Develop Bugs

[Q] post/pre OTA explaination?

Could someone explain or point me in the direction of an explanation for how installing a custom rom affected automatic updates, as well as the difference between pre and post ota, and why we can't install a pure clean android 2.2 installation in our phones. I am relatively new to this, but did alot of iPhone hacking before.. I've already rooted, S-OFF and flashed a few different roms having my phone 2 weeks and new to android hope someone can explain, thanks :_)

When you flash a custom ROM, you will no longer get the automatic updates OTA. Either you will have to revert to the stock ROM for the update, or the ROM developer will have to incorporate the OTA update changes into the ROM.
There are a few ROMs that attempt to give you a plain vanilla Android experience. But in my opinion, Cyanogen is one of the best mixes of plain Android with lots of extra features.

Okay that makes sense, I'm currently using a villian rom with no sense, is it worth my while installing cyanogen? and if so will i go with RC4 of wait for the stable release?

jakbjak said:
Could someone explain or point me in the direction of an explanation for how installing a custom rom affected automatic updates, as well as the difference between pre and post ota, and why we can't install a pure clean android 2.2 installation in our phones. I am relatively new to this, but did alot of iPhone hacking before.. I've already rooted, S-OFF and flashed a few different roms having my phone 2 weeks and new to android hope someone can explain, thanks :_)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, the reason for many semi-bricks from trying to downgrade to original stock rom pre- or post-OTA was the fact that hboot was hacked, and not truly "S-OFF." If you search the dev section you will find the S-OFF, SIM unlock, SuperCID guide that will give you true S-OFF. I recommend reading that--it helped elucidate why semi-bricks were showing up. Once this is done, it should be easy to flash a rooted, stock ROM when the OTAs start showing up and get the update that way, or just wait for it appear in the forums (which is usually sooner than the OTA gets pushed out, anyhow).

So the S-OFF I have isn't complete? Not that I need a sim unlock as I bought the phone off contract, but it's worth my while getting the true S-OFF? Thanks for all ye're help, there are so many people talking about these things in every section it's hard to pull a search of a simple explanation,

jakbjak said:
So the S-OFF I have isn't complete? Not that I need a sim unlock as I bought the phone off contract, but it's worth my while getting the true S-OFF? Thanks for all ye're help, there are so many people talking about these things in every section it's hard to pull a search of a simple explanation,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, the previous S-OFF was via an engineering version of HBOOT, which was set to report S-OFF. But the security setting is actually held in the radio, and was still S-ON.
The new, "true" S-OFF (via gfree) is a lot safer than the old method, e.g. much less prone to a brick if you flash the wrong thing (e.g. an older RUU than the ROM you're running).

[WARNING] Do not flash a new official RUU/ROM/OTA if you have root and/or S-OFF

DO NOT FLASH A NEW RUU OR OFFICIAL ROM IMAGE UNLESS YOU *REALLY* KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING !
Sorry for shouting, but this is very important. Thanks to the mods for making this sticky.
The latest official RUU that has been released - http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=870369 - has been found to break the existing methods of rooting and getting full S-OFF.
This shouldn't be a big suprise, because when HTC saw that the amazing devs on XDA had cracked the existing security, we should expect them to put something even tougher in later releases.
So flashing any later release, whether that's an official RUU or just the ROM image (PC10IMG.zip) is a very dangerous thing to do until it has been fully tested and "cleared" by the devs here. i.e. your previously rooted and S-OFF'd phone might lose root and go back to S-ON, and be unable to be rooted and S-OFF'd again.
It's of course fine if your phone came with a particular ROM release to flash that *exact same* release back onto the phone if you want to return to stock. What I'm referring to is flashing a brand new release that isn't the one that came with your phone.
It's fine to flash custom ROMs of course, because those have already been tested out. In general, it's probably best to steer very clear of new official releases, and wait till the devs have pulled them apart and put any cool new stuff into a custom ROM. Then you know it'll be safe to flash.
Currently I don't think it's entirely clear what just flashing a new *radio* on its own will do, as opposed to the entire ROM/RUU. That's still being worked on. But steer clear of even that if you're not sure what you're doing or dont' want to take any chances of losing root/S-OFF.
Thanks for reading

Thanks for the heads up.

