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Hey guys
Im on holiday now so cannot really check myself the differences, but just wanted some quick info on the A2SD, with the official froyo i was hoping everybody will start using it, but somehow people still using the old method, whys that?
thanks
Froyo A2SD is completely reliant on app developers. If the devs doesn't allow it in their app then it can't be moved to the SD card. This is really only a problem because Froyo is still new.
Old A2SD you can dump everything on the SD
However, I'd be interested in seeing if there is a way to force an app onto the nand using A2SD+. Would work better for things like widgets, home replacements etc, as they'd run quicker for people with slow sd cards.
Probably because the FroYo one sucks !
Why ? Well, mostly because devs have to rewrite their apps so they can use FroYo's app2sd function...
With the "old-fashioned" a2sd, there is no need to do anything, just sit and enjoy the free space
APP2SD allows you to move certain apps to your SD card and run them from there BUT as these are placed on the normal root of the SD when you mount the SD, via USB for example, you loose access to these apps until you remount SD. This means you cant install widgets to the SD and such like.
APP2SD+ on the other hand uses an ext3 partition (or ext4 on newer versions) which then installs all apps & widgets to that partition and when the SD is mounted you dont lose any apps or widgets as is located in a seperate partition.
Hope that helps.
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App
wow! thats quick thanks for you input guys think you explained everything i wanted to know really
Id want to use the offical a2sd as i think using ext3 partitioned sd card have already slightly damaged the card cuz it keeps giving me errors everytime i connect it to a pc
mrwookie6379 said:
APP2SD allows you to move certain apps to your SD card and run them from there BUT as these are placed on the normal root of the SD when you mount the SD, via USB for example, you loose access to these apps until you remount SD. This means you cant install widgets to the SD and such like.
APP2SD+ on the other hand uses an ext3 partition (or ext4 on newer versions) which then installs all apps & widgets to that partition and when the SD is mounted you dont lose any apps or widgets as is located in a seperate partition.
Hope that helps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So let me understand the names:
APPS2SD = Froyo Original (comes with official Froyo release)
APPS2SD+ = Hacked version which has been out since FRF50 leak?
EDIT: But if APPS2SD+ is so much better (keeps apps on ext3 partition), why to people keep using the original APPS2SD on their ROMs?
Check this explaination. Quoted from neoKushan from yesterdays thread.
neoKushan said:
Ok, so here's the deal, in a very longwinded way that should hopefully explain everything and answer ALL questions.
You have an SD card in your phone and, a bit like normal PC Hard Drives, you can "partition" them (split them into two or more sections of different filesystems). Normally, your SD card is just one big FAT32 partition, which is fine for storing your pics, messages, emails, etc.
Now, other then your Phone's SD card, your phone will have its own internal flash memory (or "NAND") storage. Tradditionally with Android, you could only install applications to this NAND storage, you cannot install them onto your SD card. So if you have an empty 32GB SD card, but only 5Mb of internal phone storage, you still wont be able to install many apps, if any at all.
This was done to protect the apps from things like piracy - it's not easy to access the location where apps are installed on your phone's internal storage (normally impossible without root), so you can't for example buy an app, copy it, refund it, then install it again.
Still, this is no good for those of us who like to install lots and lots of apps, legitimately, as we run out of internal storage very quickly.
So Google came up with a way to install apps to the SD card. A folder is created called something like .android_secure and this stores (I believe) encrypted versions of applications, but there's a few catches:
1) Apps aren't automatically stored here, you have to manually "move" them
2) Not all apps are capable of being moved, in fact most apps aren't, the developer needs to update their app and allow it. Some apps aren't and wont be updated and some developers may not want to allow it for whatever reason.
3) Not all app data is moved, most of it is but some data is left on your phone so many people still run out of internal storage quickly.
4) You can force ALL apps to be moved to this area by default, but it breaks incompatible ones - such as Widgets, which are unable to load due to the SD card not being "prepared".
So that's Froyo's version. Before Froyo existed, some very clever people came up with a thing called "Apps2SD". Remember I said that your SD card normally is one big FAT32 partition? Well, Apps2SD works by having your SD card patitioned into TWO filesystems. A normal FAT32 partition for your usual stuff and a secondary "EXT" partition. EXT is just a filesystem, like FAT32 or NTFS, but it's the filesystem used by Android internally. The SD card is normally FAT32 because it's a "universal" filesystem, that just about any machine will be able to read, whereas EXT filesystems are generally Linux only, but I digress.
EXT has several different versions. The most common one you'll see is ext3. The main difference between ext2 and ext3 is "journaling", which is just a fancy way of saying that should an operation (such as copying, writing or reading) be interrupted unexpectedly (say, by you turning your phone off), then no data should be lost or corrupted. You know how when you turn your phone on, it says "preparing SD card"? It takes a few minutes, but what it's actually doing is checking that the FAT32 partition hasn't been damaged, because FAT does NOT have journaling. If you used a computer back in the Windows 98 days, you may remember that lovely blue "Scandisk" screen that had to run every time you didn't shut your computer down correctly - that's the same thing. But then Windows 2000/XP came along with NTFS, which also has journaling, meaning you had less chance of loosing data. But I digress once more.
So you have your SD card partitioned into EXT and FAT32. Generally it doesn't matter if it's ext3 or ext4, but you don't get any real advantage with ext4 over ext3 in this instance. Apps2SD then runs a special script on your phone which "symbolically links" the folder from your phone's internal storage where your apps are normally stored, to the ext partition on your SD card. A symbolic link is a bit like a shortcut for folders, except it's transparent to the OS: In other words, Android doesn't know that when it's installing it's apps to the internal phone storage, it's actually being stored on the SD card. This effectively boosts your internal phone memory from the previous 5mb that you had in my example above, up to whatever size you made the ext partition on your SD card (often 512Mb or 1Gb, but it depends on how many apps you install).
