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hi,
when microsoft annouced wp7 they said all apps in the marketplace must have a free trial. i have downloaded the new zune software and alot of apps do not have free trials.
have MS changed their policy?
I think it works like this. If you buy an app, you can return it in 24 hours and get your money back.
It definitely doesn't work like that.
It's up to developers if they want to offer a trial or not and they can implement trials in any way they want (time limits, function limits, ads). Forcing Devs wouldn't make any sense, it'd only put some off developing for the platform. Apps with trials are likely to sell better (just as iPhone apps with 'lite' versions tend to do better) so it shouldn't take too long for trials to become the norm.
satchef1 said:
It definitely doesn't work like that.
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I'm pretty sure i read it somewhere but maybe i mixed it up with something else. I'm reading too much about WP7 so everything starts to blur inside my head.
From what I have read the games need to have a free demo but not heard anything about other apps
Will old apps (for Windows Mobile 6.xx) still work under WP7?
ahkow said:
Will old apps (for Windows Mobile 6.xx) still work under WP7?
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no........
Oh....then this could be my big concern of WP7. I like WM 6.5 is there are plenty of apps around..
There is reported around 2000 apps ready to go for wp7 already, when iphone launched it had less then 500. I dont think apps will be an issue except for people going on about how its an issue and manifesting a self fulfilling prophesy. WP7 is a dream for dev's if they get on board.
I SOOOO have faith in Windows Phone 7 and think it will be a hit. The developers have definately shown more interest than 6.X OS and that is a good thing for us at the end of the day. We will be getting high quality apps and apps that were made for Android and IOS and not for old WinMo are now being made for WP7. Developers have faith too! We all win
lumpaywk said:
From what I have read the games need to have a free demo but not heard anything about other apps
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yh i heard that too but some games dont have demo's. i think MS backtracked.
I think the only app developers that would not want to add a demo are the ones that know the apps are crap and not worth the money.
There's around 500 apps in the marketplace as of now - the goal is afaik 2000 by launch in three days time.
emigrating said:
There's around 500 apps in the marketplace as of now - the goal is afaik 2000 by launch in three days time.
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i reckon they will have about 1000 by the uk launch on thursday and just under 2500 by the US launch.
cant see them testing and passing 1500 apps in 3 days (500 a day).
I just browsed through all the apps. My big question is "Where is the killer game app" like MonkeyBall was for iPhone? Microsoft should fully know (XBox) that you need to have a killer game at the launch of your gaming platform.
I even saw a few fart apps
So far it looks like too many rinky-dink apps instead of full-blown quality apps. Let's hope this changes soon.
WhyBe said:
I just browsed through all the apps. My big question is "Where is the killer game app" like MonkeyBall was for iPhone? Microsoft should fully know (XBox) that you need to have a killer game at the launch of your gaming platform.
I even saw a few fart apps
So far it looks like too many rinky-dink apps instead of full-blown quality apps. Let's hope this changes soon.
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more and more apps are available everyday, and I have a feeling they are holding off on some apps (i.e. Harvest) until the actual release day.
Have you seen the apps though? I mean really seen what's there as of now? Mostly, pretty much rubbish IMHO! From a business, productivity, tools point of view - useless. Really hoping it improves soon
Okay I can agree to an extent on that..I actually saw a farting dinosaur app....:facepalm: but on the whole some looked useful and a few of the games looked nice.
Microsoft seem to be putting their software onto apples phone, http://wmpoweruser.com/how-to-alienate-your-customers-101/
whats next microsoft office on iOS if this continues then there will be on reason to get a wp7 device, after all, the iphone has a better gpu, far more memory (i live in the uk so 16gb is the max 8gb is the norm) so why would i want to buy a wp7 device again if MS starts doing this???
Because they're a software company?
davidebanks said:
Microsoft seem to be putting their software onto apples phone, http://wmpoweruser.com/how-to-alienate-your-customers-101/
whats next microsoft office on iOS if this continues then there will be on reason to get a wp7 device, after all, the iphone has a better gpu, far more memory (i live in the uk so 16gb is the max 8gb is the norm) so why would i want to buy a wp7 device again if MS starts doing this???
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why is office on mac os?
why should they not?
WP7 has a different user experience and i like it much more than the android/ios experience....wp7 wouldn`t a good plattform if only the apps are the pros for it.
And why not give iOS users possibility to like office and maybe consider wp7 for their next phone then?
Well, might never happen, cause most applers stay applers...
Sent from my HTC 7 Mozart using Board Express
Geez. Why should you buy a WP7 rather than iPhone? Because the user experience between the two devices are completely different.
Obviously apps are going to be cross platform, Microsoft is after all a software company. Now, one could argue that they should perhaps do what Google does - and wait with releasing their apps on other platforms until they absolutely have to, but this is the iPhone we are talking about - they have to.
Good Point bro!!!
And because in the futur all softwares will be able to run all platform.
0711 said:
why is office on mac os?
why should they not?
WP7 has a different user experience and i like it much more than the android/ios experience....wp7 wouldn`t a good plattform if only the apps are the pros for it.
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Why is there iTunes Windows? It is slow by the way.
I am sure that companies do this so that user can have options and maybe pick the companies OS next time.
Peew971 said:
Because they're a software company?
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Then why do they not port Halo to PS3 for example? Like you said, they are a software company, and could easily double the revenue. MS are idiots for not porting Xbox games like Halo to other platforms.
Keep in mind that the software developed for the iPhone was a separate team from those working on Wp7.
