaged??? could it of been from shipping it to texas (place where it got JTAGged)? what about sprint could i lie and get a refurbished one???
btw it was bricked by a flash, so how could it damage the EMMC chip????
thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It was damaged when you formatted the partitions in cwm....only thing you can do is go to sprint and see if they replace it if not then ship it to Samsung and see if they will do it.....it was not damaged in shipping...it was damaged by u not reading and flashing the way devs have said
The emmc is not really damaged but the partitions are screwed up and no way to fix..
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

What you do is post in the right section and then buy another god damn phone... I don't mean to be a **** but seriously, there have been sooo many bricking threads and warnings...

Now what? Now you go to Sprint, be honest with them, appeal to their kindness and hope for the best. If that doesn't work then you buy a new one.

I'll supplement the previous comments by this...
Once you get your new phone read up on flashing CM9 to avoid bricking it again. You can start with the sticky at the top of this thread.

No. What you do is, go to Sprint, say you were playing a game, it froze, you pulled the battery and now all it has is a steady blue LED and you don't know why. Do not mention rooting, act like you don't know what rooting is. They can't check if it's rooted anymore without wiping all software so you're fine. If you have warranty, they'll have a replacement in 3 days.

Stay away from CM9. C stands for catastrophic and m for meltdown, the nine is just a nine.
Pp.
" It is said that when He swims, dolphins appear "......... even if its in a pool!

hrffd said:
No. What you do is, go to Sprint, say you were playing a game, it froze, you pulled the battery and now all it has is a steady blue LED and you don't know why. Do not mention rooting, act like you don't know what rooting is. They can't check if it's rooted anymore without wiping all software so you're fine. If you have warranty, they'll have a replacement in 3 days.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, by all means let's advise people how to avoid taking personal responsibility for not following instructions and screwing up their phones in the process. That's a surefire way to keep future costs down.

Bricked also, welcome to the club
I to have a bricked device. I now know that this issue resides from a defect that resides in the kernel i believe and really only happens when going from one ICS rom to another. I can't believe that this even happened in the first place. Since i first got the phone when it was released I've been flashing away completely fine up until I flashed the Slim rom and then bam, Nothing. I to sent it in for repair at mobiletechvideos.com but they were not able to fix that eMMC data issue. I've been dealing with this since May 2 now and still don't have a working phone. I"m going to be send back to Samsung for a possible repair but this issue is not because of anything that you did wrong. It's a know issue by know and hopefully in the near future other users won't have to deal this this same **** either. Sounds like a possible patch in the works to prevent this from happening at all on these phones running this particular processor.
Good luck to you
http://www.xda-developers.com/tag/att-samsung-galaxy-s-ii/

Esoteric68 said:
Yes, by all means let's advise people how to avoid taking personal responsibility for not following instructions and screwing up their phones in the process. That's a surefire way to keep future costs down.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sorry I have to say this. First let me say that I do believe in taking responsibility for my own actions. But the arguement that people going in a lying to sprint will raise cost is mute. If one was to stop and think about this. This is a company that sells you a plan that includes unlimited data and text and then charges you an additional fee for premium data. They have a whole team at the corporate level that their whole job is to figure out ways to raise cost and pitch it to customers in a way that they will still want to buy. I really do understand what you're saying but believe me. If everyone that ever bricked a phone was honest and paid out the ass for a new phone. Sprint and Samsung would still raise the cost of their services and producst. The only thing that people lying to sprint does is give them an excuse. Maybe I've been in the tech feild too long and am just jaded. Its not just sprint. Its all companies like that. How else do you think they afford to pay their CEO's and underlings 6-7figures aa year.

I believe the issue lies with step 2 in the cm9 install directions.
I never wipe data or factory reset in CWM. Wipe cache or davlik is fine. I always use calks format all to wipe data.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk

jamesey said:
I believe the issue lies with step 2 in the cm9 install directions.
I never wipe data or factory reset in CWM. Wipe cache or davlik is fine. I always use calks format all to wipe data.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do the same except I use the modified format (no data) zip as well but sounds like its only a matter of time before I get bit for being lazy

hrffd said:
No. What you do is, go to Sprint, say you were playing a game, it froze, you pulled the battery and now all it has is a steady blue LED and you don't know why. Do not mention rooting, act like you don't know what rooting is. They can't check if it's rooted anymore without wiping all software so you're fine. If you have warranty, they'll have a replacement in 3 days.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Completely off-topic but your signature is making me want to fire up the GBA emulator and play Pokemon Red/Blue again.

