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i just got back from the att store in Lexington ky off richmond rd and the rudest jerk would not sell me the tilt 2 unless i got a data plan, even if i paid full price! What the heck! I hate freakin att, it took all I had not to pop this blond haired dude just for how rude he was to me and my wife. I told him I'll just get it off ebay and he said they would detect it and automatically add data plan.
My wife is eligible for early upgrade and she has an iphone w/ data plan
Shouldn't I be able to get her to get the tilt 2. They will de-activate her iphone, then when she gets home put my old sim in tilt 2 and have her re-activate her phone. Is this possible or no. Please help
I don't want to pay for a stupid 30 a month data plan data plan, i only want the wifi use.
ATT is much more proactive about checking IMEI's now than they used to be. As a result, upon placing your sim in the Tilt 2, you will very likely receive a text message informing you that if you do not add a smartphone data plan to your phone, one will be added for you.
One possible, and I stress POSSIBLE, way around this is to use an unlocked TP2 from another carrier, or the int'l unbranded version. It won't have 3G, but it may not get flagged as a smartphone because most carriers only have their own phones in the IMEI database that they use to check for this sort of thing. So while they would detect the Tilt2 and charge you for a monthly data plan, they might not detect an unlocked branded version from VZW or Tmobile or the unbranded international version as a smartphone.
I'm sorry the dude was rude, and I'm not super fond of ATT (or other carriers for that matter) either, but based on my experience and that of some other users I know, I believe his information is accurate. We used to be able to get away with a lot more than we can now.
Best way to go without paying for data these days is prepaid (though prepaid plans like VZW's which include for example, unlimited data, don't allow smartphones for fear of abuse. I haven't heard of ATT's prepaid rejecting smartphones because their prepaid data packages are per mb--no danger of abuse).
fortunz said:
One possible, and I stress POSSIBLE, way around this is to use an unlocked TP2 from another carrier, or the int'l unbranded version. It won't have 3G, but it may not get flagged as a smartphone because most carriers only have their own phones in the IMEI database that they use to check for this sort of thing. So while they would detect the Tilt2 and charge you for a monthly data plan, they might not detect an unlocked branded version from VZW or Tmobile or the unbranded international version as a smartphone.
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Click to collapse
That sounds good in theory, and would work out pretty well for OP since he isn't concerned about 3G capabilities.
When you log into your AT&T wireless account, AT&T attempts to detect your phone and displays it on screen for you. When I was using unlocked phones on their network (i900 Omnia for a year and most recently for 3 days, T-MO's Touch Pro 2), it never detected/displayed my phone.
I just logged into my account now to check if it detected my new AT&T branded Tilt 2, and indeed it did.
Not to spam OP, but if you're interested in a T-Mo Touch Pro 2, I have one listed in the Marketplace. Good luck!
Thanks for your sympathy
Thanks for your sim-pathy (sympathy), It is good to know I'm not the only one angry about this.
It would sure be nice to have a 3.5 jack with an unlocked verizon or sprint version, but I'm just not sure how not having 3g band would effect my signal. Years ago I remember having sprint service and it was horrible where I live.
You are wondering how it would affect your carrier edge data signal? I thought you only wanted to use wifi?
If you are worried about how it would affect your regular GSM phone signal, I can't imagine that would be problem. I believe the GSM chip is the same in all versions, and would expect similar performance from all TP2s that have it.
To date, I haven't yet heard of an unlocked Sprint version working on US GSM carriers (possibly due to some software protections they added in). Unlocked VZWs have been proven to work on ATT. If you want the 3.5mm jack, maybe VZW or Telus would be your best bet.
thanks for the tip
I did not know unlocked sprint versions would not work on US gsm, thanks for the tip. I'm going to start searching the threads for people who have got the unlocked Verizon's to work before I buy.
I was not for sure if the 3g just carried data, thanks for clearing that up. If that is all it adds I won't miss it because, "i really only use wifi".
or maybe just hold out for the hd2.....don't know if I can stand using my backup Motorola phone much longer *my htc trinity drowned ......
There is an alternative
You may try to purchase a phone from T-mobile and they won't limit you to having a data plan especially if you pay full price. I've seen many do it, and many succeed. Good Luck
lol, get the phone with the data plan. go home, call at&t and tell them you've changed your mind and dont want the data plan. have your old phone's imei around and tell them your going to use your old phone. done. i've done it multiple times. no use arguing with those idiots at the store; most of us here know more about phones than they do
xda kindness
If only our mobile devices companies were all staffed by the nice and informative people of xda the universe would be a better place.
omaralt said:
lol, get the phone with the data plan. go home, call at&t and tell them you've changed your mind and dont want the data plan. have your old phone's imei around and tell them your going to use your old phone. done. i've done it multiple times. no use arguing with those idiots at the store; most of us here know more about phones than they do
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Lots of us have, but you should note that not all the old tricks work anymore. IMEI checking occurs much more often now, not just when you call in.
Are you looking to just not have a data plan period for her phone? The Smartphone/PDA data and iPhone data are the same price.
fortunz said:
As a result, upon placing your sim in the Tilt 2, you will very likely receive a text message informing you that if you do not add a smartphone data plan to your phone, one will be added for you
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I've been running for about a week now on my old SIM w/ MediaNet and have not received any such message.
RacerX10 said:
I've been running for about a week now on my old SIM w/ MediaNet and have not received any such message.
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I hope it keeps working for you.