Also, if iphone users start to use a bunch of microsoft apps, maybe they will think "maybe I should be using a microsoft phone" and then buy a windows phone. Sure it could go the other way as well... but I'm an optimist.
To make money, as what pretty much most if not all paid apps are for.
digger1985 said:
Then why do they not port Halo to PS3 for example? Like you said, they are a software company, and could easily double the revenue. MS are idiots for not porting Xbox games like Halo to other platforms.
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Too much work? Maybe they figured that game exclusivity is what drives the console sales.
canadariot2312 said:
Too much work? Maybe they figured that game exclusivity is what drives the console sales.
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is all about the market share, and profit.
canadariot2312 said:
Too much work? Maybe they figured that game exclusivity is what drives the console sales.
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But porting apps over to iOS is not? How come they can't figure out that app exclusivity also drives phone sales.
digger1985 said:
But porting apps over to iOS is not? How come they can't figure out that app exclusivity also drives phone sales.
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Because console games are complicated and require certain components to work. Every smartphone uses the same SoC set no matter what OS they run whether it would be snapdragon, omap, a4, etc. The consoles are made differently, the 360 with tri-cores and the ps3 uses something really confusing. Than again, Final Fantasy did appear on the Xbox, but Sony didn't exclusive rights to that game.
I would imagine that it is miles easier for porting apps, or maybe they want to do something like having an app on a certain phone will just run better as oppose to something not native.
kabumm said:
And why not give iOS users possibility to like office and maybe consider wp7 for their next phone then?
Well, might never happen, cause most applers stay applers...
Sent from my HTC 7 Mozart using Board Express
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I didn't . Don't get me wrong, I loved my iPhone (until Apple butchered it with iOS 4), but when I went to go snag an iPhone 4 and got to play with it side by side with the Samsung Focus, the choice was clear--Focus is a MUCH nicer device, with a nicer screen and of course, Windows Phone 7 itself--which makes iOS look antiquated and stale.
That said, I also have a 2010 Macbook Pro 13" which I got purely so I can submit apps to the iOS store, but I can't stand Mac OSX, it's a ****in' turd. So I'm glad the laptop runs Windows 7 nicely enough, LOL.
digger1985 said:
Then why do they not port Halo to PS3 for example? Like you said, they are a software company, and could easily double the revenue. MS are idiots for not porting Xbox games like Halo to other platforms.
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MS also makes the hardware for the XBOX. And they sold the hardware at a loss. Their revenue model was dependent on software attach rates being high on the console. People often choose game consoles based on exclusive games. MS could spend millions marketing Halo because they know that the reason people buy XBOX consoles is so that they could play awesome games. Period. Everything else the XBOX does is just gravy.
People buy smartphones for so many different reasons.
MS can't invest millions of dollars into the promotion and marketing of a single app, because a large portion of customers won't care about it.
Bing and One Note are fighting for mindshare. You can't have a killer phone app if nobody even knows what it is.
The only way to market and advertise how good Bing and One Note could be is by putting it the hands of the most people possible. And for now, that's on the iPhone.
Reflexx1 said:
People buy smartphones for so many different reasons.
MS can't invest millions of dollars into the promotion and marketing of a single app, because a large portion of customers won't care about it.
Bing and One Note are fighting for mindshare. You can't have a killer phone app if nobody even knows what it is.
The only way to market and advertise how good Bing and One Note could be is by putting it the hands of the most people possible. And for now, that's on the iPhone.
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If you are using a smartphone for a single app, than you need to rethink.
I heard that you can get Bing on Android devices as well, although not many people actually want it (seeing that it is a Google phone). I think putting Microsoft software on other OS' is not a bad idea. After all, you see Microsoft everywhere.
Reflexx1 said:
MS also makes the hardware for the XBOX. And they sold the hardware at a loss. Their revenue model was dependent on software attach rates being high on the console. People often choose game consoles based on exclusive games. MS could spend millions marketing Halo because they know that the reason people buy XBOX consoles is so that they could play awesome games. Period. Everything else the XBOX does is just gravy.
People buy smartphones for so many different reasons.
MS can't invest millions of dollars into the promotion and marketing of a single app, because a large portion of customers won't care about it.
Bing and One Note are fighting for mindshare. You can't have a killer phone app if nobody even knows what it is.
The only way to market and advertise how good Bing and One Note could be is by putting it the hands of the most people possible. And for now, that's on the iPhone.
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You comment doesn't make any sense. They sell hardware at a loss and make money from games. Keeping Xbox exclusives would make sense if they made money from the hardware. Since they make money from the games, they should be doing everything to port games to other platforms as well.
Thing is, Microsoft is the top player in the console industry - so they don't have to port games to other platforms. The increase in revenue would likely be offset by the increase in development cost to support the PS3 and/or Wii. Not to mention the fact that Microsoft Game Studio titles do drive console sales (I know plenty of people who have bought an Xbox 360 purely because of Halo for example); higher console sales lead to higher revenue (even if they did initially sell hardware at a loss) as people pay for the XBL Gold service, spend money in the Xbox marketplace and purchase Xbox 360 games (for which MS get's a license fee no matter if it's an in-house title or not).
This is pretty much how the printer/ink/toner industry or coffee-pod industry works also. They sell the hardware at little to no profit but you are tied in to buying their ink/toner or coffee-pods for the lifetime of the product. It's actually cheaper for me to purchase a new CLP every so often than it is to buy new toner - when I then sell the old printer online I more or less come out at zero cost.
