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Hi there, this post is basically dedicated to current users of windows mobile, who bought their phone because of the virtues an open plattform offers. People like us aren't happy with the direction ms is heading with windows phone 7 and hope that the realize their wrong doing by reimplanting things like multitasking, deep-customization, file-system access, native coding or simply copy, cut and paste.
But why should we buy a windows phone 7 device and hope they transform it to something that resembles wm6 offer time when we could just switch to another plattform?
I mean...
- booth the devices we own and the software we use are not compatible to wp7.
- Android basically got every of the above features wp7 is lagging.
- Android devices are aviable or will be released from every major windows mobile manufacture.
- A lot of software studios will produce for Android.
- Through the ndk Google offers there will probably be more windows mobile software on Android than on windows phone in a year from now.
The only thing wp7 got IMO is the ui, and as we all know from endless debates with the iphone-guys ui is a matter of taste and can be ported...
If you're not a Google or Java hater and Android does what you need... don't hesitate.
Android is good. I'm right now playing with an older Android phone, and although it is very slow (old QCOM processor) and has a small screen, I find the experience to be better than the experience I have with my HD2.
I don't have the slightest doubt anymore that Android is better than iPhone OS or WP7S.
It's smooth.
It has a great, flexible home screen (who needs tiles when you got widgets?).
It has by far the best solution for notifications.
It multitasks.
It has a Marketplace and allows you to side-load apps.
It allows you to access the file system.
It copies and pastes.
It has an NDK.
It is available right now and only getting better.
What you don't get is integration with Microsoft's services, like Windows Live and XBox Live. Of course, there's a good chance that you don't care about them.
I've never used an iPhone but I've dabbled in Android for a while. Mostly, through the Poly port for Kaiser. Here's my views on WM6.5 vs Android.
Windows Mobile GOOD
#1 WM5 sucked. Very unstable, and scrolling speed is very slow. WM6 wasn't much different. WM6.1 become stable, but speed still suffers. WM6.5 very stable, but speed suffers. WM6.5.3 is very stable, and the speed is very fast, including scrolling.
#2 True freedom. You have 3 ways to install applications, and the choice for it to be on the SD card or internal memory. Copy and Paste, and all that jazz.
#3 Customization! Like Mc Donald's says, have it your way.
#4 Huge selection of apps.
Windows Mobile BAD
#1 Lots of problems with 3D acceleration support. Mainly due to OpenGL ES drivers.
#2 Only way to upgrade OS is through custom built roms on XDA-Developers. No support from MS, HTC, and etc.
#3 Majority of applications were written in 2003, and have since been abandoned.
#4 With Phone7 coming soon, developers will completely abandon WM6.5, and move onto Phone 7.
Android GOOD
#1 Based on Linux, which means lots of community support.
#2 Already has an established amount of useful applications.
#3 Very customizable. I've seen some impressive 3D stuff.
#4 You can install applications from the SD card.
#5 Copy and paste exists.
Android BAD
#1 Applications must be installed into main memory, unless you partition your SD card.
#2 Very reliant on a internet connection to do a lot of things.
#3 No Offline GPS option for the Nav.
#4 Google might try to take away the "Google" experience from rom cookers.
#3 No Offline GPS option for the Nav.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There's IGO8, Copilot... and some others. Or did I get you wrong?
#1 Applications must be installed into main memory, unless you partition your SD card.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not anymore, afaik.
#4 Huge selection of apps.
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Click to collapse
That's even more true for Android.
But this is not WM6.5 vs. Android. WM6.5 is doomed, so the time will come when you have to switch.
WP7S is not worth waiting for, it's just an iPhone OS clone. So, in my opinion, there's no reason not to switch now, if you want to.
What happens when Android becomes the NEW Windows Mobile? You know it's headed in that direction now. There's like 3 or 4 different versions of the OS and the app community isn't doing well. When WP7 gets its footing in the market (iPhone already has), it's going to be really difficult to compete with these. Perhaps Android will be relegated to low-end smartphones
C:Sharp! said:
There's IGO8, Copilot... and some others. Or did I get you wrong?
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Click to collapse
I mean the built in Nav software, which the new one is pretty cool. I could use Ndrive, but I really like the built in Nav.
Not anymore, afaik.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe it's because I'm using a port for the HTC Kaiser. If that's the case, that can be scratched off the list.
WhyBe said:
What happens when Android becomes the NEW Windows Mobile? You know it's headed in that direction now. There's like 3 or 4 different versions of the OS and the app community isn't doing well. When WP7 gets its footing in the market (iPhone already has), it's going to be really difficult to compete with these. Perhaps Android will be relegated to low-end smartphones
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Won't happen for various reasons. Windows Mobile was never really taken seriously by Microsoft until now, but Android has Google behind them.
It's a lot like what happened to Internet Explorer. When Microsoft won the browser war between Netscape, they left it completely alone. Suddenly FireFox, Chrome, Safari, and Opera are kicking it's ass. Same thing happened with Windows Mobile. iPhone, and Android appeared and took Microsoft by surprise.
Also, since it's linux based, it can never truly die. The community has it's hands on it now, and they'll never let go. Don't be surprised if we see Linux distros in the Future for many phones. Something like Ubuntu or Slackware could become common to see on cooked phone roms, in a couple of years.
iPhone and Windows Phone 7 will still be popular, but does anyone truly believe that phones with so many restrictions will last? I'm sure Microsoft is betting that the Xbox feature will grab people, much like Apple is betting on that their fan base will always grab customers.
Won't happen for various reasons. Windows Mobile was never really taken seriously by Microsoft until now, but Android has Google behind them.
Click to expand...
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Google has one success, that is it's search engine. This does not automatically mean success with other endeavors.
It's a lot like what happened to Internet Explorer. When Microsoft won the browser war between Netscape, they left it completely alone. Suddenly FireFox, Chrome, Safari, and Opera are kicking it's ass.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nothing is kicking IE's ass. What world are you living in?
Same thing happened with Windows Mobile. iPhone, and Android appeared and took Microsoft by surprise.
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Click to collapse
MS deserved it.
Also, since it's linux based, it can never truly die. The community has it's hands on it now, and they'll never let go. Don't be surprised if we see Linux distros in the Future for many phones. Something like Ubuntu or Slackware could become common to see on cooked phone roms, in a couple of years.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It may not die, per se, but it definitely will never be big. Niche product at best. There's too much confusion in open systems. How many incompatible Android OS'es are out now? Modern smartphones will win or lose based on their apps. Androids app situation sucks right now.
iPhone and Windows Phone 7 will still be popular, but does anyone truly believe that phones with so many restrictions will last? I'm sure Microsoft is betting that the Xbox feature will grab people, much like Apple is betting on that their fan base will always grab customers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is smart business. Use your existing successes to build a customer base. All smart companies do this...even Google.
WhyBe said:
Google has one success, that is it's search engine. This does not automatically mean success with other endeavors.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Gmail
Google Map
Chrome Web Broswer
Google voice
YouTube
All this is offered for free.
Nothing is kicking IE's ass. What world are you living in?
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This world.
If you added IE6+IE7+IE8, then you can say it's more popular then FireFox. You have to wonder, if people are still using IE6 then it's most likely they probably don't know about other web browsers, or don't even know what one is. You know the type, logs on twitter, facebook, and myspace and uses AIM to chat to people.
It may not die, per se, but it definitely will never be big. Niche product at best. There's too much confusion in open systems. How many incompatible Android OS'es are out now?
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No more then Windows Mobile will have. We'll soon have legacy Windows Mobile 6.5, and Phone 7. Neither are compatible.
Modern smartphones will win or lose based on their apps. Androids app situation sucks right now.
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Not sure about Windows Phone 7, but iPhone has it horrible right now.
No porn apps
No emulators
No web browsers
No flash support
Android may not have as many pull my finger apps or farting apps as iPhone, but at least we can have all of the above. iPhone and Phone7 owners will be able to have 100 different choices of how to make fart noises from their phone, while I'll be able to view flash websites. While iPhone and Phone7 will enjoy half ass made games for their phones, eventually Android will get a Playstation and N64 emulator. I consider any Genesis or SNES game to be far superior then any 3D accelerated game they can put on those phones as is.