Plus, because it's "journaled", it doesn't need to be "prepared", meaning it's ready to go as soon as the phone starts - so your widgets and apps work immediately (unlike "forced" Froyo Apps2SD, where widgets disappear).
The catch with Apps2SD is that whatever space the ext partition takes up is taken away from the SD card. So if you have a 4Gb card (with something like 3.5Gb of actual storage) and you make a 512Mb ext partition, your SD card will "shrink" to 3Gb. The space isn't actually lost, it's just being used by the ext partition. If you reformat your card, you'll get it back.
Finally, there's a difference between "Apps2SD" and "Apps2SD+". Remember I said that your apps are stored on a special folder inside your Phone's NAND storage? Well, that was a bit of a lie. It's actually stored in TWO places. There's a second area which is called the Davlik Cache. You don't really need to worry about what this is for (Hint: IT's to do with the Java runetime your phone uses to run apps), all you need to know is that apps use it to store data, which also eats up internal phone memory. Apps2SD+ moves davlik cache to the ext partition on your SD card as well, freeing up even more space. Some people believe that this may come at the cost of performance, as the internal NAND memory should be faster than your SD card (Which is why you also get people arguing over which "class" SD card is better for Apps2SD - the logic being that a faster SD card means less impact from this move), but the truth of the matter is that your applications will be running from your Phone's RAM anyway, so performance isn't really impacted at all. Since most apps are only a few hundred Kb's in size, or a couple of MB at the most, it's a non-issue.
Finally, any recent version of Apps2SD/Apps2SD+ should work with an SD card that is or isn't formatted with an ext partition. It'll check for this partition when your phone first boots and if it's not there, just use internal phone storage.
Having an ext partition WITHOUT Apps2SD+ shouldn't cause any issues, either, so you can format your SD card whenever you're ready.
So in summary:
Apps2SD "fakes" your phone's internal memory and puts it all on a hidden section of your SD card.
Apps2SD+ pushes even more content to the SD card, freeing up even more space on the phone itself.
"Froyo" Apps2SD has various limitations that "old" apps2SD does not, but is much easier to handle as it doesn't involve any kind of "partitioning".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a great summary, thanks for that!
But... how can I create an ext3 partition on a new SD card? I don't want to use ROM Manager because that has a maximum of 512Mb for ext3, I want to make 1gb or more.
Also, what size should I make swap partition?
Vice83 said:
That's a great summary, thanks for that!
But... how can I create an ext3 partition on a new SD card? I don't want to use ROM Manager because that has a maximum of 512Mb for ext3, I want to make 1gb or more.
Also, what size should I make swap partition?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can do that thru recovery-windows.bat by going thru recovery mode by volume down + power, go to recovery then when the red exclamation point appears just run the recovery-windows.bat by double clicking on it. You can get these files from r5-desire-root-alt from the rooting process files (search the forums for this if you don't have it). But be cautious cause when you partition your sd card, all your files will be wiped so make sure to backup everything you need. Cheers!
Edit:
Actually this summary about the ap2sd and ap2sd+ and froyo ap2sd should be stickyed for everyone, so it would not be ask over and over again.
Couple of extra ways to partition:
1) Flash AmonRA's Recovery to your phone (I used Unrevoked to do it)
2) Use GParted on a Linux LiveCD (e.g Slax) to partition your card exactly how you want it
Vice83 said:
That's a great summary, thanks for that!
But... how can I create an ext3 partition on a new SD card? I don't want to use ROM Manager because that has a maximum of 512Mb for ext3, I want to make 1gb or more.
Also, what size should I make swap partition?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ROM Manager is probably the easiest way to do it, but I was stuck with EXACTLY the same problem when I rooted. I chose to flash AMON Ra recovery (don't have the link, but you can google it up), and then used that to create a 1024MB ext partition. Then used AMON Ra again to convert the ext partition to ext3. Hope that helps.
However, one question I have regarding neoKushan's explanation is that if I did create a 1024MB ext3 partition, then the same capacity should be visible in the phone's internal memory. However, after I rooted and restored my apps, I could only see about 100+ MB of free internal memory. Can anyone help me with this please? Am using the Opendesire Official Froyo 1.0c ROM that has A2SD built in
deepdevil said:
ROM Manager is probably the easiest way to do it, but I was stuck with EXACTLY the same problem when I rooted. I chose to flash AMON Ra recovery (don't have the link, but you can google it up), and then used that to create a 1024MB ext partition. Then used AMON Ra again to convert the ext partition to ext3. Hope that helps.
However, one question I have regarding neoKushan's explanation is that if I did create a 1024MB ext3 partition, then the same capacity should be visible in the phone's internal memory. However, after I rooted and restored my apps, I could only see about 100+ MB of free internal memory. Can anyone help me with this please? Am using the Opendesire Official Froyo 1.0c ROM that has A2SD built in
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure about what exact capacity for the internal memory after partitioning to ext3 but when I was on Opendesire before for the eclair 2.1 after I'm done flashing the rom and setting up the whole ap2sd+ my internal memory was 410mb. I used:
swap=0
ext=1024
fat32 is for the rest of the card
Then after upgrading to froyo rooted ROM, I'm only getting 140mb tops. I dunno... I'm too lazy now to get into it right now... maybe soon I'll play around with it again so I can get back my 410mb internal space with the ap2sd+
Stewge said:
Froyo A2SD is completely reliant on app developers. If the devs doesn't allow it in their app then it can't be moved to the SD card. This is really only a problem because Froyo is still new.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not 100% true, because you can change the default install location to SD card (via ADB if stock, and an app if rooted) and then you can have the vast majority of your apps on SD card even if they've not been updated for Froyo.
