Develop Bugs

How can we support WP7 to make sure it succeds? ( and actually gets a version 2 even)

Ive showed my support by getting one myself, most, no, ALL people who have seen my phone are impressed with it. there are also tons of GOOD reviews for WP7 and the devices themselves have received good reviews....so what going wrong? anything we can do?

Open up the API so we can develop more useful applications for the phone!

From a uk perspective, there are 2 issues IMHO.
1) the marketing, not visible enough and not helped by sales staff in carrier shops and online not knowing about wp7 and/or actively selling against it. All the phone shops in my loca mall still have huge iPhone 4 banners in the window and that was launched months ago.
2) if anyone does get as far as thinking about getting a wp7, they come to a site like this to research it and are immediately greeted by loads of posts about wp7 being crap because you can't sync with outlook 1995 via a piece of string attached to a commodore PET running dos 1.0, and WP7 being crap cos you can't load custom roms etc.
I like wp7 and I want Microsoft to fill the gaps with the missing features, what concerns me is that if all the negativity results in poor sales, MS will have less incentive to spend money on the platform. We have to "evangelise" with positive posts on forums like this highlighting the many good features of the platform, and where we criticise, it should be constructive. I have used all the main mobile OS's, I think wp7 has the most promise and am proud to say I am a fan.

you are spot on! the UK marketing is EXTREEMLY poor and whats with 8GB?? how can we make MS take notice of whats really going on over here in the UK?

I havev16gb on my hd7, I don't use it all (only 4th at the mo).

go into t-mobile stores and tell the reps how much you like it. It seems like T-Mobile employees have been instructed to be anti-WP7. The 3 stores I went to to buy a case, screen protector, and the phone itself all seemed to bring up the problems with WM 6.5 when I was looking at the phones.
All of them were also surprised that I liked the phone alot and couldn't believe I used to have a nexus one and then a vibrant. When I bought the phone the sales rep kept trying to talk me out of it also. I've also seen plent of people posting the same comments about t-mobile here on this forum.

What are some creative apps that can be done quickly to fill in gaps?
I'd say one way to get some sustainability is to work with companies that currently have iphone/droid apps and offer services to help deliver a WP7 app - either through custom work for them directly or seeking out a new open source project/effort.
i've been communicating with NPR myself to get the framework for an open source npr app. If people go to npr.com and see a winodws phone app listed there they may feel a tad more comforatable that their phone is feature rich and relevent. Same could be said for other popular institutions that have apps available where there is no current wp7 branding

One of the things I find disheartening is the misunderstanding that 7 can't do something just because the 6.5 way to do that job can't be copied over. Case in point: MyPhone. There are plenty of threads where folk get riled up because they can't believe that MS could forget to make 7 compatible with MyPhone! What's even more disturbing is the lack of responses in those threads about how MyPhone is utterly obsolete now due to Live.
To reiterate what has been said already, those of us that have actually used 7 need to get out there a lot more and help answer questions and concerns, especially when they're just flat-out wrong or based on misunderstanding. If anything, that's what's gonna help with understanding of adoption of the platform.
As far as success goes, though, I don't really see any need for worry. MS is obviously expressing a serious desire to compete here, and is laying out the resources to do it right. They did it with the Xbox when folk thought they were crazy and couldn't possibly break into that market, and they're coming in fierce with 7 now.
At this point, we only need to be honest. Let it be known what you like and dislike, and help folk around you to make informed decisions.
Also, have lots of fun playing with the things. People respond well to information, but a smile is also very telling, and infectious.

FL5 said:
Case in point: MyPhone. There are plenty of threads where folk get riled up because they can't believe that MS could forget to make 7 compatible with MyPhone! What's even more disturbing is the lack of responses in those threads about how MyPhone is utterly obsolete now due to Live.
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That's not true. There's no document or text message backup with Live. Those are critical features that must be implemented to make it a real My Phone replacement.

jeffgeno said:
That's not true. There's no document or text message backup with Live. Those are critical features that must be implemented to make it a real My Phone replacement.
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I like how you dismissed everything pertinent in that post to pick out that one part to whinge about, managing to both miss the point entirely and not contribute to the topic.
That being said, I guess I need to look into how to back up SMS. Not something I usually worry about, as I view SMS as disposable data (and partly because winmo got me used to having to clear SMS to prevent lag. Not really relevant anymore, I suppose), but it might be handy info in case I need to answer a question.

Buy games and apps on the marketplace. If this phone is going to survive we need developers writing quality apps. When you do download an app/game rate it and leave comments. Even if the app/game is free let the developer know there's interest in it.

this thread is a repeat of before... but as i said before... the best way to get people into windows phone is to let them use yours. i've shown my phone to a lot of my friends and all of them really like it. a lot of them iPhone users. let them play with your phone, the messaging, email, even facebook app. it's a risk to you cause they could do stuff to your wall but in the end it shows them what it's like. sure, they're not rushing out to buy it now, but at least it's now in their sights and they can think whether they'll stick with the sea of icons, or have a river of them (jokes of course, river being the app list... come on MS implement serach...).

It's really up to MS and the hardware partners.
Case in point..the new Nexus phone for Android from Samsung. The prototype for this phone has been around for a while. Why wasn't this also the Samsung's WP7 offering? 16 GB storage and a sweet body.
Don't get me wrong, I love my Focus, but seeing that Nexus made me cuss a bit.
HD7 - screen issues. HTC surround - speakers are a gimmick and again, lousy screen - compared to the S-Amoled of the Focus. Kick ass hardware is a must.
MS needs to get on the ball and get updates out fast and regular. They have to keep WP7 users interested and invested. That means better communication with us. Let us know in no uncertain terms what is being worked on and it's progress.
If people are confident that MS will keep upgrading/updating the OS, they will jump on board.
Get those missing features into the OS. Roll out those performance enhancements - for God's sake fix the issues with MarketPlace! It's hard enough to be behind on features, MS also has to integrate stuff that's ahead of the competition.
Advertising - the ads for WP7 are not getting the job done. Granted, it's tricky to advertise a brand new OS that's suppose to get MS back in the game while the OS itself is behind the others in features, but there is a huge market out there that won't miss those features. Show the People and Photo hubs in action..show the FB integration in greater detail.
Of course, open up the APIs. I cannot fathom why this is seemingly not a priority.