I flashed the ROM you mentioned.
For those who want to try:
Just remember to get REAL S-OFF using gfree before flashing it.
This provide you a medicine for regret. You can get back to WWE ROM using WWE RUU and root/recover your old ROM.

What is RUU? What is it to do with ROMs? Did HTC provide a change log for newer Radio? Or does anyone know what changes are , in the latest Radio?
Just to be clear. Don’t flame me for this please. I’m still learning just like many others in here.

androidtoy09 said:
What is RUU? What is it to do with ROMs? Did HTC provide a change log for newer Radio? Or does anyone know what changes are , in the latest Radio?
Just to be clear. Don’t flame me for this please. I’m still learning just like many others in here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We don't have a changelog, no.
RUU is ROM Update Utility. It's a program to run on Windows (.exe) which flashes your new ROM for you, and holds your hand through the process. It's possible to extract just the ROM zip file from the exe so you can flash it yourself if you want.
The thing about the RUU and stock ROMs is that they will flash pretty much *everything* on your phone. So as well as a new system partition (the main stuff for Android), you'll probably get a new hboot, new radio, new recovery. Those *might* all have increased security which is a lot more difficult to crack. So generally you should not flash it until we know it's "safe" to do so, i.e. it can be re-rooted and S-OFF'd etc.

steviewevie said:
We don't have a changelog, no.
RUU is ROM Update Utility. It's a program to run on Windows (.exe) which flashes your new ROM for you, and holds your hand through the process. It's possible to extract just the ROM zip file from the exe so you can flash it yourself if you want.
The thing about the RUU and stock ROMs is that they will flash pretty much *everything* on your phone. So as well as a new system partition (the main stuff for Android), you'll probably get a new hboot, new radio, new recovery. Those *might* all have increased security which is a lot more difficult to crack. So generally you should not flash it until we know it's "safe" to do so, i.e. it can be re-rooted and S-OFF'd etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok, thanks for clearing it up. So, RUU is pretty much similar to the method RIM uses to flash its OS on the Blackberries.

Im a little confused here.. So just to clear some things up i hope someone will answer these questions i have.
I have the software on my Desire Z that it came with (1.34.405.5), which i've rooted, S-off'ed and installed another kernel for OC porpuses. This is working fine, but lets say that i wanted to try another rom .. After some time i decide to go back to the stock software and then update to the newest software, would that be a problem? And has HTC released some newer software than the one iam using?

If you flashed back to stock, that would be fine. But if you flashed a new official update (e.g OTA), then you run the risk of installing something that you can't root/S-OFF.
It is best to steer clear of any official upgrades until they've been checked by the devs here and been given the all-clear.
Given that the phone came with certain areas write-protected, and the devs managed to crack that, we should be expecting HTC to release an even more secure update.
Yes, there is a new ROM out, at the moment for Egypt, that seems to have increased security. It would not be a suprise if HTC rolled out similar security as an OTA update for all existing ROMs. Right now there is something in that Egypt ROM (probably the hboot, at the minimum) which mean existing permanent root and S-OFF methods fail. It may be this is easily cracked again, or maybe it will take some time, who knows.
Bottom line - don't apply any official updates to your phone if it is rooted/S-OFF or you plan to root/S-OFF.
Sent from my HTC Desire Z

perm-rooted g2 stock tmobile rom s-off
ok, my question is....i perm-rooted my g2 and have s-off, does this mean that i cant except the new gingerbread OTA update? ive had my fill of flashing roms with my old windows phone.. att tilt, tmobile touch pro 2, and tmobile hd2. im not looking to flash my g2 with a new rom...no offense to the chefs. love there work. but i only rooted the g2 to get rid of the bs apps that tmobile and google added to the phone. and i thought i heard that wen u root the phone tmobile cant tell wen u tether, so there for no more throttle b/s but thats not true...i must have miss read. but i would like to stay w/the stock rom and still b able to install the Gingerbread OTA. please someone provide an answer for me or point me in the right direction. thank you in advance.... sorry if the answer is already provided somewhere and i over looked it, i tend to do that a lot.