Regards,
Dave
I always thought the main negative with A2SD+ was that the cache was moved to the sdcard, which of course would wear out the sdcard (slightly) quicker.
Vice83 said:
So let me understand the names:
APPS2SD = Froyo Original (comes with official Froyo release)
APPS2SD+ = Hacked version which has been out since FRF50 leak?
EDIT: But if APPS2SD+ is so much better (keeps apps on ext3 partition), why to people keep using the original APPS2SD on their ROMs?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not exactly!
Prior to Froyo, there were principally two versions of Apps2SD:
1. APPS2SD (or A2SD )
2. APPS2SD+ (or A2SD+)
The first would move your apps to the EXT partition, and the second would move your apps and the Dalvik cache to the EXT partition (see here for an explanation of the Dalvik cache).
Now we have Froyo, we have "native", or "Froyo" apps2sd as well, which does much the same as (1) above except that there is no EXT partition and the apps are on the FAT32 partition of your SD card.
Regards,
Dave
sparksalot said:
I always thought the main negative with A2SD+ was that the cache was moved to the sdcard, which of course would wear out the sdcard (slightly) quicker.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dalvik cache is only actually updated when a new app is installed or and old app is updated, so whilst it will incur more writes to SD card, it probably isn't anywhere near as much as the apps write themselves to the FAT32 partition.
Regards,
Dave
Great summary, but can I format my 8 GB SD card as EXT3 and just forget about the FAT partition? I'm using Ubuntu on my laptop and my EXT4 /home partition is just fine for storing images, movies etc. I really don't get this ado about having an EXT and a FAT partition. Or am I wrong here?
quick question, if i move to another bigger sd card, can i copy my card and transfer it to the new one without losing the EXT, and the apps on it? would i need to make a image of the card? thanx for any advice.
make a backup of them first on your pc and copy them to the newly partitioned sdcard....ext to ext and fat to fat
So there is 3 versions?
1. Froyo A2sd = fat32 only = apps installed to sd
2. A2sd = fat32 + ext = apps installed to sd in ext partition
3. A2sd+ = fat32 + ext = apps installed and Dalvik cache moved to sd in ext partition
Is there any more variants? lol
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App
1) I have an ext3 partition on my SD card, which means my Desire is A2SD/A2SD+ compliant right? But whether A2SD or A2SD+ is in effect depends on the ROM I'm running - am I right to say this?
2) What exactly is Hboot? I seem to recall having read somewhere that Hboot is an alternative to A2SD... can anybody clarify? (And before you start flaming that there are a thousand and one topics on this already, I tried searching, but search was down)
1. Yes that's correct.
2. Hboot us essentially a different set of partitions for your desire's system. Currently your desire has internal memory split into 250mb system, 150mb data and a cache partition. The rom goes in system, apps in data. If the rom is small (aosp roms are smaller than sense due to the lack of sense which takes up tons of space) you can flash a different hboot which will change the layout of your phones internal memory. N1 table for instance has about 175 for system and a larger data partition, while the oxygen hboot has a tiny (90mb) system partition and a massive (300 odd mb) data partition negating the need for a2sd+ at all.
Hope that helps
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App
lick_the_fish said:
1. Yes that's correct.
2. Hboot us essentially a different set of partitions for your desire's system. Currently your desire has internal memory split into 250mb system, 150mb data and a cache partition. The rom goes in system, apps in data. If the rom is small (aosp roms are smaller than sense due to the lack of sense which takes up tons of space) you can flash a different hboot which will change the layout of your phones internal memory. N1 table for instance has about 175 for system and a larger data partition, while the oxygen hboot has a tiny (90mb) system partition and a massive (300 odd mb) data partition negating the need for a2sd+ at all.
Hope that helps
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Super informative, better than I could have hoped for Thanks!
Anyway I'm going to flash CM7 now, but on my previous ROM (GingerVillain), I'm pretty sure A2SD/A2SD+ was working fine, but in Titanium Backup it shows that my internal data partition was pretty congested. Any ideas?
fterh said:
Super informative, better than I could have hoped for Thanks!
Anyway I'm going to flash CM7 now, but on my previous ROM (GingerVillain), I'm pretty sure A2SD/A2SD+ was working fine, but in Titanium Backup it shows that my internal data partition was pretty congested. Any ideas?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm no expert and don't fully understand how a2sd+ installs apps etc. I don't know if it uses phone data first and then ext partition or what.
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App
fterh said:
Super informative, better than I could have hoped for Thanks!
Anyway I'm going to flash CM7 now, but on my previous ROM (GingerVillain), I'm pretty sure A2SD/A2SD+ was working fine, but in Titanium Backup it shows that my internal data partition was pretty congested. Any ideas?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Titanium Backup doesn't always show the correct info when it comes to available memory.
On gingervillian you have to use a dalvik-cache to ext script to create space on the internal memory, if you didn't do that then it can fill up quickly.
lick_the_fish said:
I'm no expert and don't fully understand how a2sd+ installs apps etc. I don't know if it uses phone data first and then ext partition or what.
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
a2sd+ uses the ext partition on you sd card to move the apk file of applications. however, there are still some parts of the app, mainly the dalvik cache, which remain on the data partition in your phone's internal memory; that's why your internal storage still decreases, even when using an a2sd+-enabled ROM. there are some scripts which will move this dalvik cache to the sd card as well, but be sure you read carefully before applying and pay close attention to whether your card is fast enough so as not to generate performance issues (generally, you would need at least a class-4 card, with a class-6 or higher being recommended)
Hi all.
