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Question about app2sd and MoDaCo 3.0

Hello guys!
I am using this ROM with app2sd and Recovery Amon RA 1.5.2
My question is- when I install some apps from the Market, not from files, do they go to SD card or I have to install there manually?
Thanks a lot!

miragebg said:
Hello guys!
I am using this ROM with app2sd and Recovery Amon RA 1.5.2
My question is- when I install some apps from the Market, not from files, do they go to SD card or I have to install there manually?
Thanks a lot!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you have formatted your sd properly in ext3 partition... then you shouldnt do anything.just installing from market would put it on the card.

one question..
when a app is installed in the ext3 partion, why does the menu with the internal memory lose space? or is this normal?

With a2sd, your /data/app and /data/app-private directories are actually mounted to a filesystem on your sd card. The OS still installs the apps in those directories, which just happen to be on the sd card. It's all transparent to the OS.
The dalvik cache, where virtual machines are created to run your apps, still resides in internal memory, so when you run your new app for the first time, a VM gets created, and the amount of available internal memory goes down. That's normal.
Word of caution: Never remove the SD card while the system is running. Always turn it off first.

marinierb said:
With a2sd, your /data/app and /data/app-private directories are actually mounted to a filesystem on your sd card.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
technically it is the other way around, the sdcard is mounted to the directories. but other than that you are spot on

so what happend when i'm over the internal memory?
i mean when the internal memory shows 80mb and i am installing a lot off apps, over the 80 mb what happend?^^
does the internal memory goes in the negative?

no just u cant install more apps. the problem is the dalvik cache. i moved the dalvik chache to the sd card too to save more space.

zerofigther said:
so what happend when i'm over the internal memory?
i mean when the internal memory shows 80mb and i am installing a lot off apps, over the 80 mb what happend?^^
does the internal memory goes in the negative?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol yes the memory goes into negative, and the data starts to leak out of your phone!
scnr, i can imagine two scenarios: android tells you that there is no more space left and you can not install more apps, or it will just start to freeze, give force closes, reset itself, stuff like that. i'd guess the first one, it is forseeable that one fills the rather small phone memory, so there should be routines that stop the phone from failing catastrophically. anyone up for a test?

Do I need to prepare my SD card before flashing 2.2 rom?

If I want to use the build-in A2SD in 2.2 rom, do I have to format my SD card in a special way (in order to make EXT partition)?
If not, how much space in the SD will be avaliable for applications?
And when I will download from the market, will I be able to choose where to install the application (Internal of SD)?

The built in a2sd is rubbish.
90% of apps don't support moving to sdcard.
Those that do still store space on your internal memory.
But if that sounds good for you then no, you do not need to prepare anything.
You will not get to choose where, but if you go to settings -> applications, for the apps that support you there is the option to move to sd card.
The usual amount of space will be available, depends on whether or not you wipe data/cache etc. Memory will go down as you install apps.
Hope this helps.

so what should I do in order it not be rubbish?

cgrec92 said:
The built in a2sd is rubbish.
90% of apps don't support moving to sdcard.
Those that do still store space on your internal memory.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
IMHO, it isn't that bad! I've used the ModInstallLocation app to set my install location to SD card and the majority of apps have played nice and gone to the SD card automatically. I *believe* that the only ones which haven't are those that have specifically disallowed the privilege by the application author.
Regards,
Dave

I think there are mixed views about which one is 'better'.
I've been using A2SD+ on 2.1 ROMS; just upgraded to 2.2 and still am using it. Many say that it ultimately saves more space than the built in Froyo version of it.

