Develop Bugs

Are su/sudo available in android, can root be performed without rom flash?

Hello guys, seem like I will be moving to this part of xda in a couple of weeks
I have several questions though, mostly regarding roms and rooting. I have used linux for sometime and from what I understand su/sudo/gksu/gksudo etc. are not available in android? I mean I cannot gain root access in the same way as on the desktop. And if I root the device it will not lose warranty, as I can unroot it later on similar to SPL/HardSPL in winmo. The other question is, I think I am going to be OK with the stock rom, as the desire is some pretty fast hardware, so can I root it without installing rooted rom, again as HardSPL in winmo. I will probably need the root access for some applications, like task manager, otherwise I will probably only use the phone, browser, mp3, social stuff, gps, email, videos like I did in the past.
I am sorry if these questions were asked before, I read the tutorials in the first post, however things are still not quite clear for me

You don't have to install a custom ROM if you use unrevoked for root, it just adds the superuser app to your current ROM. However it will flash the recovery, so it voids your warranty anyway. There is no way to avoid this.
No idea about su/sudo though, I know nothing about linux

Well,I kinda have the same questions...First off,there is the su command in Android which is equal to the sudo command in Ubuntu etc.To give an example,I was trying out the ezHero rom on my Hero the other day and jit was enabled with this process:in terminal emulator you type in su,and then it asks for superuser permissions(probably only available through root?) and then you type jit-on and some other things happen that don't really matter here.I believe I answered half your question.Now,if root can be achieved through terminal...I don't think so!It's above my head though...

Thanks guys, that cleared up a lot
About this recovery, I guess if I can unroot and flash "stock recovery" if there is such a thing, it will not be a problem, is this the case? If I can't maybe I should buy a used device instead of a new one.
About the su/sudo, I have used mostly Ubuntu, and in the users menu I usually had 2 users - admin and root, once I set up a root password. Then I used the admin user and if I needed root access for something I did it with su or sudo + <command>, requiring password, or if it was software launcher requiring root access with a path gksudo + <regular parameters/command> in the launcher properties. For example, as far as I know you cannot change attributes like readable/writeable or edit files which are not personally belonging to your user without root access . It is a really neat and simple feature on the desktop and I am puzzled as to why they removed it from the stock rom. I didn't include this in the original post so that it is not too confusing.
Anyway thanks guys, having been with winmo for the last few years, I will finally give android a go and see if it works for me

Yeah it is relatively easy to flash to complete stock ROM and recovery. There's a guide somewhere in the developer board.

Invisible Elf said:
You don't have to install a custom ROM if you use unrevoked for root, it just adds the superuser app to your current ROM. However it will flash the recovery, so it voids your warranty anyway. There is no way to avoid this.
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No. Just no.
There's nothing in the warranty agreement to suggest that (there is a line that confirms that in the N1 agreement, though), and countless people have sent their rooted Desires back to HTC for repairs, and they've all been repaired. They just won't repair it if the ROM you flashed broke some hardware (ie overheated the LED and made it short-circuit).

Thanks guys, then I'll get a new device, great

[Q] Replace recovery without rooting?

Bit of an unusual request and I think I might already know the answer to this but here goes...
I'm looking for a way to gain adb access to my desire without booting the Android OS. I figured the best way of doing this would be to flash the recovery with a replacement (ClockworkMod for example).
Why am I doing this? I'm a forensic investigator and have a suspect's desire. I'm testing on my own phone and want to find a way of accessing the phone without changing any data inside the MTDs.
I'm thinking that a fastboot command might work but I'd like some confirmation before I start as I do not want to brick my own phone
Is it possible either:
a) gain adb access or replace the recovery without rooting the phone?
b) root the phone, get into recovery with a modified recovery, get the data, and then 'fix' the rooting?
Any help would be gratefully received.