WP7 suffers from the same issues as Zune did. If they don't open the API then WP7 will fall by the wayside just like Zune.

votum said:
WP7 suffers from the same issues as Zune did. If they don't open the API then WP7 will fall by the wayside just like Zune.
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Don't know what you're talking about but I love my Zune HD and use it daily.
As for Zune falling by the wayside, it's on Xbox and WP7. It's all around and it's somehow on the wayside somewhere? Be real.
As for the APIs, devs seem to be so lazy anyway, I doubt open APIs will bring about the AP revolution you think will happen.
Even offerings from MS have been half-hearted. A lot of APs really could have benefited from the Live Tile technology but for some reason, chose not to implement it.
Devs need to love or at least appear to love what they're doing if we want quality apps.
Apps done right are a joy on my HD7 and I do not regret buying this phone at all. It's just pleasant surprise after pleasant surprise with this OS and I expect the manufacturers of handsets to step up to the bar after they realize it's here to stay. MS will continue to invest heavily in mobile as it is the way of the future. We've only had WP7 for not even 2 months, give it time!

lekki said:
Don't know what you're talking about but I love my Zune HD and use it daily.
As for Zune falling by the wayside, it's on Xbox and WP7. It's all around and it's somehow on the wayside somewhere? Be real.
As for the APIs, devs seem to be so lazy anyway, I doubt open APIs will bring about the AP revolution you think will happen.
Even offerings from MS have been half-hearted. A lot of APs really could have benefited from the Live Tile technology but for some reason, chose not to implement it.
Devs need to love or at least appear to love what they're doing if we want quality apps.
Apps done right are a joy on my HD7 and I do not regret buying this phone at all. It's just pleasant surprise after pleasant surprise with this OS and I expect the manufacturers of handsets to step up to the bar after they realize it's here to stay. MS will continue to invest heavily in mobile as it is the way of the future. We've only had WP7 for not even 2 months, give it time!
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I dunno man,
ask 100 people if they have a Zune or an iPod and or use Zune or iTunes and see what the response is...

orangekid said:
I dunno man,
ask 100 people if they have a Zune or an iPod and or use Zune or iTunes and see what the response is...
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you have a point in that the market is flooded with iPod/iPhone which results in more people using iTunes (so it's a bit of a loaded question).
but yea, as good as the Zune is for those that have it, the marketing that Apple does is just a lot better. I think it was wise that MS move their Zune to windows phone. It is a really good peice of software and many find it better than iTunes (on Windows). But of course, if you have an iPhone (or i product) you're locked into using iTunes, as you are with windows phone. So this is why the numbers for iTunes are so high. If that wasn't the case, there would be far fewer people using iTunes that's for sure.

blahism said:
What are some creative apps that can be done quickly to fill in gaps?
I'd say one way to get some sustainability is to work with companies that currently have iphone/droid apps and offer services to help deliver a WP7 app - either through custom work for them directly or seeking out a new open source project/effort.
i've been communicating with NPR myself to get the framework for an open source npr app. If people go to npr.com and see a winodws phone app listed there they may feel a tad more comforatable that their phone is feature rich and relevent. Same could be said for other popular institutions that have apps available where there is no current wp7 branding
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there is a npr app in the marketplace. good reviews too.

200000 Windows phone users

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1134006593#!/apps/application.php?id=7933375107
Clicked the windows icon on the wall post I created on my friends wall through my phone and it went here which leads me to believe that this is an accurate number of windows phone 7 users who use the integrated Facebook app.

are you certain it's the integrated facebook features or is it the actual facebook app itself?
also, facebook isn't a true measure of the number of people using windows phones as there are a lot who either don't want to tie their phone to facebook, or merely do not have facebook.
edit: i also think you should check out http://wmpoweruser.com/windows-phone-7180000-facebook-users-3800-apps/, and the comments in the latter half of the page. a lot of people bring up valid points on how WMPU done their measurements and how they can't really be founded to be the actual sales figures.

Try it post on a friends wall then go to their wall and click the windows icon next to the wall post you made. I did this through the integrated app. All be it that not all windows phone users have facebook it should be quite accurate that if even half have it which is more likely than not it only equals 400000. I am not a nay sayer I was just dissapointed to see that.

yea i don't doubt that it does link to it as i've seen it myself. though who knows, those numbers (400,000ish) could be right with a lot of issues on the initial launch with lack of devices and what not. also looking at stats from whistleout.com.au (gives comparisons between australian companies, so in this case against telcos), WP7 got 4.8% comparisons compared to 26.8% of Android, and 53.7% of iPhone.
source: http://www.whistleout.com.au/blog/wp7-sales-not-taking-off
disclaimer: iPhone was around in australia and with a greater presence than any other smartphone, and australians are very much tech consumers, and once consumed it's hard to get them off, hence why iPhone is massively stronger here than say in the US (stronger in ratio wise, after all australia is only 22million).

As far as I see it, this isn't even the "real" launch of WP7. It's a launch for early adopters, and 200.000 early adopters is excellent! In January we will see some updates to the platform, and by summer we should see some really cool devices, and I bet MS will start touting WP7 more as apps are getting more available etc etc.

tbh i love the fact that not many people have wp7 yet as it means when people see mine there more impressed. MS knew it would be a slow launch you have to plug away at these things until people catch on (look at android). Once the updates are out we will see great phones and much like the desire was to android we will have one that stands out and pushes it forward.

I hope MS ditches the BOGO deal and instead offers a base dataplan that is included with every new phone. So instead of blowing 199 on a device most people won't be able to do because the contract renewals don't jive up, just pay the carrier for a 500mb/month base data 3g plan. If people can get their monthly costs down the phones will sell more.
Honestly, once Sprint & Verizon have the phones, i think it will be a game changer. The devices will really take off.
Not to mention tons of people are still holding out for the set they want. cough dell cough
not sure how the facebook numbers are tallied.. it jumps by about 25k randomly

Many people waiting on their contracts to expire. I couldn't wait and bought myself an unlocked phone.

Wife and I each have a Focus, I use FB all the time, she never. So hers is not setup....

JETninja said:
Wife and I each have a Focus, I use FB all the time, she never. So hers is not setup....
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The phone isn't being sold as a facebook phone, so i hope people keep that in mind
With that being said, the attach rate for Facebook adoption has to be rather high and that is a good thing if you ask me.
200k mobile users on a new facebook platform that doesn't even support all the fb features yet?
More anecdotatal evidence - i'm seeing lots of my friends message me and tell me they can't wait to get their phone and even some of my nerdy anti-ms friends are jumping in and totally distancing themselves from the hate-rumors fully knowing the small issues will be fixed but the functionality at large is exactly what they're looking for.
Funny enough i had one dude i knew who was totally for android but didn't own an android phone (has an iphone 3g) and when he saw my phone he just spit out the same talking points. I asked him how is iphone 3g works with microSD cards and if tethering was an issue for him and he shut up. he even asked to see my phone later
its going to be a slow start.. from crappy economy to limited carriers but hopefully 2011 with 2 new cdma phones will set things forward!

WP7 is definitely a long-term project and won't have immediate success. However, if MS keep up continual updates next year, then it's going to be a real contender in the market. Can't wait to see what 2011 has in store for WP7 from a user perspective as well as a developer perspective.

I don't have a WP7 device since it's not available here and there's no Cyrillic keyboard, but if I did, I wouldn't enter the Facebook account. There's Windows Live support, and WL can integrate Facebook together with a bunch of other social networks including FB. In FB stats you won't see such access at all because it's done by a Microsoft web service.
Now, I have no clue how many people would use this (you need a WLID but I don't remember whether WL offers to add FB during registration), but this is definitely another possible source of statistical errors.
However, these small numbers actually kind of coincide with another piece of circumstantial evidence - the recently released app download numbers are really tiny.
So yeah, WP7 didn't put the smartphone world on fire, to put it mildly.