blitz69 said:
ok, my question is....i perm-rooted my g2 and have s-off, does this mean that i cant except the new gingerbread OTA update? ive had my fill of flashing roms with my old windows phone.. att tilt, tmobile touch pro 2, and tmobile hd2. im not looking to flash my g2 with a new rom...no offense to the chefs. love there work. but i only rooted the g2 to get rid of the bs apps that tmobile and google added to the phone. and i thought i heard that wen u root the phone tmobile cant tell wen u tether, so there for no more throttle b/s but thats not true...i must have miss read. but i would like to stay w/the stock rom and still b able to install the Gingerbread OTA. please someone provide an answer for me or point me in the right direction. thank you in advance.... sorry if the answer is already provided somewhere and i over looked it, i tend to do that a lot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The trouble is, HTC/T-Mobile don't want you to root and/or S-OFF your phone, because it's a lot easier to end up bricking the phone if you don't know what you're doing. They put greatly increased security on the G2/DZ/DHD when they came out, in order to help prevent this.
Now this security has been cracked, we can expect HTC/T-Mobile to try and increase security even further (e.g. closing loopholes that let our current methods of root/S-OFF work) in future updates.
So if you accept any future OTA, you run a high risk of accepting something that will lock you out of root and S-OFF, at least temporarily, and possibly permanently (depending on how good a solution they come up with).
If you are not bothered about root/S-OFF, then that's fine of course.
This doesn't mean that you necessarily have to switch to a custom ROM to get updates though. If you stay with the stock ROM (and I'm still on a stock ROM too right now), then just do not accept the update when an OTA comes out, and keep checking these forums to see when the devs say that they can root/S-OFF with the new version. When they say it's ok then you know you can apply the update and still get root/S-OFF.
This already happened with the G2. Very soon after release, but after rooting had been achieved, there was an OTA. Most people here decided to wait until the OTA had been looked at, and sure enough there was a small adjustment needed to the rooting method. But of course this OTA was before HTC had a chance to respond to the cracking of the security, so as I said, any future updates may well require a lot more time and effort from the devs to investigate and crack again.

Ok. Thank you very much

Will this muff up my phone if I factory reset it by using the Power+Volume Down option?

Ok,there is a new gfree method to get root and S-Off.
And gfree can now also be used to set radio S-ON.
But what about the backup "part7backup-1291675121.bin"
which gfree created at my sdcard?
No longer needed?
And with the new root and S-Off method,is it now possible to
to flash stock RUU 1.34.405.5 to get all original?
Because with old UBERROOT method this doesn`t work!

Ganii said:
Ok,there is a new gfree method to get root and S-Off.
And gfree can now also be used to set radio S-ON.
But what about the backup "part7backup-1291675121.bin"
which gfree created at my sdcard?
No longer needed?
And with the new root and S-Off method,is it now possible to
to flash stock RUU 1.34.405.5 to get all original?
Because with old UBERROOT method this doesn`t work!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What do you mean with gfree?
Is my waranty broken When i execute radio s-off?
Is it possible to make it radio s-on?

Yes,warranty is broken,but with the new gfree method
you can go back to S-ON:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/wiki/index.php?title=HTC_Vision#Rooting_the_G2

ericjosepi said:
Will this muff up my phone if I factory reset it by using the Power+Volume Down option?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you do a factory reset then I think you'll lose root, but you can get it back again easily enough. The issue for this thread is flashing new updated stuff from HTC etc.

Ganii said:
Ok,there is a new gfree method to get root and S-Off.
And gfree can now also be used to set radio S-ON.
But what about the backup "part7backup-1291675121.bin"
which gfree created at my sdcard?
No longer needed?
And with the new root and S-Off method,is it now possible to
to flash stock RUU 1.34.405.5 to get all original?
Because with old UBERROOT method this doesn`t work!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You might still need that backup, e.g. if you don't know what your old CID was and you want to un-do that bit too. I would keep it.
Sorry I don't think I understand your last question though, or why you say the uberroot method (I'm personally not keen on that name, it's just the usual method using Visionary/rage with gfree, not a new method) doesn't work.