I'd like to understand better the "alternate HBOOTSs and internal partitions" thing.
I've tried to look around but the information seems to be quite scattered.
What I'd like to understand is:
1. Pros and cons in general
2. Whether and how should i change my SD partitioning
Thanks.
with default hboot your system partition is 250mb.
some roms like oxygen or cm7 dont need 250mb. so installing them on stock hboot is a waste, lots of MBs arent used neither by ROM nor by you since we cant install apps in system.
so thats why there are custom hboots, so you use a CM7 hboot with CM7 rom, system is big enough to hold the ROM and you get bigger /data which is where apps go.
EXT is needed if it is writtien in the ROM thread.
there are also Sense 2.1/3.0 roms that run on data++ or cm7 hboots AND ext.
so for example insertcoin CM7 - 130mb is available on nand, however /system of the ROM is bigger. so essetntial parts go into nand, rest is stored on sd-ext. system is still super-fast, as apps run from NAND, not from ext. files present on ext are not essential for the system speed.
so generally
pros: super fast roms since apps run from NAND, lots of space for apps
cons: if you are a retard you can brick your phone if you flash something wrong
dzumagos said:
with default hboot your system partition is 250mb.
some roms like oxygen or cm7 dont need 250mb. so installing them on stock hboot is a waste, lots of MBs arent used neither by ROM nor by you since we cant install apps in system.
so thats why there are custom hboots, so you use a CM7 hboot with CM7 rom, system is big enough to hold the ROM and you get bigger /data which is where apps go.
EXT is needed if it is writtien in the ROM thread.
there are also Sense 2.1/3.0 roms that run on data++ or cm7 hboots AND ext.
so for example insertcoin CM7 - 130mb is available on nand, however /system of the ROM is bigger. so essetntial parts go into nand, rest is stored on sd-ext. system is still super-fast, as apps run from NAND, not from ext. files present on ext are not essential for the system speed.
so generally
pros: super fast roms since apps run from NAND, lots of space for apps
cons: if you are a retard you can brick your phone if you flash something wrong
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
Sent from Oxygen
1st of all, thanks for the explanation!
So, If I understood well, my favorite ROM, which is Reflex S v2.1.7 should be installed in the CM7HBOOT variant. This ROM claims to support "AP2SD+".
Now, If the apps go in the internal /data partition, why should I bother about the EXT3 partition on my SD?
Very likely I'm still missing something else ...
Uqbar said:
1st of all, thanks for the explanation!
So, If I understood well, my favorite ROM, which is Reflex S v2.1.7 should be installed in the CM7HBOOT variant. This ROM claims to support "AP2SD+".
Now, If the apps go in the internal /data partition, why should I bother about the EXT3 partition on my SD?
Very likely I'm still missing something else ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A2SD/A2SD+ works on this way:
Usually all apps will be installed to /data partition in the internal memory. If you use a2sd/a2sd+, all apps will be automatically redirected to /sd-ext/app. That's a2sd. When dalvik cache is also moved on sd ext, you use a2sd+. The big advantage is, you do not have to move apps yourself to sd card. It will be done automatically, wether the developer of the app has programmed the app for this or not.
NEVER MOVE APPS TO SD MANUALLY WHEN USING A2SD/A2SD+!!
Referring to reflex s rom running cm7 hboot. Actually, the /system partition of cm7 hboot (130 mb or 145 mb with r2 version) does not give you enough space for reflex s rom. So things will be moved to internal /data partition. Problem is, you don't have enough space for apps because internal /data partition gets filled. To avoid this problem you need the ext partition on your sd card.
Conclusion: You should really bother about an ext partition!!!
MatDrOiD said:
Conclusion: You should really bother about an ext partition!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I though to choose CM7HBOOT to have faster application startup.
You say that Reflex S will fill the /data up and the other apps will end in /sd-ext/app, that is my (sloooow) uSD.
So my question: do you think it's really worth it installing CM7HBOOT with this ROM?
no, no, no, it is not the way matdroid said.
/system is bigger than 130mb (or 145mb) so essential parts stay on NAND, rest goes to SD-EXT, to the folder that is symlinked to the /system (not to /data)
now the apps that you download.
in order for you to understand it, i need to explain a bit. this rom is deodexed. if you really want to know what .odex file is do some research, it is not important. anyway in deodexed roms, apps run from Dalvik-cache and not from the .apk itself (.apk is only needed to create dalvik on 1st boot)
so in reflex S your .apk go to sd-ext BUT the dalvik stays in internal, and since its dalvik what matters ROM is fast.
rom system files do not fill up /data, the /system files that could not fit into 130mb go to sd-ext.
and overally yes, it is worth it, i basically re-discovered my desire after S-OFFing and running custom hboot roms. i have a class 2 sd card, and rom performs super fast (on custom hboot roms your sd class really doesnt matter anymore)
Uqbar said:
1st of all, thanks for the explanation!
So, If I understood well, my favorite ROM, which is Reflex S v2.1.7 should be installed in the CM7HBOOT variant. This ROM claims to support "AP2SD+".
Now, If the apps go in the internal /data partition, why should I bother about the EXT3 partition on my SD?
Very likely I'm still missing something else ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and also i as wrote before ....
why should you bother about ext ???
cause /system is 130mb (or145) but it is not enough !!! AND I DID WRITE THAT REST GOES TO SD-EXT.
seriously, you gotta read everything if you are going to s-off and play with custom hboots
and also apart from some /system files on sd-ext, your downloaded .apk's will be on sd-ext too. only their dalvik will stay on NAND
dzumagos said:
no, no, no, it is not the way matdroid said.