Most people that come to my store and buy a wp7 do not log into facebook. I offer to help with it and most of the time they tell me they either dont use facebook or do not want to log in.

Had an HD7 briefly, didnt use facebook on it and wont be using it on my Dell or ever.

I have a WinPhone and don't use facebook. I like to remain incognito. (Which defeats the purpose when I post to these boards)

Wow
More people use facebook than google. Nuf said. Actually if you look at the initial sales numbers of andriod 1.0 and the iphone 1.0 this is probably on par if not better, But it is great to get MS people mad, BTW I am a MS person.
Media center on both laptop and desktop
2 XBOX 360's 1 with kinnect
1 WM 6.5 alway had WM!!!
1 WP7
and manage 1400 win desktops
and 40 win servers
and why.... their technology keeps me employed
I was just amazed that ppl wernt floking in the store.

enterprise is one thing, consumer market... not so much. That and the so much of the media all drink Apple/Google Kool-aid.

It was kind of fun that all the people I work with, who swear to iPhone (I believe they think they're still "special" - not "special" like I think of them, but "special" like not too many people have it) actually admired my new WP7 phone. And I, who said I would rather go down the Android path, might be back on track
Another thing that proves the market is opening to WP is that I already got three programming assignments - and they all want to pay me for making the apps, plus I can charge users for using the app.

What are WP7 Best Features???

MS really need to sort out its advertising campaign i think. Im in the UK and its all very quiet over here, those `really` wouldnt want me to buy a wp7. i was in the US and noticed the presence of WP7 a bit more... but still the question is what is the best way to advertise WP7. what would make you think... i want one of those!!!! doh ive clicked the poll button but it wont give me any options to sort the poll help!!! im sure this happened to me last time.

They need to show what the phone does instead of a bunch of people just using it. The big advantage wp7 has its its unique and fluid interface and they need to show this of more.
I also think they should push the zune pass a lot more as for the law abiding music lovers this is the best music service there is. It also would help if the uk got the 10 perminant downloads a month that the usa get.
As for its presence i don't know if i watch different tv to the rest of you (maybe as my wife makes me watch crap) but i see the wp7 adds more then any other phone though the iphone is very close second.
They also need to check the stores as they are not pushing it bar orange who from what i have seen are the only ones clued up and pushing it (even the tv adverts are for the mozart on orange). When i went to the o2 store the display had 2 demo phones but both where vandalized and just left and the display itself was tucked away round a corner. I think they should also send there own reps out to shopping malls like htc are doing for the desire range and push there brand with there own sales people, displays and demo's. Give people a chance to see it and be shown how it works properly they will love it but one thing i get from non phoney people is that it looks different so they don't know if they would be able to use it then once they see how easy it is there hooked but they need to be shown first before they are sure.

i wanted to poll this how can i do it? when i try polling it did not give me options to type what i wanted.

no business users on xda? would have thought that wp7 office would have scored some points. im always using wp7 office i tend not to write stuff on it but use it to transfer documents. come to think of it. wp7 office is the main reason why i stuck with windows mobile in the first place...after having the laggy htc diamond 2 i wanted some slighty bigger and far quicker and was being drawn towards the dark side when wp7 came along. all the other stuff, like zune, xbox live cemented my decision

Need to tweet this thread to the world

davidebanks said:
no business users on xda? would have thought that wp7 office would have scored some points. im always using wp7 office i tend not to write stuff on it but use it to transfer documents. come to think of it. wp7 office is the main reason why i stuck with windows mobile in the first place...after having the laggy htc diamond 2 i wanted some slighty bigger and far quicker and was being drawn towards the dark side when wp7 came along. all the other stuff, like zune, xbox live cemented my decision
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You are right mate. Office is nice. However this should at least match DocsToGo.
It is available for WM and Android.
Current Office is sweet but absolutely too limited.

Seriously, it's not one thing that really sets WP7, it's the INTEGRATION of ALL those things that sets it apart. When I show my focus off to people, I start with the integration with contacts to facebook (that I have their number/email) and show that I can write on their wall, send an email, txt and stuff and if they have an address, how I can quickly map it to Bing and then find directions. Also updating my facebook status and commenting. Then I show them the voice command for search to call people or find a place and directions. The dedicated camera button. Xbox games and it's graphics. I forget to show them Zune (but I don't have a zune pass) besides how if I go to a youtube video that it saves my recent history so I don't have to remember the site. I also show them pics uploading to facebook and show them how my pictures automatically upload to skydrive and tell them about the 25 GB free of online storage.
It's really how all those things come together which is why I love my WP7. It's SYNERGY! lol.

davidebanks said:
no business users on xda? would have thought that wp7 office would have scored some points. im always using wp7 office i tend not to write stuff on it but use it to transfer documents. come to think of it. wp7 office is the main reason why i stuck with windows mobile in the first place...after having the laggy htc diamond 2 i wanted some slighty bigger and far quicker and was being drawn towards the dark side when wp7 came along. all the other stuff, like zune, xbox live cemented my decision
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I hope you are not serious about business users. As our Chief Security Officer put it for our CEO and CTO when they brought their wp7 devices to work and wanted integrate them with our Exchange environment: "leave the toys at home".
Sent from my Nero powered Vibrant

lqaddict said:
I hope you are not serious about business users. As our Chief Security Officer put it for our CEO and CTO when they brought their wp7 devices to work and wanted integrate them with our Exchange environment: "leave the toys at home".
Sent from my Nero powered Vibrant
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Puhleeezee....

Forget the rest of the features, it's going to be Xbox Live that sells it to the mainstream.. they've already started advertising this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHNWL-WdzsM

wspaw said:
Puhleeezee....
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Believe it or not but setting AllowSimplePassword was more than enough to violate the security policy enforced http://social.technet.microsoft.com...tions-when-using-windows-phone-7-clients.aspx
The subject of on-device encryption just put a final nail.
It might be ok for small businesses not to care about these policies but large organizations rely on the security provided by the Exchange if they care about security of their email transactions.
Sent from my Nero powered Vibrant

I went into O2 today and asked to see the HTC HD7 (was with a friend and left mine at home). and the guy said, yes, but we also have the iPhone and took us to it without asking me. Which greatly saddened me as the WP7 has better features like (bing search to find places near you faster, back button, smooth/glossy/simple interface, Xbox live, better music marketplace, better SDK ect). but if you don't know much, you would have go to the iPhone. Yet another idiot who doesn't know anything about phones. Selling phones >.<.

All of them partially! I mean none of them separately is SO amazing but TOGETHER...
You don't believe Facebook is the only key selling point.
You may laugh but office IS important too.
The mix is important. Fluid modern OS. And integrity with MS services.
Also the fact that WP7 devices are highend. Good browser and Email. Homescreen.