In the smartphone sector, Apple is the king of the hill and it only makes sense to have their software available. Apps do not drive phone sales; UX (User eXperience) does. Keeping a title exclusive to WP7 makes no sense at all. At the same time, it does not make sense (business wise) to support all possible smartphone platforms out there, only iOS and Android has a valuable marketplace (app wise) so those are the platforms to support - this is why Google hasn't released their apps as official WP7 clients thus far; Windows Phone 7 doesn't have a big enough marketshare that it pays for them to spend development dollars on it. Once the OS gains momentum (if it does) Google will rather quickly release what they have to offer.
All said, I do agree it's painful when "better" software appears for the iPhone rather than their own OS, WP7, but this goes back to the fact Microsoft are so large. There is no single person making decisions, they have COO's and project managers en masse, often trying to out-do eachother or vote other projects down as they step on their own projects toes. Microsoft is filled to the brim with highly competent people, but they operate like a bureaucracy. Ask anyone who's ever worked there and they'll all more or less tell the same story - the layers of hierarchy is killing creative output.
How many times has Microsoft not come out with killer products which has failed miserably in the marketplace because upper management hasn't seen or understood the possibility. Take Media Center for example, it has given the best UX for DVRs for years - still, they never took it to the next level and now it's almost too late. With a lot of luck their embedded Media Center's showcased (in a back-room no less?!) at CES may make a dent in the market, but it's highly unlikely as they missed the boat. GoogleTV, AppleTV, Boxee and a whole lot of other players are now ruling the roost.
That's exactly what they did with the mobile sector also - they had great ideas and were the top players years ago. But they became complacent and stopped innovating. Then other players came along and completely killed them; what was WM's marketshare last year? How much of that was made up of HD2 sales which were re-flashed with Android?
digger1985 said:
Then why do they not port Halo to PS3 for example? Like you said, they are a software company, and could easily double the revenue. MS are idiots for not porting Xbox games like Halo to other platforms.
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This is off topic but why would you want to port Halo to the PS3? Halo is more aimed at muliplayer and as everyone knows Playstation sucks at on-line gaming.
I mean I understand that it's to be released on both the Xbox and WP7 at the same time but really? That's it? I am thoroughly disappointed this time. Xbox has dug through mounds of **** just to make a name for itself and what has Windows Phone 7 shown in that department? I mean there's ilomilo and then theres iphone clones. It's so sad to see a first rate OS by a corporate giant turned into a third rate gaming platforms because they'd rather spend a huge budget on advertising what the phone can currently do rather than making that Xbox live tile appeal to a plethora of users who had hope in their hearts when they saw Xbox live integration and watched it be shat on with garbage like... well... half the stuff on the Xbox live WP7 marketplace. It's cool that you're getting the most popular iphone clone and a game I played on my beat up sega dreamcast a decade ago but really, where's the innovation?
I think it might be time to change your siggy...
I don't have an xbox, so I don't care so much about the integration, but I'm finding way more games I like on my phone right now than on android or winmo.
Currently working on twin blades, AC, I dig it, and The Harvest. Also play majong(sp) tiles and a couple rounds of spades as well.
nrfitchett4 said:
I think it might be time to change your siggy...
I don't have an xbox, so I don't care so much about the integration, but I'm finding way more games I like on my phone right now than on android or winmo.
Currently working on twin blades, AC, I dig it, and The Harvest. Also play majong(sp) tiles and a couple rounds of spades as well.
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Ah, R.I.P. Twin Blades. It was a great game unfortunately I've since swapped memory cards coincidentally on the day it vanished from the market and alas I am left without one of the defining games on the platform. I Dig It I havent really visited in some time due to the inability to save (not sure if that's still present), The Harvest has somewhat annoying controls, a virtual joystick makes more sense than a point and click diablo-esque phone game in my opinion, and AC has been on multiple other platforms as well as the other two games though perhaps not the exact same program. The astounding part though is regardless of the faults it's still the best. It's just that they've given us an amazing game or two (The Harvest really is amazing the controls just aren't for me) and then since have lacked innovation greatly. Where I thought they were going to try and stand alone it now looks like they're trying to be a "me too" platform. I did recieve an email from someone regarding a mobile version of Torchlight though and though they couldn't confirm or deny they did tell me it was an option they were exploring. That would be amazing as that game only takes like what? 140 megs on the xbox? Dull it down a bit and it could be a game changer for WP7.
z33dev33l said:
Ah, R.I.P. Twin Blades. It was a great game unfortunately I've since swapped memory cards coincidentally on the day it vanished from the market and alas I am left without one of the defining games on the platform. I Dig It I havent really visited in some time due to the inability to save (not sure if that's still present), The Harvest has somewhat annoying controls, a virtual joystick makes more sense than a point and click diablo-esque phone game in my opinion, and AC has been on multiple other platforms as well as the other two games though perhaps not the exact same program. The astounding part though is regardless of the faults it's still the best. It's just that they've given us an amazing game or two (The Harvest really is amazing the controls just aren't for me) and then since have lacked innovation greatly. Where I thought they were going to try and stand alone it now looks like they're trying to be a "me too" platform. I did recieve an email from someone regarding a mobile version of Torchlight though and though they couldn't confirm or deny they did tell me it was an option they were exploring. That would be amazing as that game only takes like what? 140 megs on the xbox? Dull it down a bit and it could be a game changer for WP7.
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I know there are several big titles slated for first week in april. I agree they could do more, and I think they will. MS, if nothing else, is willing to throw money at devs.
So what's next on your list of complaint...
nrfitchett4 said:
I know there are several big titles slated for first week in april. I agree they could do more, and I think they will. MS, if nothing else, is willing to throw money at devs.