I don't understand how he was being rude at all. If he can't sell it to you without those conditions then it certainly isn't his fault. I work at RadioShack and the system we use will not allow us to sell smartphones without adding data either. Not sure how this applies to phones bought outright but all sellers do things a little different. Don't be upset at the associate, be upset at att and the rest of the carriers who also require this.
Actually, according to the rep I had, it seems more along the lines of the phones official launch being today that is the issue from the store side. Since its so new they're not, at least the regular associate isn't, allowed to sell the phone sans contract.
Needless to say my shackles are back on
Considering the amount that shipped out to some stores if his store was any indicator it wouldn't surprise me. How do you only send 3, with one to be set for display purposes?
RE: att rep
I never blamed this guy for the rules this att rep he had to follow, that is not what ticked me off. This had nothing to do with what ticked me off
From the second I walked into this store he was the most sarcastic punk ever, and took it personal that I was trying to get this great htc phone without a data plan. He treated me like I was trying to steal it. I was very polite and I doubt he even knew that I was the least bit upset.
Just got back from an At&t store myself. Rep said the same thing and was also a jerk. I couldn't purchase the phone by itself. I'm not due for an upgrade yet so I was trying to buy the phone full price.
The rep was asking me why I wanted the phone. He said its horrible, it useless, he had a Fuze and gave it away because of how bad it was. He uses a BB and iPhone (BIG SURPRISE). He said I was probably the only person asking for the phone the whole day and thats why they didn't have a display model, because no one wants this phone. He said "Why do you want a windows phone, its windows!!!! Haha, c'mon!"
I was screaming inside. If the jackass had any technology knowledge he would understand why I wanted the phone. The possibilities are endless. I'm running TomTom, Wifi access point, internet sharing, mp3 trimmer, push e-mail, Skyfire, DirecTV NFL Superfan Streaming, registry edits, etc. I know a BB and iPhone can also do some of these things but they CAN'T DO ALL.
gtdRR said:
Just got back from an At&t store myself. Rep said the same thing and was also a jerk. I couldn't purchase the phone by itself. I'm not due for an upgrade yet so I was trying to buy the phone full price.
The rep was asking me why I wanted the phone. He said its horrible, it useless, he had a Fuze and gave it away because of how bad it was. He uses a BB and iPhone (BIG SURPRISE). He said I was probably the only person asking for the phone the whole day and thats why they didn't have a display model, because no one wants this phone. He said "Why do you want a windows phone, its windows!!!! Haha, c'mon!"
I was screaming inside. If the jackass had any technology knowledge he would understand why I wanted the phone. The possibilities are endless. I'm running TomTom, Wifi access point, internet sharing, mp3 trimmer, push e-mail, Skyfire, DirecTV NFL Superfan Streaming, registry edits, etc. I know a BB and iPhone can also do some of these things but they CAN'T DO ALL.
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Most of the people in the stores are just typical sales people. They have bad attitudes, and think they know everything because of their "training". Just remember that they are trying to make their commission off of you. Every time I call customer service I make a point to complain about the sales people in the stores. Once, I went in to a store and asked for a new SIM card, and the jerk didn't want to give me one because I was not buying something. I asked for a manager, and she was a b***h about it too and told me that the SIM cards cost them a lot of money. She told me to go to the RadioShack down the road and get one (and they wanted to charge me $25 for one). I just stopped going to the stores all together. If I need a new SIM card, I call customer service and request one to be shipped to me. My advise.... Stay away from the stores!!!!
If they are so into earning their commissions one would think they would want to sell a $549 phone at full price, no?
I work for Best Buy Mobile and indeed AT&T does automatically add the data plan once the IMEI for smartphones is detected in their database but this does not mean you can't buy the phone outright.. that's where the guy was wrong. I don't know if he would get a lesser commission if he sells without an activation or whatnot.
I was told that when you buy the tilt2, even at the no commitment price, as soon as you insert the sim AT&T will charge/change your service into a $30/mo data plan. Before anyone suggests to take the $30/mo plan that's $360 for the year. Purchasing it subsided with the data plan for a year is more than buying unlocked, nor do I want the $30 plan.
I was wondering if I purchase an unlocked Tilt2 can att still do that if I insert my sim into unlocked one. I'm happy with my data plan (medianet) and want to avoid being hit with the change buy purchasing an unlocked one. OK experts what's the verdict.
Any workaround anyone gives you is susceptible to being caught eventually, just FYI.
The one that's probably most reliable for now is purchasing an unlocked int'l GSM, TMobile or Sprint TP2 and plugging your sim into it. You won't have the proper 3g bands, so your data speed will be slower than if you were using a Tilt 2, but carriers don't generally maintain imei dbs of phones that aren't on their network.
Others may tell you they got by ATT with a Tilt2 and haven't had their data plan changed, but not everyone is so lucky. ATT most definitely monitors imei more now than they used to (defeating this used to be much more simple and effective before ATT began rebuilding their systems to accommodate iPhone enforcement--now those protections are starting to be used against other smartphones), so before you take the chance, keep in mind some people are getting nailed. The same is true for my suggestion above -- there are no guarantees.
I have a TMO HTC touch pro 2 that i purchased unlocked and am using it on AT&T on the medianet plan. My last several phones have been Samsung Innov8 and Nokia 5800 both Symbian OS that I have used unlocked on AT&T and only paid for medianet with no issues (aside from lack of 3G which isn't available in my area anyway).