Its a tough choice I think which comes down to personal preferance at least it shows that wp7 has a lot of good things working for it. Looks like Xbox live is taking a good lead Microsoft would be wise to exploit their Xbox users to give wp7 a good advantage over other phones

wspaw said:
Puhleeezee....
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Agree, Lol!
WP7 actually has better Exchange support than Android, and the data on the devices are more secure than on Android devices.
But given who you quoted, I'm not surprised

Looks like I'm only 1 of 2 who voted for the Bing search. I really like the voice integration and the way it gives you the 3 categories. News, web, local.

action_efn_jackson said:
Looks like I'm only 1 of 2 who voted for the Bing search. I really like the voice integration and the way it gives you the 3 categories. News, web, local.
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Google has this. The differences are mostly in the user interface. It's not an advantage.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

N8ter said:
Google has this. The differences are mostly in the user interface. It's not an advantage.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
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and it's US only.

Fine for most business users
lqaddict said:
Believe it or not but setting AllowSimplePassword was more than enough to violate the security policy enforced http://social.technet.microsoft.com...tions-when-using-windows-phone-7-clients.aspx
The subject of on-device encryption just put a final nail.
It might be ok for small businesses not to care about these policies but large organizations rely on the security provided by the Exchange if they care about security of their email transactions.
Sent from my Nero powered Vibrant
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Exactly. I own 2 small businesses and WP7 is fine (better that WM and Android for me). I'd wager most WP7 users are not in large corporate environments where email security is on the forefront - I can't imagine anyone hacking my phone for my email.
davidebanks was serious in recommending WP7 for business users. Probably the majority of them, as there are many, many industries with mobile needs that don't need such airtight email security (it can still be fairly secure, btw).
To say that he shouldn't be serious and to quote your Chief Security Officer's cute little one-liner dismissing every device on the platform as a toy is a disservice to those using this tread for what it is intended for. There is a thread comparing WP7 to Android, btw.

N8ter said:
Google has this. The differences are mostly in the user interface. It's not an advantage.
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As in a Google App or Andriod OS?

Official: Mango Public Unveiling on May 24th

Just under 2 weeks now .
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/microsoft/microsoft-slates-mango-vip-unveiling-for-may-24-in-new-york/9389

does the developers kit mean that develpoers will get mango on their wp7, or they can only make wp7 apps? As I can sign up to become a developer for free due to dreamspark?

andoridkiller said:
does the developers kit mean that develpoers will get mango on their wp7, or they can only make wp7 apps? As I can sign up to become a developer for free due to dreamspark?
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I doubt it. I expect it'll just run in the emulator.
Also, you have to submit an app if you're signing up through DreamSpark to get your identity verified by GeoTrust.
Casey

I'm excited to see what they announce. All the features leaked over the last few days are already nice (plus all the Developer goodies announced at MIX), but you know thats just the tip of the iceberg, and they will probably have one or two major things to announce as well.

Probably the best thing they can do right now. The OS is dead until Mango/Nokia. When Nokia devices hit with Mango I expect to see a huge spike in sales and development.

Casey_boy said:
I doubt it. I expect it'll just run in the emulator.
Also, you have to submit an app if you're signing up through DreamSpark to get your identity verified by GeoTrust.
Casey
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Yes Developers will get an image to install on there test phones this has been stated several times including at mix11.

vetvito said:
Probably the best thing they can do right now. The OS is dead until Mango/Nokia. When Nokia devices hit with Mango I expect to see a huge spike in sales and development.
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The OS is far from dead, and a steady marketshare despite the disgusting drop in Windows Mobile sales shows that. Microsoft is basically countering the complete loss of Windows Mobile market sales with Windows Phone, which can't be an easy task, to be honest. People don't see this. And all the reports I've read show this, aside the biased blogs which look like they were written by users on this site.
But, I do agree with the huge spike coming with Mango and Nokia. Microsoft has developed a steady foundation where many developers have seen the ease in development for the platform. Therefore, once the available apis are there, I see them all joining the platform. After all, they're here to make money, and the more OS platforms they're on, the more potential they have.
Honestly, the phone is fine as it is now, it does everything the real public wants, aside from chat and Words With Friends -.- and things like AIM are basically dead to the American teenage market, where FB Chat has taken over and Skype. Come Mango, the "missing" features will flood in, and with Verizon's marketing history, and Nokia's dominance, I think the outlook is significantly more positive than some on here would lead you to believe.
This is Microsoft, they don't lose.

FiyaFleye said:
Honestly, the phone is fine as it is now, it does everything the real public wants
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No it's not, most people have issues with Live Tiles and Notifications and that's a big deal. When you get an eBay "outbid" notification after the auction is over you would agree it is totally pointless.
aside from chat and Words With Friends -.- and things like AIM are basically dead to the American teenage market, where FB Chat has taken over and Skype.
This is Microsoft, they don't lose.
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To be fair AlphaJax is just as good as Words With Friends .
You're totally wrong on AIM, there are enough people who can't be bothered to go through facebook to chat with their friends. Have you seen how popular BBM is? Not to mention WLM and Google Talk.
Come Mango, the "missing" features will flood in, and with Verizon's marketing history, and Nokia's dominance, I think the outlook is significantly more positive than some on here would lead you to believe.
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Partly agree, Mango will make it a great OS and that's the OS that will sell people, not Verizon (which is US only) or Nokia, although they will help.
This is Microsoft, they don't lose.
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Click to collapse
I'm a MS fan too but can't occult Windows Mobile 6.5, Zune or Kin as overall failures.

The problem with Skype isn't really its existence or lack thereof. It's the fact that major players like Google and Microsoft do not have decent mobile clients. Windows Live Messenger supports VoIP and Video Calling. So did Google Talk and look how long it took Google to add it into Android. I'm unsure if Micorsoft is adding this in Mango, but we don't know all the details.
Read reviews online. Most people who post them want Skype for the Video Calling and Free Skype to Skype VoIP. With the proliferation of Smartphones these days, in many cases it's just dumb to pay Skype anything when you can have your friends install the app and do it all for free, Lol.
Google and Microsoft have the capacity to offer those same services with a better user experience. They just need to get off of their asses and do it. Skype hysteria is completely due to services like WLM and Google Talk sucking on smartphones.
Then again, Skype would probably file AntiTrust suits against them if they did that
I've never understood people who were all "SKYPE SKYPE SKYPE!" when they really should be saying "fix your fking mobile clients so we don't have to install this boring battery hogging app that restricts functionality on various platforms because they have carrier deals" and things like that.