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yeah and though I'm ok with that theyre throwing money at devs to release iPhone ports. Originality is Microsoft ticket and they've got more capable devs on their rolodex than any other mobile os. They should utilize those resources...
Crimson Lotus said:
So what's next on your list of compliant...
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always such informative and insightful posts. They add a lot to the conversation.
I'm starting to agree with you about all the new releases. Puzzle games have their place (especially on a mobile phone platform), but without more action titles, it makes it seem like XBox live is not really a serious reason for someone to get a WP7 as Microsoft would like people to think.
That said, I have actually really, really enjoyed the XBox Live games. I used WinMo and Android for a long time before WP7 and never really got into gaming on either platform but for some reason, I just started playing games on WP7 a lot. I don't have an XBox so the integration with XBox is not something I really care about. I like the achievements. It gives me something to play for.
The April releases will keep me satisfied for a while, but in my opinion, they need a lot more releases like those in April, not just every now and then.
edit: oh yeah, an afterthought... maybe chill out on the tower defense games. 1 is enough on the entire platform. It seems like every other game on the Marketplace is a freakin tower defense game. Not a big fan.
I guess you guys haven't seen the poker commercial on xbox live then? Its quite stupid.
You can play the game on both your console and phone.
Spoiler alert; its not the way you think it is. Integration my ass.
Crimson Lotus said:
So what's next on your list of compliant...
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Well I'm not sure, but I believe he's FCC compliant. And he probably adheres to compliance codes for device usage?
sure haven't said:
Well I'm not sure, but I believe he's FCC compliant. And he probably adheres to compliance codes for device usage?
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LOL!!!
Give people a break. Typos are just typos and oftentimes, people use translators and such.
SPORTS GAMES! WTF!
Is there a single sports game on this platform? XBox may not have many either....but some sports games (i.e. one button swing type games) are made for mobile.
WP7 is lacking sports games something fierce.
thesecondsfade said:
LOL!!!
Give people a break. Typos are just typos and oftentimes, people use translators and such.
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lol yeah I'm just being a bugger. Heaven knows I've made my share of typos.
I'm sorry for those spelling errors...
thesecondsfade said:
I'm starting to agree with you about all the new releases. Puzzle games have their place (especially on a mobile phone platform), but without more action titles, it makes it seem like XBox live is not really a serious reason for someone to get a WP7 as Microsoft would like people to think.
That said, I have actually really, really enjoyed the XBox Live games. I used WinMo and Android for a long time before WP7 and never really got into gaming on either platform but for some reason, I just started playing games on WP7 a lot. I don't have an XBox so the integration with XBox is not something I really care about. I like the achievements. It gives me something to play for.
The April releases will keep me satisfied for a while, but in my opinion, they need a lot more releases like those in April, not just every now and then.
edit: oh yeah, an afterthought... maybe chill out on the tower defense games. 1 is enough on the entire platform. It seems like every other game on the Marketplace is a freakin tower defense game. Not a big fan.
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I agree about the tower defense games, but the star wars one is actually quite fun...
We could definitely use some more games, but we are still getting them faster than android!!!
How do y'all like WP7? I'm still on WinMo because Garmin Mobile XT is awesome, particularly where there is no cellular coverage. Also, I do not own a laptop and do a lot of long emails on my phone when I'm not at home with my 70lb desktop and I'm irritated that I can't get a WP7 device with the exact same keyboard as my Rhodium and at least the latest Qualcomm 45nm goodness in it complete with Adreno 205, much less the upcoming dual Cortex A8 with independent clock speed and CPU voltage and Adreno 220. Why in the Sam Hill did M$ decide that only 65nm OG Snapdragon SoC's were going to go into WP7 devices?
I read a few reviews of the Euro-spec 7 Pro and it seems that HTC used a crappy LCD but not as crappy as the HD7's, and they somehow messed up the chassis of the Rhodium and the keyboard. I like that I can get giant batteries for these things and that unibody sh*t jus doesn't float my boat. I guess I'm just pissed that WP7 is locked to 65nm Snapdragon and irritated with HTC for messing with the landscape qwerty slider chassis and keyboard that they perfected with the Rhodium.
sure haven't said:
lol yeah I'm just being a bugger. Heaven knows I've made my share of typos.
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I konw. Your comment was funny though.
DeathmonkeyGTX said:
How do y'all like WP7? I'm still on WinMo because Garmin Mobile XT is awesome, particularly where there is no cellular coverage. Also, I do not own a laptop and do a lot of long emails on my phone when I'm not at home with my 70lb desktop and I'm irritated that I can't get a WP7 device with the exact same keyboard as my Rhodium and at least the latest Qualcomm 45nm goodness in it complete with Adreno 205, much less the upcoming dual Cortex A8 with independent clock speed and CPU voltage and Adreno 220. Why in the Sam Hill did M$ decide that only 65nm OG Snapdragon SoC's were going to go into WP7 devices?
I read a few reviews of the Euro-spec 7 Pro and it seems that HTC used a crappy LCD but not as crappy as the HD7's, and they somehow messed up the chassis of the Rhodium and the keyboard. I like that I can get giant batteries for these things and that unibody sh*t jus doesn't float my boat. I guess I'm just pissed that WP7 is locked to 65nm Snapdragon and irritated with HTC for messing with the landscape qwerty slider chassis and keyboard that they perfected with the Rhodium.
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huh. most reviewers have said the 7 pro keyboard is the best keyboard since the tp2. Those tp2's won't last forever.