Ok,so I can go back to S-ON with gfree commands from here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/wiki/index.php?title=HTC_Vision#Rooting_the_G2
If you are only interested in permanent root you only need radio S-OFF and then it is sufficient to use
# ./gfree -s off
instead of
# ./gfree -f
in the following commands.
And gfree can now also be used to set radio S-ON by using the "-s on" option and to change the CID back to the original value be using i.e. "-c T-MOB010" if you want or have to go back.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But for CID (you mean SuperCid right?) I need the backup?
And with the last question which you don`t understand,I mean
with flashing the HTC RUU 1.34.405.5 I don`t go back to S-ON
and original CID whether I use UBERROT method or this from here:
(Rooting the Vision (G2/DZ) and DHD)
http://forum.xda-developers.com/wiki/index.php?title=HTC_Vision#Rooting_the_G2

Thanks for the advice, I will stick myself with the current rom for a while

Ganii said:
Ok,so I can go back to S-ON with gfree commands from here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/wiki/index.php?title=HTC_Vision#Rooting_the_G2
But for CID (you mean SuperCid right?) I need the backup?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, I mean to go from your SuperCID back to your regular CID. You might not know what your original CID was.
And with the last question which you don`t understand,I mean
with flashing the HTC RUU 1.34.405.5 I don`t go back to S-ON
and original CID whether I use UBERROT method or this from here:
(Rooting the Vision (G2/DZ) and DHD)
http://forum.xda-developers.com/wiki/index.php?title=HTC_Vision#Rooting_the_G2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, if you flash a stock ROM then it won't affect your S-OFF and CID status (or SIM unlock). These are stored in your radio configuration partition, and not in any of the partitions which are overwritten by the ROM flash.

[Q] stock update S-OFF phone

I've used the search but frankly, the vBulletin search still sucks after all these years.
I rooted the phone following this guide. Now my phone says a system update is available.
Since I would like to install it (my phone is still 1.34, I think. The latest version should be 1.72, right?) and installing a stock update onto a S-OFF phone is highly inadvisable (I've read), how do I go about this?
I have Visionary installed but it says the phone does not appear rooted, even though it is (just checked).
I'm sure there have been others with similar questions and I just couldn't find the right thread. If so, please point me in the right direction.
Regards and thank you,

Kokuyo said:
I've used the search but frankly, the vBulletin search still sucks after all these years.
I rooted the phone following this guide. Now my phone says a system update is available.
Since I would like to install it (my phone is still 1.34, I think. The latest version should be 1.72, right?) and installing a stock update onto a S-OFF phone is highly inadvisable (I've read), how do I go about this?
I have Visionary installed but it says the phone does not appear rooted, even though it is (just checked).
I'm sure there have been others with similar questions and I just couldn't find the right thread. If so, please point me in the right direction.
Regards and thank you,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why did you root your phone? There is no need to update your phone to the latest OTA update if you are wanting to install custom ROMs.

Because I was testing custom mods and wanted to go back to stock?

Kokuyo said:
Because I was testing custom mods and wanted to go back to stock?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ahhh, I thought you had just rooted it. I updated the day after I received my new phone. I had problems with bluetooth (music wouldn't resume after ending phone calls) and wound up here on the XDA forums looking for answers. I ended up rooting my phone, installing CM6 and now CM7 and never looked back. There is no bluetooth switching problems using CM builds so I'm happy.

Found this:
http://www.thinkthinkdo.com/trac/project1/wiki/back_to_stock

Thanks, that looks interesting. Now the only question: Do I need my original CID? And if so, how do I find it now that the CID has been changed by gfree?

That link is about a procedure to restore the stock G2 ROM. Since you seem to have a DZ ROM, I'm not sure if you want to flash a G2 ROM (though the other bits might be useful).
The 1.72 OTA update has been rootable for some time now, so you can safely accept the update if you want. But it might be easier just to flash the 1.72 ROM in its entireity (you can get it from the dev forum).
With SuperCID and S-OFF you should have no problems flashing 1.72.

steviewevie said:
With SuperCID and S-OFF you should have no problems flashing 1.72.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really? Then I don't quite understand the stickied warning thread that says to never, ever attempt that.
Anyhow, I gave the Virtuous mod another go. Since it has sense and 1.72 I'm thinking of testing this one out a bit more, before I go flashing stock.
Thanks for the replies, though.