The biggest blunder from Apple was them pulling the porn apps. Everyone knows the internet and DVDs became popular due to porn. Enforcing that rule is sure suicide, despite the horrible image of me walking into a public bathroom and finding someone wacking off to porn on their Android phone.
When Mozilla ports FireFox to Android, I'll be able to use ABP and NoScript to have a truly secure surfing experience. While IE on Phone7 fails horribly on the Acid3 test. As it is IE9 gets a 55/100 on Acid3.
Just from what I've mentioned I say there's plenty of incentive to go with an open OS. Jail break your iPhone or **** break your Phone7, but you'll be in this endless battle between Microsoft or Apple.
Dukenukemx said:
Gmail
Google Map
Chrome Web Broswer
Google voice
YouTube
All this is offered for free.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Chrome Web Browser? A success? You must be kidding me. No, I'm not saying it's a bad product. But can you imagine how much money a promo campaign like Google did for Chrome, would cost a third party? So you spend billions of dollars (even though "virtual" in this case) and get absolutely laughable market share. Success?
YouTube they bought for a ridiculous amount of money, and it's a cash disposer. Yeah, we all enjoy it, no doubt about it. The more we enjoy it the more money Google coughs out on it. Windows Mobile is a bigger success than this.
Google Maps? You forgot Gmail. Some 90%+ of Google's income comes from its home page. Not even Adsense, which ads a few percentage points. So no, Google hasn't had a single success in any area apart from search, even though they've been trying to diversify like crazy because they are really scared of what may happen if they lose their search engine domination. The problem is, by doing all this free stuff everywhere about the only thing they achieve is that they technically cannot "fail". Sure, you don't set revenue targets, you just burn cash, what's a failure?
I love WM 6.5.3 and right now my phone (TD2) is just perfect the way it is. And if someday I want something to change then I can just flash a new ROM, install a cab or write another tool on my own.
I hate Android because your applications are running in a Java VM and you can't access the OS kernel functions like you can with WM.
Though yesterday I just for fun run Android on a Touch Diamond. I have to admit the UI is really nice done, even though it isn't THAT MUCH different compared to the user experience you get with 6.5.3. Some window animations here and there and I love it like you can pull down the taskbar and I like the multiple homescreen thing. Though I couldn't do a lot of things with it because for most things it needed a data connection (I didn't plug in a SIM card) and USB/WiFi didn't work. Also it asked me to sign up for Google account all the time. On 6.5.3 on the other hand some things are quite better implemented, for example start menu or Sense. I also like it that you can reach all functions through your touch screen. On Android you're always forced to use the hard keys to close a window or get out of an app. After all I wonder if it's possible to hack into the taskbar or bottom bar like I do on WM but due to Java VM environment I doubt you can do that.
After all, right now there's no reason why I should switch to Android. However I don't know what the situation will be in the next 1-2 years. So in the end all I can say: On the longer run it might be the only OS able to replace 6.5.3 in the future but right now it's just too limited for my taste (in other words I can also say it doesn't give me enough features to forget about some limits). But I definitely keep an eye on it
vangrieg said:
Chrome Web Browser? A success? You must be kidding me. No, I'm not saying it's a bad product. But can you imagine how much money a promo campaign like Google did for Chrome, would cost a third party? So you spend billions of dollars (even though "virtual" in this case) and get absolutely laughable market share. Success?
YouTube they bought for a ridiculous amount of money, and it's a cash disposer. Yeah, we all enjoy it, no doubt about it. The more we enjoy it the more money Google coughs out on it. Windows Mobile is a bigger success than this.
Google Maps? You forgot Gmail. Some 90%+ of Google's income comes from its home page. Not even Adsense, which ads a few percentage points. So no, Google hasn't had a single success in any area apart from search, even though they've been trying to diversify like crazy because they are really scared of what may happen if they lose their search engine domination. The problem is, by doing all this free stuff everywhere about the only thing they achieve is that they technically cannot "fail". Sure, you don't set revenue targets, you just burn cash, what's a failure?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+100
Thanks Vangrieg, you beat me to it
vangrieg said:
Chrome Web Browser? A success? You must be kidding me. No, I'm not saying it's a bad product. But can you imagine how much money a promo campaign like Google did for Chrome, would cost a third party? So you spend billions of dollars (even though "virtual" in this case) and get absolutely laughable market share. Success?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is success, even though the way to reach it is.... strange!?
But are Microsoft doing any better? They're just buying off companies if they need a new feature.
Google is buying new companies if they need a new feature - Android and YouTube are good examples. Microsoft isn't much better, but they have at least 2.5 sources of income - Windows, Office and Server/Tools. Now, that's a much better success because they sell that stuff. You have to be a complete loser to provide something that usually costs money for free, having a huge pile of cash and the world's largest web ad brokerage to not get a sizable market share. Yet Google does it all the time with Buzzes, Waves and all that acid-driven stuff that even tech savvy people rarely understand. And yeah, they'll muck up more than once with Android, the patent protection issue for OEMs is just the first bell that rang.
vangrieg said:
.. You have to be a complete loser to provide something that usually costs money for free ...
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Click to collapse
xda-developers provide a lot of free stuff, are they losers too? I don't think so
XDA is not a business, we're here for fun. Oh, and one little nuance, XDA doesn't have 20 billion dollars to burn and can't put an ad on every freakin' web site out there.
Dukenukemx said:
Windows Mobile BAD
#1 Lots of problems with 3D acceleration support. Mainly due to OpenGL ES drivers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's not a deficiency of Windows Mobile, it's a deficiency of phones manufactured by HTC. Users of the Toshiba TG01 and Acer neoTouch are very happy with their 3D support, and indeed with their hardware-accelerated video playback of virtually any codec and wrapper format.
vangrieg said:
Google is buying new companies if they need a new feature - Android and YouTube are good examples. Microsoft isn't much better, but they have at least 2.5 sources of income - Windows, Office and Server/Tools. Now, that's a much better success because they sell that stuff. You have to be a complete loser to provide something that usually costs money for free, having a huge pile of cash and the world's largest web ad brokerage to not get a sizable market share. Yet Google does it all the time with Buzzes, Waves and all that acid-driven stuff that even tech savvy people rarely understand. And yeah, they'll muck up more than once with Android, the patent protection issue for OEMs is just the first bell that rang.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't understand it as well, but seems like it's working for them. Microsoft offer more products because they are around way longer. Google are only here for roughly 10 years. Look up what MS had to offer after 10 years of existence, which was in 1985.
Actually, if you carefully listen to what Google execs say, it's not working for them. They are very nervous. I agree that one of the key problems is that they just started to diversify. They are doing too many mistakes though which are relatively easy to avoid. It's actually a funny phenomenon you can often see in companies driven by engineers because they're so into technologies and inventions and such that they just can't resist pushing their cool new things out the door. Google is in fact a lot like Microsoft, only less mature and disciplined, in this regard. A contrast to this approach is Apple where hardly anyone ever sees a beta product, and the company is incredibly focused.
Apart from product development, there's one more thing where Google doesn't have a lot of experience, and that's partnering with others. Jobs once said that he absolutely admires Gates's abilities in this regard, saying that in fact, with all the spats, fan base animosity, tensions and all, Microsoft is the only long-term partner Apple has had through all these years, and the partnership works amazingly well for both parties. He even noted that MS is the second largest developer of software for Apple products after Apple. Google has a long way to learn how to maze through all these issues and make lasting relationships. It's one thing to attract everyone with a free product and give OEMs better bargaining position against Microsoft with a mobile OS, it's a totally different thing to carry it on to market leadership with so many conflicting interests and challenges.
Sure OEMs flirt with open source OSes, IBMs and HPs of the world are investing a lot of resources into Linux development and all, but at the end of the day which OS shows up as "recommended" on their web sites? Sure HTC is all about Android, Open Handset Alliance and all that PR stuff these days, but what does its CEO say when asked why HD2 was a WM device? "We have to take care of Windows Mobile first".