/system is bigger than 130mb (or 145mb) so essential parts stay on NAND, rest goes to SD-EXT, to the folder that is symlinked to the /system (not to /data)
now the apps that you download.
in order for you to understand it, i need to explain a bit. this rom is deodexed. if you really want to know what .odex file is do some research, it is not important. anyway in deodexed roms, apps run from Dalvik-cache and not from the .apk itself (.apk is only needed to create dalvik on 1st boot)
so in reflex S your .apk go to sd-ext BUT the dalvik stays in internal, and since its dalvik what matters ROM is fast.
rom system files do not fill up /data, the /system files that could not fit into 130mb go to sd-ext.
and overally yes, it is worth it, i basically re-discovered my desire after S-OFFing and running custom hboot roms. i have a class 2 sd card, and rom performs super fast (on custom hboot roms your sd class really doesnt matter anymore)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good to know, thanks. Thought it would work the way I described.
Hmmm ... I don't understand why the ROM looks quite slower than before (STOCK HBOOT) ...
Accordingly to what dzumagos says, I should get a (much) better experience now.
I understand the Dalvik cache stuff and what he says makes sense to me.
Nonetheless the ROM seems to be way slower than before ...
My system should be 145MB, cache 5MB and data 287MB.
Settings say that I have 256MB available on /data e 34MB on /system.
This should mean that I'm not really exploiting the internal storage!!!
And in fact my 1GB ext3 partition is at 50% of capacity.
Now, if my /cache is 5MB as said by AlphaRev, I think it's way too small to fit the (Dalvik?) cache I'd need.
What'd be your view here?
Finally, I'm trying to read everything. But the information is scattered among a dozen of threads each with dozens of posts ... and, as you can see, it's far from easy to discern the cream from the crap.
I really tried to figure it out before posting!
Uqbar said:
Hmmm ... I don't understand why the ROM looks quite slower than before (STOCK HBOOT) ...
Accordingly to what dzumagos says, I should get a (much) better experience now.
I understand the Dalvik cache stuff and what he says makes sense to me.
Nonetheless the ROM seems to be way slower than before ...
My system should be 145MB, cache 5MB and data 287MB.
Settings say that I have 256MB available on /data e 34MB on /system.
This should mean that I'm not really exploiting the internal storage!!!
And in fact my 1GB ext3 partition is at 50% of capacity.
Now, if my /cache is 5MB as said by AlphaRev, I think it's way too small to fit the (Dalvik?) cache I'd need.
What'd be your view here?
Finally, I'm trying to read everything. But the information is scattered among a dozen of threads each with dozens of posts ... and, as you can see, it's far from easy to discern the cream from the crap.
I really tried to figure it out before posting!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dalvik cache is not in the /cache partition.
I think I get the reasons for custom hboot but how do you tell which hboot you've got?
My Desire is rooted and S-OFF. I have flashed with STOCKHBOOT version of Reflex_S_2.1.7_LITE_GingerBread_Sense-2.1_GRI40_A2SD+
It works but don't know if I should have used the the CM7 version.
after s-offing you get a stock unlocked hboot.
roms designed for cm7 hboots will work on stock hboot but it works only this way.
MatDrOiD said:
A2SD/A2SD+ works on this way:
Usually all apps will be installed to /data partition in the internal memory. If you use a2sd/a2sd+, all apps will be automatically redirected to /sd-ext/app. That's a2sd. When dalvik cache is also moved on sd ext, you use a2sd+. The big advantage is, you do not have to move apps yourself to sd card. It will be done automatically, wether the developer of the app has programmed the app for this or not.
NEVER MOVE APPS TO SD MANUALLY WHEN USING A2SD/A2SD+!!
Referring to reflex s rom running cm7 hboot. Actually, the /system partition of cm7 hboot (130 mb or 145 mb with r2 version) does not give you enough space for reflex s rom. So things will be moved to internal /data partition. Problem is, you don't have enough space for apps because internal /data partition gets filled. To avoid this problem you need the ext partition on your sd card.
Conclusion: You should really bother about an ext partition!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the heads up but am still a bit confused. Pls help me out.
I'm s-off and using the cm7 hboot running Insertcoin stable 1.0.8 cm7 version. Now in the rom under settings>applications>manage applications when you click on some apps you get the option to move the app to sd card and when you do so it frees up some internal memory. But you say not to move apps to sd card manually Should I do this or not?
Any help to clarify would be much appreciated
This is froyo/android a2sd and yes you can do it. It moves some app data to fat32 while a2sd+ move parts of the app itself (in this specific case the .apk only) to the ext. Dalvik will stay on internal unless you issue some superuser commands in adb or terminal.
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App
I'm also confused...so for Reflex S, which hboot should I be running?
Bravo Stock
Bravo N1Table
Bravo Data++
Bravo Sense
Bravo Oxygen r2
Bravo CM7 r2
Bravo Downgrader???
herb1 said:
I'm also confused...so for Reflex S, which hboot should I be running?
Bravo Stock
Bravo N1Table
Bravo Data++
Bravo Sense
Bravo Oxygen r2
Bravo CM7 r2
Bravo Downgrader???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sense since its a sense rom?
herb1 said:
I'm also confused...so for Reflex S, which hboot should I be running?
Bravo Stock
Bravo N1Table
Bravo Data++
Bravo Sense
Bravo Oxygen r2
Bravo CM7 r2
Bravo Downgrader???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Use the recommended one. Maybe you need to search the thread for this.
You only need the downgrader if you flashed one of the r2 hboots and want to change it now.