Is this issue only going to get worse when a true ICS recovery is developed? Will the new recoveries gracefully handle GB to ICS and the reverse? I hope so, or it sounds like we're in for a lot of madness.
I've always used Mobile Odin to get back to EL26 and I've never had a problem flip-flopping back and forth to roms. CM9 alpha 4 seems very refined to me and I'm going to stick with it for awhile until MIUI gets its battery issues resolved.
But I say if people want to play in the ICS pool, pay your $5 to get mobile odin pro, and only use the proper EL26 recovery for everything. It's so simple and that's a lot cheaper than a warranty replace or totally new phone.

jamesey said:
I believe the issue lies with step 2 in the cm9 install directions.
I never wipe data or factory reset in CWM. Wipe cache or davlik is fine. I always use calks format all to wipe data.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I believe the issue lies in user error. CM9 instructions are to odin el26cwm which has been safe to wipe/data since it's a Gingerbread kernel. I have installed cm9, aokp, codename, gummy, and mainly lots of nightly builds for cm9. Never had an issue and yes I followed the cm9 instructions. Somewhere along the way I believe people don't realize is that on this phone, every time you flash a rom, it comes with it's own kernel and recovery if there is one packaged. For now all instructions are pretty much the same across the board, for any flashing wiping etc it has to be done on a gingerbread recovery either el26 or el29.

scarmon25 said:
I'm sorry I have to say this. First let me say that I do believe in taking responsibility for my own actions. But the arguement that people going in a lying to sprint will raise cost is mute. If one was to stop and think about this. This is a company that sells you a plan that includes unlimited data and text and then charges you an additional fee for premium data. They have a whole team at the corporate level that their whole job is to figure out ways to raise cost and pitch it to customers in a way that they will still want to buy. I really do understand what you're saying but believe me. If everyone that ever bricked a phone was honest and paid out the ass for a new phone. Sprint and Samsung would still raise the cost of their services and producst. The only thing that people lying to sprint does is give them an excuse. Maybe I've been in the tech feild too long and am just jaded. Its not just sprint. Its all companies like that. How else do you think they afford to pay their CEO's and underlings 6-7figures aa year.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're right, of course the carrier(s) and manufacturer(s) are going to continue to raise costs because they are a business and that's how they stay in business but it's a little naive (or wishful thinking?) to assume these types of events do not affect cost.
So while I agree with you on that point (they raise prices regardless) I still stand firm on people lying to cover their asses when they screw up and ruin their phones.
I can't count the number of these threads I've seen, just since January, despite there being tons of warnings, detailed installation instructions, and other threads like this alerting people what not to do. It leaves me to wonder how many people have read, but not posted, and followed the dishonest advice to obtain new phones at little or no cost.
My argument is that we are enabling an irresponsible mindset that doesn't stop with broken phones. Pointless argument perhaps but just my personal feelings.

Esoteric68 said:
You're right, of course the carrier(s) and manufacturer(s) are going to continue to raise costs because they are a business and that's how they stay in business but it's a little naive (or wishful thinking?) to assume these types of events do not affect cost.
So while I agree with you on that point (they raise prices regardless) I still stand firm on people lying to cover their asses when they screw up and ruin their phones.
I can't count the number of these threads I've seen, just since January, despite there being tons of warnings, detailed installation instructions, and other threads like this alerting people what not to do. It leaves me to wonder how many people have read, but not posted, and followed the dishonest advice to obtain new phones at little or no cost.
My argument is that we are enabling an irresponsible mindset that doesn't stop with broken phones. Pointless argument perhaps but just my personal feelings.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do agree with some of your points, though I think your exaggerating the costs.
They are not going to give him a new phone just a refurbished one. The one he damaged is not beyond repair. It will be sent out and be refurbished for someone else.
I'm sure the cost of tep more then covers Sprint's costs.