-Jerry
webfrm said:
I was told that when you buy the tilt2, even at the no commitment price, as soon as you insert the sim AT&T will charge/change your service into a $30/mo data plan. Before anyone suggests to take the $30/mo plan that's $360 for the year. Purchasing it subsided with the data plan for a year is more than buying unlocked, nor do I want the $30 plan.
I was wondering if I purchase an unlocked Tilt2 can att still do that if I insert my sim into unlocked one. I'm happy with my data plan (medianet) and want to avoid being hit with the change buy purchasing an unlocked one. OK experts what's the verdict.
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IDT they can add the data plan to your account without your consent.
sdaddy said:
IDT they can add the data plan to your account without your consent.
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Click to collapse
They can and have. It started with the iPhone, and has expanded to other smartphones recently. First I heard of the expansion to other phones was when a friend got a txt warning him that he had to add one himself or it would be added for him immediately after he popped a sim into his old nokia smartphone when he was going to use it for a weekend. It's really only a question of whether their software will spot your smartphone.
I can't believe another one of these threads has popped up. No, they won't add a data plan without your consent. They will add it if they can twist your arm enough to say ok. If they add it without your consent there is plenty of precedent showing that they will remove it upon your insistence.
As for me, I have an iPhone 3GS, a Tilt2, and a Sony Xperia x1a that I use on my MediaNet $15 plan + $5 for 200 text message plan. I bought the Tilt 2 subsidized and even then didn't have to add the $30 plan.
Of course, it doesn't matter how many times this is stated there will still be the naysayers who will claim otherwise.
If the phone you by is a Tilt 2 (an AT&T branded phone) they will know by the IMEI. If you buy a TouchPro 2 or a phone from say another carrier they won't know what phone you have and allow you to get a less expansive data plan or no plan at all. Down side is you can't use AT&T's 3G and are stuck with the much slower data connection.
Honestly not having a data plan really hampers having such a capable phone.
jlczl said:
I can't believe another one of these threads has popped up. No, they won't add a data plan without your consent. They will add it if they can twist your arm enough to say ok. If they add it without your consent there is plenty of precedent showing that they will remove it upon your insistence.
As for me, I have an iPhone 3GS, a Tilt2, and a Sony Xperia x1a that I use on my MediaNet $15 plan + $5 for 200 text message plan. I bought the Tilt 2 subsidized and even then didn't have to add the $30 plan.
Of course, it doesn't matter how many times this is stated there will still be the naysayers who will claim otherwise.
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They sent me a text saying, "I data plan is required and if omitted, one would be added." Got home and checked and my data plan was changed.
It DOES happen.
jlczl said:
I can't believe another one of these threads has popped up. No, they won't add a data plan without your consent. They will add it if they can twist your arm enough to say ok. If they add it without your consent there is plenty of precedent showing that they will remove it upon your insistence.
As for me, I have an iPhone 3GS, a Tilt2, and a Sony Xperia x1a that I use on my MediaNet $15 plan + $5 for 200 text message plan. I bought the Tilt 2 subsidized and even then didn't have to add the $30 plan.
Of course, it doesn't matter how many times this is stated there will still be the naysayers who will claim otherwise.
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Click to collapse
Which is because exceptions don't disprove a rule.
I don't even doubt that some people have managed to talk their way out of the rule -- when I was tethering off my samsung a500 (on a different carrier) as a primary home internet connection on a $15 a month plan, they caught me, canceled, and I managed to get the right person on the phone and quickly got it reinstated and continued that use until I was done with that carrier.
Not everyone doing the same thing I did was so lucky, which is to say, just because I got around their policies doesn't mean the policies won't trap and damage users. And years later, carriers are far better equipped to detect violations and make changes without a human ever getting involved. Undoing their chicanery (they had a fair point in my case, but current policies are crap) is sometimes just a matter of luck, and sometimes is just impossible.
Telling people it might be possible to get around it, and how, is a nice piece of information. Telling people there is no valid concern when it's so clear there is one is irresponsible and harmful.
RojasTKD said:
Honestly not having a data plan really hampers having such a capable phone.
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Click to collapse
That of course depends on intended usage. Not everyone is a twittering feed-reading emailaholic. Some people are database using, note taking, app-aholics who need a 24/7 connection about as much as they need a hole in their head. Most are inbetween, but with the ubiquity of wifi in many people's worlds, inbetween users can potentially cut their cell bill in half with little-to-no usage sacrifice.
Is access to marketplace and zune pass on the device dependant on the IMEI of the phone?
I had an unlocked TP2 with a $15 unlimited data plan from ATT, when I bought the focus, ATT input this new IMEI into their system and my data plan is now $15 for 200mb. If access to these features is not IMEI dependant I would like to get my unlimited plan back...
Thanks in advance for the help.
chizzwhizz said:
Is access to marketplace and zune pass on the device dependant on the IMEI of the phone?
I had an unlocked TP2 with a $15 unlimited data plan from ATT, when I bought the focus, ATT input this new IMEI into their system and my data plan is now $15 for 200mb. If access to these features is not IMEI dependant I would like to get my unlimited plan back...
Thanks in advance for the help.
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Click to collapse
it only looks at your email (your phone is connected to your email,xboxlive )
it doesn't look at your imei
AT&T shafted you. This has nothing to do with Microsoft or even Windows Phone 7. Unless you gave them permission to change your plan, you should call back and get your old plan back.
chizzwhizz said:
Is access to marketplace and zune pass on the device dependant on the IMEI of the phone?