Sent from Oxygen
Ok I use bravo sense but cm7 r2 does work with reflex s too
Then make sure you use cm 7 version of reflex!
I followed instructions on Apharev homepage and flashed the 'bravo_alphaspl-sense.img'
Downloaded the necessary PB99IMG zipfile and saved it to SD card
now phone goes silver ANDROID logo that reflects passing light after splash image but won't loaded my homepage afterwards
HELP????
I'm bored because the UOT Kitchen is down so since I flashed CM7 only a couple of days ago, and pretty much like it, I thought I'd also now take the plunge and flash the CM7 r2 HBOOT but I have a couple of questions first:
1) I've read the instructions on Alpharev site but still confused by the partition table. Do I somehow have to change the various system/data/cache size before flashing the HBOOT, or am I right in thinking that when I flash the HBOOT this will automatically resize them as part of the flash process?
2) What's the benefit of flashing this particular HBOOT? Is it because it'll increase system partition due to the number of apps? (noticed much less available space since swapping from LeeDroid)
and (yes I know I said only "a couple" of questions but...)
3) % chance of bricking my phone???
1. It will automatically resize the partition tables.
2. More space on data partition for apps.
3. None if you do it properly and check the MD5 of the image file you've downloaded.
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App
I'm confused by the two methods shown on Alpharev. Method 1 says to donwload the image file and Fastboot flash the file and Method 2 says to add the renamed PB99IMG.zip to SD card and flash. With method 1 do I do I have to do any of the process on PC or all on the phone? With method 2 do I just boot into recovery and flash the .zip like I would flash a new ROM (i.e. "Install zip from SD Card">"Choose zip from SD Card") or do I have to go into Fastboot the same as in Method 1?
As you can tell, I'm confused, but this is something I want to get right, for obvious reasons. The instructions on the Alpharev are basic but need to be a bit better explained for noobs like me, I think.
Which of the 2 methods are the easiest/safest and could some one be kind enough to give a more precise walkthrough please?
xybadog said:
I'm confused by the two methods shown on Alpharev. Method 1 says to donwload the image file and Fastboot flash the file and Method 2 says to add the renamed PB99IMG.zip to SD card and flash. With method 1 do I do I have to do any of the process on PC or all on the phone? With method 2 do I just boot into recovery and flash the .zip like I would flash a new ROM (i.e. "Install zip from SD Card">"Choose zip from SD Card") or do I have to go into Fastboot the same as in Method 1?
As you can tell, I'm confused, but this is something I want to get right, for obvious reasons. The instructions on the Alpharev are basic but need to be a bit better explained for noobs like me, I think.
Which of the 2 methods are the easiest/safest and could some one be kind enough to give a more precise walkthrough please?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think fastboot is the best way to do it.... Not one of your choices - Edit - sorry it is i'm just blind!!! you have more control because you run the commands
As the previous dude said CHECK MD5SUMS!! if they match you should be fine
You flash the hboot depending on your needs.... I use reflex s CM7 with CM7 r2 hboot and I have a huge internal memory
The fastboot method says I have to rename the image file for the HBOOT I downloaded. The file I downloaded was bravo_spl_cm7r2.img so what do I have to rename it to?
Jeez I'm confused @!*$!&
EDIT: Ignore me, I just figured it out
xybadog said:
The fastboot method says I have to rename the image file for the HBOOT I downloaded. The file I downloaded was bravo_spl_cm7r2.img so what do I have to rename it to?
Jeez I'm confused @!*$!&
EDIT: Ignore me, I just figured it out
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For others, please write your solution here.
Swyped from Oxygen with Transparent XDA App
@matdroid - No solution, just me misreading the instructions on Alpharev :/
I'm in the fastboot.exe cmd screen (made sure that the HBOOT .img file is in the same folder as fastboot.exe) and when I enter "fastboot flash hboot bravo_alphaspl-cm7r2.img" I get the error "cannot load bravo_alphaspl-cm7r2.img". When I enter Fastboot on the phone do I then have to select "BootLoader"? before I can flash the HBOOT?
Any ideas?
EDIT: Done it I used the info here.
Do I just "Power Down" now that flashing the HBOOT is complete or "Reboot Bootloader" or what? (Hope I get an answer quick coz don't want to leave the phone attached to the laptop in fastboot mode all night lol.
OK, so just installed the CM7 HBOOT but while my internal memory is excellent (currently 154MB free) the system storage size repartitioned to 145MB as expected but is showing only 15MB free. Is this worryingly low? What could be hogging this space?
xybadog said:
OK, so just installed the CM7 HBOOT but while my internal memory is excellent (currently 154MB free) the system storage size repartitioned to 145MB as expected but is showing only 15MB free. Is this worryingly low? What could be hogging this space?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The less space on /system/ partition the better, apps will use only /data/.
Actually i have like 400kb free space on /system.
double post sorry
///delete please
xybadog said:
OK, so just installed the CM7 HBOOT but while my internal memory is excellent (currently 154MB free) the system storage size repartitioned to 145MB as expected but is showing only 15MB free. Is this worryingly low? What could be hogging this space?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unless you've got a lot of apps installed it shouldn't be that low (did you do a fresh instal after flashing the hboot? if not then..) .. do a nand backup of your rom, then do a full wipe (/mounts & storage/ format boot, system, data, cache; /advanced/ wipe dalvic cache) and install CM7 again.. you should have the full 145mb.. and if you don't (for some reason) you can always restore your backup ^_^
If you install MIUI-XJ it actually see's your sd-ext as internal memory.. so I have 2GB recognised as internal memory
I have quite a few user apps installed (about 60).Did full wipes after flashing the hboot then restored my nandroid backup.
xybadog said:
I have quite a few user apps installed (about 60).Did full wipes after flashing the hboot then restored my nandroid backup.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah then the 15mb free space sounds about right lol.. you could try A2SD if you need more space, for that you need an EXT parition on your SD.. just read this, I can't explain what it is and how to use it better than that lol
neoKushan said:
Ok, so here's the deal, in a very longwinded way that should hopefully explain everything and answer ALL questions.