Pretty sure you need root to flash a new recovery

Well as rooting is just the superuser apk and a Su binary placed on the system partition it should be possible. This is usually done after flashing the recovery which is flashed using an exploit. Most programs like unrevoked do both things though so you will have to remove the superuser apk and the binary afterwards.
Alternately there might be a command to dump a partition from fastboot. I don't know.

schizophreud said:
Bit of an unusual request and I think I might already know the answer to this but here goes...
I'm looking for a way to gain adb access to my desire without booting the Android OS. I figured the best way of doing this would be to flash the recovery with a replacement (ClockworkMod for example).
Why am I doing this? I'm a forensic investigator and have a suspect's desire. I'm testing on my own phone and want to find a way of accessing the phone without changing any data inside the MTDs.
I'm thinking that a fastboot command might work but I'd like some confirmation before I start as I do not want to brick my own phone
Is it possible either:
a) gain adb access or replace the recovery without rooting the phone?
b) root the phone, get into recovery with a modified recovery, get the data, and then 'fix' the rooting?
Any help would be gratefully received.
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Click to collapse
I want your Job....

killyouridols said:
I want your Job....
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I kinda need it to support my family

I suppose if you contact HTC or Google and supply the proper credentials, they would have a way to access that information. Worth a shot, anyway.
Sent from my CDMA Hero. I got some hot Froyo on Hero action here!

user7618 said:
I suppose if you contact HTC or Google and supply the proper credentials, they would have a way to access that information. Worth a shot, anyway.
Sent from my CDMA Hero. I got some hot Froyo on Hero action here!
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In a perfect world yes, but I don't work for the police directly and there's all kinds of trade secret issues with software and phones so HTC are, sadly, disinclined to acquiesce to our request!
I know where their offices are in the UK so I might go knock on their door instead

So unrevoked's payload includes the superuser.apk and su. I guess it should be possible to do something similar but without so those in the payload. Pity they haven't shared their exploit.
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App

Hi, I have a similar question - how to replace custom recovery by original one?
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App

[Q] Unroot EVO and still keep a custom rom?

Is this possible? I know most unroot the phone to take it in for service/exchange etc but my situation is different. I have to use Good for Enterprise to access my company's email and as you may know, Good does not allow rooted phones. So, I have no choice but to unroot my Evo.
The image that is used in unrooting is a stock ROM. What I want to do is setup my phone - the way I want it with Mikfroyo - with all the tweaks etc and then "just do the unrooting part". If that makes any sense - I don't need any superuser permissions etc.
Long story short - can a phone be unrooted with a custom ROM instead of a stock ROM?

im pretty sure this is impossible dude, sorry, just leave it all rooted, whats the problem

I know you can't unroot and keep a custom ROM but I wonder if there is a way to hide the fact that you're rooted from the app. What kind of message pops up when you install it?
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App

It just says that Good cannot run on a rooted phone and just locks the app - I have to call IT to get an unlock code using the device ID that is displayed in Good's pop-up message.

It has to be checking for something specific and I bet there is a way to fudge it but unfortunately that's outside my realm of understanding. I would ask one of the devs here about it.

What permissions does the App request when you install? It could just check for SuperUser

SSjon said:
What permissions does the App request when you install? If could just check for SuperUser
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I which case you could either delete superuser or use it to block the app... perhaps?

I am sure its more complicated than that - if they are touting themselves as a replacement for blackberry security for iPhones and Android - I seriously doubt a simple fudging of the superuser permissions will deceive it. Also, I'd like to comply with my company's requirements for using an Android phone so I don't get into trouble.
So from what I understand - you cannot have a custom ROM on an unrooted phone. Thanks so much guys - I'll just have to learn to live with the bloated stockware and manual restores arghh......

It's not possible.... to unroot, you'd have to RUU, which returns the phone back to stock. And then, you'd have no way of flashing a custom rom unless you rooted again

ok this is one thing that I am starting to not understand here...
so many people when they answer - say "yes" it can be done or "no" it can not be done...
...ummm where is the why? It would be very informative to know such things or if someone has even tried said thing before.
like why can't you just run a ROM or other flash file from renaming the file and letting the stock loader do the flashing? ......answer: because the stock loader does a file signature check - see? that makes sense and answers the why. it also helps users to retain the information as well as understand it.
I would love to know why the OP can't just run the unrevoked s-on tool from here http://unrevoked.com/rootwiki/doku.php/public/forever#custom_splash (in the FAQ section) without removing his custom ROM and just make sure he doesn't use any apps that need the su access. sounds like it should work? has someone done this and found that it does not work? flashing back to s-on should just prevent flashing to any other ROM's I would think from everything I have read in this forum.
or once s-on is back does it also check the current ROM on the phone and would cause some issues? would be great information to know. because if the security only checks file signatures of flies to be flashed and not the current ROM it seems like the OP could do what he is wanting to.
well, just thought I would ask to see if I could gain some more understanding as to the mechanics of everything