PanchoPlanet said:
Stay away from CM9. C stands for catastrophic and m for meltdown, the nine is just a nine.
Pp.
" It is said that when He swims, dolphins appear "......... even if its in a pool!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Except that, if you actually follow instructions, it's not either of those things. I've flashed CM9 and AOKP literally dozens of times, following the instructions to the letter, and haven't had a single issue. All you have to do is make sure that when you do wipe data/factory reset, you're doing it on EL26 Stock CWM, not a Rogue repack or whatnot.

People are going to do whatever they do no matter what is said. Some feel they've been screwed over by the carriers and OEM's and this is their opportunity to get back at em. Trust me if I had an opportunity toto stick Comcast with a nice shafting I would. In all honesty though. If you know how to read people. You can go into a store and tell the tech the truth and he will still swap it for 35 bucks or free if you have the TEP. You may have to go to a few stores and talk to the tech for a few minutes to feel em out. Hell I bricked mine and me and the tech talked for a few minutes about the issues happening wwith the phone and what caused it and he had no problem swapping it out. I paid the 35 bucks and was done with it. As I said. I agree with the taking responsibility cause lord knows this nation could use a morals lesson or two. But aether your honest or you lie there is going to be people that seal these bricks out for free phones. Whether its a nice tech doing a solid or a lying customer. Not to mention the thousands Samsung has probably already bricked looking into it. My grip isn't with telling people to be honest. Its with the arguement that alot of people seem to bring that them lying and that alone will be the reason for price hikes. I know that wasn't what was said here it was just one of those deals where it was the post that caused me to respond.
Take care.

[Q] How annoyed are you, not having root? (w/o voiding the warrenty)

Hi,
i am pretty much annoyed (and it's getting worse every day) about not able to root my device, without voiding the warranty.
I had made a decision, that i will never ever buy a new device again, before there is solution for rooting.
How about you?
schnurzelat

I'm really annoyed by their policy. I'm a student, I don't have enough money to just use HTC Dev tools and say goodbye to the fact my expensive device is gonna last at least two years.
I was expectin of course that I could not use warranty for a software problem that is totally understandable but after everything I saw on the forum I'm really angry against HTC.
So that is clear for me. It's my last HTC phone.

joplayer said:
I'm really annoyed by their policy. I'm a student, I don't have enough money to just use HTC Dev tools and say goodbye to the fact my expensive device is gonna last at least two years.
I was expectin of course that I could not use warranty for a software problem that is totally understandable but after everything I saw on the forum I'm really angry against HTC.
So that is clear for me. It's my last HTC phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My device was unlocked and HTC in the UK replaced my screen under warranty. I re-locked, restored the stock recovery and ROM before sending it in.

I won't buy a HTC phone again.
My next phone is a Nexus Series.

I decided to root because i was assured by HTC Chat that it did not void ALL warranty, only issues that could be caused by software (rooting), so if any major hardware faults developed, it SHOULD still be covered under warranty

I'm not too fussed tbh, I'll wait for S-Off like a patient little boy.
HTC only allowed us to have S-Off through HTCDev because people were bugging them about it and they gave in.
They had to safeguard themselves against any backlash that might have come from N00bs bricking their devices and trying to claim for a new handset when it their own failures that fscked up their device anyway.
It's like Car Insurance, keep crashing your motor and expect to pay higher premiums... sooner or later you'll stop driving like a nob, understand what I'm saying?

The-Last-Hylian said:
I'm not too fussed tbh, I'll wait for S-Off like a patient little boy.
HTC only allowed us to have S-Off through HTCDev because people were bugging them about it and they gave in.
They had to safeguard themselves against any backlash that might have come from N00bs bricking their devices and trying to claim for a new handset when it their own failures that fscked up their device anyway.
It's like Car Insurance, keep crashing your motor and expect to pay higher premiums... sooner or later you'll stop driving like a nob, understand what I'm saying?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well said,the HOX is not as easy to root as previous HTC mobiles so they have had to cover their own backs.