I had an unlocked TP2 with a $15 unlimited data plan from ATT, when I bought the focus, ATT input this new IMEI into their system and my data plan is now $15 for 200mb. If access to these features is not IMEI dependant I would like to get my unlimited plan back...
Thanks in advance for the help.
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Click to collapse
$15 Unlimited Data Plans are for Feature Phones, not Smartphones.
You phone sends off your IMEI to AT&T whenever it connects to the network. Since you put a SIM Card from a Feature Phone into a Smartphone, they automatically upgraded you to a 200MB Smartphone data plan.
Call AT&T. If you're on a contract you HAVE to have a Smartphone data plan if you put that SIM in a Smartphone. There's no way to get around it. If you get them to change it back (i.e. tell them you're going to just use you feature phone), the minute your phone connects to the network again, it will check the IMEI and if the SIM is in the smartphone it will simply upgrade you to a smartphone data plan again.
I made a huge post about this in another thread talking about getting a WP7 device without a data plan in that forum. My mom did that and wondered why her bill went from $80 to $120 in less than a month a while back
RustyGrom said:
AT&T shafted you. This has nothing to do with Microsoft or even Windows Phone 7. Unless you gave them permission to change your plan, you should call back and get your old plan back.
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Click to collapse
Incorrect. It's common knowledge that Feature Phone Data Plans are incompatible with smartphones and that a smartphone data plan is required if you use a smartphone on contract. It's in the contract. It's in you contract too. Might want to read it.
They reserve the right to change you service if you use an incompatible device with you contract (i.e. alter you contract to compliance), and they reserve the right to add services onto you contract if you use them (i.e. if you tether without a tethering plan, they will add the tethering plan to you contract).
AT&T didn't shaft him, he just got himself kapwnd trying to shaft AT&T.
Nice try, but no cigar.
T-Mobile would do the same thing, and CDMA carriers would require you to upgrade you plan if you try to swap out a feature phone for a smart phone. Call Sprint, smarty, and see what they tell you about this (I've had all 4 carriers ).
Do you seriously think carriers are so dumb as to leave such an odd profit-killing loophole in their systems?
N8ter said:
$15 Unlimited Data Plans are for Feature Phones, not Smartphones.
You phone sends off your IMEI to AT&T whenever it connects to the network. Since you put a SIM Card from a Feature Phone into a Smartphone, they automatically upgraded you to a 200MB Smartphone data plan.
Call AT&T. If you're on a contract you HAVE to have a Smartphone data plan if you put that SIM in a Smartphone. There's no way to get around it. If you get them to change it back (i.e. tell them you're going to just use you feature phone), the minute your phone connects to the network again, it will check the IMEI and if the SIM is in the smartphone it will simply upgrade you to a smartphone data plan again.
I made a huge post about this in another thread talking about getting a WP7 device without a data plan in that forum. My mom did that and wondered why her bill went from $80 to $120 in less than a month a while back
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it still amazes me how cheap people are with this. You will spend 600 bucks on a device but expect not to pay for the plan.
Y'all have been getting around the data for quite a while now and it finally looks like the cellular companies are catching up to you.
nrfitchett4 said:
it still amazes me how cheap people are with this. You will spend 600 bucks on a device but expect not to pay for the plan.
Y'all have been getting around the data for quite a while now and it finally looks like the cellular companies are catching up to you.
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Click to collapse
The carriers have been doing that for years. I think it's too late to even consider ignorance a valid excuse, especially when you have other people sprouting around invalid information and posters are allergic to forum search (the thread I posted in probably would have popped up in the results).
The truth and the matter is, someone with an Unlimited Feature Phone plan probably never uses more than 200MB data a month anyways, and a smartphone can do 10x that easily. Can probably do over 200MB just with passive Syncing if you have busy email/facebook/twitter accounts. In that case, marketing the data plans for feature phones as "Unlimited" is nice from a strategic standpoint once the person is locked into a contract they either have to pay AT&T/Verizon's enourmous ETF Fee (which they increased from $200 to $325 or 350, one of the two) to move to another carrier, or simply upgrade to the smartphone data plans (and for anyone who even moderately uses their device - 200MB is NOT going to cut it on a fairly recent smartphone).
200MB smartphone data plans are for people who have smartphones but use them like feature phones - you know, the people who think the phone is pretty but don't even have an email/facebook/twitter/etc. acocunt linked up with it (except maybe a google or live account, but they never use it and just make and recieve calls on the phone, and maybe some texts).
Well i'm not on contract with att anymore, my two years ended about 4 months ago...didnt upgrade or anything. I bought my phone out of contract. But i got my unlimited plan for feature phones back so i'm happy. It's not about being cheap...i make more than enough money in a year. It just doesnt make sense to charge $15 for 200mb knowing full well that anyone with a smartphone will use over 200mb in a month and then charge $10 for every mb over...
chizzwhizz said:
Well i'm not on contract with att anymore, my two years ended about 4 months ago...didnt upgrade or anything. I bought my phone out of contract. But i got my unlimited plan for feature phones back so i'm happy. It's not about being cheap...i make more than enough money in a year. It just doesnt make sense to charge $15 for 200mb knowing full well that anyone with a smartphone will use over 200mb in a month and then charge $10 for every mb over...
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isn't that why they offer a 2gb plan???
what are y'all gonna due when sim cards become unremovable???
http://www.engadget.com/2010/11/17/gsm-association-proposes-embedded-sim-cards-with-remote-activati/
I am worried about the same thing.