I had the same question the first time I was about to root and flash a 2.2 ROM (am a noob).
From the (huge) info on the site, it appears that you really don't have to worry about preparing your SD card before you root.
You DO have to prepare it before flashing a custom Froyo ROM (with A2SD+) AFTER you root it successfully (unrEVOked3 is just great).
I used ROM Manager to partition:
swap 0, ext3 512 partition and fat32 for the rest
Gurus, correct me if I am wrong

Legacy ADSD+ should save more space than Froyo native A2SD since it moves the Dalvik cache to SD card.
I would imagine that there is little to no difference between regular legacy A2SD and Froyo native A2SD in terms of internal storage savings, though I could certainly be wrong on this count!
Regards,
Dave

rahulforlove said:
You DO have to prepare it before flashing a custom Froyo ROM (with A2SD+) AFTER you root it successfully (unrEVOked3 is just great).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Generally, you don't need to have an EXT partition on your SD card prior to flashing a ROM with A2SD+, because if the EXT partition doesn't exist the scripts to move the apps/cache to the EXT partition do not run. So, you should be able to flash a new ROM with A2SD+, and if subsequently you want to enable A2SD+ you simply need to partition your SD card and it will move everything over on the next boot.
Regards,
Dave

Understood. Thanks, Dave!

Official Froyo A2sd vs A2sd+

Hey guys
Im on holiday now so cannot really check myself the differences, but just wanted some quick info on the A2SD, with the official froyo i was hoping everybody will start using it, but somehow people still using the old method, whys that?
thanks

Froyo A2SD is completely reliant on app developers. If the devs doesn't allow it in their app then it can't be moved to the SD card. This is really only a problem because Froyo is still new.
Old A2SD you can dump everything on the SD
However, I'd be interested in seeing if there is a way to force an app onto the nand using A2SD+. Would work better for things like widgets, home replacements etc, as they'd run quicker for people with slow sd cards.

Probably because the FroYo one sucks !
Why ? Well, mostly because devs have to rewrite their apps so they can use FroYo's app2sd function...
With the "old-fashioned" a2sd, there is no need to do anything, just sit and enjoy the free space

APP2SD allows you to move certain apps to your SD card and run them from there BUT as these are placed on the normal root of the SD when you mount the SD, via USB for example, you loose access to these apps until you remount SD. This means you cant install widgets to the SD and such like.
APP2SD+ on the other hand uses an ext3 partition (or ext4 on newer versions) which then installs all apps & widgets to that partition and when the SD is mounted you dont lose any apps or widgets as is located in a seperate partition.
Hope that helps.
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App

wow! thats quick thanks for you input guys think you explained everything i wanted to know really
Id want to use the offical a2sd as i think using ext3 partitioned sd card have already slightly damaged the card cuz it keeps giving me errors everytime i connect it to a pc

mrwookie6379 said:
APP2SD allows you to move certain apps to your SD card and run them from there BUT as these are placed on the normal root of the SD when you mount the SD, via USB for example, you loose access to these apps until you remount SD. This means you cant install widgets to the SD and such like.
APP2SD+ on the other hand uses an ext3 partition (or ext4 on newer versions) which then installs all apps & widgets to that partition and when the SD is mounted you dont lose any apps or widgets as is located in a seperate partition.
Hope that helps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So let me understand the names:
APPS2SD = Froyo Original (comes with official Froyo release)
APPS2SD+ = Hacked version which has been out since FRF50 leak?
EDIT: But if APPS2SD+ is so much better (keeps apps on ext3 partition), why to people keep using the original APPS2SD on their ROMs?