WhyBe said:
What happens when Android becomes the NEW Windows Mobile?
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Click to collapse
This is not going to happen.
Contrary to what some people believe, "fragmentation" does not hurt Android much and it's not what made Windows Mobile die.
Windows Mobile died, because it got zero support from Microsoft over many years. There was no money and no developers. They could easily have made it competitive to the iPhone within a year. But they didn't. It took them one and a half years to even figure out what to do and end all the internal battles, which is an eternity in the mobile space.
Google stand behind their mobile OS and you can be sure that they will fix any problems that emerge. If fragmentation becomes too much of an issue, they'll fix it. If the UI gets outdated, they'll fix it. Microsoft didn't fix anything.
And aside from that, it will take Windows Phone 7 at least another year, to even become an option. Handsets must be launched, bugs will have to be fixed and the Marketplace has to be filled. Only then will it be competitive, if ever.
That's plenty of time before you can even consider Windows Phone 7, thus switching to Android now is not wasted money.
RAMMANN said:
I don't understand it as well, but seems like it's working for them. Microsoft offer more products because they are around way longer. Google are only here for roughly 10 years. Look up what MS had to offer after 10 years of existence, which was in 1985.
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Click to collapse
How can you compare this?
A lot of what Google has done the last 10 years is based on what MS and others made possible the first 10 years.
It's like saying that Ferrari has accomplished more then Ford because they have made better and faster cars the last 10 years then Ford did the first 10.
Ferrari might not have existed today if their wasn't someone that made engines and wheels before them.
Android is the first (open source) Linux OS that has been sold on a device. although you call it open source it's not more open the WM or iPhone.
Google is controlling the development of the OS and anyone can make applications for it.. whats the difference now between android, WM or iPhone? and witch one of them is most open source? all of them have the same. A company that develops the OS and developers making the apps.
I only see MS going less open source with WP7.
and to not having porn apps and other stuff on iPhone well jailbreak and you have it.
Now some will say you can't do anything without jailbraking an iphone. Well without Hard spl you are also kind of sucked on WM.
Android has already several updates and can't be run by all older devices.
WM also have a few updates but a wizard that is quite an old device can run WM 6.5.
READ this article BEFORE you post to this thread!
http://www.theunwired.net/?item=tho...ons-and-live-tiles-anywhere-in-the-cloud&5669
Glanceable information? No jumping in and out of apps? Less stop and stare? Integration?
Everything just a big, fat lie.
Here's the truth: Nothing in WP7 is new, nothing is different.
You will still jump in and out of apps.
You will still not be able to see information "at a glance".
WP7 will just be a grid of static, oversized icons, like iOS.
From The Unwired:
But rather than that, Windows Phone 7 customers have to jump in and out of the apps - to get status updates; just like on pre-Windows Phone 7 smartphones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Except for Android, of course.
Yes, there is an OS that doesn't just talk about "integration" and "information at a glance".
There is an OS that does it. And it's not WP7! It's Android.
WP7 is just lies and hot air. Google does all the things Microsoft only talks about but can't do.
Do you need a hug?
I could use one, yes.
EDIT: Wait... maybe not.
I do agree that Windows Phone 7 does have a few issues with its lack of features but it does look like a good OS. I would personally like to see the live widgets do a bit more as they don't really do much as I would have to go into the Facebook app to look at status updates etc.
The goal is to get you to use LIVE for everything. If not Live then use what's integrated in the phone.
Another thing Hubs will be rare. Carrier hubs and OEM hubs that's it.
ohh here we go again
Uhm... the fact that you give no information? the fact that you just started saying ANDROID ANDROID ANDROID, tells me you should go to the Android section... I love Android a lot too, but Windows Phone 7 just has something I have been missing, and that's something called QUALITY, with so much open source, Android feels locked down and broken, WP7 looks polished and well built. Of course people as of right now dislike it:
NO TETHER, NO FLASH(well guess what iPhone doesn't have that either lmfao), NO THIS APP, etc. etc.
IT IS BRAND NEW! And with this many things at LAUNCH! It's gotten a bigger start than Android!
So just stop trying to kill an OS because your **** is so hard for Android, give other platforms a chance.
Smokexz said:
Uhm... the fact that you give no information? the fact that you just started saying ANDROID ANDROID ANDROID, tells me you should go to the Android section... I love Android a lot too, but Windows Phone 7 just has something I have been missing, and that's something called QUALITY, with so much open source, Android feels locked down and broken, WP7 looks polished and well built. Of course people as of right now dislike it:
NO TETHER, NO FLASH(well guess what iPhone doesn't have that either lmfao), NO THIS APP, etc. etc.
IT IS BRAND NEW! And with this many things at LAUNCH! It's gotten a bigger start than Android!
So just stop trying to kill an OS because your **** is so hard for Android, give other platforms a chance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
*Standing Ovation*
Smokexz said:
So just stop trying to kill an OS because your **** is so hard for Android, give other platforms a chance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Funniest post of the day. I can't stop laughing LOL.
OP's a troll..
Phone Titan said:
I do agree that Windows Phone 7 does have a few issues with its lack of features but it does look like a good OS. I would personally like to see the live widgets do a bit more as they don't really do much as I would have to go into the Facebook app to look at status updates etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
no you wouldnt jus go to peoples hub to see this information
I think the OP is missing the point. Yes you have to launch apps for certains things - all phones have to no matter what OS. It would be truely magic to be able to get to do something or see something without tapping or launching something.
The whole glance and go premise is related to the home screen with the hubs and live tiles. Its the equivalent of the old win mo today screen which tells you all the necessary info on one screen as soon as you unlock the phone. Something the iPhone can't do right now.
OP, you need to chill. WP7 is brand new and was a bit rushed. This is Microsoft's new baby, however, and it will be continually supported and updated. Just watch.
Smokexz said:
Uhm... the fact that you give no information? the fact that you just started saying ANDROID ANDROID ANDROID, tells me you should go to the Android section... I love Android a lot too, but Windows Phone 7 just has something I have been missing, and that's something called QUALITY, with so much open source, Android feels locked down and broken, WP7 looks polished and well built. Of course people as of right now dislike it:
NO TETHER, NO FLASH(well guess what iPhone doesn't have that either lmfao), NO THIS APP, etc. etc.
IT IS BRAND NEW! And with this many things at LAUNCH! It's gotten a bigger start than Android!
So just stop trying to kill an OS because your **** is so hard for Android, give other platforms a chance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
*applause*
Don't forget that OPs is a Android fanboy and Troll.
Omega Ra said:
*Standing Ovation*
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Click to collapse
Two for the ovation
Smokexz said:
Uhm... the fact that you give no information? the fact that you just started saying ANDROID ANDROID ANDROID, tells me you should go to the Android section... I love Android a lot too, but Windows Phone 7 just has something I have been missing, and that's something called QUALITY, with so much open source, Android feels locked down and broken, WP7 looks polished and well built. Of course people as of right now dislike it:
NO TETHER, NO FLASH(well guess what iPhone doesn't have that either lmfao), NO THIS APP, etc. etc.
IT IS BRAND NEW! And with this many things at LAUNCH! It's gotten a bigger start than Android!
So just stop trying to kill an OS because your **** is so hard for Android, give other platforms a chance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Microsoft has intentionally not included services and featuers which are standard. They are either being stubborn, or they are doing the ol' apple trick of trickling features through "New OS Versions". WP7 has been in development for TWO YEARS, there's no excuse for glaring oversights regarding things that are more less standards and expected.
WP7 lacks saves states for applications, that's inexcusable.
There's no background services. For small developers this basically rules out developing for WP7 without having a lackluster application. Anybody that wants to provide HUB updates to apps will need an extensive infrastructure in the cloud as push is the only solution.
It feels like MS is solving the "fart app" issue of android and ios through pure class division. Any worthwhile application will need a developer with deep pockets to have servers providing push.
I won't deny the fact that the OS is cohesive, fluid, and very beautiful. Once you step out of MS applications things start to fall apart.
It really isn't revolutionary at all. Microsoft is said to spend over $1 Billion in advertising for WP7. WP7 is all about hype and marketing without any substance.