Saw this great article (http://www.wpcentral.com/nokia-causing-fragmentation-windows-phone-their-exclusive-apps) and it's worth discussion. Actually I'm pissed about what Nokia is doing. Is it by force to use a Nokia device?? If I dont, why I'm I being punnised for it by not getting some good apps?
Nokia has made moves to gain some big titles (and leverage) for their hardware. Who does it hurt? Who does it benefit and is it a good thing? I say a BIG NO, it's not a good thing. Good for Nokia but not for the OS (Windows Phone)
The real deal is, Nokia’s strategy to get these apps and games on their hardware will definetely hurt Windows Phone and I can see Nokia's Version of Windows Phone coming out real soon and it aint good.
Pissed this morning, Always Nokia, Nokia, Nokia all ove the news with exclusive good apps.....WTF
All of the applications will be timed exclusive to nokia phones. Since the applications will be arriving sooner or later to other windows phones, i see no harm is being made. That being said, i think this is nokia trying to make developers care for the windows phone platform and is helping them to develop their applications for windows. That is probably why they get a timed exclusive for their phones. In the end, every windows phone user will be benefited as more applications will arrive to the platform!
I do not see why this is a bad thing.
1. Every manufacturer has their exclusive apps. Nokia is not the first one to do this, it's what manufacturers need on WP7 to differ themselves from each other.
2. Some of these are not even proper exclusives. These are timed exclusive and will be available to other phones at a later time as well.
I agree with you but wait for a year or what? Why do I have to wait soo long to get a CNN or ESPN app on my phone? How many people can just wait for apps they want desperately? I just can't wait and I just can't get a Lumia device so what? How about we that fall in this category?
Kenzibit said:
I agree with you but wait for a year or what? Why do I have to wait soo long to get a CNN or ESPN app on my phone? How many people can just wait for apps they want desperately? I just can't wait and I just can't get a Lumia device so what? How about we that fall in this category?
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ESPN has another app, and is also available online. CNN can be pulled into any RSS reader. Are these the only examples you have?
If so, the argument is very weak.
For the apps that dont exist - would they at all anyway if not for Nokia? Would you get them any sooner if not for Nokia? At all?
I see no validity in the argument for fragmentation. App availability by region has always been there. Is China causing fragmentation in WP7 because Twitter and Facebook have been removed for any handset sold in China?
Kenzibit said:
I agree with you but wait for a year or what? Why do I have to wait soo long to get a CNN or ESPN app on my phone? How many people can just wait for apps they want desperately? I just can't wait and I just can't get a Lumia device so what? How about we that fall in this category?
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Because Nokia is investing the time and money to develop these apps in the first place or at least is incenting the content owner (CNN or ESPN) to create these apps.
as eknutson described it already: If not for Nokia, you'd probably not see these apps at all or at least a lot later, when the OS has seen a wider range of adoption.
Let me also point out that some apps are not even without an alternative. Take the announced "BOX" app: Why wait for an official app, if "Boxfiles For Box.net FREE" does the same job?
If you managed to live without a paypal app this long, why not another 6 months?
hMM
i have to admit the ESPN app on Nokia is nice, I just used the switcher app in the forum.
LOL, what is all the nonsense about fragmentation?
You act like the apps won't work on other WP devices.
Nokia coughed up their own money to make the developers bring these apps to WP and you want them to then share with other OEMs?!?
OEMs who have been in the game significantly longer and have simply twiddled their thumbs and blamed MS for all WP woes while pumping out me-too devices as opposed to innovating?
BE REAL!
Thank Nokia for giving these developers the incentive to give WP the time of day.
Once they begin working on their apps, they will realize just how easy it is to code for the OS, leading to more apps in the future as opposed to the current developers having to rely on APIs that blocked all the time (Pandora, Instagram) so they too can produce their own original apps for the platform.
Plus fragmentation refers to the OS version, not the apps themselves.
And if you're so mad about it, go buy a Nokia device.
Well let's see, either Nokia gets them first by paying cash out of their own pockets and then in time shares it with the OEMs who couldn't care less about doing anything for the platform, or we don't get them at all because no OEM cares. Without Nokia, WP7 really would be a lesser OS. Don't get me wrong, I used a DVP for almost a year before the first Nokia device got sent my way, but Nokia made WP7 MUCH better.
Not only does this give us the games, it builds the framework to create future versions of the game. This is helping WP7 perpetually, now stop getting angry that you picked up a piece of recycled android hardware and be happy for all that Nokia has done for our fine OS.
Other OEM's are free to make deals with big development companies too...
But they won´t, take a look at HTC for example, they could make deal with Route 66 about navigation, for example one/two free maps, but no, they offer you trial, and then you must pay.
Excellent comments so far but I still don't think it's fair for people to benefit more than others on the same OS. In the Android world, I think it's about OS customizations and not apps benefits. All apps are acquired by everyone, the only difference being your customizations and experience.
Secondly, I know some HTC and MS workers will see this post, after all they are here with us under disguise ;-)
Yea, right, I hate everyone who owns an HTC because he has an sound enhancer...wait, I don´t, I don´t even hated LG for having DLNA app in front of many others...just think please!
Some companies put simply more effort into the platform, HTC puts it into the Android OS, Nokia is so far first OEM whose commitment can be really seen, and you want to hate just because of that? Gimmie a break.
It could encourage HTC and Samsung to retreat even more from Windows Phone, if their sales get that much worse in comparison.