It would be good to know if this works with Good for Enterprise. I am stuck on an SGS 2.1 with Telstra and want a non stock ROM but really need to use Good.

ushkand said:
Is this possible? I know most unroot the phone to take it in for service/exchange etc but my situation is different. I have to use Good for Enterprise to access my company's email and as you may know, Good does not allow rooted phones. So, I have no choice but to unroot my Evo.
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I did not know that, and that SUCKS. My company's piloting Good now, and I was really looking forward to it. This just infuriates me. Mobile device makers are getting away with things that desktop/laptop makers never dreamed of trying. We shouldn't even NEED to "root" a phone. Imagine if you needed to hack your Windows machine in order to get the admin password and be able to install whatever you want. Now yes, I get that companies often do add those restrictions on their devices, and that they need to protect their data. Allowing access to company data on a personal device might make it a little more of a gray area, but it still blows. Good should be able to develop a system that can be secure, even if you have root access.
Here's a thread I just found. It sounds like you can just delete su and the superuser.apk. I think you can keep the custom rom, but you probably wouldn't be able to run anything that needs root, like Wireless Tether, Titanium Backup, or whatever. But you could probably have a flashable zip to re-add them when you need them. Or maybe one of the temp root methods would work. But it makes me furious that this is needed.
http://androidforums.com/droid-x-all-things-root/207397-good-enterprise.html

bkrodgers said:
I did not know that, and that SUCKS. My company's piloting Good now, and I was really looking forward to it. This just infuriates me. Mobile device makers are getting away with things that desktop/laptop makers never dreamed of trying. We shouldn't even NEED to "root" a phone. Imagine if you needed to hack your Windows machine in order to get the admin password and be able to install whatever you want. Now yes, I get that companies often do add those restrictions on their devices, and that they need to protect their data. Allowing access to company data on a personal device might make it a little more of a gray area, but it still blows. Good should be able to develop a system that can be secure, even if you have root access.
Here's a thread I just found. It sounds like you can just delete su and the superuser.apk. I think you can keep the custom rom, but you probably wouldn't be able to run anything that needs root, like Wireless Tether, Titanium Backup, or whatever. But you could probably have a flashable zip to re-add them when you need them. Or maybe one of the temp root methods would work. But it makes me furious that this is needed.
http://androidforums.com/droid-x-all-things-root/207397-good-enterprise.html
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My thoughts exactly

Update- I was able to get Good running finally on a custom rom - However, I had to forgo my superuser capabilities. I just renamed both the Su and Superuser.apk and then was able to run Good without any issues. I can easily restore Superuser access by adb when I need to. The good thing is that with the recovery being there, I can still flash updates without needing superuser access.
Thank you all for your help.

ushkand said:
Update- I was able to get Good running finally on a custom rom - However, I had to forgo my superuser capabilities. I just renamed both the Su and Superuser.apk and then was able to run Good without any issues. I can easily restore Superuser access by adb when I need to. The good thing is that with the recovery being there, I can still flash updates without needing superuser access.
Thank you all for your help.
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Thanks for the information. What is the ROM that you are using?

bkrodgers said:
Or maybe one of the temp root methods would work.
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are there still temp root methods that work on the EVO?

I am using Mikfroyo 4.5.

Just came across this thread and was seeing if your GFE was still working? I have a DX and put a custom ROM and could not get it to work. I'm waiting for my new PIN and have removed SU to see if it works.

ushkand said:
Update- I was able to get Good running finally on a custom rom - However, I had to forgo my superuser capabilities. I just renamed both the Su and Superuser.apk and then was able to run Good without any issues. I can easily restore Superuser access by adb when I need to. The good thing is that with the recovery being there, I can still flash updates without needing superuser access.
Thank you all for your help.
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Click to collapse
I rooted my HTC Salsa to install apps2sd which is great, but what commands do i have to run and where to be able to rename su.apk ?
Thanks,
Mike

[Q] How is root obtained on the G-Nexus?

Alright so being the tech-nut that I am, I have an off the wall question, which, appears to be unanswered from my searching.
I've rooted plenty of android devices in my day, but I've never actually known how root is gained, or how tools like the Nexus tool kit obtain it. My question is...what do these tools do in order to gain root? AKA, how is it done? Hope that makes sense!