Peew971 said:
No it's not, most people have issues with Live Tiles and Notifications and that's a big deal. When you get an eBay "outbid" notification after the auction is over you would agree it is totally pointless.
To be fair AlphaJax is just as good as Words With Friends .
You're totally wrong on AIM, there are enough people who can't be bothered to go through facebook to chat with their friends. Have you seen how popular BBM is? Not to mention WLM and Google Talk.
Partly agree, Mango will make it a great OS and that's the OS that will sell people, not Verizon (which is US only) or Nokia, although they will help.
Unnecessary fanboyism. I'm a MS fan too but can't occult Windows Mobile 6.5, Zune or Kin as overall failures.
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Click to collapse
People is very inclusive. I had to intentionally break my Live Tiles for them to stop working. But, I do agree Push Notifications needs work, however, this is not a vital piece of the phone, and none of the major apps even use it. I do get extremely irritated when Microsoft can't communicate with my phone and it returns back to the server that I can't be reached... It should continue to try... Which is unfortunate as it takes Rowi & such to provide fixes, which shows its possible to make them more reliable for now. Second, BBM isn't AIM, I would argue that GTalk or whatever the hell it is would be more important than AIM, and there are already alternates. I believe AIM is the only major player with no support, third party included, on the OS, but you need to understand that THIS generation of American teenagers relies more on FB & Skype/Oovoo than I did on AIM 10 years ago... AlphaJax may be as good, but it doesn't have the cross-platform ability of WWF, nor its popularity. Potential iPhone customers want to see the name WWF, and Angry Birds, not Alpha Jax and Chicks&Vixens...
For you to downplay the Verizon inclusion, or Nokia deal is ridiculous tho, and we usually agree issues from what I've seen. Verizon singlehandedly blew Android up. ALONE, Lol. They made Motorola relevant again too. Verizon and AT&T jumping on the WP7 bandwagon is important, extremely. Microsoft is an American company, and as we saw with Xbox, their American success determines how hard they pursue the rest of the world. WP7 MUST be a success here, and I believe it will be... Android is also in trouble, lots of it, legal wise from what I keep reading.
Fanboyism? WinMo was a success until the market changed lol, a huge success. They just didn't want to jump into the consumer market the way they should have, but WinMo was huge... So huge that it's still being developed for on here, when it's pretty useless when it comes to the average consumer. Kin was a failure because I'm almost positive they were using it as a guinea pig for their cloud services... Which sucks for those customers. The Zune wasn't a failure either, they just didn't back it with the necessary advertising. But as far as a product, it was extremely successful, and it most cases, better than the iPod... And it led the way to this OS...
Microsoft has a history of pouring money into things it wants to succeed until it gets it right... I just see that. Apple got "lucky" with the iPhone, and they've run with it. And the iPhone has singlehandedly made they cool enough to own all of their products. But I see Microsoft's attempt to integrate everything now as a "we'll own these markets if it kills us" approach.

FiyaFleye said:
People is very inclusive. I had to intentionally break my Live Tiles for them to stop working. But, I do agree Push Notifications needs work, however, this is not a vital piece of the phone, and none of the major apps even use it. I do get extremely irritated when Microsoft can't communicate with my phone and it returns back to the server that I can't be reached... It should continue to try... Which is unfortunate as it takes Rowi & such to provide fixes, which shows its possible to make them more reliable for now. Second, BBM isn't AIM, I would argue that GTalk or whatever the hell it is would be more important than AIM, and there are already alternates. I believe AIM is the only major player with no support, third party included, on the OS, but you need to understand that THIS generation of American teenagers relies more on FB & Skype/Oovoo than I did on AIM 10 years ago... AlphaJax may be as good, but it doesn't have the cross-platform ability of WWF, nor its popularity. Potential iPhone customers want to see the name WWF, and Angry Birds, not Alpha Jax and Chicks&Vixens...
For you to downplay the Verizon inclusion, or Nokia deal is ridiculous tho, and we usually agree issues from what I've seen. Verizon singlehandedly blew Android up. ALONE, Lol. They made Motorola relevant again too. Verizon and AT&T jumping on the WP7 bandwagon is important, extremely. Microsoft is an American company, and as we saw with Xbox, their American success determines how hard they pursue the rest of the world. WP7 MUST be a success here, and I believe it will be... Android is also in trouble, lots of it, legal wise from what I keep reading.
Fanboyism? WinMo was a success until the market changed lol, a huge success. They just didn't want to jump into the consumer market the way they should have, but WinMo was huge... So huge that it's still being developed for on here, when it's pretty useless when it comes to the average consumer. Kin was a failure because I'm almost positive they were using it as a guinea pig for their cloud services... Which sucks for those customers. The Zune wasn't a failure either, they just didn't back it with the necessary advertising. But as far as a product, it was extremely successful, and it most cases, better than the iPod... And it led the way to this OS...
Microsoft has a history of pouring money into things it wants to succeed until it gets it right... I just see that. Apple got "lucky" with the iPhone, and they've run with it. And the iPhone has singlehandedly made they cool enough to own all of their products. But I see Microsoft's attempt to integrate everything now as a "we'll own these markets if it kills us" approach.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
- Teenagers might rely more on facebook but remember teenagers aren't the target from what MS stated last year. IM might still be the best option.
- Agreed on WWF, didn't know it was cross-platform. Don't get me started on Xbox Live.
- Maybe it's best to focus on other territories just as much, if not more than on the US. Verizon isn't in Europe but Android are still selling like hot cakes.
The key IMO is to have the best possible OS and as many carriers onboard as possible. I'm not downplaying Verizon, just stating doing well in the US isn't the end of the road (e.g. the Xbox 360 is behind the PS3 in worldwide sales).
The Nokia deal is great but many people have stayed with Nokia for Symbian (oddly enough) so not all users will carry over to WP7.
Let the OS do the talking is what I say, more than Verizon and Nokia.
- Yes Winmo was a success, I specifically said Winmo 6.5 which was an attempt to stay relevant in a changing market. That didn't work.
Zune was/is a great player (I went through 2) but it wasn't a success, which was the point I was arguing.
Kin was a failure, I'm sure they believed in it. Just like Zune it can bring great features to WP7 though.
So you must admit that your "MS never lose" was a bit pushing it, I'm sure other people can find other examples.
I'm just as optimistic as you are probably for WP7, it's just that I don't see it as a walk in the park at all.