When is the best time to S-off?

Newb Alert!
Hi I'm currently running stock android 2.2.1 (build 1.72.405.3) on an unbranded DHD in the UK (I'm on Orange if that matters) I'm getting frustrated with the wait for 2.3 to be released here so I want to install the official RUU that was released a little while back.
I understand that to do this my phone will still be "official" ish, and that the only real difference between this way and OTA is that I'll lose my apps etc. which I can handle.
I want to be able to try some custom roms (in the future) but then be able to return the phone to stock - I believe this is possible? Am I better off downgrading now and doing S-off / eng-off, clockwork recovery, root etc? Or will I be fine to downgrade from 2.3 to 1.32 in the future to do everything I'll need for custom ROMS?
Or am I a muppet and have things totally wrong?
Any help appreciated,
Grim.
Ps. I've read the sticky in the Development forum, and tried searching the forum to find answers but have found it difficult as the terms I'm searching for are really generic - for this forum at least.

grimbola said:
I want to be able to try some custom roms (in the future) but then be able to return the phone to stock - I believe this is possible? Am I better off downgrading now and doing S-off / eng-off, clockwork recovery, root etc? Or will I be fine to downgrade from 2.3 to 1.32 in the future to do everything I'll need for custom ROMS?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Simple answer: Do it NOW!!!
Yes you can always go back to stock.
Much easier to do everything now.
Even if you only do root and S-OFF, you will be protected should the OTA update arrive in the sense that you won't need to downgrade again. But in for a penny and all that, go for the lot now and start exploring the greatness of Android and Sense (if you like that).

grimbola said:
Newb Alert!
Hi I'm currently running stock android 2.2.1 (build 1.72.405.3) on an unbranded DHD in the UK (I'm on Orange if that matters) I'm getting frustrated with the wait for 2.3 to be released here so I want to install the official RUU that was released a little while back.
I understand that to do this my phone will still be "official" ish, and that the only real difference between this way and OTA is that I'll lose my apps etc. which I can handle.
I want to be able to try some custom roms (in the future) but then be able to return the phone to stock - I believe this is possible? Am I better off downgrading now and doing S-off / eng-off, clockwork recovery, root etc? Or will I be fine to downgrade from 2.3 to 1.32 in the future to do everything I'll need for custom ROMS?
Or am I a muppet and have things totally wrong?
Any help appreciated,
Grim.
Ps. I've read the sticky in the Development forum, and tried searching the forum to find answers but have found it difficult as the of yerms I'm searching for are really generic - for this forum at least.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hi grim..
not neccesary you are going to lose your apk´s...
you can install "titanium backup" and do a backup of your apk´s, your system and your data (dialer, missed calls, wifi passwords...on sd-card\titaniumbackup) and then when you has installed your new gingerbread rom you can restore it.
download it from android market..
and finally say to you step by step what should to do:
1ºDOWNGRADE proccess from 1.72xx to 1.32xx wee off. ru
2ºroot with visionary Rxx
3º s-off eng-off+SUPERCID
4ºinstall ROM MANAGER from market and then flash a CWM recovery (lastest)
5ºDOWNLOAD the gingerbread rom, copy, paste to sd card root,
6ºDO FULL WIPE in recovery (factory reset, data, dalvik)
7ºFLASH the new rom and ENJOY

Mr_JMM said:
Simple answer: Do it NOW!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
WIN!!!!!!