Why should HTC allow you a warranty when u rooted ur phone. HTC team did a fantastic job in Sense.

deakodude said:
Well said,the HOX is not as easy to root as previous HTC mobiles so they have had to cover their own backs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks, naturally, as with all things technological, people fiddle with it and break things, fix things and improve upon things. HTC did a good job with Sense imho, if we want to detract from that and make our own alterations why should they provide us with a warranty? In their eyes Sense was a finished product.
manoj971 said:
Why should HTC allow you a warranty when u rooted ur phone. HTC team did a fantastic job in Sense.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly! Overall, aesthetically, I really like Sense, it does have it's limitations however and is a resource hog, but it's a nice little eco-system that works well.

manoj971 said:
Why should HTC allow you a warranty when u rooted ur phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If I root and flash custom software on my phone I should have warranty on hardware issues such as the WiFi issue which has been proven to be a manufacturing defect. ie NOT caused by software.
It's like, buying a computer and running Ubuntu instead of Windows and then the manufacturer not covering a HDD replacement for a failed disk because of your OS. The only way hardware issues could be caused by the software is by overclocking the cpu and playing with voltages. There is no way in hell any other hardware issues could be caused by the software running on it especially bent pins affecting wifi antenna or assembly gaps to mention a few.
HTC not standing by warranty on these phones (especially when allowing us to unlock the bootloader) is criminal. Why allow us to unlock the bootloader if you can't do anything with it???
I am quietly waiting for the next nexus phone to be announced. I think I may sell my one x (which is the best phone I've ever owned) and go for a nexus. My last few phones have all been HTC but I have lost faith in the company and brand.

I think its a piss take HTC voiding part or whole of your warranty. If you went out and brought a brand new laptop and wanted to put Windows 8 on it, but you had to wait for let's say Acer to decide if the upgrade would work, to tweak and add useless programs and put a skin over it, OR void your warranty, have Windows 8 and never be allowed to send your laptop in for hardware errors, people would be pretty pissed off. These phones are mini computers. I believe they should be unlockable by 'fastboot oem unlock' which would mean full S-Off, anyway if your into loading ROMs and want a warranty. Don't buy this phone... Simple.
Sent from my HTC One X using xda app-developers app

cosmicovertones said:
There is no way in hell any other hardware issues could be caused by the software running on it especially bent pins affecting wifi antenna or assembly gaps to mention a few.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On certain Samsung phones with certain emmc firmware in combination with certain ics kernel could permanently destroy the emmc if you did a full wipe/factory reset in cwm

godutch said:
On certain Samsung phones with certain emmc firmware in combination with certain ics kernel could permanently destroy the emmc if you did a full wipe/factory reset in cwm
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is quite poor from Samsung in my opinion.

i purchased the one x on release day - coming from the dhd i thought i was choosing the right phone for me. i loved changing roms and fiddling until i had a hard ware failure on the device.
i was suprised that htc had done this, i have always upgraded my phone until the dhd (nothing else really worth the upgrade until the one x was released) around 6-9 months of age (due to boredom most of the time).
I just know that my next phone will not have sense on - as much as i love sense i can live without it, but not having root makes the phone boring after a while. Its a shame as i love htc hardware, but not willing to lose warrenty on a device that could fail after so many months. My wife already has her name on my phone when i upgrade next so warrenty is still needed.
i think this is a dirty trick htc has done here and will only cost them as time goes on.
i fancy a plain android phone now as ics / jellybean looks so nice so sense wont be missed too much thinking about it, i can see a nexus coming in my near future when they release the next generation.
IMHO, i wouldnt have minded so much if htc gave the option to remove ALL bloatware inc sense - forcing programs such as suckbook and twatter with only the option to disable is pathetic, they should either give you the option to flash a vanilla rom or remove all bloat before making you void warrenty getting rid of the crap.

[Q] Regarding the warranty and those who flash

After learning that once we flash a rom, we are 100% screwed if we ever need to use our warranty. The only reason I bought the T-Mobile Note 3 was because of the unlocked boot loader, and now I learn that if my device ever breaks, Samsung will not honor it? There has to be a way, or I'm sure others wouldn't be dropping $700 so easily on this device.
What do we do if we develop a genuine issue with this phone after we have flashed roms on it and restored to stock?
Edit: in triangle away my counter reads: 0 and binary: custom

You did read about your options before you bought the phone right? There are other threads where this is/has been discussed. There are options.

krelvinaz said:
You did read about your options before you bought the phone right? There are other threads where this is/has been discussed. There are options.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, there has been, however, most of those threads are full of useless clutter that doesn't contribute anything. I have searched, and have been a member of these forums for a long time, and know how they work. I don't see any options for those who have already flashed a custom rom and want to maintain their warranties.