All the apps look the same. Everything has the same structure. It is a bunch of same.
It is a pity that Microsoft actually HAD TO PAY DEVELOPERS to develop apps for WP7.
tboy2000 said:
The whole glance and go premise is related to the home screen with the hubs and live tiles. Its the equivalent of the old win mo today screen which tells you all the necessary info on one screen as soon as you unlock the phone. Something the iPhone can't do right now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How about reading before you post?
The whole issue is that the "glance and go premise" will not work because live tiles do not work.
The only tiles that will be "live" are the built in ones from Microsoft. Almost no third party developer will make use of live tiles, because there are huge costs associated with that - setting up a server etc.
What that means is that WP7 will not be "glanceable". In fact, it even will hardly present more information than iOS!
In the end, WP7 will be a grid of (huge) icons, just like iOS. The whole glance and go premise is nothing but a big, fat lie.
@Smokexz
Next time read before you post, moron. I gave you a full article.
I'm not talking about features like multitasking that have been beaten to death. Now read, think, then post.
JCopernicus said:
Any worthwhile application will need a developer with deep pockets to have servers providing push.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
crow26 said:
How about reading before you post?
The whole issue is that the "glance and go premise" will not work because live tiles do not work.
The only tiles that will be "live" are the built in ones from Microsoft. Almost no third party developer will make use of live tiles, because there are huge costs associated with that - setting up a server etc.
What that means is that WP7 will not be "glanceable". In fact, it even will hardly present more information than iOS!
In the end, WP7 will be a grid of (huge) icons, just like iOS. The whole glance and go premise is nothing but a big, fat lie.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is this the same kind of lie that apple told about how the iphone 4 will make phone calls, without adding it requires it to be held a certain way or needs a case? Just because there is a cost to implement live tiles doesnt make MS's statements lies, just means the uptake wont be as quick. But no worries, thanks to your news flash I'm off to give all my data to google and the hordes of dodgy devs mining personal data, that'll show MS!
I think i read somewhere that Microsoft hosts servers for push applications for free. If that is true then there is no problem for developers to make such apps.
WP7 UI experience is just plain AWESOME. If only MS gets Mango on all current and future WP7 devices before this year end, its gonna be a real threat to Android and iOS.
-proud owner of a Samsung Focus (7.0.7004.0)
update::
Ok so why do I think WP7 is awesome compared to Android? Well for starters the concept of Hubs is amazing. The Music Hub has all my songs, videos and even links to 3rd party Music/Video Apps right in one place. The Android Music Player seems like junk compared to the Zune player, it even automatically finds the currently playing songs Artist image and sets it as the background for the entire Zune Hub which although seems trivial but it really adds a nice touch.
The Office Hub does not even have a comparable application on Android. The mango update is gonna make it even better with skydrive integration built rt into the hub.
Xbox live integration with its achievements and gamer points really increases the replay value of games. Although one thing which i currently find annoying is the high minimum price of the xbox live games, some of which cost $2 more than their iPhone counterparts. This may be due in part becoz WP7 is a newer platform so as it matures and the adoption rate increases prices will reduce.
overall the UI really seems to be built for the consumer and is really easy to use. from what I have seen of Android it just seems like a marriage between Symbian/WinMo. Sure you can customize the hell out of it and currently it has a lot of features which WP7 lacks but IMO only features do not determine the success of a platform coz Symbian/WMO had most of these features half a decade ago. And frankly the average consumer does not give a damn about modding/ ROMS/ features etc.
.....hmm have to get back to work now, will update this asap ....unless the thread gets locked
Well, I recommend you get your NoDo fix now...it is super easy, and works using either the data method or wifi...
kapanak said:
Well, I recommend you get your NoDo fix now...it is super easy, and works using either the data method or wifi...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yup I'm aware of the Hungarian VPN hack, but am not that desperate for NoDo right now so will wait for ATT to get its act together.
Tried Android emulator on amazon.com and decided that WP7 UI is awesome?
I'm not sure how this works.
vangrieg said:
Tried Android emulator on amazon.com and decided that WP7 UI is awesome?
I'm not sure how this works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Something like humping an ugly fat neighbour to appreciate your slim, beautiful wife even more ?!
Avandor said:
Something like humping an ugly fat neighbour to appreciate your slim, beautiful wife even more ?!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Jesus!
vangrieg said:
Tried Android emulator on amazon.com and decided that WP7 UI is awesome?
I'm not sure how this works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well I was a former Symbian user and had never used an Android device before, so this was my first time with the Android UI which I must say offers nothing compared to WP7.
Avandor said:
Something like humping an ugly fat neighbour to appreciate your slim, beautiful wife even more ?!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol rofl
fat girls need loving too
but they gotta pay!!!
As for android, best to go look at a device. Sadly, it functions quite similarly to amazon's test...sometimes fast, most times slow
And what does text based WP7 offers, thad android doesn`t?
balance
non fragmented hardware
driver specific code to run at optimum
me thinks that's enough
UbiMaiden said:
And what does text based WP7 offers, thad android doesn`t?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Text based? At least WP7 doesn't use any terminal emulator
UbiMaiden said:
And what does text based WP7 offers, thad android doesn`t?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A clean, smooth, fast interface?
This thread should be closed before it gets out of control.
I have used Windows Mobile before moving to Android.
here is what I feel about Android...
Android is the new Windows Mobile 6.X
very powerful...but lacks cohesiveness. Unusable without custom ROMs
I am thinking of giving Windows phone 7 a try. Perhaps I am getting too old to keep flashing my phone every week.
Anyways... don't completely ignore Android. UI can be improved at any time. Next few years will be interesting to watch.
arkavat said:
Android is the new Windows Mobile 6.X
very powerful...but lacks cohesiveness. Unusable without custom ROMs
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
^^^^My thoughts exactly. Maybe those Microsoft WM developers jumped ship to Google
If you ever played with the Windows Mobile emulator before, it's the same experience. Very plain and boring. That's why OEMs spent so much time skin it and customize it.
What you see on the emulator is not the same on devices.
What's hilarious is that someone starts a thread like this, then some WP7 denizens wonder why there is "negativity" about WP7. What is the OP even saying? Such valuable information that will surely help someone out, the forums are better for it that's for sure. Pretty sad actually.
as per the topic (whatever it actually is), the problem with the WP7 UI is that it can't be changed. So you either love Metro forever, or you best get a phone where you can theme it a little or at least change the wallpaper. I'm not going to sit here and bash WP7 because even though it is missing essential features that I need as a power-user, it is still a nice OS and I can see that it might be right for some people. For me It's going to be Android, iOS, and WM6.5.x for at least a couple more years till WP7 matures.
arkavat said:
I have used Windows Mobile before moving to Android.
here is what I feel about Android...
Android is the new Windows Mobile 6.X
very powerful...but lacks cohesiveness. Unusable without custom ROMs
I am thinking of giving Windows phone 7 a try. Perhaps I am getting too old to keep flashing my phone every week.
Anyways... don't completely ignore Android. UI can be improved at any time. Next few years will be interesting to watch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's not true.
That being said, to some people the ability to load a custom rom is an advantage. If you want to "customize" WP7 you're SoL. If you don't like your manufacturer's Andorid skin, but love the hardware (as many Galaxy S users do), it's not hard to load a stock custom ROM on it and get on with your life.
In many cases people don't even need custom roms. They just install something like ADW or LauncherPro and that's good enough for them.
That being said, no software differences will make up for the huge gap in hadware between WP7 and Android phones. The WP7 hardware is just not... attractive... these days. Even normal consumers are asking about specs these days, because the tech press and even the normal press have been conditioning them to expect these things to improve over time, not drop back (as WP7 has... going from late 2010 hardware to late 2009 hardware if you "upgraded" from Android to WP7).
Another thing Anddoid has going for it is Apps. AmEx just came out with Serve.com and there's only an App for iOS and Android, for example. No WhatsApp for WP7. No Trillian for WP7. RIM is supposed to be releasing BBM for iOS and Android. There are tons of apps that either aren't available for WP7, or will never be available in the forseeable future due to API lockdown by Microsoft.