Hi grimbola
You can do anything, anywhere, and anyhow on your Desire HD (But make sure you know what you are doing. Lol.) It all depends on your risk appetite.

only follow the guides, it sounds more difficult than it is.
I did it as an unexperienced user 3 weeks ago and the master plan was, to read the guides

Hi guys,
Thanks for all the speedy replies! I read them last week, but have only now have the time to reply.
I did it! I downgraded to 1.36 (?) then ran the tool on my pc to do radio S-off then also ran the other tool to Eng S-off - I followed jkoljo's posts (from the sticky roll-up thread over on the development forum). I've now installed the official 2.3. It was a little scary at times, but easy as pie!
The only issue I had was that I don't think I backed up my apps correctly (I used Astro file browser to do it) as they have not all been restored, however this is no great pain!
I'm now thinking that I might try installing a custom ROM, maybe Leedroid? I'm after something that is like the stock rom - i.e. Sense based (at least to start with) but has more bells and whistles - any suggestions are welcome!
Once again many thanks for your replies,
Grim.

Worth upgrading HBOOT and Radio?

First of all, please accept my apologies if this has been in some way answered before. I did a search as far back as early 2011 but could not find a satisfactory response hence my posting here.
I have a PVT1 Desire with HBOOT 0.80.0000, 5.14.05.17 Radio and S-ON. The phone is rooted with Amon-RA recovery and currently happily running JB. All is working well and I am conscious of the fact that should I decide to update the HBOOT and Radio to the latest version, I would have to start from scratch in terms of rooting etc. but as the phone is currently working just fine, I would appreciate people's opinion if there are any real benefits in upgrading.
Many thanks in advance.

bump

I really don't know or understand what you're waiting for. Why not s-off? It's so simple using revolutionary.
If you have a s-off, "rooting" is just flashing superuser from recovery. Not a complicated process at all.
Sent from my iStone using a shoe.

abaaaabbbb63 said:
I really don't know or understand what you're waiting for. Why not s-off? It's so simple using revolutionary.
If you have a s-off, "rooting" is just flashing superuser from recovery. Not a complicated process at all.
Sent from my iStone using a shoe.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
except his hboot is 0.80
revolutionary needs 0.93.001 or 1.02.0001 to work
Sent from my HTC Desire

Then his only option is to use unrevoked?
Sent from my HTC Desire using xda premium

thanged losse
Just to clarify, I have no issues with upgrading and then rooting from scratch but, as my understanding is, that would involve going back to the official GB rom (to upgrade the HBOOT) and then doing all else, I was just wondering if it worth the hassle i.e. whether upgrading HBOOT and the Radio files brings any tangible benefits.
Many thanks for your responses.

fraxos said:
Just to clarify, I have no issues with upgrading and then rooting from scratch but, as my understanding is, that would involve going back to the official GB rom (to upgrade the HBOOT) and then doing all else, I was just wondering if it worth the hassle i.e. whether upgrading HBOOT and the Radio files brings any tangible benefits.
Many thanks for your responses.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
alot of roms these days do recommend the latest radio and the advantage of s-off is that u can change hboots for more space. if u click the all things root guide in my sig i think ul get pretty much all the info u need there.
Sent from my HTC Desire

Many thanks for all the suggestions.
I have now updated to the latest Radio but still not sure about HBOOT and S-OFF. Since I am using JB which requires stock HBOOT, there is little advantage to S-OFF for me? Also, is there a quick way to upgrade just the HBOOT without having to install the offiicial HTC GB rom?

i wouldnt recommend upgrading RADIO ! had so many issues with different roms the last year after upgrading to the latest radio. Now I am back to the latest official radio that was delivered in Europe (5.11.05.27) and having no issues since then with ICS or any other roms.
I have the impression that some issues revolve from the newer 5.17.xx.xx radios being incompatible with some roms.

fraxos said:
I have a PVT1 Desire with HBOOT 0.80.0000, 5.14.05.17 Radio and S-ON. The phone is rooted with Amon-RA recovery and currently happily running JB. All is working well and I am conscious of the fact that should I decide to update the HBOOT and Radio to the latest version, I would have to start from scratch in terms of rooting etc. but as the phone is currently working just fine, I would appreciate people's opinion if there are any real benefits in upgrading..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why just not to install latest RUU - it automatically flashes new HBOOT and Radio.
About efforts - it's just allows to use modern ROMs.
May be a little improves quality, stability and battery time.
PS I haven't any issues with 5.17.05.27 radio

Dude... He got his answer. Stop reviving dead threads.
Sent from my toaster.