I presently use HP Ipaq 614C and have 30USD a month unlimited data plan.. I want to buy unlocked HTC Surround since its almost the same price if I buy locked one from AtnT (I dont qualify for contract upgrade as I just renewed a two year contract with them 2 months back).
I am worried once I get unlocked HTC Surround from expansys-usa.. and put my SIM card in their.. wether they will change my 30USD per month unlimited data plan to 30USD per month 2GB LIMITED data plan..
I have read one more poster writing about it, about how once he put his sim, his data plan was changed from unlimited to 2GB limited data plan..
Purple11 said:
I am worried about the same thing.
I presently use HP Ipaq 614C and have 30USD a month unlimited data plan.. I want to buy unlocked HTC Surround since its almost the same price if I buy locked one from AtnT (I dont qualify for contract upgrade as I just renewed a two year contract with them 2 months back).
I am worried once I get unlocked HTC Surround from expansys-usa.. and put my SIM card in their.. wether they will change my 30USD per month unlimited data plan to 30USD per month 2GB LIMITED data plan..
I have read one more poster writing about it, about how once he put his sim, his data plan was changed from unlimited to 2GB limited data plan..
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Click to collapse
if you already have a smartphone unlimited data plan, they shouldn't change it and if they do, I would call and make them change it back. The other poster had a featurephone data plan that was not compatible with the new phone.
Purple11 said:
I am worried about the same thing.
I presently use HP Ipaq 614C and have 30USD a month unlimited data plan.. I want to buy unlocked HTC Surround since its almost the same price if I buy locked one from AtnT (I dont qualify for contract upgrade as I just renewed a two year contract with them 2 months back).
I am worried once I get unlocked HTC Surround from expansys-usa.. and put my SIM card in their.. wether they will change my 30USD per month unlimited data plan to 30USD per month 2GB LIMITED data plan..
I have read one more poster writing about it, about how once he put his sim, his data plan was changed from unlimited to 2GB limited data plan..
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Click to collapse
Different situation, buddy.
AT&T used to have $30 unlimited Data Plans before they changed it. If you upgrade your phone, you get to keep your $30 unlimited Data Plan.
They call this being "Grandfathered in." Sprint did the same with SERO plans, and other carriers do the same with older plans that they have phased out.
You don't have to do anything. You just put your SIM card in the new phone and you'll still have $30 unlimited data plan, until you cancel your contract/service, then for a new line you won't have that option.
We aren't even talking about what you're talking about.
We're talking about someone trying to use a cheap feature phone plan with a smartphone, not someone who thinks he's going to lose his grandfathered unlimited data plan if he switches phones.
To the OP, it doesn't matter if your contract is out. The AT&T system sees that you have x Minutes, x SMS/MMS, and Unlimited Feature Phone data plan. When you turn your phone on with your SIM card in it, it checks the phone's IMEI to make sure it's a feature phone or dumb phone (basically the same, feature phones just have bigger screans and oftentimes QWERTY keyboards or touchscreens). If you don't, they change it to the Smartphone plan.
Since a Smartphone cannot be used with that plan, they are potentially saving you money by automatically switching you over to a smartphone data plan, because otherwise all the data you use on the smartphone would count as overages. Fortunately for you, they have tiered data plans, and it's $15 instead of 30.
If they had just let you get all the overages, you'd be paying a lot more than $15 for it and since it's explicitely written in your contract/terms that you cannot use that phone with that data plan, you'd have no choice but to pay up. That is Cell Phone Service 101. Most people who pay attention know there is a distinct difference between feature phone and smartphone plans. They aren't even called the same thing on the AT&T website, or on your bill.
nrfitchett4 said:
isn't that why they offer a 2gb plan???
what are y'all gonna due when sim cards become unremovable???
http://www.engadget.com/2010/11/17/gsm-association-proposes-embedded-sim-cards-with-remote-activati/
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Click to collapse
Rejoice that when someone steals a GSM smartphone it will no longer be equivalent to them hitting eBay lottery? They should have started doing this a long time ago, IMO.
i understand what you guys are saying but why was it that when i went from my razr to an unlocked touch pro 2 (feature phone to smartphone), my data plan didnt change? even when att introduced the tiered plans, my data plan didnt change.
chizzwhizz said:
i understand what you guys are saying but why was it that when i went from my razr to an unlocked touch pro 2 (feature phone to smartphone), my data plan didnt change? even when att introduced the tiered plans, my data plan didnt change.
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you were lucky???
I really don't know. Carriers are getting better at being able to tell what phone you are using these days. Used to be that they couldn't tell at all. Now, a lot of phones can transmit the imei number back to the carrier that they can now check against a database to see what type of phone it is.
More like "every phone."
nrfitchett4 said:
you were lucky???
I really don't know. Carriers are getting better at being able to tell what phone you are using these days. Used to be that they couldn't tell at all. Now, a lot of phones can transmit the imei number back to the carrier that they can now check against a database to see what type of phone it is.
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Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
ceesheim said:
it only looks at your email (your phone is connected to your email,xboxlive )
it doesn't look at your imei
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Click to collapse
It checks a serial code stored in the device's rom for market, zune, xbl,.etc.
Live account is used to access services, ofc. Microsoft can ban phonea by serial though, which is exactly what will happen to every phone using a ported rom (i.e. Hd2s running wp7).
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
N8ter said:
It checks a serial code stored in the device's rom for market, zune, xbl,.etc.