Probably a question that most people don't know the answer to lol.
But to my understanding, root is achieved when you find the exploit in the system. I dunno, that's my guess lol.

mackster248 said:
Probably a question that most people don't know the answer to lol.
But to my understanding, root is achieved when you find the exploit in the system. I dunno, that's my guess lol.
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I kinda felt weird asking this because I didn't know if it was obvious, But my curiosity intrigued me!
That's kinda what I thought, but I guess I've just always been curious!
I've been told by one of my friends who has the verizon version that the toolkit basically flashes an unlocked image of the stock rom and then installs super user. Not sure how true it is.

mackster248 said:
Probably a question that most people don't know the answer to lol.
But to my understanding, root is achieved when you find the exploit in the system. I dunno, that's my guess lol.
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There is no exploit required on a Nexus. You just unlock the bootloader (1 command line prompt) and push the SU binary to the phone, then push superuser.apk to the phone, and grant it SU access. Done.
The only way you needed an exploit for is if you were on 4.0.2 and didn't want to unlock your bootloader (which wiped the device). There was an exploit to root w/o unlocking first.

Just to add to what martonikaj said:
"Rooting" or gaining root user access to the Android OS is essentially placing 2 file (with the correct permissions) in the system partition: the su binary, which actually grants root access, and a Superuser app, which acts as kind of a firewall, filtering root access requests.
The trick, however, on most devices, is getting write access to the system partition (which is read-only by default). Devices with locked bootloaders require an exploit of some sort to enable "temporary root access" to make /system rw.
Given that all Nexus devices have unlockable bootloaders, an exploit is not really necessary. With an unlocked bootloader, we can flash a custom recovery like CWM, and then flash the two required files via the recovery. Done.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

[Q]Regarding rooting

Hey guys, I recently got my Gnex(internation version from expansys) last week, but I'm a little bit on the fence when it comes to rooting as this is my first Android device. What are the benefits? I mean, I know that you guys get a ton of options with the variety of roms available to download/install, but I'm liking the stock ics that came with the device. If somebody cold convince on on doing it, then I'd be grateful. My baseband is XXLA2, is that the recommended one if I'm living in the US?

The ability to control your phone like you should. However being a really new person to android I wouldn't recommend you do it right away. Maybe browse the forum and learn somethings. Knowledge is power.
Sent From My Sprint Galaxy Nexus

Root gives you admin access to your phone. Definitely you should root, even if you want to stay on stock factory rom.

RogerPodacter said:
Root gives you admin access to your phone. Definitely you should root, even if you want to stay on stock factory rom.
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Only if he sees the benefits for himself. There's absolutely no reason for him to root if he doesn't understand what it does or how it will help/hurt him.

As mentioned previously, root access is admin access to the phone. Some benefits of it include being able to use the Adfree app to block advertisements in apps or Titanium Backup to backup apps the data associated with them. I'd take the time to get to know the phone and operating system first and then decide if you have a need for apps that require root access.

Off the top of my head:
-Fastest updates
-Ad removal
-Firewall
-True call blocking
-Lightflow
-Theming
-Backups (titanium, nandroid)
-Custom ROMs and all the millions of features they have (you could write pages and pages about this alone)
-Custom kernels (better battery+performance, touch wake, etc)
Since you have the Galaxy Nexus(a dev phone) as opposed to another locked-down phone, rooting is very, very easy. Unless you do something totally retarded you'll be safe. Just don't use toolkits -- do it manually.

fredryk said:
-Fastest updates
-Lightflow
-Backups (titanium, nandroid)
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Click to collapse
-You don't need to root to get fast updates. You can flash update files the day they come out via fastboot w/ an unlocked bootloader.
-Lightflow also works w/o root.
-You can do backups with ADB also.

martonikaj said:
-You don't need to root to get fast updates. You can flash update files the day they come out via fastboot w/ an unlocked bootloader.
-Lightflow also works w/o root.
-You can do backups with ADB also.
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I guess I was thinking of "root" being synonymous with unlocked bootloader. My old phone required root...still need root for TB.

fredryk said:
I guess I was thinking of "root" being synonymous with unlocked bootloader. My old phone required root...still need root for TB.
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Yes this is usually the case with other phones. With the Nexus, its extremely easy to unlock the bootloader and not root. I'd recommend unlocking the bootloader on this phone, but I'm not so quick to recommend rooting. People on XDA or too quick to recommend rooting to people who have absolutely no idea what it is and end up bricking their device.