you need to understand that THIS generation of American teenagers relies more on FB & Skype/Oovoo than I did on AIM 10 years ago... AlphaJax may be as good, but it doesn't have the cross-platform ability of WWF, nor its popularity. Potential iPhone customers want to see the name WWF, and Angry Birds, not Alpha Jax and Chicks&Vixens...
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Click to collapse
Is this a teenage phone? You may be on to something here.
For you to downplay the Verizon inclusion, or Nokia deal is ridiculous tho, and we usually agree issues from what I've seen. Verizon singlehandedly blew Android up. ALONE, Lol.
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Click to collapse
So verizon made a ton of different Androids, and sold them around the world to zillions of people. Don't let a single ad campaign fool you. You have to forget about HTC, Samsung, and Motorola to say that. I can guarantee you, it won't happen for WP.
Microsoft is an American company, and as we saw with Xbox, their American success determines how hard they pursue the rest of the world. WP7 MUST be a success here, and I believe it will be... Android is also in trouble, lots of it, legal wise from what I keep reading.
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Click to collapse
OMG, the Xbox crutch. Stop it. Microsoft is a consumer failure, and you guys rely on this one product to measure its success.
Also, you know Oracle had to drop 98% of their claims against Android.
Fanboyism? WinMo was a success until the market changed lol, a huge success.
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Click to collapse
A huge success? Please stop it. The sales have never been great. The HD2 is the highest selling Microsoft phone EVER.
Kin was a failure because I'm almost positive they were using it as a guinea pig for their cloud services... Which sucks for those customers.
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Click to collapse
No, the company you praise called Verizon made Kin fail. It had a high ass smartphone data plan.
The Zune wasn't a failure either, they just didn't back it with the necessary advertising. But as far as a product, it was extremely successful, and it most cases, better than the iPod... And it led the way to this OS...
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It was better than the iPod, it just didn't do as much as the iPod. Zune wasn't a success either. Stop it. Everyone knows it wasn't.
Microsoft has a history of pouring money into things it wants to succeed until it gets it right... I just see that.
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Name 4 consumer products that succeeded from Microsoft. Products that don't involve another corporation or OEM, Microsoft consumer products. I'll start
1. Xbox
2. ?
3. ?
4. ?
Apple got "lucky" with the iPhone, and they've run with it. And the iPhone has singlehandedly made they cool enough to own all of their products. But I see Microsoft's attempt to integrate everything now as a "we'll own these markets if it kills us" approach.
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Click to collapse
They got lucky with the iPhone? Sure my friend, lets not go there.

Peew971 said:
- Teenagers might rely more on facebook but remember teenagers aren't the target from what MS stated last year. IM might still be the best option.
- Agreed on WWF, didn't know it was cross-platform. Don't get me started on Xbox Live.
- Maybe it's best to focus on other territories just as much, if not more than on the US. Verizon isn't in Europe but Android are still selling like hot cakes.
The key IMO is to have the best possible OS and as many carriers onboard as possible. I'm not downplaying Verizon, just stating doing well in the US isn't the end of the road (e.g. the Xbox 360 is behind the PS3 in worldwide sales).
The Nokia deal is great but many people have stayed with Nokia for Symbian (oddly enough) so not all users will carry over to WP7.
Let the OS do the talking is what I say, more than Verizon and Nokia.
- Yes Winmo was a success, I specifically said Winmo 6.5 which was an attempt to stay relevant in a changing market. That didn't work.
Zune was/is a great player (I went through 2) but it wasn't a success, which was the point I was arguing.
Kin was a failure, I'm sure they believed in it. Just like Zune it can bring great features to WP7 though.
So you must admit that your "MS never lose" was a bit pushing it, I'm sure other people can find other examples.
I'm just as optimistic as you are probably for WP7, it's just that I don't see it as a walk in the park at all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
XBL is hindered by the lack of APIs, we both know that. We're going to see multiplayer the second Mango lands, I'll bet anything on that. Also, the OS can do all it wants, but when HTC and such put horrible quality cameras, and hardware on these devices, it's going to hinder their sales. I've been fortunate, but others haven't in terms of cameras and such.
About Android, they're about to have that success because of their explosion here though, and that's my point. Microsoft needs to succeed on its turf before it can succeed everywhere, same as Google did with Verizon.
And the PS3 might be ahead in lifetime sales, but my point is that now the 360 is the #1 platform afaik... And has been for a significant while now. And like I said about the Kin, I don't think they ever cared about the Kin, just what it offered, and how they could test their cloud services... At least it seemed like it. they released the Kin after development of WP started... Which leads me to believe they weren't in it for the long run.

vetvito said:
Probably the best thing they can do right now. The OS is dead until Mango/Nokia. When Nokia devices hit with Mango I expect to see a huge spike in sales and development.
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It's not dead. Not by a long shot..
WP7 has slow adoption rates but it's doing fine. The general public who buys most of this stuff has no idea Mango exists or what it would do for them.
WP7 is a great, feature rich, easy to use and elegant OS. It has what it needs to excel it just needs more advertising and some kick ass hardware like Android has been getting.
Updates like Mango only appeal to the very small number of enthusiasts such as ourselves.

It depends on how you define dead. Form a development perspective it's dead. There are too many things you simply can't do on the platform, nad there are too many apps that are impossible to port due to the lack of APIs. From that point of view it's dead. Mango will change that. Mango will also make the platform more desireable because it won't be seen as a dead end for so many people, as WP7 currently is with it's limitations and lack of top/useful apps.
If you mean dead by ceasing to exist than that's not possible, not even Windows Mobile is dead yet, if going by that definition.
But there cannot be much momentum for WP7 until Mango hits. The OS was released in a state that simply doesn't allow it at the moment.
If you look at WP7 and Mango the way Microsoft looks at them: two completely different OS releases instead of a base OS and an update or SP, then the average consumer who brought these devices and were forced (using the term loosely) to use it in its current state should be pretty pissed, IMO. I think Microsoft would have struggled to sell half the devices they did if they told users up front they'd have to wait a year for a decent feature update before it RTM'd...
The way they view it, trying to justify the current state of the OS with Mango is like trying to justify RTM Vista using Windows 7 as a rebuttal. It just doesn't work, especially when users have months of this clunky user experience to look forward to before they get an update, and lord knows how to carriers will handle that...

N8ter said:
The problem with Skype isn't really its existence or lack thereof. It's the fact that major players like Google and Microsoft do not have decent mobile clients. Windows Live Messenger supports VoIP and Video Calling. So did Google Talk and look how long it took Google to add it into Android. I'm unsure if Micorsoft is adding this in Mango, but we don't know all the details.
Read reviews online. Most people who post them want Skype for the Video Calling and Free Skype to Skype VoIP. With the proliferation of Smartphones these days, in many cases it's just dumb to pay Skype anything when you can have your friends install the app and do it all for free, Lol.
Google and Microsoft have the capacity to offer those same services with a better user experience. They just need to get off of their asses and do it. Skype hysteria is completely due to services like WLM and Google Talk sucking on smartphones.
Then again, Skype would probably file AntiTrust suits against them if they did that
I've never understood people who were all "SKYPE SKYPE SKYPE!" when they really should be saying "fix your fking mobile clients so we don't have to install this boring battery hogging app that restricts functionality on various platforms because they have carrier deals" and things like that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
windows Live/Massanger whatever you call it will be built in/integrated in the contacts/people tile.
MS is trying to buy Skype, or joint venture, so u will see video call on WP7.5 devices...