MattMJB0188 said:
Yes, there has been, however, most of those threads are full of useless clutter that doesn't contribute anything. I have searched, and have been a member of these forums for a long time, and know how they work. I don't see any options for those who have already flashed a custom rom and want to maintain their warranties.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If your phone does not power on who can say it has been need with. You have a year with tmobile. Never had an issue with them covering it.
NOTE 3

MattMJB0188 said:
Yes, there has been, however, most of those threads are full of useless clutter that doesn't contribute anything. I have searched, and have been a member of these forums for a long time, and know how they work. I don't see any options for those who have already flashed a custom rom and want to maintain their warranties.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then you already know the answer.
If you are looking for Samsung, T-Mobile or any other provider to come out and say, Yes, if you root and flash your phone it will still have Warranty Coverage.... it won't happen! They are never going to say that. All of them have listed policies that say rooting = no warranty.
The Knox flag might bring in a new element to this, it shouldn't but could.
The reality however depends on how you deal with it, like stated above, I have personally never had a warranty issue if there is a hardware problem with my phones regardless to rooting it. For the first year, you should be dealing with T-Mobile for issues. But a lot depends on how you deal with it.
Options:
Have hardware replacement warranty (Provider, SquareTrade etc)
Be smart when you call for support, the word Rooted, Different Rom is not in the conversation.
Rooting, flashing ROMs is not something 99.5% of the users of the devices do. Most have no idea what it is, any any idea that it exists. So for most users of devices, this is a non-issue.

krelvinaz said:
Then you already know the answer.
If you are looking for Samsung, T-Mobile or any other provider to come out and say, Yes, if you root and flash your phone it will still have Warranty Coverage.... it won't happen! They are never going to say that. All of them have listed policies that say rooting = no warranty.
The Knox flag might bring in a new element to this, it shouldn't but could.
The reality however depends on how you deal with it, like stated above, I have personally never had a warranty issue if there is a hardware problem with my phones regardless to rooting it. For the first year, you should be dealing with T-Mobile for issues. But a lot depends on how you deal with it.
Options:
Have hardware replacement warranty (Provider, SquareTrade etc)
Be smart when you call for support, the word Rooted, Different Rom is not in the conversation.
Rooting, flashing ROMs is not something 99.5% of the users of the devices do. Most have no idea what it is, any any idea that it exists. So for most users of devices, this is a non-issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am not a current T-mobile customer, so I doubt they'd cover it if I'm not one of their customers with an insurance plan. Still, no guarantees if they do that I'd still still be covered since I flashed a rom.
Is SquareTrade really worth the $125 for two years? Even then, would they cover it if I flashed a rom if something happened?
Boy do I miss the days of the Galaxy S2 and S3 where none of this even came into question.

A bit OT, but one reason why I liked staying with Sprint was because they did cover my phone regardless of root. Too bad their network sucks.

See when u said u bought the T-Mobile phone I was under the impression u had T-Mobile service. It a chance you took so just read and ask questions before you flash anything that might brick ur phone. If you bought the phone from the mobile they must issue 1 year warranty regardless. But it will be a battle for you
NOTE 3

BACARDILIMON said:
See when u said u bought the T-Mobile phone I was under the impression u had T-Mobile service. It a chance you took so just read and ask questions before you flash anything that might brick ur phone. If you bought the phone from the mobile they must issue 1 year warranty regardless. But it will be a battle for you
NOTE 3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been flashing roms on Samsung devices for over two years now, so I'm pretty experienced and haven't bricked a phone yet. My concerns are the device malfunctioning on its own or developing a hardware issue. Assuming flashing a custom rom had nothing to do with it, would Samsung still honor the warranty?
This really makes me want to return the device mwhy did they have to do this?

MattMJB0188 said:
I've been flashing roms on Samsung devices for over two years now, so I'm pretty experienced and haven't bricked a phone yet. My concerns are the device malfunctioning on its own or developing a hardware issue. Assuming flashing a custom rom had nothing to do with it, would Samsung still honor the warranty?
This really makes me want to return the device mwhy did they have to do this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Samsung will not honor it if it powers up and shows a mod has been done. But if phone does not turn on then as long as no physical harm has been done they have to warranty it
NOTE 3