You have an SD card in your phone and, a bit like normal PC Hard Drives, you can "partition" them (split them into two or more sections of different filesystems). Normally, your SD card is just one big FAT32 partition, which is fine for storing your pics, messages, emails, etc.
Now, other then your Phone's SD card, your phone will have its own internal flash memory (or "NAND") storage. Tradditionally with Android, you could only install applications to this NAND storage, you cannot install them onto your SD card. So if you have an empty 32GB SD card, but only 5Mb of internal phone storage, you still wont be able to install many apps, if any at all.
This was done to protect the apps from things like piracy - it's not easy to access the location where apps are installed on your phone's internal storage (normally impossible without root), so you can't for example buy an app, copy it, refund it, then install it again.
Still, this is no good for those of us who like to install lots and lots of apps, legitimately, as we run out of internal storage very quickly.
So Google came up with a way to install apps to the SD card. A folder is created called something like .android_secure and this stores (I believe) encrypted versions of applications, but there's a few catches:
1) Apps aren't automatically stored here, you have to manually "move" them
2) Not all apps are capable of being moved, in fact most apps aren't, the developer needs to update their app and allow it. Some apps aren't and wont be updated and some developers may not want to allow it for whatever reason.
3) Not all app data is moved, most of it is but some data is left on your phone so many people still run out of internal storage quickly.
4) You can force ALL apps to be moved to this area by default, but it breaks incompatible ones - such as Widgets, which are unable to load due to the SD card not being "prepared".
So that's Froyo's version. Before Froyo existed, some very clever people came up with a thing called "Apps2SD". Remember I said that your SD card normally is one big FAT32 partition? Well, Apps2SD works by having your SD card patitioned into TWO filesystems. A normal FAT32 partition for your usual stuff and a secondary "EXT" partition. EXT is just a filesystem, like FAT32 or NTFS, but it's the filesystem used by Android internally. The SD card is normally FAT32 because it's a "universal" filesystem, that just about any machine will be able to read, whereas EXT filesystems are generally Linux only, but I digress.
EXT has several different versions. The most common one you'll see is ext3. The main difference between ext2 and ext3 is "journaling", which is just a fancy way of saying that should an operation (such as copying, writing or reading) be interrupted unexpectedly (say, by you turning your phone off), then no data should be lost or corrupted. You know how when you turn your phone on, it says "preparing SD card"? It takes a few minutes, but what it's actually doing is checking that the FAT32 partition hasn't been damaged, because FAT does NOT have journaling. If you used a computer back in the Windows 98 days, you may remember that lovely blue "Scandisk" screen that had to run every time you didn't shut your computer down correctly - that's the same thing. But then Windows 2000/XP came along with NTFS, which also has journaling, meaning you had less chance of loosing data. But I digress once more.
So you have your SD card partitioned into EXT and FAT32. Generally it doesn't matter if it's ext3 or ext4, but you don't get any real advantage with ext4 over ext3 in this instance. Apps2SD then runs a special script on your phone which "symbolically links" the folder from your phone's internal storage where your apps are normally stored, to the ext partition on your SD card. A symbolic link is a bit like a shortcut for folders, except it's transparent to the OS: In other words, Android doesn't know that when it's installing it's apps to the internal phone storage, it's actually being stored on the SD card. This effectively boosts your internal phone memory from the previous 5mb that you had in my example above, up to whatever size you made the ext partition on your SD card (often 512Mb or 1Gb, but it depends on how many apps you install).
Plus, because it's "journaled", it doesn't need to be "prepared", meaning it's ready to go as soon as the phone starts - so your widgets and apps work immediately (unlike "forced" Froyo Apps2SD, where widgets disappear).
The catch with Apps2SD is that whatever space the ext partition takes up is taken away from the SD card. So if you have a 4Gb card (with something like 3.5Gb of actual storage) and you make a 512Mb ext partition, your SD card will "shrink" to 3Gb. The space isn't actually lost, it's just being used by the ext partition. If you reformat your card, you'll get it back.
Finally, there's a difference between "Apps2SD" and "Apps2SD+". Remember I said that your apps are stored on a special folder inside your Phone's NAND storage? Well, that was a bit of a lie. It's actually stored in TWO places. There's a second area which is called the Davlik Cache. You don't really need to worry about what this is for (Hint: IT's to do with the Java runetime your phone uses to run apps), all you need to know is that apps use it to store data, which also eats up internal phone memory. Apps2SD+ moves davlik cache to the ext partition on your SD card as well, freeing up even more space. Some people believe that this may come at the cost of performance, as the internal NAND memory should be faster than your SD card (Which is why you also get people arguing over which "class" SD card is better for Apps2SD - the logic being that a faster SD card means less impact from this move), but the truth of the matter is that your applications will be running from your Phone's RAM anyway, so performance isn't really impacted at all. Since most apps are only a few hundred Kb's in size, or a couple of MB at the most, it's a non-issue.
Finally, any recent version of Apps2SD/Apps2SD+ should work with an SD card that is or isn't formatted with an ext partition. It'll check for this partition when your phone first boots and if it's not there, just use internal phone storage.
Having an ext partition WITHOUT Apps2SD+ shouldn't cause any issues, either, so you can format your SD card whenever you're ready.