N8ter said:
It depends on how you define dead. Form a development perspective it's dead. There are too many things you simply can't do on the platform, nad there are too many apps that are impossible to port due to the lack of APIs.
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Click to collapse
Last time I checked, Marketplace was doing just fine for a platform that's 6 months old. I agree there are gaps in functionality and things devs can't do, but does it warrant the term "dead" really?
N8ter said:
But there cannot be much momentum for WP7 until Mango hits. The OS was released in a state that simply doesn't allow it at the moment.
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Click to collapse
Mango schmango. WP7 won't have any serious marketshare until it gets dozens of devices and worldwide distribution. Even if it were the most functional thing in the world it would still need it, otherwise it's doomed to linger in the WebOS type of marketshare limbo.
Oh, and a couple of "flagships", too.
N8ter said:
If you look at WP7 and Mango the way Microsoft looks at them: two completely different OS releases instead of a base OS and an update or SP, then the average consumer who brought these devices and were forced (using the term loosely) to use it in its current state should be pretty pissed, IMO.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why should I be pissed, sorry?

vetvito said:
Probably the best thing they can do right now. The OS is dead until Mango/Nokia. When Nokia devices hit with Mango I expect to see a huge spike in sales and development.
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Click to collapse
Waiting for this but i'm not holding my breath. With their track record, this Mango update could get released waaay late 2011 or early 2012. Maybe when the flagship Nokia/WP7 comes out with better specs than what is present (3year? old specs), and IF they expand their marketplace/zune support to include my country, with way better apps and games that are worth the Xbox Live logo ( Lunar Lander anyone?) i'll consider picking one up again (gave my HTC Trophy to my sister).

Seriously, this is just a preview. Stop complaining people.
We are going to have everything we asked for!
Messenger, Skype, Twitter and Facebook inside our OS like no other.
Better push notifications, faster, more reliable.
API, API, API and more API.
IE9
Multi Task for third apps(!!!!!!!!!!!)
New languages, dictionarys, markets..
And bug corrections.
What more do you want? Microsoft wouldn't announce something like "Oh, and it download embedded images from email. It's magical!".
Or you expect they to mention something stupid like that?
Wait and try the OS by yourself.
Usually, I'm complaining about MS and their failures. But.. Seriously, they're doing everything fine about Mango. At least, until now.
I bet someone will say "oh, it doesn't have video chat". Screw it. No one uses it. Even the 'Almighty' Android doesn't have it. Guess just now, and just for Nexus S. No one really care. It's just to say "I have it!".
Stop complaining for nothing. Microsoft is doing great!

vetvito said:
^ I can agree with that. Early adopters will be the one's screwed over.
I also believe Nokia will be the only maker of WP devices, if not the only, they will be the most dominant. That is if, they stop their other projects.
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Click to collapse
Why? I think the samsung devices are doing fine, once mango has more languages a new major part of the world will start buying the devices. Right now if a phone is not in your native language a lot of people are not interested thus it is not marketed in those countries (half of europe). Imagine these markets which are very wealthy countries (some of the most wealthy countries actually) start to buy wp7. In these countries the design of the software is very important, maybe even more important than the features and if HTC will also design good devices along with Samsung I think they will stay. The people who've seen my phone asked me what it was and if I like it. I say yes, however native language support + multitasking + next level apps (all comming with mango) will really make it a superb platform.
Most guys here are phone tweakers, dont forget the majority of the customers are not like us and if they see some well designed apps like IMDB they are sold.
The reality at the moment is no native language for those countries, buggy features because of the system locale settings, no marketing/advertisement, no possibility yet to BUY apps (yes this is very important for a smartphone). Once Mango drops the word will spread and it will surely count. Samsung who sells a lot of its devices on these markets will see boosts in sales, I can see people being done with android or BB or iphone after those years of the same lay-out, so a change to WP7 will be very logical and if all desired features will be there people will enjoy it and tell their friends,

The Perfect Windows Phone Ad?

There are rumours this will be turned into an ad campaign, time will tell.

The "really" ad was true to life and not a rigged survey like this one is, but hey, we're talking marketing soooooooo... it should get interesting.

ohgood said:
The "really" ad was true to life and not a rigged survey like this one is, but hey, we're talking marketing soooooooo... it should get interesting.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't get your point at all. How are the "really" ads more true to life than this? This is not a survey, these are real life scenarios, have you even watched the video?

ohgood said:
The "really" ad was true to life and not a rigged survey like this one is, but hey, we're talking marketing soooooooo... it should get interesting.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think it's rigged dude...

Nope. MS should just watch iphone ads and copy them
For example: an iphone ad will be something like "with the iphone you can do, x, y, z" with video on how to do them all in the ad.
With WP7 ads sometimes even I have no idea what they are trying to do, or even then how to do it (the guy shopping with his kids typing in a document in skydrive). Keep it simple and to the point.

pillsburydoughman said:
Nope. MS should just watch iphone ads and copy them
For example: an iphone ad will be something like "with the iphone you can do, x, y, z" with video on how to do them all in the ad.
With WP7 ads sometimes even I have no idea what they are trying to do, or even then how to do it (the guy shopping with his kids typing in a document in skydrive). Keep it simple and to the point.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I totally agree with copying what Apple does, it's just great and Google has started doing it too (for non-Android services) but the above video is still miles better than all the generic stuff Microsoft has been doing so far.

cool video. It wasn't rigged but the contestants were obviously not prepared.
First test the guy could have stopped the app and it would have found the song.
The others didn't make use of their widgets, instead they went looking for the app.
Nice try though.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk

Well you're right, but the whole point of the contest is to show how on WP7 you don't have to look for a way to do things faster (like stopping soundhound).

vetvito said:
cool video. It wasn't rigged but the contestants were obviously not prepared.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed.
First test the guy could have stopped the app and it would have found the song.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Couldn't the WP7 guy as well? Wouldn't a fair test be both to run its course?
The others didn't make use of their widgets, instead they went looking for the app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. Again, not prepared. I was shocked the iPhone beat the WP7 with its straight to camera ability. But then I remembered iOS5.
Nice try though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I love this campaign. It has more meaning than the "really" one which is entertaining but does not really show anything. The one great thing about the iPhone/iPad ads are they fully demonstrate the products' capabilities. The Macs take that entertaining approach.
Has my thumbs up.

nicksti said:
I was shocked the iPhone beat the WP7 with its straight to camera ability. But then I remembered iOS5.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To Me the WP won if it was based on who said uploading first now as far as the completed task there are many other variables like which image was larger thus taking longer to post to twitter.

rruffman said:
To Me the WP won if it was based on who said uploading first now as far as the completed task there are many other variables like which image was larger thus taking longer to post to twitter.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Either way, this campaign drives the message home:
"Get in, get out, get on with your life."

Peew971 said:
I don't get your point at all. How are the "really" ads more true to life than this? This is not a survey, these are real life scenarios, have you even watched the video?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The "really" ads showed people staring at their phones, walking into doors, refusing sex, etc which is true to life.
The survey is neither scientific nor prepared users other than the surveyor offering a $100 bet. He decides the task, instead of an impartial third party. Give an impartial third party the opportunity to decide random tasks, it will be very different and less dramatic.
^ this is why I said its marketing, soooooo you know.