Live account is used to access services, ofc. Microsoft can ban phonea by serial though, which is exactly what will happen to every phone using a ported rom (i.e. Hd2s running wp7).
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we don't know that for sure , I have 2 hd7 (direct from O2 online) and one of them couldn't be activated (email) so I called O2 for the code ( 5 times 5 numbers) but they couldn't help me .
they told me that the phone wasn't activated for some reason at Microsoft.
I called Microsoft and tolled the story and they say " gif us a email and wait 2 min , we are generating an code for you " LOL phone was unlocked and I could use the email.
I called again to activate that same phone with an different email and I got a different code and that one worked to
I think that if you have a hd2 with a ported rom you just have to call Microsoft and ask them to unlock your email for it and after that you can do the same as a real wp7 phone.
ceesheim said:
we don't know that for sure , I have 2 hd7 (direct from O2 online) and one of them couldn't be activated (email) so I called O2 for the code ( 5 times 5 numbers) but they couldn't help me .
they told me that the phone wasn't activated for some reason at Microsoft.
I called Microsoft and tolled the story and they say " gif us a email and wait 2 min , we are generating an code for you " LOL phone was unlocked and I could use the email.
I called again to activate that same phone with an different email and I got a different code and that one worked to
I think that if you have a hd2 with a ported rom you just have to call Microsoft and ask them to unlock your email for it and after that you can do the same as a real wp7 phone.
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Yes we do.
That HD7 incident you're talking about has nothing to do with what I'm talking about.
Microsoft doesn't do that by eMail address.
It uses a serial in the device's ROM. It does the same for XBox 360s and they can ban a device by serial number. They can probably do it for Zune HDs as well. It has nothing to do with you email address, otherwise you can unban yourself simply by creating a new Live ID, master resetting the phone, and putting that Windows Live ID when setting the phone up. Obviously that's an elementary loophole. It would be embarassing if they left the system that easy to circumvent...
Think through these things a bit before you make such sweeping conclusions.
Microsoft already has the infrastructure up for this. These are known facts.
An HD2 with a ported WP7 ROM won't be useful at all, except as a feature phone with a cute UI, because the system would probably ban it the minute it checked in with Microsoft's servers and sent that phony certificate (or no certificate at all in the worse case).
WP7 phones send this serial (certificate, etc.) to Microsoft's servers whenever they connect to check for updates, etc. It's like a Windows Genuine Advantage for phones, except much stronger. Apple can also block iPhones/iTouches from iTunes via the Serial number if unsupported changes are made to the firmware or the firmware is ported to an unsupported device, so it's not like this has never been done or implemented before...
The Serial/Certificate and the IMEI is pretty much all Microsoft needs to ban a phone from all their cloud services automatically. The IMEI itself is enough to tell them that you're running WP7 on a non-WP7 device (i.e. HD2), which can result in an auto-ban on the first connection attempt.
N8ter said:
Different situation, buddy.
AT&T used to have $30 unlimited Data Plans before they changed it. If you upgrade your phone, you get to keep your $30 unlimited Data Plan.
They call this being "Grandfathered in." Sprint did the same with SERO plans, and other carriers do the same with older plans that they have phased out.
You don't have to do anything. You just put your SIM card in the new phone and you'll still have $30 unlimited data plan, until you cancel your contract/service, then for a new line you won't have that option.
We aren't even talking about what you're talking about.
We're talking about someone trying to use a cheap feature phone plan with a smartphone, not someone who thinks he's going to lose his grandfathered unlimited data plan if he switches phones.
To the OP, it doesn't matter if your contract is out. The AT&T system sees that you have x Minutes, x SMS/MMS, and Unlimited Feature Phone data plan. When you turn your phone on with your SIM card in it, it checks the phone's IMEI to make sure it's a feature phone or dumb phone (basically the same, feature phones just have bigger screans and oftentimes QWERTY keyboards or touchscreens). If you don't, they change it to the Smartphone plan.
Since a Smartphone cannot be used with that plan, they are potentially saving you money by automatically switching you over to a smartphone data plan, because otherwise all the data you use on the smartphone would count as overages. Fortunately for you, they have tiered data plans, and it's $15 instead of 30.
If they had just let you get all the overages, you'd be paying a lot more than $15 for it and since it's explicitely written in your contract/terms that you cannot use that phone with that data plan, you'd have no choice but to pay up. That is Cell Phone Service 101. Most people who pay attention know there is a distinct difference between feature phone and smartphone plans. They aren't even called the same thing on the AT&T website, or on your bill.
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Thanks for the reply..
I have paid Atnt for last 4 months 30USD a month just to keep this unlimited data plan.. my battery at Ipaq died and I have been using this cheap flip phone and absolutly no data.. but I know this December I will be getting WP7 back.. so I am just paying 30USD a month every month, just to keep the plan.. and zero use of data.. one cannot even stop it 'temporarily'.. once you get it off.. you can only get 2GB limited data plan max... which I usually finish in first 10-12 days when I used my HP Ipaq614c... I play a lot of streaming music.. and heck of a data intensive financial softwares on my phone..
I love the new WP7 phones and am dying to get my hands on one. I had a question about getting one though. Right now I am on a family plan with AT&T running a G1 that doesn't require a data plan. I would like to keep the data plan off of my tab. I have my reasons but my biggest is that I am constantly surrounded by WiFi and even when I am out and about, data isn't a big deal to me.