So in summary:
Apps2SD "fakes" your phone's internal memory and puts it all on a hidden section of your SD card.
Apps2SD+ pushes even more content to the SD card, freeing up even more space on the phone itself.
"Froyo" Apps2SD has various limitations that "old" apps2SD does not, but is much easier to handle as it doesn't involve any kind of "partitioning".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Already got A2SD with Ext3 partition. I've noticed though that the A2SD partition doesn't show up on Titanium Backup or System info like it does with other ROMs.
xybadog said:
Already got A2SD with Ext3 partition. I've noticed though that the A2SD partition doesn't show up on Titanium Backup or System info like it does with other ROMs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Partition your sd card again (make sure to save all important data on it before) with recovery or gparted again and take care, you set correct sizes. When you use gparted:
1st create fat32 (primary) and then ext partition (also primary).
MatDrOiD said:
Partition your sd card again (make sure to save all important data on it before) with recovery or gparted again and take care, you set correct sizes. When you use gparted:
1st create fat32 (primary) and then ext partition (also primary).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Got a new SD card on order so I'll wait till I get that and partition from new and see if that works.
Dear XDA forum,
since a few roms i always get a "low on storage" warning, even after factory reset and flashing a new rom.
So i'd want to ask for a small summery of what storage there is inside the desire and on the sdcard and how to solve this problem
My sdcard is 16GB class 10. I didnt partition it manually (i think).
according to my desire it has effective 14.2gb.about 2gb are used and 4gb are free? that doesnt sound right.
so i guess its 2 partitions?
could anyone please tell me which mountpoint is which?
and how do i solve the low storage problem? do i need some a2sd script or do i have to more the internal storage to the sdcard?
which mountpoints do the scripts actarlly move?
i have no problem with repartitioning my sdcard. i was given to understand that u usually need a fat32 partition (for apps i guess) and an ext2/3 partition afterwards. some scripts even allow a swap partition at the end of the sdcard to be used as swap space. is that a good idea?
i know its a lot of questions :/ but i hope for some good answers :>
thanks & greetings,
soomon
my advice would be to backup your sd card and (re)partition using gparted, start from scratch because I don't know what your current configuration is, step 5 here
choose ext3/ext4 partition (max ~1.5GB) depending on rom requirements, most support ext4 and should be slightly faster. most roms don't need swap partition.
in simple terms, your space will get taken up by apps (apks), dalvik cache, app cache and app data. most custom roms will automatically move apks to your sd-ext partition. there are various different scripts which move the other bits around. generally it is better to keep app data on internal (/data partition)
regardless of which rom you choose, use an app like 'diskusage' to browse all your partitions, so you can work out where and how all your space is being use.
to maximise space you also need to be s-off and correct hboot for the rom (again should be stated within each rom thread, or search within it)
ok so the first partition on the sdcard will become my sd-ext which will replace the /data partition on the internal storage.
I guess is hould try data2sd then?
with a class 10 it should not get that slow and i get loads of space on that partition.
thanks for your help.
also use links2d,very usefull.....
hi again,
as i see in a terminal emulator by typing "df -h"
my data is 150mb and has 15mb left, so i guess i better moe the whole partition to the sdcard as i'd have to move all the apps to the sdcard anyway sooner or later.
my /system has only 5mb of 250mb left. is that a problem?
soomon said:
hi again,
as i see in a terminal emulator by typing "df -h"
my data is 150mb and has 15mb left, so i guess i better moe the whole partition to the sdcard as i'd have to move all the apps to the sdcard anyway sooner or later.
my /system has only 5mb of 250mb left. is that a problem?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
depends entirely what rom you're running if any, and what scripts it uses. basically you should be able to find some way to install many apps without running out of space (one of the main reasons for rooting in the first place ).
with your current setup, you could try something like link2sd to just move apps and dalvik to sd, see if you have enough space that way. you shouldnt have to manually 'move to sd', keeping them on 'internal' tricks them to sd-ext. (you can use something like 'diskusage' to check they're actually on the sd-ext)
the system partition is meant to be mostly full. free space on /system is wasted space.
you're still on stock hboot, which is why your data partition is so small.
if you install another rom, many of them have a smaller system size, so if you're s-off you can flash a different hboot to repartition your internal memory layout: your system size will reduce to roughly match your rom, and the saved space is converted into extra data space, see alpharev.nl for hboots.
e.g. if your rom system is 140MB, will fit nicely into cm7r2 hboot with 145MB system, and you get 287MB of data instead of 150MB. 287MB can be enough to store app data and dalvik cache if you don't have too many apps.
i refer you to these sets of guides for further reading, should explain a lot more, and better than i have...
thanks eddie,
i'm still s-on and stock hboot, but i use a custom rom: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1766550
i guess the problem is that LBE gues 4 and lookout together need over 22mb of space :/
i'll try link2sd then.
thanks!
hm.. when i try to install link2sd i get "insufficient storage available". that program is not even 1MB in size and i have 15mb of free space on the internal storage.. what can i do?
edit: i'll try to install it at home with an adb tool. maybe i have more luck with that.
follow instructions for a2sd with that rom (scroll down). this will move apps and dalvik to sd-ext automatically. or follow/search the thread for other methods, it's regularly discussed...
[not used link2sd, it should in theory do the same thing, but my advice would be to stick with the instructions as that's the recommended way if you really need/want to install link2sd...uninstall something else to make more space ]
ofc removing apps might help (althrough i only installed 2 or 3). but 15mb should be enough to install a 800kb software
gonna try to install some apps later after running a2sd.
thanks a lot man didnt see that information.