And if they instead take the initiative and start on the same strategy then that would be fragmentation, just like the article says. Temporary fragmentation, to be sure, but what happens when someone realizes that "I either buy HTC and get this and this app, or Samsung and get this and this app, or Nokia and get this and this app"?
thebobp said:
It could encourage HTC and Samsung to retreat even more from Windows Phone, if their sales get that much worse in comparison.
And if they instead take the initiative and start on the same strategy then that would be fragmentation, just like the article says. Temporary fragmentation, to be sure, but what happens when someone realizes that "I either buy HTC and get this and this app, or Samsung and get this and this app, or Nokia and get this and this app"?
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Going on this way Android should have failed real quick then. But apparently it's alive and well...to me stepping up the competion always leads to a win for the user. Without HTC and other OEMs skinning the older, fugly and piss poor versions of Android there would have been no Android boom at all IMHO. Thanks to them actually investing on the platform, it is now the most relevant phone OS in the world. Not bad heh?
vnvman said:
Going on this way Android should have failed real quick then. But apparently it's alive and well...to me stepping up the competion always leads to a win for the user. Without HTC and other OEMs skinning the older, fugly and piss poor versions of Android there would have been no Android boom at all IMHO. Thanks to them actually investing on the platform, it is now the most relevant phone OS in the world. Not bad heh?
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I'm not talking about skinning (which the user can rationalize as "am i buying this look or that look?" ) but apps actually being unavailable depending on which phone you buy. Say all manufacturers start advertising very hard: "come to us; the others don't have these apps!" Unfortunately, this is negative advertising, and incoming users would start wondering "eh, why don't i just go to iOS, where i'll have all of them?" that's the essence of fragmentation.
Of course, the other alternative (that nobody else bothers to escalate) is almost as bad.
sent from my Terran Command Center.
This thread must be a wind-up. Seriously -- no one could be complaining about "fragmentation" due to one OEM deciding to bring more value to their own handsets.
Kenzibit said:
Is Nokia causing fragmentation on Windows Phone with their exclusive apps? YES
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I don't understand your use of the word "fragmentation." At present if a developer chooses to make an app that works on ALL Windows Phones they can. If some developer is sitting on their @$$ and only servicing the iphone market and a manufacturer makes a deal and pays the developer to make an exclusive app for their phone I don't see what the problem is. It's not like they are saying, hey ebay I know you have a Windows Phone app. Why don't I pay you to pull it and only make it for my handsets.
HTC can join the party or fold. By Nokia enticing developers with ITS OWN MONEY they are only expanding the Windows Phone eco system. I don't really see a time in the future where so many apps are bought up everyone has a hard time getting an app on their phone. Once a critical mass of apps are on Windows Phone more handsets will sell and developers will create apps without incentives. Heck if someone enticed epocrates to create a Windows Phone version of their software I would buy that brand of phone. That would be better than the current state of affairs (ie nothing).
sitizenx said:
I don't understand your use of the word "fragmentation." At present if a developer chooses to make an app that works on ALL Windows Phones they can. If some developer is sitting on their @$$ and only servicing the iphone market and a manufacturer makes a deal and pays the developer to make an exclusive app for their phone I don't see what the problem is. It's not like they are saying, hey ebay I know you have a Windows Phone app. Why don't I pay you to pull it and only make it for my handsets.
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Same result either way: the app is available only for Nokia (at least temporarily). If you agree the latter is fragmentation, then you'll agree the former is. Fragmentation for a good reason is still fragmentation.
Right now it's not that worrisome; what is worrisome is if the others happen to respond in kind. Then we'll really have fragmentation of apps - "such and such is available only on HTC Windows Phone, such and such only on Samsung Windows Phone, and such and such only on Nokia".
That's not "fragmentation," it's "exclusivity."
Different issue.
There is nobody responsible for Windows Phone 10 on Microsoft. The WP10 has been abandoned for 1 year and as you have seen by recent news and pages about WP10, it's pretty dead by now.
Nobody is fixing bugs not even critical bugs. They just want to have a great 3D experience with WP10. Oh come on Microsoft, really? 3D apps and the critical stuff dead or not working.
I think that the WP10 manager is just playing gold everyday and waiting for it to die. I don't know if it's Dona Sarkar or another person, but my opinion is that she is just a pretty face to keep everybody fooled about the destiny of the WP10 project. To die, because it's been on coma for a long time now. It's like a joke, but a sad one.
So, I'm out of Windows Insider Preview for Windows Phone 10 and reset the phone to have a working version.
I'm still on insider preview for Windows 10 desktop because this one is being taken seriously and it has been great reporting stuff and helping build the future of Windows. Desktop, not mobile.
Remember Nokia? It's back with Android and with amazing smartphones. Nokia 6 will sell like hot cakes and so Nokia 5 and 3. Also I'm buying the flagship Nokia 8 or 9. Yes, two Android Nokia.
find something interesting to do in life... who cares which phone you buy next... is your choice...
adevel said:
There is nobody responsible for Windows Phone 10 on Microsoft. The WP10 has been abandoned for 1 year and as you have seen by recent news and pages about WP10, it's pretty dead by now.
Nobody is fixing bugs not even critical bugs. They just want to have a great 3D experience with WP10. Oh come on Microsoft, really? 3D apps and the critical stuff dead or not working.
I think that the WP10 manager is just playing gold everyday and waiting for it to die. I don't know if it's Dona Sarkar or another person, but my opinion is that she is just a pretty face to keep everybody fooled about the destiny of the WP10 project. To die, because it's been on coma for a long time now. It's like a joke, but a sad one.