Check this explaination. Quoted from neoKushan from yesterdays thread.
neoKushan said:
Ok, so here's the deal, in a very longwinded way that should hopefully explain everything and answer ALL questions.
You have an SD card in your phone and, a bit like normal PC Hard Drives, you can "partition" them (split them into two or more sections of different filesystems). Normally, your SD card is just one big FAT32 partition, which is fine for storing your pics, messages, emails, etc.
Now, other then your Phone's SD card, your phone will have its own internal flash memory (or "NAND") storage. Tradditionally with Android, you could only install applications to this NAND storage, you cannot install them onto your SD card. So if you have an empty 32GB SD card, but only 5Mb of internal phone storage, you still wont be able to install many apps, if any at all.
This was done to protect the apps from things like piracy - it's not easy to access the location where apps are installed on your phone's internal storage (normally impossible without root), so you can't for example buy an app, copy it, refund it, then install it again.
Still, this is no good for those of us who like to install lots and lots of apps, legitimately, as we run out of internal storage very quickly.
So Google came up with a way to install apps to the SD card. A folder is created called something like .android_secure and this stores (I believe) encrypted versions of applications, but there's a few catches:
1) Apps aren't automatically stored here, you have to manually "move" them
2) Not all apps are capable of being moved, in fact most apps aren't, the developer needs to update their app and allow it. Some apps aren't and wont be updated and some developers may not want to allow it for whatever reason.
3) Not all app data is moved, most of it is but some data is left on your phone so many people still run out of internal storage quickly.
4) You can force ALL apps to be moved to this area by default, but it breaks incompatible ones - such as Widgets, which are unable to load due to the SD card not being "prepared".
So that's Froyo's version. Before Froyo existed, some very clever people came up with a thing called "Apps2SD". Remember I said that your SD card normally is one big FAT32 partition? Well, Apps2SD works by having your SD card patitioned into TWO filesystems. A normal FAT32 partition for your usual stuff and a secondary "EXT" partition. EXT is just a filesystem, like FAT32 or NTFS, but it's the filesystem used by Android internally. The SD card is normally FAT32 because it's a "universal" filesystem, that just about any machine will be able to read, whereas EXT filesystems are generally Linux only, but I digress.
EXT has several different versions. The most common one you'll see is ext3. The main difference between ext2 and ext3 is "journaling", which is just a fancy way of saying that should an operation (such as copying, writing or reading) be interrupted unexpectedly (say, by you turning your phone off), then no data should be lost or corrupted. You know how when you turn your phone on, it says "preparing SD card"? It takes a few minutes, but what it's actually doing is checking that the FAT32 partition hasn't been damaged, because FAT does NOT have journaling. If you used a computer back in the Windows 98 days, you may remember that lovely blue "Scandisk" screen that had to run every time you didn't shut your computer down correctly - that's the same thing. But then Windows 2000/XP came along with NTFS, which also has journaling, meaning you had less chance of loosing data. But I digress once more.
So you have your SD card partitioned into EXT and FAT32. Generally it doesn't matter if it's ext3 or ext4, but you don't get any real advantage with ext4 over ext3 in this instance. Apps2SD then runs a special script on your phone which "symbolically links" the folder from your phone's internal storage where your apps are normally stored, to the ext partition on your SD card. A symbolic link is a bit like a shortcut for folders, except it's transparent to the OS: In other words, Android doesn't know that when it's installing it's apps to the internal phone storage, it's actually being stored on the SD card. This effectively boosts your internal phone memory from the previous 5mb that you had in my example above, up to whatever size you made the ext partition on your SD card (often 512Mb or 1Gb, but it depends on how many apps you install).
Plus, because it's "journaled", it doesn't need to be "prepared", meaning it's ready to go as soon as the phone starts - so your widgets and apps work immediately (unlike "forced" Froyo Apps2SD, where widgets disappear).
The catch with Apps2SD is that whatever space the ext partition takes up is taken away from the SD card. So if you have a 4Gb card (with something like 3.5Gb of actual storage) and you make a 512Mb ext partition, your SD card will "shrink" to 3Gb. The space isn't actually lost, it's just being used by the ext partition. If you reformat your card, you'll get it back.
Finally, there's a difference between "Apps2SD" and "Apps2SD+". Remember I said that your apps are stored on a special folder inside your Phone's NAND storage? Well, that was a bit of a lie. It's actually stored in TWO places. There's a second area which is called the Davlik Cache. You don't really need to worry about what this is for (Hint: IT's to do with the Java runetime your phone uses to run apps), all you need to know is that apps use it to store data, which also eats up internal phone memory. Apps2SD+ moves davlik cache to the ext partition on your SD card as well, freeing up even more space. Some people believe that this may come at the cost of performance, as the internal NAND memory should be faster than your SD card (Which is why you also get people arguing over which "class" SD card is better for Apps2SD - the logic being that a faster SD card means less impact from this move), but the truth of the matter is that your applications will be running from your Phone's RAM anyway, so performance isn't really impacted at all. Since most apps are only a few hundred Kb's in size, or a couple of MB at the most, it's a non-issue.
Finally, any recent version of Apps2SD/Apps2SD+ should work with an SD card that is or isn't formatted with an ext partition. It'll check for this partition when your phone first boots and if it's not there, just use internal phone storage.
Having an ext partition WITHOUT Apps2SD+ shouldn't cause any issues, either, so you can format your SD card whenever you're ready.
So in summary:
Apps2SD "fakes" your phone's internal memory and puts it all on a hidden section of your SD card.
Apps2SD+ pushes even more content to the SD card, freeing up even more space on the phone itself.
"Froyo" Apps2SD has various limitations that "old" apps2SD does not, but is much easier to handle as it doesn't involve any kind of "partitioning".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