It's a terrible platform for an App-o-holic and moving form Android to WP7 I find myself carrying around both phones pretty much 100% of the time because there are lots of apps that simply aren't available on WP7. There still isn't an IM client. No HTML5 browser. No SP-to-SP messaging app, no Turn-by-Turn Navigation, still cannot attach videos to MMS or Email, etc.
Like I said in another thread. Looks only get you so far. A dumb blond may be hot as hell, but she's still dumb.
but then this leads to the question, what do you want to change? besides putting background image and font changing, much of the wp7 is extremely theme friendly. Now, granted, haven't found a way to change the square tiles but even then that's a wip...
And even with the tile shape not being able to be changed, there are plenty of options to create something amazing
domineus said:
but then this leads to the question, what do you want to change? besides putting background image and font changing, much of the wp7 is extremely theme friendly. Now, granted, haven't found a way to change the square tiles but even then that's a wip...
And even with the tile shape not being able to be changed, there are plenty of options to create something amazing
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The size of the tiles? Make the App List a a grid instead of a list?
Change the default search provider in the browser?
Lower the touchscreen sensitivity and/or threshold for panning so that moving my finger 1 millimeter won't make the phone switch panes.
A lot of stuff people would want to change are impossible becuase Microsoft has crafted the OS in such a way that even skilled developers cannot compete with their stock apps (better browsers, other music players, better email clients (with conversation view and unified inbox, e.g.).
Ok, so here is my theory why it is taking Microsoft so long to release updates and bug fixes. I think the Windows Phone team is currently recoding Metro to run on top of Windows 8 instead of Windows CE. All the updates they are talking about down the road will be integrated into the new Windows 8 platform. Anyone else think this may be the case.
randude said:
Ok, so here is my theory why it is taking Microsoft so long to release updates and bug fixes. I think the Windows Phone team is currently recoding Metro to run on top of Windows 8 instead of Windows CE. All the updates they are talking about down the road will be integrated into the new Windows 8 platform. Anyone else think this may be the case.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That'd be EPIC if it were true.
I'm fairly confident that WP8 will indeed run ontop of Windows 8.
why ?
why would you want wp8 when 7 is still so immature ? a complete rewrite again ? id rather see wp7 mature and actually be updated as promised before a new version was beta'd.
ohgood said:
why would you want wp8 when 7 is still so immature ? a complete rewrite again ? id rather see wp7 mature and actually be updated as promised before a new version was beta'd.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I very much enjoy my WP7 device thank you. There is no reason for me not to want a WP8 next year.
In any case, merging Windows CE and Windows "proper" makes perfect sense. I see no good reason to maintain two completely different codebases (Windows CE and Windows 8) once Windows runs on ARM. In many ways there is no need for a complete rewrite as Windows CE (albeit very old) was always the ARM (or, mobile if you wish) version of Windows - it includes many of the very same underlaying principles.
What many people are missing is that WP7 is not an OS as such, the OS is Windows CE. WP7 is the shell. Porting this to Windows 8 should require much less effort than maintaining WinCE.
Since [most] all third-party WP7 apps are frameworked it also means any existing apps will work on WP8.
If done correctly (and I know, this is Microsoft we are talking about - chances are slim) it would also enable devs to code/design apps for Windows Phone and Windows Slate simultaneously. Rather than offer two different versions the app would adapt to the form-factor it's currently running on.
I think they have to. Especially at the rate the competition is going, they will have to merge. They will have to do it fast, if they want to stay relevant.
from what I've read, many people feel that Microsoft will release "Mango" as 7.5, and then WP8 to coencide with Windows 8...bumping up a version number doesn't mean it's a total rewrite...just that it adds enough features to be considered a major enough update to get a new number. For example, iOS 4 wasn't a rewrite of iOS 3, and android 2.x isn't a total rewrite of android 1.x
vetvito said:
I think they have to. Especially at the rate the competition is going, they will have to merge. They will have to do it fast, if they want to stay relevant.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep, and I'm sure Apple is going to have OS/X on Phones and Tablets next year.
I swear some of you people don't even think this through completely before making such baseless statements.
There's nothing saying they have to merge.
Windows just needed ARM support, which is basically done (and Microsoft probably was working on it for years beforehand - CE already basically worked on ARM and they've supported other platforms in the past) and of course another UI layer which they are working on.
However, this says nothing about the tons of Windows Apps which are optimized for non-touch keyboard+mouse use that will be basically broken on a touchscreen device.
You can use any HP touchscreen computer and see just how clunky a Win32 application is on a touchscreen computer. I don't see a majority of vendors running to revamp their application UIs to support touch, and a UI layer cannot do this on the fly due to the multitude of layouts, etc. used in Win32 applications.
Most vendors will basically have to create a touch and non-touch version of their applications.
That's why Apple is using iOS and not OS/X on their iPad. Icons and Widgets work better on larger tablet screens than Tiles, so while WP7 looks great on phones and certainly scales really well to larger/higher res displays... It would look terribad on a tablet, and lead to a ridiculous amount of wasted screen real estate.
I swear you must have misinterpreted my post.
Who said anything about OSX on a phone?
Jobs already said that wouldn't happen. IOS, WebOS(debatable) , and Android will continue to pave the future. Unless Microsoft does something, and I'm not talking about a Windows 7 tablet.
Windows is slow as hell compared to the competition. Look at Windows Media Center, and loom at Google TV, Apple TV.
ohgood said:
why would you want wp8 when 7 is still so immature ? a complete rewrite again ? id rather see wp7 mature and actually be updated as promised before a new version was beta'd.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That does not explain why MS failed to solve all the bugs listed here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=9153088&postcount=1
the NoDo update, that arrived so late, shall logically have solved must of the above mentioned bugs/issues. But it didn't.
What are MS waiting for? They behave like they have no competitors.
If the applications are all managed code than who cares whether it's WinCE or Win32?
vangrieg said:
If the applications are all managed code than who cares whether it's WinCE or Win32?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are some differences between Silverlight on Windows Phone and Desktop. I believe Silverlight on Windows Phone is a fork of Silverlight 3, whereas the desktop is currently Silverlight 4. It'd be nice to see them converge at Silverlight 5 (crossing fingers for MIX 2011). I've heard plenty of rumors that Microsoft is at work on the compatibility issues.
Sure, but Silverlight can be updated with or without changing the underlying OS.
N8ter said:
I swear some of you people don't even think this through completely before making such baseless statements.
There's nothing saying they have to merge.
Windows just needed ARM support, which is basically done (and Microsoft probably was working on it for years beforehand - CE already basically worked on ARM and they've supported other platforms in the past) and of course another UI layer which they are working on.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're right - there is nothing saying they have to. It makes sense business wise though. Rather than having two teams working full out maintaining two similar yet very different OSes they can have one team working on maintaining one OS running on both platforms.
CE does run on ARM, it has done so for years and it's been in use in the enterprise sector for as long. Problem is, WinCE, even in it's later versions is old tech. Not just from a UI perspective but the core OS is old tech.
N8ter said:
However, this says nothing about the tons of Windows Apps which are optimized for non-touch keyboard+mouse use that will be basically broken on a touchscreen device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They won't be broken. They will function just as they have always done - with a mouse and/or keyboard. You can't take any old Win32 app and run it on ARM anyway, that's not the idea behind it at all.
N8ter said:
Most vendors will basically have to create a touch and non-touch version of their applications.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Again, no. They don't have to do anything of the kind. They can do so to stay relevant - especially if their app is the type of app that would be useful on a tablet, but they don't have to. Just because Win8 will have a tablet specific UI does not mean it will not also have the old desktop UI we're all used to. You need to make a distinction between OS and UI, they are two very different things.
arturobandini said:
That does not explain why MS failed to solve all the bugs listed here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=9153088&postcount=1
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While I agree, there are still some bugs in the OS, NoDo did fix the major ones. Most of the remaining ones are non reproducible or actually "as designed". Also, many of them are not OS bugs but rather bugs that only appear on certain handsets.