LOL, everybody on here that's mad and complaining got smoked by a Windows Phone.

sinister1 said:
LOL, everybody on here that's mad and complaining got smoked by a Windows Phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
now that's funnay, sigline updated !

nicksti said:
Agreed.I was shocked the iPhone beat the WP7 with its straight to camera ability. But then I remembered iOS5.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We'll see:
http://wmpoweruser.com/microsoft-applies-for-patent-on-locked-mode-camera-access-in-smartphones
I seem to remember some iFan reporting on iOS 5 and how one of the reasons it was so much better than Windows Phone was because you could access the camera from the lock screen. He was oblivious that WP7 had done this first, and a year earlier, and would have had serious egg on his face if anyone had ever bothered correcting him.

drokkon said:
We'll see:
http://wmpoweruser.com/microsoft-applies-for-patent-on-locked-mode-camera-access-in-smartphones
I seem to remember some iFan reporting on iOS 5 and how one of the reasons it was so much better than Windows Phone was because you could access the camera from the lock screen. He was oblivious that WP7 had done this first, and a year earlier, and would have had serious egg on his face if anyone had ever bothered correcting him.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There was a nokia something or other years ago that did this. Not that it matters who was first, its an awesome feature reguardless !

The ads were interesting and did prove some points, but too social network-centered. Come on, you don't choose a phone just because it allows you to quickly post stuff to Twitter. I don't facebook and post to Twitter twice a month, so this is hardly useful. And cameras on most Windows phones suck, especially first-generation models.
No mentions of
- integrated Office
- contact grouping (Android 4 does something like this, but WP7 is better)
- best-of-class email (reading large emails is much better in WP7 than Android)
Now if they did some other real-world scenarios:
- Use turn-by-turn navigation without distracting (Android navigation is a lot better)
- Load an Ajax-heavy page over a crappy network connection (Opera Mini obviously wins)
- Use a non-facebook online messenger, such as Google Talk or ICQ, or a non-integrated social network
- Uploading a bunch of documents for later reference with a USB cable instead of using Skydrive or email
- Identifying a random object (sorry, Bing Vision is pathetic compared to Google Goggles)
- Making a Skype call
- Switching between third-party apps without them losing state
that would make the competition a lot more interesting!
Or if they offered contestants to propose the challenge instead of the predefined scenarios.

ohgood said:
The "really" ads showed people staring at their phones, walking into doors, refusing sex, etc which is true to life.
The survey is neither scientific nor prepared users other than the surveyor offering a $100 bet. He decides the task, instead of an impartial third party. Give an impartial third party the opportunity to decide random tasks, it will be very different and less dramatic.
^ this is why I said its marketing, soooooo you know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think I have walked into doors or been refused sex - so don't seem like that's a real life situation for me!
Anyways, if you did read about the 'survey' which was a challenge as a matter of fact - you would have known. The 'survey' wasn't meant to be scientific or wasn't meant to compared the 'cores' of phones. We know the hardware boasting of android is much above par. Dual cores, nearly 2ghz sorta processor etc etc.
What the challenge was to show that, yeah whatever funky hardware you carry in your pocket, let's just do something we do daily and we will see who can do it faster. Yes the incentive was $100. But it is completely wrong to say that 'he chose' the tasks. The tasks were mutually agreed by both and generally the task that the challenger thought he does daily with his phone and is happy doing it was performed as a challenge. For example if someone was so much into tweeting all the time on his dual core high end Android phone, he was challenged to do so against Windows Phone and get smoked!
Ideally if I was challenging WindowsPhone I wouldn't want a random dude to tell me what I should try. Instead asking the user to do what he does daily is scientifically even more challenging. You are not only challenging the cognitive brain but also challenging the routine co-ordination the user has already mastered on his phone. Thus the users who tweet regularly would ideally have the 'widget' somewhere pinned down. If they din't it's sad. But then it shows how the users are used to going into the 'app drawer' even for things they do daily or very frequently. Whereas a WindowsPhone user can pin it in a similar way as any other OS user too. But the fact that is very clear is - Only a few Pinned Live tiles covered ALL or Majority of tasks that any other OS user performed routinely. Thus, you don't need to clutter you screen with widgets, but live tiles (few) will let you do a plenty!
---------- Post added at 03:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:05 PM ----------
zlogic42 said:
The ads were interesting and did prove some points, but too social network-centered. Come on, you don't choose a phone just because it allows you to quickly post stuff to Twitter. I don't facebook and post to Twitter twice a month, so this is hardly useful. And cameras on most Windows phones suck, especially first-generation models.
No mentions of
- integrated Office
- contact grouping (Android 4 does something like this, but WP7 is better)
- best-of-class email (reading large emails is much better in WP7 than Android)
Now if they did some other real-world scenarios:
- Use turn-by-turn navigation without distracting (Android navigation is a lot better)
- Load an Ajax-heavy page over a crappy network connection (Opera Mini obviously wins)
- Use a non-facebook online messenger, such as Google Talk or ICQ, or a non-integrated social network
- Uploading a bunch of documents for later reference with a USB cable instead of using Skydrive or email
- Identifying a random object (sorry, Bing Vision is pathetic compared to Google Goggles)
- Making a Skype call
- Switching between third-party apps without them losing state
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Turn-by-turn navigation on WP7 is much less distracting than Googles one. You only hear the annoying woman when you tap and need it. Else it smoothly shows the directions to you. But probably that was no possible anyway unless they go on driving from CES to McD and then to CES!
Do you load Ajax-heavey pages daily? I think loading documents will be done easily and quickly via email. The task for fixed, not the method. So if aim was upload documents - WP7 would have done much faster and safer way using the hotspot connectivity they had. Certain third-party apps like skype, googles and many google services would have surely made WP7 stumble but obviously they could come back with - Ok let's get your XBOX achievements on your android phone? Or let's play assassin's creed or any WP7 only app/games on your phone? - that doesn't look like would have worked!

drupad2drupad said:
Do you load Ajax-heavey pages daily?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do, every day. Reading news on the bus/train, while most websites include tons of widgets (Facebook like, Tweet this, +1 etc), ads and inefficiently formatted HTML makes surfing the web with a real browser (instead of Opera Mini) unusable, especially in non-3G areas. I don't need AJAX features, but they do use a lot of traffic and not all websites provide a decent mobile-friendly version. Even forums without tons of AJAX still load much faster in Opera Mini. Online stores, cinema sites, forums - all load slowly, sometimes even on a 3G connection.
If you need to search an answer for something that's not integrated in WP7's Bing features, it's going to be so slow over 2G that most people give up and call a friend to google it on a regular computer.
IE on WP7 however is a very good browser UI-wise, I'd call it the best I've seen on a smartphone.
I do agree with your other points, but the ads could've shown much more features - like voice recognition (in cases where both phones support it), making a call, sending a text or email with the restaurant address. No mentioning of the live tiles or lockscreen displaying the number of unread messages, or the next appointment. Something like 80% of the ads displayed taking a picture and/or posting to social networks. Both Android 4 and iOS 5 already made taking a picture easy right from the lockscreen and posting stuff to social networks right on the spot is not a top priority for most people. It's a nice feature, but email/text is much more important in real life.

Damn the hate on this forum even extends to this competition. I don't remotely see how this was rigged, this was all stuff I do on a daily basis: post to twitter, take pictures and upload them to twitter/fb, etc... Not to mention, the image sizes had nothing to do with this, as the taste was completed when the picture was submitted, not when the upload completed. And, both basically took identical pictures of each other.