That's a great summary, thanks for that!
But... how can I create an ext3 partition on a new SD card? I don't want to use ROM Manager because that has a maximum of 512Mb for ext3, I want to make 1gb or more.
Also, what size should I make swap partition?

Vice83 said:
That's a great summary, thanks for that!
But... how can I create an ext3 partition on a new SD card? I don't want to use ROM Manager because that has a maximum of 512Mb for ext3, I want to make 1gb or more.
Also, what size should I make swap partition?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can do that thru recovery-windows.bat by going thru recovery mode by volume down + power, go to recovery then when the red exclamation point appears just run the recovery-windows.bat by double clicking on it. You can get these files from r5-desire-root-alt from the rooting process files (search the forums for this if you don't have it). But be cautious cause when you partition your sd card, all your files will be wiped so make sure to backup everything you need. Cheers!
Edit:
Actually this summary about the ap2sd and ap2sd+ and froyo ap2sd should be stickyed for everyone, so it would not be ask over and over again.

Couple of extra ways to partition:
1) Flash AmonRA's Recovery to your phone (I used Unrevoked to do it)
2) Use GParted on a Linux LiveCD (e.g Slax) to partition your card exactly how you want it

Vice83 said:
That's a great summary, thanks for that!
But... how can I create an ext3 partition on a new SD card? I don't want to use ROM Manager because that has a maximum of 512Mb for ext3, I want to make 1gb or more.
Also, what size should I make swap partition?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ROM Manager is probably the easiest way to do it, but I was stuck with EXACTLY the same problem when I rooted. I chose to flash AMON Ra recovery (don't have the link, but you can google it up), and then used that to create a 1024MB ext partition. Then used AMON Ra again to convert the ext partition to ext3. Hope that helps.
However, one question I have regarding neoKushan's explanation is that if I did create a 1024MB ext3 partition, then the same capacity should be visible in the phone's internal memory. However, after I rooted and restored my apps, I could only see about 100+ MB of free internal memory. Can anyone help me with this please? Am using the Opendesire Official Froyo 1.0c ROM that has A2SD built in

deepdevil said:
ROM Manager is probably the easiest way to do it, but I was stuck with EXACTLY the same problem when I rooted. I chose to flash AMON Ra recovery (don't have the link, but you can google it up), and then used that to create a 1024MB ext partition. Then used AMON Ra again to convert the ext partition to ext3. Hope that helps.
However, one question I have regarding neoKushan's explanation is that if I did create a 1024MB ext3 partition, then the same capacity should be visible in the phone's internal memory. However, after I rooted and restored my apps, I could only see about 100+ MB of free internal memory. Can anyone help me with this please? Am using the Opendesire Official Froyo 1.0c ROM that has A2SD built in
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure about what exact capacity for the internal memory after partitioning to ext3 but when I was on Opendesire before for the eclair 2.1 after I'm done flashing the rom and setting up the whole ap2sd+ my internal memory was 410mb. I used:
swap=0
ext=1024
fat32 is for the rest of the card
Then after upgrading to froyo rooted ROM, I'm only getting 140mb tops. I dunno... I'm too lazy now to get into it right now... maybe soon I'll play around with it again so I can get back my 410mb internal space with the ap2sd+