PG2G said:
There are some differences between Silverlight on Windows Phone and Desktop. I believe Silverlight on Windows Phone is a fork of Silverlight 3, whereas the desktop is currently Silverlight 4. It'd be nice to see them converge at Silverlight 5 (crossing fingers for MIX 2011). I've heard plenty of rumors that Microsoft is at work on the compatibility issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True, but that's of little concern really. As long as SLx is backwards compatible - which it will be, all existing apps will continue to run just fine. Also, with Silverlight finally coming to the Xbox they have all three screens covered (personally I would have preferred a new iteration of Media Center, but there's still time for that) - TV, Desktop and Mobile. The idea is that we as developers can code/design for the audience rather than the platform. Great things ahead if you ask me.
vetvito said:
I swear you must have misinterpreted my post.
Who said anything about OSX on a phone?
Jobs already said that wouldn't happen. IOS, WebOS(debatable) , and Android will continue to pave the future. Unless Microsoft does something, and I'm not talking about a Windows 7 tablet.
Windows is slow as hell compared to the competition. Look at Windows Media Center, and loom at Google TV, Apple TV.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
AppleTV and GoogleTV are Appliance products. Microsoft did have a TV thing a while back, but that's another story. Windows Media Center is fine.
If people aren't expecting Apple to put OS/X on tablets, etc. Why would you make a statement basically they have no choice but to merge WP7 and Windows eventually?
Also, I was talking about Windows 8 (which runs on ARM, and is coming with touch UI), not Windows 7...
N8ter said:
AppleTV and GoogleTV are Appliance products. Microsoft did have a TV thing a while back, but that's another story. Windows Media Center is fine.
If people aren't expecting Apple to put OS/X on tablets, etc. Why would you make a statement basically they have no choice but to merge WP7 and Windows eventually?
Also, I was talking about Windows 8 (which runs on ARM, and is coming with touch UI), not Windows 7...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My choice of words was wrong. My bad. I was meaning that they should do something, something faster than what they are doing. Phones are moving closer and closer to PC capabilities.
Windows Media Center sucks balls compared to Google TV, and Apple TV. I'm seriously thinking about throwing my HTPC out the window. Its embarrassing. I mentioned it because Microsoft basically invented this market, and now they've been left behind. Sort of like what's going on now.
vetvito said:
Windows Media Center sucks balls compared to Google TV, and Apple TV. I'm seriously thinking about throwing my HTPC out the window. Its embarrassing. I mentioned it because Microsoft basically invented this market, and now they've been left behind. Sort of like what's going on now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Windows Media Center is still the absolute best platform out there. Google TV has nothing on MC7. That said, they [MS] have definitely mismanaged the "platform", I say "platform" because Microsoft never saw it as a platform (God knows why?!). WES (Windows Embedded - which is basically a modularized version of Windows 7) should change this though. There were a few MC7 appliances on show at CES earlier this year and if they can deliver they will kill the competition.
From a WAF perspective nothing is close to MC7. From a live TV perspective the other platforms aren't even in the same ballpark.
emigrating said:
Windows Media Center is still the absolute best platform out there. Google TV has nothing on MC7. That said, they [MS] have definitely mismanaged the "platform", I say "platform" because Microsoft never saw it as a platform (God knows why?!). WES (Windows Embedded - which is basically a modularized version of Windows 7) should change this though. There were a few MC7 appliances on show at CES earlier this year and if they can deliver they will kill the competition.
From a WAF perspective nothing is close to MC7. From a live TV perspective the other platforms aren't even in the same ballpark.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd like to know more. Honestly elaborate more. Media Center is awfully slow compared to Google TV. I don't have a gtv, but I demoed it. You can search for shows and the web in a overlay of what you're currently watching on gtv. On my HTPC running windows 7, that's impossible. Starting Media Center is unbelievably slow, and browsing through media in media center is not fun. Its laggy as hell. On GTV its instant.
vetvito said:
I'd like to know more. Honestly elaborate more. Media Center is awfully slow compared to Google TV. I don't have a gtv, but I demoed it. You can search for shows and the web in a overlay of what you're currently watching on gtv. On my HTPC running windows 7, that's impossible. Starting Media Center is unbelievably slow, and browsing through media in media center is not fun. Its laggy as hell. On GTV its instant.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you find MC7 to be slow there is a problem with your machine (either hardware or software wise). I'm running it on several HTPCs in the house and there is no lag what so ever.
Comparing it to Google TV is kind of like comparing apples and oranges. They are both fruits, but that's pretty much it. Google TV does not have a live TV option as such - you have to feed the output of your DVR or whatever thru the gtv box. MC7 on the other hand accepts tuners (either local or remote) and acts as your DVR.
If you press the Guide button on your MC7 remote while watching TV it will overlay ontop of what you're watching, exactly like gtv. The guide is also one of the best in the industry (depending on your location of course). You also get [some] internet TV built in, but more can be added by installing a Hulu plugin. In addition you have Netflix etc.
I will agree that browsing the media on MC7 using the built-in functionality is rather lacking, but there are plenty of third-party apps that help with this. myTV is great for downloaded/recorded TV shows and My Movies is great for movies.
I've been using HTPCs for around 10 years and MC7 is IMO still the best option available and I've tried them all - multiple times
I'm running on a AMD 6000, dual core 3.2 ghz. 4gb of ram. That's more than enough for media.
Have you tried XBMC? It runs circles around Media Center. I haven't tried those plugins you mentioned, I will do that today.
Source
Research from Kantar WorldPanel on Tuesday showed Android gaining share strongly in most of seven major markets - Australia, Britain, France, Germany, Italy, Spain and the United States - in the 12 weeks to mid April.
...
Windows' share in Germany more than doubled to 6 percent over the past year, and climbed to 3-4 percent in Britain, France, Italy and the United States.
These gains came at the expense of Nokia's Symbian platform and Canadian BlackBerry maker Research In Motion, the biggest market share losers. RIM's share in the U.S. market dropped to just 3 percent from 9 percent a year earlier.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We do not know if that is all Windows platforms, or only Windows Phone. Previous share numbers put Windows phone at 2% so maybe that is only Windows Phone. But no matter how you spin it, Nokia has made some kind of impact with the Lumia series. And the Germany numbers would not include the Lumia 900 either.
Windows Phone is gaining momentum! One day, sometime in the future, the forum will no longer have to be ridiculed for poor sales numbers. I wonder what will be the next reason why not to own a Windows Phone?
nicksti said:
Windows Phone is gaining momentum! One day, sometime in the future, the forum will no longer have to be ridiculed for poor sales numbers. I wonder what will be the next reason why not to own a Windows Phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Itz no open source, evil! It can't play Crash Bandicoot!1
And more.
Sent from my Lumia 800 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Itz no open source, evil!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So is iPhone.
I'm not trying to be illogical, But the experience I have with my window phone (Mozart 7) is far better than what I had with any Android phone.
Although Windows Phone still has a long way to go (mainly apps in marketplace are not comparable to Apple/Android market figures) But I think WP will be a real competitor for iPhone/Android in near future.
Kamyar.P said:
So is iPhone.
I'm not trying to be illogical, But the experience I have with my window phone (Mozart 7) is far better than what I had with any Android phone.
Although Windows Phone still has a long way to go (mainly apps in marketplace are not comparable to Apple/Android market figures) But I think WP will be a real competitor for iPhone/Android in near future.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think he was sarcastic.
No normal user should care about opensourceness.
Most of the programs I like more are closed source.
dragonide said:
I think he was sarcastic.
No normal user should care about opensourceness.
Most of the programs I like more are closed source.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's it, sarcasm that is also, most people don't know that Android isn't really open source: you can't access the repositories on which gdevs are working. Also, nobody ever gives a crap about bug reports/feature requests, and most issue are left pending and unaddressed. The AOSP project is ran in a not so opened source after all: the code shared is generally partial and you have no access whatsoever to what is actually worked on. Chrome, for example, is instead an open source project, and is actually ran as such. Too bad it sucks because it's a resource whore, despite being probably the fastest guy in town. However I agree, most of my favourite programs are closed source too. Woops, this is very off topic btw
Sent from my Lumia 800 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
nicksti said:
Source
We do not know if that is all Windows platforms, or only Windows Phone. Previous share numbers put Windows phone at 2% so maybe that is only Windows Phone. But no matter how you spin it, Nokia has made some kind of impact with the Lumia series. And the Germany numbers would not include the Lumia 900 either.