So, I'm out of Windows Insider Preview for Windows Phone 10 and reset the phone to have a working version.
I'm still on insider preview for Windows 10 desktop because this one is being taken seriously and it has been great reporting stuff and helping build the future of Windows. Desktop, not mobile.
Remember Nokia? It's back with Android and with amazing smartphones. Nokia 6 will sell like hot cakes and so Nokia 5 and 3. Also I'm buying the flagship Nokia 8 or 9. Yes, two Android Nokia.
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gooooo, bundyyyy!!!!!
Don't think so
I just joined about 2 weeks ago the windows 10 mobile family with a L640 DS. Let me tell you that it is very interesting, companies like gamelfot, for example, are not taking into account opinions like yours, they are still making apps for the system and very good ones. There are others that are developing apps that are exclusive for windows 10 M. I am coming from an Android device that had all the development in the world, you can look for it, Xiaomi Redmi 2 Prime and I just gave it to my wife. You would say, you missed it, or you are crazy, but in fact, will all the tweaks that I have found here in xda with advanced users help, I might say, not comming back to android any future soon. Yes, MS may have delays on fixing bugs or getting updates, but they still do it. For me, W10M is not dead, does not have a good position in market, it is true, but if you look at the good apps in the store, they sometimes have just 2 reviews, out of 1000 downloads. So you can ask.. is it really MS fault?? Or users fault?? W10 M have received 2 updates within the last month.. how many does android get?? 1 in.... IDK 1 year??? Be realistic of what you think and what you believe... and yes, android has still fragmentation even in 7.1.2.. It is just my opinion.. even if pages like wcentral or others try to kill the system, which as I have read, have been doing it for a while now, they have not been able to.. idk what is the bad thing that they turn around about it... just be happy.. if you will change devices.. it is ok.. everyone should be happy with what they have or what they want.. just do not try to let people think the same way than you do right now.. not every one needs to know when or why you change your device
adevel said:
Windows Phone 10 is dead because Microsoft wanted that way
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That is old news, and why Windows 10 Mobile is only current. Microsoft does not just do things for any reason. It is by plan. Now if that plan turns out to be bad, then it was still by design and plan that they do what they do. Like all things in life there is bad with good. I am not certain anyone knows the complete end goal for Microsoft or why they had to disappoint. I have hunch you have no clue either...
I am curious as to why did you post this here? There are many social media forums that you could get more discussion out of with topics like this.
Jemec26 said:
...There are others that are developing apps that are exclusive for windows 10 M.
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Name at least three
I use HP Elite x3 and totally love it, but I'm also capable of seeing the real world in which W10M is on deathbed
Nickolas_Shelomov said:
Name at least three
I use HP Elite x3 and totally love it, but I'm also capable of seeing the real world in which W10M is on deathbed
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Rudy Huyn is a big developer, Game troopers and I cannot recall several others developers that just work on that platform
Jemec26 said:
Rudy Huyn is a big developer, Game troopers and I cannot recall several others developers that just work on that platform
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Latest news that i got after searching "Rudy Huyn" are from 2015
Based on the info on their website,Game troopers released ONE game on W10M, so yeah ONE exclusive for os is really a significant amount
The new Nokia isn't like the old one at all. Those new phones they produced barely match the old Nokia phones quality. One thing I like about Nokia was its unrivaled PureView technology. But that technology belongs to Microsoft now and they've already killed Lumia. So, no more smartphone with exclusive camera technology unless they're willing to buy their old technologies back
The thing is though, is that Microsoft is so tight lipped about it all that we do not know and will not know till they say or show something for it. Andromeda devices are the future??? Who knows until Microsoft shows it...
nate0 said:
The thing is though, is that Microsoft is so tight lipped about it all that we do not know and will not know till they say or show something for it. Andromeda devices are the future??? Who knows until Microsoft shows it...
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my opinion is like that: if microsoft doesn't care bout their devices, why they forbid andromeda project? i mean, if they don't care(and it's quite obvious that this is the case), why not open up the source code so those, who DO care will make smth good for all w10m fans, like andromeda reborn or smth? Microsoft will lose nothing in such case, and i mean nothing. But this can potentially help them to get rid of remaining devices so they will return at least some of the spent money to use it in future projects + a lot of people would be grateful for such gesture.
windows phone never die ...
microsoft worked on it since 2003 and our problem its not new windows phone hardwares has stopped at 2011 by htc and started again with nokia windows 10 mobile has something android and ios cant have we can acces xbox store on w10 store . why microsoft is a lazy company ? he cant ban our access ?
do you thinked why microsoft bring appx for pc ? new generation of apps ? no its all for mobile we just need to wait for hardware transform(surface phone) ...
when it happens we can open pc appxs on mobile some good appx we can open by hardware transform (surface phone) :
roblox - kodi and many pc apps thats not available for us
Only time will tell at this point. I get tons more out of W10M then I do on Andoid device. And a heck of lot more out of a W10M phone than a iOS device, that is for sure.
nate0 said:
Only time will tell at this point. I get tons more out of W10M then I do on Andoid device. And a heck of lot more out of a W10M phone than a iOS device, that is for sure.
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Just curious, what do you "get out of W10M" that's not possible with Android?
Even though I can alter the system to the way I need I cannot say it offers everything but from the customizing standpoint it is close to what I get from an Android device minus the boot loader unlocking.