Stewge said:
Froyo A2SD is completely reliant on app developers. If the devs doesn't allow it in their app then it can't be moved to the SD card. This is really only a problem because Froyo is still new.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not 100% true, because you can change the default install location to SD card (via ADB if stock, and an app if rooted) and then you can have the vast majority of your apps on SD card even if they've not been updated for Froyo.
Regards,
Dave

I always thought the main negative with A2SD+ was that the cache was moved to the sdcard, which of course would wear out the sdcard (slightly) quicker.

Vice83 said:
So let me understand the names:
APPS2SD = Froyo Original (comes with official Froyo release)
APPS2SD+ = Hacked version which has been out since FRF50 leak?
EDIT: But if APPS2SD+ is so much better (keeps apps on ext3 partition), why to people keep using the original APPS2SD on their ROMs?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not exactly!
Prior to Froyo, there were principally two versions of Apps2SD:
1. APPS2SD (or A2SD )
2. APPS2SD+ (or A2SD+)
The first would move your apps to the EXT partition, and the second would move your apps and the Dalvik cache to the EXT partition (see here for an explanation of the Dalvik cache).
Now we have Froyo, we have "native", or "Froyo" apps2sd as well, which does much the same as (1) above except that there is no EXT partition and the apps are on the FAT32 partition of your SD card.
Regards,
Dave

sparksalot said:
I always thought the main negative with A2SD+ was that the cache was moved to the sdcard, which of course would wear out the sdcard (slightly) quicker.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dalvik cache is only actually updated when a new app is installed or and old app is updated, so whilst it will incur more writes to SD card, it probably isn't anywhere near as much as the apps write themselves to the FAT32 partition.
Regards,
Dave

Great summary, but can I format my 8 GB SD card as EXT3 and just forget about the FAT partition? I'm using Ubuntu on my laptop and my EXT4 /home partition is just fine for storing images, movies etc. I really don't get this ado about having an EXT and a FAT partition. Or am I wrong here?

quick question, if i move to another bigger sd card, can i copy my card and transfer it to the new one without losing the EXT, and the apps on it? would i need to make a image of the card? thanx for any advice.

make a backup of them first on your pc and copy them to the newly partitioned sdcard....ext to ext and fat to fat

So there is 3 versions?
1. Froyo A2sd = fat32 only = apps installed to sd
2. A2sd = fat32 + ext = apps installed to sd in ext partition
3. A2sd+ = fat32 + ext = apps installed and Dalvik cache moved to sd in ext partition
Is there any more variants? lol
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App

[Q] Question A2SD & OpenDesire 4.0.34

Hi,
I'm using OpenDesire 4.0.34 and have partitioned my sdcard to have 3 partitions:
1 - FAT32 14GB
2 - EXT3 512MB
3 - SWAP/CACHE 32MB
Now I have one question:
I have enabled the "Allow application moving" setting in Settings->CyanogenMod settings->Application settings and selected Install location: Internal the same screen.
My question is: I've installed a bunch of apps I often use and they used to leave me with only 19MB free in internal phone memory. Now it shows free internal memory around 120MB?! I've checked all the apps in the Manage applications and they are on the phone (at least it says so). I've mounted /sd-ext in recovery and all the apps are there...
Can anyone explain me what's goin' on here?
Thanks for your help!

Uhm... you do know that the partition of an ext3 sd-ext system is exactly to provide greater storage space for your applications, don't you?!

Guess not...
The /sd-ext is the mount point of my ext3 partition on the sd card?
Anyway, I didn't move any app to sd card (at least explicitily).

z7x8c9 said:
Guess not...
The /sd-ext is the mount point of my ext3 partition on the sd card?
Anyway, I didn't move any app to sd card (at least explicitily).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When you use Ext3 partition youll get "A2SD+" and both your internal memory and your Ext3 partiton will become your new "internal" space on phone. So if the setting is set to "internal" the apps will go to ext3 and internal phone memory.
The internal phone memory counter however only show how much space you have on the internal phone memory where only small parts of the apps is installed.