Windows Phone is gaining momentum! One day, sometime in the future, the forum will no longer have to be ridiculed for poor sales numbers. I wonder what will be the next reason why not to own a Windows Phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Interesting stuff in the comments from your link:
(Reuters) – Nokia launched two low-end cellphones on Tuesday, aiming to regain its footing in emerging markets.
Operating system: Symbian Series 40
Windows Phone market share is so tiny, Nielsen doesn’t even list it “The bad news for Windows Phone market share continues: In a recent report, Windows Phone market share was so small in the U.S. that the well-known research firm Nielsen didn’t even bother to break out its usage,” Preston Gralla reports for Computerworld. (Friday, March 30, 2012)
Could Linux still usurp Windows Phone as Nokia’s saviour?
http://www.techrepublic.com/blog/eu...ill-usurp-windows-phone-as-nokias-saviour/560
Elsop told a group of engineers in Berlin last year that the goal is once again to “find that next big thing that blows away Apple, Android, and everything we’re doing with Microsoft right now, and makes it irrelevant – all of it. So go for it, without having to worry about saving Nokia’s rear end in the next 12 months. I’ve taken off the handcuffs.” The product in development is known as Meltemi, a Linux-based OS, which was referenced in a memo leaked to the The Wall Street Journal last year.
Honestly I don't even care that much about WP7 anymore...I mean (don't get me wrong) I don't want it to die because I really like it and it's the perfect fit for me now. What really matters to me now tho is that with this Lumia phone I'm in love with Nokia back again. I don't even care about apps anymore, as far as I have a functional phone with a good browser and a twitter client I'm more than fine. If Nokia keeps making WP devices with Lumia like quality and above then good, I'll buy them, if Nokia starts making N9 like Linux based devices I'll buy them as well, maybe I'd like them even more. Just gimme Nokia phones please, I'm hooked. Hopefully I'm not the only one...
Sent from my Lumia 800 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
We can only hope that more people come to understand the ease of use of wp, the message will spread more quickly.
Window Phones just overtakes iPhone marketshare in China.
http://www.gsmarena.com/wp_reportedly_overtakes_iphone_in_china_with_7_of_market-news-4268.php
I see a lot more people with windows phones these days than I did before Nokia released their windows phone.
Sent from my Lumia 800 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Hey guys, just came here as I've been using an LG Optimus 7 for about a week now. Now I don't want to get into any arguments, I just want to share my thoughts.
I personally am not a fan of WP7 (actually that's a massive understatement). I have no doubt that for some users it's just fine, but not me. I'm an Android user and the reason I'm using this phone right now is because I'm in between phones and this is a work phone.
For me, there are too many UI and UX idiosyncrasies for me to be able to like WP7. The tiles are an interesting approach, but on a small screen device it fails. It feels very claustrophobic for me; as if you're looking at a large sheet of paper but only have a small window to look through.
The lock screen leaves something to be desired also. I'm disappointed that a pin password is the only way to password protect your phone. I miss pattern unlock.
The keyboard, while good at autocorrect, cannot compare to Swype, which I also miss dearly. I absolutely loath tapping on a virtual keyboard now that I've been using Swype for over a year.
Please take no offence to this but if I had to describe WP7 it would be a very advanced feature phone, or a very simple smartphone. And by "simple" I don't mean easy to use, I mean limited functionality. Random example: In the browser, when I find a phone number online, I cannot just click on it and choose to automatically call it like on Android. Furthermore, I cannot even copy the text on the website and paste it into the dialing app like on Android. So I'm forced to either memorize the number or jot it down on a piece of paper and then recite it in the dialing app. Not very "smartphone-ish". People talk about how Android is only for "advanced users" but in all seriousness Android does most of, if not all, the simple things much more intuitively than any other device (IMO).
If I had to say one thing that my WP7 device did well, was Bluetooth connection and syncing with my F150's radio. But then again, that's a Microsoft Sync product, so I would expect no less. Edit: Oh, and voice commands. It actually does voice commands fairly nicely without any extra software.
But I would like to hear from everyone else, explicitly what they like about WP7 over iPhone or Android (we're not including Blackberry, why bother.).
cbstryker said:
I personally am not a fan of WP7 (actually that's a massive understatement).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
cbstryker said:
I'm an Android user...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm curious. I don't go over the the Andriod forums since I'm exclusively a Windows Phone user at the moment. Do you guys have a lot of Windows Phone users coming over there and thread crapping?
cbstryker said:
For me, there are too many UI and UX idiosyncrasies for me to be able to like WP7.
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That's why there are multiple OS. It is impossible to make an OS that EVERYONE will love. Most people who sit down and look at all the major OS interfaces agree that the Windows Phone interface is clean and easy to read compared to others.
cbstryker said:
The tiles are an interesting approach, but on a small screen device it fails.
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If you feel constricted buy a bigger screen. Windows Phone devices come in a variety of sizes. There is even rumored to be a Galaxy Note in the works.
cbstryker said:
I'm disappointed that a pin password is the only way to password protect your phone. I miss pattern unlock.
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Billions of people have lived just fine with pin unlock. Furthermore I see no reason why a future iteration of Windows Phone wouldn't have pattern unlock. A whole new OS is about to drop in <1 year. At this stage there is no way of knowing what Windows Phone will and will not have in 6-8 months.
cbstryker said:
Please take no offence...
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No one is offended we are just curios why seemingly happy Andriod users feel the need to continual thread crap in our forum. I have never had any need to post in an Andriod forum. Do you get the feeling one of us is insecure?
cbstryker said:
Please take no offence to this but if I had to describe WP7 it would be a very advanced feature phone, or a very simple smartphone. And by "simple" I don't mean easy to use, I mean limited functionality. Random example: In the browser, when I find a phone number online, I cannot just click on it and choose to automatically call it like on Android. Furthermore, I cannot even copy the text on the website and paste it into the dialing app like on Android. So I'm forced to either memorize the number or jot it down on a piece of paper and then recite it in the dialing app. Not very "smartphone-ish". People talk about how Android is only for "advanced users" but in all seriousness Android does most of, if not all, the simple things much more intuitively than any other device (IMO).
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Windows Phone is a newer operating system and functionality is being added incrementally. A whole new OS is going to drop in <1 yr. Your post is going to look silly in a matter of months. I like the Windows Phone OS. I like the hardware. I like the fact that my Lumia 900 works smoothly out of the box with no tweaks. I don't have to brag about how many cores it has because it doesn't matter. When I see an Andriod phone with twice the number of cores doing its stutter and lag routine I don't feel bad for the owner.
sitizenx said:
I'm curious. I don't go over the the Andriod forums since I'm exclusively a Windows Phone user at the moment. Do you guys have a lot of Windows Phone users coming over there and thread crapping?
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I can't speak for other users out there. Frankly, they just sound like trolls. That's not at all what I'm doing here. I have genuinely been using a Windows Phone exclusively for a week and I wanted to dig in to some of the forums to see what kind of tweaks or hints I can find, and then I found this thread. So I'm not just a random Android Fanboy coming here to "thread crap".
sitizenx said:
I like the fact that my Lumia 900 works smoothly out of the box with no tweaks. I don't have to brag about how many cores it has because it doesn't matter. When I see an Andriod phone with twice the number of cores doing its stutter and lag routine I don't feel bad for the owner.
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My Android phone (the one being repaired) has only a single core and is smooth as butter. This whole "my phone is smoother than yours" flack is nothing but non-sense. This phone I've been using has lagged on me plenty of times and I've even had plenty of iPhones lag on me also. Pointless argument.
Edit: This guy is exactly the type of person I was trying to avoid. All I wanted was the opinions of WP7 enthusiasts as to why they like their platform of choice. Not some 15 year old that can only resort to verbal attacks.
cbstryker said:
I can't speak for other users out there. Frankly, they just sound like trolls. That's not at all what I'm doing here. I have genuinely been using a Windows Phone exclusively for a week...