So is it possible to get a new phone without the data plan? I fully am aware that I will need to buy out of contract (which I am fine with), I just don't want to pay 200 - 300 bucks a year for a data plan. Last Wednesday, I went in to pick up a Focus at an AT&T store and the girl told me she had to add a data plan. I walked out and am hoping you guys can help me out a bit.
Has anyone had any luck with buying a phone out of contract, turning off the network data and not getting billed for a data plan? I am up for getting either a Samsung Focus or the HTC HD7 (whatever works... but the HD7 might be a good option as well considering I want to move to T-Mobile once I get out of my contract in a year).
Believe me I researched this. I have a Fuze on AT&T that has no data plan. We were lucky to have gotten them when contracts did not require a data plan. Our phone is grandfathered in...
However, if you get a new smartphone, it will trigger adding a data plan to your account. I believe it goes by IMEI number and your account... your original phone's IMEI number is set to be excluded from this provision. Any new phone you get will cause the data plan to be added automatically. If you put someone else's SIM card in your old phone... they get a data plan automatically. You can buy a new smartphone and pay full price online somewhere... as soon as you put your SIM card in it, you'll have a data plan added to your account.
There's just no way (as far as I know) to get one of these new phones without a data plan. I will be biting the bullet and getting a new Windows phone sometime in the next couple of months...
makku12 said:
Believe me I researched this. I have a Fuze on AT&T that has no data plan. We were lucky to have gotten them when contracts did not require a data plan. Our phone is grandfathered in...
However, if you get a new smartphone, it will trigger adding a data plan to your account. I believe it goes by IMEI number and your account... your original phone's IMEI number is set to be excluded from this provision. Any new phone you get will cause the data plan to be added automatically. If you put someone else's SIM card in your old phone... they get a data plan automatically. You can buy a new smartphone and pay full price online somewhere... as soon as you put your SIM card in it, you'll have a data plan added to your account.
There's just no way (as far as I know) to get one of these new phones without a data plan. I will be biting the bullet and getting a new Windows phone sometime in the next couple of months...
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This is exactly correct. As soon as your SIM is inserted into a new smartphone, although it may take time, you will be charged for a data plan. It registers the IMEI number of that phone on your account.
Damn. Well... can't say I tried. Thanks for the info gents.
Even if you could, I wouldn't suggest it
as far as I've been able to tell, you can't turn off your data connection fully
and this phone is always grabbing data, you'd be paying tons for data...much more than on a data plan
dressanderc said:
This is exactly correct. As soon as your SIM is inserted into a new smartphone, although it may take time, you will be charged for a data plan. It registers the IMEI number of that phone on your account.
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That's not true (At least in my case). As long as data is not initial from the phone, my AT&T Pure didn't trigger the automatic data plan (It did trigger once because I accidentally turn the data on and had to call At&t support to remove it).
For my X1a, I've been using it for almost 2 yrs on their cheap media-net plan without issue. Therefore, I suspect they could only verify smartphone that being sold by them (like the Focus I got recently). That's why I am looking at the HTC Mozart being sold in Austria (850mzh UMTS support)
edit: nevermind
drleospaceman said:
LG Optimus 7's on Ebay should work.
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Only on UMTS 1900 portion. I don't think it support 850
That's pretty lame... I have T-mobile and picked up an HD7. No data package and my HD7 is running flawlessly. The only feature that doesnt work with wi-fi is slacker radio and to be honest I don't need it...
I just wanted to ask others opinion on how they feel about AT&T taking away the unlimited data plan with the smart phone packages unless you got grandfathered in from having the unlimited data before all this took place.
Well for many many months i have wondered why i didnt get grandfathered in because i had the unlimited before with WM6.5, well they failed to mention it to me and i thought i still had it, but come to find out i got put on the 2gb plan and havent went over the limit for a long time. The past couple months i have went over and got txt saying i reached 75% of my data then 100% and was being charged 10$ for extra gb. I called them to consult them with the problem and they tell me i should have been grandfathered in with my old data plan being unlimited but that they were sorry that i had went past the 3month period to be able to ask for it, and that i had to stay on the rated data plan. So with that said i called them back couple days later and told them i wanted to switch to a old phone i had " LG-VU" and wanted the unlimited data plan, then i gave them my IMEI number and switched devices but never even took out the sim from my samsung focus. They say that it would not work without the smart phone data plan but it still performs as it was before and i have unlimited data plan. I have called the *3282# to see, and it says unlimited data and that the other 2gb plan is deactivated.
My question is if anyone else has experienced this kinda situation before as i have and what they did about it. Will AT&T be able to see that i am still using the focus and not the Vu?
When i had the WM6.5 i never told them what device i was using, i just put sim card in and edited the APN and never had to have smart phone data.
Many opinions Appreciated!!
i had same problem. i was told after having an htc fuze with unlimited data that i could not be grandfathered in with my new smart phone even after explaining that the fuze was also a smart phone. its now been a year though. i may try your method of getting the unlimited data back.
I was determined to figure a way around it, especially after the Hot Spot hack, using that for my xbox 360 live. But it seams to be do the trick so far, its been a couple days now and i havent gotten any alert as i did before, but thats not saying i wont get one saying im being charged. So lets hope this is a work around with a dumb phone!!
All I did was upgrade my phone in a store then call ATT after my first bill stating that I was told I would keep my unlimited plan and if they dont want to give it back I can just return the phone and go with another provider... lets just say I have unlimited data again.
They will try to say you went past the the 14 day return but just tell them that you were sold the phone on false pretenses and that it was a mistake on their end. They will fold once you get past the first teir rep.