martonikaj said:
Yes this is usually the case with other phones. With the Nexus, its extremely easy to unlock the bootloader and not root. I'd recommend unlocking the bootloader on this phone, but I'm not so quick to recommend rooting. People on XDA or too quick to recommend rooting to people who have absolutely no idea what it is and end up bricking their device.
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+1. Exactly.
You do not need root to flash custom ROMs, get updates, etc. if you have an unlocked bootloader. I totally agree with martonikaj: you SHOULD unlock your bootloader, but you shouldn't mess around with root until you know what root is and need it.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

I would unlock the bootloader immediately if you think you'll ever want to root the phone. Reason why is that you can unlock the bootloader easily with a single command, but it will wipe your phone, and there's no good way to do a real backup without rooting it. Better to do it now, before you have everything set up the way you want it and all of your apps installed.
For rooting, I agree that you shouldn't do it until you have a better idea what it is and why you want to do it.

I've been back and forth between root and non-root (always unlocked bootloader) and other than a few things already mentioned (Ad-free, Titanium Backup) I'm the type that can live with Stock ICS. I do flash custom ROM's once in a while to see if I enjoy them but I've always come back to Stock (for now) because of random reboot issues.

I'm reading this thread while on my way to root my phone (virgin like the guy who started this thread) I've been reading about rooting for a year, what's the difference between root and unlocked bootloader
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda app-developers app

kennwoodkenn said:
I'm reading this thread while on my way to root my phone (virgin like the guy who started this thread) I've been reading about rooting for a year, what's the difference between root and unlocked bootloader
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda app-developers app
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Click to collapse
From someone who knows just enough to get by....
Unlocking your bootloader allows you to flash custom recovery/ROM/Stock version/etc. You don't need root for this.
Root allows you full access to the phone with superuser permissions and install some apps that require full access to system files.

kennwoodkenn said:
I'm reading this thread while on my way to root my phone (virgin like the guy who started this thread) I've been reading about rooting for a year, what's the difference between root and unlocked bootloader
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda app-developers app
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Click to collapse
You couldn't have been doing a lot of good reading if you've been reading for a year and don't know the difference. But don't feel bad -- there are lots of senior members that use the terms interchangeably which is completely and utterly wrong.
Root means having root user access to the file system. Kinda like being the administrator user on Windows machines. You can access all the files and modify and delete anything. The process consists of placing two files on the /system partition of your device. The problems with this process, is finding a way to make /system write-able to place those two files there (as it is read-only by default when you are booted in Android). Chicken or the egg -- You need root to get root.
Think of the bootloader as the BIOS of a computer. It loads up before the operating system, and allows you to perform certain basic tasks. In our case, the bootloader allows you to flash images to your device, and to boot images on your devices (without actually writing them to the NAND). Unlocking the bootloader removes the security on the bootloader, which means that the bootloader no longer verifies the signature of images you are trying to flash or boot and, thus, allows you to flash or boot non-Google signed images.
Now, are rooting and unlocking your bootloader related? Well, to a certain extent yes. If you unlock your bootloader, you can easily obtain root access. This is true because you can flash or boot a custom recovery, which will allow you to write files to /system without being booted into Android. So, with an unlocked bootloader, "rooting" becomes trivial. However, there are other ways to root -- by using exploits. GNex Android builds up to ICL53F can be rooted by mempodroid (see link 4 in my signature), but to-date, an exploit has not been found for IMM76D and higher.

For the epic touch it looks pretty easy to root in Odin mode it seems to be a way to go I know I want root for all the reasons above
My process
Root with ODIN
Install CWM
And like what I see in the AOKP ROM
I HAVE NOT FORGOTTEN TO BACKUP
Am I on the right track
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda app-developers app

kennwoodkenn said:
For the epic touch it looks pretty easy to root in Odin mode it seems to be a way to go I know I want root for all the reasons above
My process
Root with ODIN
Install CWM
And like what I see in the AOKP ROM
I HAVE NOT FORGOTTEN TO BACKUP
Am I on the right track
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why don't you ask in the Epic Touch forum??

Rooting your gnex doesn't need to be seen as taking a dive off a cliff while blindfolded. This is a myth perpetuated by people who have either never rooted their devices or did something retarded and bricked it. It's easy, painless, and uncomplicated if you follow the instructions. If you can take advantage of the ad removal, backups, call blocking, etc with ease....why not do it?
Use this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1529058

Thanks for all your help!
I'll proceed to unlock the bootloader, but will remain on stock for a while until I get the hang of it and want to expand my options.