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By your own admission you are an android user that is only temporarily using a work phone for a few days and not by choice. Not sure how that makes you any different from all the other Andriod users that have dropped by to say hi.
cbstryker said:
My Android phone (the one being repaired) has only a single core and is smooth as butter.
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The whole "core" thing was me just making fun of the Andriod conversations I've accidentally stumble across. This forum is littered with them. Windows Phone just takes a different approach to the whole smartphone thing in a number of ways. I wouldn't expect a committed Android user to pick up on the differences let alone appreciate them in a handful of days especially if he was involuntarily forced to use Windows Phone.
cbstryker said:
Wow, dude. Just wow....
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We could say the same thing about you. How many Andriod vs Windows Phone threads have to be locked by the mods before Andriod users get the message?
cbstryker said:
Edit: This guy is exactly the type of person I was trying to avoid...
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A Windows Phone 7 forum is an odd place to hide out from Windows Phone users.
Bottom line, A whole new OS is going to drop in <1yr. You have just wasted your time and our time critiquing a bunch of issues that may very well be moot in a matter of months. Unlike you we didn't have our Windows Phones forced on us for a few days. We made a conscious decision after evaluating our options to buy the phone we felt would best suit our needs for the next 2 years.
I don't like Andriod and I don't like iOS. But I don't go to those forums and start telling everyone who owns the phone my opinion. A lot of the decision regarding what phone someone ultimately ends up using is subjective. All OSes have pros and cons. I could easily cherry pick a few pros and cons and post over in the Andriod forum. I don't and there is a reason for that.
cbstryker said:
Hey guys, just came here as I've been using an LG Optimus 7 for about a week now. Now I don't want to get into any arguments, I just want to share my thoughts.
I personally am not a fan of WP7 (actually that's a massive understatement). I have no doubt that for some users it's just fine, but not me. I'm an Android user and the reason I'm using this phone right now is because I'm in between phones and this is a work phone.
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And in general there is absolutely no problem with that in the Windows Phone forum.
I can see why Metro UI would not be appealing to everyone. I personally find it to be less attractive than what Android can be with all the custom roms, but more useable than any OS on the market. It is the perfect blend of simplicity and functionality and i have owned an iPhone and owned/used quite a few different Android phones from different OEMs.
Sitizenx is being a little blunt. Well alot blunt But I want to let you know where Sit is coming from:
"Windows Phone is dead"
"Marketshare/Sales are pathetic"
"Apps are missing/inferior/overpriced"
"Hardware is a joke"
It is that last one that is the motivation behind his self-pleasuring retort. Out of curiousity, which single core Android phone did you use that was smooth? Nexus S? i am sure there are smooth droids out there, but there are quite a few that just are not and it is laughable based on the hardware that goes into some of there phones.
But it is quite okay for you to not like Windows Phone. Some of your issues can be resolved, some also apply to the iPhone (swype, pattern unlock).
Btw, that borrowed data parsing feature to recognize emails/numbers and pick the appropriate task is what got HTC banned
This whole bashing on Windows Phone, or iOS or whatever is such a waste of time and energy. I can think of a dozen things off the bat to be more constructive with. We really need to get off this "fanboy" mentality.
To each his/her own. Master your domain and work within it if you enjoy it. Simple.
Just MHO.
cbstryker said:
In the browser, when I find a phone number online, I cannot just click on it and choose to automatically call it like on Android. Furthermore, I cannot even copy the text on the website and paste it into the dialing app like on Android.
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That's a patent issue. Microsoft is forced to leave this feature out of WP7. You can thank Apple for that.
And why should be a pattern unlock better/safer? I find it easier to memorize a pattern when someone unlocks his phone.
Energata said:
This whole bashing on Windows Phone, or iOS or whatever is such a waste of time and energy. I can think of a dozen things off the bat to be more constructive with. We really need to get off this "fanboy" mentality.
To each his/her own. Master your domain and work within it if you enjoy it. Simple.
Just MHO.
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For a first timer, you have a mighty good outlook Good to see. Welcome to the forums.
Let's not get too side-tracked in here, quit the baiting, and get back on-topic
cbstryker said:
Hey guys, just came here as I've been using an LG Optimus 7 for about a week now. Now I don't want to get into any arguments, I just want to share my thoughts.
Please take no offence to this but if I had to describe WP7 it would be a very advanced feature phone, or a very simple smartphone. And by "simple" I don't mean easy to use, I mean limited functionality. Random example: In the browser, when I find a phone number online, I cannot just click on it and choose to automatically call it like on Android. Furthermore, I cannot even copy the text on the website and paste it into the dialing app like on Android. So I'm forced to either memorize the number or jot it down on a piece of paper and then recite it in the dialing app. Not very "smartphone-ish". People talk about how Android is only for "advanced users" but in all seriousness Android does most of, if not all, the simple things much more intuitively than any other device (IMO).
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Just with reference to your example there... that is not a limitation of Windows Phone... that's a limitation in the default settings for Canada specifically. I'm in Canada with a Samsung Focus (also on Telus) and I can click on phone and street addresses in the web browser to have them open in the dialer or map program on Windows Phone. You just have to go into "Settings/Region+Language" and set your "Region format" to "English (United States)". You should then have clickable links for telephone numbers and street addresses. While you're there, change your "Browser and search language" to "English (United States)" to enable local scout in Canada.
The limitation on copy/pasting a number into the dialer is a legitimate gripe - copying the number is easy, but there is no paste option from the dialer.
cbstryker said:
Hey guys, just came here as I've been using an LG Optimus 7 for about a week now. Now I don't want to get into any arguments, I just want to share my thoughts.
I personally am not a fan of WP7 (actually that's a massive understatement). I have no doubt that for some users it's just fine, but not me. I'm an Android user and the reason I'm using this phone right now is because I'm in between phones and this is a work phone.
For me, there are too many UI and UX idiosyncrasies for me to be able to like WP7. The tiles are an interesting approach, but on a small screen device it fails. It feels very claustrophobic for me; as if you're looking at a large sheet of paper but only have a small window to look through.
The lock screen leaves something to be desired also. I'm disappointed that a pin password is the only way to password protect your phone. I miss pattern unlock.
The keyboard, while good at autocorrect, cannot compare to Swype, which I also miss dearly. I absolutely loath tapping on a virtual keyboard now that I've been using Swype for over a year.
Please take no offence to this but if I had to describe WP7 it would be a very advanced feature phone, or a very simple smartphone. And by "simple" I don't mean easy to use, I mean limited functionality. Random example: In the browser, when I find a phone number online, I cannot just click on it and choose to automatically call it like on Android. Furthermore, I cannot even copy the text on the website and paste it into the dialing app like on Android. So I'm forced to either memorize the number or jot it down on a piece of paper and then recite it in the dialing app. Not very "smartphone-ish". People talk about how Android is only for "advanced users" but in all seriousness Android does most of, if not all, the simple things much more intuitively than any other device (IMO).
If I had to say one thing that my WP7 device did well, was Bluetooth connection and syncing with my F150's radio. But then again, that's a Microsoft Sync product, so I would expect no less. Edit: Oh, and voice commands. It actually does voice commands fairly nicely without any extra software.
But I would like to hear from everyone else, explicitly what they like about WP7 over iPhone or Android (we're not including Blackberry, why bother.).
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The simple ui, the difference of the ui, and the huge microsoft stamp on it. its lacking in hardware and app developement, but apparently folks just accept the shortcomings, or don't care.
Id imagine working the price of a phone into a ford vehicle wouldn't be difficult, surprised it hasn't happened yet.
Sitizen's comments revolve around accusations of androidfanism and the future release to be expected. Unfortunately, neither are relevant today.
The sales information is interesting though. Apparently china likes it, or there is some promotion prompting sales with very cheap devices, dunno, I don't live there.
I'm still not seeing any wp7 devices around town, bars, etc. I've never seen one in a motorcycling buddies hand. Those are alllll iphones or the latest android, for the obvious mapping and navigation reasons.