I just removed my sdcard to see what would happen and all my apps are gone.
As such I assume they are all on the sdcard...
So when using the ext3 partition, how can I choose if an app is installed to the phone memory or to the sdcard? Is this possible at all?
Also, when I go to manage applications, I can "move to sd card" any app, but what does this do then?
I'm a bit confused...

Moved to Q&A as not development.
Please do not make new threads in development to ask questions

z7x8c9 said:
I just removed my sdcard to see what would happen and all my apps are gone.
As such I assume they are all on the sdcard...
So when using the ext3 partition, how can I choose if an app is installed to the phone memory or to the sdcard? Is this possible at all?
Also, when I go to manage applications, I can "move to sd card" any app, but what does this do then?
I'm a bit confused...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you are getting apps2sd confused with the native android move to sd function!!, when you create an ext partition and use a rom that supports apps2sd, the developer has used a script that point the device to the /sd-ext as the INTERNAL STORAGE location, where as if you use the move to sd function in android, the apk's are move to the Androidsecure folder in the root of your sd card, as aposed to being stored in /data/app

I think I've got it...
On an a2sd enabled rom, I'm not required to do anything in order to install apps on the sdcard.
The move to sdcard button is the native android method to move apps to the sdcard.
I got confused because in OpenDesire in the Settings->CyanogenMod settings->Application settings there is an option to allow application moving, but all this does is enable me to move any app to the .android_secure using the move to sdcard button. It's got nothing to do with a2sd, right?
Thanks for your help!

[Q] app2sd

I just flashed Synergy RC2, and wanted to install DT's app2sd, so I followed the steps from Here and Here. wiped everything, partioned, all that jazz, but yet, apps that i install are still installing to internal memory and not to the sd card.
Did I not do something right?

How do you know they are installing to internal storage and not the SD card? Tell me what's giving you that impression.
The only reason I ask is that Darktremor Apps2SD uses an EXT partition to store your applications (and other things as well). To accomplish this, your /data/app and /data/app-private directories are symbolically linked to identical directories on the SDCard (either in /system/sd or /sd-ext, wherever the EXT partition is mounted to). As far as Android is concerned, it is storing applications to Internal Storage, but the symbolic link tricks Android into putting it on the SD card.
If it said External, it would also be using your SD card, but it would use a special directory (.android_secure) on your FAT32 partition.
Goth_ said:
I just flashed Synergy RC2, and wanted to install DT's app2sd, so I followed the steps from Here and Here. wiped everything, partioned, all that jazz, but yet, apps that i install are still installing to internal memory and not to the sd card.
Did I not do something right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

it seemed like the internal memory was getting lower, but idk, im kinda confused.

Even with applications and dalvik-cache on the SD card, the internal storage will still decrease because the application data and caches (i.e. browser cache) are still in internal storage. They shouldn't decrease at a rapid rate.
Goth_ said:
it seemed like the internal memory was getting lower, but idk, im kinda confused.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Maybe, it seems like it's working. But I don't think the dalvik-cache has been moved to SD, I can't figure out where to type in that command.

Goth_ said:
Maybe, it seems like it's working. But I don't think the dalvik-cache has been moved to SD, I can't figure out where to type in that command.[/QUOTE
open up android terminal and type a2sd check, to make sure its working or you could even download the dark tremor app which is basically an app that controls the scripts that are noob friendly
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

i used terminal emulator, it worked, lol.
had some error, then rebooted, but i have 325mb of internal space now, rofl.

Hmm, I just checked this again, and I went from having 325MB of internal storage, to now having 51. What happened? :|
Edit: just tried a2sd cachesdreset, it went through the steps, and said error cant mount sd, busy, but before i could read the whole thing, it rebooted my phone.
Any ideas?