I have done this upgrading from a iPhone 2G to 3GS and then from 3GS to WP7. I also managed to get it when I added a second line for my GF with the old 3GS haha... Play stupid and just go with the old, "I was told I would get this.... are you telling me I was lied to by one of your ATT sales people?" they trip over themselves then give you what you want.
HoorayBeer said:
i had same problem. i was told after having an htc fuze with unlimited data that i could not be grandfathered in with my new smart phone even after explaining that the fuze was also a smart phone. its now been a year though. i may try your method of getting the unlimited data back.
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I didn't have any problem at all. But then, when I heard about the change, I went straight to an AT&T store to make sure I had a guarantee that I would be grandfathered in no matter what. When I upgraded from my Fuze to a Focus, I had no trouble, and I'm still unlimited a year later.
you can get it back and here's how
as soon as I get my titan and get back with at&t
i'm talking to this guy or you can use your own iphone 2g if you have one lying around
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220875871251
Seems like a good deal! We'll see if AT&T honors that promise of grandfathering T-Mo people!
noelitaux said:
as soon as I get my titan and get back with at&t
i'm talking to this guy or you can use your own iphone 2g if you have one lying around
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220875871251
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I get the same txt that he is getting
noelitaux said:
i'm talking to this guy or you can use your own iphone 2g if you have one lying around
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220875871251
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As for me, it looks like some kind of criminal transaction. Somehow this guy got access to AT&T billing/accounting system and makes non-authorized changes in database. I prefer to stay with my 2 Gb only data plan but w/o possible problems...
I think that guy is doing the same thing as i did, but he is charging ppl to call and do it for you. All i did was change the IMEI by supplying them with it and acctivating unlimted data for that dumb device, But keep my sim card in my Focus. As you can see in my screen capture on phone that i just took a few min before i posted showing that the 2gb plan was cancelled and unlimited was activated.
Lets just hope this is a work around sollution for this, as it is working as of now!!
I only pay $40 a month unlimited everything through simple mobile... I don't know how much you guys are paying but can't beat that deal... And its $40 flat...not $40 plus this and that fee.
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lucasryan said:
I think that guy is doing the same thing as i did, but he is charging ppl to call and do it for you.
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I don't think so - too much pain in the a$$ for $25 Definitely he found the way to change AT&T database...
lucasryan said:
As you can see in my screen capture on phone that i just took a few min before i posted showing that the 2gb plan was cancelled and unlimited was activated.
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How about your bill? How much AT&T charges for unlim? $30/m as it was before?
Hmm you maybe right on that, i wouldnt do all those phones for that much.
My current unlimited data is costing me 15 a month now.
i wonder if this would work on their gophone as well?
register a dumbphone for the $50 unlimited and then put the sim in a smartphone?
does the network read IMEI when the device tries to connect?
for me, when i got my gophone sim card, i didn't have my focus with me, so the att rep entered all 0's or 1's for imei, does it read the phone and change them? or is there a way to see what phone they think i'm using?
sorry if it's a bit off topic, but it's very interesting to me
Still Unlimited
I went from an ATT FUZE with a PDA Unlimited Plan to an ATT Samsung Focus and the rep merely moved my SIM in the FUZE to the Focus last December and I still have the Unlimited Plan.
Hmm, I think I'll switch to the unlimited and not add data and see what happens, worst case I spend an extra $25 next month
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I just switched to att $10 unlimited last night using my SIM in my HD2 and telling them my IMIE number (which att's system didnt recognize) I told them I was using a t-mo dumbphone becuase my focus broke (lie) and they switched me over no problem. I'm going to use my HD2 for a little bit then go back to my focus and see what happens
On a side note you can get a gophone from walmart for like $10 its a samsung a107 then toss your sim in that call them up with the IMIE num and they will move you over to a dumbphone plan as well.
adiliyo said:
i wonder if this would work on their gophone as well?
register a dumbphone for the $50 unlimited and then put the sim in a smartphone?
does the network read IMEI when the device tries to connect?
for me, when i got my gophone sim card, i didn't have my focus with me, so the att rep entered all 0's or 1's for imei, does it read the phone and change them? or is there a way to see what phone they think i'm using?
sorry if it's a bit off topic, but it's very interesting to me
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Yes the system reads the IMEI when connecting, but i think it will also work for gophones also. I dont know what the rates are for those plans but i dont think it will catch it unless the done a manual audit on it, witch they have no reason to do so.
voluptuary said:
I just switched to att $10 unlimited last night using my SIM in my HD2 and telling them my IMIE number (which att's system didnt recognize) I told them I was using a t-mo dumbphone becuase my focus broke (lie) and they switched me over no problem. I'm going to use my HD2 for a little bit then go back to my focus and see what happens
On a side note you can get a gophone from walmart for like $10 its a samsung a107 then toss your sim in that call them up with the IMIE num and they will move you over to a dumbphone plan as well.
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All i did was just call in and tell them i was switching phones to my old LG-Vu and went to unlimited plan, i never even took out my sim from my focus, then they did test call to make sure all was working, i answered call from focus as again i never took my sim out lol and they didnt notice it so it ALL GOOD
How about your bill? How much AT&T charges for unlim? $30/m as it was before?[/QUOTE]
Its 15 for the unlimited data, but i have the Media Max Unlimited plan for $35. The $15 plan mentioned is for the Media Net unlimited. That gives you unlimited data access only, but i need sms unlimited also cause there are alot of my friends that can only txt.