I guess I am picky on what I look for or how productive I am. There is simplicity in the UI with no clutter. Android is a busy OS, and easily out performs all others in the way of notifying you of everything. It sometimes can take more than 2 steps extra to do the same thing I would on a Windows 10M device. I cannot stand the Gboard or any other OEM VKB for that matter. I have always liked the Windows 8.0/10 Virtual Keyboard. I spend most my time on Email, the camera, messaging, and forum reading. I do all of those fluidly (for me) and quickly. On android it seems apps and OS developers are all veering down their own path. Some, apps follow a standard outline others don't. It could take me months of hunting for apps that all fit my day to day usage with out stumbling through each one each time I use them for it to be at par with how I use like an Elite X3 or 950 XL. But that is just me I suppose. I need no social apps, or special apps for doing what I want while away from my PC so I feel no app pressure from my end. On top of that newer apps are coming along slowly but surely. Plus it is a pc plus a phone in my hand if I use continuum. So without rambling on much more those are some ways.
nate0 said:
Even though I can alter the system to the way I need I cannot say it offers everything but from the customizing standpoint it is close to what I get from an Android device minus the boot loader unlocking.
I guess I am picky on what I look for or how productive I am. There is simplicity in the UI with no clutter. Android is a busy OS, and easily out performs all others in the way of notifying you of everything. It sometimes can take more than 2 steps extra to do the same thing I would on a Windows 10M device. I cannot stand the Gboard or any other OEM VKB for that matter. I have always liked the Windows 8.0/10 Virtual Keyboard. I spend most my time on Email, the camera, messaging, and forum reading. I do all of those fluidly (for me) and quickly. On android it seems apps and OS developers are all veering down their own path. Some, apps follow a standard outline others don't. It could take me months of hunting for apps that all fit my day to day usage with out stumbling through each one each time I use them for it to be at par with how I use like an Elite X3 or 950 XL. But that is just me I suppose. I need no social apps, or special apps for doing what I want while away from my PC so I feel no app pressure from my end. On top of that newer apps are coming along slowly but surely. Plus it is a pc plus a phone in my hand if I use continuum. So without rambling on much more those are some ways.
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Thanks for your opinions. I have used phones with Windows Phone / Windows Mobile as work phones since the very first "Pocket PC 2002" devices.
For private use I have Android.
I am trying really hard to like my 950 XL enough to keep using it as my work phone but I have finally give up and will replace it with an Android device. Mainly because I am a heavy MS user, and the MS echo system with Office apps, OneDrive, Outlook, To-Do etc. is so much better on Android. And there are so many things that worked well in WP8.1 that are worse on W10M. I loved the keyboard in WP8.1, in W10M it is not nearly as good.
I don't think it's fair to say that W10M in any way is close to Android when it comes to customization. How do you customize W10M to get night mode or to fix the broken bluetooth audio (since MS doesn't care about these)?
WP8.1 had a fast and fluid UI but W10M on my 950 XL feels slower then my Nexus 6P. There is irritating animations and waiting times everywhere and browsing the Store is so slow compared to Play Store on Android or the store on WP8.1. And multitasking is not working well at all.
The Microsoft Arrow launcher on Android is so much better then the W10M start screen. It gives you great overview from your Outlook calendar and mail and it's widgets are better in every way compared to the "live tiles". It has smart features and are customizable which lets you do tasks directly from the start screen instead of launching apps.
I use both devices daily and the only thing I like better on my 950 XL vs the Nexus 6P is the camera button. Otherwise I can't think of any task or anything that's faster/easier done on the 950 XL. The Edge web browser is clearly slower and more buggy compared to Chrome/Firefox. In general apps load slower and need reloading more often. Etc.
Even if I don't care about the apps (I use my Nexus 6P for apps) I sadly can't find any reason to keep using my 950 XL with it's abandoned OS. For the time being, Android is clearly the way to go if you want to use Microsoft's services in the best way.
dape16 said:
Thanks for your opinions. I have used phones with Windows Phone / Windows Mobile as work phones since the very first "Pocket PC 2002" devices.
For private use I have Android.
I am trying really hard to like my 950 XL enough to keep using it as my work phone but I have finally give up and will replace it with an Android device. Mainly because I am a heavy MS user, and the MS echo system with Office apps, OneDrive, Outlook, To-Do etc. is so much better on Android. And there are so many things that worked well in WP8.1 that are worse on W10M. I loved the keyboard in WP8.1, in W10M it is not nearly as good.
I don't think it's fair to say that W10M in any way is close to Android when it comes to customization. How do you customize W10M to get night mode or to fix the broken bluetooth audio (since MS doesn't care about these)?
WP8.1 had a fast and fluid UI but W10M on my 950 XL feels slower then my Nexus 6P. There is irritating animations and waiting times everywhere and browsing the Store is so slow compared to Play Store on Android or the store on WP8.1. And multitasking is not working well at all.
The Microsoft Arrow launcher on Android is so much better then the W10M start screen. It gives you great overview from your Outlook calendar and mail and it's widgets are better in every way compared to the "live tiles". It has smart features and are customizable which lets you do tasks directly from the start screen instead of launching apps.
I use both devices daily and the only thing I like better on my 950 XL vs the Nexus 6P is the camera button. Otherwise I can't think of any task or anything that's faster/easier done on the 950 XL. The Edge web browser is clearly slower and more buggy compared to Chrome/Firefox. In general apps load slower and need reloading more often. Etc.
Even if I don't care about the apps (I use my Nexus 6P for apps) I sadly can't find any reason to keep using my 950 XL with it's abandoned OS. For the time being, Android is clearly the way to go if you want to use Microsoft's services in the best way.
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To each his own. That is why there are choices...and why there are more than several other OS platforms to choose from for what we need.